Engine did 50 miles it’s in Pieces. Guess what we found inside!
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- Опубліковано 28 вер 2024
- We strip this MGB engine and this is what we found. We check the rings and pistons and report what we find. Issac gives us an update on the Jeep engine and shows us some build process footage
My 1967 TR4A has a similar PCV system. It needs to be serviced and inspected during normal intervals. The issue is the client's PCV system. Many technicians overlook ancillary systems unless they know vintage vehicles. Be kind to your leg. Wishing you a Deluxe weekend.
Every mechanic here knows it is the pcv valve allowing oil and fuel vapour from the crankcase into the intake. Its burst wide open..
That's the problem people think. Oh, I've had my engine restored it's good to go they never check the auxiliary parts that bolt back on. You're 100% right to make it idle those carbs have been set rich as f**k. 👍
Yep , or it's one of those "for now" deals.
Put that alternator back on with the rumbling bearings, and that exhaust manifold with the cracked flange is fine for now.
Have fun hearing a lifter tick or any noise with a messed up exhaust.
That's one thing that I always laugh at and never do, is a fresh rebuild with open exhaust.
I wanna hear if it's got a rod knock 😃
Crikey, the guys are actually cleaning up their workspace! Nice work.!
You should have fixed the pcv and test driven it before you ever took the head off. Then if the customer wants the engine stripped its no quibble when nothing other than the pcv is found and they pay for the strip down.
this is going to turn out to be one Expensive pcv Valve for this guy
If Lee doesn't bottle it.
I'm kind of glad it's going to wind up being pretty expensive for someone else. The owner is a Richard Cranium but, the mechanics that were doing the job should have found this PCV problem in the first place so I'm suspecting they're going to be the ones paying the price, possibly for the initial rebuild too.
@@lorditsprobingtime6668 Richard Cranium 🤣🤣🤣🤣
@@colinscutt5104 YT are so clamped down on swearing that I've had to revert to ways we sneakily used back in the schoolyard many years ago. Of course you understood it so at least it does have the desired effect 😁.
@@lorditsprobingtime6668 I'm sorry but I think you will probably find they are not mechanics, most likely call themselves technicians. No computer will ever beat experience. We used to create faults that would confuse the OBD system but was so obvious if using common sense, probably not allowed to teach like that now, get accused as being a bully.
Absolutely right Lee, you'll happily honour a repair if the issue is found to be the workshops.
No workshop issue then there has to be a bill.
Might be worth adding that to your t's & c's.
Agreed to all except the adding it to any "t's & c's" since that's obvious. The wrong diagnosis seems to be the issue and that was the mechanics failure, not Lee or anyone in his workshop, it's becoming VERY obvious they did everything perfectly but the mechanic failed to even check that very messed up PCV.
@@lorditsprobingtime6668 This is why you take your car to a specialist when you have an issue. They will usually know the problem in seconds. Not all mechs know what they are dealing with in every case.
@@stewills9711 They SHOULD have diagnosed this one. All cars have plumbing and mechanisms for dealing with whatever gases manage to leak past the rings into the engine block, that's nothing new or complicated. Any mechanic that couldn't work this issue out on such a simple and uncomplicated old engine SHOULDN'T ever be calling himself a mechanic, nor charging mechanic rates.
I've worked in a lot of different fields but never as a mechanic but, even I would have checked and worked that one out. I have fixed PCV issues with cars I've had in the past. On older engines without ALL the crap added to newer ones, it's very basic and diagnosing issues like it when you've got a running engine in the vehicle it's pretty easy to work out THAT particular issue. Modern engines are basically the same internally but, they've become an absolute nightmare for anyone without very expensive diagnostic electronics, specialised tools etc to work on and near impossible to find where a problem is, unless it's external and physically and obviously actually broken.
I'm really impressed with Issac. He has a real gift for explaining things with clarity, especially for we home mechanics.
Had issues like this in the past and engine breathing systems as many have suggested have been the culprit. The best one was a on an old VW polo engine where the breather line entered the block there was an oil drain o the inner casting, which could be seen once the tin cover was removed was totally blocked with carbon. With the residual oil not able to go anywhere and building up in the tin chamber the engine was sucking it up and throwing out oil through the inlet side.managed to poke a welding rod into the drain hole and cleared the carbon . Good as new.
