We've been using BTR cams for over 5 years. It's amazing how many people don't know how good they are! Great comparison video. Keep up the great work 👍
@@christianjones1559 I've ran a gmm v1 street racer as an apso deal sbe 6L for around 30k. Ran mint as a daily driver. Was showing around 530hp. Then fitted a F1a procharged setup & ran it for 20k. Made good power & good economy for the power. Then fitted a brutespeed blower cam which has done 80k now. Made more power with next to no difference in economy. Can't complain. Tried a custom grind centrifugal blower cam for abit. Went backwards.
This was a great video guys. You make some excellent content and its great to see some Aussies putting out these sorts of comparisons for the LS engines.
What about adding a set of CNC heads to the truck Norris so you could keep it reving in the top end without falling off, I feel like that would be the perfect mix
You could also put those same heads with the other cam and get the same gains too... The Truck Norris is geared towards a stout street engine or for towing with.
What about the 226/232 112 vs the torque master vs the btr stage 1 . 6 litre combos would be good to see overlays of the dyno runs on multiple cams people consider. Nice video.
You make some awesome content there guy, me and my son love Chevy old and new,for SPC we use comp cams & crower . On the beautiful ls engine it has been lovely companies and they are Btr ,Tsp and Lingenfelter is awesome also cam motion ,GPI. Depends on the application and driving style. They all make great products. Edelbrock!
Would love to see you do the comparison now with the stage 2 btr cam ls1 231/244 and what pushrods you use as a base idea for a build I’m thinking about doing
@@kevinobrien4155I don't believe the truck Norris will benefit from anything else other than a stall converter, because it doesn't make the top end power off of the bigger camshafts it's not going to benefit from any cylinder head work perhaps a little bit of compression but that's all I would do If I was pulling the heads off but I wouldn't go out of my way.
Thanks for yet another informative video. I ran the same crow cam 871247 in my ls1 & only made 227rwkw. My tuner put the lower than expected result down to exhaust size. Would you be able to do a video on how critical exhaust selection is on power results? A comparison between single 3” vs twin 2.5” vs twin 3” would be very interesting.
It's actually really not that critical our best results have all been on a twin 2.5" on the ls1 platform, something's majorly wrong with your combination for it to be that low
I am saving to upgrade my 6l daily driver. Richard holdener has covered this stuff but not in a chassis with losses. I just want to remove the dod but keep or improve economy. Hopefully can get a tune in with you once I do the work.
Are you still working on your Territory turbo I am just swapping to Haltech now after doing my time with pcmtec was great software but like paddling a canoe upstream with a toothpick my biggest issue was voltage at the alternator on alot if fords I work in they get a big fail in the pwm controller at the pcm when run 2 fuel pumps etc. It pulls your amps so spark drop Would like your opinion on this seems to be a common fault Again great videos Mike MJL Engineering Cairns
Do it you,you won't be disappointed, We have now decided that we are going to put the Chuck Norris back into this car with a converter and leave it at that, the lowdown torque is perfect for the street
Thanks for testing the stage 1 mate. Wanna see the stage 1 vs the btr red hot prob next best test i rekon red hot will gain 10kw at the wheels on top end over stage 1
I've just had a BTR stage 2 V 2 cam fitted to my VF LS3 if you want to use it for a dyno video comparison. Has difilippo 1 7/8 headers into twin 3 inch exhaust VCM OTR and BTR trunnion upgrade
That's actually a camshaft we would like to back-to-back with the BTR red hot If you are interested I might just take you up on that offer.@@bretthall7489
Just curious have you used a lunati camshaft ive got a vl walkinshaw replica with a 304 and the engine builder recommended a lunati stage 4 when he did all the machine work to it and considering i haven't seen much reviews on them so i thought id ask you also i love watching all your vids mate you explain everything very well thx again cheers
BTR also has the No Springs Required Truck Norris. Im debating between the regular and the NSR as springs add quite a bit to the cost. On a L98 what kind of diffrences can be expected?
Yeah I'm not sure if I would go to that extent personally the Springs are crap at the best of times. We haven't used one in a 6ltr yet but I would certainly love to if you're close to us we could work out a good deal
How would an old grind Comp Cam 222/224 .566 lift 114 compare with these other small cams in an ls1? This grind was popular in the LS community from 2006 onwards.
@@IndependentMotorsports ime running the truck norris great cam but on 3.73s would you think that low end torque would increase for that 4000rmp range cool video to love your work. The big nasty camshaft from summit try this on fairly new 218/232 same lift as the truck norris but on a 105 lobe sep.
