There’s near infinite ways to skin a cat. Brandon’s approach is just as valid as Matt’s. If everyone approached everything, exactly the same, there’d be nothing interesting in the world. I love Matt’s approach, and his passion, and skill with seeing fallacies and flawed thinking. And I love Brandon’s calm and kind manner. Both work well for accomplishing slightly different things, and I don’t think we need to pick one or the other.
@@lifefindsaway7875not for me it isn't. I am way more calmed by people like Matt Dillahunty getting down to brass tax at a quicker pace and not letting people constantly weasel their way out of things. It's cool to know how diverse humans can be!
Brandon is such a great fit here. I really like his content, demeanor, and thoughfulness. I hope we get to see a lot more of him here. I highly recommend subscribing to his channel.
I love that there is actually a conversation that happens between the caller and Brandon rather every other host who talk at a ratio of 10:1 for each caller.
Matt Intro 09:50 - Brandon joins 26:30 - Colier (She/Her) Agnostic - New York - Wants to talk about what she puts her faith, hope and trust in. 48:59 - Ram (He/Him) Theist - New Delhi - Says he can prove to Matt that God exists in three months. 52:29 - Larry (He/Him) Theist - Ecuador - Calls in to convince the hosts that God is real. 1:00:29 - Greg (He/Him) Theist - Texas - Caller has proof of a God or does he? 1:59:15 - Wes (He/Him) Theist - Georgia - Caller agrees with previous caller, Greg. Does Wes make better points? 2:44:36 - Eric (He/Him) Theist - USA - Caller who is going through deconstruction of his beliefs. 3:10:36 - Superchats.
Larry Theist- Ecuador- Calls in to waste the hosts and viewers time with word salad about you having to be open minded and never actually giving anything close to evidence or an argument.
Not gonna lie, I do enjoy watching these shows for the takedown of caller’s claims, especially when the callers are being rude and obnoxious. But I truly love hearing the individual stories of deconstruction, they fill me with hope for the future of mankind, maybe we’re not doomed. Thank you both for that.
Got to keep this combination. These two together are POWERFUL 1-2 punch for reason, rationality, facts, science, religion, logic & fallacies, epistemology and argument construction etc. This is it!
Can we talk about how well Mindshift did on this stream? So calm and poised but dropping logic bombs like he's engaged in some thought based world war. 🤯
Right on!!!👍✌ His channel is calm cool and collected too. Brandon's calmness has enough power to convince millions of Gullibles he's Jesus coming back to earth. He could have become minister making twice the profit televangelist doo. but, his honesty caring heart is simply not that type of thing. Still God seems more away from existing with honest warm hearted intelligent men on the subject .
@@BaA-zz4pq I would argue that most of the hosts blow up unnecessarily in most cases. Maintaining composure with even the most difficult people will help you with the optics win.
My first step towards shaking off the shackles of indoctrination was when I was 16 and my vicar said “…we have no problem in accepting evolution, but evolution guided by God for creating humans…” and I thought “…hang on…that’s not how it works…you’re trying to change the science to fit your religion…surely it should be the other way round…”. It still took me another 10 to 15 years to break free completely but I shall always be grateful to that vicar for setting me on the path to being free from religion. I do love the irony! 😁
I love MindShift/Brandon!! I’ve watched all his stuff. I hope he does a call in show in the future (please Brandon). I know it would be great!! Thanks Matt for having him on!
Wes: "We know Jesus is real because the Jews told us they saw him." Also Wes: "We can't trust the Jewish experts to interpret their own language better than me because they didn't even know Jesus came through." 😵😵 Wild stances to take dude
26:27 Coleir, lost in translation. 48:52 Ram, Theist can prove Jebus in 3 Months by rubbing Matt up the wrong way, in India.. 52:28 Larry, Theist playing silly games with creation, he’s just missing the other two Stooges. 1:00:27 Greg, Theist, Can explain why he can’t explain the existence of Jebus. Everything has a beginning, (sept 4 God coz magic). 1:59:14 Wes, Theist, starts of by hanging shit on Greg, and slides down the book of Genesis, hill from there. 2:15:07, I pulled my ears off, to save my sanity….
I’ve never seen any of MindShift Brandon’s content before, but I really enjoyed his contribution to this episode and I am going to seek out more of his content. Thanks for having him on. I thought he was a great compliment to Matt’s typical blunt and impatient manner (which I also quite enjoy). I’d love to see more of this pairing!
Matt and Brandon are so damned good together. There is a balance not seen on most shows. Both have a great personality and are so damned intelligent. Great show!!!