The reason he didn't just replace the valve first is because he was convinced its your fault (in his head) unlikely you get repeat business off of someone like that. More likely to bad mouth
Thanks Lee. I look forward to hearing about the customer arguing over costs 😬
Looks like you found the problem. Too bad the engine had to come apart (at the customer's insistance, however) I would check the valve stem seals carefully, just in case.
all so check the brake servo that there is no brake fluid in there as ive had that leaking master clyinder engine sucks that up the vacuum line and smokes' rubber gasket are by far the better ones the jag guy is 100% right,
Hope you get that customer sorted,all the best to yous and your loved ones
If that engine has only done 50 miles it looks like some oil additive must have been added to make the oil look like that in the sump
on PVC system a friend runs a feet feet of clear hose with stainless steel pot scrubber inside , it runs down to a T, which has a ft to Foot and a half hose to a cap coming off it for oils to store in. then a hose back to the intake, The stainless scrubber gives a place for the oils to condense on. and after a few months, you can drain it from the T section.. works great on a diesel. His diesel intake was clean after 200,000 miles.
Definitely. A proper catch can setup will keep things much cleaner and on higher HP builds they're a necessity TBH. Not to mention how complex/ expensive/ fragile a lot of OEM PCV setups are. Deleting all that crap for a catch can is a no-brainer almost always.
That MGB V8 engine has the original Buick oil system with the tortuous oil path into the oil pump. Many of the older Buick engines shared that design, the V6 was one. There is a kit to increase the capacity of the factory oil pump to aid lubrication.
Also in 1986 Buick went to the crankshaft driven oil pump installed in the timing cover. The only problem with that is they went to sequential fuel injection and distributorless ignition, so no provision for a distributor. I understand that Rover used a timing cover with the oil pump in it and had the distributor boss. Unless the customer is looking for a concours built engine, I would recommend changing up to the newer timing cover instead of the work to get the bolts out of the original. All the bits can be saved should he want the original down the road.
neverseize is used to prohibit aluminum galling is recommended in Aluminum Assemblies, grease all the studs and nuts for torquing
im engine fitter.. blacksmith with 12 TIG certs.. I can do all of cnc .. But this little man you have 10:38 .. thats a nice aprentice u got there
At least he had a Snap on tool box, congratulations.
I had an midget years ago with the same problem turned out to be a pin hole in the pcv valve diaphragm
I know it's not much to do with your MGB engine,, but in the past I've fitted loads of the Cords rings. It would take hundreds of miles before they stopped squawking, squeaking, and smoking. Then they were good for 12,000 miles. Enough for 2 or 3 years motoring for a local runabout.
The application of the gasket compound on the jeep block sump face looks a bit naff , especially on point of starting and stopping application. Might leak in future perhaps ?
Agreed sealant on the wrong side of bolt holes and I hope the torque specs call for oiled bolts
Ring gap placement. The one next to the one you picked up 1st and second ring gaps were lined up.
The customer is a;ways right!??? I had a similar situation where a brand new floor was laid by a specialist that subsequently failed, the customer blaming the floor layer, who because of the amount of business that was done throughout the country, the floor layer re-laid the floor only for it to fail again. Fortunately, an unannounced visit identified the problem that was down to the customer overloading the floor despite having specific instructions as to the limitations. The result was that the embarrassed customer had to stump up another £250k to have the floor laid again and to pay for the second floor laying! A different scale but the same principle.
All adds up to breather, oil smells of fuel. pretty obvious over rich mixture to compensate for manifold leak.
No no no no....I posted on that vid.Change or repair that pcv valve first and see what occurs.If a bit like vauxhall ecotech 16 valves blocking breathers.They smoked like me.Start with the obvious fault and work on from there.Why whip a head off and then the sump and drop the pistons.The bill will be huge for the bloke.?This just doesnt make sense .
Is there a way to measure the pressure in crankcase?
