I hate it when people indicate during or after a manoeuvre. The point of a signal is to let me know what you’re going to do in advance so that I know how to react, not to let me know what you already did.
Or worse. At roundabouts, you are stopped, the car coming from the right enters as there is a safe gap w/o signal so you stay put assuming they intend to go straight on. They peel off to their left. Had they signalled you would have had the perfect opportunity to go and now there is traffic coming from the right delaying you more. It's a simple but important process and shamefully not many drivers understand the importance of signalling.
My ex used to have a go at me for indicating when I didn't need to, like if it was right turn only. But what about pedestrians? They can't see the same signage as you, and they might not be drivers themselves. Ask any runner whether drivers indicate enough. There are some roundabouts near me where signalling is well below 50%.
Exactly this! When you are in a right turn only lane, that information is not accessible to everyone else, they cannot see the painted arrow that is under your car
Kind of a late comment, but I think instructors should teach their students to signal *at all times if changing driving direction* (that includes lane changes) for a few simple reasons: 1. The student and newly driver on the road will not have to selectively chose not to signal because they can get away with it. Otherwise not signalling becomes a habit faster than you might think. 2. Blind spots - mistakes happen, nearly every car will have a blind spot, especially when it comes to bikes and small vehicles on your side or other vehicles that turn into your direction of travel from an perpendicular road. 3. Night driving - far too many times I had the issue of encountering people driving on the motorway with all their lights turned off (or defective headlights). In case of lane changes you might just go into them even though you can't see them on roads that are completely dark. At least you have the benefit of cause if that happens and in most cases your signalling lights will reflect off the cars behind and you might manage to see it better. 4. Pedestrians (as mentioned in the video) that might cross because they don't know the traffic lights priorities and directions. They might just jump in front of you thinking you'll go straight ahead when you actually turn left/right. 5. Common courtesy to other drivers to give them an idea of your intentions. Not everyone looks just one car ahead of them (I tend to track at least 2-3 cars ahead of me to be as predictive as possible). Also, on congested roads, someone might wait for a long time to exit because other drivers won't signal their intentions (which leads to longer queues on that road and creating unwanted tension with some drivers). 6. It costs you literally nothing to flick that bloody turn signal. Obviously signalling should be done properly and not too early. But at all times you should signal and not get the mentality that you can *get away with not doing it*.
Absolutely, I like the sentiment of knowing who you are signaling for, but you can never have complete knowledge of your environment, so you should signal even if you think there is no-one there to see it. There might be a pedestrian planning to cross the road hidden behind some foliage. All your points are valid reasons in of themselves to always signal, added together it just makes sense to always signal
I completely agree and hate this idea of not signalling but until you pass your test you can apparently get a minor for unnecessarily signalling. I think this video is really about test conditions and not real life.
first instructor asked me cryptic questions whilst driving. I just pulled up and said tell me clearly or take me back.. he respected me more for stopping than continuing flustered.
I use to say to my pupils, a Signal is to inform, not to mislead. It is amazing how many road users don’t indicate at the right time, don’t indicate at all or mislead others into thinking they are about to do something else.
When I learnt to drive I was taught to always signal and you read the road, rather than other vehicles. I was surprised when accompanying a learner that there instructor had told them you don't have to signal if there is no-one to see it. This now makes sense, thank you! I will of course continue to signal all the time as that's how I learned, but this method does I think get you to the right place more quickly
Personally I put my signal when I'm about to slow down for the turn, seems to be the perfect timing in my opinion and it does scale well to the speed you're driving, this way people don't wonder why you slow down before they realize you want to turn, and you're not signaling too early so people think you're turning earlier. I find very annoying when someone slow down and I have more than enough time to guess he's tuning before they even put their signal on.
Joe Hew I have an Audi and always use the indicators but when I'm in my BMW I'm still trying to get the hang of not using indicators because I don't need to ;)
At 10.10 you appear to ignore that there may be pedestrian as a road user. sorry to be a bit repetitive but as a driver and pedestrian a lot of drivers do not bother to indicate for pedestrians.
In the scenario where there are two junctions one after the other, my driving instructor used to tell me to always indicate when I'm passing the first junction. Honestly though, the sad truth is that a fair few drivers don't bother to indicate at all resulting in quite a surprise.
Never indicate. Keep em guessing. It adds a sense of mystery to other people’s drive. They’ll discuss it for days, years even, especially if you drive a BMW.
I passed only a year and a half ago I had a fantastic instructor but as with playing music you never stop learning because different people have different ways of teaching so there is always some new piece of information no matter how small.
