@@Rotem_S nothing defines any branch from any other; everything is completely random to an infinite degree. In this way, everything is the same. In an infinite amount of trials, something unlikely will happen the same amount of times as something likely. It’s like an infinite number of $20 bills and $1 bills.
Him just punching random numbers into a calculator, getting a syntax error, and continuing to punch random numbers sped up is way funnier than it should have been
They actually put the "staple foods" (i.e. bread, milk, eggs, sugar, etc.) as far away from each other as possible, so that you spend more time looking at stuff you wouldn't normally buy, so that you're more likely to buy more stuff. This is what causes you to go to the supermarket "just to grab a loaf of bread" and come back with a trunk full of groceries.
@@vikingursigurdsson Nothing, really. They're just so ubiquotous in DIY electronics projects on UA-cam these days that it's nice to see a project that doesn't use one.
@@mrspeedrunwastaken1348 i believe he is talking about sunlight which birthed life on the planet, and in turn birthed random number generator - generating humans :)
Technicaly speaking there is no true random, it may be unfathomable to be able to predict the outcome of the response, but it is still technicaly possible. Also humans aren't random either, every action you take can be predetermined, and could be predetermined from the beginning of time. With enough computing power you could predict the end of the universe and everything that happened during the universe, from the moment the universe began with 100% accuracy, because physics is absolute, and every reaction and interaction that occurs is bound by those same physics Edit: I've finished watching the video and I've found that he covers exactly what I'm talking about here, however I find that the explination given doesn't make much sense. Now I would love to explain why but im not typing out a 3 page essay in a comment reply section, so ill just leave it at feel free to ignore this message.
@@official-obama well, 10 seconds instead of the regular 12 hours of the round clock, but it still goes round, just many more times in unnamed and unfollowed cycles
Ah yes, this is me. It seems that the organisation is at it again. Don't worry though, I already my move to. This is all the choice of Steins;gate. El Psy Congrooooo
@@MJFallout After opening the box, the Schrodinger's Cat experiment has two possible outputs, dead (0) and alive (1). This guy suggests to do one machine like the one of the video, but that randomly chose between 0 and 1, making it be in essence a Schrodinger's Cat that don't use a cat, wich make it vegan.
Very smooth execution and presentation. Phenomenal job with putting the random number generator together! If you could make a double nixie tube system, I’m convinced there are some dedicated D&D players that would demand one of these elegant quantum systems to make their game proper.🤓
i hate to admit it.. but yeah that was my idea aswell, rolling up to a d&d game with one of these, preferable with: 1. more lights, preferably different ones with all the common dice numbers plus a d2 or some way to configure it into such 2. loads of buttons and switches like oh if i switch over this here this is a d6, if i switch those 2 aswell its a d100 but if i only switch those 2 its a d10
I hold onto the pilot wave. I know it's having _little bit_ of problems currently but it makes most sense to my human mind and _obviously_ I am the center of the universe so this conclusion is only logical. lol
This device I don't think can serve as /dev/random without some work. Need consant source of numbers at any time, it cannot afford to wait seconds between requests - what do you do if you need /dev/random 13,000 times this second, 4,000 next second, etc?
@@kiraPh1234k just have it backlog a bunch of random numbers and save those number for future use. As one is referenced, toss it away. Place a piece of radioactive material next to the device to crank out random numbers faster.
So... hypothetically, if I asked to purchase this box off of you, how much would you charge + shipping? Also, how would you go about making a D20 version?
You could have the number counter count up to 20 instead of 9 and have 2 tubes instead of the 1 the circuitry isn't that hard its pretty cool to think of possibly having a toggle to chose what the highest number could be and then beable to toggle between diffrent standard dice
Ah, I found the ttrpger. I also would like one. Or 8. In the d2, d4, d6, d8, d10, d100, d12, and d20 type. I knew my quest for perfect dice was not over.
Well.... I mean, make a tube with a thin wire in it, vacuum it, maybe slap a different gas in it, I don't know, wire that through to the circuitry shown in the video, make a container for it, set the outputs, and uh... work yourself to death trying to figure out what you actually need to do.
I found you with the "tiniest UA-cam plaque" video. Glad I stuck around! Really looking forward to what you have to show, man. GREAT editing, and I can really tell you put your heart into your videos. I'll be here for the long-run :)
Thanks! Editing can be a pain but it's also a pile of fun! I love when I get to release a new project - next one shouldn't be too far out. I'm literally right now making final renders out of matlab for a Snake-playing AI... (tell your friends) =D
As a designer of random number generators of the sort you find in your CPU, that's a not-very-good random number generator. If you sample fast enough, you will get highly serially correlated data since it's an up-counter with a partially random clock. You use the term "Truly Random" when you should say "Non deterministic". To get to full randomness (1 bit of entropy per bit of data) you need to study up on entropy extractor theory. All the non-determinism in normal electrical RNGs come from quantum effects that lead to electrical noise. So there's nothing particularly special about a Geiger counter based RNG.
@@jayjasespud The term "True Random" is used differently by different people. In all cases it seems to mean nondeterministic but for some it means full entropy and others it does not. Since cryptographically secure, nondeterministic, deterministic, full entropy, partially entropic and other terms like that are vey well defined and accurately define the properties of an RNG, poorly defined terms that don't really match what they mean like PRNG and True Random should be avoided if you want to make your words unambiguous.