This one is a difficult one with the mg engine. There is a few ways to solve this. From the start before the engine was removed from the car there was two clear paths to walk down. At that point the professionals ie the mechanic and you should have sat the owner down and said look we have two ways of coming to the same conclusion. One will be relatively inexpensive the other has the potential of being very expensive. They first and the one the professionals needed to steer the owner to would be let's take care of the pcv to rule it out knowing it has already failed. Would have saved the owner tons of money and the pros a ton of time. . The second is what you all have done. Pulled the motor cost the owner money and you guys time . Granted it sounds like this was driven by the owner but it's up to barum and the mechanic to be professional and at the same time forward with the owner and save the money and time and do the correct thing
It seemed as if the owner had the motor back out in a blink as he was adamant it was an internal engine issue caused by the builders
Where's your workshop ? then I can keep well away
How come you couldn't replace the pcv and test ?
Lee, good thinking, get that oil tested for evidence. you're doing the right thing by offering to strip the engine and charge if necessary. imagine if you just told him to jog on in this era of social media bad mouthers
What was the sealant you guys used on the down pins on the rear main seal cap? I think it was a jeep? Thanks John.
Hi lee 😩vacuum advance 😢is it working ✍️
When the PCV valve isn't working, it also leaks oil. To fix oil leaks, make suer the PCV valve works then there's less pressure inside the engine than outside it.
The customer is always wrong. That's why they're a customer. Otherwise they'd do it themselves.
That's one big problem with only doing part of the job. Doing the whole job from start to finish makes things so much easier in terms of correctness and reliability with no finger pointing.
i like the brits they never no how to say words ... say it with me Ahh-Lum-in-um
it's a B-series engine.. they drip oil on the showroom floor.
2:48 so why?
Mate you stuck your hand in all that philth then touched those clean rings. Hope you washed them
News on getting the Vapor Blaster delivered?
Should be with us soon just a nightmare sorting a forklift!!
Appreciate your explanation re MGB engine. Glad you are charging him for work/parts, good customer though he is. You are running a business not a charity, there is no option. He should have found the pcv problem not you. Had he done so, you wouldnt be where you are.
Given the stubbornness of this customer, I think your next legal attack is brewing
Put a nut a little bigger then the stud over the stud and weld stud to nut take stud out with socet
Why is it so hard for British people to pronounce aluminum?
Don't bugger up your other knee by spending too long weight bearing on it.
You should have insisted; in writing, that the PCV valve be replaced and engine retested and carbs checked for correct setup to evaluate resolution at minimal expenditure of coin and time. Your ignorance of the underlying issue means you have helped walk the maladvised misdirected naive customer into unnecessary engine strip down. Doubtless if this issue presented again you would be adamant on renew the PCV and likely have checked the oil as well for that clue; though it does look like it also has a molybdenum based additive added. I therefore posit the customer should not be charged for your engine strip and you put it down to your valuable new insights gained. Action has been taken in haste without appropriate appraisal and evaluation using available resources; not least the net searches and respondents here on your site.To charge would be detrimental to your espoused integrity; you stand to gain stature and business by admitting your contribution to the saga (lack of knowledge). Waive the charge.
I think this is the correct way forwards to best rectify things and retain integrity.
Another customer who won't want to pay for your time and effort I bet you .
Yes exactly you are not running a charity
why don't you add a pcv valve when you do a complete engine re build
Why didn't the MECHANIC who sent it work that out. It was probably sent to Lee with parts like that already removed. That actually makes it even worse for that mechanic.
Sounds a bit gloopy and oily to me.
I like how you basically twisted the dudes arm into paying you for the teardown.
"We have to tear the engine down again to make sure, and if it's not we'll bill you."
"Wait, what? Nah, just button it up and I'll come get it."
"Nope. Head's off, pan's off. Too bad."
Yep ! Like I said on the previous video, that PCV should have been checked BEFORE they sent you the engine for a rebuild, even worse the second time. This is completely down to the garage that sent it to you. I worked on these B series and A series engines for over 10 years, so I really do know it’s not your fault.
I personally would have replaced the pcv valve 1st then got the carbs tuned properly. Then taken that pig out for a hard drive. That customer is a turkey....expensive pcv valve incoming 🤣
Hi Lee,
as I said in my last reply.
It's 100% the PCV valve.
I restored MG's Jaguar's and Austin Healey's for over 30 years. It's the first thing we checked if there's any sign of blue smoke.