One thing about signaling that seems like common sense but many fail to realize (at least where I'm from) that you should signal *before* you start slowing down for a turn. The point of signaling is to make others aware of your intentions, so if you're slowing down for a turn without your indicator on, then you intend to turn and yet choose not to notify others about that. I realize it's usually not a big deal, but after being slightly inconvenienced by that on a regular basis, all those numerous inconveniences add up to a massive frustration. Sometimes people slow down for no apparent reason even by using their brakes, so when someone's slowing down for a turn in front of me and decides to indicate after they start slowing down, I either have to wait unnecessarily or risk doing an illegal overtake, since I can't be certain that they're not slowing down for no apparent reason.
@@sallybilzon3507 same, I still remember my msm and mspsl routines. But I did have one scenario during my lessons where I had to slow down before indicating left, I say indicate as your brake lights are also a signal light. Part of the road that I was learning on had a junction literally next to the sheep market car park I was instructed to turn into, my instructor did warn me that this part was gonna be tricky and sure enough I goofed it. I did my msm and indicated left, potentially confusing people behind me into thinking I was gonna go up the junction instead of the sheep market car park. OK so how could I potentially confuse other motorists with giving the correct signal? Well the junction is literally right next to the car park, that's how. I learned how to indicate appropriately in this scenario, brake + signal. (It's the Lairg sheep market if you want to find the road I'm talking about).
"you should signal before you start slowing down for a turn. " On the other hand, there are a lot of (usually middle aged) drivers who barrel down a road, brake hard, start turning and THEN turn on their indicator. It's one thing to signal in a laned road but it's absolutely necessary to tell following traffic to expect a change of speed on a rural single carriageway, etc. The rule of thumb I was taught was "around 3 seconds before STARTING the manouvre" (where starting means changing speed, etc)
I've made signaling at junctions for example into such a habit that it feels strange and leaves a bad taste in my mouth when I don't or fail to signal when on new and unfamiliar roads, driving without a seat belt on does this too! ....and I feel "naked" without my seat belt on.
Maybe not strictly relevant to your footage, but there are quite a few cars now that have a 'lane departure assist' gadget (like mine), that encourage the use of indicators to keep them quiet - e.g. changing from lane 2 to 1 on a motorway. Years ago, I never did before moving over ahead of a slower car/truck. The other issue is that on sections equipped with VSLI, it's now tolerable to pass on either side in heavy traffic, so in such circumstances it's wise to indicate in advance of a lane change.
Everything you say about using your position and speed to inform other users of your intentions is important and I agree with the idea that if a signal won’t benefit others, it’s unnecessary and you shouldn’t have done it when pulling away or stopping, if you don’t mislead or affect anybody else would that deserve a driving fault on your test?
The real question is, should taxi drivers have to re take their test every 12 months?! Considering they carry fare paying passengers, quite a lot dont know how to indicate or stop at red lights (had one yesterday where I stopped and 2 seconds later a private hire vehicle ran the red light). What do you think Ashley?
@@stephenmudiecastles.2938 Taxi drivers can be uniquely bad! It's a bit of a stereotype but it's a stereotype for a reason; many taxi drivers aren't great with signalling, and considering taxis are (almost always) carrying passengers they should be more considerate with signals than your average driver IMO.
Hi Ashley, I take a slightly different view (not saying it's correct). I personally don't think there is such a thing as a wasted signal, providing of course we don't confuse anyone around us with that signal. In advanced driving circles there is a lot of emphasis on signal if it will be of benefit, but at learner standard you are dealing with an examiner who will have been trained on his examiner driving test to signal at side roads etc (I think). Therefore a pupil who consideres a signal and decides not to, may look favourable to one examiner, but to another it may simply look like a missed signal. (hence you pointing out to your pupil in this video to signal for side rds). However if a driver does signal when there is no one to benefit, well its of no disadvantage to anyone apart from a bit more wear and tear on bulbs. I personally are happy for my pupils always to signal as they are moving off (note I say as they are moving not stationary, Ie hand from handbrake to indicator stalk) as it has no disadvantage at all, and may warn that person that just appeared as you were moving away. It also takes one more decision away from the learner. I fully understand the dangers of ill considered signals ie "I'm going right so let's bang the signal on" but a considered mirror check and observation to check that your signal isn't going to mislead,, (even if it doesn't inform anyone) is I feel OK. Remember our brake lights signal that we are braking, even when there is no one there to benefit. Just my thoughts on it Ashley, keep up the informative videos
Hi Graham I agree it’s a shame we can’t trust examiners to be on that level of thinking regarding signalling. The only disagreement is your choice to “take one more decision away”. Effectively you are making them less observant and less complete as a driver just so they can pass the test. Your perspective is much appreciated as is you time to add to this discussion. Many thanks, Ashley
Ashley Neal hi again Ashley, I fully understand the point about taking a decision away may make them less competent, but my point was regarding the fact that a signal with no one to benefit has no disadvantage. I would consider myself a competent and observant driver /rider, but I have no issues putting the signal on as I move off, why not. We have to be very careful that traditions that have gone unchallenged for years ie signal only if it benefits somebody, don't close our minds to a different view point. Regards Graham
I get your point Graham but how many people on the road put a signal on and move straight away? Treat a signal as saying "excuse me", which you wouldn't do in an empty room?! I disagree that putting the signal on when no one is there has no disadvantage. It does! Your pupil is not having to take effective observation and they get lazy. I have had this discussion with a lovely guy at the DVSA called Nigel Robinson who is in charge of all ADI examiners. He pulled me on an ORDIT inspection for letting a Part 2 PDI signal at a T-Junction when no one was about. I mentioned the point about not being able to trust examiners at a lower level to have this train of thought. He couldn't obviously agree but the lack of a true response told the story. So in summary, the DVSA at the highest level want my way of thinking delivered. Thanks for your time, Ashley.