The next step is noticing amplification is associated with decoherence, and voila - a nice, logical (and completely rigorous, with no further axioms) reasoning behind the many worlds interpertation
When I was in the military I proposed a setup for random number generator that used subatomic particals to pick a randomly selected number that was then used to pick a random number of algorithms for a second number to be run through and then that will be your result the order of the algorithms could be determined randomly along with the starting algorithm and you could also make it repeat any number of times you want at random and the whole idea was to introduce as much difficulty as possible to determining the final value and what might have made the whole thing possible is that you could possibly just get it to work on a smartphone of the time.
Nicely done, I’ve always pondered the use of a Geiger counter as a random number generator. In fact I’ve got a tube just like your one in my parts box in a breadboard boost converter circuit that may or may not have experienced one too many exciting discharges. As for your use of a nixie tube with an upside-down 2 as a 5, I like your style.
The SBM-20 was an upgrade from some really really tiny glass geiger tube I started with a few years ago. Other than making some toasty arcs inside when I got the test source too close to it, it's a great tube! I think I may have too little resistance in series or something to get very high countrates... As for the upside-down numbers, what can I say but I bought the cheapest tubes I could get!
AlphaPhoenix Different GM tubes have different gains or counts/area/second or whatever the metric is. There was a website I found a year or two ago when searching for a comparison between tubes that comprehensively measured a dozen or two of the tubes with alpha, beta, and gamma sources, both solid can and end-window tubes, chances are you’ve also stumbled across it. Really great resource, but I’m the end cost becomes the major factor when choosing, at least for me. I initially picked up the tiny SBM-21 as it was the cheapest GM tube on eBay, but I tried to solder a wire to it and it turns out that the plug in the end to keep the inside at low pressure melted at under 300C, so that ruined that tube. So I bought an SBM-20, as the ends of it perfectly fit a standard fuse holder bracket. The positive end of the SBM-21 is too small for any common size of fuse holder I know of, so I’ve no clue how it’s supposed to be held. I assume you’re also using fuse brackets yourself. As far as nixies go, a lot of the surplus ones around today are of soviet origin, where cutting costs by using the same digit for a 2 and 5 was somewhat common. I personally quite like this, it gives the display a character not found on other displays. I haven’t began a foray into the realm of nixies just yet, but when I do I plan on going for tubes which have symbol versions, e.g. Ω, V, A, Hz, etc. I’m also considering some of those obscure panel-mount electroluminescent displays, since they can be used for alphanumeric applications. From what I’ve seen on Applied Science’s channel, multiplexing EL displays is quite the task.
Yeah inside the lasercut wood humps on top of the box I've got some bent-up fuse holders I had to be very careful to not let touch any of the screws I use to hold it together lest I zap myself with 400V... I have also noticed that nearly all ebay vacuum tubes seem to come from former soviet states. Kinda interesting
i love a good pure random sequence. there was an urban legend that the random number sequence used in Doom's source code was generated using a nuclear generator. probably my favorite thing is using nuclear random sequences in a completely deterministic way. That is, you get the exact same number sequence each time, but the sequence follows no pattern at all. this can be incredibly useful for various things. it is like seeding your PRNG with 0 each time you use it, but on steroids
I love that quantum mechanics can, in a way, be explained with math or philosophy interchangeably. It's a deliciously counterintuitive intersection of thinking.
I’d say it can only be adequately described (ie. predicted) with math. Philosophy is just the approximate interpretation from a human brain. When you try to wedge something that’s pure math into everyday life, it just doesn’t work...
I'd say more - Modern Physics in general is a window into incomprehensible through mathematics. The fact that humanity can formulate and manipulate that which it cannot understand is insane.
@@AlphaPhoenixChannel Man, I wish Philosophy was actually useful. I find this kinda stuff extremely interesting, and I can _kinda_ swallow it, but I’m more talented for philosophical thoughts.
@@officersoulknight6321 Philosophy is useful, just not in a modern sense. Philosophy can be the difference between a life spent in contentment and a life spent in dread. But unfortunately, the modern definition of "useful" is "makes corporations more money", so the viability of important human practices like art and philosophy is tanking at the moment.
I need to apologize (to you and the almighty algorithm) because I've seen this video in my feed multiple times in the past but not clicked it. I finally clicked on your Veritasium response a while ago and I'm now watching a bunch of your videos, and they're all fantastic! Wish I had done so sooner.
Excellent video! More about Muons! Also you should show a how to step by step video on how to build a machine. Where can your viewers buy one? Maybe you should sell them! Doesn't need to be that fancy. No need for special tube counter.
you should find a company to make and sell these! I want one that has multiple Nixie tubes that each would have a different die value, so you have your full set of polyhedrals displayed ( a d4, d6, d8, d10, d12, d20, and d% or d100).
Just a random (ah.. yeah) thought - You could use 2 (or more) events to set the clock frequency, then a another to start and stop the counter, if you wanted to reduce the averaging of time between muon events as a way of predicting the next event. Start at random a counter clock whose period is determined at random, then stop it at random. When recycled, there would be no way to predict the next event especially if you run the clock in the mhz range. You could even use several GM tubes and select the tubes used for the events based on a previous muon event. If you wanted a bigger more elaborate randomizer model. I've been a student of random since 1977 when I built my 1st big computer, a 6502 machine overclocked to 2mhz. True random is much harder than most people realize, but this is one of the better method I've seen. Cool too, using natures random events as an engine. Nice project. Enjoyed the video, thanks!
