If you have the money, it's worth it. Saying this as someone who, for the longest time, didn't have the money and run a NAS on a cobbled-together server with 6 different generations of hard drives.
@@SimonToth83 Ahem, this is something you can _very easily_ DIY upon any Linux distro for half the price and a lot of other functionalities (well tested)…
@@SimonToth83 You can do so much things on a little server these things cannot, especially if you have a good deal of memory - in fact, these things are more comfortable for somebody who doesn't want (or doesn't know how) to put his hands under the hood or somebody in a real hurry without any spare time.
Regarding the drives failing while trying to rebuild and array, Wendell is 100% right. I had an 8 drive Qnap NAS in which one drive failed. I bought an exact replacement and the NAS went ahead and started a rebuild. After the rebuild for some reason during the night while I was asleep the rebuild completed but the new drive was marked as spare. I saw this and restarted the array rebuild being quite annoyed TBH, Remember, 1 drive has failed and another failure would be catastrophic. During the rebuild a second drive failed. Boom, you're dead. I got QNAP to login to the NAS and try to recover it but they were unable to. That left a VERY bad taste in my mouth. I replaced all 8 drives in the NAS with new ones at a very pretty penny. Remember folks, a single NAS is not a backup strategy. I have 3 NAS's and currently setting up another remote offsite all the way over in Europe. A second offsite would be nice.
In Germany HAT5300 18TB is about 39€/TB wich is just rediculus, they are only price competitive if you buy them bundled with the NAS, then they are 18-19€/TB (144TB Bundle).
I really like Synology products. Got a DS1522+ and it's been awesome. I upgraded from a DS218 and got to keep everything exactly the same and lost no data. Will do the same thing when I fill the 48TB but I think that will take some time.
Synology stuff is just great. Got a DS918+ several years ago just for the file sharing and possibly running as a media center (Jellyfin). Since also dumping all my personal photos and videos in Synology Photos and discovering Docker for running self-hosted services I am now deep into the homelab scene, discovering new cool services to run almost weekly. And for that, a plus-series Synology Diskstation is a great start!
So glad they finally released this. I have a client needing to replace 2 ageing Dell T420 servers and I was waiting for an update to the older DS1821XS+ before I made the move. Now I'm going to quote them for 2 of these, configured with 6x Exos-16 16 TB drives, 32GB RAM and a pair of Gen 3 NVMe drives...
One thing I'd love to see Synology allow in the future: The installation of small Transcoder cards or GPUs (NVIDIA Quadro P1000s) into the PCI-e slot for Plex, Kodi, Jellyfin, etc. Some of the older NASs don't support Intel QuickSync but that PCI-e slot would be super useful for an add-on card. Those cards could also be useful for headless VMs which might need GPU workloads. If it's a thing... let me know please!
first time viewer, saw you on another video from 3 years ago, good job on losing weight, i , myself am also in the process of losing. keep up the good work.
My slightly older Synology ds1821+ does 50 Gbit with the same pcie card. Obviously using Linux Ethernet bonding, which is called LACP or whatever. Ubiquity switch on the other side. We also use a management port, because for a while Synology had drama doing LACP. I would not recommend using nvme with dramatic multiple bits per memory cell, and suggest using the higher wear level memory, optane is actually ideal.
20:15 you mean overprovisioned/over-provisioned; which is telling the SSD to reserve more space for eventual wear. (It also means to provide any amount of space that exceeded the physical storage.) Decreasing the amount of over-provisioning will never induce under-provisioning as the amount of OP will simply be zero. Under-provisioning simply means you're supplying less of a resource than is required; i.e. a VM that needs 4 vCPUs but is provisioned with 2 is said to be under-provisioned.
Synology have been total AHs to their prosumer and small business unit customers. Apple-style disk and RAM vendor restrictions. NVME limited to 1GB/sec. Sucky customer support.
That 3rd party drive warning is pretty annoying knowing when I want to upgrade my ANCIENT Synology DS414. The main thing I would want to upgrade is to maybe have a 2,5Gbps link some day, but I get the feeling from this video it's not that easy to even saturate that, even with this monster NAS.
My 1612+ is sill chugging along, but I dread the day it eventually will die. If synology really goes nuts with the "certified components" stuff, it would at least bring up the question if the next one should still be Synology.
I'm planning to build my first nas and that 3rd party warning is the reason why I'm thinking of going with DS1821+ over DS1823xs+ since according to Synology's website DS1821+ should still support Seagate drives. At the moment where I live eight 16tb Seagate IronWolf Pro drives would cost me about 4177.08 US dollars, while eight 16tb Synology HAT5300 drives would cost me about 7332.99 US dollars. A 3155.91 dollar difference is a bit pricey in my opinion. Hopefully in a somewhat far distant future when it's time to replace the DS1821+ prices for Synology drives will have decreased or I'm able to slowly replace the Seagate drives over time.
From 22:30 you reminded me; I think this channel and STH are basically the only two that I would like to see playing with RS232 9pin devices, like the GPDPocket 3 and many others. Would you consider doing a video on them, maybe from the perspective of the power user/home labber but also from a straight up industrial perspective?
he is using raid6. I am using SHR1. I didn't have a drive fail but instead swapped out a littler drive for a bigger drive. I WISH it took a day. Mine right now is on step 3/3 (7.35% done on the 3rd step) & its been almost a week.
