Best QRP Antenna? :: EFHW vs Dipole
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- Опубліковано 15 вер 2024
- Today we will be testing an End Fed Half Wave against a linked dipole antenna. Which will work better for portable QRP radio operations?
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EFHW Antenna Kit - km4ack.square....
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When doing POTA, I find the fewer "hang points" the better. I've used both and find if I want to use my linked dipole then I really hunt for a secluded deployment site. I don't use a balun or tuner for the dipole which means I have to get the feed point at least a 1/2 wave above ground and the tips at least 10ft above ground which can be a challenge. The dipole wire is also black with neon guy paracord, for safety to others. SOTA sights can be bare of trees and limited hang points. With an EFHW you just need one. I don't worry much about the height of the hang point, but try to get 45 deg. out of the slope. I also use a 49:1 and hike with a matching unit, just to make sure I can TX if I get a bad location. The feed point is typically under 1 ft above the ground and without a CP. Thanks for the video sir! W0KNI Like+Sub.
Very interesting, thanks! It's no surprise both antennas are almost identical in performance for both are dipoles in their nature. From what I've learned during my park activations is that a dipole ( I like the multiband doublet most) is more convenient to use when you have a mast and this mast is supported by or fixed to the vehicle because , in this case it is very convenient for me to sit in the car just in the middle under the antenna centre with easy access to the feeding cable. On the other hand, I always choose my 80-10 Shorty EFHW when hiking and I know I will have to deploy my Go-Box without a luxory of the car, straight in the forest or so. Then it is very convenient to have a feeding point in the end with a short and lightweight piece of cable and with equally lightweight 6m mast leaned to a tree, for example, as a middle support for the Inv V configuration of the EFHW. The performance as compared on the RBN were always almost identical of both the 26m overal length 80-10m band Doublet and 23m overal length 80-10m band EFHW. 73! Have a nice, experiment-friendly wx! Linas LY2H.
Good comparison. My feelings are the same. The dipole is just a bit louder, but you do get more bands with the EFHW. I've run the EFHW as a vertical with interesting results. I'd recommend either one for portable operations.
I'm sold on the EFHW. I use one and a 40 meter loop. Incredible performance and band selection all without a tuner
well done and a much needed "apples to apples" comparison!
Have used EFHWs and centre-fed dipoles for SOTA and other QRP/P. My personal favourite is EFHW. However, to be a true EFHW, it should be a HW and not some multiple. It will work and match OK at multiples of the fundamental but you won't be getting HW dipole radiation pattern. So, if you want a multiband EFWH, just install some links. The advantage is you only need x1 extra link for each additional band (unlike x2 on center-fed). Of course, adding/removing links is a hassle and if you're happy with the performance of, say, a 20m EFHW on 10m without removing the link, why bother 😉.... I keep meaning to homebrew a trapped EFHW as this would give proper EFHWs on each band without the hassle of taking it down to change bands. Again, advantage is only x1 trap per extra band; less parts and less weight.
Another advantage of the EFHW is that you can get away with only a very short length of co-ax feed. Co-ax is lossy and heavy to support or lug around. This is why so many SOTA ops use EFHWs. Also, if you want a vertical for low angle, EFHW can be fed at the base with just a short length of co-ax where outer shield is acting as a counterpoise. No radials to mess about with and, again, you don't have tens of meters of co-ax to deal with.
Just watched Josh's video in your EFHW. Looks solid, definitely more convenient than my Silver Bullet 1000. I'll probably be getting it in a couple weeks, 73 de W8IJC!
save money and make it. EFHW group on facebook steve ellington cant remember his call has the best design.
I have done some similar testing with whisper and found same results. But i get different results when in the field. I have been using both for several years now doing SOTA and have found i make way more contacts with a dipole. If you want a dipole that you dont need to change you can build a trapped dipole. Whats nice about that is no tuner needed.
One suggestion: I would really appreciate seeing pictures of the antennas deployed. You mentioned that you had them in inverted V and L, and you considered them NVIS, but would be great to have some sense of how sloped they were, and how far above ground they were, as well as how you used the mast to hang them, etc.