Sad thing is, it may not of needed an engine rebuild in the first place.
You did the right thing in stripping down the engine again, just to double check.
I said the same thing mate, in the last video, it's 100% the PCV valve. It's sucking it's guts through the inlet manifold, I've seen it plenty of times on these over the years.
I agree
On the jeep engine if I am not mistaken the sump sealer has been applied around the outside of the bolt holes , this could result in some oil leakage from the inside of the unsealed bolt holes through the pan bolts.
I was just about to say the same thing.
@@-EC002- and me.
Me too.
@@rogerking7258 i spotted it straight away so I check if there was already a comment ...and there is
I wonder why the customer was adamant it wasn't the PCV?
a Half hour internet search would've come up with some pretty strong results
Is Paul trained in using the broom?🤣
I understand there are provisions in the labour "well-being-ness-of-technicians" guide which support therapy for those boys with "too-heavy broom" phobia.
@@jamesplotkin4674 The way he was wielding it I bet he was trained by Trigger!🤣🤣🤣
No bloody ppe on while brushing....shocking lol
To be fair, Paul did have the broom the right way round, and he wasn't looking for where to plug it in.
Not like last time. 🤣
You laugh, but most people suck at using a broom. One of my dad's pet peeves when he owned a collision repair shop. I guess I inherited it, it pains me to see people half-assed poking around with a push broom. Get a good side-swing action going and you can cover a lot of ground quickly while also not missing a bunch of dirt.
Ref smoking engine, even though the customer insisted it wasn’t the PCV valve it’s going to be a difficult conversation Monday, it will help if you get the oil tested, if badly contaminated it is evidence.
I must point out that Paul was not wearing any PPE whilst operating that broom. They are highly dangerous pieces of specialised equipment which can be very dangerous in untrained hands...... very surprised this serious misdemeanour was not rectified immediately by management........😉😊😜
Clearly on his first head needs more exsperience to get to Trigger standard.
He needs to have that brush adjusted. I do believe that some council depots use a made to measure service so that the brush is the correct height for leaning on.
@@m1cxf 😂😂
Wait until someone figures out that they think a broom needs a microchip implanted in the handle so it works better.
That is when the world passes the point of no return of intelligence.
Should also have a cone demarcated exclusion zone and then another row of cones to warn of the cone hazard!
I dontnknow what year your dealing with but I have a 1972 mgb. I bought the car in pieces and restored it. The only job I did not tackle was rebuilding the HIF 4 carburetors. After rebuilding the engine I had a smoke issue, oil consumption and rough idling. After 10,000 miles it never corrected itself and after 3 garages no one was able to determine what the cause was. I rebuilt the entire engine, everything new and checked. The engine was short blocked at a reputable engine shop. After assembling it, the engine did the same thing, same issues. After alot of time and quite by chance I found that the rear carb had not been assembled properly. When the "technician?" Assembled the throttle enrichment he did not align the alignment tab properly as was 90 degrees out. After assembling it properly the engine runs magnificent (for an mgb). The company that did the carbs charged $600 cad and I supplied the kit. They told me that that was impossible, couldn't happen and wouldn't refund anything.
(for an MGB) 😂👍
Lee, Customers that are taking on the task of restoring their engine need to understand the other associated systems that the engine depends on. If they don't that is not your problem and they probably should not be undertaking the work that they have.
Many, many people, including mechanics, do not understand the function and importance of the PCV system. If the PCV system is not functioning correctly (like this one)
It will burn oil, leak oil, and as the man that telephoned you said it will be next to impossible to tune the carbs. All the things that are going on.
It is another case of people not knowing what they don't know and putting NO effort in to educate themselves. Again thinking "this engineering shite is easy, anyone can do it".
Lean heavily on the pen when writing the invoice. All this work has been done completely unessessarily and could have been avoided by the customer replacing their shoddy ancillary equipment.
I wonder what his ignition, cooling and exhaust system are like?
They are probably knackered too.
Exactly.
That cork gasket looked old & obviously needed replacing.
Might have all sorts of stuff just hanging on in that engine bay.
Does Paul have the qualification to push a broom, have you done the risk assessment
No he's on trial apprenticeship as he hasn't got the correct pushing and pulling motion yet, he's getting there but like his school report 'Could do better'
Hopefully he's allowed a good lie down & big mug of tea in the dark afterwards? If not then you're a hard boss!
