@@IDentification77i’d say that the US has a more extensive freight system, but not the best. Speeds on lower on those locomotives, not electrified, polluting, the horns are noisy at night, the railways that’re owned by those freight companies are in poor condition and the fact that they’re not government owned creates problems for passenger rail, in most of europe they’re shared and the freight runs at night when most intercity rail has a low service frequency.
Charlottesville to Richmond? I would like to see that. I just wish they didn’t have to “obtain” trackage rights. If you ask me, they ought to be able to use any track of the original participating freight roads if they so desire; that seems like one of the initial founding principles.
They are running the “commonwealth regional” from Newport News to Lynchburg. It will have stops in Richmond, Ashland, Doswell, possibly Beaverdam, possibly Mineral, possibly Louisa, Gordonsville, Charlottesville, Roanoke, and Lynchburg.
@@winstonsolipsist1741 It ought to be passenger trains, due to their expected higher speeds and the nature of them carrying paying passengers, but with how long freight trains are these days, how irregularly they run, and how insufficiently long passing sidings are, freight railroads are unable to give passenger trains the priority they agreed to give, and I doubt any of the companies want to, either.
@@htown148 Let's be completely frank here. Without Amtrak there wouldn't be any passenger rail in the US outside of NY, Chicago, and maybe Boston (only because those 3 cities had their transit built up before cars were common). That Amtrak managed to survive airline deregulation and 4 Republican presidents who wanted to kill it off is nothing short of a miracle. The reason why we're seeing the expansion we are now is because one of Amtrak's biggest proponents basically ever is currently President.
Such a drag that they make the smart decision to go with an experienced manufacturer from a nation with a lot of high speed rail experience and then get screwed by Alstom anyway.
This is what consolidation gets you. IMHO they should've strongly considered HST designs from Kawasaki, they build most of the Shinkansen for Japan. Kawasaki already has a US presence as they build commuter trains and subway trains for MTA in NY. Hyundai-Rotem is another consideration, they build HSTs for Korail in South Korea and already have a big US presence and build commuter trains, trams and passenger cars for US commuter railroads.
No one was screwd. With all the understood frustration such a complicated project can have problems and delays no mater who builds it, especially when you choose a new and under development product that has to be modified due to specific US needs. Even in the video a failior of two experienced japanese manufacturers happend that led to the order of the Siemens Venture cars. Alstom itself has delayes on the French version of the same base model. Spain's national rail operator is still waiting for the new high speed trains they ordered from Talgo (Talgo Avril) that were supose to be delivered in 2021 and were delayed a few time, last one was supose to be in november and now it's "the first quarter of 2024". Even the current favorite Stadler has large delayes of the Liverpool Merseyrail's trains whwn only a handful were delivered and they suffer from problems that causes delays. Amtrak can sue Alstom, depending on the terms of the contract, but maybe they prefer to solve this amicably. In the mentioed Talgo delay Renfe demanded compensations witha threat to sue but they also prefer to solve this without going to court.
@@THEFINALHAZARDindeed, the new Acela is a stock TGV with some options, as opposed to the customized version for the original ‘’American Flyer’ project.
@@mrvwbug4423 In Philadelphia Kawasaki built the Broad Street Line trains and they are in much better shape than the El trains which are 10-15 years younger. Hyundai made the new Regional Rail trains which were kind of a disaster, so I could see amtrak being gun-shy about them
I live in Olean, NY. That's the town that's holding 2 of the Acela sets in the WNY&PRR freight yards. That's ex-Erie, ex-Pennsylvania and ex-Conrail territory. While I enjoy seeing the sets in the freight yards behind the Home Depot, I do wish they were working along the corridor. Even better: I wish we had these sets zipping through Olean on their way to Chicago, like the old Erie Limited used to.
amtrak is so nice when you look at it for what it is, i took the starlight from LA to San Jose and it was nice to just sit and get some amazing views while relaxing
As of this fall, an Inpector General report confirmed Amtrak has NOT received _any_ Avelia Liberties. Alstom has stored them on Amtrak property and is having probems with certification with FRA. The major one is that Alstom cannot provide computer modeling of the active banking system for each portion of track on the Corridor something which FRA said was a hard requirement before certification. BTW, Avelia Liberty is a hybrid: locomotive from the Avelia Horizon (aka TGV--M) but the coaches are Pendolinos. (and the lower speed model of Pendolino since high speed ones don't have banking). This is why the shape of loco does not match the shape of the coaches. It is somewhat ironic that in 2018, the FRA relented and realized its own rules prevented modern trains and changed it policy to allow importing modern trains, but the "made in America" rules prevent the importation of tested, working trains that can be put in service and instead the desiging of custom trains with USA components requiring full testing/certification regiment since totrally different from original model. The Viaggios were already heavy steel trains built for cheap in Europe to run on slow lines (only up to 230kmh) and Siemens then had to build a new version of it to meet "made in USA" and FRA rules (since designed in USA prior to 2018, still had the rules that requires everything to be slow and heavy). Siemens has newer Viaggios made of aluminium now but these would cost too much to convert to meet FRA stadards, so Siemens USA continue st offer the old heavy "Venture" cars. Also note that not only does "made in America" require new untested "made im USA" components, but every order of Charger locos from Amtrak as well as Viaggios has has different configurations and thus model numbers. (you noted this for locos, but this means Amtrak will have many incompatible locos that look the same but are different inside and have different perforance.). The long distance ones not only have different horsepower, but also more powerful HEP generators to power the longer trains with power-hungry Superliners. Siemens has sold enough of those Venture cars/Charger locos to more than pay for the deisgn of a "made in America" train. But it isn.t about to import and redesign ist newer rolling stock so USA (and Canada) are stuck with whatever Siemens has right now. (and Siemens has a lot of pressure to fix all the bugs in cars and locos). Cars are also different models for each order. Some are AAR coupler at each end. Some are sets of 2 cars with permanent coupling and AAR at end of the 2 car duo, and some are permanent couplings for the whole train, some allow the lococmotive to be changed. And some have AAR coupler at the CaB end so train can be towed by other loco. There are differenr door designs as well. VIA for instance is blocking doors on one end of cars, while other orders have finctioning doors are both ends. The stairs to access low level platforms are different, and of course Brightline has no stairs as all their stations have high level plaforms and instead, they have platform gap fillers that extend out from under door as door opens. So when each order requires customization, it also means lots of testing and teething problems. Now, only to Amtrak cannibalizing Acella steel trains. VIA has done the same iwth its core LRC cards (as well as trabscontiental equipennt which it no longer has enough to run daily trains). Both Amtrak and VIA thought they would be getting the replacemet trains on time and stopped orderig new spare parts for the old trains, but when the new trains turned out to be late, they were stuck with no spare parts and manufacturers no longer making them available. (For Amtrak part of issue was lack of communications internally between the gusy working on new train project and the guys taking care of old steel Acellas). The new Acellas have fancy tilting system: in the past, active tilting had a probem of delay between entering curve and cars reaching the proper tilting level to cancel the curve and this makes people sick. These new Acellas will use GPS and on-board route database to preduce when they are about to enter a curve and start to bank before the lateral G force is felt so it can be cancelled. (this is one reason FRA is wanting all i dotted on this because brand new and not used before).
I really don’t get the Made in the USA requirement. It only creates problems with big products like trains, sure it’s great for smaller products and components, but totally banning the importation of well made European products is crazy, Instead they should encourage companies to start investing in the US and build they factory there too so that there’s a slow and steady transition to turn back the knob on globalization.
I think Amtrak’s biggest issue, like most passenger rail across North America (both US and Canada) happens to be the freight companies getting in the way.
It's because fhe freight owns the rails. They get priority and when amtrak misses its alloted windows (which happens all the time because amtrak is hopelessly unreliable) they have to sit and wait until freight allows them use. This is one of the main reasons high speed rail doesn't have a chance in the US, it would be far too costly for amtrak to build its own dedicated continental network.
@@lalakerspro "Freight is extremely important for the economy," == Not for the economy, for the owner of airliners. For the economy, anything works good.
@@lalakerspro "Freight is extremely important for the economy,.." == For the economy , no For the airliner's owners and investors, yes. For the environmental impact, there's no comparison.
@@allgoo196 freight trains are used to transport important goods across the US. They are absolutely needed. Europe still uses trucks like the 18th century
I'm so glad to hear that the Cardinal line (from NY to Chicago and along the Ohio River where I live) is going back to daily service for the first time in 40 years.
What an exciting video. Issues with Alstom's trains notwithstanding, I'm looking forward to the new look and feel of Amtrak, especially on the NEC where I live. Hopefully the infrastructure will be improved at a fast rate. Portal Bridge is already under construction so that's a huge deal within itself.
That’s interesting how we haven’t gotten answers to those questions yet. My guess is that the silver meteor could get Horizons and the superliner replacement will be somewhat identical cars at least that’s what I’m hoping for
Amtrak and Via both announced earlier this year (possibly late last year) that they were looking for bids for Superliner/Budd Car replacements with the potential for a hefty joint order if I recall correctly. We'll have to wait to see how that pans out
Siemens already has sleeper cars that could work to replace both the Viewliners and Superliners. Look at the new NightJet cars in Austria, those are made by Siemens and are very similar in design to the Venture and Airo cars.
I’ve adopted an “I’ll believe it when I see it” attitude towards everything Amtrak-related. They can promise all they want, we’ll just have to wait and see.
I live in Arizona and we've been hearing about the Tucson to Phoenix line for over 20 years. Countless studies have occurred and guess what? We're getting another study.
I'm really excited for the Airo trainsets, because they look really great and they're an awesome next step for Amtrak, but I'm almost a little bummed to see the ACS-64s go. I know that they'll be something like 15+ years old by the time Airo is fully implemented, but I can't help but feel like they still have a lot of life left in them. The AEM-7s lasted Amtrak like 30+ years. At least they'll go to other rail systems where they'll serve for some time.
The AEM-7 lasted 30 years because it was based on a simple, reliable design, and built by people who knew how to make reliable trains. The ACS-64s were designed by Germans and manufactured by California’s finest minimum wage workers. They’re retired because Amtrak’s parts and service contract with Siemens expires after 20 years, and without Siemens paying for all the issues they’re having the fleet would be a massive financial black hole. Constant MU and HEP failures caused by poor connector designs that shake loose, cab control screens failing and bricking, transformers that need to be replaced rather than repaired to the tune of tens of thousands of dollars a pop because they’re sealed units that were supposed to last the lifetime of the locomotive (in reality they barely last a year or two), and horrifically-buggy software that’s been “patched” into a spaghetti mess straight-up worse than what the engines were delivered with. Unfortunately Amtrak didn’t learn from their mistake (or that of the Midwest states) and chose Siemens again rather than buy EMD-derived Stadler locomotives and rolling stock. Or just making the real sensible move and switching to multiple units.
I suspect ACS64 and P32s will last longer than predicted. It will be a while before the hybrid model of the Charger is not only delievered byt also tested and be reliable, especially the battery version. And for services that do Boston-Washington, it doesn't make sense to have the dead weight of a massive fossil fuel engine in your loco (which reduces maximum speed in curves). Where the hybrids will make sense are trains that come from new York and continue to Virginia after Washington (removes need to change loco at Washington).