I am just getting started in HF with a QRP radio, and fumbling around with antenna setups myself, so it's a great help to see what others are doing as I learn what works best for my usage.
With 22 gauge wire I really doubt you would see it on camera. Google is a wonderful tool that can give you images of how to setup the actual wire.
Thanks Jason, I think I will go EFHF as my next antenna. I like having a wide choice of bands.
Interesting and informative experiment. Answered a few of my concerns about using an EFHW for QRP. Well done Jason!
👍👍 Well done sir! I wish there was a double thumbs up for your video.
I want answers to the dipole/EFHW dilema. Excellent advice: Try them out myself. Thank you!
Great job Jason! 🤘📻👍Love it and nice to see your “found” data. Thanks for sharing!
Feed point of EFHW can be near the transceiver and need shorter feed line. It is much easier to hang a EFHW antenna than the dipole.
I'm definitely looking forward to next video, I'm very interested to see what you chose for your kit. Myself, I don't have anything super defined yet, and I have to check have my shack apart but it works. My Yaesu FT-891, my power supply (don't have a battery yet), my CW keyer, and a small manual tuner. For digital I have my Raspberry Pi 4 running Build-a-Pi, the U-Blox 7 GPS, a USB Digimode 3 sound interface, and the appropriate cables. Oh and powering the pi I have a regular usb-c power supply, no boost converter for 12v yet. To interface with the pi I'll have my Galaxy Tab S6 Lite, and a small Foldable bluetooth keyboard. And for antennas I have my Silver Bullet 1000 TIA, and hopefully soon your EFHW. Currently I need some better coax, and battery and I'll be fully portable. Thanks for the informative videos, and for Build-a-Pi!
Well, it took me more than a few weeks, but I finally managed to grab one of your EFHWs!
I think all things considered the most convenient one is the EFHW. Similar performance no tuner rqd and you only need one tie up spot instead of two. With light wire considering only 5W an EFHW can be made extremely light and compact. I think you will probably reach the same conclusion. Another option for portability is the magnetic loop but its more complicated takes more parts, a bit more cumbersome to man carry.. and you need to tune it every time you change frequency.. but! You don’t depend on having tress around. Nevertheless nice test Jason for “better” conclusions i would just comment on setting both up and testing both closer in time so you can conclude its an antenna thing and not just a propagation change.
All the best 73
Bruno
I love my endfed but I am always amazed by the performance of my homebrew loop. 73 de KF7VUT
@@timk7749 I’ve also home-brewed a loop, and use it indoor with quite good results but i get better results with the EFHW on the outside.. (a bit of an advantage there) but for portable qrp the loop is quite some gear to carry along. Capacitor with stepper box.. semi ridgid cable loop.. tripod.. cables.. electronic control box. That’s what i ment. If you haul everything in a car then i would say take both!
Cheers!
Bruno CT7AXA
@@tasheido exactly. I have used my loop in hotel rooms on many occasions with excellent results. I also like the fact that, in a noisy hotel environment, you can turn the loop and null out some of the really bad noise. Loops definitely has a place in the QRP bag of tricks. 73 de KF7VUT
A very well done test. Great job!
Another consideration is receive. I often give worse reports than I get with my EFHW. I'm not sure if it's my antenna or rig but it's pretty consistent. Still, I love the simplicity of my 64' EFHW setup as an inverted L on a 40' Spiderbeam mast.
DE KJ7LVZ
Try adding a counterpoise wire or two for giggles and see if that helps. I hardly ever gave out 5/9 reports until I added one. Could've been coincidental but wire is cheap and experimenting can be fun.
Good content! Personally I believe that some days you'll find one works better than the other because band conditions will dictate propagation and it is always changing. For whatever reason one just seems to do better on that particular day even though the other antenna worked better two days ago. It's good to have options and won't hurt to keep both handy. I use a random-ish end fed, 9:1 unun, and antenna tuner in a sloper configuration for my FT-818 at home or in the field with good results. If only working one or two bands a dipole is hard to beat but I enjoy using just about every band which is why I like end feds, not to mention they're easy to setup.
