1:20 and 3:14 you can see the difference. The pump on the left has the larger fill for the internal grease for the bearing, part of the 2007 redesign, 2006 has the little grease fill. These are plugged after grease is installed. The advance pump is for a 2007-2010 2.7. Chrysler changed the water pump 3 times on these engines. 1998-2001, 2002-2006 and 2007-2010.
I ran into the same problem on a 2006/7 Chrysler 300. There are two things you have to watch for on these. One is the chain design, there were two different pitches used. On 06/24/2006 they went from a coarse to fine pitched chain. Mine was made 06/28/2006. So, I learned that the hard way. As I can see the two pumps you have with matching thicknesses are visually different chain sprockets. One is coarse pitch, the original, and the new one is fine pitch. Next, as you pointed out, is the water pump design thickness. This was to fix several issues. One was bearing failures. So, they installed a larger bearing requiring a thicker pump housing. The other was gasket failures/delamination of the aluminum/silicone composite design. So, they changed the gasket design to an old reliable paper style gasket with integrated/coated silicone gasket coating. This allowed for a thinner gasket which helped the thicker water pump design out. So, between the two upgrades, it changed the installed height parameters which effects the front cover. For all this to work you have to use all the right components for everything to work. Nowadays, 2022, only the new redesign is an option most likely at a parts store. Online though both options are still floating around. With the new pump design, you have to use the new thinner water pump gasket. You can't use the new pump with an aluminum/silicone gasket. You'll be too thick and the front cover will have a huge gap between it and the block. Ask me how I know. Took me awhile to figure this out. So, when buying a water pump, the chain pitch had to be right, and the water pump design and gasket have to match. Looking at RockAuto both pumps and chain pitch designs and gaskets are available. Lord only knows what combination you might get. Visually, the pumps look the same to my knowledge. Unless you put calipers on them, you won't know which one you have. If you go this route, I'd buy both gaskets to make sure you get the right one matched to whatever pump you end up with. That or buy local so you can do a quick swap if needed. Before timing this thing up, lightly install the water pump and gasket. Then install the front cover and gasket. This will save a lot of time and hassle to verify you have the right parts before timing everything up. The front cover should fit pretty much flush to the gasket. If theres a gap about the thickness of cereal box cardboard/gasket thickness, you have the wrong combination.
Beautiful Dr O! You have to love aftermarket crap! People that make these parts have never held the OEM pump in their hands,not to think they would know what CAD is...
I have that same engine in my Dodge Magnum and had now over 230.000 miles on it when I had to take it apart because of a blown head gasket. I changed out the water pump and working right now towards the oilpump as well. But had zero problems with it. Running it on full synthetic amsoil 0W-20 here in Florida for most of the years and zero problem I have a video series about the head gasket products and put all my work I done to the car online so for who ever is interested can watch it.
Thanks man. Good info. My 2002 Dodge Stratus SE 2.7 l may need a new water pump. Going to try to do a thermostat housing and thermostat. Will check for leakage from the weep hole.
Yep... I got one in a 2000 intrepid/their stupid money lovin' design...... thanks EO ... long time sub....... Jon O @ Idaho ... when clickin' around ... I see YOU... I stop in.. ty
This just happened to my 01 Sebring last night. I'm devastated lol. It has around 60,000 ish miles (not exactly sure since my dash burnt out, NO BUS issue). Really deciding if it's worth it to fix this, but the used car prices are ridiculous right now. Probably will be taking a small loan out to have it done 😂
I'm a Mopar guy...and the less said about this turd of an engine the better. Where it really gives trouble is in the 98-2001 LH cars. A combination of an even worse pump design and inevitable high RPM operation caused by placing this engine in a huge car leads to some truly spectacular failures. The sad thing is that this engine ruined the reputation of what is actually decent car. The Concorde LXi and Intrepid ES from the same year range with the 3.2 (and the LHS, 300M and Intrepid R/T with the nearly identical 3.5L) are nearly bulletproof save for solenoid packs in the transaxle and some weak spots in the cooling system (heater crossover tube corrosion and O-ring failure, coolant bottle cracks, etc). As for the infamous 42LE solenoid pack, replace it with a new Mopar one. It's the only way to ensure that you'll get the redesigned part that doesn't fail often. Oh and the Mopar thermostat on the 3.2/3.5 engines is of a unique design. The aftermarket ones have a smaller orifice which leads to wider temp fluctuations that will crack radiator end tanks in due time. I currently have 265K on my 2004 300M Special with the original powertrain. It still passes smog without any funny business too. Besides the aforementioned cooling issues and a solenoid pack, the only other non maintenance items I've done are a new PCM, a new trip computer, a new mirror switch, a new high side line in the A/C and an aftermarket trans cooler to help the trans live longer down here in the Texas heat.