@@satan.is.my.copilot i guess it is. if we are talking about total randomness, there is nothing that prevents the number 8 for example, to randomly pop 10 times in a row. or the number 5555555555 to exist somewhere in the Pi number
I like that you addressed the uncertainty between if the process is truly "random" and "unpredictable", or if we just do not have the scientific knowledge required to predict it accurately yet. It vexes me that the Copenhagen interpretation of quantum physics is tacitly assumed to be the "correct" interpretation, even though there are alternatives that are at least arguably at least equally as compelling such as De Broglie-Bohm.
I think a great improvement for this would be to add some kind of memory component. Then, when a random pulse is detected, instead of displaying a value on the display, store the value in memory (or store the time between detections, since that's where the randomness comes from). Afterwards, a user can just press a button and the device will display the oldest stored value and delete it from memory. This can be made more or less complicated as needed, for example by making a system that stores lots of values and can also recall previous random values instead of deleting them, or random numbers for specific dice types (like d6, d8, d20 or others).
This is absolutely amazing. I subscribed after watching some other videos already but after this one I can't understand why you don't have more subscribers!
"SOON"* unless I am just filing to see the video in question, you are really milking that asterisk for all it is worth at this point I think. Awesome work though, only recently found your channel, but you do awesome work.
Man well nobody watched this video when it was new - there are a bunch of follow-ups I passed on cause nobody cared and making another video after the project was “done” wasn’t nearly as interesting. It’s a whole lot more worthwhile now that UA-cam is showing millions of people my thumbnails out of the blue!
I truly want upgraded version. Connection to computer, ability to change the range of numbers, and program that allows you to roll any dice easily. Not sure if possible, but connection to discord bot? Then nobody could say that the "random generator hates them", becouse that would just be "universe hates them".
I used to be the assistant to a curator in a big art gallery in Sydney Australia. Yeah, I was the go-fer . Anyway, I got to see some tricks of the trade and I can tell you with confidence that if you placed that gadget on a plain plinth and turned a few spotlights on it in an art gallery...you have a hit on your hands! A modern art gallery or museum of course . I get what you mean when you said it's more of an art piece than anything else. It's really interesting! It's art! 🎨🖌️
For those interested the special relativity that allows muons to reach the surface is basically a way of describing the fact that in real time (our practically stationary frame) these particles should decay before reaching the surface. However due to traveling at such a high rate of speed they can travel that distance while experiencing less time then it would take to travel that same distance from a stationary frame of reference.
From Little Brother my favorite definition of randomness is that the fastest way to tell a computer to print the number is just one line of code that says print 142513469205813846... because if you take the 100-200 digits of pi it might seem random but it is a lot faster to tell a computer to find digits of pi and start printing at 100 and stop at 200
+5 internets for using the Rocinante...!! Love your videos, and have since you had like 200 subscribers!! Never would have thought material science could be so interesting, and now I can't stop watching. Thank you!
I had this idea and I'm so glad i found this video. You could use this box to create a name for each universe, use it to identify nearby universes. You would have to have the box and result cause something do the universes arent just copies with different names so i would suggest using an output in a search engine and finding the first link that comes up, then find its creator get incontact, ask them what their job is and try to visit it. That should make a reliably random output, with travel cost, time, location and experience varying between the copies of the universe.
ok wtf.. that was the most interesting vid i saw on yt in a long time.. u smart.. i like that.. and i didnt actually skip to the end to see the finished product.. nice presentation.. very well done..
But the time between muons passing by can be completly predicted if you knew their positions before they pass through the box which makes it not truly random. Of course muons get to the box truly randomly, but the cube is also truly randomly in your palm
I liked this video! As somebody who doesn't subscribe to the multiverse theory-- you really held back but the rick and morety style editing was fully satisfying. I loved the-- i'm still the same timeline from the start example. Though I have a suggestion for reason why I don't subscribe to the multiverse theory, aka block theory of time. What I draw from is actually published and peeer reviewed-- E-Infinity theory. Tbh, the math is a bit overwhelming since it uses irrational numbers virtually everywhere, but its structured like a synthesize for general relativity, aether theory, and string theory-- all connected by fractal-cantorian-space-time. The key point is fractal space, as even without this math, we know it's fractal on the near-plank 'local' scale. We also know the universe seems flat at large, not a hyperbolic tilling. Atleast, not the edges of our map with hypothetical warpdrive spaceships. But here's the thing about fractals, theyre self similar somehow in all regards, including in randomness predictability studied via a term called brownian motion. Some on the internet have studied the lorentz strange arrtactor and dubbed the predictive study 'chaois theory' which is in fact 'order,' by the fact its predictable as self similar things are... And then there's Dirac's equations, which is what schrodinger's equation is based on, and if I remeber right was a fractal like equation. Been a while since I studied that... Anyway. It wouldn't make that less random. But it's support for eternalism because time is fractal-- again published under E-infinity. That doesnt mean we can predict some events, but overall we kinda can; expecially for odd impulse times in the brain with a deviance found to be statistically fractal... evidence the brain is higher dimensional in operation. But time isnt the only fractal thing, the universe looks similar at large as it does at very small and literally repeats its projection in so many dimensions as we have again-- infinitely smaller and likewise larger. After repeating a set of 22 dark dimensions and 4 for normal universe-- the whole structure is projected exactly similar to the structure viewed before zooming 26 layers deep into this 'singularity'. Not surprisingly, all of space is fractal so its all filled with this one (scalar) singularity. It is still shocking! That means we live on the 4d projected surface of a blackhole and inside it at the same time, with other connecting blackholes in our mix as one matrix. Therein space is fractal, and time is fractal time-- so far as I believe. Its not then compatable with block theory of time, but eternalism. Else, what energy creates and seperates universes continously per plank-length unit of time at all relativistic possibilities? That-- to me-- is not proven in the slightest. But I still thought the concept was really good-- I bet its true random-- so far as a standard we'll ever have. But who knows? Maybe after decades recorded information would reveal its pattern was fractal after all?