A dipole will always be better *provided* you can get it where it needs to go. You have a horizontal polarization which will better match most permanently installed antennas around the world. Temporary antennas, particularly at higher frequencies, are likely to be vertical antennas. The low takeoff angle of verticals probably offer better DX. Slopers are a compromise that will couple, somewhat less effectively, but with both vertical and horizontal antennas. By the time your signal has skipped, it will have changed polarization anyway so the best portable antenna tends to be vertical. A 40 meter quarter wave with radials is pretty big, a 40 meter end fed half wave is of course twice higher and you still need radials but you call them "counterpoise".
Review: I have the KM4ACK EFHW antenna featured in this video. It works phenomenally well. I set it up in a hybrid slope/inverted L configuration (approximately 30 feet high in the air, at a 75° angle, using a tree branch). I use it with the Yaesu FT-818. From Central Texas, I have worked Missouri (613 mi), Georgia (794 mi) and Wyoming (848 mi) on the 40 meter band; Chicago (966 mi) on the 20 meter band; and West Virginia (1,290 mi) on the 15 meter band, ON FIVE WATTS. This antenna works QRP phone very, very well.
Thanks for the report! Glad it is working well for you :-)
This sound interesting. Could you clarify, is the line from the pole going straight to the feed point, more like a 75d slope, or is there a pole in the middlish making a dog leg to the ground for the 75d?
@@larhouser The gif on this page is the best example I can find to show the angle that the wire is in when set it up from radio to wire end (all the other details in the gif are not relevant). The total angle from radio to end of EFHW wire would be an obtuse angle, around 115 degrees. I have used it with a few portable masts with success, but mainly throw it over tree branches. Hope this clarifies and helps. Thanks and 73,
www.hamuniverse.com/slopinginvl.html
I prefer the end fed antennas, that said without a doubt you are experiencing loss due to the 49:1 transformer. Nice video Jason 👍
Yes. I believe that is the difference you see in the signal reports. Is it enough to deter us from using it with a QRP rig? My initial thought is no but I want to do some more testing. Time will tell.
Loss is minimal with a 49:1 73
@@timg5tm941 it’s my understanding that a 140-43 with 16G magnet wire is ~80-85% efficient meaning a loss in this case. I’m not sure the gauge of the wire used here but thinner would be more resistive which in turn could introduce more loss. I’m not going to attempt to define “minimal”. As mentioned I’d prefer the EFHW and am simply pointing out that the EFHW will have more loss than the dipole simply because of the 49:1 👍
@@TheSmokinApe Yep, 80 to 85 % is typical efficiency for the EFHW transformer which equates to -1.0 dB to -0.7 dB which is only about 0.2 S units at the most. The other efficiency factor is proximity to the ground and ground conductivity and assuming the EFHW is located in the same location and configuration as the dipole, the only difference in performance should be the slight difference due to the EFHW transformer loss (assuming both are operating as a half wave antenna where their patterns will be the same). P.S. my home brew EFHW transformer has an efficiency of 90% (-0.46 dB) for use with my 100 watt transmitter so 90% efficiency is possible but it really does not buy a lot in regards to signal strength (mostly helps keep the transformer temperature under control). 73, Don
Jason, Nice job, Thanks for sharing your experiment with us. I like home brewing antennas and I enjoy these kind of tests.
73,
Noel W2MSA
Great video. IMO you cant go wrong with either antenna but the ease of deployment of the endfed wins me over. 73 de KF7VUT
Thanks!
Thank you for the super chat!!
A very interesting and useful comparison. Thanks for sharing.
There are field strength tests of dipoles versus EFHW on UA-cam. There’s absolutely no difference between the two. I think most of the difference is going to be in how you deploy them. If they are deployed, identically, you have identical results.
Nicely done. I tried a EFHW because I was impressed by the claimed advantages. But I discovered that my EFHW was very very noisy and that signals I could hear on my G5RV centerfed were swamped by noise on the EFHW. That is a consideration I don't see discussed in this video. You only did a comparison for transmit. How do they compare when receiving?
i can get 80m-6m minus 30m on my EFHW with my 5w radio and built in tuner. 134' ruffly 49:1 transformer. 1 antenna and all those bands . the 4:1 and 9:1 antennas just don't compare and having to mess with the antenna to change bands on a linked dipole is a no go.
what does the 110m vs 82 me before the db mean? time of receive?