I bought the parts for my 2006 sebring sedan and after watching your video i took the new pump and i measured it lucky, 0.482. but i know that some water pump for the 2.7l uses different type of gasket like the black one made of gasket paper or the like. i wonder if the thickness of this gasket is sufficient to allow the cover to fit or the pump could be too far in and miss aligned with the timing chain. It would be nice if you could dig that
Well I did run into this problem today but I didn't know until it was to late. I started all the 10mm's first before I did the 15mm big bolt's after I tightened all the 10mm's it all seemed fine until I did the 15mm's when I zipped them in I heard a loud pope & the cover didn't crack so holly shit right? Now tomorrow I will break it all back down to see what the hell the big pop was !!! Note; The bigger thickness in the pump also throw's off the guides but that was easy to fix with a grinder. If I would off checked it like you did I would of did the same to the stud guard's on the timing cover.. Oh well !!! Wish me luck, Thank's & that's a great video... By; pust76 P.S. I used air tool's, nobody need's to do that on this job LoL !!!
I have customer .... that put new water pump and put back everything then crank it up it snap supposedly but it bent the valve and said about timing chains or wanted pump is too small or too big
you have to be careful buying parts at advance auto, i dont buy airtex, or tough one, wearever brakes, exact spark plug wires, the last wearever pads i put on lasted 12000 miles. all these from advance are junk. just make sure you keep your receipt because they only keep record of your purchase at the store where you purchased the item, once the memory is full in there system all the data is dumped and deleted. lifetime warranty parts from advance is a joke. advance auto is 7miles from my house and autozone or oreilys is 16 miles away so its sometimes worth the extra drive to get a good warranty and parts
Man that sucks, all that work for nothing, hard to believe .080 extra thickness would make that not fit- Since the pump body is 080 thicker does that also mean the chain would be running at a slight angle? Maybe you should try to get dealer parts? I know they are much more expensive but maybe worth the extra for a customer
Advance Auto is now selling Carquest parts because of their buyout. I wonder if they are better. I have had various issues with ToughOne alternators and starters. Warranty them off with the Carquest equivalent and all is well.....hmmm......still from CHINA, though.
Really. There are really no other alternatives then. At least Advance has the 40% off $100 coupon for online orders which makes their load easier to swallow.
LEX Maximaguy87 How do they get a rebuild wrong? Alternators that produce a charge light after less than a year and starters that keep starting after turning the key back. Repeat problems with the same garbage.
+Blaine Bugaski lack of quality control..plus the parts are dumped into the same bin. so u get mix matched parts or parts that barely pass spec. the ones they rebuild for car manufactures are alot better.
You should have machined down the timing cover slightly so it would fit. Unfortunately, parts hangers like you don't have the required engineering skills to complete work like this.
I know that the 3rd party parts can be hit and miss at times, but man Chrysler designed a stupid engine, I mean waterpump driven by a timing chain, when is that ever a good idea,the moment the water pump starts leaking you get water in the oil.
1:20 and 3:14 you can see the difference. The pump on the left has the larger fill for the internal grease for the bearing, part of the 2007 redesign, 2006 has the little grease fill. These are plugged after grease is installed. The advance pump is for a 2007-2010 2.7. Chrysler changed the water pump 3 times on these engines. 1998-2001, 2002-2006 and 2007-2010.
I ran into the same problem on a 2006/7 Chrysler 300. There are two things you have to watch for on these.
One is the chain design, there were two different pitches used. On 06/24/2006 they went from a coarse to fine pitched chain. Mine was made 06/28/2006. So, I learned that the hard way. As I can see the two pumps you have with matching thicknesses are visually different chain sprockets. One is coarse pitch, the original, and the new one is fine pitch.
Next, as you pointed out, is the water pump design thickness. This was to fix several issues. One was bearing failures. So, they installed a larger bearing requiring a thicker pump housing. The other was gasket failures/delamination of the aluminum/silicone composite design. So, they changed the gasket design to an old reliable paper style gasket with integrated/coated silicone gasket coating. This allowed for a thinner gasket which helped the thicker water pump design out. So, between the two upgrades, it changed the installed height parameters which effects the front cover.
For all this to work you have to use all the right components for everything to work. Nowadays, 2022, only the new redesign is an option most likely at a parts store. Online though both options are still floating around. With the new pump design, you have to use the new thinner water pump gasket. You can't use the new pump with an aluminum/silicone gasket. You'll be too thick and the front cover will have a huge gap between it and the block. Ask me how I know. Took me awhile to figure this out.