It would be better to get an industrial vacuum for the swarf and reduce the amount of dust, especially in a high tech. Fitting envoi’s me to
Lee take a look at Steve morris engines on U tube his latest machine is amazing.
His blow-up was mad, never seen so many busted con rods in 1 go
Steve Morris Engines makes Barum Engines look like that Pakistani machine shop with the dirt floors.
Definitely get that MGB's oil checked! Don't think it's going to be a surprise 😕
I don't really think that's needed but, sure, be thorough. Maybe especially with this stubborn know it all customer, just make sure he has to pay for all this wasted man hours. Actually, the mechanics that sent it are probably most responsible and will probably end up having to pay for all this. I see some messy legal fighting coming up, for the mechanic mostly.
Adamant or not I think you should of gone the route of ancillaries first then an engine strip - but only upon the customers authority. This could be one that bites you unless you have something in writing that states part of the diagnostic service may involve an engine strip down , and they’ve agreed to it. Personally, I’d be a little bit salty with having to pay for an engine rebuild I didn’t authorise as part of any diagnostic work. I agree you wanted to check your work and parts but if your confident in your work, this shouldn’t be necessary and if your in doubt then it’s at your expense. But again if you’d done the PCV valve at the get go you’d of been able to rule out one or the other and moved onto your work if necessary - at that point it would of been engine issues and potentially your area worked on, and the customer would not be charged in this instance. Again it’s the new way of doing business everything in writing and agreed to because there’s always someone who is savvy and prepared to milk an oversight.
How many new heads and handles has Pauls broom had over the years? all the youngsters on here, would not have a clue on what im talking about, lol
17 new heads and 14 new handles its probably had !
@@madeljacky and a picture
One of the things pretty much most Rover V8 engine owners do is not once a year do the Barr's Radseal because inside the alloy engines there could be fine cracks and gullies that allow oil to pass either way or water and lead to pig running. The other thing they don't do is use the right antifreeze, alloy engines need a specific antifreeze as normal cast iron stuff will cause long term problems as it eats away at the soft alloy. One of the things I have done on my all alloy Reliant engine once a year is get the Barrs out, add a shot to the coolant and its good for another year. Cadillac actually put this into its owners handbooks about doing this with the Northstar engines is it as they were awful if you didn't so if you got an all alloy classic or vintage motor... get some Barrs into the coolant. Some modern engines you don't need to worry about it as I believe they coat the internals with a kind of varnish to seal everything but it is worth checking if it does need to be done or not.
It baffles me that somebody didn't repair that Valve
before you pulled the motor
Isiac seems be coming along well and have good attention to detail. One thing I see as he's about to install the sump to the jeep engine is the sealant bead is on the outside of the bolt holes. That's no problem if the holes are blind, but if not, it's an almost guaranteed oil leak as the oil makes its way between the bolt and threads. Oil will then slowly drip from the bolt heads only when running. Good practice is to always have the sealant inside the holes. I'm not trying to be critical, just trying to save you some grief from a leak and pass on some knowledge that was passed to me when I was about his age.
For A PCV valve to work it has to have a air source normally a pipe/hose from the air cleaner to the rocker box is this connection blocked or is it missing due to an after market shiney rocker box being fitted. Two things point to this failing, the way the diaphram looked and the oil leak. Instead of drawing vapor past the baffle of the tappet box cover it would be drawing oil creating a nice puddle of the stuff in the area of the leak.
PCV Valve 100%
Pulling the inlet manifold off should have shown the inlet tracks in the manifold and head, to be wet with oil.
I realize I'm a farmer in the "colonies" but why spend good money on obviously quality machine work and bits and skimp on externals and lame assembly and tuning. Then blame the machine work first.
If you have a basic engine rebuild and you are attaching all the accessories and you subsequently have a problem as described the first thing you do is check your own work and the condition of the parts you attached. The first thing you check if the engine is smoking is the condition of the PCV valve for damage and correct operation and correct any faults found before moving on.
Why don't you hoover?
