I'm no mariner, but I sailed with my pal on his J-30 200++ times in the SF Bay. There are times in that bay where you get vicious riptides moving 5.5 knots, just about the hull speed of that boat. You can have sails full, tight as a drum, thrashing through the waves like Victory at Sea and be moving backwards. I can recall a few pretty hairy occasions when were caught in those tides getting sucked into one of the supports of the SF Bay Bridge.
Oh shit. Brandon must have been the selected captain at the time. This is one of the most amazing videos you have ever posted, and I note your terminology related to the square rigger is 100% accurate.
Hahaha...! Had to laugh Sal, when you apologized for naming all the rigging..., You were on a pace like you were talking to some very experienced sailors... I love hearing all the specifics of those sailing ships..., I am not a sailor, but a “geek” of sorts for anything on water... Blancolirio recommend you for good reporting on the container shipping, and the oil pipe rupture. I have enjoyed your in-depth reporting, and I thank you. Great video.
I wasn't a bosun mate, so I would be just as lost. I'll be down in 1MMR with the SSTGs, that's my area of having a clue, lol. As a subscriber to Drachinifel, I do appreciate the old ships of the line, I'm just not that fluent in all the nitpicky stuff, it's all ropes sticks and cloth to me.
@@wgowshipping Feel free to throw out a "History Moment" video on slow news days! (keep a few in the can for when you go on vacation) Also, hat tip to the gentleman in white on the tug that rolled, he keeps his feet dry and uniform clean!
As I understand this was the ss Cisne Branco for her own propulsion going upstream assisted by the grey small tug. They then lost their power and the not their best line was used for the assisting tug and it snapped off. The orange larger tug was when the accident occurred laying holding the current downstream. In a video you can see that the small tug was not able to either push or hold Cisne Branco. When this was observed by the tug laying downstream you can see the exhaust from the stock and that they propell forward to assist the unlucky one.
The fore topgallant(?) mast was intact when she stopped against the bridge. I suspect that the forestays were snapped when they pulled her off stern first, and the bow swung around into the bridge. That would have taken support from the fore topgallant, and brought it down by tension from the backstays. Looked her up, only 2 mast doublings, so forecourse, upper + lower topsails, upper + lower topgallant. Mainmast adds a skysail. Lots of tugs have been lost by tripping that way.
No excuse for having no engine running on the Cisne Branco. It may not have done any good but it shoulda been running. Quite the Bernoulli effect in that bend in the river producing very squirrely current. Maybe they escape pretty lightly with "just" shroud damage and damage to the forward mast...doesn't look (within the video you showed) that the hull was damaged. Not that replacing a bunch of shrouds and the foremast would be cheap.
Ya! Think so I have shield before and with recent news this is top of the charts and now I very interested to watch all of your videos everyday thank you thank you it's so cool having somebody that is telling it like it is
Sal can you follow the "Julie B" barge that is being towed from Saint Simons Sound to Lousiana with two sections of the Golden Ray on the deck of the barge? It looks like the barge could roll if they encounter heavy weather. They won't be able to outrun any storms.
Small tug operator was just not on his game that day. I bet he is kicking himself in the ass right now. There are not to many things that can screw a tugboat up but that is one of them. Bad day. Glad they all got out.
Having these kinds of old-style wailing ships is most likely counting as a strategic reserve in case of EMPs or CMEs taking out the electronic infrastructure.
*The reality of the rich and the poor is this: the rich invest their money and spend what is left. The poor spend their money and invest what is left"*
The tug skipper probably put the rope in aft as that anchor was gonna get in his way, the little navy tug on forward seems to have a lot of rope out and he did this to keep his stern gear away from the payed out anchor cable and in a very vein attempt to help pull her off broadside but looking at that damage to the fore mast I dont think he did to well. A rope over the main tow rope called a gob rope might have saved a wet white uniform....
It could be a replay of how JFK let his pt109 get rammed and sunk by a far less agile destroyer. He was idling in poor visibility with the engine not in gear and was almost court martialed until strings were pulled.
This is off topic, but I saw a live video today if several navy ships off the chesapeake bay area. Is that normal? I live in ohio. The person taking the video has lived there all her life and she said action there is ramping up lately.
