UR just mess'n with our instant gratification senses eh...;) seriously have to wait till the next vid???? hey, really like your vids. please don't take this wrong.... are you using powder based foundation or liquid. the lights really shine off those beautiful cheeks.
@@min2oly Haha I tried to cover the experiments all in one video, but then it got waaay too long. Thanks for the compliment; currently using a liquid foundation.
Ah, I should! I technically just posted my first products on my Teespring store (shh the banner needs to be updated), but I don't have any mugs yet. Maybe I should do a poll to see which design people like the best... teespring.com/stores/girltalksfish
I love how deep you dive into all your experiments. I'm still so proud of how far you've come in your fish career. I always knew way back when, that your channel was something special and so were and are you! 👍💓👍
This video is perfect timing. I'm about to setup a new aquarium and I want to give fishless cycling another shot. I've only tried it once before using fish food, but with results similar to your second test. I can't wait to see part 2.
Love the video. I have a few comments/questions. 1) Did you add any fertilizer? Nitrifying organisms need trace elements to grow too, occasionally the cycle can stall because they don't have the correct available nutrients to reproduce. A teeny bit of Easy Green would prevent that. 2) One of the issues with bottled bacteria is that no producer to my knowledge includes ammonia oxidizing archaea. Fairly recent research on the subject has demonstrated that archaea is the heavy lifter when it comes to oxidizing ammonia in the aquarium (especially freshwater aquariums), and not the nitrosonomas bacteria that was believed to be the primary oxidizer in the past. In particular, nitrifying archaea thrive in low ammonia environments while nitrosonomas bacteria thrive in higher ammonia environments. The reason this is particularly relevant to this test is that when all you have in the tank is bacteria, lower amounts of ammonia, like 2 ppm, a) might not be enough to stimulate population growth in the bacterial colonies and b) amounts under a certain threshold, like 0.25 ppm ammonia, might not even be enough for the bacteria to oxidize and they may instead go dormant or die, resulting in a stalled cycle. It seems like there's a good chance that this is what happened with the second method 3) I'll bet the tank cycles much faster with plants for two reasons: a) fertilizer will ensure that the nitrifying organisms have no mineral deficiencies and b) the plants will have come from a cycled environment. Even if they were grown emersed they'll have both archaea and bacteria living on them and will act like cycled media to seed the aquarium. The same thing happens with fish-in cycling, the fish itself has nitrifying organisms living on it and it seeds the aquarium filtration. I cycled a 45 gallon aquarium in 3 days from a single bioring once. I know lots of people have demonstrated that you can use used filter media to cycle and aquarium but I'd love to see some experiments to show how little of a seed you can get away with. One bioring? A cubic inch of sponge? A single plant? a pebble of gravel? Some people have suggested that a spoonful of soil from any half-fertile bit of ground outside works as a seed too. If that's true, then why on earth are we buying bottles of incomplete bacteria? 4) Last comment: you touched for the briefest moment on one of the most misunderstood topics in the freshwater hobby: pH. Most of the time pH isn't very important but when it comes to the nitrogen cycle it's super important. That chart shows how it affect toxicity but also, nitrifying bacteria are only capable of peak growth between 7.6 and 7.8. Anywhere outside that range and they will grow more slowly (we don't yet know the peak growth environment for ammonia oxidizing archaea but it seems to be in the same vicinity, though perhaps a little lower, like 7.5ish). Below 7 and it's going to take significantly longer. Below 6.5 and it'll take months. Below 6 and it may never happen at all, and a pH below 5.5 kills them. For that reason, while chasing pH with fish in the tank is generally a terrible idea, whe performing a fishless cycle, I recommend using either distilled vinegar or baking soda (to lower or raise pH, respectively) to get the system to the optimal growth range. Then when it's cycled, you can just do a few big water changes to bring it back to whatever's normal for your location and you're good to go. Great to see you doing practical testing for this topic. I love your videos in general. Cheers!
Glad you enjoyed it, and thanks for sharing your experiences! For Method 1 and 2 in this video, I followed the exact instructions given by Dr. Tim's Aquatics (linked in the description). As for the other methods of cycling I did, you'll have to wait till parts 2 and 3. :)
can i just say HOW MUCH i appreciate you for doing these testings, methodical, and sometimes sooooo long? i mean... it's really priceless and the amount of work that goes in and the TIME and how much time you can save us is just really special and helpful.
These experiments are so useful.. Honestly thankyou thankyou.. Nothing is 100% but these sort of results are much more factual than an anecdotal comment on a forum or a video. Those failures you speak of imo are fantastic.. Gives you a realistic expectation.. And might prevent a new fish keeper from adding fish too early (which is what I did on my 1st tank). I actually think the solution might even be a little from video 1,2 and 3 if possible!
I did my fish less cycle with only plants (thanks to you ) but still added an established filter once I added a fish . I’m about to add the rest of my center piece fish this weekend 😁
Looking at your chart, your ammonia was almost gone at week 7, until you added another 2ppm of ammonia. Spikes in ammonia can actually stall and prolong a cycle, which is what I think happened here. Don't give up! Worth trying it again. This is a marathon, not a sprint :) I've used this very same method (same Dr. Tim's) without adding any starter bacteria, at 4ppm and had wonderful success. I did do water changes to keep my nitrates where I would want them once fish were in. I noticed the higher my nitrates got, the lower the ph was getting. I treated it like a fully stocked tank and did my water changes while feeding with ammonia every time it hit 0ppm. It did slow the cycle down, but did pick back up and headed in the right direction. EVENTUALLY, my tank was able to process 4ppm in 24 hours (doing water changes to lower nitrates). Once I saw it was happening on a consistent basis, I did a big water change, added my fish and had no issues at all. Notice how long it took your initial 2ppm to get to 1ppm (with the addition of starter bacteria...2 weeks). Notice it only took 1 week to go from 2ppm to 1ppm (week 8-9) without adding starter bacteria? You were almost there! Don't give up :)
Good to know. Yeah, since the point of my experiments was to find the fastest and most efficient method of cycling, I decided to quit at 9 weeks instead of continuing the experiment another 1-2 months. Most beginners will give up way before 2 months, so in parts 2 and 3, I explore other methods that are potentially faster.
Most people don't wanna deal with live plants. Sorry but it's exhausting seeing everyone recommend plants. What we want is the fastest cycling method that doesn't involve plants.