They haven't got them yet down in the west country
Bin that music off from the sped up rebuild. It’s damn annoying, ask Ricky @reperformance what people think of it. 😂
Paul finally got his broom loicence
But can he drive a teaspoon…?
All for the sake of a few quid for a new PCV valve???
Great video 👍 Got too hope the mgb problem will teach you to ask more questions when building older type engines.
He's not the mechanic. He was sent the engine with instructions on what needed machining work, he did what was asked by the mechanics who sent it to him and THEY'RE the ones who should have worked this out.
It probably never should have been sent there to have any work done if they'd simply diagnosed, inspected then replaced that comparatively extremely cheap part. THEY should have found this problem, Lees job is to bore, grind, surface or whatever when it's sent with instructions about what needs doing, especially when sent by mechanics who's job it is to diagnose these things. The mechanics should have asked questions then diagnosed any simple issues, you know, simple things any half decent mechanic would pick up on quickly like a FAULTY PCV. It's not a difficult diagnosis or even hard to inspect it, they failed their customer BADLY.
Your warranty covers engine not the faulty PCV valve causing the issue Why would the garage not tell the owner this external part is a serviceable item same as Oil filter or air filter Would they fit a broken air filter ? .Get Stuart to do a carb check on MGB see how many turns the fuel jet is turned out from the baseline and if the Carb/Carbs have been rebuilt Customer buys short engine rebuild expects full engine rebuild
Guarantee this bloke doesn't want to pay the bill "because he asked for it back after the head came off, but you kept tearing it down"
I can see that coming.
I learnt pretty early in my driving days that a properly functioning PCV system is important, even on thrashed engines.
Customer is always right, eh? 😂😂😂😂
I would insist that any damaged, broken or iffy external parts are replaced before you start taking it apart
Is the any utility in dressing smoother the fresh hone pattern on the lower portion of the bore the rings do not wear down when bedding? The intention would be to perhaps cause less initial wear on modern piston skirts? - Toyota 2NZFE being rebuilt after sludge death.
Lee. Here in British Northern Ireland we have to attend a Court in Scotland. Sold a laptop, BROKEN, advertised as BROKEN, SPARES OR REPAIRS. The buyer is taking us to Court, in Scotland. He received it and it worked. We will win, travel costs, we lose.
Pcv will do that 100% as you rightly no, I don’t understand why customers doubt you. Your the expert he’s not. Why you build an engine then customer puts old bits on, what’s a valve worth, I’m talking about the customer not you guys . Still make good viewing. Good to see issac growing ,excellent asset to the business… ok Paul to 🇦🇺
I heard several guys telling my crew chief what to do with his engine in his 68 Chevelle. Waiting until they stopped I asked what the symptoms were. It's smoking! I said it needs an overhaul. It just had one.I said PVC valve. Monday he said you were right! Another guy said you owe him lunch he saved you an engine. He bought me lunch.
If that car had come back to me, i would have first driven it with the PCV removed. Those oil rings don't look much bigger than the pistons, but that might be the video. Good thinking, the guy that asked about the compression and leak-down checks. 60 years, and never built a smoker !
I can beat 50 miles.
We rebuilt a 454 and put it in a 63 chevy c10 for the moron next door. Told him he was gonna have to take it easy and break in the engine. He pulled out of our driveway, 1/8th mile to the main highway, and then decided to see how big of a smoke show it would make. He got about another 100 yards before the engine blew apart.
Weld washers and then nuts on and then extract the bolt no drilling required.
I don't know anything about MGB but im 99% sure that's a aluminum Buick 330 I have it's bigger high compression cast iron brother in one of my Buick skylarks their one of the best GM motors ever made.
Re jeep engine don’t grind the bearings there are shims behind the gear and thrust washer ! Also don’t use those rubber bungs for want of a better word in the rear cap they will leak ! Use rtv .
Lol moe drama! If anything this channel will teach how not to build engines. How is this guy still in buisness?
That JEEP sump is going to leak like a bastard, seal the oil side of the pan bolts, or all around the pan bolts.
Sounds like a know-it-all narcissist....The best customers.
Good video but, get that sealant right ! Should be engine side of the bolt holes.
Wow, I’m an electrician, and even I know what the PCV does
50 miles isn't equal to 30k miles. Clickbait.