Aluminium nipples are generally a bad idea IMHO. Yes, they are lighter than brass, but the oxidation was always their weak spot. Not only a sealant can cause that. So if you want to have a wheel that will last - just choose brass nipples.
I've been into mountain biking for over a year now, and at home bike maintenance and upgrading for over 4 years. I've never heard of this problem until now. Thank for the helpful information, and shame on those in the comments disrespecting you! 🙄
That's actually a well known problem with Stans. Also, aluminum nipples break over time on their own. They don't need Stans to make them fragile or brittle. They'll break from fatigue on their own.
Truckerco sealant was the first sealant I ever bought, happened to find it searching and like you noticed it was the best deal going. Have used it on a couple bikes and ended up buying my second liter. Good to know it has worked well for others as well.
I had the same experience with STAN. It actually develop corrosion within a few months. Crazy that there is no more awareness of this. Unfortunately it actually corroded the alu rim around the valve (where the tubeless valve is lodged), to the point it was not airtight anymore. I managed to fix the rim by rebuilding the valve area with 2-parts epoxy 'metal' (JB Weld).
I got the same wheels like yours. The bontrager XXX, what a great wheels. I used muc off for about 2 years now but I'm switching to another Sealant because the muc off becomes basically like glue ones it dries out and it's pain in the ass to clean it.
I corroded Dura Ace aluminum tubeless road rims using Stan’s. The rims were not anodized. The anodized versions that I retired because the braking track was worn out did not corrode.
The stan's race sealant has the same issue. If your rim tape fails with stan's in the tire and you have aluminum nipples it's probably a good idea to replace all the nipples as there's unfortunately no way of actually removing the stans from around the nipples so you might as well get ahead of things before they become a problem mid ride.
Yeah seen this before the alloy starts to flake off the inner rim aswell aswell! Slime were bad for it till they made there no ammonia slime I use muc off now that bottle is an absolute nightmare with the tube hose to fill through valve!
Best tubeless tape I've used is effetto mariposa. Stan's, muck off, DT I rate lower. Stan's is the worst haha. There is so many out there. And I haven't tried them all. But after I tried effetto I haven't looked back. Used it many times now for my own wheel builds and friends
They mostly have all ammonia or ethylene glycol to prevent the latex to clog , Orange doesn't have ammonia or ethylene and isn't petroleum based but it last about 30 days, 40 if you're lucky and put a lot. Cream 2 is natural latex and has very low ammonia content it's what I use for all my wheels except the DH bike where I run automotive slime
I haven't had that problem it's still good when I switch to my winter tires. I am using the the endurance version. Do you live some where it's hot? maybe that's a factor. I'm not saying that there aren't brands that just as good or better just wondering what is different that's making it not last as long for you?
The PSA shojuld be: If you are using steel spokes then NEVER build or buy a mountain bike wheel with aluminum nipples. Steel and aluminum being dissimilar metals will naturally corrode when placed in contact with each other. It's called galvanic corrosion. Normally this reaction is very slow unless a conductive electrolyte is introduced. In practice this conductive electrolyte is water, that is, the kind of water that the wheel encounters on rain rides, muddy rides, splashing through puddles, rides through streams and creeks, even environments that are extremely humid. Mountain bikes and possibly gravel bikes are way more likely to be heavily exposed to moisture than road bikes. The moisture gets into the inner structure of the rim and once in does not readily get back out. The environment inside the inner rim becomes saturated with an electrolytic atmosphere. The corrosion between the steel spoke and the aluminum nipple begins where the steel is exposed to the aluminum, as seen in this video. Even my cheapest Forte mountain wheels have always had brass nipples. My expensive Specialized "adventure" bike, with tubed wheels, was built with cheap aluminum nipples. As I ride through rain, mud, puddles, etc, in Northern Cal, the aluminum nipples on the back wheel, where the force is greatest, corrode and give way. They have all been replaced with brass. Never buy a mountain or gravel wheel with aluminum nipples.
Yet I have 40 year old wheels with stainless spokes and aluminum alloy nipples. That said, avoid them with tubeless. Not worth the hassle. And when I'm building wheels for customers, I'll obviously avoid aluminum nipples today.