@jfmezei I believe a locomotives change only takes a max of 15 minutes. They need to obviously apply hand brakes, shut the air valves uncouple some electrical connectors and air hoses uncouple the locomotives from the cars pull the electric out recouple the diesel and reverse the process adding in a brake test once air lines are charged. All which can be done in 15 minutes but likely 10. In the meantime passenger's can be disboarded and reboarded during the entire process except for the coupling of the diesel. As that can jerk the entire train.
I would rather say that the Genesis series of locomotives are past their ORIGINAL intended service life, but are still quite useful and have been seemingly more reliable in the first couple of year, especially in winter climates. I'm sure that will be sorted out by the time the P42's are retired but it's just an observation. They don't seem to be as dangerous as the Acela sets. Those are actually "well past the end of their useful service lives" as you said about the Genesis series.
Especially because the Genesis continues to have higher availability rates than the Midwest state-owned SC-44s and ALC-42s they’re running alongside. Siemens is already trying to weasel their way out of the 20-year services & support contract they signed with the states because they’re losing money paying out to fix all the problems.
The Genesis is only reliable when compared to other Amtrak locos. The California Zephyr is regularly 6-8 hours late because one breaks down in the Rockies. I've seen the Southwest Chief breakdown three times in a single trip, if I remember correctly that train ran so late the next days train had to drag it to Chicago. The Genesis has a lot of problems... but the Charger has more.
The Genesis was built by GE, which specializes mainly in freight trains. So, it borrows a lot of internal design cues from their freight counterparts. In general, they are not particularly fast or "stylish" but are built to haul.
That’s all very exciting, but I hope Amtrak Management takes note of the fact that, from what I have read, the new venture cars look nice, I’ve heard the seats aren’t very comfortable, don’t recline, and half the car sits forward, the other half sits backward. If they don’t make improvements to those features, long distance coach passengers aren’t going to be happy riding in those coaches. The trouble with Amtrak management, they probably don’t ride the trains enough to get a first hand experience. I’m glad as we travel to and from Chicago on the Lakeshore, we get a sleeper. Thanks for the update
This video was nice for people who want to get into the technical specifics but not for the average passenger. I would have liked to hear more of what Amtrak has already done to make service in 2024 better. Lots of the video was what they are planning to do. But I appreciate the time/work that went into the video.
I found this to be quite an informative video! I didn't know about the rumors surrounding the P42DC cab cars, while I learned quite a bit about the rest! I'm looking forward to seeing how Amtrak develops in 2024, and generally, the rest of the 2020s. Thanks for making this!
Wish Amtrak would purchase the new Economy Sleeping cars the Nightjet uses. A modern version of the Slumbercoach. Also it would have been so great if Amtrak would acquire a few SBB Panorama Cars for their scenic runs like the Adirondack, Maple Leaf, Vermonter, Cardinal, Pennsylvanian maybe the Crescent 🌙. I guess we can’t have everything. I actually would have liked a modern rounded end observation car on the Silver Service and Lake Shore Limited. At the end I’m glad we’re getting what we’re getting. Now if Amtrak can work with freight railroads to get Amtrak running on schedule.. we’d be golden!
I would like to see a round-ended observation, but those were on their way out before Amtrak because the railroads were tired of having to turn them around. Also, if they update the customs at St. Albans as planned, the _Vermonter_ could become the _Montrealer_ again for the first time since 1995.
@@DiamondKingStudios Right.. I remembered when Washington Terminal had a Turntable for that.. now it’s gone.. but VIA does it every time…. As far as the Vermonter … they had the Thruway bus to Montreal but that was done away with… if I remember correctly the Montrealer and the Adirondack used the same route at the Canadian border?
@@Pisca-kk5cs Probably. They both stopped at Saint-Lambert as their only intermediate between the border and Montreal, and Amtrak has a tendency to consolidate parallel routes (like their _Southwest Chief_ Chicago-Galesburg reroute), so they likely swapped CP for CN trackage somewhere along the way.
@@DiamondKingStudios I guess that was the demise of the Broadway Limited.. I always thought that train from New York to Chicago was the best and fastest train out of the 3
@@Pisca-kk5cs Honestly they should have kept that one. And also the _National Limited_ if not for that horrid track the freight companies later ripped out. So much wasted potential; you got Columbus, Indianapolis, a link between the East and St. Louis; *there’s a reason I-70 exists for goodness sake!*
20 years is not particularly old for rail rolling stock. For example, first tgv of 1981 (the originally orange ones) were recently retired. So they did 40 years. Usually the trains get a half-life deep renovation around 20 years.
I agree. Here in the UK we were using our HSTs (the original high speed diesel units built in 1978) until just a few years ago. From a passenger point of view they were comfortable and much loved. By comparison, the replacement Japanese electric units (Hitachi) are terrible. It's not all Hitachi's fault as the specification specified by the purchaser was 'bargain basement'. We are stuck with these for the next 20-30 years.
The US does a very poor job of legislating maintenance. It's why, for example, a geothermal heat pump is expected to last you 10 to 15 years longer in Germany.
In Sweden we still use the SJ Rc locomotives which were built between 1967 and 1988 for some intercity and most night train services. They are also used for hauling freight trains.
@@razorwireclouds5708no, it's because bombardier had to make the trains heavy for crash standards, before crash-energy management tech was a thing, causing more wear and tear to the trains, especially that one incident where the train split in half. Now we're in 2024, where export trains can bypass the weight requirement for the crash standards. If we had such bad maintenance, we would have retired our old amfleet/superliner cars in the 2000s. Jeez, Europeans can't stop making up crap, can't they. I saw a similar comment like this on a CF2105 video.
It’s too bad that Amtrak didn’t select the X2000 train sets. They were built to last and are still going strong in Europe and will be around for a while longer. I remember the tour of the X2000 and ICE train sets. I never saw the ICE but I did see the X2000 in Miami on the FEC Port of Miami line next to the now gone Miami Arena. Ah, the memories!
@@TheRandCrews Yes. That is true. On the subject of the Amfleet cars, in my opinion, I think they should be rebuilt. Their shells are practically indestructible, like the Budd cars of old. In fact, if I’m not mistaken, the Amfleet 1 cars were built by Budd and were their last cars. Then any new cars would be for expansion of service and not just for replacement.
I think it's probably not because of the design, but because of maintenance, or lack thereof. Yes the X2 (the actual train is called X2, the service is called X2000) is still running in Sweden, and they're being refurbished now for further service for another decade or two. I think the main problem is the lack of proper maintenance moreso than the specific trainset. We also have 50 year-old Rc locomotives still in use, refurbished and relegated to freight because of the slower speeds, and 40 year old Rc's still in passenger operation on e.g. some night train routes.
@@armandoperez7967 It's only speculation but that certainly could be a reason. Given the state of disrepair of American railroads in general it would make sense. Or perhaps because the rails are not as well maintained, the trains wear out faster.
Great video explaining the various developments in rolling stock! Call me a foamer, but I don't think Amtrak should retire a single engine or coach if they want to have enough equipment for their proposed service expansions, especially seeing that a bunch of lines outside of the northeast are suffering from equipment shortages as it is. I would've critiqued the video for not including the tender for new LD cars to replace the superliners, but nothing for that project is finalized as of yet. I also feel Amtrak should simply Siemens American Pioneer 220s (the American name of the Velaro Novo HST currently considered by Brightline West) so this way they have various high speed trainset types to supplement the problematic Avelia Liberty. Nevertheless, I can't wait to see what's in store in terms of rolling stock and service expansion, and I hope that Amtrak and the state/federal governments make the best decisions to help these plans move forward.
we took Amtrax from DC to Philly and then to NYC and then back to DC it was an excellent service the RED CAP People were so helpful and handled all our luggage and helped us with the handicapped member of our party of six. We are so grateful for Amtrax. The employees were so helpful and kind and the train service was comfortable to ride. we were so pleased we decided to go that way and would do it again! Thank You Amtrax
I think that most ACS-64 will be transferred to commuter railroad electrified lines. Like SEPTA, MARC, NJ Transit, METRO NORTH, Keolis Boston T, and who will be continuing run Long Distance SilvervStar, Silver Meteor, Crescent, and daily Cardinal, plus why not use them continuously on lines originating from DC to Boston. Or Keystones from Harrisburg to NY. ACS-64 is reliable locomotive as Genesis, who may be retired from Amtrak but continue to have serve passengers on commuter railroads or rebuilt as cab cars!!!
I'm going to miss the genesis locomotives. Many trips on then from Pittsburgh to DC. I still miss the Swedish toasters I think that's what they were called. Electric locomotives used on the northeast corridor. They were being phased out in the late 90s
@@debmccauley99 yes and run this T service trains from Boston to New Haven or New London Connecticut at least then there SLE, then Metro North, then NJ transit, then Septa, why run them from Trenton to Baltimore or Perryville, and entire NE Corridor will have fast commuter service from Boston South to Fredericksburg!!!
My 1st advice would be to speak a little more slowly to help make these future fun Amtrak intro videos more helpful to 1st-time laypersons who may be new to this Amtrak experience or have a mild-to-mderate bearing loss like I DO going forward. Ditto for a visual timeline of Amtrak's proud roots leading up to this very day. Aside from that, hey at least we're finally heading in the right direction towards making our Amtrak trains more welcoming (i.e. Healthier dining car options) for both returning & new passengers, respectively. Beth Budner, Auburndale, MA!
There are a ton of new rail projects announced all over the country coming from the IRA. I know it will be daunting, but I hope you’ll be able to cover a few of them in-depth! The US has such a long way to go in improving passenger rail network, but I’m excited to see it happen!
I stumbled upon your channel the other night and watched this video as my first of yours. I just wanted to drop in and say to keep it up! I really enjoy the presentation and quality of your work. IMO, you're putting together better pieces than some of the US Train UA-camrs who have 6-figure followings. I hope to see your channel grow in the future. Promoted this latest one across all platforms the other day. 🙂
I hope one day Amtrak and another railroad lines will be electrified nationwide and more double cab trainset, this would solve a lot of problems. But this will never happen. (I do like the design of Aero sets)
They should also add Internal 3RD rail shoes to the ALC-42Es themselves, not just the APVs (Similar to Metro-North's future SC-42DM locomotives) so that the ALC-42Es can be detached from the Airos and be used on the Lakeshore Limited long distance trains out of New York Penn Station.
The whole battery car thing needs to be done away with, a car full of lithium ion batteries doesn't belong on a train, too much of a fire risk, and is pointless if you have access to external electric power. Even if they use it for extra acceleration since the ALC-42s have less than half the power of the ACS-64s, when they're at cruising speed they won't be getting any regen braking to recharge the batteries so the locomotive will need to divert power (i.e. burn more fuel) to recharge the batteries, on top of needing to keep the train moving and providing HEP for the train.
I could potentially see a smaller battery or super capacitor setup as something of an accumulator to allow for regen braking to add a small boost of power during acceleration, but not to replace dual mode power for going into underground stations.
Good thing I stumbled on this video, been slowly learning more about Amtrak stuff after taking a train from DC to Pittsburg for Anthrcon 23 and discovering how much better it was than driving or flying..so I took one to Samford, CT for a con...then from DC to Chicago for MFF...wish work would let me take the train to the west coast.