I switched from Blue Iris to Surveillance Station and it has been flawless. The reason I switched is that I had constant problems with Blue Iris and got tired of having to actively manage it. Once I got Surveillance Station figured out and setup I haven't had to touch it since. You do have to buy camera licenses, but you can get them for $50 per camera and they don't expire. If you go with Blue Iris you have to buy Blue Iris, plus annual updates, plus the hardware to run it. All in Blue Iris is no cheaper despite what the BI shills claim.
Great video would be awesome to get a deep dive Wendell / Ryan video on colouring outside of the Synology lines. Synology packages can be outdated ie plex, with some basic tutorials I’ve gotten plex to current version. However it would be great to see if other self hosted applications like paperless-ngx could run without the overhead of a VM. Great video, hopefully see some more Synology content in the future.
This NAS is almost perfect. I've been looking at an upgrade path from my 918+. But all the new units run AMD hence no iGPU/hardware accelerated transcoding for Plex. I wish the pci slot could be populated by a gpu
just bought the DS1823xs+ with 32GB RAM, dual Synology 800GB NVME and eight Seagate IronWolf Pro 18TB drives. Moved from DROBO. Drobo is out of business and their hardware is failing. I have 6 drobos all 5D3 two have died and three are dying. Must be a logic bomb or something in the firmware causing them to die. I know I could have gotten the DS1823+ which is for home and power users but why not? This was only $700 more. I will buy the expansion Synology 5 bay system as I have five 10TB WDC Red Pro drives from a Drobo I'll use in it. Thank you Wendell for a great review.
I recently ordered and returned a 1821+ due to faulty drive caddies. I was looking to replace a QNAP TS-873A that I've only had a few months. Sadly price has gone up on Amazon and they've said if I want a replacement I'll have to pay the difference. DSM 7.2 certainly looks interesting.
Hi Wendell Thanks for this demonstration. I noticed your Synology drives appeared to be formatted as btrfs. As you've expressed admiration for ZFS in the past, can you please comment on how reliable and flexible btrfs would be in comparison? (assuming Synology still does not offer ZFS options)
btrfs in this scenario is not setup to use btrfs' internal r5/6 mechanism but does use btrfs file integrity detection thing; snapshots run underneath. it's a pretty interesting solution that they've come up with to get around some of the worry about btrfs architecture for sure. I like zfs more generally, but this is faster. And zfs can be harder to get right i.e. its easy to get yourself into write amplification scenarios when doing the off-label uses.
you should have used Synology shr2 it is a raid 6 that lets you mix and match drive sizes this is much better if you have 16 tb drives ok I want 20 tb drives it will let you use all of the drive spaces without upgrading all of them at once
SHR is only available on consumer DiskStation models, not the "pro" units (basically all "xs"-models and all Rackstation products). Don't ask me why, this is how it is. :/
I returned a synology after customer support couldn't walk me through how to setup remote access using my own DNS from a source that their app recommends. Support is a joke !
Please make a video about Surveillance Station! I recently got a used PowerEdge to use as my NAS, and want to use my old Synology with Surveillance Station and some IP cameras to upgrade my home surveillance. Thanks for the great videos!
@@burntnougat5341 Hey I already know about the licenses and it's still my intent because another $100 for them is a lot less than... buying a completely new system to avoid buying licenses? Ya goofy.
@@scabbynack except it's not more expensive. You can run a nix server on any old hardware and run open source surveillance software that can support any number of cameras at no extra cost. Fool and his money...
Got a DIY NAS with 4x 14TB Seagate Ironwolf drives here. For data scrubbing of the raid-6 it does need almost 24 hours. But maybe you're referring to some WD blue disks? ;-)
I feel like you misrepresented SHR. It's more automatic raid level management to optimise for space as opposed to blending SSD's and mechanical drives in arrays. In your case of the raid 6 array an SHR2 would have created an array the same. Also those SSD drives are over provisioned not under provisioned.
Does this apply to the EU as well? My current Synology is not bugging me about off-brand stuff yet, and yeah, the diff in price is ~100%. I will need to upgrade eventually, and I got used to the "setup and forget" nature of these things. So it would be good to know.
@Level1Techs At 18:00 you mention SHR with SSDs and HDDs in SHR. I'm not sure if they ever allowed you to mix SSD and mechanical HDDs, but SHR is generally disabled in xs+ so maybe that's the software change you were talking about? Otherwise, loved the setup/review video!
Synology does not offer a "keep your drive"" warranty. That's fine if you don't care about the data on the drive that died, but if it is confidential in any way, and you need to warranty the drive, there is no good way to do so. They don't seem to want to work with you on sending the drive cover back, which is what WD and Seagate will do. It may be almost impossible to recover the data, but by policy, most places don't want to take that chance. "Just buy a new drive." Seems to be their answer.
@@PseudoChris No, but they will usually take just the top of the drive in good faith. The last time I had to warranty a WD drive, they wanted a photo of the drive instead of the top cover with the label. Dell and HP, when configuring a server or SAN will provide "Keep your drive" and even Keep your device warranties. They do cost more, but if you need that type of warranty, it's good to have the option.