@@ashley_neal "when no one was about" - It is deluded, arrogant and dangerous for any vehicle driver or road user to assume that they know with certainty that there are no other road users in the vicinity. The DSVA need to learn this.
My dad is in his 70s and always signal right to go straight ahead coming off a roundabout. It was something he was taught and I'm always reminding him that it could given the driver behind the wrong impression. Also, road positioning is very important, as that could indicate the direction you're going too.
LaiSan C not as old as your dad, but old enough that I was taught (and it was necessary) to double-de clutch, but find it astonishing that he was ever taught to signal right when going “straight ahead” at a roundabout.
There is a road near me where both lanes allow you to turn right. The left lane also allows you to turn left. There is no "ahead". If I'm in the left lane going right, to then use the first or second exit of the roundabout shortly after, I won't indicate right, and nor will most people. I think if you indicate right from that lane, it can look as if you are going to cut up the person in the right hand lane. Obviously you would indicate left as its useful.
Great videos good refreshers but I've been driving around 30 years and have seen driving standards plummet over the past 10 years to such extent I was questioning if it was me as older drivers get blamed for most things but no drivers these days have no consideration for others they drive at you they think the middle of the road is the driving lane the amount of drugs you smell from cars as they pass is unbelievable and no one wants to follow basic road etiquette they won't let you pull in or out they are happy to run you off the road irrespective if you have young children in the car and the amount of aggression is beyond a joke especially from the boy and girl racers I just see it getting worse especially when you see instructors encouraging dangerous and inconsiderate driving. When I learnt to drive in the 80's my instructor was like you so I know I was taught by a great instructor. Lets hope your students remain great drivers and ddon't turn into the fools already on the road.
One situation I managed was on a main country road. I had a right turn off coming up in 400 metres and an Audi up my backside ( I was doing the limit, 50mph) looking to overtake so after checking my mirrors I indicated well before the corner then positioned myself as close to the broken white line and stayed there, cancelled the indicator then put it back on again when I was closer to the turn. It was an interesting situation but the main thing is the Audi driver got the message and backed off.
Best lesson to learn is presume everyone is indicating wrong or not bothering and read what the other drivers intentions could possibly be, there are tell tale signs.
Always liked the old saying - the only certain thing a signal tells anyone is that the bulb works! The phrase in the police Roadcraft manual that I think describes the circumstances of use very succinctly is "signal whenever another road user (including pedestrians) would benefit or appreciate it - but do not signal indiscriminately".
I was overtaking slowly on a duel carriageway and as I was alongside a truck towing a trailer, they put their indicator on to move into my lane, I was concerned I was in their blind spot, they hadn't seen me and were about to move into me. I used the horn to warn of my presence being concerned they didn't see me. Should they have waited until I had cleared before using their indicator and changing lane or is it OK to leave the indicator on before being able to make the menouver. Was it reasonable for me to worry they hadn't seen me?
would an indercator be needed if it's a forced turning lane like at 4:09 behind the silver aldi, as you have only the one option, I only ask as your student has it on in the clip.
Should I continue to indicate on red lights the whole time while I am waiting? Should I indicate when I would like to change lanes but can't? Or should I only indicate when I have decided to change lanes. In other words, can the turn signals be used as a "request light"?
I agree it is about time and speed not distance the same with stopping too. You can put the highway code stopping distance in front of somebody but the stopping distances are useless you can't judge what X amount of distance looks like well. Thats why you should leave stopping time more than distance and go with the 3 second rule. Same thing with indicating really.