Trivia: Adirondack runs on Amfleet II since a "long distance" run, while Ethan Allen and Vermonter are on Amfleet I. Current order for the Ventura cars is to replace Amfleet I. So will be interesting to see if Amtrak downgrades the Adirondack to Venture cars, unless it wll have some configured for Amfleet II comfort (huge amount of legroom, much better seats). Since the Empire corridor will require Venture car with batteries + Charger to get into Penn, I am guessing they will downgrade to Venture commuter cars. (the interio lighting/decor is reminiscent of commuter trains. Personally I don't understand why Amtrak isn't putting overhead catenary from 125th street to Penn station for the whole duration of the Empire access tunnel to Penn. They could then do away with the battery model alltogether, and once at Penn, the train would remain powered instead of needing to be plugged in. (and if batteries are dead, that train will block a platform, unable to make it to sunnyside). And it will have to move the heavy batteries as deadweight for the vast majority of the trip while only using them for the first/last few minutes in/out of Penn.
I didn't know there was an Acela taken out of service for parts. Is there a source where I could read more about that? I'm excited for the Airo train sets! If they're successful, I'm interested to see if Amtrak replaces all of their single level coaches with Venture cars.
10:20 whats also great about these electric hybrids is within the next 10 years hopefully, GO transit will be electrifying their corridor which will allow amtrak to use this electric section for its final/beginning section of the trip on the maple leaf.
I also hope that Amtrak uses some HHPCs on the Empire Corridor as well with the P32AC-DM on the Other end, so they can beta test running the current Amfleet trains on the EC with Push-Pull Cab Cars, since that's what the Airo Trainsets will have on the other end as well.
The battery idea is stupid though. Just add 3rd rail dual mode to the locomotives on those routes, save the space and weight of batteries, and eliminate the fire risk of having a car full of Lithium Ion batteries. 3rd rail dual mode chargers are already on order to replace the P32 dual modes used by Metro North and the EMD dual modes (which are notoriously unreliable) used by LIRR.
@DiamondKingStudios NYS is broke, NIMBYS are not going to have their view of the river destroyed by catenary. Plus the if you could the pile of $$$$ needed you wold need the space shuttle to fly over.
Awesome video. I was using the maple leaf recently and that train set felt old school, can't wait until they are replaced with that new one you mentioned!
With regards to the original Acela Express trainset, there are a lot of comments along the lines of "20 years does not seem too old for those cars to retire". However, there are tons of reasons why Amtrak does want to retire the fleet. 1. The trainset was truly a unique/hybrid design. It was built by Alstom and Bombardier and basically is one of its kind. That meant there was not a lot of spares to come around, (only 20 trainsets were ever built) which made maintenance an expensive endeavor. (there were 44 X 2000 trainsets built and more than 110 SNCF TGV "Sud-Est" built by comparison). 2. FRA regulation meant train cars in the US have to be super heavy. While the TGV "Sud-Est" train weigh around 385 tons, the Acela Express trainset weight around 617 tons (nearly double). Being so heavy meant extra wear and tear across the equipment. 3. Lastly, the original Acela Express trainset was fixed which meant as capacity surged, Amtrak could not "add" more cars to service increased demand. The original 6 coaches layout is small compared to most high-speed trains layouts (8 coaches in most trainsets).
Without trying to get too political, Biden has been easily the most involved president when it comes to Amtrak and I sincerely hope we don’t get a government next year that slashes all this new funding. I don’t think anyone’s running against it, but it does seem like low hanging fruit for anyone wanting a cheap win. But this is so important, im glad Amtrak have bucked the trend of American rail systems buying trains that look and feel 20 years old off the shelf. (Looking at you Chicago L and Boston T)
Say what you want about how the L looks ..but between that and Metra, Chicagoland has the best commuter rail service in the Midwest and one of the best in the country.
@@zinc9166 oh yeah it’s good for sure. I just think the psychological value of good looking trains is really high. Kids get excited about modern trains and might poke their parents to take it more often, and new looking trains are a visual representation of improvements to the system
@@chrisorr8601 you're not wrong. But something about the L just matches the aesthetic of Chicago to me lol. It would almost look weird to have fancy modern trains moving around on the rusted, graffitied, grimy structures. They could light them all up like the Christmas train though that would be a vibe haha.
I will absolutely hate to see the P42s go away. They are such an iconic locomotive for amtrak. Then again so we're the f40Phs. And I kinda got used to the p42s until enough time passed and they were the norm. My first time being inside a locomotive was an old f40ph running the "three rivers" amtrak train. Which was the now disappeared Chicago to new York via Pittsburgh train. It was the so damn loud inside even at idle. Little did I know less than 10 years later I would be working for norfolk southern as a locomotive electrician and would be on locomotives much founder throat-ier and shakier than those f40s
I don't see why they want desiel power on the NER. It won't ever be used but costs more and wastes what could have been extra seating. Why not just get emu cab cars and call it a day there. Plus low key I hope they leave some of the current sets in service I've been seeing most of the NERs full
My understanding is for routes that start on the corridor but terminate at a destination that is not electrified (and won’t be anytime soon) like Richmond or Pittsburgh.
The newer Charger locomotives has cabs that sit lower than the Genesis engines. A big plus when it comes to going through the tunnels on the Lakeshore Limited and several other of the routes that runs from Chicago to the northeast portion of the US.
I still wonder why the acelas already need to be replaced when in other countries highspeed trains are used for 30-40 years. Were they maintained badly or is it because of track/environmental conditions? Or is it just cheaper to scrap and replace them instead of overhauling them to use them for another 20 years?
One, the tracks on the NEC are horrible. Two, the Acela train sets are heavier than your average HSR train due to FRA requirements. Three, the Acela is specifically built for America, so not a lot of off the shelf parts. Amtrak is currently addressing the first issue, while the new Avelia Liberty sets are supposed to address the second and third.
20-25 years is about the service life of a HST. The 200 series TGV that the Acela is loosely based off of is also nearing the end of its service life and is about the same age. Newer HST designs are dramatically more energy efficient, which justifies not refurbishing the older ones. Remember HSTs use a LOT more energy than a normal electric train.
@@mrvwbug4423 No, HSTs can go well into their 30s. The german ICE1s are already in service longer than that and it is not planned to get rid of them anytime soon, the famous british IC125/HST is over 40 years old and is/was until recently still in use. The first japanese Shinkansen were in use for 3 or 4 decades too I think, though I dont have the concrete numbers right now.
@@dynasty0019 The replacement part Issue seems to be the biggest reason and I wonder how that wasnt foreseen 20 years ago. Well, at least they seem to have learned from it...
Sam - have you heard anything about the equipment proposed for use in new services? Living in the NYC area, I'm particularly interested in what they're proposing for the Scranton, PA - NYC and Ronkonkoma, NY - NYC routes as discussed in Amtrak connectsUS. Would it be practical to run "shuttles" between Scranton and Ronkonkoma?
Costs over a thousand per person to go from Seattle to Denver I can fly a private jet for that cost so until they become more reasonable price wise I guess I have to fly although I would rather go by rail. I was in Norway and they have a great rail system and you can travel at a fraction of the cost of the US. same with Japan.
It's amazing that Amtrak is working to get some modern trains, although it's a shame that it seems to be focused on the east. Not entirely its fault, since as I've understood it, any line amtrak itself doesn't own is held up for hours by cargo freight illegally holding things up with their too-long trains. Hopefully we can get some progress on that front, too!
With the normal regionals sure. The longest sections of 150mph track for the Acela are between New Haven and Boston where most of the line except around Providence is 150mph rated. And remember only 56 miles of the entire NEC is rated at 150mph.
@@mrvwbug4423that will change when the upgrades sre done to the New Brunswick-Trenton section, but even then that's still not a lot. Brutally honestly I'm not expecting more than 50% of 150+ within the century
When I was in the US in 2022, I was riding with an Amtrak train three times (Boston - New York, New York - Philly and Philly Washington) and it was always a pleasure. But yes, the Acela is also the flag ship of Amtrak and thus way better than the average, which is unknown to me. Japan is the only country which served me a bit better. But compared to my home country...way better. And even overall (like I said, I know only the Acela), the US railway system is ranked slightly higher than the one of Germany. Switzerland and Japan are the two top countries in this regard, but I know only the Japanses railway system. I've never been to Switzerland.
The only time I rode Amtrak was the California Zephyr. One of the longer routes Amtrak runs. The ride was incredible but that is me comparing it to airplane and auto travel. It had a smoother ride, tons of legroom, and you can walk around. While you can walk around on an airplane it is only when allowed and sometimes turbulence can make it challenging.
I expect that at least a few get preserved, along with some sold into Mexico, as they are buying up used passenger trains from all over (such as some used HST 125s from the UK) to start up new services.
The going of the Genesis locos will be bittersweet for me, although I'll never see another Genesis, the locomotive I always used to identify a passenger train in my kid drawings, I'll get to ride Railjet-based trainsets! It's sad to see the Genesis locos go, but I can't wait to see what the future holds!
I hope they keep some p42s as cab cars, i couldnt help but feel kinda cool when i would climb in the cab and it was dark and the window was short and wide, felt like i was in a stealth bomber or something. and then when they would power test them, i could feel the full throttle exhaust rumble my lungs as i walked by.
Most of this probably won't happen in 2024, unfortunately when it comes to mechanical equipment, more electronic can mean more problems, which is what these new locomotives and trainsets seem to be suffering from. But hey, a 55 year old legacy is something that Budd can be proud of (and probably something that can't be replicated).
Can you explain to me why Amtrak is buying ALC-42 Locomotives along side Amtrak Miro trainsets? Why not just buy all Amtrak Miro trainsets? Is the plan for ALC-42's to be used with the Amfleet II cars that will still be in service after the Miro trainsets replaced the Amfleet I cars? I am confused.
Airo is for NEC & electrified corridors in the east. The ALC-42's are for the long-distance overnight trains out west, outside of the NEC & electrified corridors in the east.
@@DominikW118kinda. Regional services more so for Airo. Most of the routes the Airo is going to be serving aren't electrified South of DC, or in the case of one of their flagship routed like the Cascades, are unelectrified completely.
@@DominikW118they want to eliminate DC switching from Electric to Diesel engines what add 30 minutes at least on all schedules running past DC to South, regional corridor or long distance!!!
the MBTA should really buy some original Acelas and ACS64’s once Amtrak retires them from their fleet. Could certainly help the MBTA commuter rail become more eco-friendly.
They're not really going anywhere from the NEC though. Amtrak will just transfer them to the other railroads on the NEC. This way both Amtrak and the local railroads are getting a traction power update. Amtrak gets to standardize fleet-wide on a proven locomotive and the local railroads get a solid upgrade to a locomotive still within its prime. I don't see this as a bad thing at all. Pretty much everybody wins from this, but most importantly the riders.
I like riding the train cross country, but we just don't have access. If the government wants to get people on public transportation, they are going to have to make it usable. I don't need high speed. I need better scheduling and access. I like to ride from Abilene tx. To Dallas Tx. and Fresno CA.
I get that trains need replacements sometime, but i don't understand why this is so soon in the us. For example, here in sweden, SJ is renovating the x2000, one of the trains that went to America before the acela, to at least be used for 20 more years. Why do American trains need replacement so early?
Thanx for the great video. I'm really going to miss the lazy beat of the GE P42s as they pull out of the likes of Texarkana when they go out of service. I hope some get to go to museums.