This was the best atheist call in show example I have seen in a long time and I watch a lot of them. For the Greg call, Matt was concise and controlled the calls calling out bs and pulling back to the question asked, as usual. Brandon worked his questions and rebuttals masterfly well. First time Ive seen him and was super impressed at the steel-mans, biblical knowledge, phrasing and patience. Brandon complements Matt well and cuts in to Matt when he wants to speak which I'm sure Matt appreciates. The Greg call was awesome. Haven't heard the rest of the show but had to comment before bed. Cheers guys!
Around 1:58:20 Matt about ‘if you’d love your partner more if you didn’t live with them’. I’m gonna use that with some loved ones who I care about. Sometimes the responses really resonate with me. Thanks Matt & Brandon.
This duo is fire and ice. And yes I do believe we need both! Some people need to feel the heat 🔥 While logically holding their feet to that fire. While others need a chill, cool approach 🧊 And to be presented with cold hard facts.
1:25:09 1. Why can’t god get the translations right between Hebrew and English? That’s ridiculous. 2. If you have a relationship with god, why can’t you simply ask him to explain? 3. How can you trust god if he shows he’s not interested in ensuring his message is clear and easy to understand.
Greg is literally doing what we are all expecting theists to do: fill that gap with god. God is the sky. Nope that's the atmosphere. God is the things past the atmosphere. No thats space. God is the whole of space. No that's the universe. God is the beginning of the universe. No thats big bang cosmology. Greg special: God is now infinite regress.
His channel is very balanced easy to understand! Branden's warm hearted fast Honest Speech would do the figure 8 around televangelist making them crack. lol
This one of the best Hang Ups I have ever watched!!! Matt and Brandon are so wonderful together and I hope they are 'paired' again. There respective strengths (formidable for both) augment each other in a way that makes for outstanding viewing.
I’m dying to know what was going through Brandon’s mind when Matt said, “go find somebody else to rub, Ram, ‘cause you’re not rubbing me.” Brandon’s facial expression just remained so serene for at least 20 minutes.
Greg sounds like someone who genuinely wants to question and have a conversation, but who is completely incapable of recognising logical fallacies. Matt was right, Greg is lying to himself, he just doesn't realise it
I'm not sure it's his ability (or lack thereof) of recognizing logical fallacies... It sounded to me more like *_whatever_* approach was taken, he was happy to go along, but incapable of going beyond a certain point - probably one that would have made him realize a fault in his views. I have obviously very little information about his history and background, but it _sounds_ like a defense mechanism kicking in that was instilled in him like in oh-so-many people in certain parts of the USA (and certainly all over the world, but that specific phenomenon is one that's _far more_ common in some parts of the USA, and only fairly sporadic in in at least other western countries...)
I am so glad Brandon finally got to join! Brandon is an amazing youtube and I love his content! His calm demeanor is always something to listen to, and he always has super fun and relatable topics
Greg was a combination of misquoting, mistranslating, misunderstanding and simply making it up on the fly, Bible interpretations. It's an incredible achievement on the part of religion, to make an otherwise rational human being(assumed), perform some pretty spectacular mental gymnastics in order to continue to rationalise irrational thought.
Incredible and very scary, if someone can be brainwashed to the level of abandoning rational thinking, they can be told to do literally anything. That’s scary 😳
@@greg-op2jh Nah, you can evaluate someone's action just with their actions alone without having to "know them". If the op had made a generalized statement about greg, the it would be rude.
@@greg-op2jh The only assumption made was that Greg was rational. The rest was an observation of what was displayed during the call. Are you saying assuming Greg is rational is a mistake?
It is quite astonishing that Greg managed to remain on the show for such an extended period. His ability to spontaneously fabricate excuses was truly remarkable.
I respect and admire Matt so very much and Brandon’s joining him is absolutely wonderful. This episode is almost the most enjoyable experience I’ve had in ages. Thank you so very much ❤
Great episode! You guys pair well together! Love the M&M (Matt + Mindshift) episodes so far. Listening to The Line and Mindshift get me through long nights at work along with a little Mythvision and Joseph's Myth. Keep up the great work guys, and to everyone else..."Keep Thinking"!
Thank you Wes for telling us exactly why nobody should believe in the god you believe in, and there are massive amounts of evidence against the god you believe in.
@@crashoppe Wes believes in a very specific version of God, and that version (the Christian version, specifically with a lot of his specific claims) has evidence that the claims in the Bible are wrong.