LSA actually means nothing on its own. It's a byproduct of cam events. That's where the real details of what makes a cam work well for its intended application. Summit offer a free calculator on their website which is very helpful.
@@petergehle4222 Weird, my response seems to have disappeared. Maybe it didn't like my link. I'll try again. No, it's not totally wrong. Anyone that says that you define a cam by LSA is totally wrong. Don't listen to those people. LSA is just a number. As I said, a byproduct of cam / valve events. Ask those people who think it's all about LSA about early IVC or overlap and they have no idea. Cam designers do though. Valve events are what makes a cam work for its intended purpose. Don't take my word for it, search online. There's a good but old article on LS1tech named "why LSA doesn't matter". It touches on all of this.
@@jamestoby2552 mate I agree with some of your points but I have been building engines for thirty years and I have lots of proof that lobe separation definitely makes a huge difference. Obviously other things have a bearing on it ( compression heads etc). I don't just fall for a lot of salesmen bullshit. I test on engines but saying that I don't know it all and keep testing regularly
@@petergehle4222 That's fine, I'm not trying to argue and I can't tell you what to believe. I actually understand why you think it's LSA that decides these things. Many people do. But it's not right. It's solely controlled by valve events. For example, lumpy idle, that's not LSA like everyone says. That's overlap via chosen valve events. Speak to a Cam Designer/ Manufacturer and they'll tell you what I'm telling you. In fact, if you read that thread I mentioned, not only is the thread creator in that role, there's actually quite a few of those guys from other manufacturers posting. Trying to correct common misconceptions. I've found understanding this helps a lot with Cam choice. But everyone is entitled to their opinion.
wow cams are just numbers get those numbers right based on the engine you have in your car, not a different ls1, but your ls1, stock or not, its about what your engines heads are like the manifold runners and especially using the stock heads but making sure each of the angles for the lifter seats are perfectly seated then you can make sure the cam you pick is right, plain and simple, but at the same time Injectors ,spark plugs headers otr etc etc so many variables which will all be different to each stock ls1. 👍✌👌🦘 The way to check it out is use the same cam specs from different suppliers and then see if the hp figures are the same on a hub dyno plain and simple. To date i have not seen anyone do that, same engine same cams from diffrent suppliers and see if there's any difference in hp? I bet there is, not much 5+ or - HP at the rear wheels not much but if you're dragging the car or racing it thats a lot, even the oil will make hp? 👍👍🦘🦘
We've been using BTR cams for over 5 years. It's amazing how many people don't know how good they are! Great comparison video. Keep up the great work 👍
@@ACCELGarage Cheers mate same to you you guys are doing some good work yourselves.
@@IndependentMotorsports Appreciate it. Happy to share our experiences with any cams you havent tested 👍
What about the Brute speed cam?Do you know anything about it?Im tossing up between it and the btr stage 4.
@@christianjones1559
I've ran a gmm v1 street racer as an apso deal sbe 6L for around 30k. Ran mint as a daily driver. Was showing around 530hp.
Then fitted a F1a procharged setup & ran it for 20k.
Made good power & good economy for the power.
Then fitted a brutespeed blower cam which has done 80k now. Made more power with next to no difference in economy. Can't complain.
Tried a custom grind centrifugal blower cam for abit. Went backwards.
@@Motha-p3p do you know anything about btr stage 2 centrifugal charge cam?
Great video, great explanation, great stuff 👍
This was a great video guys. You make some excellent content and its great to see some Aussies putting out these sorts of comparisons for the LS engines.
Thanks mate, We have a lot more coming keep an eye on the channel
If I had an LS swapped 4WD, it would be the Truck Norris for sure!
But I am far beyond happy with the Redhot!
Great work Stathi and Team IMS. Nice shirt too 😊
What about adding a set of CNC heads to the truck Norris so you could keep it reving in the top end without falling off, I feel like that would be the perfect mix
I had this thought exactly
A set of TFS 215cc comp port heads would be the sh*t
You could also put those same heads with the other cam and get the same gains too...
The Truck Norris is geared towards a stout street engine or for towing with.
What about the 226/232 112 vs the torque master vs the btr stage 1 . 6 litre combos would be good to see overlays of the dyno runs on multiple cams people consider. Nice video.