I find it so weird that people do off label use and then reach for support when something goes wrong. I consider myself the "typical viewer" for this channel; I often do push things like you teach us to, but then I know better than to call support with my issues. Maybe a support forum at most. I thought that was common sense.
Xpenology with the redpill loader FTW. currently running the synology OS on a Ryzen 5600G. its just nuts. are there other OS options? sure. but synology's point and click interface is great
Hopefully one day far in the future, we will have access to affordable, blazing fast CPUs that have, like, 16 cores, and can tear through video transcoding like a rabid pit bull tears through small children. Oh, and heaps of affordable ram too.
@@SirReptitious No need for that. 2 and 4 core Celeron transcodes videos with no problems. All it need is the integrated gfx. More ram sure dont hurt though :)
I guess I need to spend more time here, I need to figure out my storage setup but a good bit of the stuff you were talking about sailed straight over my head. Do you have a "for dummies" series?
It took a bit of tweaking for me to get our rs3617xs+ capable of maxing out the 10gb link, with 24 sata SSD's. That one doesn't have the ability to put in an m.2 SSD for cache though.
@level1techs about PCIe slots please include if it’s gen 3,4 or 5… less knowledgeable viewers can be misled when trying to compare NAS by watching UA-cam
1 year ago I bought a DS920+ and mildly hacked it to run a 5GbE adapter to my workstation. Performance is decent, files move at 350MB/s... I wonder weather I should spend 500$+ today to get the new one with straight 10GbE... also i don't know how much the resale value is
Ouch on that pricetag for a 'barebone' ... € 1850,=... pfftt... I'm curious to see what should warrant this tag.. Definitely seems to be aimed at the business market.
Looking at a "FUJITSU D2755-A11 (INTEL X520-DA2) 10G DUAL PORT SFP+" on fleabay.. good idea for a home magical 🦄drive? (non-Synology) - I'm new to SFP/SFP+ type network cards..so have NO clue... Thanks internet ❣
Does their backup program have the same bug as Apple's Time Vault? When Apple "backups" a file and there is a file error (generally due to the extremely low quality of their HDDs), the backup is truncated but NOT deleted. The user is never notified of the errors. As the older backups age, they are removed until only the truncated versions remain.
Wendell SMB Service out of Beta New Version 4.15.9 released, I have installed on a DS220+ with 6GB of Ram , When I copy to a Share on Synology I get around 220MB per second. If I do Active Backup for Business , I can't get faster than 110MB per second. I was hoping Active Backup for Business would work at 220MB per second. Also I copy from Synology File Share to Windows File Share I get around 220MB per second. Any Comments thanks, Great Review.
It's €8200 for Synology only system(6x 18tb HDD, 2x 2tb SSD, 1 X 16gb ECC ram and 2 x 800gb m.2) which isn't even the "top of the line" setup. Synology is NOT just 10% markup with their own stuff, it's more like 40 to 50% in NL. What a shame, it looks good but costs way too much imo.
There really should be an option to hide the non Synology error messages, a function to easily check for Synology hardware and something to explain what the error messages actually mean. Some people don't care and want to hide the 'errors' and some people deserve to know what's in the box they've purchased from a 3rd party.
the bigger question to ask what type (speed) hdd/ssd are you going to be using Unless you have a fleet of these nas units I doubt you are going blow out on the 10gbps lan unless you have the money to deploy 4x 8TB m.2 I can't see the point of deployment of 25-100gbps lan interfaces because because at 7200 rpm your throughput speed would max out at 100mbps so you would be battling to consume 2.5gbps over 10gbps link. 25gbps fiber link would be over kill
proprietary raid? so if/when the enclosure dies, you're just plain out of luck. maybe it's zfs or something? even still, is it a proprietary storage format? I have some external single drive enclosures that are absolutely useless. take a drive out and can't read it without the enclosure.
@@qazwsx000xswzaq you pay for the software running the thing too, that's why it's "overpriced". If you can DIY and slap a TrueNas you are not their target audience
Synology NAS systems are hugely unreliable. I've had TWO Synology 1815+ DiskStations systems crap out. The first one had a bad CPU, my current one has a blown transistor on the motherboard that makes it impossible to turn on. I had to hardwire a PC PSU (plugged it in with a PSU tester) to get the thing to turn on. I will _NEVER_ buy a Synology system ever again.
I always get a warning when setting up the M.2 read/write cache with RAID 6 that I don't have enough redundancy in the cache to support the RAID. Should I be worried, since Synology doesn't support enough M.2 cache SSDs to fix their own warning???
I just can't recommend something that changes their model and now you need our drives. I know i am buying enterprise drives, i know the difference between smr and cmr. If you want to be an enterprise storage solution great, but it feels like they are abandoning the people that allowed them to get there.
wonder if you can temporarly put in a GPU and install unraid on it. the synology "buy our drives" software is a deal breaker. the whole idea that its anything but a money grab is just BS.
when using this method and into installing games and running them.... what drive is best to use to keep the files on for each game.. should my os be on the m.2 and download the game to the sata and run steam from hdd?
Overprovisioned, not under provisioned. It's a smart (no pun intended) thing to do with SSDs. I'm still using a Samsung 840 Pro that's reporting 99% health with roughly the same overprovisioning Synology used on their M.2 drives. I've only been using 200GB of a 250/256GB drive for around a decade. The drive currently has 84,681 power-on hours.