@@crashoppe it doesn't prove a god doesn't exist, it shows that the specific god that Wes believes in doesn't exist due to his beliefs being factually wrong. You see, the concept of god isn't just one thing. So each "concept" of god needs to be addressed individually, or if they fit into certain categories we can show them to be wrong, such as the tri-omni version. Or one that leads to a contradiction (truly omnipotent, not just omnipotent up to the laws of logic)
@@crashoppe ok since you don't seem to grasp basic logic. If someone you know says they have 20 billion dollars in the bank, do you believe them or do you disbelieve them by default?
Matt's answer to Larry was epic: Larry: "I have watched many of your shows, and agree with everything you say"🤤 Matt: "Then how can you be a theist"?🤨 Freaking radical!!🥳🤣
It is a terrifying situation that a fundamentalist theist occupies a position of great political power (Speaker of the House) and that the body politic of this country is infected significantly with individuals with this degree of ignorance.
This is the firest time I've heard MindShift Skeptic. I really love the way he tries to steelman the callers' arguments. It really puts the onus on the caller to be clear about what they are saying they believe. He makes some great points in a really patient way. Would like to see more of him!
What an incredible show. The two of you have different approaches but both work so well together. Loved this episode. Seriously one of my favorites I've seen.
I never had any problems with death, hell, meaning after deconstructing. It could've been that I had doubts for a long time. After being surrounded by Christians, my whole life, finding like-minded people on the Internet was so refreshing. I realized I wasn't the only one having a hard time believing things my family seem to actually believe.
Greg kept saying no one in the Bible saw God after the fall, or if they saw him it was sort of sideways and hidden a little bit. Do you not think Jacob saw God as he wrestled with god? Do you not think Abraham saw God as he had supper with him? Do you not think Moses and 500 elders of Israel saw God when they laid their eyeballs on him like the Bible says? Have Christians never cracked open their own Bible? The less they know about the bible, the more confidently they speak.
These 2 on screen look like a father and son, or a before and after. 🤣🤣 Matt changed my life years ago, and Brandon is the best thing going, I’m Mindshift for life! 🤘 Yo Ram, I’ll take a 3 month massage!!! I’ll even say “Oh god” while I’m on the table, and that can be proof of god’s existence. 🤣
Why is it that every theist who says "I watch the show all the time" never seem to know that answering a yes or no question with anything other than yes or no will piss everyone off.
@clukinvar probably because they dont watch the show much. they are treating this like they would a convo with a rando off the street. they dont seem to know they will be talking to "experts". good for entertainment though, lol.
2:13:28 - Wes: "I don't take the bulk of Judaism as an authority over the Bible". This is my new favorite quote. Its like saying: "I don't take the bulk of car mechanics as an authority over the problems with my car". Actually a new level of self deception and ignorance, you'll literally ignore the experts of a subject because your view is different. Amazing stuff. 10/10 brain working.
I've been watching a few of Brandon's videos lately and then he turns up on here!! Must be that meddling god working mysteriously.....😎. What an excellent host he is. Really enjoyed his input today and I hope to see him more on here.
(around 2:25:00) - So the agreement is that god wants everyone who could possibly be saved to be saved. Would demonstrating his existence make it *_harder_* for anyone to accept/worship/whatever him? If not, the whole excuse falls apart. If yes... well, then I have to ask why? The immediate thought I have is that only a monster would be _harder_ to worship if I really got to know it.
It's a real pleasure to see the two of you on a show together. I am not in need of deconstructing anything religious, I never really believed - even when, as a child, I was telling people I was a Catholic - but I love watching the Line. Seeing how foreign from mine some people's thought processes are is really fascinating to me and instructive. I think it helps me be more empathetic towards religious people and it sharpens my reasoning.
That's such a common dodge: of course I can't get you to 100%... Dude. There IS no 100. Forget 100. How did you get to even 10? Can uou move someone from 0 to 10? That and "how can we even "KNOW" anything?
This is such a common dodge. As you say, "never mind 100. Agreed nothing is 100. Can you get someone from 0 to 10? How did YOU get even to 10?" Or the adjacent dodge. Any good reason? So often they flip to "well how can we really KNOW anything? We might be brains in vats." Dude. Do you have a reasonable confidence that Australia exists? Great. Tell me how to have that same level of confidence that this Yahweh character is as real as Australia. _...IS_ Yahweh as real as Australia?"
Greg is impossible to talk to "well let me turn the question around to you .... well you just have to look at the evidence ....well I didn't say that I KNOW..." Nothing of substance left his mouth that entire call, it was all just sophistry.
I was just like Greg a few years ago. I actually had an argument with someone, insisting that God of the Old Testament was a good god. I BELIEVED GOD WAS GOOD despite all the verses stating the contrary.
@@gowdsake7103 False claim. I have many theist friends who have no problem giving straight and honest answers to questions. Maybe not always good nor reasonable answers, but straight and honest answers nevertheless.