My old job gave us these key fob sized things that would give us a pin number to use for the 3rd door in the building. And I was told that it works similar to this.
you should put a FIFO buffer into it, so you can get a random number instantly on demand. Would make it much more practical for let's say like a board game. Awesome project btw, hats off to you
Ah, but the numbers rolled in this video are no longer random, because they were recorded and will come out the same every time now.
They are what defines this branch from different ones though
@@Rotem_S nothing defines any branch from any other; everything is completely random to an infinite degree. In this way, everything is the same. In an infinite amount of trials, something unlikely will happen the same amount of times as something likely. It’s like an infinite number of $20 bills and $1 bills.
@@chalkeater1427 What kind of chalk do you like to eat? I like the blue kind
@@scrambledmandible Personally, the white ones are better. My family thinks it's cocaine when it's actually chalk.
true...but only in OUR universe ;)
Him just punching random numbers into a calculator, getting a syntax error, and continuing to punch random numbers sped up is way funnier than it should have been
It's okay to admit you built a thing to show all your quantum physics memes.
I respect the flex though. Most couldn’t care less how things work and exist.
is it really possible to show all possible quantum physics memes?
@@crazydog3307 The device may be universe bifurcating. So maybe he did in other universes.
1000th like
@@gama5942 to me it is tuesday.
I believe my local supermarket uses this process to decide where and when to place products.
They actually put the "staple foods" (i.e. bread, milk, eggs, sugar, etc.) as far away from each other as possible, so that you spend more time looking at stuff you wouldn't normally buy, so that you're more likely to buy more stuff.
This is what causes you to go to the supermarket "just to grab a loaf of bread" and come back with a trunk full of groceries.
Props for using no Arduino (or any microcontroller at all)
*made by the discrete component gang
*relearns what a gated IC is*
_y-yes._
Well what's wrong with microcontrollers?
@@vikingursigurdsson Nothing, really. They're just so ubiquotous in DIY electronics projects on UA-cam these days that it's nice to see a project that doesn't use one.
@@annaw.1951 Thats why I like ben eaters 8-bit breadboard computer project a lot.
Q: How do you make a truly random number generator?
A: Bombard a planet with sunlight for billions of years.
technically my dude, it'd be mostly star light or black hole radiation actually. :nerdface:
@@mrspeedrunwastaken1348 i believe he is talking about sunlight which birthed life on the planet, and in turn birthed random number generator - generating humans :)
every planet gets bombarded with sunlight lmao
@@billyumbraskey8135 I invite you to try and prove there aren't teslas on every planet near a star.
Technicaly speaking there is no true random, it may be unfathomable to be able to predict the outcome of the response, but it is still technicaly possible. Also humans aren't random either, every action you take can be predetermined, and could be predetermined from the beginning of time. With enough computing power you could predict the end of the universe and everything that happened during the universe, from the moment the universe began with 100% accuracy, because physics is absolute, and every reaction and interaction that occurs is bound by those same physics
Edit: I've finished watching the video and I've found that he covers exactly what I'm talking about here, however I find that the explination given doesn't make much sense. Now I would love to explain why but im not typing out a 3 page essay in a comment reply section, so ill just leave it at feel free to ignore this message.
Honestly, it was nice to see a Nixie in a project that WASN'T a clock.
So random 🙃😉
Sweet right? Well time to go make a nixie clock/watch
Actually that was a clock that shows the time when a muon hits the tube
@@mr.0x373 only one digit
@@official-obama well, 10 seconds instead of the regular 12 hours of the round clock, but it still goes round, just many more times in unnamed and unfollowed cycles
It could be a prototype for Divergence meter. May the choice of steins gate be with you. El Psy Congroo.
This is definitely a Beta worldline
Ah yes, this is me. It seems that the organisation is at it again. Don't worry though, I already my move to. This is all the choice of Steins;gate. El Psy Congrooooo
i am mad scientist
A divergence meter would require a baseline reading. You would need many gravity sensors.
My first thought as well
Make another one that just toggles between 0 and 1 (Randomly) and label it "Schrodinger's Vegan Cat".
Lol.....Im sure PETA would like that version
Then finally make one that cycles through only the number zero for full zen mode random number generation.
Could you explain that please? I don't get it.
@@MJFallout
After opening the box, the Schrodinger's Cat experiment has two possible outputs, dead (0) and alive (1).
This guy suggests to do one machine like the one of the video, but that randomly chose between 0 and 1, making it be in essence a Schrodinger's Cat that don't use a cat, wich make it vegan.
@@draghettis6524 Oh, thx! catfree is the vegan option, got it.
Fun fact, you can also call an RDRAND instruction on an Intel cpu made after 2012. It uses thermal noise in the chip to produce a true random number.
I have to say that I love everything about this project. The graphics around the box telling the story of what's going on inside are double plus good.