Interesting video. Make understand "not sailors" what current can do. I "guess" they used rope not strong enough and that one failed. After hit the bridge - tug boat (the big one) have enough power to move the sail boat, but not when it's stuck and the tug boat will try to pull her out sideways against the current. The tug boat made propulsion which will hit the hull and keel, there wasn't chance to do it this way. Why the tug her out stern first and why small tug boat was connected, I don't understand. I will choose different option, but I guess inexperienced crew is my guess. If the rope was strong enough, we will not watch this video...
With the advent of bow and stern thrusters, and now azipods, the art of manoeuvring with tugs is being lost. Barge tug captains are the few that have this skill anymore. Even pilots are losing (or never gaining) this skill. But honestly, this was a total clusterduck. The capsizing was due to improper communication and a modicum of improper boat handling. The small tug should have had the towline lead out from the stern. The bigger tug was towing too fast for the stern tug. Like I said, total flustercluck.
Speed..absolute killer for tugboat's, the whole job has to much sternway on it for the bow tug to cope and the tug does not look man enough for the job anyway and he has no gob rope over his towrope, he should have put that on as soon as he made fast forward knowing it was going to back up the river. It is inevitable what is going to happen to him with that sternway and no gob, I would have tripped the hook the as soon as I recovered from the first pull down and looked after myself but in these circumstances blind panic sometime's takes over and if you are on your own you become to busy trying to control the boat to do anything else, can't believe that towrope did not part when he was beam on, I wonder what the SWL is on the rope and I wonder were all the doors closed...anyway not blaming anyone better brains than me will decide that and who could forsee the chain of events for that day. Absolutely made up they all survived because everything can be replaced except life but harrowing to see the crew on the hull !
Are you going to do an after-the-fact video about USS Fitzgerald? Or USS John McCain? Or USS Lake Champlain? Or USS Antietam? Or USS Greenville? I do wonder how your tone and obvious glee with the Cisne Branco incident might differ with any one of the above.
First, I don't have any glee with an incident. Fortunately, no one was hurt or killed. What I was doing was breaking down the incident to see what could have happened and explain a maritime event as it transpired. Second, I commented on the events regarding Fitzgerald and McCain quite a bit. Prior to posting my video I talked to a ship master who recently sailed into that port and he provided me with information on the current and conditions that Cisne Branco encountered.
@@wgowshipping In your first 13 seconds the tone of sheer sensationalism, combined with the trite article headline opens your video like an entertainment thrill. You weren't 'breaking it down' either. You are speculating at very very best. At 02:13 you yourself describe the images as 'great'. At 04:08 you are rashly dismissive of the tug crews efforts which are certainly lessening the strain on both rig and bridge at no small potential risk to themselves. At 04:57 you begin an attack on their action of dropping the anchor or its timeliness again in the most piously dismissive tone from the cosy safety of your office throne, and again utterly uninformed of the potential reasons for that delay, if there even was one. Whether it will stop the vessel or not the fact is they had the presence of mind to try that in very very challenging circumstances. It almost certainly lessened the impact and despite the fact you were certainly not on deck to have to take stock of that rapidly deteriorating situation. At 10:40 you comment there is no propwash. That would certainly be expected at that point if since impact was imminent. There would be very very little using the engine at that point would do, if they had it available, it would probably make it worse.
You are entitle to your opinion. Perhaps my enthusiasm to talk about the subject is misinterpreted. As a college professor I am enthusiastic when I am also talking about dark subjects.
@@wgowshipping ‘Enthusiasm’ - is that how you try to paint over patent glee that you can comment authoritatively about a mariners tragic mishap for which he/she will likely pay a heavy toll. If you want to comment professionally try to emulate a professional journalist/broadcaster. The line of cheap baseball caps gives the game away.
@@wgowshipping that is not broaching. Look it up in the dictionary. I've been on a submarine that broached and we didn't go sideways. We were trying to surface as fast as possible to avoid sinking to the bottom.
@@wgowshipping whatever. Going sideways in the current is nothing compared to a submarine hitting the surface at ahead full with a 45° up angle hoping to God you get to see the sun again.
Joe...I am not arguing with you, but that term has been used with sailing vessels long before submarines were around. Getting sideways to the wind and thrown on your beam ends is probably as harrowing as a an emergency blow to the surface
Your headline is so trite. You sit there all high and mighty offering your after-the-fact ‘wisdom’ when you don’t know the first thing about the actual circumstances they tragically found themselves in. I hope you have a tragedy one day and the next you can listen to other ‘experts’ ride roughshod over you.