So, when buying a water pump, the chain pitch had to be right, and the water pump design and gasket have to match. Looking at RockAuto both pumps and chain pitch designs and gaskets are available. Lord only knows what combination you might get. Visually, the pumps look the same to my knowledge. Unless you put calipers on them, you won't know which one you have. If you go this route, I'd buy both gaskets to make sure you get the right one matched to whatever pump you end up with. That or buy local so you can do a quick swap if needed.
Before timing this thing up, lightly install the water pump and gasket. Then install the front cover and gasket. This will save a lot of time and hassle to verify you have the right parts before timing everything up. The front cover should fit pretty much flush to the gasket. If theres a gap about the thickness of cereal box cardboard/gasket thickness, you have the wrong combination.
The Doctor is in da house!
You were handling it very well I would have been super pissed
Beautiful Dr O! You have to love aftermarket crap! People that make these parts have never held the OEM pump in their hands,not to think they would know what CAD is...
Nick Nicu Who needs all that when you can just guess :)
I have that same engine in my Dodge Magnum and had now over 230.000 miles on it when I had to take it apart because of a blown head gasket. I changed out the water pump and working right now towards the oilpump as well. But had zero problems with it. Running it on full synthetic amsoil 0W-20 here in Florida for most of the years and zero problem I have a video series about the head gasket products and put all my work I done to the car online so for who ever is interested can watch it.
I watched your 3 part video on changing the head gasket. Good video. Thanks.
I'd have been through the roof with that one! Wow, I guess it pays to measure everything. Thanks for the video.
oldie with a young Mr. O ! :D
Another one great video Dr.O🔧🔧
You gotta do the Dr O thing again ❤️
thanks on the bearing info for the hub tamer works all most effortless
Thanks man. Good info. My 2002 Dodge Stratus SE 2.7 l may need a new water pump. Going to try to do a thermostat housing and thermostat. Will check for leakage from the weep hole.
Thanks for the save!👍
Geez. Just put a gates pump in mine and just seen this I hope it’s the same as the old one 😬
That first part wouldve turned into a custom hand crafted model real quick 😂
Yep... I got one in a 2000 intrepid/their stupid money lovin' design...... thanks EO ... long time sub....... Jon O @ Idaho ... when clickin' around ... I see YOU... I stop in.. ty
This just happened to my 01 Sebring last night. I'm devastated lol. It has around 60,000 ish miles (not exactly sure since my dash burnt out, NO BUS issue). Really deciding if it's worth it to fix this, but the used car prices are ridiculous right now. Probably will be taking a small loan out to have it done 😂
thank u for your advise on this car water pump,
Thanks for the heads up.
The 'port' at the bottom is bigger/thicker too.(might not be a major concern)
I hate dealing with aftermarket parts,for these sorts of reasons. JUNK!
PhattyMo Amen!
Is this when you started trying Dorman?
awesome.. thanks for sharing
Keith Krueger YW
Great job and video
I'm a Mopar guy...and the less said about this turd of an engine the better. Where it really gives trouble is in the 98-2001 LH cars. A combination of an even worse pump design and inevitable high RPM operation caused by placing this engine in a huge car leads to some truly spectacular failures.
The sad thing is that this engine ruined the reputation of what is actually decent car. The Concorde LXi and Intrepid ES from the same year range with the 3.2 (and the LHS, 300M and Intrepid R/T with the nearly identical 3.5L) are nearly bulletproof save for solenoid packs in the transaxle and some weak spots in the cooling system (heater crossover tube corrosion and O-ring failure, coolant bottle cracks, etc). As for the infamous 42LE solenoid pack, replace it with a new Mopar one. It's the only way to ensure that you'll get the redesigned part that doesn't fail often. Oh and the Mopar thermostat on the 3.2/3.5 engines is of a unique design. The aftermarket ones have a smaller orifice which leads to wider temp fluctuations that will crack radiator end tanks in due time.
I currently have 265K on my 2004 300M Special with the original powertrain. It still passes smog without any funny business too. Besides the aforementioned cooling issues and a solenoid pack, the only other non maintenance items I've done are a new PCM, a new trip computer, a new mirror switch, a new high side line in the A/C and an aftermarket trans cooler to help the trans live longer down here in the Texas heat.
ho,,man those are time consuming ,, fun to do so ,, good think you have a good eye,,,thanks for the tip,,oem always
I bought the parts for my 2006 sebring sedan and after watching your video i took the new pump and i measured it lucky, 0.482.
but i know that some water pump for the 2.7l uses different type of gasket like the black one made of gasket paper or the like.
i wonder if the thickness of this gasket is sufficient to allow the cover to fit or the pump could be too far in and miss aligned with the timing chain.