36 years later and some are still using those adjective forms
what does newspeak have to do with all this? :D
Very smooth execution and presentation. Phenomenal job with putting the random number generator together! If you could make a double nixie tube system, I’m convinced there are some dedicated D&D players that would demand one of these elegant quantum systems to make their game proper.🤓
i hate to admit it.. but yeah that was my idea aswell, rolling up to a d&d game with one of these, preferable with:
1. more lights, preferably different ones with all the common dice numbers plus a d2 or some way to configure it into such
2. loads of buttons and switches like oh if i switch over this here this is a d6, if i switch those 2 aswell its a d100 but if i only switch those 2 its a d10
This was on my mind the whole time while i was watching (and of course i’m a dungeon master)
If you made more of these, I would totally buy one.
How much would you pay for it?
@@TheOpticalFreak quamtum amount of money
@@iIiWARHEADiIi was that a joke?!
@@TheOpticalFreak yes.
thrice the price to make it
I want one of these. Always been bugged how nothing in computers or physical objects that you can hold can be considered “true randomness”
Nice Video, haha didn't expect the multiverse editing, that was fun to watch.
I certainly had more fun watching it then my graphics card had trying to encode it xD
There's only supposed to be one dot on the screen or something?
@@dafoex "Oh, crap, are you kidding me? Two dots? This never needs to be more than one dot. The two of you made us uncertain!"
Imagine rolling up to your dnd game with this
Personally I do not subscribe to the many worlds interpretation but I did subscribe to your channel.
Hahahahaha thanks! (Yeah it seems kinda weird to me too but it makes for great sci-fi when you ignore like ALL of the details...)
Yeah it defies thermodynamics, creating a second universe out of nothing nah, Copenhagen interpretation for me
I hold onto the pilot wave. I know it's having _little bit_ of problems currently but it makes most sense to my human mind and _obviously_ I am the center of the universe so this conclusion is only logical. lol
Which means you didn't subscribe in the other half of the universes :p
There's a world where you both subscribe to the many worlds theory, and didn't subscribe to the channel.
"The ground is radioactive!"
"The sky is radioactive, too!"
AAAAHHAHAHAAHHAHAAA
You should try to build a device driver that integrate this device into your computer as /dev/random
But keep around the nixie tube, just for fun.
This device I don't think can serve as /dev/random without some work.
Need consant source of numbers at any time, it cannot afford to wait seconds between requests - what do you do if you need /dev/random 13,000 times this second, 4,000 next second, etc?
@@kiraPh1234k All you need to do is scale up the area of it. The more area, the more muons you can detect
@@kiraPh1234k just have it backlog a bunch of random numbers and save those number for future use. As one is referenced, toss it away. Place a piece of radioactive material next to the device to crank out random numbers faster.
believe it or not this actually exists commercially, it's called an HRNG and there are many types using many quantum random process
Honestly, I'd really like to see this being sold somewhere, it'd make games really interesting
"I swear if this thing doesn't have a nixie tu- YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEES"
The visuals paired with your explainations are so well thought out!
Absolutely love the parallel universes part
Admit it, you just unplugged the detector to get the one without any numbers getting picked for a long time
shhh
Shhh
@@ahuman2533 shhhh
Everyone ever: True randomness is literally impossible. Fact.
Quantum Physics: lol hold my beer/not beer 😂
it can also be both in quantum physics
This isn't true random
@@doctornobody6845 ?
@@doctornobody6845 how come
Shoulda been written as "hold my |beer> + |no beer>" lol
So... hypothetically, if I asked to purchase this box off of you, how much would you charge + shipping?
Also, how would you go about making a D20 version?
You could have the number counter count up to 20 instead of 9 and have 2 tubes instead of the 1 the circuitry isn't that hard its pretty cool to think of possibly having a toggle to chose what the highest number could be and then beable to toggle between diffrent standard dice
MTG?
Ah, I found the ttrpger.
I also would like one. Or 8. In the d2, d4, d6, d8, d10, d100, d12, and d20 type.
I knew my quest for perfect dice was not over.
13:20 "using this mill feels like overkill for this project" - guy using the properties of quantum physics to make a random number generator
Best comment today
Could you plllllleeeeeaasssseeee show us how to make one? I'd really enjoy making this
Well.... I mean, make a tube with a thin wire in it, vacuum it, maybe slap a different gas in it, I don't know, wire that through to the circuitry shown in the video, make a container for it, set the outputs, and uh... work yourself to death trying to figure out what you actually need to do.
Just buy Geiger tube and some sort of counter with the external triger and reset
I always wondered how Okabe Rintaro could build a machine that “detects” what worldline he’s on. This it literally it. Lol
He is future gadget lab member 001, he just doesn't know it yet...
I found you with the "tiniest UA-cam plaque" video. Glad I stuck around! Really looking forward to what you have to show, man. GREAT editing, and I can really tell you put your heart into your videos. I'll be here for the long-run :)
Thanks! Editing can be a pain but it's also a pile of fun! I love when I get to release a new project - next one shouldn't be too far out. I'm literally right now making final renders out of matlab for a Snake-playing AI...
(tell your friends) =D
As a designer of random number generators of the sort you find in your CPU, that's a not-very-good random number generator. If you sample fast enough, you will get highly serially correlated data since it's an up-counter with a partially random clock. You use the term "Truly Random" when you should say "Non deterministic". To get to full randomness (1 bit of entropy per bit of data) you need to study up on entropy extractor theory. All the non-determinism in normal electrical RNGs come from quantum effects that lead to electrical noise. So there's nothing particularly special about a Geiger counter based RNG.