@@darryldworak6356the P42 and ALC42? No, they don't. The charger series use Cummins QSK95 prime movers. It's extremely unlikely that the P42s will get a rebuild short of in a museum
I wonder if/when Amtrak will start making changes to its existing system throughout Oklahoma and Texas. We have 2 trains that run through the states, being the Amtrak Heartland flyer (consisting of 2 P42 on each end of a 2-3 car train of superliners, and the Texas Eagle, which is just a P42 on the lead of 4 superliner coaches. There is huge public and governmental support for extensions of service and equipment enhancements, but we’ve yet to see any change at all. Perhaps we’re just gonna have to wait for the scraps of the new developments on either coast to trickle down to our neck of the woods that could really use some quality transportation infrastructure
Auto Train is honestly the most innocent of Amtrak’s routes. It’s the most profitable outside of the Northeast Corridor and the Superliners are just a nice way to relax, look at the views, and wake up in the morning close to your destination. If you’re looking for upgrades to the Auto Train though, Chargers will be testing on the route soon which, if successful, will allow more passenger cars to be powered and ran on a single train (Chargers have more HEP), and May 17th is the bid deadline for manufacturers to propose for Amtrak’s long distance equipment.
I'm glad Amtrak is finally taking steps to modernize, but I actually like the classic look of their current locomotives and rolling stock. I hope at least some of them will find second careers instead of simply being scrapped wholesale.
2:58 Oh the irony to see a modern efficient but unreliable European high speed trainset, being towed at walking pace by a nearly bulletproof 60 year old Alco...
Why just take the Siemens trains (Loco and cars) number of cars (9,10,11… as many as needed/possible), put an adequate furnishing in and make them the new ACCELA? Reliable, AVAILABLE (now/very soon).
The tilting technology is essential for high speed operation, especially in the NEC. Also the ALC-42 is going to struggle with 8 cars at 125mph, it has literally half the power of the ACS-64, unless they can design it to run significantly higher power output when AC power is available. If you want a comparison. ALC-42 has 4200hp on diesel, unknown on AC electric. ACS-64 has 8600hp, maintains 125mph with ease. Current gen Acela has 12,400hp (6200hp x2 power cars), easily maintains 150mph and gets there quickly (Acela is actually known for having very quick acceleration for a HST). If you want an example of a charger being used at 125mph, Brightline runs 2x 4000hp Chargers with only 4 cars, they use both to get up to speed then usually idle the 2nd locomotive (or just have it running HEP) once up to speed.
Tilt is important, ok, didn‘t know that. Troublesome tho. But the elec. Siemens does 125mph. Isnt that good enough? Acela is all electric, so I‘m talking only about elec Siemens.
@@mrvwbug4423ALC-42 will be never run at 125, Q where??? 79 maximum 90 mph (Southwest Chief between Flagstaff and Albuquerque) that's it. 79 mph will stay for most routes in generation to come, problem is to have agreement with Host railroads to make them modify PRS schedule to allow priority for Amtrak train and introduce a mandate (maybe through government compensation) for keeping all trackage Amtrak currently use at least upgraded to 79 mph, in fact many have only 59 mph. Also quick acceleration, remove curves, straightening tracks, reduce grade crossing even with speed of 79 mph maximum, will slush several hours or more on each route Amtrak currently use. Now average speed according to most schedules are just about 50-55 mph, what's if will be at least 60 mph, then trains from Florida Orlando for example to DC will be in 13-14 runs, if that feels slow, than compare this with most Nightjets in Europe, they barely have average speed on schedules exceeding 90 km per hour!!! Remember we still use MPH that's 1.6 km per hour conversion!!! So I think 79 mph is ok and if most time of route train will maintain that speed over 70 mph and use higher platforms, Amtrak currently upgrading on many station of busiest routes on East Coast, we will see faster trains at still current 79 mph speed limit, with more regulated by FRA Host Railroad PRS, what's currently making Havoc on Amtrak trains used to be delays on schedule over 45 minutes (then it's on mercy to Host railroad to let it squeeze between PRS trains, if FRA compensate them for that, this will be priority for all Amtrak trains 24/7, on schedule or not!!! Funny that nobody yet mention this in comments, but this a reason a main reason now why Amtrak train travels often delays for hours, and use less and less priority over freight trains!!! Because of Implementation of Precision Railroading Schedules by Big 7 Club in 2018 to now!!! Amtrak trains currently like "let's run my kids to school in your car and I pay $1 for that ride, no matter how long it's takes and how much gasoline you used", this exactly Amtrak now in PRS running Big 7 Club. PRS is must have for Big 7 Club both for profiles, big revenue and overall their customers satisfaction, because they scheduling cargos delivery at precisely manner, very very predictable timing except Act of Gods, weather etc, but Amtrak is now a some obstacle for that too, if demanding what's everywhere else in the World mandated priorities over freigh trains sharing same tracks!!! Also while passing siding it's great for single track route, it will be problem if Amtrak intensified their trains for more trains running same tracks, also local communities who worried about overall safety and train horn speed, some regulated by outdated obsolete laws of time of Steam era... some just want raised bridges most of the time for their yachts... I think it's time to tax the rich, what's in 99% other capitalist country is mandatory now, but US!!! While many crying, the rich taxed higher in any country globally except US, rich pay for their luxury toys more anywhere in the World, but US, it's about a time to be make them not to convert into new aristocracy, we are not peasants for them, we are free citizens, they must stop used loopholes and pay fair taxes, so they may feel expensive for any extravaganza like running their yachts anytime they like and closing railroad bridge for that!!! 10% must be pay more taxes than 90% because they have earned more than 90%, and their combined wealth is more than those in 90% group, WE ARE NO Longer Peasants for Them, since 1776/1789!!! Then all benefits with faster train rides, also start educate children in all schools, private or public for Railroad safety, then we see less car train accidents on crossings, and less trespass along tracks, when they are in school and when they grown up, this must be mandate!!! Also anywhere doing, but US!!!
A curious question I've had for a long time but never heard an explanation for: Why are US passenger trains retired while so young? Here in Sweden the planned lifespan of the trains is ~50 years old, ex X2000 is undergoing a major revison now at 30. Why is it that the genesis locomotives are being completely retired at only 30? Aren't they still quite reliable? Is it harder emissions standards?
There is a vast difference in country sizes while running a train across Sweden versus the United States. Sweden is about 6 percent larger than the state of California in the U.S. Amtrak equipment in the U.S. takes a beating and some trains take two days to reach their destination. Inspection intervals are much farther and a single train may run 48 hours before servicing. There is just a lot more wear and tear put on the equipment. I hope this helps! Take Care, Tom
Always the case with greater methods of transportation where car-centric politicians will cut funding, the services will decline in quality, and car lobbyists will say "look at how much better cars are." The US has long since needed overhauls in so many areas of transportation, and hopefully this can be the start of something better arising from the rubble. I have the same fondness as anyone for the equipment that has always been there, but what's to come sure knows how to look good (after the many problems are fixed, of course).
It depends on the person. Some people prefer cars, some prefer trains. The difference is car lovers dont hate trains, but its not true the other way around Use what transit you like without bashing the other.
I edited this video on an 11 hour Amtrak ride
Lol
This is one reason why trains are better than cars. Sorry, I couldn't resist
Oh, you went from Philly to Pittsburgh?
Hope it was in a Viewliner or Superliner roomette.
@@counterfit5 LOL. I was just about to make a similar comment. Good one!
As a European I hope the best for your public transport furture!
Now its time for you guys to improve your freight network
@@lalakerspro
What?
The US is doing things to improve their passenger transport. What is europe doing to improve their awful freight network?
@@keahnig164
@@keahnig164Europe has better passenger rail, and the USA has better freight transport.
@@IDentification77i’d say that the US has a more extensive freight system, but not the best. Speeds on lower on those locomotives, not electrified, polluting, the horns are noisy at night, the railways that’re owned by those freight companies are in poor condition and the fact that they’re not government owned creates problems for passenger rail, in most of europe they’re shared and the freight runs at night when most intercity rail has a low service frequency.
Amtrak also just obtained trackage rights of my local rail line (C&O Piedmont Sub) and will be using it for commuter service in the near future!
Charlottesville to Richmond?
I would like to see that.
I just wish they didn’t have to “obtain” trackage rights. If you ask me, they ought to be able to use any track of the original participating freight roads if they so desire; that seems like one of the initial founding principles.
They are running the “commonwealth regional” from Newport News to Lynchburg. It will have stops in Richmond, Ashland, Doswell, possibly Beaverdam, possibly Mineral, possibly Louisa, Gordonsville, Charlottesville, Roanoke, and Lynchburg.
This is GREAT. Less cars on the highways and streets to those highways. Good for everybody. It's looking having more Rail ridership.
Who has right of way?? The freight or passenger trains?
@@winstonsolipsist1741 It ought to be passenger trains, due to their expected higher speeds and the nature of them carrying paying passengers, but with how long freight trains are these days, how irregularly they run, and how insufficiently long passing sidings are, freight railroads are unable to give passenger trains the priority they agreed to give, and I doubt any of the companies want to, either.
Next year will indeed be a roller coaster ride for Amtrak
It's ONLY happening cuz the government is paying for it. This is why government investment is good!
@@htown148also people work in it
@@htown148 Let's be completely frank here. Without Amtrak there wouldn't be any passenger rail in the US outside of NY, Chicago, and maybe Boston (only because those 3 cities had their transit built up before cars were common). That Amtrak managed to survive airline deregulation and 4 Republican presidents who wanted to kill it off is nothing short of a miracle. The reason why we're seeing the expansion we are now is because one of Amtrak's biggest proponents basically ever is currently President.
Coach airline service in the United States isn’t exactly fantastic either.
@@mrvwbug4423 I'm all for government investment in our public transportation. Wish we would've invested in the 50s in rail instead of highways. Sigh
Such a drag that they make the smart decision to go with an experienced manufacturer from a nation with a lot of high speed rail experience and then get screwed by Alstom anyway.
This is what consolidation gets you. IMHO they should've strongly considered HST designs from Kawasaki, they build most of the Shinkansen for Japan. Kawasaki already has a US presence as they build commuter trains and subway trains for MTA in NY. Hyundai-Rotem is another consideration, they build HSTs for Korail in South Korea and already have a big US presence and build commuter trains, trams and passenger cars for US commuter railroads.
No one was screwd. With all the understood frustration such a complicated project can have problems and delays no mater who builds it, especially when you choose a new and under development product that has to be modified due to specific US needs.
Even in the video a failior of two experienced japanese manufacturers happend that led to the order of the Siemens Venture cars. Alstom itself has delayes on the French version of the same base model. Spain's national rail operator is still waiting for the new high speed trains they ordered from Talgo (Talgo Avril) that were supose to be delivered in 2021 and were delayed a few time, last one was supose to be in november and now it's "the first quarter of 2024". Even the current favorite Stadler has large delayes of the Liverpool Merseyrail's trains whwn only a handful were delivered and they suffer from problems that causes delays.
Amtrak can sue Alstom, depending on the terms of the contract, but maybe they prefer to solve this amicably. In the mentioed Talgo delay Renfe demanded compensations witha threat to sue but they also prefer to solve this without going to court.
@@mrvwbug4423you mean the latest 3rd one, yeah? Cause the first and second are just redone TGVs, to be fair
@@THEFINALHAZARDindeed, the new Acela is a stock TGV with some options, as opposed to the customized version for the original ‘’American Flyer’ project.
@@mrvwbug4423 In Philadelphia Kawasaki built the Broad Street Line trains and they are in much better shape than the El trains which are 10-15 years younger.
