I was in these staff and pastoral meetings and can say that this only scratches the surface of how Alan and the rest of the team, including myself, spoke about people behind closed doors. I deeply regret my involvement in this and hope that speaking out brings truth and light. Although in these audios, you hear talk of revival, what they really mean is having a large church, building a movement with influence, getting more speaking invites, and ultimately making money. Alan was obsessed with leadership and revival, but it really boiled down to numbers and gaining recognition globally, but mostly power and control. I witnessed him lying to people's faces, manipulating situations, firing staff, and doing whatever he deemed necessary to create a culture where people believed in and followed him, and where he had control and power. During the course of my four years, I became deeply afraid of Alan. He often threatened to fire me if he felt "I was breaking his trust." He would remind me often how lucky I was that he spent so much time with me and how I could lose that privilege, and he would say things like "maybe God was wrong about me," etc. He eventually began controlling who I could or couldn't be friends with, who I was speaking to and about what, and the list goes on. I went to Jeremy Riddle multiple times, afraid of disclosing too much, and I told him in tears only about Alan's screaming and threatening fits. He told me that this was the price for revival and how apostles and spiritual fathers behaved. Jeremy shared that he had experienced similar treatment at Bethel, specifically with Kris Vallotton and the Johnson family, and it had paid off for him in his ministry/calling. He encouraged me to endure Alan's treatment, assuring me that if I left Alan's covering, no other pastor would see me or my purpose and invest in me the way Alan had. He emphasized this, claiming he had visited many churches and knew. These audio clips only scratch the surface of the toxicity I experienced within the "inner circle." My husband and I have every intention of releasing a fuller statement with supporting documents about my time as a pastor directly supervised and mentored by Alan Scott soon. What else is needed to see change and accountability here?
Cynthia, I’m so sad to hear of your experiences. You are very brave telling your story and I’m proud of you. You and Bradley are so anointed and you both we’re such a blessing to us all. I pray you and Bradley come out of this STRONGER and with MORE resolve to do the Lords work. We all have scars from our walk. As John Wimber would say, “Never trust a leader without a limp”. You will be forever changed by this but God brings ALL things together for His glory. God bless you girl and give Bradley my love. Kristy Foster (the Cheesemaker)
There is a reason we are taught to test fruit (Mt. 7.15-20; Gal. 5.19-26). Angry outbursts, abuse, greed, dissensions and factions, etc are works of the flesh. I don't care what they claim to be, these behaviors are incompatible with a person walking with the Spirit. True spirituality is love and service to others just like our Lord. Glad you both walked away from this.
Silent subscriber here: my two year old son loves to drum, and has been watching your videos on repeat for the past year or so. He even copies some of your movements and I often ask him, “Are you doing Debolt drumming?“ And he smiles and nods his head yes. Just wanted you to know, you’ve been a huge encouragement to this household. My husband is in ministry too, and we will both be praying for this situation. I’m so sorry to hear about this, thank you for coming forward and telling the truth. God bless you! 🙏
David Koresh..Jrs are out there.. all cults are the same they just wear different mask!! I don’t follow any ofcultish pied pipers… God pulled me away from all of it 7 years ago💕✝️
Being called "community-driven" like it's an insult is one of the best things I could hope to hear about myself - I hope it encourages you as well, Noah.
Thank you so much for sharing this Noah. I am so sorry this happened to you and I hope you are taking the time you need to heal. Sharing your story brings hope to people like me who attended VA for our whole lives and suffered spiritual abuse from the new leaders there as well. It’s so sad to see this happening, especially at the hands of people I’ve personally known my entire life. Thank you for your candor and for shining a light on this.
I appreciate your willingness to come forward. It’s encouraging for me to feel like I’m not the only one who is/has gone through a spiritually abusive church culture. But it still doesn’t change the fact that it burdens my heart to see another story like this. There needs to be more safeguards and accountability of leaders showing these tendencies BIG TIME.
Noah, I am so sorry for you and your wife. I am glad to hear that you are still believing in Jesus alone! I have also seen churches that promote a really strong "culture" that is, in reality, extremely toxic and exclusive. For anyone in the comments, let this be a warning to avoid the churches that promote culture, not following Jesus!
Jeremy disliked me so much so I grateful not one of his drummers. But, before he left Anaheim he did tell the worship at the time NOT to use me as the drummer because I was “too old.” When he came came to Anaheim, before the theft, he wouldn’t even speak to me. I was kicked off the worship team without any notice, reason or a sit down to talk. I tried reaching out but nothing. It was at the same time that Kathryn Scott stopped talking to me, after a 15+ year friendship. Alan had already distanced himself from me and my family. Some time later I was diagnosed with cancer. Some of the board members, pastors and parishioners offered to pray for me before the service. They invited Alan to come, but he refused. Not once did he reach out and expressed his feelings about my cancer diagnosis. Again, this was supposedly my friend of 15+ years, our family spent summers together, vacations together, and countless meals only for it to end in complete silence. I can categorically say without reservation that the words to come out of Alan‘s mouths are so filled with deception and lies. And it grieves me that people that I know for over 35 years of attending the Anaheim Vineyard are citing with Alan Scott and Jeremy Riddle rather than the countless people that have been hurt and driven out from the church, where they met their spouses, where they married, and buried their loved ones, and where they raise their kids.
"Too old." I think this shows that they are just using their body type personality theory as cover to only have people that match a certain look be visible. Too old or too fat is just bad for their image, I guess.
By Gods grace I pray peace will cover all of those hurt by this situation. But it will not come until you reach out to God and forgive. Not because they deserve it but because it is a commandment. It will free you all to let the offense go. Leave them in the hands of Almighty God and let the healing begin!!!!! In the name of Jesus
This is major church hurt, and my spirit cries for you and your wife. Your videos have helped me to help others be lead to the Lord and the fact that Jeremy and Alan couldn't see that your ministry is just as important as their what maybe started as a pure ministry is just the devil at work. Praying for you and that Diebold Drumming sees the most success in the future that it ever has.
Man's Really said "They just wanna Care and Love People" Like it was a bad thing.... and then sending a text (and not an in person meeting) asking you to step down from any leadership. So sorry you had to deal with this kind of abusive leadership. I've dealt with my fair share of toxic leadership and luckily it has made me stronger and led me to the proper church, with the proper culture that I need during this time. I hope you find the same brother. Praying for you
Wow, thank you for this video. I went through a very similar situation while drumming and working full time at a church. It’s always been a difficult thing to sit down and process. Your story and insight has helped me understand the callousness that went on. It’s truly disheartening that churches are more interested in “culture” than they are helping out their own people.
I always pictured church like that movie “How to Save a Life” or “I’m not Ashamed” which are both Christian movies but I guess it’s sad that I am so naive.
That’s why I would tell my boyfriend that we need to go to the cult church once a month I guess I was right about it the whole time 😂 that’s funny. He thinks they are all weird to we went to a wenseday night worship thing and he thought it was so weird and went to church today and once again he hated it and so we left after worship. Sad that the truth is coming to light. I think they may be Bipolar though unfortunately
My heart shattered when I heard the “so interesting” about loving and caring people, like for me that is something I truly believe, to love and care for each other is one of the primordial things, as a matter of fact it is in the Bible when Jesus is asked about the most important commandment. Noah I have no words only gratefulness, thank you for helping me in my drumming and for being open with my million doubts about drumming stuff ❤
Yes bro! Loving and caring for People is what Revival is all about. How will they know we are His disciples by the way we love one another. True revival begins when we come back to Love and Love compels us to Love each other as He loves us.
So glad you are speaking up about spiritual abuse. Me and my wife went through a similar situation a few years ago. Thank you for stepping out and speaking Truth. 🙏🏼
These videos helped me a lot. I suffered years and years of spiritual abuse growing up. Well, what I learned from this video is that these church leaders don't love PEOPLE. They love themselves, WORSHIP themselves, and they think if they can just make everyone like THEMSELVES, their "church" will be the most awesome, because it is in THEIR image. So instead of being transformed into Christ's image, the people are forced to become like this idol.
I served at a church for a long time where the pastor (my ex FIL) told me, "You can't serve the Lord with tattoos and earrings." It was manipulative. What he was actually saying was, "You can't serve in MY church...". I was told after his daughter divorced me that if I got remarried that I was gonna close the door on lots of opportunities that God has for my life and that I was gonna close the door to God's blessings. I've had more opportunities to serve the Lord since I've been out of that "cult"ure. These people care more about the name of their "church" than the name of Jesus. Thank God that my faith was deeper in Christ than it was in people and that it didn't drive me away altogether. God bless you and your family in the future 🕊🖤🎶
I hope that for him too!! I was in a spiritually abusive church, too, and was spiritually abused. When I spoke out about it, I was deemed as the bad guy and was let go to Satan for the destruction of my flesh. It took me 4 yrs to get over this spiritual abuse. I have seen so many people go out of this same church, and they are no longer walking with God!! Their lives are a mess, and they are so entrenched with sin, I'm not sure they will ever come out of it!! Honestly, I think most of these people weren't true followers of Christ. They just liked being tickled and elevated!! And then it all crashed down, and they left the church never truly committing to the Lord Jesus Christ!!
Just a thought. You didn't fail their test, they failed yours. As a follower it is our duty to test our leaders to make sure they are leading and preaching the true word and being as life giving and loving as Jesus. Please keep up the fight and know that we are with you. ALSO, please do more drum stuff when you feel ready. I cannot wait.
Welcome to the world of Christians who came out of abusive churches. Time to get Sound Doctrine in a good church where the pastor is the biggest servant of everyone. It is such a blessing this happend to you so you could get out. Thank you for your courage to share.
The problem with these worship driven communities is that they disguise themselves as churches when they are in fact, not. It is like a never-ending conference. And when people with other giftings want to join, they are alienated. Do you ever see evangelists in one of these worship movements? Hardly. Because it doesn’t fit the vision of constant worship. This model is not a real biblical church. It doesn’t include the entire body of Christ and all of it’s giftings. That’s what makes it feel exclusive or cult like.
I agree. God has shown me this as well. It's been tough finding a well rounded Church. It's like I get good teaching and The Gospel or worship. I personally beleive The Lord showed me this is what's causing the lack of some revivals.
@@selahrichardson it's hard finding a balance. I go to a church with great preaching/teaching but the worship sometimes lacks. The Pastor has made some negative comments about worship styles, and I think he kind of unintentionally stifles some of the flow of worship because of his strong personality and focus on preaching because I believe he's been so turned off by the entertainment aspect of worship in America. I used to go across town to another church who had very talented musicians, gifted, I played and sang at times there, but very fluffy preaching often. So not sure what I'm getting at here, but it's a struggle to find that balance! We should pray for the leaders of churches to be led by grace and truth in their leadership like Jesus.
This story is heart wrenching. Tis leadership is toxic and despicable. I do not have to be a prophet to predict that this leadership will implode like all the others we have seen recently. So sad. So ungodly. What you sow, you will reap. Noah, the Lord delivered you! See it as a step forward and not backward. Thank you for bringing this into the light. When I saw the first video of Jeremy Riddle, I did not know who he was and where he is from. All I can say is that my inner response was “ this guy is a performer, not a worshipper”. May the Lord bless you and through your wounds others would find healing! From South Africa.
Thank you for sharing this. Any church that prioritizes “culture” over Jesus has already failed. Culture is something so important but if the center of that culture isn’t Jesus then sadly many people can get damaged by this. I pray for you and pray God can guide you through these moments! God bless you
Man, I think I speak for a lot of people when I say this... I was never here for Jeremy. Not a hint of me even gave a wit about who's name was singing, or playing this or that instrument. I was here because I saw someone who served with such great passion on the drums that it inspired me to do the same! That was you bro! And I'm still here for the same reason. Edit: By 'here' I mean this youtube channel
Amazing how people are more concerned about defending the evil rather than exposing the truth. Noah is not the only one who’s been abused by Alan and Jeremy. Let’s make sure no one else is.