True random is non-deterministic. This is still pseudo-random.
@jayjasespud the only right answer in this whole room of pseudo intellectuals
@@jayjasespud The term "True Random" is used differently by different people. In all cases it seems to mean nondeterministic but for some it means full entropy and others it does not. Since cryptographically secure, nondeterministic, deterministic, full entropy, partially entropic and other terms like that are vey well defined and accurately define the properties of an RNG, poorly defined terms that don't really match what they mean like PRNG and True Random should be avoided if you want to make your words unambiguous.
Amplification. That is an amazingly intuitive way of looking at quantum measurement that I had never considered before!
The next step is noticing amplification is associated with decoherence, and voila - a nice, logical (and completely rigorous, with no further axioms) reasoning behind the many worlds interpertation
When the players you DM keep fudging their dice rolls:
Please please please post the schematics and plans for this, or sell them. Id love to have one
When I was in the military I proposed a setup for random number generator that used subatomic particals to pick a randomly selected number that was then used to pick a random number of algorithms for a second number to be run through and then that will be your result the order of the algorithms could be determined randomly along with the starting algorithm and you could also make it repeat any number of times you want at random and the whole idea was to introduce as much difficulty as possible to determining the final value and what might have made the whole thing possible is that you could possibly just get it to work on a smartphone of the time.
You're creating new universes for as long as that machine works.
Well done. This video really made me think. The quantum made visible (in a way) and a reference to The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy...Solid Gold.
Nicely done, I’ve always pondered the use of a Geiger counter as a random number generator. In fact I’ve got a tube just like your one in my parts box in a breadboard boost converter circuit that may or may not have experienced one too many exciting discharges.
As for your use of a nixie tube with an upside-down 2 as a 5, I like your style.
The SBM-20 was an upgrade from some really really tiny glass geiger tube I started with a few years ago. Other than making some toasty arcs inside when I got the test source too close to it, it's a great tube! I think I may have too little resistance in series or something to get very high countrates...
As for the upside-down numbers, what can I say but I bought the cheapest tubes I could get!
AlphaPhoenix
Different GM tubes have different gains or counts/area/second or whatever the metric is. There was a website I found a year or two ago when searching for a comparison between tubes that comprehensively measured a dozen or two of the tubes with alpha, beta, and gamma sources, both solid can and end-window tubes, chances are you’ve also stumbled across it. Really great resource, but I’m the end cost becomes the major factor when choosing, at least for me. I initially picked up the tiny SBM-21 as it was the cheapest GM tube on eBay, but I tried to solder a wire to it and it turns out that the plug in the end to keep the inside at low pressure melted at under 300C, so that ruined that tube. So I bought an SBM-20, as the ends of it perfectly fit a standard fuse holder bracket. The positive end of the SBM-21 is too small for any common size of fuse holder I know of, so I’ve no clue how it’s supposed to be held. I assume you’re also using fuse brackets yourself.
As far as nixies go, a lot of the surplus ones around today are of soviet origin, where cutting costs by using the same digit for a 2 and 5 was somewhat common. I personally quite like this, it gives the display a character not found on other displays. I haven’t began a foray into the realm of nixies just yet, but when I do I plan on going for tubes which have symbol versions, e.g. Ω, V, A, Hz, etc.
I’m also considering some of those obscure panel-mount electroluminescent displays, since they can be used for alphanumeric applications. From what I’ve seen on Applied Science’s channel, multiplexing EL displays is quite the task.
Yeah inside the lasercut wood humps on top of the box I've got some bent-up fuse holders I had to be very careful to not let touch any of the screws I use to hold it together lest I zap myself with 400V...
I have also noticed that nearly all ebay vacuum tubes seem to come from former soviet states. Kinda interesting
This channel deserves infinitely many more views
Alpha Phoenix is a God. He created RNGesus.
Nah, he just created a vessel for him to manifest in that uses the real world instead of the computer world.
i love a good pure random sequence. there was an urban legend that the random number sequence used in Doom's source code was generated using a nuclear generator. probably my favorite thing is using nuclear random sequences in a completely deterministic way. That is, you get the exact same number sequence each time, but the sequence follows no pattern at all. this can be incredibly useful for various things. it is like seeding your PRNG with 0 each time you use it, but on steroids
I love that quantum mechanics can, in a way, be explained with math or philosophy interchangeably. It's a deliciously counterintuitive intersection of thinking.
I’d say it can only be adequately described (ie. predicted) with math. Philosophy is just the approximate interpretation from a human brain. When you try to wedge something that’s pure math into everyday life, it just doesn’t work...
I'd say more - Modern Physics in general is a window into incomprehensible through mathematics. The fact that humanity can formulate and manipulate that which it cannot understand is insane.
@@AlphaPhoenixChannel Man, I wish Philosophy was actually useful. I find this kinda stuff extremely interesting, and I can _kinda_ swallow it, but I’m more talented for philosophical thoughts.
@@officersoulknight6321 Philosophy is useful, just not in a modern sense. Philosophy can be the difference between a life spent in contentment and a life spent in dread. But unfortunately, the modern definition of "useful" is "makes corporations more money", so the viability of important human practices like art and philosophy is tanking at the moment.
Just discovered this channel, and I’ve gotta say, this is crazy stuff to even think about.