I learned from Cichlid Forum that water changes are essential to fish less cycling with straight ammonia. Small water change every day and ammonia dosing every other day. Seems counterintuitive, but it's worked on the last two tanks I've cycled! Can't wait to see about other options though!
Interesting! Now I wish I had tried that. I just followed the instructions given by Dr. Tim's Aquatics (links in description) since I was using his ammonia product.
There is a lot of aquarium metaphysics out there, so kudos, Irene, for always being so thorough. I love your experiments because they help everyone (especially beginners) to reduce the guesswork. What was your hypothesis behind the first experiment? Where should the bacteria come from? I cycled three tanks following Dr. Tim's guide and was quite successful. I want to make two remarks: First, the method is much faster when you work with already established media, gravel, plants, etc. As you mentioned, aquariums are micro eco-systems that are affected by many variables and not just what comes out of a bottle. Forget the heater during cycling--add weeks to the process. Second comment: always check your checker. In my last tank (only a few months old) I thought I did everything right but I just couldn't get below 0.25 ammonia. I contacted Seachem asking about the batch of Stability I had, then bought different bacteria, tested like a maniac, but it just wouldn't go down. Then it dawned on me that my only point of reference is my API test kit (the one you use). It wasn't expired but I bought a new one anyway, and guess what: my older kit always showed a slightly green tinge while the new one was yellow. I sent photos to Seachem showing them how even distilled water tested positive for ammonia. They doubted what they saw, asking where I "sourced" my distilled water (Target). So, now, when I need to be sure, I always have a control test tube with RODI water. That doesn't apply to you experiments, I know, but if you take a scientific approach to the hobby that is something to keep in mind.
Little late to the party here but I LOVED this vid! Easy to comprehend, simple and straight forward whilst still being super informative. Thank you for experimenting making it easier for all of us! Subbed
Can't wait for part 2, I too am just about to cycle a 260ltr planted tank, with a sand substrate, so my plants will be water column feeders.I enjoy your video's keep up the great work.👍👍👍
Yes, I believe you were one of the original commenters that asked for this video! Parts 2 and 3 are coming right up as the next two Saturday releases. :)
Fishless cycling with ammonium chloride always worked for me (I use the powder form and heavily plant though). Only time I had an issue was cycling my 40 Gal dirted tank. My ph was stuck at 6.0 and wasnt cycling properly over 2 months in. I added a bit of baking soda to bring the ph up, and within a couple days the cycle was complete (0 ppm Amm, 0 ppm Nitrite, 20 ppm Nitrate). I recently began stocking: 6 Panda Corys, 5 Amano shrimp, and 4 Nerites so far. Ember tetras, pencilfish, and Apistos will be added soon!
Well done running tests like this. My recent shrimp / planted aquarium took two months to cycle using household (non additive/perfumed) Ammonia added in 1-2ml batches. Ammonia never got above 2 for more than a few days and that was after adding 3ml once when I wanted to see what would happen. I use a Salifert Ammonia test.
I've never used the Fritz product, but I've started several tanks with their pure ammonia and their One and Only live bacteria and never had the problems you did. Each tank was up and running within (IIRC) ten days or less. I have to think either the bottle of Fritz was bad, or something else was wrong with the experiment. Might be worth repeating with Dr. Tim's ammonia *and* their One and Only for a comparison.
Very interesting video Irene! I use seeded media from another tank to start the cycle. But if you’re starting fresh with no other tanks this info will be very helpful.
Can we use ammonium nitrate solution to keep the bacteria alive in an already cycled and established aquarium if we want to keep it without fish temporarily?
My only issue with the experiment is that 2ppm is... well, a LOT. I understand the goal is to cultivate a mass amount of healthy BB, but most people keep fish for years and never see even close to 2ppm (or maybe I’ve been lucky LOL). OTHER THAN THAT: excellent video as usual!! I very much look forward to part 2!!!💖💖💖💖💖
Irene, can you please help? My tap water tests positive ammonia (API Test kit and Tetra Test Strips). I run it through an RO system and it lowers the ammonia level a bit but still like at least 2 ppm min. I dose with Prime and Stability and I have a good amount of healthy growing live plants. But if my water going in on water changes or topping is showing ammonia how will I ever get to zero ammonia?
Oh my god, those fish have huge poops. I'm not used to seeing that because I keep tetras (fairly small) and bottom-dwelling fish like corydoras and dwarf plecos.
Haha, that happened because I accidentally dropped a bunch of fish food while trying to film with one hand. I netted out as much of the food as I could find, but apparently the platies were too fast for me. 😫
Great video, it is discouraging when you’re about a month in and have been testing everyday but getting the same results, I used tetra safe start plus so I was hoping two weeks I would be good but nope, I am getting 10-20 ppm of nitrates though which is some good news, once I get to zero ppm ammonia I’m done I’m not adding anymore ammonia I’m going to assume it’s good to go and start with a school of Danios and keep my eye on ammonia levels for a few weeks before I fully stock the tank
I’m on my 8th day fishless cycling (29gallon tank) with dr Tim’s ammonia with safestart plus and stability. Dosed 4ppm ammonia on day one.. no water changes, lots of aeration and 84 degree F temp..day 8 readings are .50 ammonia 2ppm nitrites 40ppm nitrates 7.6ph.. any thoughts? Am i cycling good or am I close? Any tips will be greatly appreciated 🙏🏽
I've been trying to do a fishless cycle on my 29 gallon for nearly 8 weeks. It's doing my head in. At one point I got my ammonia down to 0 its now at 0.25. My nitrite has been at 2ppm for nearly 3 weeks and my nitrate had been around 20 for the same time. Neither of them are going up or down. I'm ready to give up. And I don't understand if I'm still supposed to be adding an ammonia source and doing a water change or if im just supposed to leave it and not do anything (apart from testing the water)
@@danielshauger8482 I asked on a forum and someone said my pH might have been too low. It was only at 6.4 so I mixed in about 4 tablespoons of baking soda into some tank water and raised the ph to 7.4. The tank finished cycled a day later
Any good advice my new tank setup with fish cycling Ph was 7.6 Ammonia is 0 Nitrite was max high Nitrate was reduce a bit Any idea how to speed up the cycling as I think is not fully cycle
I put 2 dead shrimp and some plants along with half regular well water and half established tank water from my other aquarium. Its best to do multiple methods at once i think. worked well and it was cycled in 4 days. I think the dead shrimp is what really helped it out because the bacteria they brought to the aquarium along with the ammonia and the plants will consume ammonia over time.