Alan and Jeremy are not the enemy in this case. They are also victims of the enemy. No one is defending evil that is ludicrous. If your son was acting a jerk are you going to expose him to the world? I hope not. Then you are no better than what you are claiming to expose. Alan and Jeremy are Gods children first then leaders. Its His job to discipline them.. If He tells you to do so, then youre good.
@joanneddy7426 Friend, Alan and Jeremy are not like children who are having their mistakes exposed. They are powerful spiritual leaders with highly influential public platforms. If it is true that they are sinning and if it is true that their practices are harmful to the sheep, it is our Christian duty to address the issue. Our Lord and the scriptures make it very clear that we should not tolerate this kind of abuse in His church. Please, I want to encourage you to seriously reconsider this matter.
@@Mere-Theism my first comment was"" someone should be fasting and praying and hear from God on this matter before acting." Alan and Jeremy a rent the only ones who will be effected by this mans decision to expose. I never said it was absolutely wrong. But is it God. Not one person has said they heard from God. Nor has anyone uses any scripture to back up these actions. I have had several similar situations where God has said to me. Let it go and move on. I will handle it.
@@joanneddy7426Matthew 18, in context, eventually leads to a full on exposure. There is already one pastor in these comments, who said they tried to speak on the sin and she was told to endure it. No repentance happened. So, exposure is biblical and commanded if the parties refuse to repent. They've been addressed. By people that atte ded dwelling place and by vineyard. They ignore. So now it's to be publicized. That's a COMMAND.
Thank you for this. A leader is not someone who takes the position but earns it. I didn’t hear one verse when talking about leadership and roles. You are a priest of your home and no one can take that away from you. Wolves are not so easily discerned when they are in sheep’s clothing. God will expose them. Blessings.
The term “culture” being used that heavily in a church is a red flag for a cult. Funny how cult is in the word culture. I’ve seen a church like these fall as fast as they rise with lawsuits galore. There were special gifts given to show you were in the “inner circle” like rings and watches. I was given a watch by someone which was one of the watches given to the inner circle and the questions began to fly. Everyone in the inner circle was compulsively asking me where I got the watch and how nice it was. I think the person who gave it to me wanted to give me a peak behind the curtain. It later came out in court documents about the watch I had and the rings being given for allegiance to the leader. Man charismatic Christianity has gone off the rails big time. This caused my to walk away from church years ago but came back when I was rooted in Christ more than an organization. These types of church can cause irreparable harm to Jesus loving believers.
My brother, Im Richard from Dominican Republic. I only can say 2 things about this: 1. I'm sorry 2. Please, please, please keep seeking and knowing God personally, don't let this event discourage you and your wife. People are imperfect, but God stills there for all of us. I'll be praying for you guys. Blessings!
Sorry, I just don’t see evidence of Jeremy Riddle abusing anyone here? That's quite a serious charge. I don’t know the man and am not a blind defender (or even a fan of the music) - but not a *single* audio example amounts to “abuse”? If anything Jeremy Riddle seems overly gentle and even nervous about asking what he asks. I've known abusive people, and, if this evidence is anything to go by, he absolutely does not like sound like such a person. I am specifically talking about Jeremy Riddle here, since your first video was about him and part of this one is. It seems all the comments are coming from an alternate universe. Sure, we can take a very different view from this church's leadership on how a church should be lead, but - going by this evidence at least, I saw no "crushing atmosphere" or "systemic spiritual abuse"...being enacted by Jeremy Riddle. Nor does you own story seem to cast Jeremy in that nasty light either. If what Jeremy did here was “abuse”, then any time a leader disagrees or has a different view on what someone should do, and presents that to them (or about them in a meeting) - it’s abuse. OK. People should actually watch the evidence and make their own minds up. Stories like this can take away from actual abuse, which of course does happen and must be vehemently opposed. If what you didn't like was how the church was being run, it is well within your rights to make a video about that, but you are specifically accusing another person of systemic abuse, which is a serious charge.
I agree with you. All I can hear here is a clash of views, and no, I don't particularly agree with Alan Scott's way of doing things, but certainly when it comes to Jeremy Riddle himself I heard no evidence of "abuse". It is true abuse happens, but it has also become a lens. If this is abuse then i've been abused by pretty much every leader I've been under (but I don't think I have.) Is rebuke and disagreement not allowed? Plus the guy got $2,500 at the end! What I write will probably be seen as "part of the problem" and an example of why abuse still goes on, but it really isn't. I hate manipulation, control, and abuse. What Jeremy did, according to this evidence at least, is not that.
@@hajdu4533 Yes, exactly. Disagreement is fine; the video could even be titled along the lines of "the bad leadership of the Dwelling Place" - but an accusation of abuse is very serious!
Some of the things detailed here are definately at least manipulative, and cult-esq behaviour, if not outright abusive. J.R. Doesn't like how DeBolt chooses to help people on his Insta and UA-cam. beyond just disagreeing with him over it, he manipulates him into resigning over it to avoid the drama of firing. J.R. is forcing him to either only be a resource to his church and team, rejecting the broader christian community or not be apart of the team at all. This is CLASSIC cult behavior. Isolating Debolt from the broader church community because its not 'the mission' (his own ministry). I doubt this abuse is calculated or anything. But church leaders need to be above this kind of manipulative behavior. Its unlikely to further the Message, and leaving hurt people in your wake is not what Jesus is about.
I’m so sorry for your hurt. Never having been in a word-salad church, and I can’t comprehend what these “leaders” are even talking about. I pray you and your wife have found a safe home. I’m going to go back and see if you have other videos that will help me understand. I can see and FEEL your heartache. This is not a “church.” I have no idea what this crazy is, but dear young man, I pray you find a doctrinally sound CHURCH asap. 💔. Here from The Messed Up Church. This old grandmother’s heart is broken for what is being done in the name of Church to young people these days.
That parting shot from Jeremy was demonic. Putting a CURSE ON YOU. IN JESUS NAME I BRAKE THAT OFF YOU. JESUS WAS MADE A CURSE FOR US ON THE CROSS. .REJECT THAT CURSE OVER YOUR LIVELIHOOD. $2000. WAS GUILT MONEY BECAUSE HE KNEW WHAT HE SAID WOULD AFFECT YOUR MONEY AND ABILITY TO PROVIDE.I loose provision, the Father's love and Jesus as the perfect brother, the Holy Spirit as your Comforter. Many have gone through this. CAST OFF the bandage to Domination, Manipulation and control, which is WITCHCRAFT. Stay very close to Jesus. Forgive them by handing them over to the Father for discipline. Then pick up your tent and belongings to move on to a safer place in God. Alan Watts is in WITCHCRAFT. He poisoned Jeremy and others. So sad. So sad. But, you are free now. Walk and stay in freedom and stay away from similar places. I will pray for you and them. That God removes Alan Watts. And brings restoration to Jesus to many.❤
Oh my God. As soonas i started listening to this video I heard the Lord say "cult" and then later "Pharisees"... I know Jeremy's music and have loved it but later saw some preaching/teaching vids of his and something felt very off. I also watched a sermon by Alan Scott a couple years ago and immediately sensed an abusive man with a lot of arrogance and darkness in him. I never watched him again. This is horrible to hear and I am so sorry you went through this. Jesus loves you and I love you and I'm so glad your out of this now. May God bless and prosper you the right way. 💕❤
For some reason when I innocently googled 'obsidion' I was taken through a maze of different videos and after about an hour, boom, I was listening to you recount your bad experience with a church I've never heard of and people whose names I do not recognize. So I consider myself pretty neutral as an outside observer. I have almost 80 years living on this planet and about 50 as a 'Christian'. I put that word in quotes as I'm not sure what that even means in and to this modern, culture-obsessed world. I simply know that the older I get the more I see myself as utterly helpless and covered thick with filthy rags; not deserving of anything but somehow blessed over many years to have experienced the immeasurable depths of God's grace, forgiveness and mercy. Your story is heartbreaking and I've no doubt that every word is true. I have been through a few of those kinds of events myself and can truly identify with your hurt and confusion. I know of the endless soul-searching, self-doubts, sleepless nights and all that goes with the nasty and gory train wrecks that result when someone you love and respect turns on you. I know you know that the sweet taste of personal revenge lasts but a moment and is something we should stay far, far away from. Revenge is for God, and only God, to address in a way that only He can. Proverbs 19:11 [amplified] comes to mind; "Good sense and discretion make a man slow to anger, And it is his honor and glory to overlook a transgression or an offense [without seeking revenge and harboring resentment]." This particular truth from Proverbs has not been easy for me to learn and I certainly still struggle with getting it sequenced deep and permanently into my spiritual DNA. But I'm pretty sure you, me, and all the other folks involved will be at peace with one another some time soon when we cast our crowns before the King of heaven in all His glory - and begin our real life in that celestial and eternal city built to spec just for us. You are obviously a talented young man with more energy and vision than you could ever imagine. Walk forward, don't look back, keep those furrows straight and fruitful, pray for wisdom, keep lovin' on the drummer community and let God do the rest. He will swab on gobs of His healing balm and pretty soon you will stronger than ever. I promise.
I can't believe some of this! they are cult leaders do they hear their own language 'soil'. My blood boiled referring to 'prophet' honestly what a complete abuse of power. I really hope one day they hear themselves and how they have got lost into a hyper charismatic cult and arrogance of speaking on behalf of God - its just shameful. The moment you hear 'man of God' 'God told me' and it doesn't match up against the word - run - run fast!
Thank you Noah. Very eloquently expressed and it triggered recognition of similar patterns of spiritual abuse in a church I was part of recently. My experience was with the covert type; very manipulative, calculating, snake like, ready to pounce. One man controlled everything and everyone until the Holy Spirit revealed to me what was going on. I thank God for His grace. Jesus delivered me from that environment of abuse and left me with an experience where I can relate to others who have been through the same. May our experiences be used for the glory of Christ. God bless you from the UK.
Bro! I was wondering where you went. Long story short; I went through something very similar….. and I can say with great certainty, I’m glad you are back and talking about this. I’m sorry you and your wife went through this. Thankfully, Jeremy Riddle is not God and he can go pound sand. He will be accountable to God on his day of judgment. and I pray for a massive blessing on you and your wife’s life. For filtering this church and it’s leadership through the discernment of Scriptures. I love your drumming, I love all the videos you ever made. You were a massive inspiration, and still are to me as a worship drummer. I can’t imagine the amount of crap that you guys are having to work through right now, but just know, God is bigger and better than Alan Scott and Jeremy riddle. DeBoltDrumming blew up because of your faithfulness to God and the gifts and talents that he blessed you with. You honored those and used them to serve God. Jeremy Riddle is spiritually corrupt in what he said to you. He does not have authority over you, only God does, and again he can go pound sand. According to Jeremy, your channel shouldn’t exist because without his authority, how could you have made all those videos? You said it best I wanna love on drummers. Bro, that is one of the most sincere acts of love and kindness. And you’ve backed it up with all of your actions by putting out all this free Content over the years. Where as Jeremy riddle is paid hundreds of thousands of dollars to manipulate people. “I just wanna love on drummers” that’s something Jesus would say and do. And he sure as heck would never tell you that you’re a failure. Because unlike Jeremy riddle, an Allen Scott, Jesus loves us unconditionally no matter what. Their culture is to make money and it’s obvious. That was never your heart in any of the videos that you posted prior to any of this happening. I just want you to know how much of a blessing you are to thousands of drummers around the world. I pray you and your wife hold your head up high. In fact that you got out of this place and saw through the manipulation and evil. I pray for inspiration and motivation to get back to doing what you love to do, because let me tell you brother it was a bigger ministry than Jeremy Riddle, an Allen Scott could ever hope to have. because it was from the heart, true and you never tried to manipulate us. Be true to yourself, bro! Surround yourself, with people that truly love you and accept you for the way you are, and who you are. Never give up the passion that God put in your heart. Your videos are a shining beacon of hope and joy that comes from Jesus Christ. Way to go man, way to share Jesus with other people in a glorifying way, and using your talents for the good of everybody, in the name of Jesus. What an awesome inspiration you have been to so many drummers. God bless you and your wife. I can’t wait to watch you prove the enemy wrong. God Bless DeBoltDrumming
My son just started playing drums in church and as someone who's led worship for a couple decades now, I explained to him before he started that he must prepare himself to be hurt before he plays his first note. Unfortunately we are dealing with humans in leadership. That means pride, selfishness, lust, greed, etc. And it's in all of us. The only thing we can do about it is guard our own hearts, remember only God is good, and do our best. We can also move on when a church (or too many relationship connections) becomes unhealthy. Note I said when. I used to think church hopping was a bad thing... but, I now feel differently about that. I am married my wife (for life) and I am committed (for life) to the Lord. But it ends there. Even in the New Testament Paul parted ways with Barnabas. It's ok to leave those we minister with and it WILL happen. We will never have a perfect church or body of Christ while we're on this earth. I think sometimes, I long for it so much that it could become an idol. This is earth and there will never be perfection. We must not seek it. Keep up what you're doing with DeBoltDrumming. My son (who's gotten very good in two years), admires what you do a LOT. With all that said, I do not know Jeremy Riddle. God sees his heart as do some of those surrounding him. I do not know the Scotts either, but much of what is written about Alan is very concerning. Those who say not to question the "prophet" are in error big time! True believers question everything and weigh it against the Word of God (and even against common sense, we who follow the Spirit should NOT check our brains at the door). You're not the only source of this input on him and by a long shot. Just the fact that he's doing what he's doing with Vineyard's assets seems border line criminal (maybe full blown). He should have started from scratch vs taking what 50 years built and throwing those out who took part in building it (financially and otherwise).