You are more than welcome to not watch my videos, but news reports, which I cited in my story, only provided a brief overview and I attempted to place the events on video into context. My UA-cam page is open to comments and you are free to post your commentary. Feel free to watch any of my other videos, such as the those on the Bonhomme Richard fire and you will see that I take accidents seriously and not trite. Thanks for watching.
I'm no mariner, but I sailed with my pal on his J-30 200++ times in the SF Bay. There are times in that bay where you get vicious riptides moving 5.5 knots, just about the hull speed of that boat. You can have sails full, tight as a drum, thrashing through the waves like Victory at Sea and be moving backwards. I can recall a few pretty hairy occasions when were caught in those tides getting sucked into one of the supports of the SF Bay Bridge.
Oh shit. Brandon must have been the selected captain at the time. This is one of the most amazing videos you have ever posted, and I note your terminology related to the square rigger is 100% accurate.
Hahaha...!
Had to laugh Sal, when you apologized for naming all the rigging...,
You were on a pace like you were talking to some very experienced sailors...
I love hearing all the specifics of those sailing ships...,
I am not a sailor, but a “geek” of sorts for anything on water...
Blancolirio recommend you for good reporting on the container shipping, and the oil pipe rupture.
I have enjoyed your in-depth reporting, and I thank you.
Great video.
I was about to start calling put the specific sails and yards but I realize that when I get that wonky I lose people.
Thanks for subscribing.
Not many "merchants" can call out sails and rigging let alone on a full rigged ship. I am seriously impressed. Well done. Thank you.
@@wgowshipping hahaha...
I wasn't a bosun mate, so I would be just as lost. I'll be down in 1MMR with the SSTGs, that's my area of having a clue, lol. As a subscriber to Drachinifel, I do appreciate the old ships of the line, I'm just not that fluent in all the nitpicky stuff, it's all ropes sticks and cloth to me.
@@wgowshipping Feel free to throw out a "History Moment" video on slow news days! (keep a few in the can for when you go on vacation) Also, hat tip to the gentleman in white on the tug that rolled, he keeps his feet dry and uniform clean!
Thanks Sal. Hoping for the tug crews safe recovery. Great report.
As I understand this was the ss Cisne Branco for her own propulsion going upstream assisted by the grey small tug.
They then lost their power and the not their best line was used for the assisting tug and it snapped off.
The orange larger tug was when the accident occurred laying holding the current downstream.
In a video you can see that the small tug was not able to either push or hold Cisne Branco.
When this was observed by the tug laying downstream you can see the exhaust from the stock and that they propell forward to assist the unlucky one.
The fore topgallant(?) mast was intact when she stopped against the bridge. I suspect that the forestays were snapped when they pulled her off stern first, and the bow swung around into the bridge. That would have taken support from the fore topgallant, and brought it down by tension from the backstays. Looked her up, only 2 mast doublings, so forecourse, upper + lower topsails, upper + lower topgallant. Mainmast adds a skysail. Lots of tugs have been lost by tripping that way.
Wow! I learn so much from each of your videos. I would have loved your classes!
I believe the Matrix is falling apart...I'm seeing a lot more accidents like this.
I believe you may be right.
And now for something different!
PS - High drama pushes containers off the front page for a few seconds.
Looks like maybe the little tug had the rudder hard to starboard and as it got drug backward spun the tug to the broadside and then rolled it over.
No excuse for having no engine running on the Cisne Branco. It may not have done any good but it shoulda been running. Quite the Bernoulli effect in that bend in the river producing very squirrely current. Maybe they escape pretty lightly with "just" shroud damage and damage to the forward mast...doesn't look (within the video you showed) that the hull was damaged. Not that replacing a bunch of shrouds and the foremast would be cheap.
Ya! Think so I have shield before and with recent news this is top of the charts and now I very interested to watch all of your videos everyday thank you thank you it's so cool having somebody that is telling it like it is
No. The crew did not expect to pass that bridge.
What is going on with shipping?
undertow, strong currents, might as well add whirlpools and rogue waves, glad I'm mostly a landlubber!
Sal can you follow the "Julie B" barge that is being towed from Saint Simons Sound to Lousiana with two sections of the Golden Ray on the deck of the barge? It looks like the barge could roll if they encounter heavy weather. They won't be able to outrun any storms.