@@toniheikkila5607That just sounds like these friends of yours are more articulate and comfortable in private discussion as opposed to being on a popular live show where your answers will be judged for what they are and not be sugarcoated by existing friendship. Your friends think they are answering questions that amount to something they could never demonstrate, while these people are dumbfounded you'd even need to question it to begin with because they don't need a demonstration. They are different subsets of the same branch, all uninformed or unwilling to be informed people. It is a poor comparison on your part.
It is not unique to religious people. All thinking human beings do it. It's a foresight situation. Seeing a few steps ahead of the question or where it's leading.
@@toniheikkila5607to questions regarding providing objective evidence for the existence of their god or the veracity of their holy book or just general non-important questions?
Brandon’s calm, collected and concise manner of deconstructing Christianity is a breath of fresh air
He is so good
He is the best in the game. So easy for deconverting Christians to listen to.
He is far easier to listen to than Matt. Matt is now so disgusted with every theist that he is tough to hear now. Can't blame the gut but....
@@leonarddiiorio4337
You are changing I guess
Because Matt isn't ..
There’s near infinite ways to skin a cat. Brandon’s approach is just as valid as Matt’s. If everyone approached everything, exactly the same, there’d be nothing interesting in the world. I love Matt’s approach, and his passion, and skill with seeing fallacies and flawed thinking. And I love Brandon’s calm and kind manner. Both work well for accomplishing slightly different things, and I don’t think we need to pick one or the other.
I love Brandon on here! The way he walks callers through understanding the problems in their thought processes in a gentle way is super refreshing.
I really like his UA-cam channel too.
Yep, it is another way to go BUT their thinking is often so broken, talking to a brick would have more effect.
I really prefer Brandon’s empathetic approach. It’s a lot more pleasant to listen to a calm voice.
@@lifefindsaway7875not for me it isn't. I am way more calmed by people like Matt Dillahunty getting down to brass tax at a quicker pace and not letting people constantly weasel their way out of things. It's cool to know how diverse humans can be!
@@CrAzYpotpie I can imagine that you could find it cathartic to hear Matt express a frustration that you feel.
Fantastic job Brandon. Please have him on his guest more often!
More Brandon on The Line, please! Absolutely enjoyed his thoughtful demeanor and insight. I need to try to be more like that guy.
I like him too!
Brandon is such a great fit here. I really like his content, demeanor, and thoughfulness. I hope we get to see a lot more of him here. I highly recommend subscribing to his channel.
I love that there is actually a conversation that happens between the caller and Brandon rather every other host who talk at a ratio of 10:1 for each caller.
i enjoy how empathetic brandon is when deconstructing the bible.
Absolutely agree 💯
Matt Intro
09:50 - Brandon joins
26:30 - Colier (She/Her) Agnostic - New York - Wants to talk about what she puts her faith, hope and trust in.
48:59 - Ram (He/Him) Theist - New Delhi - Says he can prove to Matt that God exists in three months.
52:29 - Larry (He/Him) Theist - Ecuador - Calls in to convince the hosts that God is real.
1:00:29 - Greg (He/Him) Theist - Texas - Caller has proof of a God or does he?
1:59:15 - Wes (He/Him) Theist - Georgia - Caller agrees with previous caller, Greg. Does Wes make better points?
2:44:36 - Eric (He/Him) Theist - USA - Caller who is going through deconstruction of his beliefs.
3:10:36 - Superchats.
Thanks for these
Everyone! Like this comment
Thanks, Fa... uhm. Poly 😂
NICE
Larry Theist- Ecuador- Calls in to waste the hosts and viewers time with word salad about you having to be open minded and never actually giving anything close to evidence or an argument.
Not gonna lie, I do enjoy watching these shows for the takedown of caller’s claims, especially when the callers are being rude and obnoxious. But I truly love hearing the individual stories of deconstruction, they fill me with hope for the future of mankind, maybe we’re not doomed. Thank you both for that.
Got to keep this combination. These two together are POWERFUL 1-2 punch for reason, rationality, facts, science, religion, logic & fallacies, epistemology and argument construction etc. This is it!
This is a powerful combination! Red Beard is apparently less jaded by theist games as Grey Beard. But what a combo!!
Nothing is scarier than a yes or no question to a theist.
If they say "yes," they reveal something about themselves. If they say "no," they lie. So they literally can't answer any of them and I'm all for it.
🤣🤣🤣
@@FighterDoken fucking gold.
is there a name for this dilema?