Hear, Hear on all your points, especially those in your first paragraph. Good to hear! experience has shown worship ministry is way different than it was when it was not so popular, 35 years ago...
Wow cuz, I was unsure of how true this was until the evidence you provided in this video. I grew up really admiring and loving Jeremy Riddle as well, but this is very concerning. I’m glad that you and your wife are no longer a part of it and God is definitely going to bless both of you guys and use you in a powerful way.
Hi Noah, I feel myself as a very cause-driven person like Jeremy said. To be honest, I often feel depressed after meeting community-driven people and pouring out my heart and passion and they didn't even hear any of it. So I can kinda get why Jeremy felt that way. But at the same time, cause is never a reason to abuse or mistreat people. We don't trample over people to achieve our cause.
Really sorry this happened to you.. and I'm saying this to you out of the love of God. But God encourages us to take all of our hurts and pains to Him. I am also on a worship team. The messsage for this season (for me) this year has been looking at the state of MY heart. What have been my heart motives? And how are my decisions glorifying God. This has challenged me so much in terms of how I go to handle certain situations. Where previously I would have spoken up about something I've had to sit back with God and really look at the state of my heart and the decisions I make. I've started looking at everything now - like "How is whatever it is that I'm doing glorifying God?" This question has effected everything that I do. The other day - God said to me "when you praise me on stage I want you to take that same passion and use it at the workplace." It was the most unbelievably hard thing to do because my workplace is so toxic. Everymorning before going into the office I have to ask God for cover. Then during the day I put my head phones in and just work with my praise music and podcasts playing in the back ground. I would go home and pray to God again in the evening before going to bed and then God would speak to me in my dreams (because that's what He does right? he speaks to us during the day and then reveals stuff to us at night) God was reminding me that these people I was working with - as toxic as they were - are still His kids. "That's my son/daughter you're talking about. Don't do that." I really had to choose to put the joy of God as my total focus. Our hope is not in people, as you have just noticed people will fail us and hurt us. We can not even trust ourselves. Our own hearts will deceive us. We HAVE to take everything to the foot of the cross and lay it out infront of Him. Airing a grievance out online against a pastor, leader or church member only reflects where our priorities were lying. It leads others astray and prevents the salvation of others who could be on the cusp of knowing Gods heart!! What a responsibility to bear! To know we have prevented another from knowing Gods love because we were hurt by a human we trusted so much that we placed them before God... Devastating and catastrophic result for everyone. We have a responsibility to lead people to salvation. Its good that you left an environment that you feel has lost focus. Let God deal with them. Cos He will! They WILL reap the fruit of their labours. God tells us this all the time. But for you... Take your hurt, pain, grief, betrayal to God and remember you're still on Gods assignment. And before you do anything - check your heart motives. Do whatever you do with the same grace, love and determination He gave us the day He gave His life. You've got this!!
Sounds like God is just putting out all of these people. I remember Jeremy from Bethel church. He was very very good. I am sorry to hear this is happening. I just keep an open mind and see where this goes. Seems like alot of this is happening. Could it be there is just a difference of opinion as to where the vision is heading? Im just thinking out loud. Im sorry you went through all of this stuff.
Dear brother in Christ I totally understand how you are feeling! As a born again Christian filled with the Holy Spirit I was send by Jesus himself some 25 years ago to a particular church for receiving teaching how to worship, because in my own church it was not proper to express your feelings during singing to the Lord. In that new church I learned a lot from worship and praise God, but after a while the Holy Spirit showed me strange behavior of the leaders. They started appropriating the best food during meal celebrations, drinks the finest wines, while the normal people is served with the cheapest meals. They also introduced the payment off tithing, because there lavish behavior costs a lot of money! Long story short, I pray my socks of until I received answers from the Lord! And with the answer I received I approached the church leaders and they didn't like it, and we were told to leave the church! After that the Lord gave me one more message for them, "If you not continue the work I asked you to do, i will take the people of your church one by one until there are so many left that you can count them on one hand, and I will be the last one who will leave. " You know what happened? That church doesn't exist anymore! And I still loving Jesus singing praises from the moment I wake up till I laid down my head! So don't sit in sackcloth and ashes hold on tide to Jesus, ask the Holy Spirit for guidance! Forgive them and forget them and start your new journey with the Lord. GOD BLESS YOU AND YOUR FAMILY AND YOUR CHILDREN AND THEIR CHILDREN AND THEIR CHILDREN UNTIL JESUS CHRIST COMES BACK, VERY SOON,
Hey, I would like to ask you a question. What attitude do you think a born-again christian should have for such people when they go astray ..... I know God wants no one to perish, Jesus died for all mankind. In these cases, I just feel sorry for brothers who fall into the enemies' lies and have such attitudes to the sheeps they've been entrusted with. I still love them and want them to repent, it is hard for me to just forget them and leave them to suffer for eternity.
Also, sometimes God can use people to change things inside a broken environment. If something is broken, God can fix it and we can be the tool to use for that. These are just thoughts that I have for such cases ... God be praised!
Man not gonna lie, I wanted to here the receipts before coming to a conclusion about this situation, but know I see that everything you talked about is true. That is not what church is about at all. Sad to see and I hope serious change encounters that church and that leadership. I am so sorry you had to go through this brother, this is just ridiculous.
After about 6 mo. I have come back to your channel to see if you've posted anything new. In the spirit of love, I (a 70 yr. old praise band drummer) am telling you to get back in the game. We've all taken our share of lumps and bumps along this crazy worship journey. Jesus needs you playing for him because the time is short. Satan also needs you....... out of the game, (not working for God). It's up to you who you let win this battle!
Hey brother, as someone who grew up in church as a PK and is now a pastor, I grieve for you. The American church's desire for "revival culture" has deeply wounded people and deprived them of what Jesus actually called us to do: make disciples. You can't make disciples without intentional Godly community, and we see in the Word that this Godly community was NOT revival oriented or numbers oriented. Manufactured revival kills Godly community and weaponizes otherwise sound doctrine. I pray you heal, and that you can follow in whatever God has purposed you to.
I’m glad you and your wife are no longer at that church. Spiritual abuse continues. I left my legalistic church that I was part of for 13 years. I was very involved in ministry. My former husband was not a Christian and he was abusive. I went to my then pastor for advice. I was tired of the abuse. Through tears I told this man of God that I feared for my life and my 2 young children. He smiled real big and said “ praise God! You’re suffering for the Lord!” I’ve been involved with other churches but the song remains the same. So, I officially left the organized church 7 years ago. I still love Jesus. I’m in contact with fellow believers. For the past 3 years I have been running a UA-cam channel with my son called The Reassembling. Many are deconstructing- we believe in rebuilding and reassembling. God bless you and your wife on your journey with our Lord!
As a survivor of a similar type of charismatic spiritual abuse, I applaud you for your bravery to share your experience and for going to therapy! I wish I would have at the time when I decided to leave. It took me over a decade to heal and finally go to therapy. God bless you both!
No Brasil é a mesma coisa amigo. Infelizmente, o mundo está lotado de pessoas assim, e é por isso que eu não volto para a igreja, perdi todos os meus ânimos! Eu também sou baterista no Brasil e acompanho o projeto debolt drumming desde 2019, agregou bastante na minha vida espiritual. Um abraço, espero que você e sua esposa possam enfrentar isso da melhor forma. ❤
Hey Noah, I just wanted to say I’m so sorry for what you and your wife went through. Hope you can find complete healing and restoration, love on people, build community and see DeBolt Drumming grow.
Whew I’m in the position of leadership in my Community. You’re series has been an eye opener to see if I for one, a victim or a pusher of spiritual abuse. Hope all is well with you! Did love your worship stuff.
Hey Noah, love your drumming. Sorry to hear what you've been through, but young man... saddle up and start over again, nothing in the past is worth holding on and can hurt you anymore, unless you give it the power to do so. May God bless your heart and heal you. Get up, shake off the dust and nay the Lord shine on you. Unless you let go, God in my experience does not deal with those we hold resentment towards.
Hope you are doing well! I was part of Vineyard Music for a LONG time! I was very encouraged by your drumming during the CA government lockdown of in-person worship in 2020! I even bought a Strike Pad because of your very creative "noise" crashes :) God has you and your wife in his loving arms. Jeremy is 'back at it" and it makes me sad that he just gets away with what he did, and has not apologized or owned it. He's in good company with Mike Bickle (sp?) Oh well... GODSPEED brother!
Thanks for posting this. As someone who knew (before he went to Bethel) Jeremy, I think he's a genuine guy, but has been duped by Alan. For as long as I've known Jeremy, he's always been someone who reads the "radical/exciting" people in the Bible and wants to follow them. Sadly, at least in my opinion/assumption, it's perhaps more a pursuit of adrenaline. It's common the Bethel-esque church that seems obsessed with hyped spirituality vs being a disciple of Jesus. It feels like the quiet person who is faithful to Jesus is overlooked as being part of a different (less than) cause, in place of someone who will be more entertaining...as though the latter will have more of an impact on the "world/culture."
"Cause-driven"? "Community-driven"? "The health of the culture"? "80 in the worship department by tomorrow"? This is a business, not a church. The church is the bride of christ. Im not from North America. I'm so confused. Where is Jesus? I never heard him mentioned once in what ive watched so far. Are they truly born again? I really mean that question. Where are their hearts at? The things above or the things below? In Acts they said it seemed right to us and the Holy Spirit to do [....]. The mindset here is so worldly. They are also Marthas much distracted by many things but only one thing is needful and Mary chose the better part. Thanks for this, I didn't know Jeremy Riddle was like this but these people don't know the Lord intimately judging by their fruit, hey. They throw the word "revival" and "worship" around and they don't seem to ask God for direction because their goals dont match the heart of the Father. They do 'interviews' and they judge people on "types". They are always talking numbers. So strange. Scary. Jesus said "it is written, My house will be called a house of prayer, but you are making it a 'den of robbers'." I'm glad you're out of there. You (mostly) dodged a bullet. I would ask God which church is right for me to go to and not be worried about being a part of any "inner circle". Just my take.