Fishless cycle! Please tell me Do I have to always add ammonia to 2 ppm.until my cycle will be finish?at the moment I have ammonia 0.5ppm. nitrites 2-5ppm.nitrates 5ppm.Thank you.
Adding pure ammonia to your tank to 4ppm (you must use a non-surficant type) is by far the quickest way to cycle in my experience. Dose to 4ppm and leave it alone until almost all of it converts to nitrite. Repeat this until you are showing nitrates and both ammonia and nitrite read zero within 24 hours. Hey presto, you are cycled. Never had a tank take more than 3 weeks to cycle doing it this way.
@@SmAshlie17 Did you just dose to 4ppm once, or are you doing it daily? Do it one time. I would have expected to see some nitrites by now, but just leave it, it will happen. Don't do any water changes.
I used API brand Quick Start to jump start my 10g quarantine tank. I got'er done in less than 2 wks. And I never got a big spike on either ammonia or nitrites. Yesterday I got readings of 0-0-40 and 0-0-20 after water change. I just read the directions on the bottle and doubled the dose. 1 in the filtration unit, 1 in the tank.
Did you add a declorinator when doing fishless cycle with ammonia the bacteria can’t grow if the water has chlorine or chloramine in it cos that kills the bacteria
My aquarium has been cycling fishless. On day 1, I added the tetra fast cycling solution. Today is day 11 and I tested the water. These are the results: 0ppm ammonia, 7.0 pH, 0ppm nitrite, 5.0 ppm nitrate. Is it ready to add at least 1 fish or should I wait one more week and test again?
Ye your good to add most of the fish you want,you have 5ppm nitrate meaning you have nitrifying(benafictial bacteria)within your tank,just make sure when you have your fish keep your nitrates low (I think 40ppm nitrates).
This is not related to the topic but my betta fish died of what I think is dropsy :( and after 2 days I noticed white worms the size about less than 1mm all over the glass. Should I do anything before adding any new fish to the tank?
some people's tap water already has ammonia and nitrates. so it would have been good to measure the tap water first also, as a baseline. i remember a story about a fish keeper who spent a lot of time and energy and more and more strategies to try to reduce his nitrates ... but it turns out, it was a lot of it coming from his source water! that would seem to explain why your ammonia levels didn't reach near 0, and why you had nitrates already in week 2. however, that's just based on this first video. let's see what the other videos show as a result. very nice experiments!
0:25 Can we just appreciate the 💩-ing ability of that little platy? Can you imagine if humans did that and had to drag a 15 foot 💩 behind them everywhere they went? Please excuse me... I'm running on very little sleep and haven't had my coffee yet. 🤦♀️
Haha, that happened because I accidentally dropped a bunch of fish food while trying to film with one hand. I netted out as much of the food as I could find, but apparently the platies were too fast for me. 😫
@@GirlTalksFish ohh okay I was wondering if that was normal for a fish to have that long of a poop? I’ve never seen that. Although, I am new to aquariums and I only have shrimp and snails currently.
I might be wrong but I think the bacteria need substrate to latch onto, maybe that's why your experiment with Ammonia and FritzZyme took so long? I'm struggling with fishless cycle right now! using ammonia and Tetra SafeStart+. (one of the 2 patented bacteria starters that are supposed to really work!)
Dr Tim's changed the dosage from 1 drop per gallon to 4. Everyone complained. I think the concentration of the bacteria solution increased, but the ammonia stayed the same. So the dosage was probably to be used in conjunction with the bacteria.
Ammonia alone works. your reading of 4 PPM ammonia was likely incorrect (liquid test kits are fairly accurate but at those levels its hard to tell.) anything above 5ppm will start killing off any bacteria instead of encouraging it to grow. next time actually dose to 2-3ppm and your tank will fully cycle in 4-8 weeks
What do you mean by "I fed the aquarium again"? Did you use the same Fritz Aquatics again or did you use Dr. TIm's Ammonia? I'm really new and still learning. Thank you !
Why do you test it every week? I test mine everyday for fishless cycle with ammonia and quick starter bacterias. It takes 2 days for it to drop from 2ppm to 0 for both nitrite and ammonia
My tap water always tests about .25.or higher ammonia so I was fishless cycling without ammonia. Seems after research I made have been actually picking up chloramine and my free ammonia was actually zero. So I was dosing with Prime and Stability but after not cycling I believe I wasn't feeding my beneficial bacteria was just being starved without the ammonia. Does this sound reasonable to anyone else?
it was the prime if your doing fishless cycle do not use prime it will cost the stability to think its no ammonia in water when it is just use stability and prime when ever you add water
I'm on day 7 of Dr. Tims fishless cycle in a heavily planted tank and the ammonia and nitrites have remained at zero. Nothing is happening. Whats wrong? I'm so frustrated. In this same tank i tried a fish in cycle and the fish (guppies) they lived about 3 weeks then the all died almost overnight. I never had any ammonia or nitrites then either. Suggestions?
I am going thru the exact same issue. I started off with 2ppm and well I was advised to 2 drops each day. And well it backfired. I saw results the first week then it suddenly stopped. So I did a 15% water change and addrd the bacteria again. It went down from 4 ppm to 2 ppm from the water change. Today the color seemed closer to 1 ppm. Funny thing is through all this I haven't seen nitrite at all. I did get nitrate tho around 10 ppm. Let's see I will wait for it to goto 0 Ammonia before I add more this time around.
Same with my 75g tank. Never showed nitrite at all using api master test kit. So I bought Jbl pro scan, and it picked up .25 to .5 mg/l but it's stalling out. I'm still waiting and testing every 2-3 days.
Dr. Tim’s really stressed me out as a newbie. My dropper didn’t “drop.” When I turned the bottle upside down, about a quarter of it came shooting out. My ammonia would not go down for weeks, and I had used his bottle bacteria. I started dosing it with seachem stability daily, and it finally cycled. It took me almost 2 months to cycle for my 16 gal betta aquarium 😞. I’m doing research because I want a 55 gal goldfish aquarium, and cycling still intimidates me. I look forward to more in this series!