Great video! Thanks! 73s,
Great video,new subscriber :)
A nifty test, Jason. Thank you. I've got two of your well-designed winders I hope to test in the field soon.
Now, while your testing antenna configuration may have been NVIS (i.e., low to the ground in terms of wavelengths), the _propagation_ would only be NVIS if your frequency was below the MUF (Maximum Usable Frequency), which, for 40m, is unlikely from the values I've seen this year. Most of my HF operating here in Northeastern Pennsylvania is on 80m making use of NVIS prop (with an EFHW sloper), so that band, even for field ops, is a requirement for me. 73 de AB3ZI
Pretty much my findings too. It all comes down to a choice of what to deploy given local opportunities. A telescoping pole does help, but an EFHW seems to call for a bit more line tossing & hauling. And since I can set up either and/or use a vertical wire up a pole with a tuner at the bottom (the IC705/AH705 system), keeping it simple gets kinda tossed out the window with the wire. ;-) Thanks for the informative video. Stay well! 73 de W8IJN
Both are half wave antennas. So, if put up in the sam e place in the same way, there will be no difference in the radiation patterns. I think you may legitimately compare ease of use between the two, but not efficiency. The primary difference would be the input impedances, not efficiency.
Thanks for the video!
I am fairly new to HF (one year) and was wondering where you bought each of these antennas and were they kits?
Thanks
Kevin KA0KAE
The EFHW is something he sells on his website, it's $40 for a really simple kit. Not sure about the linked dipole, I believe he made that. I would recommend his EFHW, or a Silver Bullet 1000 TIA kit. ~$160 this is something you don't have to build.
73 de W8IJC
I make mine. That's the very least a ham can do that's still quite hammish--make some of our gear!.
The dipole is from Packtenna and is a great antenna and ready to go out of the box. I have had great success with it. The EFHW is a kit and is usually available on my website (km4ack.com) but is currently out of stock. More are on the way.
@@KM4ACK Oh, I see. Thanks, I'm sure that's great for a lot of folks. I suppose some should simply buy each of the dipoles they need, as well as a half-wave, and then have the ability to run whichever suits the situation best. Circumstances and desires always vary, If a ham has both types then he/she can quickly determine which they prefer--and even to be military-grade prepared: get duplicates for backups and hard times.
Great comparison, Jason. How high up did you have the end point of the EFHW? I may have missed it, if you said.
The feed point was on the ground. The wire ran up the TN07 mast ~30' and then horizontal ~37'. Where I tied the wire to a tree it was probably 15-20' off the ground.
Thank you for this video and I can say no surprises on your results. What I wonder about is the other bands of the endfed and the loss there.
Good question! Maybe I can do more test in another video.
Very interesting, thanks. 73.
Great video… but I’d differ with your size & weight comparisons… yours being what I’d consider too heavy & robust. Adam (K6ARK) has EFHW kits (I have two, 20m & 40m) which are a fraction of the size & weight as those you demonstrated. I think you’ll find most SOTA operators, prefer the EFHW over the Linked Dipoles for it’s ease of deployment, performance, size & weight. But to each his own….
My personal operational experience in Portable Ops is I like simple. I use a 26ga speaker wire doublet, or the K6ARK EFHW (49:1 BNC Match), no Coax. The OCD nature of Hams building their respective kits, is all part of the fun! 72! de W7UDT Rand Boise (dit dit)
Agree. Adam offers a GREAT kit. I have one of his for 40M now but didn't when I shot this video. Thanks for the reminder :-)
Good vid. Would have liked to see the comparison results with the endfed as a vertical.
Jason, I really enjoyed this presentation and test. Nicely done! I’m sold on the EFHW for QRP field work. Signal reports and propagation being equal, it seems like the EFHW pulls ahead by virtue of easier deployment and more easily switching bands. Do you recommend your diy kit or something fully assembled for a newbie like myself?
The EFHW kit only requires wrapping the toroid and a few solder points. I think you would be fine with it. The Packtenna linked dipole is an outstanding antenna that's ready to go out of the box.
I have been trying forever to order one of your efhw antenna kits.