Debolt drumming is a success and will continue to inspire many as it did to me. Don’t let anyone tell you otherwise !!! I enjoy watching you play with such discipline, accuracy and grace. Continue playing for Jesus. Blessing from the Caribbean 🙌🏾🔥
Thanks for this Debolt. I’m a drummer in different Christian circles and just went through a similar situations. A lot of judgement and holier then thou. This sheds a lot of light in the darkness. Most churches are corrupt sad but true. I’ve had to close doors for new ones to open. Hard to find a good wife and a good church 😅
My heart breaks for you, man. Thanks for sharing. Will be praying over this. I’ve had similar experiences, and I feel like this is becoming a common thing.
Hey man I know getting hurt by leaders you held in high esteem and deeply respected is so tough. I do have a question, what is the primary heart motive for you behind posting these videos about them?
As I stated in the video: "First of all, I am wanting to raise the alarm regarding Jeremy Riddle and Alan Scott...And in addition to that I am wanting to spread awareness on what spiritual abuse is and how it effects people."
@DeBoltDrumming I hear you, and I'm sorry for what you've gone through. Spiritual wounds are among the most hurtful someone can receive. It appears that a lot of the statements from your two videos could be simply coming from a place of hurt in your heart about everything, and you calling them out could be a form of retaliation. No judgment, just an observation. Would it possibly be more beneficial to wait until your wound is healed before saying more about this situation? I went through something really hard as well with leadership, and it took me 3 to 4 years before I saw the whole thing clearly, without the lens of my wounding. It's Okay to be angry and hurt by what happened, I would just hate for you to say a ton of things that brings others down and then several years later look back and realize that maybe I shouldn't have responded so publicly with what happened. Much love to you, my man.
Benjamin you aren’t hearing what he’s saying… this is real stuff that is currently happening in churches all over the world and it is time for leaders and Pastors to repent from their evil wicked ways.. the Bible says to expose darkness and to warn of false prophets to protect others.. this can keep people from walking away from their faith once they are spiritually abused. Noah is doing this by exposing darkness. He is not doing it to hate on people. In fact, it’s the complete opposite. Because he loves people, he is warning others so they can protect their hearts from future abuse and solely rely and trust on God alone. I understand you’ve gone through things too and you may regret speaking out, but when you’ve gone through horrible abuse which I have myself, it’s time to stand for the truth and warn other people. This is why Martin Luther King Jr is known for doing what’s right. Biblically he stood for the truth to put an end to it. Especially with “believers”, this is unacceptable and needs to be put to rest.
the point is he actually has a platform that might make a difference. What’s the point of your comment? maybe wait till your more informed before you say something (that basically what your telling Debolt). I was hesitant but after hearing almost this your concern is about the post and not the toxic culture these “christians” are creating, that’s on you.
The last time I checked, Jesus never pushed people away, in fact he embraced them. We have to pray for Alan and Jermery that God would reveal the true heart of Gods intentions for this ministry.
I’m so sorry for what you have been through. Thank you for exposing this…extremely toxic and disgusting. When JR said: “I draw people”, it’s like, I’m sorry, I thought it was God that draws people! When you become focused more on culture than Christ, you become a cult. This is detestable and I am thankful more of these people are getting exposed!
@DeboltDrumming, Noah thanks for having the courage to step up when you’ve endured so much hardship through this. Church shouldn’t be about any of the stuff those guys talk about. It’s only about being in the company of believers and focusing on God and trying to have a deeper relationship with him. Keep your head up and I hope you continue to serve and create content for Worship Drummers.
I watched this whole thing, and felt the familiarity of it all with my own experience of spiritual abuse. I’m so sad to hear this about a house of the Lord that ‘seemed’ healthy. I’m so sad for you and your family in this. I pray an abundant blessing over your drum ministry and blessing over your the dreams and heart you have for community!
Im currently reading Scot McKnights book A church called Tov and he really presses into the abuse of gaslighting! This is important video! Thanks for sharing!
This is crazy to me. All this talk about the 'corporate' culture, but where does the gospel come into play? I don't believe Jesus modeled doing things this way.
Yep, I’d take community-driven over cause-driven any day. So sorry to hear about how hard this has been for you, Noah. I hope some distance from it all has been good to you
my friend and brother in Christ... you are a blessing to many people.. I am praying for you here in Brazil.. remain strong my friend.. these deceitful leaders will fall.. and the whole truth will continue to be shown to the world all.. a big hug my friend.. may God be with you always..
Hey Noah, thanks for sharing your story. I see so many parallels to a lot of stuff I've gone through in ministry. This is not easy to talk about. So, thanks for speaking up. One thing I noticed and wanted to ask for more clarity: Could it have been that you and Jeremy had a different idea of what the "part 2" meeting was about? To me, it sounds like he wasn't trying to "test" you, but rather share what he's passionate about and just completely missed the point that you signed up for the meeting for a completely different reason... Also, please don't see this as an offense: but why didn't you interrupt him in his 45-minute-talk on revival and directed the conversation to the DeBolt-Drumming? Just trying to understand here. :)
What’s the goal here? I’m trying to wrap my head around this situation, prayerfully. Some of the accusations from the church leadership are very concerning, while other accusations do seem like they’re coming from a place of offense and rejection. I think a big problem in church “culture” (if you will) today is that most congregants put the pastor(s) on pedestals. JESUS is the only one that should be there! The Bible says to test every spirit. I do commend you to going to leadership about concerns with sermons. But Jeremy telling you that you should be concerned more about being a Levite was probably intended as a loving rebuke. Paul did it all the time. Your other video you stated you didn’t know what that meant. Why didn’t you ask him? I think a lot of hurt and offense can be resolved through communication and sometimes hard conversations. Yes the body type thing is weird and the Report you mentioned is very concerning about the actions from the senior pastor. But outside-looking-in (who I guess is the majority of your intended audience for these 2 videos you’ve made regarding this), I don’t believe Jeremy and Katie has done anything besides probably being duped by the leadership, possibly like everyone else. I’ve been in a culture like this in a church before. I’ve had to stand up to someone who was manipulating me and controlling me (Matthew 18), and a lot of the leadership didn’t agree or like what I did when I severed the friendship with this person. The other leaders accused me of listening to someone else and that this was the devil separating us. BUT I knew the Truth. I actually had to tell someone that my allegiance was to God and not man. Was it messy? Probably. Was it hard? Yes. Was it worth it, physically, mentally, spiritually? 100%. I had to learn to be OK with people not understanding and not have the need to explain. God knew, I knew, and that’s really all that matters. I was obedient to Him. Everyone is at a different place with their walk with the Lord. I think if everyone understood that, from top to bottom, there would be greater understanding and compassion. Sounds like there’s not much of that here. Leaders are still meant to call you higher - not in a worldly sense but in the true nature of friendship with Jesus and relationship with Him. It sounds like that was what Jeremy was doing, at least to me. In the end, I don’t believe that this is what God intends for dealing with conflict in the Body. It may be the clinical way to deal with things or heal, but in the Kingdom? I don’t know.
This is heartbreaking bro, I'm a South African who loves to lead worship at my church and I've always really looked up to Jeremy riddles leading like really, i guess this has just shown me that the only person you can truly look to and aspire to be like is Jesus. So sorry that this has happened to you but keep your eyes on Jesus bro, he is doing a good work in you for his kingdom, to him be the glory.
So sorry for what happened to you guys. Spiritual abuse is a real thing 😢. It blessed my heart to hear you say, when asked about your vision, that you wanted to develop drummers and love on them. What a privilege it is to be in positions where we can bless the people of God. I pray you never lose that call/drive. It's the call of Jesus: to love God with all our hearts and our NEIGHBOR as ourselves. If anyone dismisses that and creates their own vision in ministry that does not first align with the great commandment, then they've totally missed it. God bless you and your family!
We were members of a Bethel plant for several years and there were many similar issues. Instead of the Word of God and the gospel being preached, a new theology was being taught. “Culture” was more important than truth. Odd things were preached from the pulpit that weren’t biblical. I questioned these things and instead of being answered, I was told I could not return to ministry until I spoke with the pastors - as if I were at fault. They misuse prophecy as a manipulative tool. I highly recommend a Rhema church which is charismatic church but solid in the Word.
Noah I'm so sorry you went through this. You've always been an inspiration for me with drumming. I used to be a member of the debolt drumming community! Keep your head up man. Thank you so much for sharing your story. Definitely keep the life updates coming. I've missed your content and definitely been wondering where you were. Glad you're okay man!
Seen this this morning leaves me broken feeling because my spiritually abusive physically abusive mentally abusive husband is the one who got me to love Jeremy riddles worship music. Before watching this I had to pray that God would open my eyes to the truth and teach me how to praise him in Psalms and hymns only. If he is the same yesterday today and forever then why are we changing his music in the first place or changing the way we disciple people?
Watching this in April of 2024. Since you posted this, the terrible abuse at the hands of both Mike Pilavacchi and Mike Bickle has been revealed. Just yesterday, Matt Redman's short documentary about Soul Survivor and Mike P. was released. It's sickening and heartbreaking. I'm so sorry about what you went through. I have been under spiritually abusive leaders myself. I wouldn't wish it on anyone. I wonder regularly if there are ways in which my own experiences of abuse might show up in my own leadership. I appreciate the endorsement of the book you read from. I'll be picking that one up myself to learn about and hopefully identify patterns that may exist in my own character, habits, and style that I might be able to eliminate and grow through. Peace.
Im thinking theres more worship of the worship teams than of Jesus . I would love to come to the meeting and not see the team ... Just lift our being before the Lord .
I was in these staff and pastoral meetings and can say that this only scratches the surface of how Alan and the rest of the team, including myself, spoke about people behind closed doors. I deeply regret my involvement in this and hope that speaking out brings truth and light.
Although in these audios, you hear talk of revival, what they really mean is having a large church, building a movement with influence, getting more speaking invites, and ultimately making money. Alan was obsessed with leadership and revival, but it really boiled down to numbers and gaining recognition globally, but mostly power and control. I witnessed him lying to people's faces, manipulating situations, firing staff, and doing whatever he deemed necessary to create a culture where people believed in and followed him, and where he had control and power.
During the course of my four years, I became deeply afraid of Alan. He often threatened to fire me if he felt "I was breaking his trust." He would remind me often how lucky I was that he spent so much time with me and how I could lose that privilege, and he would say things like "maybe God was wrong about me," etc. He eventually began controlling who I could or couldn't be friends with, who I was speaking to and about what, and the list goes on.
I went to Jeremy Riddle multiple times, afraid of disclosing too much, and I told him in tears only about Alan's screaming and threatening fits. He told me that this was the price for revival and how apostles and spiritual fathers behaved. Jeremy shared that he had experienced similar treatment at Bethel, specifically with Kris Vallotton and the Johnson family, and it had paid off for him in his ministry/calling. He encouraged me to endure Alan's treatment, assuring me that if I left Alan's covering, no other pastor would see me or my purpose and invest in me the way Alan had. He emphasized this, claiming he had visited many churches and knew.
These audio clips only scratch the surface of the toxicity I experienced within the "inner circle." My husband and I have every intention of releasing a fuller statement with supporting documents about my time as a pastor directly supervised and mentored by Alan Scott soon. What else is needed to see change and accountability here?
These people are sick, they will never regret
Behind you Cynthia.
Cynthia, I’m so sad to hear of your experiences. You are very brave telling your story and I’m proud of you. You and Bradley are so anointed and you both we’re such a blessing to us all. I pray you and Bradley come out of this STRONGER and with MORE resolve to do the Lords work. We all have scars from our walk. As John Wimber would say, “Never trust a leader without a limp”. You will be forever changed by this but God brings ALL things together for His glory. God bless you girl and give Bradley my love. Kristy Foster (the Cheesemaker)
There is a reason we are taught to test fruit (Mt. 7.15-20; Gal. 5.19-26). Angry outbursts, abuse, greed, dissensions and factions, etc are works of the flesh. I don't care what they claim to be, these behaviors are incompatible with a person walking with the Spirit. True spirituality is love and service to others just like our Lord. Glad you both walked away from this.