I can see both sides of the hardware "restrictions", but really, this moves me away from Synology after being a happy customer & a person who has recommended their products without question (when suitable) in the past. Still like their stuff, but it's just not for me (any longer). Thanks for the vid.
2700$ cad for a 4 cores 8 bays. They can make that cheaper,much cheaper. That's a lot of profit on that little box. For 2700 I could make a better build with a quad 25gb ethernet ports for much less even with ECC. With windows server integrated yes.
everytime i want to start looking at NAS or building one.. my brain goes to 10gb, i need 50tb(no i dont) i need 4 m.2 1tb(no i dont) gpu (hell yes i do)
Can anyone tell me if there is actually feature complete alternative to SHR available outside of DSM? I run Xpenology at the moment purely because it’s the only thing that allows me to use a big pile of random drives in an array with redundancy and versioning. For context: I am way too fuckin broke to just buy a bunch of matched drives, and I don’t have a month of crying while reading stack overflow threads to learn the 10,000 ways to break a ZFS pool and 0.5 ways to kinda sorta almost not do something similar. I’m looking for an SHR replacement that actually *functions* like SHR.
@@BoraHorzaGobuchul Never mind, I did some more reasearch in the mean time. And I would never use Synology. It just doesn't have the features I want. And for what it is it is terribly overpriced.
I was considering something like this then I read that Synology will stop hosting their software for the older hardware for "licensing reasons" and that made the decision easier. You will own nothing.
Can anyone help me understand how 1gb/s or 2.5gb/s is saturation level traffic on 10 and 25gb network cards? My initial guess is it's something about theoretical vs practical limits, but I'd appreciate it if someone who's more familiar with the topic could explain what's going on here.
Bits vs bytes. 10 gigabit is 10 billion bits. You need 8 bits to make a byte, plus a little bit for overhead. 10 billion bits is theoretical max 1.2 gigabytes/sec and as a practical matter closer to 1.05-1.1 gigabytes/sec
Just sharing: $1,755.99 without disks, the NVMe cache, or the 25Gbps card.
As Wendell is testing, this is around $3,000+.
If you have the money, it's worth it.
Saying this as someone who, for the longest time, didn't have the money and run a NAS on a cobbled-together server with 6 different generations of hard drives.
@@SimonToth83 Ahem, this is something you can _very easily_ DIY upon any Linux distro for half the price and a lot of other functionalities (well tested)…
@@hankhulator5007 Yes, you can. As I said I did that in the past.
It is still 100% worth it.
@@SimonToth83 You can do so much things on a little server these things cannot, especially if you have a good deal of memory - in fact, these things are more comfortable for somebody who doesn't want (or doesn't know how) to put his hands under the hood or somebody in a real hurry without any spare time.
@@SimonToth83 you're paying for the convenience. That's all. Fedora with cockpit on custom hardware works great for those with more time
Regarding the drives failing while trying to rebuild and array, Wendell is 100% right. I had an 8 drive Qnap NAS in which one drive failed. I bought an exact replacement and the NAS went ahead and started a rebuild. After the rebuild for some reason during the night while I was asleep the rebuild completed but the new drive was marked as spare. I saw this and restarted the array rebuild being quite annoyed TBH, Remember, 1 drive has failed and another failure would be catastrophic. During the rebuild a second drive failed. Boom, you're dead. I got QNAP to login to the NAS and try to recover it but they were unable to. That left a VERY bad taste in my mouth. I replaced all 8 drives in the NAS with new ones at a very pretty penny. Remember folks, a single NAS is not a backup strategy. I have 3 NAS's and currently setting up another remote offsite all the way over in Europe. A second offsite would be nice.
The timing is impeccable! I was just rethinking my home lab setup with energy efficiency being a priority.
Definitely do a video on Surveillance Station please! Would love to see how it compares to Blue Iris on an 2U server with external DAS :)
Both suck. Use Frigate NVR
Petition for a second channel that is 100% dedicated to bewildered high voice Wendell
In Germany HAT5300 18TB is about 39€/TB wich is just rediculus,
they are only price competitive if you buy them bundled with the NAS, then they are 18-19€/TB (144TB Bundle).
THANK YOU !!!! I have been on a never ending NAS searching / familiarization journey.
Off topic Wendell, but as someone who recently lost 56lbs (and still losing) congrats AND you look freaking great dude!!!!
Being bit by a tick and becoming allergic to meat is not the diet most people would choose... Ozempic/wegovy or saxenda would be a better idea.
I really like Synology products. Got a DS1522+ and it's been awesome. I upgraded from a DS218 and got to keep everything exactly the same and lost no data. Will do the same thing when I fill the 48TB but I think that will take some time.
I know it is a typo and not what you meant by a factor of 1k, but I laughed at the thought of someone struggling to fill 48GB lol
@@prgnify Lol I did mean TB. Windows takes up almost 48 gigs nowadays so I can see why it sounded so funny.
Synology stuff is just great. Got a DS918+ several years ago just for the file sharing and possibly running as a media center (Jellyfin). Since also dumping all my personal photos and videos in Synology Photos and discovering Docker for running self-hosted services I am now deep into the homelab scene, discovering new cool services to run almost weekly. And for that, a plus-series Synology Diskstation is a great start!