"damned if you do, damned if you don't" perhaps? lol
@@Quadrupliplex I just call it "religion" 😂
Theists feel the universe owes them an explanation. It doesn't!
Can we talk about how well Mindshift did on this stream? So calm and poised but dropping logic bombs like he's engaged in some thought based world war. 🤯
Seeing Brandon for the first time and immediately became his fan.!!! Great stuff
Wow, Brandon is so refreshing. Cool, calm, and collected. If you want to convince people, this sort of demeanor is needed.
Right on!!!👍✌ His channel is calm cool and collected too. Brandon's calmness has enough power to convince millions of Gullibles he's Jesus coming back to earth. He could have become minister making twice the profit televangelist doo. but, his honesty caring heart is simply not that type of thing. Still God seems more away from existing with honest warm hearted intelligent men on the subject .
@@BaA-zz4pq I would argue that most of the hosts blow up unnecessarily in most cases. Maintaining composure with even the most difficult people will help you with the optics win.
My first step towards shaking off the shackles of indoctrination was when I was 16 and my vicar said “…we have no problem in accepting evolution, but evolution guided by God for creating humans…” and I thought “…hang on…that’s not how it works…you’re trying to change the science to fit your religion…surely it should be the other way round…”. It still took me another 10 to 15 years to break free completely but I shall always be grateful to that vicar for setting me on the path to being free from religion. I do love the irony! 😁
I love MindShift/Brandon!! I’ve watched all his stuff. I hope he does a call in show in the future (please Brandon). I know it would be great!! Thanks Matt for having him on!
Wes: "We know Jesus is real because the Jews told us they saw him."
Also Wes: "We can't trust the Jewish experts to interpret their own language better than me because they didn't even know Jesus came through."
😵😵
Wild stances to take dude
Well spotted!
Brandon was great. I hope you have him on again.
26:27 Coleir, lost in translation.
48:52 Ram, Theist can prove Jebus in 3 Months by rubbing Matt up the wrong way, in India..
52:28 Larry, Theist playing silly games with creation, he’s just missing the other two Stooges.
1:00:27 Greg, Theist, Can explain why he can’t explain the existence of Jebus. Everything has a beginning, (sept 4 God coz magic).
1:59:14 Wes, Theist, starts of by hanging shit on Greg, and slides down the book of Genesis, hill from there.
2:15:07, I pulled my ears off, to save my sanity….
I’ve never seen any of MindShift Brandon’s content before, but I really enjoyed his contribution to this episode and I am going to seek out more of his content. Thanks for having him on. I thought he was a great compliment to Matt’s typical blunt and impatient manner (which I also quite enjoy). I’d love to see more of this pairing!
His content is really good.
I subscribed immediately and was happy I did.
His stuff is amazing.
Mindshift is absolute top tier.
He’s got a lot of good stuff.
Matt and Brandon are so damned good together. There is a balance not seen on most shows. Both have a great personality and are so damned intelligent. Great show!!!
agreed!!!
Works as a bit of a good cop/ bad cop duo and I'm here for it
This was the best atheist call in show example I have seen in a long time and I watch a lot of them.
For the Greg call, Matt was concise and controlled the calls calling out bs and pulling back to the question asked, as usual. Brandon worked his questions and rebuttals masterfly well. First time Ive seen him and was super impressed at the steel-mans, biblical knowledge, phrasing and patience. Brandon complements Matt well and cuts in to Matt when he wants to speak which I'm sure Matt appreciates.
The Greg call was awesome. Haven't heard the rest of the show but had to comment before bed. Cheers guys!
1000% agree! Please... MORE OF THIS 💖
Around 1:58:20 Matt about ‘if you’d love your partner more if you didn’t live with them’.
I’m gonna use that with some loved ones who I care about.
Sometimes the responses really resonate with me. Thanks Matt & Brandon.
This duo is fire and ice.
And yes I do believe we need both!
Some people need to feel the heat 🔥
While logically holding their feet to that fire.
While others need a chill, cool approach 🧊
And to be presented with cold hard facts.
Fighting the urge to quote Robert Frost here
@@nameforcomments4092...don't...do it.
So is this episode a _Song of Ice & Fire?_
Brandon is absolutely superb! What a find!
Love Brandon's demeanor. His calm confidence in his beliefs is encouraging.
Brandon is incredibly articulate, i'm a big fan
Yes ! His channel is easy to understand with out a dull moment.
Agreed!
Thanks ! his words are rapid but, can be picked up easily with perfect pronunciation and never hardly a slip.@@paganalesociety
1:25:09
1. Why can’t god get the translations right between Hebrew and English? That’s ridiculous.
2. If you have a relationship with god, why can’t you simply ask him to explain?
3. How can you trust god if he shows he’s not interested in ensuring his message is clear and easy to understand.
It's not that kind of relationship, you wouldn't understand, god goes to a different school, in Canada!