@@ColeM440 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
It is time for spiritual abuse to be brought in the light and dealt with it’s hurting the sheep and it breaks the heart of God! Thank you for sharing
Silent subscriber here: my two year old son loves to drum, and has been watching your videos on repeat for the past year or so. He even copies some of your movements and I often ask him, “Are you doing Debolt drumming?“ And he smiles and nods his head yes. Just wanted you to know, you’ve been a huge encouragement to this household. My husband is in ministry too, and we will both be praying for this situation. I’m so sorry to hear about this, thank you for coming forward and telling the truth. God bless you! 🙏
That’s amazing! I’ll have to check out his videos always wanted to play the drums to hard thing to do I bet
David Koresh..Jrs are out there.. all cults are the same they just wear different mask!! I don’t follow any ofcultish pied pipers… God pulled me away from all of it 7 years ago💕✝️
Being called "community-driven" like it's an insult is one of the best things I could hope to hear about myself - I hope it encourages you as well, Noah.
Amen
Exactly!
Thank you so much for sharing this Noah. I am so sorry this happened to you and I hope you are taking the time you need to heal. Sharing your story brings hope to people like me who attended VA for our whole lives and suffered spiritual abuse from the new leaders there as well. It’s so sad to see this happening, especially at the hands of people I’ve personally known my entire life. Thank you for your candor and for shining a light on this.
Hi Nicole!
Major props to you man for standing strong on Jesus and His Kingdom. We’re all praying for you ❤
I appreciate your willingness to come forward. It’s encouraging for me to feel like I’m not the only one who is/has gone through a spiritually abusive church culture. But it still doesn’t change the fact that it burdens my heart to see another story like this. There needs to be more safeguards and accountability of leaders showing these tendencies BIG TIME.
Noah, I am so sorry for you and your wife. I am glad to hear that you are still believing in Jesus alone!
I have also seen churches that promote a really strong "culture" that is, in reality, extremely toxic and exclusive. For anyone in the comments, let this be a warning to avoid the churches that promote culture, not following Jesus!
Jeremy disliked me so much so I grateful not one of his drummers. But, before he left Anaheim he did tell the worship at the time NOT to use me as the drummer because I was “too old.” When he came came to Anaheim, before the theft, he wouldn’t even speak to me. I was kicked off the worship team without any notice, reason or a sit down to talk. I tried reaching out but nothing. It was at the same time that Kathryn Scott stopped talking to me, after a 15+ year friendship. Alan had already distanced himself from me and my family.
Some time later I was diagnosed with cancer. Some of the board members, pastors and parishioners offered to pray for me before the service. They invited Alan to come, but he refused. Not once did he reach out and expressed his feelings about my cancer diagnosis. Again, this was supposedly my friend of 15+ years, our family spent summers together, vacations together, and countless meals only for it to end in complete silence.
I can categorically say without reservation that the words to come out of Alan‘s mouths are so filled with deception and lies. And it grieves me that people that I know for over 35 years of attending the Anaheim Vineyard are citing with Alan Scott and Jeremy Riddle rather than the countless people that have been hurt and driven out from the church, where they met their spouses, where they married, and buried their loved ones, and where they raise their kids.
Well said. I am stunned by those from our family who have chosen to stand with Alan and Jeremy.
These people are sick and evil. Sorry for you. God will judge them with justice
I am so sorry for the way you have been treated. Praying for you and if there is anything I can do, please let me know. - Luke Geraty
"Too old." I think this shows that they are just using their body type personality theory as cover to only have people that match a certain look be visible. Too old or too fat is just bad for their image, I guess.
By Gods grace I pray peace will cover all of those hurt by this situation. But it will not come until you reach out to God and forgive. Not because they deserve it but because it is a commandment. It will free you all to let the offense go. Leave them in the hands of Almighty God and let the healing begin!!!!! In the name of Jesus
This is major church hurt, and my spirit cries for you and your wife. Your videos have helped me to help others be lead to the Lord and the fact that Jeremy and Alan couldn't see that your ministry is just as important as their what maybe started as a pure ministry is just the devil at work. Praying for you and that Diebold Drumming sees the most success in the future that it ever has.
Yes glad I found these videos
You’re such a blessing thank you so much! 😢 I’m sorry you and your wife went through this and I hope that you all are okay now.
Man's Really said "They just wanna Care and Love People" Like it was a bad thing.... and then sending a text (and not an in person meeting) asking you to step down from any leadership. So sorry you had to deal with this kind of abusive leadership. I've dealt with my fair share of toxic leadership and luckily it has made me stronger and led me to the proper church, with the proper culture that I need during this time. I hope you find the same brother. Praying for you
Thank you so much for sharing this. Churches like this are hotbeds for cults of personality. Worship should never revolve around a pastor.
Wow, thank you for this video. I went through a very similar situation while drumming and working full time at a church. It’s always been a difficult thing to sit down and process. Your story and insight has helped me understand the callousness that went on. It’s truly disheartening that churches are more interested in “culture” than they are helping out their own people.
I always pictured church like that movie “How to Save a Life” or “I’m not Ashamed” which are both Christian movies but I guess it’s sad that I am so naive.
This sounds like a cult not a church . I’m so sorry this happened to you!
That’s why I would tell my boyfriend that we need to go to the cult church once a month I guess I was right about it the whole time 😂 that’s funny. He thinks they are all weird to we went to a wenseday night worship thing and he thought it was so weird and went to church today and once again he hated it and so we left after worship. Sad that the truth is coming to light. I think they may be Bipolar though unfortunately
It is very cult like. I went today. 🤷♀️ I just enjoy the music but I was so upset when I saw this video and heard the clips.
Yikes “ THE PROPHET “ thing! Again
It is a CULT. It really is, I had to discover this all by myself. The Vineyard USA and it's splinter churches
As a “3” it’s disheartening to see that my body “type” is used against me to assume bad intent on my part. Ugh this whole thing makes me so sick
God designed your body. How arrogant for them to discuss body types at all! Where is the Gospel of Jesus Christ?
Bizarre about body type. Japan hires people according to blood type.
My heart shattered when I heard the “so interesting” about loving and caring people, like for me that is something I truly believe, to love and care for each other is one of the primordial things, as a matter of fact it is in the Bible when Jesus is asked about the most important commandment.
Noah I have no words only gratefulness, thank you for helping me in my drumming and for being open with my million doubts about drumming stuff ❤
Yes bro! Loving and caring for People is what Revival is all about. How will they know we are His disciples by the way we love one another. True revival begins when we come back to Love and Love compels us to Love each other as He loves us.
So glad you are speaking up about spiritual abuse. Me and my wife went through a similar situation a few years ago. Thank you for stepping out and speaking Truth. 🙏🏼
These videos helped me a lot. I suffered years and years of spiritual abuse growing up. Well, what I learned from this video is that these church leaders don't love PEOPLE. They love themselves, WORSHIP themselves, and they think if they can just make everyone like THEMSELVES, their "church" will be the most awesome, because it is in THEIR image. So instead of being transformed into Christ's image, the people are forced to become like this idol.
I believe you and I’m so sorry. Your points here are spot on.
I served at a church for a long time where the pastor (my ex FIL) told me, "You can't serve the Lord with tattoos and earrings." It was manipulative. What he was actually saying was, "You can't serve in MY church...". I was told after his daughter divorced me that if I got remarried that I was gonna close the door on lots of opportunities that God has for my life and that I was gonna close the door to God's blessings.
I've had more opportunities to serve the Lord since I've been out of that "cult"ure. These people care more about the name of their "church" than the name of Jesus.
Thank God that my faith was deeper in Christ than it was in people and that it didn't drive me away altogether.
God bless you and your family in the future 🕊🖤🎶
That is so true, they care more about their church, then Jesus and the global body of Christ.
I am from Brazil. I've seen both videos. I hope you stay with Lord, despite the spiritual abuse. be blessed!!
I hope that for him too!! I was in a spiritually abusive church, too, and was spiritually abused. When I spoke out about it, I was deemed as the bad guy and was let go to Satan for the destruction of my flesh. It took me 4 yrs to get over this spiritual abuse. I have seen so many people go out of this same church, and they are no longer walking with God!! Their lives are a mess, and they are so entrenched with sin, I'm not sure they will ever come out of it!! Honestly, I think most of these people weren't true followers of Christ. They just liked being tickled and elevated!! And then it all crashed down, and they left the church never truly committing to the Lord Jesus Christ!!
Very important to stay with the Lord.
Just a thought. You didn't fail their test, they failed yours. As a follower it is our duty to test our leaders to make sure they are leading and preaching the true word and being as life giving and loving as Jesus. Please keep up the fight and know that we are with you. ALSO, please do more drum stuff when you feel ready. I cannot wait.
Agree. They failed the test, not you.
Welcome to the world of Christians who came out of abusive churches. Time to get Sound Doctrine in a good church where the pastor is the biggest servant of everyone. It is such a blessing this happend to you so you could get out. Thank you for your courage to share.
Thank you for sharing! Keep the faith and expose darkness!
The problem with these worship driven communities is that they disguise themselves as churches when they are in fact, not. It is like a never-ending conference. And when people with other giftings want to join, they are alienated. Do you ever see evangelists in one of these worship movements? Hardly. Because it doesn’t fit the vision of constant worship. This model is not a real biblical church. It doesn’t include the entire body of Christ and all of it’s giftings. That’s what makes it feel exclusive or cult like.
Thats an interesting point as someone who loves music it is difficult not to be attracted to a church with great worship. There is a danger in that
I agree. God has shown me this as well. It's been tough finding a well rounded Church. It's like I get good teaching and The Gospel or worship. I personally beleive The Lord showed me this is what's causing the lack of some revivals.
@@selahrichardson it's hard finding a balance. I go to a church with great preaching/teaching but the worship sometimes lacks. The Pastor has made some negative comments about worship styles, and I think he kind of unintentionally stifles some of the flow of worship because of his strong personality and focus on preaching because I believe he's been so turned off by the entertainment aspect of worship in America. I used to go across town to another church who had very talented musicians, gifted, I played and sang at times there, but very fluffy preaching often. So not sure what I'm getting at here, but it's a struggle to find that balance! We should pray for the leaders of churches to be led by grace and truth in their leadership like Jesus.
This story is heart wrenching. Tis leadership is toxic and despicable. I do not have to be a prophet to predict that this leadership will implode like all the others we have seen recently. So sad. So ungodly. What you sow, you will reap. Noah, the Lord delivered you! See it as a step forward and not backward. Thank you for bringing this into the light. When I saw the first video of Jeremy Riddle, I did not know who he was and where he is from. All I can say is that my inner response was “ this guy is a performer, not a worshipper”. May the Lord bless you and through your wounds others would find healing! From South Africa.
This kind of stuff is insidious and needs to be called out. Good on you man
Thank you for speaking up and sharing your story.
Thank you for sharing this. Any church that prioritizes “culture” over Jesus has already failed. Culture is something so important but if the center of that culture isn’t Jesus then sadly many people can get damaged by this. I pray for you and pray God can guide you through these moments! God bless you
Man, I think I speak for a lot of people when I say this... I was never here for Jeremy. Not a hint of me even gave a wit about who's name was singing, or playing this or that instrument. I was here because I saw someone who served with such great passion on the drums that it inspired me to do the same! That was you bro! And I'm still here for the same reason.
Edit: By 'here' I mean this youtube channel
I don’t remember debolt so it must have been a long time ago but I started attending the church back in 2021 I think.
Amazing how people are more concerned about defending the evil rather than exposing the truth. Noah is not the only one who’s been abused by Alan and Jeremy. Let’s make sure no one else is.