When you're ready to start your 55 you could gravel vac you betta tank and put all the brown (mulm) water into your 55 to kick start the cycle. Just remember the bacteria are gonna need a source of ammonia to keep the cycle going.
Totally agree - I think most beginners get really stressed out by fishless cycling, which is a shame when you follow Dr. Tim's instructions to the letter and don't get the amazing results that the rest of the internet claims to see. Hope you enjoy the rest of the 3-part series!
Hey, I have recently started a tropical 20g aquarium and I am looking for center piece fish ideas. I am open to any suggestions and any at all would be greatly appreciated.
Does anyone have this problem? I used the api test and everytime I measure nitrites it reads somewhere between 0 and 0.25ppm I never seem to get the same shade as 0ppm? This is my 2nd week on fiahless cycle. Ammonia is 0 and nitrate is 20ppm
If you are worried about high ammonia and nitrite, you can dose your aquarium/pond with Seachem Pond Prime!! It doesn't get rid of the ammonia or nitrite, but it does neutralize it so it doesn't have any ill effects on your fish! I currently use Seachem Pond Prime in my cycling koi pond right now and I'm sitting at around 2ppm Nitrite for almost a week now. I dose every 48 hours and my fish are perfectly fine and healthy! Many others can probably testify the same thing :)
Hmmm I used Dr Tims ammonia and I also had 4ppm too 🤔 It did work, but I put the 4ppm down to something in the substrate, but your quarantine tank was without substrate.
I'd test your pH level during fishless cycling because if the pH drops below 6 in a given system, the Nitrosomonas bacterium will not adequately process the ammonia in the water. If the pH eventually gets low enough, the nitrogen cycle will cease to function all together.
I’ve literally been cycling for almost 2 weeks now I got a axolotl for a birthday present and I did know it was coming along I set his tank up and I had it set up for 3 days before he arrived then about 2 weeks after my adorable cutie was home and settled I had to do a emergency take out and put in a separate tank because the sponge filter didn’t have any bacteria and had caused a spike of ammonia luckily I had a spare small reptile tank on hand and I gave him tea baths for a week to make sure his skin was okay and I got him out just in time the day it happened was the day I noticed he was acting weird he was lethargic and very ghostly white. Now it’s been a week or 2 now and he is back to his pinky self and eating and seriously growing I need this tank to cycle already!!!! I’ve been doing water changes in the reptile tank for like 2 weeks now and using ice packs against the glass to keep it cool please don’t hate me I am trying to be a good mom I love my little Axel (that’s his name)😭😭😭
Just set up with soil capped with sand and add live plants then add a couple of small fish a day later, do not feed them for a few days then feed very little, or just use a cycled sponge filter.
You definitely can, but the water column doesn’t actually hold much (if any) of the good bacteria. It lives on the substrate, inside the sponge filter, and on the decorations. You can seed the tank using any of those things and it will help establish the bacteria colony and cycle the tank a bit quicker, but you still have to cycle it. :)
*Watch the rest of the Cycling Experiment series here: **ua-cam.com/play/PLlBBJ7xBuqubL9YSRiZuJY2fpeqzslu8t.html*
UR just mess'n with our instant gratification senses eh...;) seriously have to wait till the next vid????
hey, really like your vids.
please don't take this wrong....
are you using powder based foundation or liquid. the lights really shine off those beautiful cheeks.
@@min2oly Haha I tried to cover the experiments all in one video, but then it got waaay too long. Thanks for the compliment; currently using a liquid foundation.
Saturday mornings with GirlTalksFish and coffee! Perfect!! Thanks for all your hard work! :)
RIGHT!!? It’s a perfect combo
Maybe we need a #girltalksfish mug now?! ... Hook us up Irene?! ;)
Ah, I should! I technically just posted my first products on my Teespring store (shh the banner needs to be updated), but I don't have any mugs yet. Maybe I should do a poll to see which design people like the best... teespring.com/stores/girltalksfish
@@EricLabelleUX fully agree!
@@GirlTalksFish So exciting!! Congrats!! I am all over polls lol! - and banner design for that manner.... but we aren’t here to talk shop ;)
I love how deep you dive into all your experiments.
I'm still so proud of how far you've come in your fish career. I always knew way back when, that your channel was something special and so were and are you!
👍💓👍
Thank you so much! I always remember you as one of my OG subscribers, so it's always great to see you in the comments. :)
This video is perfect timing. I'm about to setup a new aquarium and I want to give fishless cycling another shot. I've only tried it once before using fish food, but with results similar to your second test. I can't wait to see part 2.
I really appreciate your time to upload in 60FPS. It makes you look so much more 'live'. Thank you!
Thank you! I wasn't sure if people would like 60 FPS or 24 FPS better, so it's good to hear some feedback about the change.
OMG... That's the longest poop I've ever seen!
Internal parasites my friend
@@rob2250 doesn't look like it has mucus so a bad diet is more likely than internal parasites.
Ha ha ha only my big goldfish ever makes that much poo! 😂👍🏻
Love the video. I have a few comments/questions.
1) Did you add any fertilizer? Nitrifying organisms need trace elements to grow too, occasionally the cycle can stall because they don't have the correct available nutrients to reproduce. A teeny bit of Easy Green would prevent that.
2) One of the issues with bottled bacteria is that no producer to my knowledge includes ammonia oxidizing archaea. Fairly recent research on the subject has demonstrated that archaea is the heavy lifter when it comes to oxidizing ammonia in the aquarium (especially freshwater aquariums), and not the nitrosonomas bacteria that was believed to be the primary oxidizer in the past. In particular, nitrifying archaea thrive in low ammonia environments while nitrosonomas bacteria thrive in higher ammonia environments. The reason this is particularly relevant to this test is that when all you have in the tank is bacteria, lower amounts of ammonia, like 2 ppm, a) might not be enough to stimulate population growth in the bacterial colonies and b) amounts under a certain threshold, like 0.25 ppm ammonia, might not even be enough for the bacteria to oxidize and they may instead go dormant or die, resulting in a stalled cycle. It seems like there's a good chance that this is what happened with the second method
3) I'll bet the tank cycles much faster with plants for two reasons: a) fertilizer will ensure that the nitrifying organisms have no mineral deficiencies and b) the plants will have come from a cycled environment. Even if they were grown emersed they'll have both archaea and bacteria living on them and will act like cycled media to seed the aquarium. The same thing happens with fish-in cycling, the fish itself has nitrifying organisms living on it and it seeds the aquarium filtration. I cycled a 45 gallon aquarium in 3 days from a single bioring once. I know lots of people have demonstrated that you can use used filter media to cycle and aquarium but I'd love to see some experiments to show how little of a seed you can get away with. One bioring? A cubic inch of sponge? A single plant? a pebble of gravel? Some people have suggested that a spoonful of soil from any half-fertile bit of ground outside works as a seed too. If that's true, then why on earth are we buying bottles of incomplete bacteria?