I got a friend of mine and he has what I believe, a somewhat bizarre style for signalling. So on a roundabout, he applies the signal perfectly fine, however he seems to cancel it himself way before the steering does (usually just as he's beginning to turn into an exit of a roundabout). I'm not sure why he does this and have questioned this but hos response is usually "It doesn't cancel the signal soon enough". Though I could argue this isn't normal behaviour, how can I make a good argument that this could lead to issues that might make him re-think his style of signalling is not best? Or am I wrong and it's actually perfectly safe to cancel it sooner? The reason I ask is years ago I remember my instructor told me "only (to) cancel the signal after you have completed the manoeuvre" (which atleast in my car, seems to self-cancel it at the perfect time IMHO).
Hi Ashley, I'm learning to drive at the moment and I'm always a tad confused when to signal when overtaking parked cars & bikes. If you're on a single carriage way road with 1 lane each direction even if it's big enough to be a 3 lane road and cars park on the left of it. (the stretch of road I'm thinking of has no road marking indicating the centre of the road (Marston road, Oxford. Clive booth hall bus stop if you'd like to look at it on google maps)) and I don't know whether I should be indicating, I don't because about 15-20 yards later there is an actual right hand turn. Am I doing the right thing not indicating there? And would it be different if there wasn't a road there? thanks
I love this thinking regarding “time” of signal.. it’s fabulous! I would appreciate your thoughts about signalling before moving off from the side of of the road? (Apologies if you have already covered it!)
Pisses me off when on roundabout, when you want to turn right, and people coming from right they don't indicate that they turn left, so I stay and wait for them to pass straight because that's where I think they going, and then instead of going straight, they proceed going left, like seriously, is it that hard to indicate that you turn on first exit letting people know that you won't go straight...
Could you include tips for indicating on roundabouts please. I think that is where most confusion occurs. Many people seem to indicate right when exiting roundabouts or fail to indicate at all. This greatly inpedes the flow of traffic.
i once HEARD a car signalling... like the reverse alarm... "WARNING.... THIS VEHICLE IS TURNING LEFT!!"... but you dont know which car is shouting and if every car did that it would be completely useless...
I kinda see what you are saying, however, I am still a big fan of only using the turn signals if anyone is to benefit from it. So, rarely use them late at night - no traffic, no pedestrians, no cyclists, etc, ergo, no one would benefit from the turn signal, so I don't bother using it. My mantra is just that - if there is no one who will benefit from me using a turn signal, then I don't use one.
@@szymongorczynski7621 True, I agree. Plus, sometimes you think there's no one because of the blind spot or something when there actually is someone you can't see. I mean what would it cost you to move that thing up or down?! Why not just do such a simple thing just in case?
The moreton roundabout in wirral is a pain for indicating, people in the right hand lane go straight even tho ur ment to be in the left, them road markings have been their since like 70s people dont use common sense they use the arrows and now days people who learned years ago end up causing more accidents for new drivers who learn to use left to go left or straight and anything after 12oclock to the right is to go right or right around annoys me that
For the same reason that a blind spot check is needed on every turn, a signal is also required on every turn. There is no point trying to figure out, ahead of time, if one is unnecessary or not. There exist some people who may want to know or need to know where you're going. You can't be in everyone's state of mind at all times.
A large level of observational skills is required to signal as described in the video. This reduces risk. To signal all the time is the opposite and doesn't require much skill in driving observation. Not many people can grasp this concept, but give it a go as you might improve your driving. Thanks, Ashley.
@10:43 Ah! After the third viewing I finally realized that it is the taxi driver who sets the bad example I should learn from and not the pupil in the car. I did have a hard time figuring out what we did wrong in that situation.
Always signal to let others know of your intentions. There's isn't always a need, especially if you are certain there are no other vehicles or pedestrians about. No point in signalling to an empty road.
Wouldn’t be the first time I have been sat in the car waiting to get out, see someone approaching and think “I’ll wait till this car passes” only to have them pull off or park without indicating because they haven’t seen someone. Complete fail on them indicating their intentions and inconveniencing others by not indicating. Remember just because you haven’t seen anyone doesn’t mean there aren’t people around
You won't get marked down if you signal with nobody around. Try to only signal when needed though as it forces more thorough observations. Good Luck, Ashley
I always remember my Dad quoting some instructor saying to him 'signalling to the birds?' (said in a very condescending tone!!) when using a signal if there is no-one around. You did talk about this when your learner was at lights and about to turn right. Also my Dad said there was no point on indicting to left when you had completed an overtake and were pulling back in. What are your thoughts on that Neal?