Alan and Jeremy are not the enemy in this case. They are also victims of the enemy. No one is defending evil that is ludicrous. If your son was acting a jerk are you going to expose him to the world? I hope not. Then you are no better than what you are claiming to expose. Alan and Jeremy are Gods children first then leaders. Its His job to discipline them.. If He tells you to do so, then youre good.
@joanneddy7426 Friend, Alan and Jeremy are not like children who are having their mistakes exposed. They are powerful spiritual leaders with highly influential public platforms. If it is true that they are sinning and if it is true that their practices are harmful to the sheep, it is our Christian duty to address the issue. Our Lord and the scriptures make it very clear that we should not tolerate this kind of abuse in His church. Please, I want to encourage you to seriously reconsider this matter.
@@Mere-Theism my first comment was"" someone should be fasting and praying and hear from God on this matter before acting." Alan and Jeremy a rent the only ones who will be effected by this mans decision to expose. I never said it was absolutely wrong. But is it God. Not one person has said they heard from God. Nor has anyone uses any scripture to back up these actions. I have had several similar situations where God has said to me. Let it go and move on. I will handle it.
@@Mere-Theism nothing to reconsider. Who has heard from ALMIGHTY GOD??? Who?
@@joanneddy7426Matthew 18, in context, eventually leads to a full on exposure.
There is already one pastor in these comments, who said they tried to speak on the sin and she was told to endure it. No repentance happened.
So, exposure is biblical and commanded if the parties refuse to repent. They've been addressed. By people that atte ded dwelling place and by vineyard.
They ignore. So now it's to be publicized. That's a COMMAND.
The body type thing???? Wtf????? Thank you for sharing and being so transparent man. So sorry about the abuse you’ve had to experience over the years.
Wow, how sad that people in Leadership misrepresent the heart of God and his kingdom. 🙏🏽🙏🏽😢😢
Thank you for sharing DeBoltDrumming 🙏🏽
Noah, lift your head brother, in the right time God will do his justice. Rest your heart! A big hug. ♥️🇧🇷
🇧🇷🇧🇷🇧🇷
Thank you for this. A leader is not someone who takes the position but earns it. I didn’t hear one verse when talking about leadership and roles. You are a priest of your home and no one can take that away from you. Wolves are not so easily discerned when they are in sheep’s clothing. God will expose them. Blessings.
The term “culture” being used that heavily in a church is a red flag for a cult. Funny how cult is in the word culture. I’ve seen a church like these fall as fast as they rise with lawsuits galore. There were special gifts given to show you were in the “inner circle” like rings and watches. I was given a watch by someone which was one of the watches given to the inner circle and the questions began to fly. Everyone in the inner circle was compulsively asking me where I got the watch and how nice it was. I think the person who gave it to me wanted to give me a peak behind the curtain. It later came out in court documents about the watch I had and the rings being given for allegiance to the leader. Man charismatic Christianity has gone off the rails big time. This caused my to walk away from church years ago but came back when I was rooted in Christ more than an organization. These types of church can cause irreparable harm to Jesus loving believers.
My brother, Im Richard from Dominican Republic. I only can say 2 things about this: 1. I'm sorry 2. Please, please, please keep seeking and knowing God personally, don't let this event discourage you and your wife.
People are imperfect, but God stills there for all of us.
I'll be praying for you guys.
Blessings!
Sorry, I just don’t see evidence of Jeremy Riddle abusing anyone here? That's quite a serious charge. I don’t know the man and am not a blind defender (or even a fan of the music) - but not a *single* audio example amounts to “abuse”? If anything Jeremy Riddle seems overly gentle and even nervous about asking what he asks. I've known abusive people, and, if this evidence is anything to go by, he absolutely does not like sound like such a person. I am specifically talking about Jeremy Riddle here, since your first video was about him and part of this one is.
It seems all the comments are coming from an alternate universe. Sure, we can take a very different view from this church's leadership on how a church should be lead, but - going by this evidence at least, I saw no "crushing atmosphere" or "systemic spiritual abuse"...being enacted by Jeremy Riddle. Nor does you own story seem to cast Jeremy in that nasty light either.
If what Jeremy did here was “abuse”, then any time a leader disagrees or has a different view on what someone should do, and presents that to them (or about them in a meeting) - it’s abuse.
OK.
People should actually watch the evidence and make their own minds up. Stories like this can take away from actual abuse, which of course does happen and must be vehemently opposed. If what you didn't like was how the church was being run, it is well within your rights to make a video about that, but you are specifically accusing another person of systemic abuse, which is a serious charge.
I agree with you. All I can hear here is a clash of views, and no, I don't particularly agree with Alan Scott's way of doing things, but certainly when it comes to Jeremy Riddle himself I heard no evidence of "abuse". It is true abuse happens, but it has also become a lens. If this is abuse then i've been abused by pretty much every leader I've been under (but I don't think I have.) Is rebuke and disagreement not allowed? Plus the guy got $2,500 at the end!
What I write will probably be seen as "part of the problem" and an example of why abuse still goes on, but it really isn't. I hate manipulation, control, and abuse. What Jeremy did, according to this evidence at least, is not that.
@@hajdu4533 Yes, exactly. Disagreement is fine; the video could even be titled along the lines of "the bad leadership of the Dwelling Place" - but an accusation of abuse is very serious!
Your right!
Some of the things detailed here are definately at least manipulative, and cult-esq behaviour, if not outright abusive.
J.R. Doesn't like how DeBolt chooses to help people on his Insta and UA-cam. beyond just disagreeing with him over it, he manipulates him into resigning over it to avoid the drama of firing. J.R. is forcing him to either only be a resource to his church and team, rejecting the broader christian community or not be apart of the team at all. This is CLASSIC cult behavior. Isolating Debolt from the broader church community because its not 'the mission' (his own ministry).
I doubt this abuse is calculated or anything. But church leaders need to be above this kind of manipulative behavior. Its unlikely to further the Message, and leaving hurt people in your wake is not what Jesus is about.
Thank God for these recordings. All meetings should be recorded in churches.
I’m so sorry for your hurt. Never having been in a word-salad church, and I can’t comprehend what these “leaders” are even talking about. I pray you and your wife have found a safe home. I’m going to go back and see if you have other videos that will help me understand. I can see and FEEL your heartache. This is not a “church.” I have no idea what this crazy is, but dear young man, I pray you find a doctrinally sound CHURCH asap. 💔. Here from The Messed Up Church. This old grandmother’s heart is broken for what is being done in the name of Church to young people these days.
Dont you think it rather strange that just about EVERY worship video seems to exclusively feature people between 20-30, no children or eldelry people?
That parting shot from Jeremy was demonic. Putting a CURSE ON YOU. IN JESUS NAME I BRAKE THAT OFF YOU. JESUS WAS MADE A CURSE FOR US ON THE CROSS. .REJECT THAT CURSE OVER YOUR LIVELIHOOD. $2000. WAS GUILT MONEY BECAUSE HE KNEW WHAT HE SAID WOULD AFFECT YOUR MONEY AND ABILITY TO PROVIDE.I loose provision, the Father's love and Jesus as the perfect brother, the Holy Spirit as your Comforter. Many have gone through this. CAST OFF the bandage to Domination, Manipulation and control, which is WITCHCRAFT. Stay very close to Jesus. Forgive them by handing them over to the Father for discipline. Then pick up your tent and belongings to move on to a safer place in God. Alan Watts is in WITCHCRAFT. He poisoned Jeremy and others. So sad. So sad. But, you are free now. Walk and stay in freedom and stay away from similar places. I will pray for you and them. That God removes Alan Watts. And brings restoration to Jesus to many.❤
Oh my God. As soonas i started listening to this video I heard the Lord say "cult" and then later "Pharisees"...
I know Jeremy's music and have loved it but later saw some preaching/teaching vids of his and something felt very off. I also watched a sermon by Alan Scott a couple years ago and immediately sensed an abusive man with a lot of arrogance and darkness in him. I never watched him again.
This is horrible to hear and I am so sorry you went through this.
Jesus loves you and I love you and I'm so glad your out of this now.
May God bless and prosper you the right way.
💕❤
For some reason when I innocently googled 'obsidion' I was taken through a maze of different videos and after about an hour, boom, I was listening to you recount your bad experience with a church I've never heard of and people whose names I do not recognize.
So I consider myself pretty neutral as an outside observer. I have almost 80 years living on this planet and about 50 as a 'Christian'. I put that word in quotes as I'm not sure what that even means in and to this modern, culture-obsessed world. I simply know that the older I get the more I see myself as utterly helpless and covered thick with filthy rags; not deserving of anything but somehow blessed over many years to have experienced the immeasurable depths of God's grace, forgiveness and mercy.
Your story is heartbreaking and I've no doubt that every word is true. I have been through a few of those kinds of events myself and can truly identify with your hurt and confusion. I know of the endless soul-searching, self-doubts, sleepless nights and all that goes with the nasty and gory train wrecks that result when someone you love and respect turns on you.
I know you know that the sweet taste of personal revenge lasts but a moment and is something we should stay far, far away from. Revenge is for God, and only God, to address in a way that only He can. Proverbs 19:11 [amplified] comes to mind; "Good sense and discretion make a man slow to anger, And it is his honor and glory to overlook a transgression or an offense [without seeking revenge and harboring resentment]."
This particular truth from Proverbs has not been easy for me to learn and I certainly still struggle with getting it sequenced deep and permanently into my spiritual DNA. But I'm pretty sure you, me, and all the other folks involved will be at peace with one another some time soon when we cast our crowns before the King of heaven in all His glory - and begin our real life in that celestial and eternal city built to spec just for us. You are obviously a talented young man with more energy and vision than you could ever imagine. Walk forward, don't look back, keep those furrows straight and fruitful, pray for wisdom, keep lovin' on the drummer community and let God do the rest. He will swab on gobs of His healing balm and pretty soon you will stronger than ever. I promise.
I can't believe some of this! they are cult leaders do they hear their own language 'soil'. My blood boiled referring to 'prophet' honestly what a complete abuse of power. I really hope one day they hear themselves and how they have got lost into a hyper charismatic cult and arrogance of speaking on behalf of God - its just shameful. The moment you hear 'man of God' 'God told me' and it doesn't match up against the word - run - run fast!
This is what happens when there's no discipleship on both sides....
Proud of you for putting this out bro. We support you
Thank you Noah. Very eloquently expressed and it triggered recognition of similar patterns of spiritual abuse in a church I was part of recently. My experience was with the covert type; very manipulative, calculating, snake like, ready to pounce. One man controlled everything and everyone until the Holy Spirit revealed to me what was going on. I thank God for His grace. Jesus delivered me from that environment of abuse and left me with an experience where I can relate to others who have been through the same. May our experiences be used for the glory of Christ. God bless you from the UK.
Much love to you. I'm glad you were able to get out.