4) Last comment: you touched for the briefest moment on one of the most misunderstood topics in the freshwater hobby: pH. Most of the time pH isn't very important but when it comes to the nitrogen cycle it's super important. That chart shows how it affect toxicity but also, nitrifying bacteria are only capable of peak growth between 7.6 and 7.8. Anywhere outside that range and they will grow more slowly (we don't yet know the peak growth environment for ammonia oxidizing archaea but it seems to be in the same vicinity, though perhaps a little lower, like 7.5ish). Below 7 and it's going to take significantly longer. Below 6.5 and it'll take months. Below 6 and it may never happen at all, and a pH below 5.5 kills them. For that reason, while chasing pH with fish in the tank is generally a terrible idea, whe performing a fishless cycle, I recommend using either distilled vinegar or baking soda (to lower or raise pH, respectively) to get the system to the optimal growth range. Then when it's cycled, you can just do a few big water changes to bring it back to whatever's normal for your location and you're good to go.
Great to see you doing practical testing for this topic. I love your videos in general. Cheers!
Glad you enjoyed it, and thanks for sharing your experiences! For Method 1 and 2 in this video, I followed the exact instructions given by Dr. Tim's Aquatics (linked in the description). As for the other methods of cycling I did, you'll have to wait till parts 2 and 3. :)
can i just say HOW MUCH i appreciate you for doing these testings, methodical, and sometimes sooooo long? i mean... it's really priceless and the amount of work that goes in and the TIME and how much time you can save us is just really special and helpful.
A year long experiment! Thanks for doing this, excited for the next parts!
My pleasure! It's a 3-part series, so hope you stick around till the end. :)
These experiments are so useful.. Honestly thankyou thankyou.. Nothing is 100% but these sort of results are much more factual than an anecdotal comment on a forum or a video.
Those failures you speak of imo are fantastic.. Gives you a realistic expectation.. And might prevent a new fish keeper from adding fish too early (which is what I did on my 1st tank).
I actually think the solution might even be a little from video 1,2 and 3 if possible!
I did my fish less cycle with only plants (thanks to you ) but still added an established filter once I added a fish . I’m about to add the rest of my center piece fish this weekend 😁
Thank you so much for all of the hard work that you put into these videos. Sharing this information is so valuable to the hobby
Looking at your chart, your ammonia was almost gone at week 7, until you added another 2ppm of ammonia. Spikes in ammonia can actually stall and prolong a cycle, which is what I think happened here. Don't give up! Worth trying it again. This is a marathon, not a sprint :) I've used this very same method (same Dr. Tim's) without adding any starter bacteria, at 4ppm and had wonderful success. I did do water changes to keep my nitrates where I would want them once fish were in. I noticed the higher my nitrates got, the lower the ph was getting. I treated it like a fully stocked tank and did my water changes while feeding with ammonia every time it hit 0ppm. It did slow the cycle down, but did pick back up and headed in the right direction. EVENTUALLY, my tank was able to process 4ppm in 24 hours (doing water changes to lower nitrates). Once I saw it was happening on a consistent basis, I did a big water change, added my fish and had no issues at all. Notice how long it took your initial 2ppm to get to 1ppm (with the addition of starter bacteria...2 weeks). Notice it only took 1 week to go from 2ppm to 1ppm (week 8-9) without adding starter bacteria? You were almost there! Don't give up :)
Good to know. Yeah, since the point of my experiments was to find the fastest and most efficient method of cycling, I decided to quit at 9 weeks instead of continuing the experiment another 1-2 months. Most beginners will give up way before 2 months, so in parts 2 and 3, I explore other methods that are potentially faster.
@@GirlTalksFish I'm looking forward to it :) I appreciate you and the work you're doing. Keep it up!
Most people don't wanna deal with live plants. Sorry but it's exhausting seeing everyone recommend plants. What we want is the fastest cycling method that doesn't involve plants.
I learned from Cichlid Forum that water changes are essential to fish less cycling with straight ammonia. Small water change every day and ammonia dosing every other day. Seems counterintuitive, but it's worked on the last two tanks I've cycled! Can't wait to see about other options though!
Interesting! Now I wish I had tried that. I just followed the instructions given by Dr. Tim's Aquatics (links in description) since I was using his ammonia product.
There is a lot of aquarium metaphysics out there, so kudos, Irene, for always being so thorough. I love your experiments because they help everyone (especially beginners) to reduce the guesswork.
What was your hypothesis behind the first experiment? Where should the bacteria come from?
I cycled three tanks following Dr. Tim's guide and was quite successful. I want to make two remarks: First, the method is much faster when you work with already established media, gravel, plants, etc. As you mentioned, aquariums are micro eco-systems that are affected by many variables and not just what comes out of a bottle. Forget the heater during cycling--add weeks to the process. Second comment: always check your checker. In my last tank (only a few months old) I thought I did everything right but I just couldn't get below 0.25 ammonia. I contacted Seachem asking about the batch of Stability I had, then bought different bacteria, tested like a maniac, but it just wouldn't go down. Then it dawned on me that my only point of reference is my API test kit (the one you use). It wasn't expired but I bought a new one anyway, and guess what: my older kit always showed a slightly green tinge while the new one was yellow. I sent photos to Seachem showing them how even distilled water tested positive for ammonia. They doubted what they saw, asking where I "sourced" my distilled water (Target). So, now, when I need to be sure, I always have a control test tube with RODI water. That doesn't apply to you experiments, I know, but if you take a scientific approach to the hobby that is something to keep in mind.
Wow! I never thought of having a control but that’s an awesome observation.
Can’t wait for the next part 😊 my favorite way to cycle is with starting with plants and snails!
I do the same thing and I have always had success. It only takes a few snails too. I have never seen a creature that 💩's sooooo much lol.