I just had another batch to sell out today. Should have more stock in 2 weeks. If you aren't already, get on the stock alert list - mailchi.mp/2e9aae5d07ee/efhw-kit
@@KM4ACK ok I added it to it. Wf4dt is one of my close friends and was wanting to get one for myself and also do a giveaway for one on my page that I just started up.
What antenna is best for a spot with high qrm.
How were the antennas mounted WRT direction, i.e. North-South, East-West? Which end of the EFHW was fed?
NE>SW. When the EFHW was in the inverted V it was fed from the SW
Tried to order one of your antennas, there was one left, had it in my cart.... and someone else sniped it! Congrats to the lucky sniper! Please let us know when there are more in stock!
Hey Guy, there are several in the store as I type this. Try again and you should be good :-)
@@KM4ACK Yup, I checked back the day after (Maybe it was two) but it showed it was available again, and ordered one.
Thank You! Also, would using a larger gauge magnet wire increase the max wattage? (I'm still studying for the General, and hope to pass it by the end of the month) :)
@@yugbe you would need a larger toroid and magnet wire to increase wattage rating.
Thank you for taking the time to test, the information and I certainly appreciate the education. Can you discuss the height of your antenna setup, especially the "L", counterpoise used - are you using a UNUN? When I hear QRP, you automatically move to t he top of my pileup.
KL1JP alaska.
It's a 49:1 transformer. No counterpoise. The inverted L has the feed point on the ground and the wire runs up the mast ~30 feet. The rest (~37') of wire is roughly horizontal to the ground.
What is a "JSA Comb heartbeat?" Thanks. I'd like to be able to test reception like that.
JS8Call is a digital mode application. The heartbeat is a type of transmission that JS8Call sends out. js8call.com/
Have you tried an antenna by N9SAB?
I haven’t
SSB voice with signal reports.
Super video and test. I have been wondering about this for a while. I personally use a homemade EFHW for SOTA and love it. I built a linked dipole, but, especially on summits where things are forested and tight, deploying was a huge pain vs tossing one wire in the tree. One question I had was what coax you used for the dipole? To me that is another challenge and weight consideration. If you use RG-174 it is light and portable, but a bit lossy even for HF at QRP levels since you have to use a decent amount up to the dipole. However, if you use 8X or similar, there is a significant weight and bulk. With the EFHW you only need a couple of feet between the radio and match so 174 is not a loss problem and the couple of feet weigh nearly nothing.
If you have the chance to do this again, I would be curious about how an end-fed random wire (non-resonant) would stack up. I have used one of those too, and it seemed to do pretty well but not as well as the EFJW. However, that is a feeling not backed by any data. Thanks again for the great video.
Hey Steve, it was indeed RG174 and you are right about the losses. I keep the length to a minimum (20') for this very reason. Now that you mention it, I may shorten that to 10' since I have chosen this antenna for the new QRP kit I have been working on.
Привет Джейсон!!! Ты молодец!!!
Thanks!
Nice job. A shame you didn't show us how you do the heart beat stuff, new to me. Maybe you have already gone and in-depth already? Keep up the good work
I have gone into it about a year ago. Another JS8 video is in the works. Stay tuned :-)
@@KM4ACK thanks.
What is the title so I can look it up or do you have the link handy?
Search Js8call basics on my channel.
How about a half shopper?
Wire in the woods can sometimes be such a tangled hot mess. No perfect solution.
That’s my jeep looks like it
Great lesson but I didn't catch the start point. Your location.
Middle Tennessee
Hi Jason. Thank you for another informative video. I heard you state a few times that you don't need a tuner for the EFHW, but i didn't catch the reason. Do you mind elaborating on that? Thanks again. 73.
It is resonant on 40M. The harmonics give you 10, 15, and 20 with less than 2:1 SWR.
I think I have not received my order yet
I'll contact you through Patreon with your order details.
Nice comparison. I run both and have often wondered, although my gut feeling has always been that I get better results with the linked dipole.
Grant VK4JAZ
Thank you Jason, I use your kit for most of my POTA activations. Here is a link to my most recent video showing your antenna and installation.
ua-cam.com/video/SNQj8c3zOh0/v-deo.html
👍👏👏