Ram rubbed Matt the wrong way.
Lol.
Atleast it had a…. Happy ending 😂
Not a McCartney fan?
lol
Ram is always a frustrating caller to listen to, talking to him has got to be even worse
Greg is literally doing what we are all expecting theists to do: fill that gap with god.
God is the sky.
Nope that's the atmosphere.
God is the things past the atmosphere.
No thats space.
God is the whole of space.
No that's the universe.
God is the beginning of the universe.
No thats big bang cosmology.
Greg special: God is now infinite regress.
On that I agree, God is definitely infinite regress for the intellect of believers.
@@pascalsimioli6777 🤣
Brandon and Matt are a powerful force. Thank you both!
Branden's patience adds such a needed balance to this program.
His channel is very balanced easy to understand! Branden's warm hearted fast Honest Speech would do the figure 8 around televangelist making them crack. lol
These two side-by-side is like a Matt before-after image of 30 years taking calls.
😅😂
haha so true, Matt's patience with BS has eroded so much 😂
brandon is well composed and methodical; always a refreshing contribution to the show.
Brandon. You’re the best. I can’t wait until your own call in show starts. You’re really good at this.
The “I won’t hang up” call in show with Brandon.
I'm relatively new to this stuff, that was excellent. More of Brandon and Matt!
The good cop/bad cop thing going on this episode really worked.
You took the words right out of my mouth 😄
This one of the best Hang Ups I have ever watched!!! Matt and Brandon are so wonderful together and I hope they are 'paired' again. There respective strengths (formidable for both) augment each other in a way that makes for outstanding viewing.
I’m dying to know what was going through Brandon’s mind when Matt said, “go find somebody else to rub, Ram, ‘cause you’re not rubbing me.” Brandon’s facial expression just remained so serene for at least 20 minutes.
Greg sounds like someone who genuinely wants to question and have a conversation, but who is completely incapable of recognising logical fallacies.
Matt was right, Greg is lying to himself, he just doesn't realise it
I'm not sure it's his ability (or lack thereof) of recognizing logical fallacies... It sounded to me more like *_whatever_* approach was taken, he was happy to go along, but incapable of going beyond a certain point - probably one that would have made him realize a fault in his views.
I have obviously very little information about his history and background, but it _sounds_ like a defense mechanism kicking in that was instilled in him like in oh-so-many people in certain parts of the USA (and certainly all over the world, but that specific phenomenon is one that's _far more_ common in some parts of the USA, and only fairly sporadic in in at least other western countries...)
Yo, Brandon rocks. Love this dude
Big fan of Brandon. Great to see him on the show.
I am so glad Brandon finally got to join! Brandon is an amazing youtube and I love his content! His calm demeanor is always something to listen to, and he always has super fun and relatable topics
Greg was a combination of misquoting, mistranslating, misunderstanding and simply making it up on the fly, Bible interpretations.
It's an incredible achievement on the part of religion, to make an otherwise rational human being(assumed), perform some pretty spectacular mental gymnastics in order to continue to rationalise irrational thought.
Incredible and very scary, if someone can be brainwashed to the level of abandoning rational thinking, they can be told to do literally anything. That’s scary 😳
Thats very rude to talk about people you don't know 😅😉
@@greg-op2jh Nah, you can evaluate someone's action just with their actions alone without having to "know them". If the op had made a generalized statement about greg, the it would be rude.
@@greg-op2jh The only assumption made was that Greg was rational. The rest was an observation of what was displayed during the call. Are you saying assuming Greg is rational is a mistake?
MINDSHIFT ON THE LINE???? IS IT MY BIRTHDAY OR SOMETHING what a collab
Wow! mindshift absolutely crushed it and Matt with his take no BS is always great to hear.
A bunch of frustrating calls and then a really nice one. Worth it. Love seeing Brandon on the show always, excellent episode guys!
Brandon, "Mindshift", right up there with the best of the hosts!
So cool to see mindshift on here, I just started watching his videos
Please have Brandon on more.
You guys are really the A-Team... great show. Go the beards! Love from southern Australia 🇦🇺 ❤
Haha, I'm subbed to both. Also from South Australia. 😁
@@QuestionThingsUseLogicNice to see you around here
🍻 from QLD
@@Johnmhatheistl did reply but my comment disappeared, lol.
It is quite astonishing that Greg managed to remain on the show for such an extended period. His ability to spontaneously fabricate excuses was truly remarkable.