It has become a habit of late, for a signal to be given, around halfway through a manoeuvre. These people might as well not bother at all, for what good it does.
Yes, there is. Not everyone knows the intersection. Not everyone is a driver. Not everyone drove up to the intersection seeing the same signs you did. Pedestrians, Cyclists, Tourists,... they have no idea that you're in a turn-specific lane and they have no idea where you are going.
I always think, if I was a pedestrian, would a signal be useful. If the answer is yes, then I signal. Signalling isn't for your benefit, it's for others.
If you do not signal because there is no car behind 8.25, there maybe a pedestrian who is waiting to cross the road and will not know which way you are turning.
Unfortunately, the people that do care about blinkers will already use them, and the people who don’t care about blinkers won’t even see this video. I see people not using their blinkers every day, and tailgaters... Half of the population with a drivers license is crazy.
I think if an accident happened and there was video evidence of a driver not signalling at a junction for e.g. then that driver would be deemed at fault in my opinion.
Sorry, but I can never get behind the idea of deciding not to signal. There is ALWAYS the chance that there is a bike or a pedestrian or someone you just haven't seen that will benefit from your signal. If it is not misleading, use your signals. Of course this is not a substitute for checking your surroundings, but I don't feel that one needs to be sacrificed for the other.
I do feel you should indicate even if you think there's no one else around, especially with lane changes, someone sat in a blind spot for example, we can all make mistakes. It can also help idiots on the road be less idiotic. A motorbike speeding at 120mph down a sliproad might not be there when you check the mirror could be right next to you as you're crossing the lane. I kind of think of the indicator in these situations as a last resort if I've fucked up, at least I give others a chance to react to my mistake.
I think telling someone not to signal 'if there's no one about' is very bad advice. I think one should *always* signal where appropriate, in case there is someone you haven't seen, either vehicle or pedestrian, who will benefit from knowing your intention.
#ohgoodie but you didn't make a "comment". 1st "comment" isn't really a comment. What you thought about the lesson or any part of the video would be a "comment".
You shouldn't tell students not to bother indicating when changing lanes .. very bad advice no wonder there's so many accidents especially on motorways where people think you should just drift in and out of lanes willy nilly.!!! 😡
When driving your car, the time your spending looking at the camera should be spent checking your mirrors. Pay more attention on the road not your camera. Unless your parked up with the car out of gear and handbrake on. Drive safe
I hate it when people indicate during or after a manoeuvre. The point of a signal is to let me know what you’re going to do in advance so that I know how to react, not to let me know what you already did.
Or worse. At roundabouts, you are stopped, the car coming from the right enters as there is a safe gap w/o signal so you stay put assuming they intend to go straight on. They peel off to their left. Had they signalled you would have had the perfect opportunity to go and now there is traffic coming from the right delaying you more. It's a simple but important process and shamefully not many drivers understand the importance of signalling.
I thought this is only a Slovenia thing, but I guess there are dumbasses all over the world.
I couldn't agree more; if you signal at the same time as making the manoeuvre you might as well not signal at all.
That's called being a Mercedes/BMW driver
My ex used to have a go at me for indicating when I didn't need to, like if it was right turn only. But what about pedestrians? They can't see the same signage as you, and they might not be drivers themselves.
Ask any runner whether drivers indicate enough. There are some roundabouts near me where signalling is well below 50%.
Exactly this! When you are in a right turn only lane, that information is not accessible to everyone else, they cannot see the painted arrow that is under your car
Exactly what my driving instructor use to tell me..
I always indicate as early as practical without giving wrong information, was taught by a police advanced driving instructor
Kind of a late comment, but I think instructors should teach their students to signal *at all times if changing driving direction* (that includes lane changes) for a few simple reasons:
1. The student and newly driver on the road will not have to selectively chose not to signal because they can get away with it. Otherwise not signalling becomes a habit faster than you might think.
2. Blind spots - mistakes happen, nearly every car will have a blind spot, especially when it comes to bikes and small vehicles on your side or other vehicles that turn into your direction of travel from an perpendicular road.
3. Night driving - far too many times I had the issue of encountering people driving on the motorway with all their lights turned off (or defective headlights). In case of lane changes you might just go into them even though you can't see them on roads that are completely dark. At least you have the benefit of cause if that happens and in most cases your signalling lights will reflect off the cars behind and you might manage to see it better.
4. Pedestrians (as mentioned in the video) that might cross because they don't know the traffic lights priorities and directions. They might just jump in front of you thinking you'll go straight ahead when you actually turn left/right.