Such a project! And extremely well documented. Love this!
Thanks! This one was literally years in the making! (Granted shelved for most of that time)
I need to apologize (to you and the almighty algorithm) because I've seen this video in my feed multiple times in the past but not clicked it. I finally clicked on your Veritasium response a while ago and I'm now watching a bunch of your videos, and they're all fantastic! Wish I had done so sooner.
Always a pleasure to watch a new video from you. Thank you very much and happy New Year!
Thanks! Happy New Year!
once again your presentations, youth, excitement, enthusiasm keep me wanting more and more, ty
This is the most overengineered D10 I've ever seen
Excellent video! More about Muons! Also you should show a how to step by step video on how to build a machine. Where can your viewers buy one? Maybe you should sell them!
Doesn't need to be that fancy. No need for special tube counter.
Perfect for my D&D games.
That casual slow mo scene in the beginning was very cool. I was not ready
you should find a company to make and sell these! I want one that has multiple Nixie tubes that each would have a different die value, so you have your full set of polyhedrals displayed ( a d4, d6, d8, d10, d12, d20, and d% or d100).
Just a random (ah.. yeah) thought - You could use 2 (or more) events to set the clock frequency, then a another to start and stop the counter, if you wanted to reduce the averaging of time between muon events as a way of predicting the next event. Start at random a counter clock whose period is determined at random, then stop it at random. When recycled, there would be no way to predict the next event especially if you run the clock in the mhz range. You could even use several GM tubes and select the tubes used for the events based on a previous muon event. If you wanted a bigger more elaborate randomizer model. I've been a student of random since 1977 when I built my 1st big computer, a 6502 machine overclocked to 2mhz. True random is much harder than most people realize, but this is one of the better method I've seen. Cool too, using natures random events as an engine.
Nice project. Enjoyed the video, thanks!
Dice are decently chaotic. I think I'll stick with dice for dnd.
this one is better though
Dice are lawful neutral, change my mind
found your channel on a UA-cam suggestion and I have been enjoying your videos for the past few days. I think you'll hit 1million subs in no time.
I kind of want a version that cycles between 1 and 20. If we can randomise a D10, we can randomise a D20 as well.
The many-worlds you sequence was very satisfying to watch, thank you.
Great video, please post stats about randomness of the device
"this is basically spitting out a new universe for every instant of time" is a pretty raw and powerful line
Is this how Okabe built the divergence meter in Steins;gate?
was looking for the Stein's Gate reference.
The fact you used a nixie tube for this is incredible.
7:40 talking about total randomness, and the device gives 8-9 and then again 8-9...spooky
@Michael Darrow ye i understand that. it was just a joke ;)
I noticed that too, and I don't understand. Was that indeed random that it did exactly the same thing twice?
@@satan.is.my.copilot i guess it is. if we are talking about total randomness, there is nothing that prevents the number 8 for example, to randomly pop 10 times in a row. or the number 5555555555 to exist somewhere in the Pi number
I like that you addressed the uncertainty between if the process is truly "random" and "unpredictable", or if we just do not have the scientific knowledge required to predict it accurately yet. It vexes me that the Copenhagen interpretation of quantum physics is tacitly assumed to be the "correct" interpretation, even though there are alternatives that are at least arguably at least equally as compelling such as De Broglie-Bohm.
Where's the schematic for this?
"Aggressively terrible cold open"? That was the trippiest intro I've seen in YEARS
I think a great improvement for this would be to add some kind of memory component. Then, when a random pulse is detected, instead of displaying a value on the display, store the value in memory (or store the time between detections, since that's where the randomness comes from). Afterwards, a user can just press a button and the device will display the oldest stored value and delete it from memory. This can be made more or less complicated as needed, for example by making a system that stores lots of values and can also recall previous random values instead of deleting them, or random numbers for specific dice types (like d6, d8, d20 or others).
This is absolutely amazing. I subscribed after watching some other videos already but after this one I can't understand why you don't have more subscribers!
"SOON"* unless I am just filing to see the video in question, you are really milking that asterisk for all it is worth at this point I think.
Awesome work though, only recently found your channel, but you do awesome work.
Man well nobody watched this video when it was new - there are a bunch of follow-ups I passed on cause nobody cared and making another video after the project was “done” wasn’t nearly as interesting.
It’s a whole lot more worthwhile now that UA-cam is showing millions of people my thumbnails out of the blue!
@@AlphaPhoenixChannel My best guess is youtube hooked themselves up with a quantum computer XD
It's quite lame that your channel doesn't have millions of subs. It's brilliant!
I truly want upgraded version. Connection to computer, ability to change the range of numbers, and program that allows you to roll any dice easily. Not sure if possible, but connection to discord bot? Then nobody could say that the "random generator hates them", becouse that would just be "universe hates them".
What a fun, instructive and inspiring video! Great stuff and very much appreciate all the hard work that went into it.
You play with that devil's machine long enough - TVA will come for you and they prune you, just like every other unwanted VARIANT
I swear the Geiger counter in your video looked precisely like the one I used to test on a weekly basis back in the 70's.
Civil Defense FTW!!!
Just discovered you, and I absolutely love the content! This is one of the most satisfying diy gizmos I’ve seen yet 😊
6:25 The Expanse reference is what earned my like, love it
The parallel universe part got me subscribed. Awesome editing.