So glad they finally released this. I have a client needing to replace 2 ageing Dell T420 servers and I was waiting for an update to the older DS1821XS+ before I made the move. Now I'm going to quote them for 2 of these, configured with 6x Exos-16 16 TB drives, 32GB RAM and a pair of Gen 3 NVMe drives...
Looks like the Synology drives are rebranded WD HC550's, so those would be an option to stay closer to the HCL.. and run cooler at lower wattage.
24:08 that beep! Had my heart skipped a beat
Your channel is so awesome. Thank you for sharing the OCD, may the force be with you.
I’ve, literally, been considering getting this exact unit!
One thing I'd love to see Synology allow in the future: The installation of small Transcoder cards or GPUs (NVIDIA Quadro P1000s) into the PCI-e slot for Plex, Kodi, Jellyfin, etc. Some of the older NASs don't support Intel QuickSync but that PCI-e slot would be super useful for an add-on card. Those cards could also be useful for headless VMs which might need GPU workloads.
If it's a thing... let me know please!
If it ever happens, it will be Synology label-branded cards with a 400% markup
excellent content as always! one of the best channels on YT!
I have a ds218+ with 6GB of RAM and two Seagate 2TB drives.. working fine for more than 5 years..
first time viewer, saw you on another video from 3 years ago, good job on losing weight, i , myself am also in the process of losing. keep up the good work.
My slightly older Synology ds1821+ does 50 Gbit with the same pcie card. Obviously using Linux Ethernet bonding, which is called LACP or whatever. Ubiquity switch on the other side. We also use a management port, because for a while Synology had drama doing LACP. I would not recommend using nvme with dramatic multiple bits per memory cell, and suggest using the higher wear level memory, optane is actually ideal.
20:15 you mean overprovisioned/over-provisioned; which is telling the SSD to reserve more space for eventual wear.
(It also means to provide any amount of space that exceeded the physical storage.)
Decreasing the amount of over-provisioning will never induce under-provisioning as the amount of OP will simply be zero.
Under-provisioning simply means you're supplying less of a resource than is required; i.e. a VM that needs 4 vCPUs but is provisioned with 2 is said to be under-provisioned.
Synology have been total AHs to their prosumer and small business unit customers. Apple-style disk and RAM vendor restrictions. NVME limited to 1GB/sec. Sucky customer support.
Maybe try x pen ology
Nope. You can use any "3rd" party RAM as loings its the same spec and what ever discs you want.
i was able to upgrade my ds918+ with non approved ram no problem no tricks to get it to work.
Where you saw RAM vendor restrictions, it's not HPE with their "Smart Ram" lol
@@bossman762x39 Yeah, Just get same type of ram and you're set :)
That 3rd party drive warning is pretty annoying knowing when I want to upgrade my ANCIENT Synology DS414. The main thing I would want to upgrade is to maybe have a 2,5Gbps link some day, but I get the feeling from this video it's not that easy to even saturate that, even with this monster NAS.
My 1612+ is sill chugging along, but I dread the day it eventually will die. If synology really goes nuts with the "certified components" stuff, it would at least bring up the question if the next one should still be Synology.
I'm planning to build my first nas and that 3rd party warning is the reason why I'm thinking of going with DS1821+ over DS1823xs+ since according to Synology's website DS1821+ should still support Seagate drives. At the moment where I live eight 16tb Seagate IronWolf Pro drives would cost me about 4177.08 US dollars, while eight 16tb Synology HAT5300 drives would cost me about 7332.99 US dollars. A 3155.91 dollar difference is a bit pricey in my opinion. Hopefully in a somewhat far distant future when it's time to replace the DS1821+ prices for Synology drives will have decreased or I'm able to slowly replace the Seagate drives over time.
From 22:30 you reminded me; I think this channel and STH are basically the only two that I would like to see playing with RS232 9pin devices, like the GPDPocket 3 and many others. Would you consider doing a video on them, maybe from the perspective of the power user/home labber but also from a straight up industrial perspective?
he is using raid6. I am using SHR1. I didn't have a drive fail but instead swapped out a littler drive for a bigger drive. I WISH it took a day. Mine right now is on step 3/3 (7.35% done on the 3rd step) & its been almost a week.
Thats a pretty old embedded Ryzen chip. If they went through the work to validate a newer chip, its a shame to go this old.
Surveillance Station sounds great, and I never tried it before I sold my RT2600ac. Would love to see a video on that!
It sucks. You have to cough up more dough just to add more cameras than the default 2
I switched from Blue Iris to Surveillance Station and it has been flawless. The reason I switched is that I had constant problems with Blue Iris and got tired of having to actively manage it. Once I got Surveillance Station figured out and setup I haven't had to touch it since.
You do have to buy camera licenses, but you can get them for $50 per camera and they don't expire. If you go with Blue Iris you have to buy Blue Iris, plus annual updates, plus the hardware to run it. All in Blue Iris is no cheaper despite what the BI shills claim.
I've seen people get 2GB/s (20Gbps) on those. Crazy speeds. (Not my thing, but I can respect it)
Great video would be awesome to get a deep dive Wendell / Ryan video on colouring outside of the Synology lines.