It’s not as simple as all aluminum nipples will corrode. Anodized aluminum is resistant to corrosion. Stainless steel is also resistant to corrosion. Brass can corrode. When I was a construction insurance adjuster, we saw many failures with brass plumbing fittings and copper tubing that was made from inferior alloys. Too much zinc which is cheaper than copper. The zinc would dissolve in copper tubing leading to failures. Environmentally assisted cracking in brass fittings is also a problem. Agin from poor alloys where manufacturers substitute zinc for copper. I worked in bike shops in the 80s. Cheap wheels and some old wheels suffered from seized and corroded nipples all the time. The problem comes from low quality materials in combination with corrosive environments. In the days of rim brakes this was less of a problem because the rims wore out from braking pretty quick. Disc brakes allow rims to last far longer and corrosion of the components can become a problem. Build with good quality nipples and spokes and your wheels will last longer. A good tape job will minimize exposure to sealants. Plus for those that think it’s just the stainless steel spoke in contact with anodized aluminum, consider that the other end of the spoke is in contact with an aluminum hub flange. It’s more than dust the two metals. Hubs are not really exposed to sealants though unless one is really sloppy and there is no rim cavity to hold sealants in contact with nipples. Once agin use good components, do a good tape job and avoid potentially corrosive sealants.
I' have Mavic Crossmax' in natural and anodized and both are rotted completely at the valve hole all set up without any rim tape. Many other tubeless ready rims with tape in use but haven't really checked under the tape.(if it ain't broke, don't fix it!). I'm low on Stans at the moment, will probably try something else. Did contact Stans about the Crossmax' several year ago, no response and their literature claim no corrosive ammonia used even though the odor is obvious.
Yup, unfortunately Stan's was pretty much the only thing you could find at bike shops until the past few years - hopefully people have mostly switched onto better sealants by now!
The ammonia is indeed bad but another problem is the galvanic corrosion when you have carbon rims with with aluminum nipples. If you have carbon rims and aluminum nipples they will eat away. Btw its not just Stans that uses ammonia.
Yup - good point. Others use ammonia as well, but I think Stan's might have a higher amount of it? Either way, there are plenty of good options nowadays without ammonia.
Aluminum nipples are a no-go. They are lighter and make wheel-building easier, but they will corrode and become brittle with age, regardless of sealant. Brass will last. Unless it's a racing wheelset that will get a rebuild anyway, there's no reason in saving that weight with alu nipples.
IF there was no sealant under the tape, it wasnt the sealant. Aluminium nipples sometimes are made of weak alu. They corode because many factors like road salt (in winter) etc. I had this case. Few nipples broke one after another. The wheels weren't tubeless.
You're a few years late. Orange Seal also contains Ammonia and destroys aluminum wheels. I've had a wheel with completely eaten up aluminum valve. The new Peaty's Biofiber does not contain Ammonia. Rims are anodized, but not inside the cavity. Once sealant gets inside, you're done.
Proper anodizing protects the aluminum. Evidence just by the other replies on this subject indicate lots of aluminum nipples corrode, sealant or not. I’ve seen a few natural aluminum color nipples on supposedly quality wheels with corrosion of the spoke nipples.
Aluminium nipples are generally a bad idea IMHO. Yes, they are lighter than brass, but the oxidation was always their weak spot. Not only a sealant can cause that. So if you want to have a wheel that will last - just choose brass nipples.
a no brainer.
Great info! I agree! Tubeless systems need alot of attention and maintenance. Nobody really talks about the issues. Thanks for the video!🍻
Yup - not maintenance free at all! I love tubeless, but I think a lot of people neglect the maintenance on it.
A lot of attention and maintenance? Besides topping off sealant occasionally between tire changes there is zero attention required…
@@HUKIT. till you get sealant adhering to your sidewalls or failed rim tape its pretty low maintenance
My old wheels have failing alu nipples and they have never been around any sealant
I've been into mountain biking for over a year now, and at home bike maintenance and upgrading for over 4 years. I've never heard of this problem until now. Thank for the helpful information, and shame on those in the comments disrespecting you! 🙄
That's actually a well known problem with Stans.
Also, aluminum nipples break over time on their own. They don't need Stans to make them fragile or brittle. They'll break from fatigue on their own.
Aluminium plus Carbon is a reactive combination. !