Bro! I was wondering where you went. Long story short; I went through something very similar….. and I can say with great certainty, I’m glad you are back and talking about this. I’m sorry you and your wife went through this. Thankfully, Jeremy Riddle is not God and he can go pound sand. He will be accountable to God on his day of judgment. and I pray for a massive blessing on you and your wife’s life. For filtering this church and it’s leadership through the discernment of Scriptures. I love your drumming, I love all the videos you ever made. You were a massive inspiration, and still are to me as a worship drummer. I can’t imagine the amount of crap that you guys are having to work through right now, but just know, God is bigger and better than Alan Scott and Jeremy riddle. DeBoltDrumming blew up because of your faithfulness to God and the gifts and talents that he blessed you with. You honored those and used them to serve God. Jeremy Riddle is spiritually corrupt in what he said to you. He does not have authority over you, only God does, and again he can go pound sand. According to Jeremy, your channel shouldn’t exist because without his authority, how could you have made all those videos? You said it best I wanna love on drummers. Bro, that is one of the most sincere acts of love and kindness. And you’ve backed it up with all of your actions by putting out all this free Content over the years. Where as Jeremy riddle is paid hundreds of thousands of dollars to manipulate people. “I just wanna love on drummers” that’s something Jesus would say and do. And he sure as heck would never tell you that you’re a failure. Because unlike Jeremy riddle, an Allen Scott, Jesus loves us unconditionally no matter what. Their culture is to make money and it’s obvious. That was never your heart in any of the videos that you posted prior to any of this happening. I just want you to know how much of a blessing you are to thousands of drummers around the world. I pray you and your wife hold your head up high. In fact that you got out of this place and saw through the manipulation and evil. I pray for inspiration and motivation to get back to doing what you love to do, because let me tell you brother it was a bigger ministry than Jeremy Riddle, an Allen Scott could ever hope to have. because it was from the heart, true and you never tried to manipulate us. Be true to yourself, bro! Surround yourself, with people that truly love you and accept you for the way you are, and who you are. Never give up the passion that God put in your heart. Your videos are a shining beacon of hope and joy that comes from Jesus Christ. Way to go man, way to share Jesus with other people in a glorifying way, and using your talents for the good of everybody, in the name of Jesus. What an awesome inspiration you have been to so many drummers. God bless you and your wife. I can’t wait to watch you prove the enemy wrong. God Bless DeBoltDrumming
My son just started playing drums in church and as someone who's led worship for a couple decades now, I explained to him before he started that he must prepare himself to be hurt before he plays his first note. Unfortunately we are dealing with humans in leadership. That means pride, selfishness, lust, greed, etc. And it's in all of us. The only thing we can do about it is guard our own hearts, remember only God is good, and do our best. We can also move on when a church (or too many relationship connections) becomes unhealthy. Note I said when. I used to think church hopping was a bad thing... but, I now feel differently about that. I am married my wife (for life) and I am committed (for life) to the Lord. But it ends there. Even in the New Testament Paul parted ways with Barnabas. It's ok to leave those we minister with and it WILL happen. We will never have a perfect church or body of Christ while we're on this earth. I think sometimes, I long for it so much that it could become an idol. This is earth and there will never be perfection. We must not seek it.
Keep up what you're doing with DeBoltDrumming. My son (who's gotten very good in two years), admires what you do a LOT.
With all that said, I do not know Jeremy Riddle. God sees his heart as do some of those surrounding him. I do not know the Scotts either, but much of what is written about Alan is very concerning. Those who say not to question the "prophet" are in error big time! True believers question everything and weigh it against the Word of God (and even against common sense, we who follow the Spirit should NOT check our brains at the door). You're not the only source of this input on him and by a long shot. Just the fact that he's doing what he's doing with Vineyard's assets seems border line criminal (maybe full blown). He should have started from scratch vs taking what 50 years built and throwing those out who took part in building it (financially and otherwise).
Hear, Hear on all your points, especially those in your first paragraph. Good to hear! experience has shown worship ministry is way different than it was when it was not so popular, 35 years ago...
Wow cuz, I was unsure of how true this was until the evidence you provided in this video. I grew up really admiring and loving Jeremy Riddle as well, but this is very concerning. I’m glad that you and your wife are no longer a part of it and God is definitely going to bless both of you guys and use you in a powerful way.
Hi Noah, I feel myself as a very cause-driven person like Jeremy said. To be honest, I often feel depressed after meeting community-driven people and pouring out my heart and passion and they didn't even hear any of it. So I can kinda get why Jeremy felt that way.
But at the same time, cause is never a reason to abuse or mistreat people. We don't trample over people to achieve our cause.
Really sorry this happened to you.. and I'm saying this to you out of the love of God. But God encourages us to take all of our hurts and pains to Him. I am also on a worship team. The messsage for this season (for me) this year has been looking at the state of MY heart. What have been my heart motives? And how are my decisions glorifying God. This has challenged me so much in terms of how I go to handle certain situations. Where previously I would have spoken up about something I've had to sit back with God and really look at the state of my heart and the decisions I make.
I've started looking at everything now - like "How is whatever it is that I'm doing glorifying God?" This question has effected everything that I do. The other day - God said to me "when you praise me on stage I want you to take that same passion and use it at the workplace."
It was the most unbelievably hard thing to do because my workplace is so toxic. Everymorning before going into the office I have to ask God for cover. Then during the day I put my head phones in and just work with my praise music and podcasts playing in the back ground. I would go home and pray to God again in the evening before going to bed and then God would speak to me in my dreams (because that's what He does right? he speaks to us during the day and then reveals stuff to us at night) God was reminding me that these people I was working with - as toxic as they were - are still His kids. "That's my son/daughter you're talking about. Don't do that." I really had to choose to put the joy of God as my total focus.
Our hope is not in people, as you have just noticed people will fail us and hurt us. We can not even trust ourselves. Our own hearts will deceive us.
We HAVE to take everything to the foot of the cross and lay it out infront of Him. Airing a grievance out online against a pastor, leader or church member only reflects where our priorities were lying. It leads others astray and prevents the salvation of others who could be on the cusp of knowing Gods heart!! What a responsibility to bear! To know we have prevented another from knowing Gods love because we were hurt by a human we trusted so much that we placed them before God... Devastating and catastrophic result for everyone.
We have a responsibility to lead people to salvation. Its good that you left an environment that you feel has lost focus. Let God deal with them. Cos He will! They WILL reap the fruit of their labours. God tells us this all the time.
But for you... Take your hurt, pain, grief, betrayal to God and remember you're still on Gods assignment.
And before you do anything - check your heart motives. Do whatever you do with the same grace, love and determination He gave us the day He gave His life. You've got this!!
Sounds like God is just putting out all of these people. I remember Jeremy from Bethel church. He was very very good. I am sorry to hear this is happening. I just keep an open mind and see where this goes. Seems like alot of this is happening. Could it be there is just a difference of opinion as to where the vision is heading? Im just thinking out loud. Im sorry you went through all of this stuff.
Dear brother in Christ I totally understand how you are feeling!
As a born again Christian filled with the Holy Spirit I was send by Jesus himself some 25 years ago to a particular church for receiving teaching how to worship, because in my own church it was not proper to express your feelings during singing to the Lord.
In that new church I learned a lot from worship and praise God, but after a while the Holy Spirit showed me strange behavior of the leaders.
They started appropriating the best food during meal celebrations, drinks the finest wines, while the normal people is served with the cheapest meals.
They also introduced the payment off tithing, because there lavish behavior costs a lot of money!
Long story short, I pray my socks of until I received answers from the Lord!
And with the answer I received I approached the church leaders and they didn't like it, and we were told to leave the church!
After that the Lord gave me one more message for them, "If you not continue the work I asked you to do, i will take the people of your church one by one until there are so many left that you can count them on one hand, and I will be the last one who will leave. "
You know what happened? That church doesn't exist anymore! And I still loving Jesus singing praises from the moment I wake up till I laid down my head!
So don't sit in sackcloth and ashes hold on tide to Jesus, ask the Holy Spirit for guidance!
Forgive them and forget them and start your new journey with the Lord.
GOD BLESS YOU AND YOUR FAMILY AND YOUR CHILDREN AND THEIR CHILDREN AND THEIR CHILDREN UNTIL JESUS CHRIST COMES BACK, VERY SOON,
Hey, I would like to ask you a question. What attitude do you think a born-again christian should have for such people when they go astray ..... I know God wants no one to perish, Jesus died for all mankind. In these cases, I just feel sorry for brothers who fall into the enemies' lies and have such attitudes to the sheeps they've been entrusted with. I still love them and want them to repent, it is hard for me to just forget them and leave them to suffer for eternity.
Also, sometimes God can use people to change things inside a broken environment. If something is broken, God can fix it and we can be the tool to use for that. These are just thoughts that I have for such cases ... God be praised!
Man not gonna lie, I wanted to here the receipts before coming to a conclusion about this situation, but know I see that everything you talked about is true. That is not what church is about at all. Sad to see and I hope serious change encounters that church and that leadership. I am so sorry you had to go through this brother, this is just ridiculous.
After about 6 mo. I have come back to your channel to see if you've posted anything new. In the spirit of love, I (a 70 yr. old praise band drummer) am telling you to get back in the game. We've all taken our share of lumps and bumps along this crazy worship journey. Jesus needs you playing for him because the time is short. Satan also needs you....... out of the game, (not working for God). It's up to you who you let win this battle!
Thank you for this video bro
It’s all too common and you’re helping shine a light on it
Hey brother, as someone who grew up in church as a PK and is now a pastor, I grieve for you. The American church's desire for "revival culture" has deeply wounded people and deprived them of what Jesus actually called us to do: make disciples. You can't make disciples without intentional Godly community, and we see in the Word that this Godly community was NOT revival oriented or numbers oriented. Manufactured revival kills Godly community and weaponizes otherwise sound doctrine. I pray you heal, and that you can follow in whatever God has purposed you to.
I’m glad you and your wife are no longer at that church. Spiritual abuse continues. I left my legalistic church that I was part of for 13 years. I was very involved in ministry. My former husband was not a Christian and he was abusive. I went to my then pastor for advice. I was tired of the abuse. Through tears I told this man of God that I feared for my life and my 2 young children. He smiled real big and said “ praise God! You’re suffering for the Lord!” I’ve been involved with other churches but the song remains the same. So, I officially left the organized church 7 years ago. I still love Jesus. I’m in contact with fellow believers. For the past 3 years I have been running a UA-cam channel with my son called The Reassembling. Many are deconstructing- we believe in rebuilding and reassembling. God bless you and your wife on your journey with our Lord!
As a survivor of a similar type of charismatic spiritual abuse, I applaud you for your bravery to share your experience and for going to therapy! I wish I would have at the time when I decided to leave. It took me over a decade to heal and finally go to therapy. God bless you both!
No Brasil é a mesma coisa amigo. Infelizmente, o mundo está lotado de pessoas assim, e é por isso que eu não volto para a igreja, perdi todos os meus ânimos! Eu também sou baterista no Brasil e acompanho o projeto debolt drumming desde 2019, agregou bastante na minha vida espiritual. Um abraço, espero que você e sua esposa possam enfrentar isso da melhor forma. ❤
Volta cara. Jesus não errou contigo, foi o homem. 😢. Não são todas as igrejas que são assim.
Hey Noah, I just wanted to say I’m so sorry for what you and your wife went through. Hope you can find complete healing and restoration, love on people, build community and see DeBolt Drumming grow.
Whew I’m in the position of leadership in my Community. You’re series has been an eye opener to see if I for one, a victim or a pusher of spiritual abuse.
Hope all is well with you! Did love your worship stuff.
Sorry you went through that, Noah. Prayers for you and yours.
Hey Noah, love your drumming. Sorry to hear what you've been through, but young man... saddle up and start over again, nothing in the past is worth holding on and can hurt you anymore, unless you give it the power to do so. May God bless your heart and heal you. Get up, shake off the dust and nay the Lord shine on you. Unless you let go, God in my experience does not deal with those we hold resentment towards.
Hope you are doing well! I was part of Vineyard Music for a LONG time! I was very encouraged by your drumming during the CA government lockdown of in-person worship in 2020! I even bought a Strike Pad because of your very creative "noise" crashes :) God has you and your wife in his loving arms. Jeremy is 'back at it" and it makes me sad that he just gets away with what he did, and has not apologized or owned it. He's in good company with Mike Bickle (sp?) Oh well... GODSPEED brother!
Thanks for posting this. As someone who knew (before he went to Bethel) Jeremy, I think he's a genuine guy, but has been duped by Alan. For as long as I've known Jeremy, he's always been someone who reads the "radical/exciting" people in the Bible and wants to follow them. Sadly, at least in my opinion/assumption, it's perhaps more a pursuit of adrenaline. It's common the Bethel-esque church that seems obsessed with hyped spirituality vs being a disciple of Jesus. It feels like the quiet person who is faithful to Jesus is overlooked as being part of a different (less than) cause, in place of someone who will be more entertaining...as though the latter will have more of an impact on the "world/culture."