Synology packages can be outdated ie plex, with some basic tutorials I’ve gotten plex to current version. However it would be great to see if other self hosted applications like paperless-ngx could run without the overhead of a VM.
Great video, hopefully see some more Synology content in the future.
This NAS is almost perfect. I've been looking at an upgrade path from my 918+. But all the new units run AMD hence no iGPU/hardware accelerated transcoding for Plex. I wish the pci slot could be populated by a gpu
Yes! Or for complete overkill, an AMD Alveo Media Accelerator 😂
Wouldn't get the XS version though, Get the + version, Huge price difference at least in my region.
just bought the DS1823xs+ with 32GB RAM, dual Synology 800GB NVME and eight Seagate IronWolf Pro 18TB drives. Moved from DROBO. Drobo is out of business and their hardware is failing. I have 6 drobos all 5D3 two have died and three are dying. Must be a logic bomb or something in the firmware causing them to die. I know I could have gotten the DS1823+ which is for home and power users but why not? This was only $700 more.
I will buy the expansion Synology 5 bay system as I have five 10TB WDC Red Pro drives from a Drobo I'll use in it.
Thank you Wendell for a great review.
I recently ordered and returned a 1821+ due to faulty drive caddies. I was looking to replace a QNAP TS-873A that I've only had a few months. Sadly price has gone up on Amazon and they've said if I want a replacement I'll have to pay the difference. DSM 7.2 certainly looks interesting.
Hopefully this doesn't mean there's not going to be a DS1823+ and we have to wait until 2024 :(
Hi Wendell
Thanks for this demonstration. I noticed your Synology drives appeared to be formatted as btrfs. As you've expressed admiration for ZFS in the past, can you please comment on how reliable and flexible btrfs would be in comparison? (assuming Synology still does not offer ZFS options)
btrfs in this scenario is not setup to use btrfs' internal r5/6 mechanism but does use btrfs file integrity detection thing; snapshots run underneath. it's a pretty interesting solution that they've come up with to get around some of the worry about btrfs architecture for sure. I like zfs more generally, but this is faster. And zfs can be harder to get right i.e. its easy to get yourself into write amplification scenarios when doing the off-label uses.
you should have used Synology shr2 it is a raid 6 that lets you mix and match drive sizes this is much better if you have 16 tb drives ok I want 20 tb drives it will let you use all of the drive spaces without upgrading all of them at once
SHR is only available on consumer DiskStation models, not the "pro" units (basically all "xs"-models and all Rackstation products). Don't ask me why, this is how it is. :/
Was wondering about this
yeh, thats cool, maybe ill get one.
I returned a synology after customer support couldn't walk me through how to setup remote access using my own DNS from a source that their app recommends. Support is a joke !
Thanks for the warning!
Yeah you basically gotta google it. At that point just go truenas or some nix server
Please make a video about Surveillance Station! I recently got a used PowerEdge to use as my NAS, and want to use my old Synology with Surveillance Station and some IP cameras to upgrade my home surveillance.
Thanks for the great videos!
SS is meh. Too restrictive and license keys for more cameras adds up. Not worth it
@@burntnougat5341 Hey I already know about the licenses and it's still my intent because another $100 for them is a lot less than... buying a completely new system to avoid buying licenses?
Ya goofy.
@@scabbynack except it's not more expensive. You can run a nix server on any old hardware and run open source surveillance software that can support any number of cameras at no extra cost. Fool and his money...
The problem we had with Synology devices is there is no retailer that carries their drives in the APAC region.
A day to image a 14 TB drive? If your using a SAS drive and take the NAS offline maybe. Expect closer to 2 with off the shelf consumer hardware.
Got a DIY NAS with 4x 14TB Seagate Ironwolf drives here. For data scrubbing of the raid-6 it does need almost 24 hours. But maybe you're referring to some WD blue disks? ;-)
If my using what the what?
I feel like you misrepresented SHR. It's more automatic raid level management to optimise for space as opposed to blending SSD's and mechanical drives in arrays. In your case of the raid 6 array an SHR2 would have created an array the same.
Also those SSD drives are over provisioned not under provisioned.
I wish they had a decent tow bay with anything better LAN than 1gbe. Looking to replace my aging DS215+, seems like I have to look at QNAP.
Does this apply to the EU as well? My current Synology is not bugging me about off-brand stuff yet, and yeah, the diff in price is ~100%.
I will need to upgrade eventually, and I got used to the "setup and forget" nature of these things. So it would be good to know.
@Level1Techs At 18:00 you mention SHR with SSDs and HDDs in SHR.
I'm not sure if they ever allowed you to mix SSD and mechanical HDDs, but SHR is generally disabled in xs+ so maybe that's the software change you were talking about?
Otherwise, loved the setup/review video!
SHR was supported in 1821xs
I am using it in SHR and with regular HDD
more wendell
Thanks for the video.
Was hoping to Intel Optane and what it could offer?
Synology does not offer a "keep your drive"" warranty. That's fine if you don't care about the data on the drive that died, but if it is confidential in any way, and you need to warranty the drive, there is no good way to do so. They don't seem to want to work with you on sending the drive cover back, which is what WD and Seagate will do. It may be almost impossible to recover the data, but by policy, most places don't want to take that chance. "Just buy a new drive." Seems to be their answer.