5. Common courtesy to other drivers to give them an idea of your intentions. Not everyone looks just one car ahead of them (I tend to track at least 2-3 cars ahead of me to be as predictive as possible). Also, on congested roads, someone might wait for a long time to exit because other drivers won't signal their intentions (which leads to longer queues on that road and creating unwanted tension with some drivers).
6. It costs you literally nothing to flick that bloody turn signal.
Obviously signalling should be done properly and not too early. But at all times you should signal and not get the mentality that you can *get away with not doing it*.
Absolutely, I like the sentiment of knowing who you are signaling for, but you can never have complete knowledge of your environment, so you should signal even if you think there is no-one there to see it. There might be a pedestrian planning to cross the road hidden behind some foliage. All your points are valid reasons in of themselves to always signal, added together it just makes sense to always signal
I completely agree and hate this idea of not signalling but until you pass your test you can apparently get a minor for unnecessarily signalling. I think this video is really about test conditions and not real life.
@@SuperSiggiboy A hidden pedestrian won't see you (or your signal) for the foliage anyway?
@@aztimms They've probably gone blind from wanking, watching people do stuff in parked cars.
@@dlucey123Facts tho because you get a minor
first instructor asked me cryptic questions whilst driving. I just pulled up and said tell me clearly or take me back.. he respected me more for stopping than continuing flustered.
I use to say to my pupils, a Signal is to inform, not to mislead. It is amazing how many road users don’t indicate at the right time, don’t indicate at all or mislead others into thinking they are about to do something else.
Being consistent with signaling is vital, even if nobody else is around signal that way it becomes an automatic action.
I own a BMW does this apply to me?
Shazzkid dont think applys to bmws they just go 😂😂😂😂
None of this channel applies. We see you coming and make allowances.
Brains are not allowed when driving/owning a BMW.
Didn't think BMWs came with the facility tbh
Yes it does - all cars whatever the make.
I love the way you guided the learner into understanding the importance of time over distance.
When I learnt to drive I was taught to always signal and you read the road, rather than other vehicles. I was surprised when accompanying a learner that there instructor had told them you don't have to signal if there is no-one to see it. This now makes sense, thank you! I will of course continue to signal all the time as that's how I learned, but this method does I think get you to the right place more quickly
Personally I put my signal when I'm about to slow down for the turn, seems to be the perfect timing in my opinion and it does scale well to the speed you're driving, this way people don't wonder why you slow down before they realize you want to turn, and you're not signaling too early so people think you're turning earlier. I find very annoying when someone slow down and I have more than enough time to guess he's tuning before they even put their signal on.
Never if you drive a BMW
Haha. I've got 2............and an Audi ;)
Joe Hew I have an Audi and always use the indicators but when I'm in my BMW I'm still trying to get the hang of not using indicators because I don't need to ;)
At 10.10 you appear to ignore that there may be pedestrian as a road user. sorry to be a bit repetitive but as a driver and pedestrian a lot of drivers do not bother to indicate for pedestrians.
Yet another great one. Time length of signal is a great way of putting it.
In the scenario where there are two junctions one after the other, my driving instructor used to tell me to always indicate when I'm passing the first junction. Honestly though, the sad truth is that a fair few drivers don't bother to indicate at all resulting in quite a surprise.
Never indicate. Keep em guessing. It adds a sense of mystery to other people’s drive. They’ll discuss it for days, years even, especially if you drive a BMW.
I passed in 1995 but find your videos helpful on little tips, thank you
I passed only a year and a half ago I had a fantastic instructor but as with playing music you never stop learning because different people have different ways of teaching so there is always some new piece of information no matter how small.
One thing about signaling that seems like common sense but many fail to realize (at least where I'm from) that you should signal *before* you start slowing down for a turn. The point of signaling is to make others aware of your intentions, so if you're slowing down for a turn without your indicator on, then you intend to turn and yet choose not to notify others about that. I realize it's usually not a big deal, but after being slightly inconvenienced by that on a regular basis, all those numerous inconveniences add up to a massive frustration. Sometimes people slow down for no apparent reason even by using their brakes, so when someone's slowing down for a turn in front of me and decides to indicate after they start slowing down, I either have to wait unnecessarily or risk doing an illegal overtake, since I can't be certain that they're not slowing down for no apparent reason.
I was taught to Mirror, Signal, Manoeuvre and a lot of people don't; they tend to slow down and then signal.
@@sallybilzon3507 same, I still remember my msm and mspsl routines.
But I did have one scenario during my lessons where I had to slow down before indicating left, I say indicate as your brake lights are also a signal light.