Brandon's a keeper!
Yo
"Don't interrupt me while I am summing up your failure"
Thats one of the coldest most badass quotes in existence
Damn, great ft!
MindShift does a great job.
I can't take Ram seriously, every time he calls he has some of the dumbest things I've ever heard to say.
I travelled to India and spent 3 months with him and it’s true he will turn you into a believer, his hands were gifts from god himself…..
@@experienceofchris1108 Troll
@@experienceofchris1108😂😂😂
@@TheRaven_200 Whooooaaaaat, really? /s
Sort of like Ontangelo from Brazil. 😂 I remember that cat from AXP. 😂
I respect and admire Matt so very much and Brandon’s joining him is absolutely wonderful. This episode is almost the most enjoyable experience I’ve had in ages. Thank you so very much ❤
Brandon is excellent.
Great episode! You guys pair well together! Love the M&M (Matt + Mindshift) episodes so far. Listening to The Line and Mindshift get me through long nights at work along with a little Mythvision and Joseph's Myth. Keep up the great work guys, and to everyone else..."Keep Thinking"!
Thank you Wes for telling us exactly why nobody should believe in the god you believe in, and there are massive amounts of evidence against the god you believe in.
@@crashoppe Wes believes in a very specific version of God, and that version (the Christian version, specifically with a lot of his specific claims) has evidence that the claims in the Bible are wrong.
The best way to falsify a god is to make the person try to define it. Very quickly they will hit a stumbling block or say something incorrect.
@@crashoppe it doesn't prove a god doesn't exist, it shows that the specific god that Wes believes in doesn't exist due to his beliefs being factually wrong.
You see, the concept of god isn't just one thing. So each "concept" of god needs to be addressed individually, or if they fit into certain categories we can show them to be wrong, such as the tri-omni version. Or one that leads to a contradiction (truly omnipotent, not just omnipotent up to the laws of logic)
@@crashoppe Do you think that the default state of belief is to accept a claim until it has been disproven?
@@crashoppe ok since you don't seem to grasp basic logic.
If someone you know says they have 20 billion dollars in the bank, do you believe them or do you disbelieve them by default?
Matt's answer to Larry was epic:
Larry: "I have watched many of your shows, and agree with everything you say"🤤
Matt: "Then how can you be a theist"?🤨
Freaking radical!!🥳🤣
When Matt says: "Go find somebody else to rub, Ram - you're not rubbing me!" I almost died 😂
It is a terrifying situation that a fundamentalist theist occupies a position of great political power (Speaker of the House) and that the body politic of this country is infected significantly with individuals with this degree of ignorance.
"Go find somebody else to rub Ram, you're not rubbing me!"
I can't 😅 , Matt is great!
Brandon is so awesome. He has made me think about things in a different light while watching his Mindshift channel so many times! Thanks!
This is the firest time I've heard MindShift Skeptic. I really love the way he tries to steelman the callers' arguments. It really puts the onus on the caller to be clear about what they are saying they believe. He makes some great points in a really patient way. Would like to see more of him!
What an incredible show. The two of you have different approaches but both work so well together. Loved this episode. Seriously one of my favorites I've seen.
I love Brandon!! Please have him back!! ❤
Greg wins the gold medal for mental gymnastics 🥇
Brandon is my new fave host. Well done!
Excellent combo of hosts. 👏👏👏 Great calls.
Wow. Wow. Wow. Really great episode. Loved every minute.
Proud of you Brandon!
Plz have Brandon on more often.
I never had any problems with death, hell, meaning after deconstructing. It could've been that I had doubts for a long time.
After being surrounded by Christians, my whole life, finding like-minded people on the Internet was so refreshing. I realized I wasn't the only one having a hard time believing things my family seem to actually believe.
Brandon speaks with total clarity
Would love to see more of Matt and Brandon together, they really complement each other, great show guys 😊
What a bloody great show.
ive neen waiting for brandon to be featured in one of these! i watch his channel religiously (haha), and i hope to see more of him here!!
Mindshift is awesome ❤
Brandon, you need a callin show. You’ll kill it! I promise you.
More Brandon,please
Wes felt uncomfortable in his doubt so he snug back under the blanket of faith.
Brandon Is truly great!
Greg kept saying no one in the Bible saw God after the fall, or if they saw him it was sort of sideways and hidden a little bit. Do you not think Jacob saw God as he wrestled with god? Do you not think Abraham saw God as he had supper with him? Do you not think Moses and 500 elders of Israel saw God when they laid their eyeballs on him like the Bible says? Have Christians never cracked open their own Bible?
The less they know about the bible, the more confidently they speak.