Truckerco sealant was the first sealant I ever bought, happened to find it searching and like you noticed it was the best deal going. Have used it on a couple bikes and ended up buying my second liter. Good to know it has worked well for others as well.
Yup, it's been my go-to!
I had the same experience with STAN. It actually develop corrosion within a few months. Crazy that there is no more awareness of this. Unfortunately it actually corroded the alu rim around the valve (where the tubeless valve is lodged), to the point it was not airtight anymore. I managed to fix the rim by rebuilding the valve area with 2-parts epoxy 'metal' (JB Weld).
I got the same wheels like yours. The bontrager XXX, what a great wheels. I used muc off for about 2 years now but I'm switching to another Sealant because the muc off becomes basically like glue ones it dries out and it's pain in the ass to clean it.
Are we not supposed to retire aluminum wheels after 3-5 years due to rim fatigue? I do also because getting freehub service kits can be a pain...
Learned something new! Thanks
Glad it was helpful!
I corroded Dura Ace aluminum tubeless road rims using Stan’s. The rims were not anodized. The anodized versions that I retired because the braking track was worn out did not corrode.
Yup, seems like a few people have had this issue.
The stan's race sealant has the same issue. If your rim tape fails with stan's in the tire and you have aluminum nipples it's probably a good idea to replace all the nipples as there's unfortunately no way of actually removing the stans from around the nipples so you might as well get ahead of things before they become a problem mid ride.
Yeah seen this before the alloy starts to flake off the inner rim aswell aswell! Slime were bad for it till they made there no ammonia slime I use muc off now that bottle is an absolute nightmare with the tube hose to fill through valve!
I have nothing to add except to say if you are in need of new rim tape, try the Tesa brand
Haven't tried that one - why do you like it?
I usually use Stan's or DT Swiss
Best tubeless tape I've used is effetto mariposa.
Stan's, muck off, DT I rate lower. Stan's is the worst haha.
There is so many out there. And I haven't tried them all. But after I tried effetto I haven't looked back. Used it many times now for my own wheel builds and friends
They mostly have all ammonia or ethylene glycol to prevent the latex to clog , Orange doesn't have ammonia or ethylene and isn't petroleum based but it last about 30 days, 40 if you're lucky and put a lot.
Cream 2 is natural latex and has very low ammonia content it's what I use for all my wheels except the DH bike where I run automotive slime
Thanks for the info! I've had great luck with Cream 2 as well.
Orange Seal does contain Amonia.
@@sandykavor8434 Where did you find the listing that told you it had ammonia in it?
I haven't had that problem it's still good when I switch to my winter tires. I am using the the endurance version. Do you live some where it's hot? maybe that's a factor. I'm not saying that there aren't brands that just as good or better just wondering what is different that's making it not last as long for you?
Does it contact the nipples due to getting under a bad rim tape job, or is it getting there by spilling during injection in the valve stem?
I'd imagine both are potential causes - more likely due to a bad rim tape job.
The PSA shojuld be: If you are using steel spokes then NEVER build or buy a mountain bike wheel with aluminum nipples. Steel and aluminum being dissimilar metals will naturally corrode when placed in contact with each other. It's called galvanic corrosion. Normally this reaction is very slow unless a conductive electrolyte is introduced. In practice this conductive electrolyte is water, that is, the kind of water that the wheel encounters on rain rides, muddy rides, splashing through puddles, rides through streams and creeks, even environments that are extremely humid. Mountain bikes and possibly gravel bikes are way more likely to be heavily exposed to moisture than road bikes. The moisture gets into the inner structure of the rim and once in does not readily get back out. The environment inside the inner rim becomes saturated with an electrolytic atmosphere. The corrosion between the steel spoke and the aluminum nipple begins where the steel is exposed to the aluminum, as seen in this video. Even my cheapest Forte mountain wheels have always had brass nipples. My expensive Specialized "adventure" bike, with tubed wheels, was built with cheap aluminum nipples. As I ride through rain, mud, puddles, etc, in Northern Cal, the aluminum nipples on the back wheel, where the force is greatest, corrode and give way. They have all been replaced with brass. Never buy a mountain or gravel wheel with aluminum nipples.
Yet I have 40 year old wheels with stainless spokes and aluminum alloy nipples.
That said, avoid them with tubeless. Not worth the hassle.