Do you have a link for info on a "keep your drive" warranty for Seagate or WD? I wasn't able to find any info on this.
@@PseudoChris No, but they will usually take just the top of the drive in good faith. The last time I had to warranty a WD drive, they wanted a photo of the drive instead of the top cover with the label. Dell and HP, when configuring a server or SAN will provide "Keep your drive" and even Keep your device warranties. They do cost more, but if you need that type of warranty, it's good to have the option.
I find it so weird that people do off label use and then reach for support when something goes wrong. I consider myself the "typical viewer" for this channel; I often do push things like you teach us to, but then I know better than to call support with my issues. Maybe a support forum at most.
I thought that was common sense.
Xpenology with the redpill loader FTW. currently running the synology OS on a Ryzen 5600G. its just nuts. are there other OS options? sure. but synology's point and click interface is great
Wish they would bring back the 1520+ . The only 5+ drive that could do hardware transcoding.
Hopefully one day far in the future, we will have access to affordable, blazing fast CPUs that have, like, 16 cores, and can tear through video transcoding like a rabid pit bull tears through small children. Oh, and heaps of affordable ram too.
@@SirReptitious No need for that. 2 and 4 core Celeron transcodes videos with no problems. All it need is the integrated gfx.
More ram sure dont hurt though :)
got a DS1621+ with 32gb ram 6x 8tb + 2x 512 ssd cache to replace a windows 2012 r2 server
Wendell are you on Ozempic? Looking good dude
I guess I need to spend more time here, I need to figure out my storage setup but a good bit of the stuff you were talking about sailed straight over my head. Do you have a "for dummies" series?
It took a bit of tweaking for me to get our rs3617xs+ capable of maxing out the 10gb link, with 24 sata SSD's. That one doesn't have the ability to put in an m.2 SSD for cache though.
1:43 LOL! Well done, son. Well done!
@level1techs about PCIe slots please include if it’s gen 3,4 or 5… less knowledgeable viewers can be misled when trying to compare NAS by watching UA-cam
1 year ago I bought a DS920+ and mildly hacked it to run a 5GbE adapter to my workstation. Performance is decent, files move at 350MB/s... I wonder weather I should spend 500$+ today to get the new one with straight 10GbE... also i don't know how much the resale value is
2-3 mortgages in one device :)
thought this model only took their synology brand drives? did they open that up with a software update after people started yelling at them?
Would love to see if it's possible to hack in something like an Icy Dock ToughArmor MB993SK-B to get the extra drive capacity.
Ouch on that pricetag for a 'barebone' ... € 1850,=... pfftt... I'm curious to see what should warrant this tag.. Definitely seems to be aimed at the business market.
Same as the older DS1821, which is about half the price. Add 10 or 25 Gb/sec to the old one. Or buy 2 old ones. Can I run TrueNAS on it?
Looking at a "FUJITSU D2755-A11 (INTEL X520-DA2) 10G DUAL PORT SFP+" on fleabay.. good idea for a home magical 🦄drive? (non-Synology) - I'm new to SFP/SFP+ type network cards..so have NO clue...
Thanks internet ❣
Does their backup program have the same bug as Apple's Time Vault? When Apple "backups" a file and there is a file error (generally due to the extremely low quality of their HDDs), the backup is truncated but NOT deleted. The user is never notified of the errors. As the older backups age, they are removed until only the truncated versions remain.
Wendell SMB Service out of Beta New Version 4.15.9 released, I have installed on a DS220+ with 6GB of Ram , When I copy to a Share on Synology I get around 220MB per second. If I do Active Backup for Business , I can't get faster than 110MB per second. I was hoping Active Backup for Business would work at 220MB per second. Also I copy from Synology File Share to Windows File Share I get around 220MB per second. Any Comments thanks,
Great Review.
It's €8200 for Synology only system(6x 18tb HDD, 2x 2tb SSD, 1 X 16gb ECC ram and 2 x 800gb m.2) which isn't even the "top of the line" setup. Synology is NOT just 10% markup with their own stuff, it's more like 40 to 50% in NL. What a shame, it looks good but costs way too much imo.
There really should be an option to hide the non Synology error messages, a function to easily check for Synology hardware and something to explain what the error messages actually mean. Some people don't care and want to hide the 'errors' and some people deserve to know what's in the box they've purchased from a 3rd party.
Which model is comparable DS1221+ 8 bay rack mount or the TrueNAS Mini XL +?
Hikvision cameras are not knockoff products
the bigger question to ask what type (speed) hdd/ssd are you going to be using Unless you have a fleet of these nas units I doubt you are going blow out on the 10gbps lan unless you have the money to deploy 4x 8TB m.2
I can't see the point of deployment of 25-100gbps lan interfaces because because at 7200 rpm your throughput speed would max out at 100mbps so you would be battling to consume 2.5gbps over 10gbps link. 25gbps fiber link would be over kill
Can you do a video on shadow copy? I haven't seen an option to just turn on shadow copy on folders.
The walkthrough of that is in this vid :)
@Level1Techs What do you think about Synologys Raid F1 ?
proprietary raid? so if/when the enclosure dies, you're just plain out of luck. maybe it's zfs or something? even still, is it a proprietary storage format? I have some external single drive enclosures that are absolutely useless. take a drive out and can't read it without the enclosure.