And the GOLD in the Mental Gymnastics goes to……….Greg!!! 👏👏👏 (🎶🎵 Oh say can you see……..🎶)
This was a great episode!!! 🎉
These 2 on screen look like a father and son, or a before and after. 🤣🤣 Matt changed my life years ago, and Brandon is the best thing going, I’m Mindshift for life! 🤘
Yo Ram, I’ll take a 3 month massage!!! I’ll even say “Oh god” while I’m on the table, and that can be proof of god’s existence. 🤣
Bring Brandon back any day! Great show!
Brandon fuckin killed it, and this is a power duo.
Why is it that every theist who says "I watch the show all the time" never seem to know that answering a yes or no question with anything other than yes or no will piss everyone off.
@clukinvar probably because they dont watch the show much.
they are treating this like they would a convo with a rando off the street.
they dont seem to know they will be talking to "experts".
good for entertainment though, lol.
Glad to hear Matt verbalize his efforts to do better with callers.
Verbalizing possible intent and doing it are two remotely different things. Let's SEE him do it.
@@Sealust50 Yeah, I agree. He's still just as much of a dick than ever. I guess it makes him feel good or something. Kind of a bummer.
2:13:28 - Wes: "I don't take the bulk of Judaism as an authority over the Bible".
This is my new favorite quote. Its like saying: "I don't take the bulk of car mechanics as an authority over the problems with my car".
Actually a new level of self deception and ignorance, you'll literally ignore the experts of a subject because your view is different. Amazing stuff. 10/10 brain working.
I've been watching a few of Brandon's videos lately and then he turns up on here!! Must be that meddling god working mysteriously.....😎.
What an excellent host he is. Really enjoyed his input today and I hope to see him more on here.
(around 2:25:00) - So the agreement is that god wants everyone who could possibly be saved to be saved. Would demonstrating his existence make it *_harder_* for anyone to accept/worship/whatever him?
If not, the whole excuse falls apart.
If yes... well, then I have to ask why? The immediate thought I have is that only a monster would be _harder_ to worship if I really got to know it.
It's a real pleasure to see the two of you on a show together.
I am not in need of deconstructing anything religious, I never really believed - even when, as a child, I was telling people I was a Catholic - but I love watching the Line.
Seeing how foreign from mine some people's thought processes are is really fascinating to me and instructive. I think it helps me be more empathetic towards religious people and it sharpens my reasoning.
We don’t need 100% percent Greg. I think most atheists would be impressed by 25%. So long as it’s verifiable
That's such a common dodge: of course I can't get you to 100%...
Dude. There IS no 100. Forget 100. How did you get to even 10? Can uou move someone from 0 to 10?
That and "how can we even "KNOW" anything?
This is such a common dodge. As you say, "never mind 100. Agreed nothing is 100. Can you get someone from 0 to 10? How did YOU get even to 10?"
Or the adjacent dodge. Any good reason? So often they flip to "well how can we really KNOW anything? We might be brains in vats."
Dude. Do you have a reasonable confidence that Australia exists? Great. Tell me how to have that same level of confidence that this Yahweh character is as real as Australia.
_...IS_ Yahweh as real as Australia?"
Greg is impossible to talk to
"well let me turn the question around to you .... well you just have to look at the evidence ....well I didn't say that I KNOW..."
Nothing of substance left his mouth that entire call, it was all just sophistry.
I was just like Greg a few years ago. I actually had an argument with someone, insisting that God of the Old Testament was a good god. I BELIEVED GOD WAS GOOD despite all the verses stating the contrary.
Its so weird how some religious people are absolutely unable to give a single straight answer to even the simplest of questions.
Ummm ALL theists
@@gowdsake7103 False claim.
I have many theist friends who have no problem giving straight and honest answers to questions.
Maybe not always good nor reasonable answers, but straight and honest answers nevertheless.
@@toniheikkila5607That just sounds like these friends of yours are more articulate and comfortable in private discussion as opposed to being on a popular live show where your answers will be judged for what they are and not be sugarcoated by existing friendship. Your friends think they are answering questions that amount to something they could never demonstrate, while these people are dumbfounded you'd even need to question it to begin with because they don't need a demonstration. They are different subsets of the same branch, all uninformed or unwilling to be informed people. It is a poor comparison on your part.
It is not unique to religious people. All thinking human beings do it.
It's a foresight situation. Seeing a few steps ahead of the question or where it's leading.
@@toniheikkila5607to questions regarding providing objective evidence for the existence of their god or the veracity of their holy book or just general non-important questions?
Happy to see Brandon on the Line. Much respect
Brandon is great!!! 👏👍👌