Part of the road that I was learning on had a junction literally next to the sheep market car park I was instructed to turn into, my instructor did warn me that this part was gonna be tricky and sure enough I goofed it. I did my msm and indicated left, potentially confusing people behind me into thinking I was gonna go up the junction instead of the sheep market car park.
OK so how could I potentially confuse other motorists with giving the correct signal? Well the junction is literally right next to the car park, that's how. I learned how to indicate appropriately in this scenario, brake + signal.
(It's the Lairg sheep market if you want to find the road I'm talking about).
"you should signal before you start slowing down for a turn. "
On the other hand, there are a lot of (usually middle aged) drivers who barrel down a road, brake hard, start turning and THEN turn on their indicator.
It's one thing to signal in a laned road but it's absolutely necessary to tell following traffic to expect a change of speed on a rural single carriageway, etc.
The rule of thumb I was taught was "around 3 seconds before STARTING the manouvre" (where starting means changing speed, etc)
I've made signaling at junctions for example into such a habit that it feels strange and leaves a bad taste in my mouth when I don't or fail to signal when on new and unfamiliar roads, driving without a seat belt on does this too! ....and I feel "naked" without my seat belt on.
Maybe not strictly relevant to your footage, but there are quite a few cars now that have a 'lane departure assist' gadget (like mine), that encourage the use of indicators to keep them quiet - e.g. changing from lane 2 to 1 on a motorway. Years ago, I never did before moving over ahead of a slower car/truck. The other issue is that on sections equipped with VSLI, it's now tolerable to pass on either side in heavy traffic, so in such circumstances it's wise to indicate in advance of a lane change.
Everything you say about using your position and speed to inform other users of your intentions is important and I agree with the idea that if a signal won’t benefit others, it’s unnecessary and you shouldn’t have done it when pulling away or stopping, if you don’t mislead or affect anybody else would that deserve a driving fault on your test?
The real question is, should taxi drivers have to re take their test every 12 months?! Considering they carry fare paying passengers, quite a lot dont know how to indicate or stop at red lights (had one yesterday where I stopped and 2 seconds later a private hire vehicle ran the red light). What do you think Ashley?
No comment ;)
Why only taxi drivers??Why not everybody?
@@stephenmudiecastles.2938 Taxi drivers can be uniquely bad! It's a bit of a stereotype but it's a stereotype for a reason; many taxi drivers aren't great with signalling, and considering taxis are (almost always) carrying passengers they should be more considerate with signals than your average driver IMO.
Hi Ashley, I take a slightly different view (not saying it's correct). I personally don't think there is such a thing as a wasted signal, providing of course we don't confuse anyone around us with that signal.
In advanced driving circles there is a lot of emphasis on signal if it will be of benefit, but at learner standard you are dealing with an examiner who will have been trained on his examiner driving test to signal at side roads etc (I think).
Therefore a pupil who consideres a signal and decides not to, may look favourable to one examiner, but to another it may simply look like a missed signal. (hence you pointing out to your pupil in this video to signal for side rds). However if a driver does signal when there is no one to benefit, well its of no disadvantage to anyone apart from a bit more wear and tear on bulbs.
I personally are happy for my pupils always to signal as they are moving off (note I say as they are moving not stationary, Ie hand from handbrake to indicator stalk) as it has no disadvantage at all, and may warn that person that just appeared as you were moving away. It also takes one more decision away from the learner.
I fully understand the dangers of ill considered signals ie "I'm going right so let's bang the signal on" but a considered mirror check and observation to check that your signal isn't going to mislead,, (even if it doesn't inform anyone) is I feel OK.
Remember our brake lights signal that we are braking, even when there is no one there to benefit.
Just my thoughts on it Ashley, keep up the informative videos
Hi Graham
I agree it’s a shame we can’t trust examiners to be on that level of thinking regarding signalling.
The only disagreement is your choice to “take one more decision away”. Effectively you are making them less observant and less complete as a driver just so they can pass the test.
Your perspective is much appreciated as is you time to add to this discussion.
Many thanks, Ashley
Ashley Neal hi again Ashley, I fully understand the point about taking a decision away may make them less competent, but my point was regarding the fact that a signal with no one to benefit has no disadvantage. I would consider myself a competent and observant driver /rider, but I have no issues putting the signal on as I move off, why not. We have to be very careful that traditions that have gone unchallenged for years ie signal only if it benefits somebody, don't close our minds to a different view point.