@@cyndicombs1419 Exactly!! And the snails will eat the plant melt too so it’s a like a win/win 😝
Lol, I didn't think of using snails since I'm on Team "Kill It With Fire" but that's a good idea.
Little late to the party here but I LOVED this vid! Easy to comprehend, simple and straight forward whilst still being super informative. Thank you for experimenting making it easier for all of us! Subbed
Can't wait for part 2, I too am just about to cycle a 260ltr planted tank, with a sand substrate, so my plants will be water column feeders.I enjoy your video's keep up the great work.👍👍👍
Very interesting tests! I’m excited to see the next video. I’m about 8 weeks into cycling currently, so this is helpful info
Best of luck to ya!
Hello irene! Great video as always! This is sure to help A LOT of beginner fishkeepers!😀😆😆😄
Yay, I hope so!
@@GirlTalksFish 😊
My aquarium just finished its cycle yesterday! On to the fish store!!
Congratulations! What do you plan on getting?
@@GirlTalksFish The Angelfish are my favorite fish, so defenetley some of those along with a school of cardinal tetras!
@@James-yv1qq sounds beautiful! 😇🐟
really useful information. Thanks for all your hard work!
Let's get that next video up girl! I've been stalled for weeks on my quarantine tank fishless cycle.
Haha, right? Parts 2 and 3 will be my releases for the next two weeks.
@@GirlTalksFish Sweet. Your videos are always down to earth and informative.
This was just what I was looking for, thanks so much! You grabbed a new subscriber ;)
Great video! can't wait for the next one! (i have been waiting for the plants cycling process vid from u, for a while so exited to see the results!!)
Yes, I believe you were one of the original commenters that asked for this video! Parts 2 and 3 are coming right up as the next two Saturday releases. :)
Fishless cycling with ammonium chloride always worked for me (I use the powder form and heavily plant though).
Only time I had an issue was cycling my 40 Gal dirted tank. My ph was stuck at 6.0 and wasnt cycling properly over 2 months in. I added a bit of baking soda to bring the ph up, and within a couple days the cycle was complete (0 ppm Amm, 0 ppm Nitrite, 20 ppm Nitrate).
I recently began stocking: 6 Panda Corys, 5 Amano shrimp, and 4 Nerites so far.
Ember tetras, pencilfish, and Apistos will be added soon!
Well done running tests like this. My recent shrimp / planted aquarium took two months to cycle using household (non additive/perfumed) Ammonia added in 1-2ml batches. Ammonia never got above 2 for more than a few days and that was after adding 3ml once when I wanted to see what would happen. I use a Salifert Ammonia test.
Niiice. Glad it worked out for you.
I've never used the Fritz product, but I've started several tanks with their pure ammonia and their One and Only live bacteria and never had the problems you did. Each tank was up and running within (IIRC) ten days or less. I have to think either the bottle of Fritz was bad, or something else was wrong with the experiment. Might be worth repeating with Dr. Tim's ammonia *and* their One and Only for a comparison.
Very detailed. Kudos!
Very interesting video Irene! I use seeded media from another tank to start the cycle. But if you’re starting fresh with no other tanks this info will be very helpful.
Spoiler alert, but that's my favorite method too. 😉
Can we use ammonium nitrate solution to keep the bacteria alive in an already cycled and established aquarium if we want to keep it without fish temporarily?
My only issue with the experiment is that 2ppm is... well, a LOT. I understand the goal is to cultivate a mass amount of healthy BB, but most people keep fish for years and never see even close to 2ppm (or maybe I’ve been lucky LOL). OTHER THAN THAT: excellent video as usual!! I very much look forward to part 2!!!💖💖💖💖💖
Yeeessss... you just hit the nail on the head. Spoiler alert, but I talk about this very thing in the last video in this 3-part series.
@@GirlTalksFish awesome!!!😍 can’t wait for it!💖💖💖💖💖
That’s just to build the bacteria colony
Can I do the same thing to a brackish water tank
Irene, can you please help? My tap water tests positive ammonia (API Test kit and Tetra Test Strips). I run it through an RO system and it lowers the ammonia level a bit but still like at least 2 ppm min.
I dose with Prime and Stability and I have a good amount of healthy growing live plants.
But if my water going in on water changes or topping is showing ammonia how will I ever get to zero ammonia?
Oh my god, those fish have huge poops. I'm not used to seeing that because I keep tetras (fairly small) and bottom-dwelling fish like corydoras and dwarf plecos.
Haha, that happened because I accidentally dropped a bunch of fish food while trying to film with one hand. I netted out as much of the food as I could find, but apparently the platies were too fast for me. 😫
Great video, it is discouraging when you’re about a month in and have been testing everyday but getting the same results, I used tetra safe start plus so I was hoping two weeks I would be good but nope, I am getting 10-20 ppm of nitrates though which is some good news, once I get to zero ppm ammonia I’m done I’m not adding anymore ammonia I’m going to assume it’s good to go and start with a school of Danios and keep my eye on ammonia levels for a few weeks before I fully stock the tank
Im gonna cycle my tank. Just gotta work out where the pedals go 😁🐟
I love your experiment videos! I always wonder if live plants help speed up the cycling process, can't wait to see the next video
I believe you need to use booth Dr.Tim to make it work, well at least for saltwater
I always dose nitrifying bacteria in my tank’s filter and it grows algae and I keep very hardy fish as my ammonia source.
I can’t wait to see the next part of this! 😁
Coming up next week! There will be 3 parts in all with one video releasing each week.
Hi! Just a quick question, what size sponge filter would you suggest for a 10 gallon tank?
Get one rated for 15 or 20 gallons.
Okay, thanks for the response!