Hyundai made the new Regional Rail trains which were kind of a disaster, so I could see amtrak being gun-shy about them
nice to see Amtrak finally get some love again.
Amtrak got far more love under Trump, 75 engines and all new passenger cars. The only stipulation was, the trains have to WORK!
@@tonyburzio4107 Trump barely understood the context behind the 2017 Cascades derailment. But whatever floats your boat.
Tf does this have to do with trump.@@tonyburzio4107
@@tonyburzio4107US passenger rail is shitty and has not improved in decades
@gotworc it hasn't improved since the 50's
Desperately hope a museum gets a metroliner cab car. Love those things
I live in Olean, NY. That's the town that's holding 2 of the Acela sets in the WNY&PRR freight yards. That's ex-Erie, ex-Pennsylvania and ex-Conrail territory.
While I enjoy seeing the sets in the freight yards behind the Home Depot, I do wish they were working along the corridor.
Even better: I wish we had these sets zipping through Olean on their way to Chicago, like the old Erie Limited used to.
It would be fun to see new electrified lines bought by Amtrak and use Bombardier Acela sets using them while new units are ordered
The Alstom factory where the Acela trains are assembled (and is Alstom's main North America factory) is located in nearby Hornell.
amtrak is so nice when you look at it for what it is, i took the starlight from LA to San Jose and it was nice to just sit and get some amazing views while relaxing
As of this fall, an Inpector General report confirmed Amtrak has NOT received _any_ Avelia Liberties. Alstom has stored them on Amtrak property and is having probems with certification with FRA. The major one is that Alstom cannot provide computer modeling of the active banking system for each portion of track on the Corridor something which FRA said was a hard requirement before certification.
BTW, Avelia Liberty is a hybrid: locomotive from the Avelia Horizon (aka TGV--M) but the coaches are Pendolinos. (and the lower speed model of Pendolino since high speed ones don't have banking). This is why the shape of loco does not match the shape of the coaches.
It is somewhat ironic that in 2018, the FRA relented and realized its own rules prevented modern trains and changed it policy to allow importing modern trains, but the "made in America" rules prevent the importation of tested, working trains that can be put in service and instead the desiging of custom trains with USA components requiring full testing/certification regiment since totrally different from original model.
The Viaggios were already heavy steel trains built for cheap in Europe to run on slow lines (only up to 230kmh) and Siemens then had to build a new version of it to meet "made in USA" and FRA rules (since designed in USA prior to 2018, still had the rules that requires everything to be slow and heavy).
Siemens has newer Viaggios made of aluminium now but these would cost too much to convert to meet FRA stadards, so Siemens USA continue st offer the old heavy "Venture" cars.
Also note that not only does "made in America" require new untested "made im USA" components, but every order of Charger locos from Amtrak as well as Viaggios has has different configurations and thus model numbers. (you noted this for locos, but this means Amtrak will have many incompatible locos that look the same but are different inside and have different perforance.). The long distance ones not only have different horsepower, but also more powerful HEP generators to power the longer trains with power-hungry Superliners.
Siemens has sold enough of those Venture cars/Charger locos to more than pay for the deisgn of a "made in America" train. But it isn.t about to import and redesign ist newer rolling stock so USA (and Canada) are stuck with whatever Siemens has right now. (and Siemens has a lot of pressure to fix all the bugs in cars and locos).
Cars are also different models for each order. Some are AAR coupler at each end. Some are sets of 2 cars with permanent coupling and AAR at end of the 2 car duo, and some are permanent couplings for the whole train, some allow the lococmotive to be changed. And some have AAR coupler at the CaB end so train can be towed by other loco. There are differenr door designs as well. VIA for instance is blocking doors on one end of cars, while other orders have finctioning doors are both ends. The stairs to access low level platforms are different, and of course Brightline has no stairs as all their stations have high level plaforms and instead, they have platform gap fillers that extend out from under door as door opens.
So when each order requires customization, it also means lots of testing and teething problems.
Now, only to Amtrak cannibalizing Acella steel trains. VIA has done the same iwth its core LRC cards (as well as trabscontiental equipennt which it no longer has enough to run daily trains). Both Amtrak and VIA thought they would be getting the replacemet trains on time and stopped orderig new spare parts for the old trains, but when the new trains turned out to be late, they were stuck with no spare parts and manufacturers no longer making them available.
(For Amtrak part of issue was lack of communications internally between the gusy working on new train project and the guys taking care of old steel Acellas).
The new Acellas have fancy tilting system: in the past, active tilting had a probem of delay between entering curve and cars reaching the proper tilting level to cancel the curve and this makes people sick. These new Acellas will use GPS and on-board route database to preduce when they are about to enter a curve and start to bank before the lateral G force is felt so it can be cancelled. (this is one reason FRA is wanting all i dotted on this because brand new and not used before).
I really don’t get the Made in the USA requirement. It only creates problems with big products like trains, sure it’s great for smaller products and components, but totally banning the importation of well made European products is crazy, Instead they should encourage companies to start investing in the US and build they factory there too so that there’s a slow and steady transition to turn back the knob on globalization.
I think Amtrak’s biggest issue, like most passenger rail across North America (both US and Canada) happens to be the freight companies getting in the way.
Freight is extremely important for the economy, US has the best freight network in the world
It's because fhe freight owns the rails. They get priority and when amtrak misses its alloted windows (which happens all the time because amtrak is hopelessly unreliable) they have to sit and wait until freight allows them use. This is one of the main reasons high speed rail doesn't have a chance in the US, it would be far too costly for amtrak to build its own dedicated continental network.
@@lalakerspro
"Freight is extremely important for the economy,"
==
Not for the economy, for the owner of airliners.
For the economy, anything works good.
@@lalakerspro
"Freight is extremely important for the economy,.."
==
For the economy , no
For the airliner's owners and investors, yes.
For the environmental impact, there's no comparison.
@@allgoo196 freight trains are used to transport important goods across the US. They are absolutely needed. Europe still uses trucks like the 18th century
I'm so glad to hear that the Cardinal line (from NY to Chicago and along the Ohio River where I live) is going back to daily service for the first time in 40 years.
What an exciting video. Issues with Alstom's trains notwithstanding, I'm looking forward to the new look and feel of Amtrak, especially on the NEC where I live.
Hopefully the infrastructure will be improved at a fast rate. Portal Bridge is already under construction so that's a huge deal within itself.
The biggest question is, what about the replacement of superliners and Amfleets on routes such as the silver meteor?
That’s interesting how we haven’t gotten answers to those questions yet. My guess is that the silver meteor could get Horizons and the superliner replacement will be somewhat identical cars at least that’s what I’m hoping for
Amtrak and Via both announced earlier this year (possibly late last year) that they were looking for bids for Superliner/Budd Car replacements with the potential for a hefty joint order if I recall correctly. We'll have to wait to see how that pans out
And also what about the recent revival Night Owl that is a night train Service between Boston to DC?
Siemens already has sleeper cars that could work to replace both the Viewliners and Superliners. Look at the new NightJet cars in Austria, those are made by Siemens and are very similar in design to the Venture and Airo cars.
@@mrvwbug4423 What about Viewliner 2, these railcars are made of stainless steel but they are fresh new?
I’ve adopted an “I’ll believe it when I see it” attitude towards everything Amtrak-related. They can promise all they want, we’ll just have to wait and see.
I live in Arizona and we've been hearing about the Tucson to Phoenix line for over 20 years. Countless studies have occurred and guess what? We're getting another study.
Same should go for anything from either Alstom or Siemens in general. Their recent track record, even outside the US, has been abysmal.
Why? Amtrak is actually pretty good at bringing upgrades online.
@@garcjrParalysis by analysis.
@@TohaBgood2You may be in a small minority with another unfounded opinion. Won't bother expecting an example proving otherwise.
I'm really excited for the Airo trainsets, because they look really great and they're an awesome next step for Amtrak, but I'm almost a little bummed to see the ACS-64s go. I know that they'll be something like 15+ years old by the time Airo is fully implemented, but I can't help but feel like they still have a lot of life left in them. The AEM-7s lasted Amtrak like 30+ years. At least they'll go to other rail systems where they'll serve for some time.
We will see how much they're loved when one car gets bad ordered and an entire train is cancelled.
The AEM-7 lasted 30 years because it was based on a simple, reliable design, and built by people who knew how to make reliable trains. The ACS-64s were designed by Germans and manufactured by California’s finest minimum wage workers.
They’re retired because Amtrak’s parts and service contract with Siemens expires after 20 years, and without Siemens paying for all the issues they’re having the fleet would be a massive financial black hole. Constant MU and HEP failures caused by poor connector designs that shake loose, cab control screens failing and bricking, transformers that need to be replaced rather than repaired to the tune of tens of thousands of dollars a pop because they’re sealed units that were supposed to last the lifetime of the locomotive (in reality they barely last a year or two), and horrifically-buggy software that’s been “patched” into a spaghetti mess straight-up worse than what the engines were delivered with.
Unfortunately Amtrak didn’t learn from their mistake (or that of the Midwest states) and chose Siemens again rather than buy EMD-derived Stadler locomotives and rolling stock. Or just making the real sensible move and switching to multiple units.
@@GintaPPE1000the AEM-7 was European too tho
I suspect ACS64 and P32s will last longer than predicted. It will be a while before the hybrid model of the Charger is not only delievered byt also tested and be reliable, especially the battery version. And for services that do Boston-Washington, it doesn't make sense to have the dead weight of a massive fossil fuel engine in your loco (which reduces maximum speed in curves). Where the hybrids will make sense are trains that come from new York and continue to Virginia after Washington (removes need to change loco at Washington).
@jfmezei I believe a locomotives change only takes a max of 15 minutes. They need to obviously apply hand brakes, shut the air valves uncouple some electrical connectors and air hoses uncouple the locomotives from the cars pull the electric out recouple the diesel and reverse the process adding in a brake test once air lines are charged. All which can be done in 15 minutes but likely 10. In the meantime passenger's can be disboarded and reboarded during the entire process except for the coupling of the diesel. As that can jerk the entire train.
I would rather say that the Genesis series of locomotives are past their ORIGINAL intended service life, but are still quite useful and have been seemingly more reliable in the first couple of year, especially in winter climates. I'm sure that will be sorted out by the time the P42's are retired but it's just an observation. They don't seem to be as dangerous as the Acela sets. Those are actually "well past the end of their useful service lives" as you said about the Genesis series.
Especially because the Genesis continues to have higher availability rates than the Midwest state-owned SC-44s and ALC-42s they’re running alongside. Siemens is already trying to weasel their way out of the 20-year services & support contract they signed with the states because they’re losing money paying out to fix all the problems.
@@GintaPPE1000I wonder how Amtrak Chargers got these problems while Via Rail trainsets yet to have one since it’s soft launch last winter
The Genesis is only reliable when compared to other Amtrak locos. The California Zephyr is regularly 6-8 hours late because one breaks down in the Rockies. I've seen the Southwest Chief breakdown three times in a single trip, if I remember correctly that train ran so late the next days train had to drag it to Chicago. The Genesis has a lot of problems... but the Charger has more.
@@burlingtonnorthernblackdia7591- Bring back the F-40's!
The Genesis was built by GE, which specializes mainly in freight trains. So, it borrows a lot of internal design cues from their freight counterparts. In general, they are not particularly fast or "stylish" but are built to haul.