Very interesting Sal.
It's a good break from all the container, port, and trucking doom. They'll likely get this ship fixed up before the shipping mess is resolved.
Geez! How hairy. That current must have caused a lot of trouble over tie.
That Skipper has a lot of explaining.
Small tug operator was just not on his game that day. I bet he is kicking himself in the ass right now. There are not to many things that can screw a tugboat up but that is one of them. Bad day. Glad they all got out.
Having these kinds of old-style wailing ships is most likely counting as a strategic reserve in case of EMPs or CMEs taking out the electronic infrastructure.
*The reality of the rich and the poor is this: the rich invest their money and spend what is left. The poor spend their money and invest what is left"*
Investing in crypto is the best way to earn financial freedom,Without doubt crypto is so money making
This is the kind of information that we don’t get from most youtubers..
*I could invest in Crypto but always got confused by it’s volatility in nature.*
@@elizabethstone911 That won't bother you if you trade with a professional like Mr Larry Stafan.
Count me in, I’m placing my trades with Expert Larry Stafan ASAP
Just goes to show in emergency situation people don’t think out their plan they just react. Especially when the small tag got pulled under.
More training means your reaction is more likely to be correct.
The tug skipper probably put the rope in aft as that anchor was gonna get in his way, the little navy tug on forward seems to have a lot of rope out and he did this to keep his stern gear away from the payed out anchor cable and in a very vein attempt to help pull her off broadside but looking at that damage to the fore mast I dont think he did to well. A rope over the main tow rope called a gob rope might have saved a wet white uniform....
Does anyone knew the final outcome of the small tug.....did it sink was it recoverable?
They were shouting Vamos Brandon ! . I guess Brandon was driving the orange tug or somesuch?
It could be a replay of how JFK let his pt109 get rammed and sunk by a far less agile destroyer. He was idling in poor visibility with the engine not in gear and was almost court martialed until strings were pulled.
This is off topic, but I saw a live video today if several navy ships off the chesapeake bay area. Is that normal? I live in ohio. The person taking the video has lived there all her life and she said action there is ramping up lately.
There is frequent training off the Virginia Capes.
Interesting video. Make understand "not sailors" what current can do. I "guess" they used rope not strong enough and that one failed. After hit the bridge - tug boat (the big one) have enough power to move the sail boat, but not when it's stuck and the tug boat will try to pull her out sideways against the current. The tug boat made propulsion which will hit the hull and keel, there wasn't chance to do it this way. Why the tug her out stern first and why small tug boat was connected, I don't understand. I will choose different option, but I guess inexperienced crew is my guess. If the rope was strong enough, we will not watch this video...
Ay caramba!!
Never go full Brazilian.
Don’t knock it if you haven’t tried it
@@Dog.soldier1950 ARE YOU saying Brazilians are retarded...sure sounds like it, eh.
@@scottscouter1065 Brazilian is a American slang for a full shave “DOWN THERE” on men or women
@@Dog.soldier1950 You mean down there in South America ... SURE! Actually in Brazil the undergrowth is usually removed by BURNING, so there's that!
@@scottscouter1065 It's a friction thing.
Sal. Does your computer have translation capability?
I was able to translate the tweets, but they were just general statements.
Dangerous !Too much power by the big tug, Small tug had no chance !
'Cisne Branco' in portuguese means 'White Swan' in english.
That was So Scary 😧
sound different? changed mic setting?
Yes...better or worse?
I have ordered a new mic for my school office to match the one I have at home
@@wgowshipping i noticed,because it sounded a little more like from a box. i prefered the earlier sound,as that was clearer
With the advent of bow and stern thrusters, and now azipods, the art of manoeuvring with tugs is being lost. Barge tug captains are the few that have this skill anymore. Even pilots are losing (or never gaining) this skill. But honestly, this was a total clusterduck. The capsizing was due to improper communication and a modicum of improper boat handling. The small tug should have had the towline lead out from the stern. The bigger tug was towing too fast for the stern tug. Like I said, total flustercluck.
Take a little more time. I can't keep up with you flashing in and out on images.