You make some awesome content there guy, me and my son love Chevy old and new,for SPC we use comp cams & crower . On the beautiful ls engine it has been lovely companies and they are Btr ,Tsp and Lingenfelter is awesome also cam motion ,GPI. Depends on the application and driving style. They all make great products. Edelbrock!
Would love to see you do the comparison now with the stage 2 btr cam ls1 231/244 and what pushrods you use as a base idea for a build I’m thinking about doing
I run a crow cam 871250RH much more streetable then my vcm13 it had. I do miss the rowdyness of the vcm but 😍.
Great comparison!
Keep the N/A videos coming
Yeeeww been waiting for this one 👌🏾👌🏾
Next week we have a Stage 1 Vs Stage 2 BTR
@@IndependentMotorsports awesome can't wait , best motorsport channel by far , and nothing but facts and honesty , great work 👏
Loved video 👌🏾 , I'll be tuning in next week for the stage 1 stage 2 BTR
@@IndependentMotorsports what difference would some of these btr cams like the truck Norris Benefit from ported heads?
@@kevinobrien4155I don't believe the truck Norris will benefit from anything else other than a stall converter, because it doesn't make the top end power off of the bigger camshafts it's not going to benefit from any cylinder head work perhaps a little bit of compression but that's all I would do If I was pulling the heads off but I wouldn't go out of my way.
Thanks for yet another informative video.
I ran the same crow cam 871247 in my ls1 & only made 227rwkw. My tuner put the lower than expected result down to exhaust size. Would you be able to do a video on how critical exhaust selection is on power results? A comparison between single 3” vs twin 2.5” vs twin 3” would be very interesting.
It's actually really not that critical our best results have all been on a twin 2.5" on the ls1 platform, something's majorly wrong with your combination for it to be that low
Should test the BTR stage 3(what il be going with) but would like to know dyno numbers
I am saving to upgrade my 6l daily driver. Richard holdener has covered this stuff but not in a chassis with losses. I just want to remove the dod but keep or improve economy. Hopefully can get a tune in with you once I do the work.
@@Low760 you'll need to increase efficiency mechanically. Ideas on how you're going to do that?
For the price choppacobra down low and madd max for top end Texas speed pricing is awesome
Nice video thanks
Are you still working on your Territory turbo I am just swapping to Haltech now after doing my time with pcmtec was great software but like paddling a canoe upstream with a toothpick my biggest issue was voltage at the alternator on alot if fords I work in they get a big fail in the pwm controller at the pcm when run 2 fuel pumps etc. It pulls your amps so spark drop
Would like your opinion on this seems to be a common fault
Again great videos
Mike MJL Engineering Cairns
Ive got a street racer cam in my ss and have a truck norris cam in my garage....this video really makes me want yo do the cam swap.
Do it you,you won't be disappointed, We have now decided that we are going to put the Chuck Norris back into this car with a converter and leave it at that, the lowdown torque is perfect for the street
What was the idle speed and vacuum in kpa for the truck Norris cam ?
Would like to get your thoughts on the Crow cams 871212 for an LS1
That's a pretty big cam for the street. I run the slightly smaller 871249 and it's a beast
Thanks for testing the stage 1 mate. Wanna see the stage 1 vs the btr red hot prob next best test i rekon red hot will gain 10kw at the wheels on top end over stage 1
Cheers mate it's on our to do list
I've just had a BTR stage 2 V 2 cam fitted to my VF LS3 if you want to use it for a dyno video comparison. Has difilippo 1 7/8 headers into twin 3 inch exhaust VCM OTR and BTR trunnion upgrade
That's actually a camshaft we would like to back-to-back with the BTR red hot If you are interested I might just take you up on that offer.@@bretthall7489
Does anyone know where the Truck Norris Starts picking up Power?
Just curious have you used a lunati camshaft ive got a vl walkinshaw replica with a 304 and the engine builder recommended a lunati stage 4 when he did all the machine work to it and considering i haven't seen much reviews on them so i thought id ask you also i love watching all your vids mate you explain everything very well thx again cheers
Sorry we have not used that cam yet
BTR also has the No Springs Required Truck Norris. Im debating between the regular and the NSR as springs add quite a bit to the cost. On a L98 what kind of diffrences can be expected?
Yeah I'm not sure if I would go to that extent personally the Springs are crap at the best of times.
We haven't used one in a 6ltr yet but I would certainly love to if you're close to us we could work out a good deal
@@IndependentMotorsports unfortunately as much I would like working with you guys I’m in Saudi Arabia. Love the videos
Does that ls1 have 3 bolt or 1 bolt for the cam.