It would be nice if you could dig that
Well I did run into this problem today but I didn't know until it was to late. I started all the 10mm's first before I did the 15mm big bolt's after I tightened all the 10mm's it all seemed fine until I did the 15mm's when I zipped them in I heard a loud pope & the cover didn't crack so holly shit right? Now tomorrow I will break it all back down to see what the hell the big pop was !!! Note; The bigger thickness in the pump also throw's off the guides but that was easy to fix with a grinder. If I would off checked it like you did I would of did the same to the stud guard's on the timing cover.. Oh well !!! Wish me luck, Thank's & that's a great video... By; pust76
P.S. I used air tool's, nobody need's to do that on this job LoL !!!
The problem is, Advance Auto Parts. They sell nothing but sub-par junk for parts....too bad you don't have an independent parts distributor nearby.
Ima fan Being a DIYr, that’s good to know! Thanks!
Scott Yakoubian the problem is the Chrysler 2.7 lol
Thanks for that but the big problem is driving a water pump by the timing chain
I have customer .... that put new water pump and put back everything then crank it up it snap supposedly but it bent the valve and said about timing chains or wanted pump is too small or too big
thaxs
Hi Eric.
As a tech myself why would you install aftermarket junk, esp on a key timing component. not worth the risk esp for 50 dollars more for oem.
It is the same company that makes the aftermarket and the OEM I.E Chinese.
Have you done a water pump in a Ford 3.5/3.7 NA Duratec yet, Eric?
Easy to pessy
How did you take that cover off?
Leave it to Chrysler to run a water pump off the timing chain. Hopefully the water doesn't mix with oil when the pump leaks.
Nissan does it, GM does it, and Subaru does it. Makes the engine more compact.
KenLyns Mine didn't when it went out .
We took the ideal from Renault.
Why i don't check this video before, ? Now my timing chain cover is broken..
you have to be careful buying parts at advance auto, i dont buy airtex, or tough one, wearever brakes, exact spark plug wires, the last wearever pads i put on lasted 12000 miles. all these from advance are junk. just make sure you keep your receipt because they only keep record of your purchase at the store where you purchased the item, once the memory is full in there system all the data is dumped and deleted. lifetime warranty parts from advance is a joke. advance auto is 7miles from my house and autozone or oreilys is 16 miles away so its sometimes worth the extra drive to get a good warranty and parts
These types of fitment issues get me.
Dam! That sucks!
Man that sucks, all that work for nothing, hard to believe .080 extra thickness would make that not fit- Since the pump body is 080 thicker does that also mean the chain would be running at a slight angle?
Maybe you should try to get dealer parts? I know they are much more expensive but maybe worth the extra for a customer
jim dandy Yep it turned out good in the end :)
What's a job like that cost
1ooo I KNOW ASK MY POCKET
The pulleys are different the gear
Advance Auto is now selling Carquest parts because of their buyout. I wonder if they are better.
I have had various issues with ToughOne alternators and starters. Warranty them off with the Carquest equivalent and all is well.....hmmm......still from CHINA, though.
+Blaine Bugaski advance, carquest, both junk, advance goes from bad to worse haha
Really. There are really no other alternatives then. At least Advance has the 40% off $100 coupon for online orders which makes their load easier to swallow.
+Blaine Bugaski there are only 3 major reman suppliers. toughone is still either remy, worldwide, or BBB. so yes still the same junk.
LEX Maximaguy87 How do they get a rebuild wrong? Alternators that produce a charge light after less than a year and starters that keep starting after turning the key back. Repeat problems with the same garbage.
+Blaine Bugaski lack of quality control..plus the parts are dumped into the same bin. so u get mix matched parts or parts that barely pass spec. the ones they rebuild for car manufactures are alot better.
when it comes to (modern) Chrysler internals, unless it's from well known race engine parts mfg's, I stick with OEM ...
Eric says: "Repeat after me; Advance Auto and cheap Chinese junk parts."
You know what coming back here makes me kind of miss the old beat up hat.
You should have machined down the timing cover slightly so it would fit. Unfortunately, parts hangers like you don't have the required engineering skills to complete work like this.
Always hated that engine.... dumb design. I was having to do them before 30k miles.... dumb. Chain driven?? It's a maintenance item.
All the auto parts stores sell junk Chinese made parts, replace with oem parts
ok doctor
Yup,problem solved, stop buying parts at Advance Auto parts.
Damn advance auto 🙄
I know that the 3rd party parts can be hit and miss at times, but man Chrysler designed a stupid engine, I mean waterpump driven by a timing chain, when is that ever a good idea,the moment the water pump starts leaking you get water in the oil.
I guess all those reliable Japanese engines that run the water pump off the timing belt are dumb too
All that work for a water pump. Good old chrysler junk..
YEAH STUPID ASS DESIGN FOR SURE. TOOK ME 30 MIN TO REPLACE THE WATER PUMP ON MY BMW. MY CHRYSLER - FORGET IT.
A lot of cars run the water pump off the timing belt or chain