That’s all very exciting, but I hope Amtrak Management takes note of the fact that, from what I have read, the new venture cars look nice, I’ve heard the seats aren’t very comfortable, don’t recline, and half the car sits forward, the other half sits backward. If they don’t make improvements to those features, long distance coach passengers aren’t going to be happy riding in those coaches.
The trouble with Amtrak management, they probably don’t ride the trains enough to get a first hand experience. I’m glad as we travel to and from Chicago on the Lakeshore, we get a sleeper.
Thanks for the update
This video was nice for people who want to get into the technical specifics but not for the average passenger. I would have liked to hear more of what Amtrak has already done to make service in 2024 better. Lots of the video was what they are planning to do. But I appreciate the time/work that went into the video.
Great job presenting such a huge amount of information in such great context. An exciting time, for sure!
I found this to be quite an informative video! I didn't know about the rumors surrounding the P42DC cab cars, while I learned quite a bit about the rest! I'm looking forward to seeing how Amtrak develops in 2024, and generally, the rest of the 2020s.
Thanks for making this!
The new Siemens train set look so cool!
I appreciate your well sourced, informative, concise video. I’m so excited for this Amtrak future!
Wish Amtrak would purchase the new Economy Sleeping cars the Nightjet uses. A modern version of the Slumbercoach. Also it would have been so great if Amtrak would acquire a few SBB Panorama Cars for their scenic runs like the Adirondack, Maple Leaf, Vermonter, Cardinal, Pennsylvanian maybe the Crescent 🌙. I guess we can’t have everything. I actually would have liked a modern rounded end observation car on the Silver Service and Lake Shore Limited. At the end I’m glad we’re getting what we’re getting. Now if Amtrak can work with freight railroads to get Amtrak running on schedule.. we’d be golden!
I would like to see a round-ended observation, but those were on their way out before Amtrak because the railroads were tired of having to turn them around.
Also, if they update the customs at St. Albans as planned, the _Vermonter_ could become the _Montrealer_ again for the first time since 1995.
@@DiamondKingStudios Right.. I remembered when Washington Terminal had a Turntable for that.. now it’s gone.. but VIA does it every time…. As far as the Vermonter … they had the Thruway bus to Montreal but that was done away with… if I remember correctly the Montrealer and the Adirondack used the same route at the Canadian border?
@@Pisca-kk5cs Probably.
They both stopped at Saint-Lambert as their only intermediate between the border and Montreal, and Amtrak has a tendency to consolidate parallel routes (like their _Southwest Chief_ Chicago-Galesburg reroute), so they likely swapped CP for CN trackage somewhere along the way.
@@DiamondKingStudios I guess that was the demise of the Broadway Limited.. I always thought that train from New York to Chicago was the best and fastest train out of the 3
@@Pisca-kk5cs Honestly they should have kept that one.
And also the _National Limited_ if not for that horrid track the freight companies later ripped out. So much wasted potential; you got Columbus, Indianapolis, a link between the East and St. Louis; *there’s a reason I-70 exists for goodness sake!*
20 years is not particularly old for rail rolling stock. For example, first tgv of 1981 (the originally orange ones) were recently retired. So they did 40 years.
Usually the trains get a half-life deep renovation around 20 years.
I agree. Here in the UK we were using our HSTs (the original high speed diesel units built in 1978) until just a few years ago. From a passenger point of view they were comfortable and much loved. By comparison, the replacement Japanese electric units (Hitachi) are terrible. It's not all Hitachi's fault as the specification specified by the purchaser was 'bargain basement'. We are stuck with these for the next 20-30 years.
The US does a very poor job of legislating maintenance. It's why, for example, a geothermal heat pump is expected to last you 10 to 15 years longer in Germany.
@@razorwireclouds5708 makes sense. Buy 2 heat pumps in 30 years instead of 1 create jobs in sale and advertising 😁
In Sweden we still use the SJ Rc locomotives which were built between 1967 and 1988 for some intercity and most night train services. They are also used for hauling freight trains.
@@razorwireclouds5708no, it's because bombardier had to make the trains heavy for crash standards, before crash-energy management tech was a thing, causing more wear and tear to the trains, especially that one incident where the train split in half. Now we're in 2024, where export trains can bypass the weight requirement for the crash standards. If we had such bad maintenance, we would have retired our old amfleet/superliner cars in the 2000s. Jeez, Europeans can't stop making up crap, can't they. I saw a similar comment like this on a CF2105 video.
It’s too bad that Amtrak didn’t select the X2000 train sets. They were built to last and are still going strong in Europe and will be around for a while longer. I remember the tour of the X2000 and ICE train sets. I never saw the ICE but I did see the X2000 in Miami on the FEC Port of Miami line next to the now gone Miami Arena. Ah, the memories!
It’s corrugated steel outer design really feels at home with the amfleets it would’ve serve along side
@@TheRandCrews Yes. That is true. On the subject of the Amfleet cars, in my opinion, I think they should be rebuilt. Their shells are practically indestructible, like the Budd cars of old. In fact, if I’m not mistaken, the Amfleet 1 cars were built by Budd and were their last cars. Then any new cars would be for expansion of service and not just for replacement.
I think it's probably not because of the design, but because of maintenance, or lack thereof. Yes the X2 (the actual train is called X2, the service is called X2000) is still running in Sweden, and they're being refurbished now for further service for another decade or two. I think the main problem is the lack of proper maintenance moreso than the specific trainset. We also have 50 year-old Rc locomotives still in use, refurbished and relegated to freight because of the slower speeds, and 40 year old Rc's still in passenger operation on e.g. some night train routes.
@@dijikstra8 Could it be because the trains receive better maintenance in Europe than the trains receive in North America?
@@armandoperez7967 It's only speculation but that certainly could be a reason. Given the state of disrepair of American railroads in general it would make sense. Or perhaps because the rails are not as well maintained, the trains wear out faster.
Great video explaining the various developments in rolling stock! Call me a foamer, but I don't think Amtrak should retire a single engine or coach if they want to have enough equipment for their proposed service expansions, especially seeing that a bunch of lines outside of the northeast are suffering from equipment shortages as it is. I would've critiqued the video for not including the tender for new LD cars to replace the superliners, but nothing for that project is finalized as of yet. I also feel Amtrak should simply Siemens American Pioneer 220s (the American name of the Velaro Novo HST currently considered by Brightline West) so this way they have various high speed trainset types to supplement the problematic Avelia Liberty. Nevertheless, I can't wait to see what's in store in terms of rolling stock and service expansion, and I hope that Amtrak and the state/federal governments make the best decisions to help these plans move forward.
Just have the Siemens train set as the base model for everything. Numer of cars and furnishing adjusted to the task. Including Acela. Finito. Why not?
Top priority must be safety with a major focus on infrastructure and absolute assurance of track and rail integrity.
Yeah don't pull a China and build a massive HSR network that is now so plagued with safety issues that they only operate at 180km/h
@@mrvwbug4423 Are you sure? Give some real specifics.
we took Amtrax from DC to Philly and then to NYC and then back to DC it was an excellent service the RED CAP People were so helpful and handled all our luggage and helped us with the handicapped member of our party of six. We are so grateful for Amtrax. The employees were so helpful and kind and the train service was comfortable to ride. we were so pleased we decided to go that way and would do it again! Thank You Amtrax
I had a feeling the HHP-8s and Genesis units were gonna be rebuilt into NPCUs or cab cars at some point in their service lives!
I think that most ACS-64 will be transferred to commuter railroad electrified lines. Like SEPTA, MARC, NJ Transit, METRO NORTH, Keolis Boston T, and who will be continuing run Long Distance SilvervStar, Silver Meteor, Crescent, and daily Cardinal, plus why not use them continuously on lines originating from DC to Boston. Or Keystones from Harrisburg to NY. ACS-64 is reliable locomotive as Genesis, who may be retired from Amtrak but continue to have serve passengers on commuter railroads or rebuilt as cab cars!!!
I'm going to miss the genesis locomotives. Many trips on then from Pittsburgh to DC. I still miss the Swedish toasters I think that's what they were called. Electric locomotives used on the northeast corridor. They were being phased out in the late 90s
Obviously, a former rail engineer , comments are based upon knowledge.🚅
@@JackArkitektboston mass
@@debmccauley99 yes and run this T service trains from Boston to New Haven or New London Connecticut at least then there SLE, then Metro North, then NJ transit, then Septa, why run them from Trenton to Baltimore or Perryville, and entire NE Corridor will have fast commuter service from Boston South to Fredericksburg!!!
My 1st advice would be to speak a little more slowly to help make these future fun Amtrak intro videos more helpful to 1st-time laypersons who may be new to this Amtrak experience or have a mild-to-mderate bearing loss like I DO going forward.
Ditto for a visual timeline of Amtrak's proud roots leading up to this very day.
Aside from that, hey at least we're finally heading in the right direction towards making our Amtrak trains more welcoming (i.e. Healthier dining car options) for both returning & new passengers, respectively.
Beth Budner, Auburndale, MA!
There are a ton of new rail projects announced all over the country coming from the IRA. I know it will be daunting, but I hope you’ll be able to cover a few of them in-depth!
The US has such a long way to go in improving passenger rail network, but I’m excited to see it happen!
At least US is improving. Europe is making no effort whatsoever to improve their freight network.
Love Amtrak. Keep us updated!! Time for a trip. 👍
I’m exited for the Amtrak airos. They will be a big upgrade to the fleet, hope they’re good
Great research and I see you really upped the production quality on this one! Thanks for the update.
Its hard to underestimate how just making trains looking modern will change how america views and talks about trains. The amfleets GTG
I stumbled upon your channel the other night and watched this video as my first of yours. I just wanted to drop in and say to keep it up! I really enjoy the presentation and quality of your work. IMO, you're putting together better pieces than some of the US Train UA-camrs who have 6-figure followings. I hope to see your channel grow in the future. Promoted this latest one across all platforms the other day. 🙂
You may wish to check out some of the channel's recent past videos which are also very good.
Watching this while riding the Amtrak
Another great video. Thanks for all the info.
Looking forward to more details about Amtraks Long Distance cars replacement for Superliners.
Stay tuned for May 17th then I believe! That should be the due date for manufacturers to propose replacements to Amtrak.
Amtrak has been my favorite train brand since my childhood. Can’t wait to see what’s next.
I hope one day Amtrak and another railroad lines will be electrified nationwide and more double cab trainset, this would solve a lot of problems. But this will never happen. (I do like the design of Aero sets)
The most important thing is transforming our minds, for a new way of thinking, a new outlook: we should strive to develop a new inner world.
Sounds like new-age drivel rather than meaningful ideas regarding infrastructure.
They should also add Internal 3RD rail shoes to the ALC-42Es themselves, not just the APVs (Similar to Metro-North's future SC-42DM locomotives) so that the ALC-42Es can be detached from the Airos and be used on the Lakeshore Limited long distance trains out of New York Penn Station.
The whole battery car thing needs to be done away with, a car full of lithium ion batteries doesn't belong on a train, too much of a fire risk, and is pointless if you have access to external electric power. Even if they use it for extra acceleration since the ALC-42s have less than half the power of the ACS-64s, when they're at cruising speed they won't be getting any regen braking to recharge the batteries so the locomotive will need to divert power (i.e. burn more fuel) to recharge the batteries, on top of needing to keep the train moving and providing HEP for the train.