I’m on my 8th day fishless cycling (29gallon tank) with dr Tim’s ammonia with safestart plus and stability. Dosed 4ppm ammonia on day one.. no water changes, lots of aeration and 84 degree F temp..day 8 readings are .50 ammonia 2ppm nitrites 40ppm nitrates 7.6ph.. any thoughts? Am i cycling good or am I close? Any tips will be greatly appreciated 🙏🏽
I've been trying to do a fishless cycle on my 29 gallon for nearly 8 weeks. It's doing my head in. At one point I got my ammonia down to 0 its now at 0.25. My nitrite has been at 2ppm for nearly 3 weeks and my nitrate had been around 20 for the same time. Neither of them are going up or down. I'm ready to give up. And I don't understand if I'm still supposed to be adding an ammonia source and doing a water change or if im just supposed to leave it and not do anything (apart from testing the water)
I have the same question issue, can someone please help
@@danielshauger8482 I asked on a forum and someone said my pH might have been too low. It was only at 6.4 so I mixed in about 4 tablespoons of baking soda into some tank water and raised the ph to 7.4. The tank finished cycled a day later
Any good advice my new tank setup with fish cycling
Ph was 7.6
Ammonia is 0
Nitrite was max high
Nitrate was reduce a bit
Any idea how to speed up the cycling as I think is not fully cycle
I put 2 dead shrimp and some plants along with half regular well water and half established tank water from my other aquarium. Its best to do multiple methods at once i think. worked well and it was cycled in 4 days. I think the dead shrimp is what really helped it out because the bacteria they brought to the aquarium along with the ammonia and the plants will consume ammonia over time.
Fishless cycle! Please tell me Do I have to always add ammonia to 2 ppm.until my cycle will be finish?at the moment I have ammonia 0.5ppm. nitrites 2-5ppm.nitrates 5ppm.Thank you.
Love you vids btw!!!!
Adding pure ammonia to your tank to 4ppm (you must use a non-surficant type) is by far the quickest way to cycle in my experience.
Dose to 4ppm and leave it alone until almost all of it converts to nitrite. Repeat this until you are showing nitrates and both ammonia and nitrite read zero within 24 hours. Hey presto, you are cycled. Never had a tank take more than 3 weeks to cycle doing it this way.
Do I keep a filter running while doing this process ?
@@bjparker7421 absolutely. The filter is where most of the good bacteria will live.
How long should it take for ammonia to start dropping? I'm almost 2 weeks in with no change in ammonia and 0 nitrites
@@SmAshlie17 Did you just dose to 4ppm once, or are you doing it daily? Do it one time.
I would have expected to see some nitrites by now, but just leave it, it will happen. Don't do any water changes.
@@andreashessler838 just the one initial does and then I also added seachem stability for the recommended 7 days
Great information and video!
I used API brand Quick Start to jump start my 10g quarantine tank. I got'er done in less than 2 wks.
And I never got a big spike on either ammonia or nitrites.
Yesterday I got readings of 0-0-40 and 0-0-20 after water change.
I just read the directions on the bottle and doubled the dose.
1 in the filtration unit, 1 in the tank.
@just me yo
I got in a Betta, 3 dwarf frogs and 4 mystery snails.
They're doing great.
Did you add a declorinator when doing fishless cycle with ammonia the bacteria can’t grow if the water has chlorine or chloramine in it cos that kills the bacteria
My aquarium has been cycling fishless. On day 1, I added the tetra fast cycling solution. Today is day 11 and I tested the water. These are the results: 0ppm ammonia, 7.0 pH, 0ppm nitrite, 5.0 ppm nitrate. Is it ready to add at least 1 fish or should I wait one more week and test again?
Ye your good to add most of the fish you want,you have 5ppm nitrate meaning you have nitrifying(benafictial bacteria)within your tank,just make sure when you have your fish keep your nitrates low (I think 40ppm nitrates).
This is not related to the topic but my betta fish died of what I think is dropsy :( and after 2 days I noticed white worms the size about less than 1mm all over the glass. Should I do anything before adding any new fish to the tank?
Thanks.
Hello Great videos? Not sure if I heard it but did you add any beneficial bacteria?
some people's tap water already has ammonia and nitrates. so it would have been good to measure the tap water first also, as a baseline.
i remember a story about a fish keeper who spent a lot of time and energy and more and more strategies to try to reduce his nitrates ... but it turns out, it was a lot of it coming from his source water!
that would seem to explain why your ammonia levels didn't reach near 0, and why you had nitrates already in week 2.
however, that's just based on this first video. let's see what the other videos show as a result.
very nice experiments!
Great work!
0:25 Can we just appreciate the 💩-ing ability of that little platy? Can you imagine if humans did that and had to drag a 15 foot 💩 behind them everywhere they went?
Please excuse me... I'm running on very little sleep and haven't had my coffee yet. 🤦♀️
First thing I noticed too 😂
Haha, that happened because I accidentally dropped a bunch of fish food while trying to film with one hand. I netted out as much of the food as I could find, but apparently the platies were too fast for me. 😫
@@GirlTalksFish ohh okay I was wondering if that was normal for a fish to have that long of a poop? I’ve never seen that. Although, I am new to aquariums and I only have shrimp and snails currently.
Isn't too much drop to count for 37 gallons like 2x37=74 drops? Is there a quicker way?
Great video x
I might be wrong but I think the bacteria need substrate to latch onto, maybe that's why your experiment with Ammonia and FritzZyme took so long? I'm struggling with fishless cycle right now! using ammonia and Tetra SafeStart+. (one of the 2 patented bacteria starters that are supposed to really work!)
Great video!
Do you need to have a source of ammonia to cycle your tank? such as fish food
Love it, keep it up
Another great video 👍😍🥰✨
Dr Tim's changed the dosage from 1 drop per gallon to 4. Everyone complained. I think the concentration of the bacteria solution increased, but the ammonia stayed the same. So the dosage was probably to be used in conjunction with the bacteria.
Are some types of bettas more aggressive than others??
yes
Ammonia alone works. your reading of 4 PPM ammonia was likely incorrect (liquid test kits are fairly accurate but at those levels its hard to tell.) anything above 5ppm will start killing off any bacteria instead of encouraging it to grow.
next time actually dose to 2-3ppm and your tank will fully cycle in 4-8 weeks
What do you mean by "I fed the aquarium again"? Did you use the same Fritz Aquatics again or did you use Dr. TIm's Ammonia? I'm really new and still learning. Thank you !
Why do you test it every week? I test mine everyday for fishless cycle with ammonia and quick starter bacterias. It takes 2 days for it to drop from 2ppm to 0 for both nitrite and ammonia
My tap water always tests about .25.or higher ammonia so I was fishless cycling without ammonia. Seems after research I made have been actually picking up chloramine and my free ammonia was actually zero.