As is typical with Synology now overpriced and underpowered.
Wait a second... US$1799..... WTF...
@@qazwsx000xswzaq you pay for the software running the thing too, that's why it's "overpriced". If you can DIY and slap a TrueNas you are not their target audience
Bought a used Synology 8GB ECC DDR4 module and my DS1618 still complains about it not being Synology, even though it is.
Synology NAS systems are hugely unreliable. I've had TWO Synology 1815+ DiskStations systems crap out. The first one had a bad CPU, my current one has a blown transistor on the motherboard that makes it impossible to turn on. I had to hardwire a PC PSU (plugged it in with a PSU tester) to get the thing to turn on. I will _NEVER_ buy a Synology system ever again.
I always get a warning when setting up the M.2 read/write cache with RAID 6 that I don't have enough redundancy in the cache to support the RAID. Should I be worried, since Synology doesn't support enough M.2 cache SSDs to fix their own warning???
Put the excess INXS.
Does 25 Gigabit Ethernet finally eliminate the need for sneaker lan?
But does it transcode plex
I just can't recommend something that changes their model and now you need our drives.
I know i am buying enterprise drives, i know the difference between smr and cmr.
If you want to be an enterprise storage solution great, but it feels like they are abandoning the people that allowed them to get there.
18:40 their claim is so not true. They could have partner with Seagate, WD, Toshiba, and just allow good hdd with good brand-name.
Good HDD with good brand name... So, not Seagate
wonder if you can temporarly put in a GPU and install unraid on it. the synology "buy our drives" software is a deal breaker. the whole idea that its anything but a money grab is just BS.
when using this method and into installing games and running them.... what drive is best to use to keep the files on for each game.. should my os be on the m.2 and download the game to the sata and run steam from hdd?
If you have expendable income and little-to no technical skills then Synology is for you.
Overprovisioned, not under provisioned. It's a smart (no pun intended) thing to do with SSDs. I'm still using a Samsung 840 Pro that's reporting 99% health with roughly the same overprovisioning Synology used on their M.2 drives. I've only been using 200GB of a 250/256GB drive for around a decade. The drive currently has 84,681 power-on hours.
It's under provisioned.
Isn't + means PCIe a lot available?
I can see both sides of the hardware "restrictions", but really, this moves me away from Synology after being a happy customer & a person who has recommended their products without question (when suitable) in the past. Still like their stuff, but it's just not for me (any longer). Thanks for the vid.
2700$ cad for a 4 cores 8 bays. They can make that cheaper,much cheaper. That's a lot of profit on that little box. For 2700 I could make a better build with a quad 25gb ethernet ports for much less even with ECC. With windows server integrated yes.
everytime i want to start looking at NAS or building one.. my brain goes to 10gb, i need 50tb(no i dont) i need 4 m.2 1tb(no i dont) gpu (hell yes i do)
They took away shr and restrict HDD compatibility. Not a good brand anymore 😢
Quite overpriced if you know how to DIY a NAS, but for those that don't - seems like a good option.
Can anyone tell me if there is actually feature complete alternative to SHR available outside of DSM? I run Xpenology at the moment purely because it’s the only thing that allows me to use a big pile of random drives in an array with redundancy and versioning.
For context: I am way too fuckin broke to just buy a bunch of matched drives, and I don’t have a month of crying while reading stack overflow threads to learn the 10,000 ways to break a ZFS pool and 0.5 ways to kinda sorta almost not do something similar. I’m looking for an SHR replacement that actually *functions* like SHR.
Ok, it's going in the right direct. But Idle power draw? Can I use FDE on the boot drive? ZFS?
No ZFS and no plans. Btrfs. Volume encryption is apparently coming in the next release.
@@dfgdfg_ Thanks for the reply! Sorry for being lazy and not reaseraching myself, but does Volume encryption include encryption of the boot drive?
Afaik the os is stored on the drives themselves. Whether it gets encrypted is a question
@@BoraHorzaGobuchul Never mind, I did some more reasearch in the mean time. And I would never use Synology. It just doesn't have the features I want.
And for what it is it is terribly overpriced.
I was considering something like this then I read that Synology will stop hosting their software for the older hardware for "licensing reasons" and that made the decision easier. You will own nothing.
So expensive
For the money, I’d build my own NAS with TrueNAS or OpenMediaVault, but it’s the time vs money trade off.
Can anyone help me understand how 1gb/s or 2.5gb/s is saturation level traffic on 10 and 25gb network cards? My initial guess is it's something about theoretical vs practical limits, but I'd appreciate it if someone who's more familiar with the topic could explain what's going on here.
Bits vs bytes. 10 gigabit is 10 billion bits. You need 8 bits to make a byte, plus a little bit for overhead. 10 billion bits is theoretical max 1.2 gigabytes/sec and as a practical matter closer to 1.05-1.1 gigabytes/sec
@@Level1Techs ah, I didn't pick up on the switch between bits and bytes, that makes sense. Thanks for the reply!
It ain't cheep! 🤔 😳
I don't use Windows.. blehh
NIce NIce but for that money you build a better one from pc parts and just put truenas on it though that's not for the faint hearted
Surveillence station is absolute trash. Only 2 cameras by default and like $50 to add new cameras. Total ripoff