3 bolt
Was there plenty of vacuum for the brakes and stuff with the 207 LSA?
Engine vacuum is perfect 52kpa, Brakes work exactly as they do with the stock cam
How would an old grind Comp Cam 222/224 .566 lift 114 compare with these other small cams in an ls1? This grind was popular in the LS community from 2006 onwards.
Still a popular cam but the latest generation camshaft development is leap years in front.
How was driveability on the auto stock stall? Any push?
No problems
Review on the Crow cam 871212, 229/232 .611"/.614" 112LSA please!
Is good, pushed 292rwkw in my 6L ute.
Turns tyres no problem
Check out OnSong Performance, theyve done a few 871212 setups now
It's a good cam. I run the slightly smaller 871249 and love it
Btr ls3 stage 1 v2
So what camshaft would you recommend for a LS1 that will give you the biggest chop noise but still retain the stock stall?
Truck Norris is a clear winner
Truck norris looks like a good healthy powerband
Absolutely it's going to be my number one recommendation
What differential gearing is the car running
3.08
@@IndependentMotorsports ime running the truck norris great cam but on 3.73s would you think that low end torque would increase for that 4000rmp range cool video to love your work.
The big nasty camshaft from summit try this on fairly new 218/232 same lift as the truck norris but on a 105 lobe sep.
@@Justls1v8partsThe truck Norris makes excellent torque down low I think it would actually benefit more from a 3.4 ratio
We want to hear them
The video has the sound of both camshafts in it.
Someone didn't watch thwle whole video.
Truck Norris needs more lift to help top end power...I think.
why don't you try a Crow cam 871777 cam stock converter 226/236 .607/.617 113 apparently its their biggest selling cam
As time goes on we'll get all the cams tested
I call it the Warwick Armstrong Cam
What are these numbers in hp lol
2500-3750… 🥵
Lobe separation is where its at. Don't think much of btr cams.
LSA actually means nothing on its own. It's a byproduct of cam events. That's where the real details of what makes a cam work well for its intended application. Summit offer a free calculator on their website which is very helpful.
@@jamestoby2552 mate that is totally wrong. Part of the reason I don't like btr cams
@@petergehle4222 Weird, my response seems to have disappeared. Maybe it didn't like my link. I'll try again.
No, it's not totally wrong. Anyone that says that you define a cam by LSA is totally wrong. Don't listen to those people. LSA is just a number. As I said, a byproduct of cam / valve events. Ask those people who think it's all about LSA about early IVC or overlap and they have no idea. Cam designers do though. Valve events are what makes a cam work for its intended purpose.
Don't take my word for it, search online. There's a good but old article on LS1tech named "why LSA doesn't matter". It touches on all of this.
@@jamestoby2552 mate I agree with some of your points but I have been building engines for thirty years and I have lots of proof that lobe separation definitely makes a huge difference. Obviously other things have a bearing on it ( compression heads etc). I don't just fall for a lot of salesmen bullshit. I test on engines but saying that I don't know it all and keep testing regularly
@@petergehle4222 That's fine, I'm not trying to argue and I can't tell you what to believe. I actually understand why you think it's LSA that decides these things. Many people do. But it's not right. It's solely controlled by valve events. For example, lumpy idle, that's not LSA like everyone says. That's overlap via chosen valve events.
Speak to a Cam Designer/ Manufacturer and they'll tell you what I'm telling you. In fact, if you read that thread I mentioned, not only is the thread creator in that role, there's actually quite a few of those guys from other manufacturers posting. Trying to correct common misconceptions. I've found understanding this helps a lot with Cam choice. But everyone is entitled to their opinion.
wow cams are just numbers get those numbers right based on the engine you have in your car, not a different ls1, but your ls1, stock or not, its about what your engines heads are like the manifold runners and especially using the stock heads but making sure each of the angles for the lifter seats are perfectly seated then you can make sure the cam you pick is right, plain and simple, but at the same time Injectors ,spark plugs headers otr etc etc so many variables which will all be different to each stock ls1. 👍✌👌🦘
The way to check it out is use the same cam specs from different suppliers and then see if the hp figures are the same on a hub dyno plain and simple. To date i have not seen anyone do that, same engine same cams from diffrent suppliers and see if there's any difference in hp?
I bet there is, not much 5+ or - HP at the rear wheels not much but if you're dragging the car or racing it thats a lot, even the oil will make hp? 👍👍🦘🦘
He literally swapped cams on the same motor on the same day.