I could potentially see a smaller battery or super capacitor setup as something of an accumulator to allow for regen braking to add a small boost of power during acceleration, but not to replace dual mode power for going into underground stations.
Good thing I stumbled on this video, been slowly learning more about Amtrak stuff after taking a train from DC to Pittsburg for Anthrcon 23 and discovering how much better it was than driving or flying..so I took one to Samford, CT for a con...then from DC to Chicago for MFF...wish work would let me take the train to the west coast.
Trivia: Adirondack runs on Amfleet II since a "long distance" run, while Ethan Allen and Vermonter are on Amfleet I. Current order for the Ventura cars is to replace Amfleet I. So will be interesting to see if Amtrak downgrades the Adirondack to Venture cars, unless it wll have some configured for Amfleet II comfort (huge amount of legroom, much better seats). Since the Empire corridor will require Venture car with batteries + Charger to get into Penn, I am guessing they will downgrade to Venture commuter cars. (the interio lighting/decor is reminiscent of commuter trains. Personally I don't understand why Amtrak isn't putting overhead catenary from 125th street to Penn station for the whole duration of the Empire access tunnel to Penn. They could then do away with the battery model alltogether, and once at Penn, the train would remain powered instead of needing to be plugged in. (and if batteries are dead, that train will block a platform, unable to make it to sunnyside). And it will have to move the heavy batteries as deadweight for the vast majority of the trip while only using them for the first/last few minutes in/out of Penn.
Dude I seriously love the train. It's gonna be sweet to ride that one.i wish amtrak will get it together and make it the awesome way to travel again.
I didn't know there was an Acela taken out of service for parts. Is there a source where I could read more about that?
I'm excited for the Airo train sets! If they're successful, I'm interested to see if Amtrak replaces all of their single level coaches with Venture cars.
Just search for "OIG Amtrak Acela", you'll find the documents
10:20 whats also great about these electric hybrids is within the next 10 years hopefully, GO transit will be electrifying their corridor which will allow amtrak to use this electric section for its final/beginning section of the trip on the maple leaf.
I also hope that Amtrak uses some HHPCs on the Empire Corridor as well with the P32AC-DM on the Other end, so they can beta test running the current Amfleet trains on the EC with Push-Pull Cab Cars, since that's what the Airo Trainsets will have on the other end as well.
The battery idea is stupid though. Just add 3rd rail dual mode to the locomotives on those routes, save the space and weight of batteries, and eliminate the fire risk of having a car full of Lithium Ion batteries. 3rd rail dual mode chargers are already on order to replace the P32 dual modes used by Metro North and the EMD dual modes (which are notoriously unreliable) used by LIRR.
No thanks 90mph or better over grade crossings nah not in a cab car. I will take a tired, worn-out dual mode any day of the week.
I wish they could just electrify the Empire Corridor. Wouldn’t need dual-mode locomotives then.
@DiamondKingStudios NYS is broke, NIMBYS are not going to have their view of the river destroyed by catenary. Plus the if you could the pile of $$$$ needed you wold need the space shuttle to fly over.
@@theknickerbocker5808 What about 3rd Rail?
This is GREAT news. Thank you for sharing ! !
We'll waiting for Big Year Amtrak 2024😮
Well that didn't work.
Thank you for the news! Appreciate the info
With expansion and long haul routes there should be a Birmingham to DC route called the The Freedom Rider to commemorate the freedom rides.
Awesome video. I was using the maple leaf recently and that train set felt old school, can't wait until they are replaced with that new one you mentioned!
I'd like to try Amtrak, but why is their website so difficult to use in making reservations? Ancient
With regards to the original Acela Express trainset, there are a lot of comments along the lines of "20 years does not seem too old for those cars to retire". However, there are tons of reasons why Amtrak does want to retire the fleet.
1. The trainset was truly a unique/hybrid design. It was built by Alstom and Bombardier and basically is one of its kind. That meant there was not a lot of spares to come around, (only 20 trainsets were ever built) which made maintenance an expensive endeavor. (there were 44 X 2000 trainsets built and more than 110 SNCF TGV "Sud-Est" built by comparison).
2. FRA regulation meant train cars in the US have to be super heavy. While the TGV "Sud-Est" train weigh around 385 tons, the Acela Express trainset weight around 617 tons (nearly double). Being so heavy meant extra wear and tear across the equipment.
3. Lastly, the original Acela Express trainset was fixed which meant as capacity surged, Amtrak could not "add" more cars to service increased demand. The original 6 coaches layout is small compared to most high-speed trains layouts (8 coaches in most trainsets).
Without trying to get too political, Biden has been easily the most involved president when it comes to Amtrak and I sincerely hope we don’t get a government next year that slashes all this new funding. I don’t think anyone’s running against it, but it does seem like low hanging fruit for anyone wanting a cheap win. But this is so important, im glad Amtrak have bucked the trend of American rail systems buying trains that look and feel 20 years old off the shelf. (Looking at you Chicago L and Boston T)
Say what you want about how the L looks ..but between that and Metra, Chicagoland has the best commuter rail service in the Midwest and one of the best in the country.
@@zinc9166 oh yeah it’s good for sure. I just think the psychological value of good looking trains is really high. Kids get excited about modern trains and might poke their parents to take it more often, and new looking trains are a visual representation of improvements to the system
@@chrisorr8601 you're not wrong. But something about the L just matches the aesthetic of Chicago to me lol. It would almost look weird to have fancy modern trains moving around on the rusted, graffitied, grimy structures. They could light them all up like the Christmas train though that would be a vibe haha.
I will absolutely hate to see the P42s go away. They are such an iconic locomotive for amtrak. Then again so we're the f40Phs. And I kinda got used to the p42s until enough time passed and they were the norm.
My first time being inside a locomotive was an old f40ph running the "three rivers" amtrak train. Which was the now disappeared Chicago to new York via Pittsburgh train. It was the so damn loud inside even at idle. Little did I know less than 10 years later I would be working for norfolk southern as a locomotive electrician and would be on locomotives much founder throat-ier and shakier than those f40s
I don't see why they want desiel power on the NER. It won't ever be used but costs more and wastes what could have been extra seating. Why not just get emu cab cars and call it a day there.
Plus low key I hope they leave some of the current sets in service I've been seeing most of the NERs full
My understanding is for routes that start on the corridor but terminate at a destination that is not electrified (and won’t be anytime soon) like Richmond or Pittsburgh.
The newer Charger locomotives has cabs that sit lower than the Genesis engines. A big plus when it comes to going through the tunnels on the Lakeshore Limited and several other of the routes that runs from Chicago to the northeast portion of the US.
As long as you push the engine and get the turbo spun up, the Chargers spit out their engine cylinders.
I still wonder why the acelas already need to be replaced when in other countries highspeed trains are used for 30-40 years. Were they maintained badly or is it because of track/environmental conditions? Or is it just cheaper to scrap and replace them instead of overhauling them to use them for another 20 years?
One, the tracks on the NEC are horrible. Two, the Acela train sets are heavier than your average HSR train due to FRA requirements. Three, the Acela is specifically built for America, so not a lot of off the shelf parts. Amtrak is currently addressing the first issue, while the new Avelia Liberty sets are supposed to address the second and third.
20-25 years is about the service life of a HST. The 200 series TGV that the Acela is loosely based off of is also nearing the end of its service life and is about the same age. Newer HST designs are dramatically more energy efficient, which justifies not refurbishing the older ones. Remember HSTs use a LOT more energy than a normal electric train.
@@mrvwbug4423 No, HSTs can go well into their 30s. The german ICE1s are already in service longer than that and it is not planned to get rid of them anytime soon, the famous british IC125/HST is over 40 years old and is/was until recently still in use. The first japanese Shinkansen were in use for 3 or 4 decades too I think, though I dont have the concrete numbers right now.
@@dynasty0019 The replacement part Issue seems to be the biggest reason and I wonder how that wasnt foreseen 20 years ago. Well, at least they seem to have learned from it...
Sam - have you heard anything about the equipment proposed for use in new services? Living in the NYC area, I'm particularly interested in what they're proposing for the Scranton, PA - NYC and Ronkonkoma, NY - NYC routes as discussed in Amtrak connectsUS. Would it be practical to run "shuttles" between Scranton and Ronkonkoma?
No official word on the equipment for new routes yet, however this order allows for additional trains to be ordered, likely for these services
I think once Amtrak's older engines and cars some of them should be preserved at museums to remember their history
Costs over a thousand per person to go from Seattle to Denver I can fly a private jet for that cost so until they become more reasonable price wise I guess I have to fly although I would rather go by rail. I was in Norway and they have a great rail system and you can travel at a fraction of the cost of the US. same with Japan.
When will the next rebuilt MBTA locomotives be back? Different subject but I was hoping you'd know.
It's amazing that Amtrak is working to get some modern trains, although it's a shame that it seems to be focused on the east. Not entirely its fault, since as I've understood it, any line amtrak itself doesn't own is held up for hours by cargo freight illegally holding things up with their too-long trains. Hopefully we can get some progress on that front, too!
Right, it's just easier for progress to happen in the east since Amtrak owns the Northeast Corridor.
The nec really gets up to speed between DC and New York
With the normal regionals sure. The longest sections of 150mph track for the Acela are between New Haven and Boston where most of the line except around Providence is 150mph rated. And remember only 56 miles of the entire NEC is rated at 150mph.
@@mrvwbug4423that will change when the upgrades sre done to the New Brunswick-Trenton section, but even then that's still not a lot. Brutally honestly I'm not expecting more than 50% of 150+ within the century
@@THEFINALHAZARDit's better than nothing at least
When I was in the US in 2022, I was riding with an Amtrak train three times (Boston - New York, New York - Philly and Philly Washington) and it was always a pleasure.
But yes, the Acela is also the flag ship of Amtrak and thus way better than the average, which is unknown to me.
Japan is the only country which served me a bit better.
But compared to my home country...way better.
And even overall (like I said, I know only the Acela), the US railway system is ranked slightly higher than the one of Germany.
Switzerland and Japan are the two top countries in this regard, but I know only the Japanses railway system. I've never been to Switzerland.
The only time I rode Amtrak was the California Zephyr. One of the longer routes Amtrak runs. The ride was incredible but that is me comparing it to airplane and auto travel. It had a smoother ride, tons of legroom, and you can walk around. While you can walk around on an airplane it is only when allowed and sometimes turbulence can make it challenging.
You forgot about the new corridors/routes announced in the Corridor ID program but im guessing that's your next video?
I’m moving to the DC area next year or so, so I’m very excited for the future of rail transport that will be available to me.
No short or long term program to replace or rebuild the Dash 8-32BWH ?
The thick foliage and intertwined vines made the hike nearly impossible.
Wonder of some npcus and genesis units will get preserved
I expect that at least a few get preserved, along with some sold into Mexico, as they are buying up used passenger trains from all over (such as some used HST 125s from the UK) to start up new services.
The going of the Genesis locos will be bittersweet for me, although I'll never see another Genesis, the locomotive I always used to identify a passenger train in my kid drawings, I'll get to ride Railjet-based trainsets! It's sad to see the Genesis locos go, but I can't wait to see what the future holds!
I don’t remember but how many Amtrak Avelia train has been delivered to Amtrak?
Last was a rider on Amtrak, Went me and sister Dot rode on one to go back home with her in Brooklyn ,NY R.I.P Dot
I hope they keep some p42s as cab cars, i couldnt help but feel kinda cool when i would climb in the cab and it was dark and the window was short and wide, felt like i was in a stealth bomber or something.
and then when they would power test them, i could feel the full throttle exhaust rumble my lungs as i walked by.