Sorry about that
Speed..absolute killer for tugboat's, the whole job has to much sternway on it for the bow tug to cope and the tug does not look man enough for the job anyway and he has no gob rope over his towrope, he should have put that on as soon as he made fast forward knowing it was going to back up the river. It is inevitable what is going to happen to him with that sternway and no gob, I would have tripped the hook the as soon as I recovered from the first pull down and looked after myself but in these circumstances blind panic sometime's takes over and if you are on your own you become to busy trying to control the boat to do anything else, can't believe that towrope did not part when he was beam on, I wonder what the SWL is on the rope and I wonder were all the doors closed...anyway not blaming anyone better brains than me will decide that and who could forsee the chain of events for that day. Absolutely made up they all survived because everything can be replaced except life but harrowing to see the crew on the hull !
Cesar Chinese owned ports they’re just not unloading are you afraid to say that
? I'm new
👍👍👊👊
hey, it was a TRAINING SHIP YUK YUK YUK
Grade F-.
I expect they learned something!
Are you going to do an after-the-fact video about USS Fitzgerald? Or USS John McCain? Or USS Lake Champlain? Or USS Antietam? Or USS Greenville? I do wonder how your tone and obvious glee with the Cisne Branco incident might differ with any one of the above.
First, I don't have any glee with an incident. Fortunately, no one was hurt or killed. What I was doing was breaking down the incident to see what could have happened and explain a maritime event as it transpired.
Second, I commented on the events regarding Fitzgerald and McCain quite a bit. Prior to posting my video I talked to a ship master who recently sailed into that port and he provided me with information on the current and conditions that Cisne Branco encountered.
@@wgowshipping In your first 13 seconds the tone of sheer sensationalism, combined with the trite article headline opens your video like an entertainment thrill. You weren't 'breaking it down' either. You are speculating at very very best. At 02:13 you yourself describe the images as 'great'.
At 04:08 you are rashly dismissive of the tug crews efforts which are certainly lessening the strain on both rig and bridge at no small potential risk to themselves.
At 04:57 you begin an attack on their action of dropping the anchor or its timeliness again in the most piously dismissive tone from the cosy safety of your office throne, and again utterly uninformed of the potential reasons for that delay, if there even was one. Whether it will stop the vessel or not the fact is they had the presence of mind to try that in very very challenging circumstances. It almost certainly lessened the impact and despite the fact you were certainly not on deck to have to take stock of that rapidly deteriorating situation.
At 10:40 you comment there is no propwash. That would certainly be expected at that point if since impact was imminent. There would be very very little using the engine at that point would do, if they had it available, it would probably make it worse.
@@wgowshipping The glee is evident from listening.
You are entitle to your opinion. Perhaps my enthusiasm to talk about the subject is misinterpreted. As a college professor I am enthusiastic when I am also talking about dark subjects.
@@wgowshipping ‘Enthusiasm’ - is that how you try to paint over patent glee that you can comment authoritatively about a mariners tragic mishap for which he/she will likely pay a heavy toll.
If you want to comment professionally try to emulate a professional journalist/broadcaster. The line of cheap baseball caps gives the game away.
Whales broach, submarines broach, surface ships do not broach.
I disagree. Ships broach when they go sidewide to the wind.
@@wgowshipping that is not broaching. Look it up in the dictionary.
I've been on a submarine that broached and we didn't go sideways. We were trying to surface as fast as possible to avoid sinking to the bottom.
@@joecombs7468 It means both.
www.dictionary.com/browse/broach
"Sailing vessel to veer to windward."
"To break the surface of the water."
@@wgowshipping whatever.
Going sideways in the current is nothing compared to a submarine hitting the surface at ahead full with a 45° up angle hoping to God you get to see the sun again.
Joe...I am not arguing with you, but that term has been used with sailing vessels long before submarines were around. Getting sideways to the wind and thrown on your beam ends is probably as harrowing as a an emergency blow to the surface
Woman driver!
Your headline is so trite. You sit there all high and mighty offering your after-the-fact ‘wisdom’ when you don’t know the first thing about the actual circumstances they tragically found themselves in. I hope you have a tragedy one day and the next you can listen to other ‘experts’ ride roughshod over you.
You are more than welcome to not watch my videos, but news reports, which I cited in my story, only provided a brief overview and I attempted to place the events on video into context.
My UA-cam page is open to comments and you are free to post your commentary. Feel free to watch any of my other videos, such as the those on the Bonhomme Richard fire and you will see that I take accidents seriously and not trite.
Thanks for watching.
Too much Blah blah blah before news