I used to be the assistant to a curator in a big art gallery in Sydney Australia. Yeah, I was the go-fer . Anyway, I got to see some tricks of the trade and I can tell you with confidence that if you placed that gadget on a plain plinth and turned a few spotlights on it in an art gallery...you have a hit on your hands! A modern art gallery or museum of course . I get what you mean when you said it's more of an art piece than anything else. It's really interesting! It's art! 🎨🖌️
I love your channel. It's also nice seeing some crystalography because i liked it a lot in high school.
this man is the StyroPyro of a completely different field. 10/10
"your so predictable"
"PREDICT THIS" *builds a muon powered random number machine*
This is sooo fricking cool. Glad I discovered this channel.
For those interested the special relativity that allows muons to reach the surface is basically a way of describing the fact that in real time (our practically stationary frame) these particles should decay before reaching the surface. However due to traveling at such a high rate of speed they can travel that distance while experiencing less time then it would take to travel that same distance from a stationary frame of reference.
AlphaPhoenix: This RNG is absolutely random.
Some nearby supernova: I'm about to end this man's whole career
I need 7 of those machines to make a D&D true random dice set
From Little Brother my favorite definition of randomness is that the fastest way to tell a computer to print the number is just one line of code that says print 142513469205813846... because if you take the 100-200 digits of pi it might seem random but it is a lot faster to tell a computer to find digits of pi and start printing at 100 and stop at 200
+5 internets for using the Rocinante...!! Love your videos, and have since you had like 200 subscribers!! Never would have thought material science could be so interesting, and now I can't stop watching. Thank you!
just stumbed onto yoru video, love your style, effort and presentation ! subscribed !
I had this idea and I'm so glad i found this video. You could use this box to create a name for each universe, use it to identify nearby universes. You would have to have the box and result cause something do the universes arent just copies with different names so i would suggest using an output in a search engine and finding the first link that comes up, then find its creator get incontact, ask them what their job is and try to visit it. That should make a reliably random output, with travel cost, time, location and experience varying between the copies of the universe.
ok wtf.. that was the most interesting vid i saw on yt in a long time.. u smart.. i like that.. and i didnt actually skip to the end to see the finished product.. nice presentation.. very well done..
But the time between muons passing by can be completly predicted if you knew their positions before they pass through the box which makes it not truly random. Of course muons get to the box truly randomly, but the cube is also truly randomly in your palm
Need one of these for my dnd games.
I am glad you made clear, that it might still not be random, we just don't know.
I liked this video! As somebody who doesn't subscribe to the multiverse theory-- you really held back but the rick and morety style editing was fully satisfying. I loved the-- i'm still the same timeline from the start example.
Though I have a suggestion for reason why I don't subscribe to the multiverse theory, aka block theory of time. What I draw from is actually published and peeer reviewed-- E-Infinity theory. Tbh, the math is a bit overwhelming since it uses irrational numbers virtually everywhere, but its structured like a synthesize for general relativity, aether theory, and string theory-- all connected by fractal-cantorian-space-time.
The key point is fractal space, as even without this math, we know it's fractal on the near-plank 'local' scale. We also know the universe seems flat at large, not a hyperbolic tilling. Atleast, not the edges of our map with hypothetical warpdrive spaceships.
But here's the thing about fractals, theyre self similar somehow in all regards, including in randomness predictability studied via a term called brownian motion. Some on the internet have studied the lorentz strange arrtactor and dubbed the predictive study 'chaois theory' which is in fact 'order,' by the fact its predictable as self similar things are...
And then there's Dirac's equations, which is what schrodinger's equation is based on, and if I remeber right was a fractal like equation. Been a while since I studied that...
Anyway. It wouldn't make that less random. But it's support for eternalism because time is fractal-- again published under E-infinity. That doesnt mean we can predict some events, but overall we kinda can; expecially for odd impulse times in the brain with a deviance found to be statistically fractal... evidence the brain is higher dimensional in operation.
But time isnt the only fractal thing, the universe looks similar at large as it does at very small and literally repeats its projection in so many dimensions as we have again-- infinitely smaller and likewise larger.
After repeating a set of 22 dark dimensions and 4 for normal universe-- the whole structure is projected exactly similar to the structure viewed before zooming 26 layers deep into this 'singularity'.
Not surprisingly, all of space is fractal so its all filled with this one (scalar) singularity. It is still shocking! That means we live on the 4d projected surface of a blackhole and inside it at the same time, with other connecting blackholes in our mix as one matrix.
Therein space is fractal, and time is fractal time-- so far as I believe. Its not then compatable with block theory of time, but eternalism. Else, what energy creates and seperates universes continously per plank-length unit of time at all relativistic possibilities? That-- to me-- is not proven in the slightest.
But I still thought the concept was really good-- I bet its true random-- so far as a standard we'll ever have. But who knows? Maybe after decades recorded information would reveal its pattern was fractal after all?
Love seeing the 555 still being a workhorse.
My old job gave us these key fob sized things that would give us a pin number to use for the 3rd door in the building. And I was told that it works similar to this.
you should put a FIFO buffer into it, so you can get a random number instantly on demand. Would make it much more practical for let's say like a board game.
Awesome project btw, hats off to you
A very cool concept, to use a Geiger tube to generate random #'s.
It's not just a fascinating machine, it looks cool as Fahrenheit!
With sufficient information about every dimension, I am sure we could actually predict radioactive decay.
I did enjoy this! And I'm glad to have discovered your channel!
Really loved your intro! Such a high quality