So I was dosing with Prime and Stability but after not cycling I believe I wasn't feeding my beneficial bacteria was just being starved without the ammonia. Does this sound reasonable to anyone else?
it was the prime if your doing fishless cycle do not use prime it will cost the stability to think its no ammonia in water when it is just use stability and prime when ever you add water
I'm on day 7 of Dr. Tims fishless cycle in a heavily planted tank and the ammonia and nitrites have remained at zero. Nothing is happening. Whats wrong? I'm so frustrated. In this same tank i tried a fish in cycle and the fish (guppies) they lived about 3 weeks then the all died almost overnight. I never had any ammonia or nitrites then either. Suggestions?
I am going thru the exact same issue. I started off with 2ppm and well I was advised to 2 drops each day. And well it backfired. I saw results the first week then it suddenly stopped.
So I did a 15% water change and addrd the bacteria again.
It went down from 4 ppm to 2 ppm from the water change. Today the color seemed closer to 1 ppm.
Funny thing is through all this I haven't seen nitrite at all. I did get nitrate tho around 10 ppm.
Let's see I will wait for it to goto 0 Ammonia before I add more this time around.
Same with my 75g tank. Never showed nitrite at all using api master test kit. So I bought Jbl pro scan, and it picked up .25 to .5 mg/l but it's stalling out. I'm still waiting and testing every 2-3 days.
I did my fishless cycle with dr tims ammonia and bottled bacteria in 12 days. I had plants helping me though
Dr. Tim’s really stressed me out as a newbie. My dropper didn’t “drop.” When I turned the bottle upside down, about a quarter of it came shooting out. My ammonia would not go down for weeks, and I had used his bottle bacteria. I started dosing it with seachem stability daily, and it finally cycled. It took me almost 2 months to cycle for my 16 gal betta aquarium 😞. I’m doing research because I want a 55 gal goldfish aquarium, and cycling still intimidates me. I look forward to more in this series!
When you're ready to start your 55 you could gravel vac you betta tank and put all the brown (mulm) water into your 55 to kick start the cycle. Just remember the bacteria are gonna need a source of ammonia to keep the cycle going.
Totally agree - I think most beginners get really stressed out by fishless cycling, which is a shame when you follow Dr. Tim's instructions to the letter and don't get the amazing results that the rest of the internet claims to see. Hope you enjoy the rest of the 3-part series!
Hey, I have recently started a tropical 20g aquarium and I am looking for center piece fish ideas. I am open to any suggestions and any at all would be greatly appreciated.
I LOVE YOUR VIDEOS
hi mam i would like to ask.... is there any problem with my betta fish if he doesn't react when he sees himself at the mirror
Look at the size of the poop on that fish @ 0:29....lol
Does anyone have this problem?
I used the api test and everytime I measure nitrites it reads somewhere between 0 and 0.25ppm I never seem to get the same shade as 0ppm?
This is my 2nd week on fiahless cycle. Ammonia is 0 and nitrate is 20ppm
Dr tims also said its hard to cycle a tank without substrat !
If you are worried about high ammonia and nitrite, you can dose your aquarium/pond with Seachem Pond Prime!! It doesn't get rid of the ammonia or nitrite, but it does neutralize it so it doesn't have any ill effects on your fish! I currently use Seachem Pond Prime in my cycling koi pond right now and I'm sitting at around 2ppm Nitrite for almost a week now. I dose every 48 hours and my fish are perfectly fine and healthy! Many others can probably testify the same thing :)
Good point! I forgot to mention that certain water dechlorinators can help detoxify your water in a pinch. Thanks for the reminder. :)
I believe you have to keep the temperature low so no ammonia would build up?
Hmmm I used Dr Tims ammonia and I also had 4ppm too 🤔 It did work, but I put the 4ppm down to something in the substrate, but your quarantine tank was without substrate.
Yeah, I wonder what other variables in my water (e.g., pH, GH, KH?) might be causing my lack of success.
What kind of fish are in 0.29 seconds?
Thank you for taking a year...to put this together for us.... can't wait for your next video
For sure! Just to give you a heads up, it'll be a 3-part series, so be prepared for another cliffhanger next week. :)
Is there a part 2?
I'd test your pH level during fishless cycling because if the pH drops below 6 in a given system, the Nitrosomonas bacterium will not adequately process the ammonia in the water. If the pH eventually gets low enough, the nitrogen cycle will cease to function all together.
that platy can lay some serious cable..
I’ve literally been cycling for almost 2 weeks now I got a axolotl for a birthday present and I did know it was coming along I set his tank up and I had it set up for 3 days before he arrived then about 2 weeks after my adorable cutie was home and settled I had to do a emergency take out and put in a separate tank because the sponge filter didn’t have any bacteria and had caused a spike of ammonia luckily I had a spare small reptile tank on hand and I gave him tea baths for a week to make sure his skin was okay and I got him out just in time the day it happened was the day I noticed he was acting weird he was lethargic and very ghostly white. Now it’s been a week or 2 now and he is back to his pinky self and eating and seriously growing I need this tank to cycle already!!!! I’ve been doing water changes in the reptile tank for like 2 weeks now and using ice packs against the glass to keep it cool please don’t hate me I am trying to be a good mom I love my little Axel (that’s his name)😭😭😭
Good vid
You can do an video about White Cloud Mountain Minnow? Please!
Should you change water while fish less cycling?? I’m using ammonia by the way.
Just set up with soil capped with sand and add live plants then add a couple of small fish a day later, do not feed them for a few days then feed very little, or just use a cycled sponge filter.
Could you just take old water from a different aquarium to the new aquarium
You definitely can, but the water column doesn’t actually hold much (if any) of the good bacteria. It lives on the substrate, inside the sponge filter, and on the decorations. You can seed the tank using any of those things and it will help establish the bacteria colony and cycle the tank a bit quicker, but you still have to cycle it. :)
0:34 holy sh!t @@
Just an Off-topic question but does anyone know if it would be a good idea to house 2 Blue Dwarfs Gouramis and a female Betta in a 20-gallon tank?
Great Video as always! When I was a child, I never cycled my aquarium.🥶🥶🥶🥶 Surprisingly, all the fish survived. Now, I always cycle my aquarium!🤗🤗🤗🤗
Ditto... RIP to my poor carnival goldfish when I was 6 years old.
@@GirlTalksFish LOL
Just a thought, has anyone bothered to use septic tank enzymes and bacteria to cycle a tank, like RID-X?
Interesting idea.
I just had that happen twice and that is why I am watching this video