In other words.......proposed projects, some in motion, nothing set in stone. Got it
Most of this probably won't happen in 2024, unfortunately when it comes to mechanical equipment, more electronic can mean more problems, which is what these new locomotives and trainsets seem to be suffering from. But hey, a 55 year old legacy is something that Budd can be proud of (and probably something that can't be replicated).
Having high speed rail across US would be so fascinating. Its the perfect country for it but its so massive that it’s hard to implement
Can you explain to me why Amtrak is buying ALC-42 Locomotives along side Amtrak Miro trainsets?
Why not just buy all Amtrak Miro trainsets? Is the plan for ALC-42's to be used with the Amfleet II cars that will still be in service after the Miro trainsets replaced the Amfleet I cars? I am confused.
Airo is for NEC & electrified corridors in the east. The ALC-42's are for the long-distance overnight trains out west, outside of the NEC & electrified corridors in the east.
@@DominikW118 Thanks for the info.
@@DominikW118kinda. Regional services more so for Airo. Most of the routes the Airo is going to be serving aren't electrified South of DC, or in the case of one of their flagship routed like the Cascades, are unelectrified completely.
@@THEFINALHAZARD Yeah, I remembered watching the video. But it is mainly the east coast plus Cascades.
@@DominikW118they want to eliminate DC switching from Electric to Diesel engines what add 30 minutes at least on all schedules running past DC to South, regional corridor or long distance!!!
the MBTA should really buy some original Acelas and ACS64’s once Amtrak retires them from their fleet. Could certainly help the MBTA commuter rail become more eco-friendly.
Really sad to see the ACS-64 go before it's time, especially on the Keystone.
They're not really going anywhere from the NEC though. Amtrak will just transfer them to the other railroads on the NEC. This way both Amtrak and the local railroads are getting a traction power update. Amtrak gets to standardize fleet-wide on a proven locomotive and the local railroads get a solid upgrade to a locomotive still within its prime.
I don't see this as a bad thing at all. Pretty much everybody wins from this, but most importantly the riders.
I like riding the train cross country, but we just don't have access. If the government wants to get people on public transportation, they are going to have to make it usable. I don't need high speed. I need better scheduling and access. I like to ride from Abilene tx. To Dallas Tx. and Fresno CA.
I get that trains need replacements sometime, but i don't understand why this is so soon in the us. For example, here in sweden, SJ is renovating the x2000, one of the trains that went to America before the acela, to at least be used for 20 more years. Why do American trains need replacement so early?
Thanx for the great video. I'm really going to miss the lazy beat of the GE P42s as they pull out of the likes of Texarkana when they go out of service. I hope some get to go to museums.
I wonder if any kind of rebuild program has been considered for the P42s, similar to the AC44C6Ms.
They both use a 7fdl engine right? If so then it could be entirely possible
@@darryldworak6356the P42 and ALC42? No, they don't. The charger series use Cummins QSK95 prime movers. It's extremely unlikely that the P42s will get a rebuild short of in a museum
@@THEFINALHAZARD no the P42s and the ac44c6ms. Former AC44CW/Dash-9s
@@darryldworak6356oh!!! Then yeah, they still use the 7FDL16
I wonder if/when Amtrak will start making changes to its existing system throughout Oklahoma and Texas. We have 2 trains that run through the states, being the Amtrak Heartland flyer (consisting of 2 P42 on each end of a 2-3 car train of superliners, and the Texas Eagle, which is just a P42 on the lead of 4 superliner coaches. There is huge public and governmental support for extensions of service and equipment enhancements, but we’ve yet to see any change at all. Perhaps we’re just gonna have to wait for the scraps of the new developments on either coast to trickle down to our neck of the woods that could really use some quality transportation infrastructure
Just do what France does and build better tracks. This makes it so your rolling stock doesn’t have to be as advanced.
That requires even more money, and strong anti-NIMBY laws. CAHSR is having to pay out billions per mile in NIMBY settlements.
@@mrvwbug4423 agree, but one can dream.
Just buy out the physical infrastructure from all of the Class 1 railroads. It can't be that expensive 🙄.
@@ferky123Probably just $1-10 trillion.
Nice video! Appreciate the information 👍🏽👍🏽
I'm 77. I have taken the auto train for 12 years. I'll be shocked if in my lifetime I'll see any of these improvements. I'm finished with amtrak.
Auto Train is honestly the most innocent of Amtrak’s routes. It’s the most profitable outside of the Northeast Corridor and the Superliners are just a nice way to relax, look at the views, and wake up in the morning close to your destination. If you’re looking for upgrades to the Auto Train though, Chargers will be testing on the route soon which, if successful, will allow more passenger cars to be powered and ran on a single train (Chargers have more HEP), and May 17th is the bid deadline for manufacturers to propose for Amtrak’s long distance equipment.
5:28 That's Chicago Amtrak main tracks and yard I worked (1993 $11.00 per hour)there it was miserable ,hahaha
I don't understand why you said that 2024 is gonna be an important year if everything except new acela, is gonna happen after 2025🤔
I’m assuming the election can affect funding. Depending on whose elected, money could be taken away before the ink dries.
@@miked853 Ahh, oky thanks, I'm from Spain so I didn't know that 👌
@@miked853The fed funding is safe regardless of politics.
I'm glad Amtrak is finally taking steps to modernize, but I actually like the classic look of their current locomotives and rolling stock. I hope at least some of them will find second careers instead of simply being scrapped wholesale.
0:06 you forgot to mention the corruption.
2:58 Oh the irony to see a modern efficient but unreliable European high speed trainset, being towed at walking pace by a nearly bulletproof 60 year old Alco...
French* train: Siemens, Stadler and even smaller manufacturers like Softronic are way better than that sh*t...
Why just take the Siemens trains (Loco and cars) number of cars (9,10,11… as many as needed/possible), put an adequate furnishing in and make them the new ACCELA? Reliable, AVAILABLE (now/very soon).
The tilting technology is essential for high speed operation, especially in the NEC. Also the ALC-42 is going to struggle with 8 cars at 125mph, it has literally half the power of the ACS-64, unless they can design it to run significantly higher power output when AC power is available. If you want a comparison. ALC-42 has 4200hp on diesel, unknown on AC electric. ACS-64 has 8600hp, maintains 125mph with ease. Current gen Acela has 12,400hp (6200hp x2 power cars), easily maintains 150mph and gets there quickly (Acela is actually known for having very quick acceleration for a HST). If you want an example of a charger being used at 125mph, Brightline runs 2x 4000hp Chargers with only 4 cars, they use both to get up to speed then usually idle the 2nd locomotive (or just have it running HEP) once up to speed.
Tilt is important, ok, didn‘t know that. Troublesome tho. But the elec. Siemens does 125mph. Isnt that good enough? Acela is all electric, so I‘m talking only about elec Siemens.
@@mrvwbug4423ALC-42 will be never run at 125, Q where??? 79 maximum 90 mph (Southwest Chief between Flagstaff and Albuquerque) that's it. 79 mph will stay for most routes in generation to come, problem is to have agreement with Host railroads to make them modify PRS schedule to allow priority for Amtrak train and introduce a mandate (maybe through government compensation) for keeping all trackage Amtrak currently use at least upgraded to 79 mph, in fact many have only 59 mph. Also quick acceleration, remove curves, straightening tracks, reduce grade crossing even with speed of 79 mph maximum, will slush several hours or more on each route Amtrak currently use. Now average speed according to most schedules are just about 50-55 mph, what's if will be at least 60 mph, then trains from Florida Orlando for example to DC will be in 13-14 runs, if that feels slow, than compare this with most Nightjets in Europe, they barely have average speed on schedules exceeding 90 km per hour!!! Remember we still use MPH that's 1.6 km per hour conversion!!!
So I think 79 mph is ok and if most time of route train will maintain that speed over 70 mph and use higher platforms, Amtrak currently upgrading on many station of busiest routes on East Coast, we will see faster trains at still current 79 mph speed limit, with more regulated by FRA Host Railroad PRS, what's currently making Havoc on Amtrak trains used to be delays on schedule over 45 minutes (then it's on mercy to Host railroad to let it squeeze between PRS trains, if FRA compensate them for that, this will be priority for all Amtrak trains 24/7, on schedule or not!!! Funny that nobody yet mention this in comments, but this a reason a main reason now why Amtrak train travels often delays for hours, and use less and less priority over freight trains!!! Because of Implementation of Precision Railroading Schedules by Big 7 Club in 2018 to now!!! Amtrak trains currently like "let's run my kids to school in your car and I pay $1 for that ride, no matter how long it's takes and how much gasoline you used", this exactly Amtrak now in PRS running Big 7 Club.
PRS is must have for Big 7 Club both for profiles, big revenue and overall their customers satisfaction, because they scheduling cargos delivery at precisely manner, very very predictable timing except Act of Gods, weather etc, but Amtrak is now a some obstacle for that too, if demanding what's everywhere else in the World mandated priorities over freigh trains sharing same tracks!!! Also while passing siding it's great for single track route, it will be problem if Amtrak intensified their trains for more trains running same tracks, also local communities who worried about overall safety and train horn speed, some regulated by outdated obsolete laws of time of Steam era... some just want raised bridges most of the time for their yachts... I think it's time to tax the rich, what's in 99% other capitalist country is mandatory now, but US!!! While many crying, the rich taxed higher in any country globally except US, rich pay for their luxury toys more anywhere in the World, but US, it's about a time to be make them not to convert into new aristocracy, we are not peasants for them, we are free citizens, they must stop used loopholes and pay fair taxes, so they may feel expensive for any extravaganza like running their yachts anytime they like and closing railroad bridge for that!!! 10% must be pay more taxes than 90% because they have earned more than 90%, and their combined wealth is more than those in 90% group, WE ARE NO Longer Peasants for Them, since 1776/1789!!! Then all benefits with faster train rides, also start educate children in all schools, private or public for Railroad safety, then we see less car train accidents on crossings, and less trespass along tracks, when they are in school and when they grown up, this must be mandate!!! Also anywhere doing, but US!!!
A curious question I've had for a long time but never heard an explanation for: Why are US passenger trains retired while so young? Here in Sweden the planned lifespan of the trains is ~50 years old, ex X2000 is undergoing a major revison now at 30. Why is it that the genesis locomotives are being completely retired at only 30? Aren't they still quite reliable? Is it harder emissions standards?
There is a vast difference in country sizes while running a train across Sweden versus the United States. Sweden is about 6 percent larger than the state of California in the U.S. Amtrak equipment in the U.S. takes a beating and some trains take two days to reach their destination. Inspection intervals are much farther and a single train may run 48 hours before servicing. There is just a lot more wear and tear put on the equipment. I hope this helps!
Take Care,
Tom
Always the case with greater methods of transportation where car-centric politicians will cut funding, the services will decline in quality, and car lobbyists will say "look at how much better cars are."
The US has long since needed overhauls in so many areas of transportation, and hopefully this can be the start of something better arising from the rubble.
I have the same fondness as anyone for the equipment that has always been there, but what's to come sure knows how to look good (after the many problems are fixed, of course).
It depends on the person. Some people prefer cars, some prefer trains. The difference is car lovers dont hate trains, but its not true the other way around
Use what transit you like without bashing the other.