And when I'm building wheels for customers, I'll obviously avoid aluminum nipples today.
It’s not as simple as all aluminum nipples will corrode. Anodized aluminum is resistant to corrosion. Stainless steel is also resistant to corrosion. Brass can corrode. When I was a construction insurance adjuster, we saw many failures with brass plumbing fittings and copper tubing that was made from inferior alloys. Too much zinc which is cheaper than copper. The zinc would dissolve in copper tubing leading to failures. Environmentally assisted cracking in brass fittings is also a problem. Agin from poor alloys where manufacturers substitute zinc for copper. I worked in bike shops in the 80s. Cheap wheels and some old wheels suffered from seized and corroded nipples all the time. The problem comes from low quality materials in combination with corrosive environments. In the days of rim brakes this was less of a problem because the rims wore out from braking pretty quick. Disc brakes allow rims to last far longer and corrosion of the components can become a problem. Build with good quality nipples and spokes and your wheels will last longer. A good tape job will minimize exposure to sealants.
Plus for those that think it’s just the stainless steel spoke in contact with anodized aluminum, consider that the other end of the spoke is in contact with an aluminum hub flange. It’s more than dust the two metals. Hubs are not really exposed to sealants though unless one is really sloppy and there is no rim cavity to hold sealants in contact with nipples. Once agin use good components, do a good tape job and avoid potentially corrosive sealants.
I' have Mavic Crossmax' in natural and anodized and both are rotted completely at the valve hole all set up without any rim tape. Many other tubeless ready rims with tape in use but haven't really checked under the tape.(if it ain't broke, don't fix it!). I'm low on Stans at the moment, will probably try something else. Did contact Stans about the Crossmax' several year ago, no response and their literature claim no corrosive ammonia used even though the odor is obvious.
never use sealant that contains ammonia. vittoria says that when they are promoting their air-liner tyre insert.
Yup, unfortunately Stan's was pretty much the only thing you could find at bike shops until the past few years - hopefully people have mostly switched onto better sealants by now!
Ever wonder why nuts and bolts used torsionally aren't aluminum?
Tubes all day long, they work when well with a dose of "flat attack" sealant.
The ammonia is indeed bad but another problem is the galvanic corrosion when you have carbon rims with with aluminum nipples. If you have carbon rims and aluminum nipples they will eat away. Btw its not just Stans that uses ammonia.
Yup - good point. Others use ammonia as well, but I think Stan's might have a higher amount of it? Either way, there are plenty of good options nowadays without ammonia.
Aluminum nipples are a no-go. They are lighter and make wheel-building easier, but they will corrode and become brittle with age, regardless of sealant. Brass will last. Unless it's a racing wheelset that will get a rebuild anyway, there's no reason in saving that weight with alu nipples.
Brass is also sensitive to cracking from ammonium exposure. Interesting engineering history if you look it up.
IF there was no sealant under the tape, it wasnt the sealant. Aluminium nipples sometimes are made of weak alu. They corode because many factors like road salt (in winter) etc. I had this case. Few nipples broke one after another. The wheels weren't tubeless.
Umunhum, eh?
Been to the top?
Grew up watching the radar tower turn.
Orange seal, good tape job, and brass nipples and your tubeless wheels will last a lifetime
You're a few years late. Orange Seal also contains Ammonia and destroys aluminum wheels. I've had a wheel with completely eaten up aluminum valve. The new Peaty's Biofiber does not contain Ammonia. Rims are anodized, but not inside the cavity. Once sealant gets inside, you're done.
My nipples are fine AF!
There's something about a backwards ball cap that screams incompetence. Bettng his problem has nothing to do with Stans.
I'm sure you have multiple PhDs based on this truly intelligent comment you took the time to write out.
This is nonsense ,alloy nipples are garbage for any wheel ,on mtb they are worse because of the conditions you ride in .
Brass is definitely better, but most high end wheels today come with aluminum nipples.
News Flash: All aluminum nipples are anodized.
Not all! Most are.
All, except some very cheap Chinese nips. Which means that all aluminum nips that we use are ano nips.
Proper anodizing protects the aluminum. Evidence just by the other replies on this subject indicate lots of aluminum nipples corrode, sealant or not. I’ve seen a few natural aluminum color nipples on supposedly quality wheels with corrosion of the spoke nipples.