I’ve known Jeremy since he was a kid. Genuine is not a word I would use.
@@swedability slander, gossip are two words I would use. Not warning people. I will pray for you
"Cause-driven"? "Community-driven"? "The health of the culture"? "80 in the worship department by tomorrow"? This is a business, not a church. The church is the bride of christ. Im not from North America. I'm so confused. Where is Jesus? I never heard him mentioned once in what ive watched so far. Are they truly born again? I really mean that question. Where are their hearts at? The things above or the things below?
In Acts they said it seemed right to us and the Holy Spirit to do [....]. The mindset here is so worldly. They are also Marthas much distracted by many things but only one thing is needful and Mary chose the better part.
Thanks for this, I didn't know Jeremy Riddle was like this but these people don't know the Lord intimately judging by their fruit, hey. They throw the word "revival" and "worship" around and they don't seem to ask God for direction because their goals dont match the heart of the Father. They do 'interviews' and they judge people on "types". They are always talking numbers. So strange. Scary. Jesus said "it is written, My house will be called a house of prayer, but you are making it a 'den of robbers'." I'm glad you're out of there. You (mostly) dodged a bullet. I would ask God which church is right for me to go to and not be worried about being a part of any "inner circle". Just my take.
Debolt drumming is a success and will continue to inspire many as it did to me. Don’t let anyone tell you otherwise !!!
I enjoy watching you play with such discipline, accuracy and grace. Continue playing for Jesus. Blessing from the Caribbean 🙌🏾🔥
Thanks for this Debolt. I’m a drummer in different Christian circles and just went through a similar situations. A lot of judgement and holier then thou. This sheds a lot of light in the darkness. Most churches are corrupt sad but true. I’ve had to close doors for new ones to open. Hard to find a good wife and a good church 😅
Aw love this comment. Yes sad but try though 😢
My heart breaks for you, man. Thanks for sharing. Will be praying over this. I’ve had similar experiences, and I feel like this is becoming a common thing.
Did you know Jeremy riddle left the dwelling place? Was it announced. He's been removed from the website
Yes, I am aware. The Riddle’s announced it on January 7th, 2024 at a Sunday service. However, DPA has removed that service from their UA-cam channel.
Hey man I know getting hurt by leaders you held in high esteem and deeply respected is so tough. I do have a question, what is the primary heart motive for you behind posting these videos about them?
As I stated in the video: "First of all, I am wanting to raise the alarm regarding Jeremy Riddle and Alan Scott...And in addition to that I am wanting to spread awareness on what spiritual abuse is and how it effects people."
@DeBoltDrumming I hear you, and I'm sorry for what you've gone through. Spiritual wounds are among the most hurtful someone can receive. It appears that a lot of the statements from your two videos could be simply coming from a place of hurt in your heart about everything, and you calling them out could be a form of retaliation. No judgment, just an observation. Would it possibly be more beneficial to wait until your wound is healed before saying more about this situation? I went through something really hard as well with leadership, and it took me 3 to 4 years before I saw the whole thing clearly, without the lens of my wounding. It's Okay to be angry and hurt by what happened, I would just hate for you to say a ton of things that brings others down and then several years later look back and realize that maybe I shouldn't have responded so publicly with what happened. Much love to you, my man.
Benjamin you aren’t hearing what he’s saying… this is real stuff that is currently happening in churches all over the world and it is time for leaders and Pastors to repent from their evil wicked ways.. the Bible says to expose darkness and to warn of false prophets to protect others.. this can keep people from walking away from their faith once they are spiritually abused. Noah is doing this by exposing darkness. He is not doing it to hate on people. In fact, it’s the complete opposite. Because he loves people, he is warning others so they can protect their hearts from future abuse and solely rely and trust on God alone. I understand you’ve gone through things too and you may regret speaking out, but when you’ve gone through horrible abuse which I have myself, it’s time to stand for the truth and warn other people. This is why Martin Luther King Jr is known for doing what’s right. Biblically he stood for the truth to put an end to it. Especially with “believers”, this is unacceptable and needs to be put to rest.
the point is he actually has a platform that might make a difference. What’s the point of your comment? maybe wait till your more informed before you say something (that basically what your telling Debolt). I was hesitant but after hearing almost this your concern is about the post and not the toxic culture these “christians” are creating, that’s on you.
The last time I checked, Jesus never pushed people away, in fact he embraced them. We have to pray for Alan and Jermery that God would reveal the true heart of Gods intentions for this ministry.
Thanks for sharing. ❤
I’m so sorry for what you have been through. Thank you for exposing this…extremely toxic and disgusting. When JR said: “I draw people”, it’s like, I’m sorry, I thought it was God that draws people! When you become focused more on culture than Christ, you become a cult. This is detestable and I am thankful more of these people are getting exposed!
@DeboltDrumming, Noah thanks for having the courage to step up when you’ve endured so much hardship through this. Church shouldn’t be about any of the stuff those guys talk about. It’s only about being in the company of believers and focusing on God and trying to have a deeper relationship with him. Keep your head up and I hope you continue to serve and create content for Worship Drummers.
Thank for coming out and exposing this man!
Dang bro i'm so sorry you went through this man. Love you bro. God has got greater for you!!
I watched this whole thing, and felt the familiarity of it all with my own experience of spiritual abuse. I’m so sad to hear this about a house of the Lord that ‘seemed’ healthy. I’m so sad for you and your family in this.
I pray an abundant blessing over your drum ministry and blessing over your the dreams and heart you have for community!
Im currently reading Scot McKnights book A church called Tov and he really presses into the abuse of gaslighting! This is important video! Thanks for sharing!
Stand firm and stand strong brother. Do not back down.
This is crazy to me. All this talk about the 'corporate' culture, but where does the gospel come into play? I don't believe Jesus modeled doing things this way.
Just wondering , does anyone know why Jeremy left Bethel Church in Redding, that might say alot?
Yep, I’d take community-driven over cause-driven any day. So sorry to hear about how hard this has been for you, Noah. I hope some distance from it all has been good to you
"Who shall bring a charge against God's elect? It is God who justifies them". Romans 8,33.
Greetings from Brazil to the best worship drummer
my friend and brother in Christ... you are a blessing to many people.. I am praying for you here in Brazil.. remain strong my friend.. these deceitful leaders will fall.. and the whole truth will continue to be shown to the world all.. a big hug my friend.. may God be with you always..
45 minutes is not a long time to talk by the way... Also, Wrong mentorship leads to wrong leadership practices
Ty for sharing! So much of what my church did to us and still does. So sad that this is a new church norm
Hey Noah, thanks for sharing your story. I see so many parallels to a lot of stuff I've gone through in ministry. This is not easy to talk about. So, thanks for speaking up. One thing I noticed and wanted to ask for more clarity: Could it have been that you and Jeremy had a different idea of what the "part 2" meeting was about? To me, it sounds like he wasn't trying to "test" you, but rather share what he's passionate about and just completely missed the point that you signed up for the meeting for a completely different reason... Also, please don't see this as an offense: but why didn't you interrupt him in his 45-minute-talk on revival and directed the conversation to the DeBolt-Drumming? Just trying to understand here. :)
What’s the goal here? I’m trying to wrap my head around this situation, prayerfully. Some of the accusations from the church leadership are very concerning, while other accusations do seem like they’re coming from a place of offense and rejection. I think a big problem in church “culture” (if you will) today is that most congregants put the pastor(s) on pedestals. JESUS is the only one that should be there! The Bible says to test every spirit. I do commend you to going to leadership about concerns with sermons. But Jeremy telling you that you should be concerned more about being a Levite was probably intended as a loving rebuke. Paul did it all the time. Your other video you stated you didn’t know what that meant. Why didn’t you ask him? I think a lot of hurt and offense can be resolved through communication and sometimes hard conversations. Yes the body type thing is weird and the Report you mentioned is very concerning about the actions from the senior pastor. But outside-looking-in (who I guess is the majority of your intended audience for these 2 videos you’ve made regarding this), I don’t believe Jeremy and Katie has done anything besides probably being duped by the leadership, possibly like everyone else.
I’ve been in a culture like this in a church before. I’ve had to stand up to someone who was manipulating me and controlling me (Matthew 18), and a lot of the leadership didn’t agree or like what I did when I severed the friendship with this person. The other leaders accused me of listening to someone else and that this was the devil separating us. BUT I knew the Truth. I actually had to tell someone that my allegiance was to God and not man. Was it messy? Probably. Was it hard? Yes. Was it worth it, physically, mentally, spiritually? 100%. I had to learn to be OK with people not understanding and not have the need to explain. God knew, I knew, and that’s really all that matters. I was obedient to Him.
Everyone is at a different place with their walk with the Lord. I think if everyone understood that, from top to bottom, there would be greater understanding and compassion. Sounds like there’s not much of that here. Leaders are still meant to call you higher - not in a worldly sense but in the true nature of friendship with Jesus and relationship with Him. It sounds like that was what Jeremy was doing, at least to me.
In the end, I don’t believe that this is what God intends for dealing with conflict in the Body. It may be the clinical way to deal with things or heal, but in the Kingdom? I don’t know.
This is very alarming to hear.. I’m so sorry you’ve been through this.. 😔 I’ve been that person too.
This is heartbreaking bro, I'm a South African who loves to lead worship at my church and I've always really looked up to Jeremy riddles leading like really, i guess this has just shown me that the only person you can truly look to and aspire to be like is Jesus. So sorry that this has happened to you but keep your eyes on Jesus bro, he is doing a good work in you for his kingdom, to him be the glory.
I applaud your honesty. I can identify with so much of your story.
So sorry for what happened to you guys. Spiritual abuse is a real thing 😢. It blessed my heart to hear you say, when asked about your vision, that you wanted to develop drummers and love on them. What a privilege it is to be in positions where we can bless the people of God. I pray you never lose that call/drive. It's the call of Jesus: to love God with all our hearts and our NEIGHBOR as ourselves. If anyone dismisses that and creates their own vision in ministry that does not first align with the great commandment, then they've totally missed it. God bless you and your family!
We were members of a Bethel plant for several years and there were many similar issues. Instead of the Word of God and the gospel being preached, a new theology was being taught. “Culture” was more important than truth. Odd things were preached from the pulpit that weren’t biblical. I questioned these things and instead of being answered, I was told I could not return to ministry until I spoke with the pastors - as if I were at fault. They misuse prophecy as a manipulative tool.
I highly recommend a Rhema church which is charismatic church but solid in the Word.
Noah I'm so sorry you went through this. You've always been an inspiration for me with drumming. I used to be a member of the debolt drumming community! Keep your head up man. Thank you so much for sharing your story. Definitely keep the life updates coming. I've missed your content and definitely been wondering where you were. Glad you're okay man!
Seen this this morning leaves me broken feeling because my spiritually abusive physically abusive mentally abusive husband is the one who got me to love Jeremy riddles worship music. Before watching this I had to pray that God would open my eyes to the truth and teach me how to praise him in Psalms and hymns only. If he is the same yesterday today and forever then why are we changing his music in the first place or changing the way we disciple people?
Watching this in April of 2024. Since you posted this, the terrible abuse at the hands of both Mike Pilavacchi and Mike Bickle has been revealed. Just yesterday, Matt Redman's short documentary about Soul Survivor and Mike P. was released. It's sickening and heartbreaking. I'm so sorry about what you went through. I have been under spiritually abusive leaders myself. I wouldn't wish it on anyone. I wonder regularly if there are ways in which my own experiences of abuse might show up in my own leadership. I appreciate the endorsement of the book you read from. I'll be picking that one up myself to learn about and hopefully identify patterns that may exist in my own character, habits, and style that I might be able to eliminate and grow through. Peace.
Gone through a similar situation with my pastor as a drummer praying for Debolt
Im thinking theres more worship of the worship teams than of Jesus . I would love to come to the meeting and not see the team ... Just lift our being before the Lord .