Regards Graham
I get your point Graham but how many people on the road put a signal on and move straight away? Treat a signal as saying "excuse me", which you wouldn't do in an empty room?! I disagree that putting the signal on when no one is there has no disadvantage. It does! Your pupil is not having to take effective observation and they get lazy. I have had this discussion with a lovely guy at the DVSA called Nigel Robinson who is in charge of all ADI examiners. He pulled me on an ORDIT inspection for letting a Part 2 PDI signal at a T-Junction when no one was about. I mentioned the point about not being able to trust examiners at a lower level to have this train of thought. He couldn't obviously agree but the lack of a true response told the story. So in summary, the DVSA at the highest level want my way of thinking delivered. Thanks for your time, Ashley.
Ashley Neal, cheers Ashley, thanks for the response and the info regarding ordit examination.
@@ashley_neal "when no one was about" - It is deluded, arrogant and dangerous for any vehicle driver or road user to assume that they know with certainty that there are no other road users in the vicinity. The DSVA need to learn this.
At the slip road at 9:52 if you were taking the other side would a right signal be required ?
My dad is in his 70s and always signal right to go straight ahead coming off a roundabout. It was something he was taught and I'm always reminding him that it could given the driver behind the wrong impression. Also, road positioning is very important, as that could indicate the direction you're going too.
Nice comment. Thanks, Ashley
LaiSan C Does your dad live in Verwood by any chance ?
Nope. :)
LaiSan C not as old as your dad, but old enough that I was taught (and it was necessary) to double-de clutch, but find it astonishing that he was ever taught to signal right when going “straight ahead” at a roundabout.
I live in Australia and see this quite a lot, young and old.
There is a road near me where both lanes allow you to turn right. The left lane also allows you to turn left. There is no "ahead". If I'm in the left lane going right, to then use the first or second exit of the roundabout shortly after, I won't indicate right, and nor will most people. I think if you indicate right from that lane, it can look as if you are going to cut up the person in the right hand lane. Obviously you would indicate left as its useful.
Great videos good refreshers but I've been driving around 30 years and have seen driving standards plummet over the past 10 years to such extent I was questioning if it was me as older drivers get blamed for most things but no drivers these days have no consideration for others they drive at you they think the middle of the road is the driving lane the amount of drugs you smell from cars as they pass is unbelievable and no one wants to follow basic road etiquette they won't let you pull in or out they are happy to run you off the road irrespective if you have young children in the car and the amount of aggression is beyond a joke especially from the boy and girl racers I just see it getting worse especially when you see instructors encouraging dangerous and inconsiderate driving. When I learnt to drive in the 80's my instructor was like you so I know I was taught by a great instructor. Lets hope your students remain great drivers and ddon't turn into the fools already on the road.
Brake and signal at the same time like most! Good job trying to educate people. Well done.
You should signal before you begin slowing down actually as it allows the person behind to anticipate your actions better.
One situation I managed was on a main country road. I had a right turn off coming up in 400 metres and an Audi up my backside ( I was doing the limit, 50mph) looking to overtake so after checking my mirrors I indicated well before the corner then positioned myself as close to the broken white line and stayed there, cancelled the indicator then put it back on again when I was closer to the turn. It was an interesting situation but the main thing is the Audi driver got the message and backed off.
Best lesson to learn is presume everyone is indicating wrong or not bothering and read what the other drivers intentions could possibly be, there are tell tale signs.
Perfect 👍 Not many are at your level 👏 Thanks, Ashley
Just follow - * Mirror - see what is going on - *signal - then you manoeuvre
Always liked the old saying - the only certain thing a signal tells anyone is that the bulb works! The phrase in the police Roadcraft manual that I think describes the circumstances of use very succinctly is "signal whenever another road user (including pedestrians) would benefit or appreciate it - but do not signal indiscriminately".
I was overtaking slowly on a duel carriageway and as I was alongside a truck towing a trailer, they put their indicator on to move into my lane, I was concerned I was in their blind spot, they hadn't seen me and were about to move into me. I used the horn to warn of my presence being concerned they didn't see me. Should they have waited until I had cleared before using their indicator and changing lane or is it OK to leave the indicator on before being able to make the menouver. Was it reasonable for me to worry they hadn't seen me?
The importance of signaling at mini-roundabouts can NOT be overstated
would an indercator be needed if it's a forced turning lane like at 4:09 behind the silver aldi, as you have only the one option, I only ask as your student has it on in the clip.
Well explained.
I secretly think youve read Road Craft or done the course.😀
Taxi pull outs.....everytime .
Should I continue to indicate on red lights the whole time while I am waiting?
Should I indicate when I would like to change lanes but can't? Or should I only indicate when I have decided to change lanes. In other words, can the turn signals be used as a "request light"?
It makes sense what your saying about the time in which u signal and when there is no one there and there is no use in a signal
Nirmal Kaur can you always guarantee someone further up the road is not making allowances for you then you go and turn without indicating
I agree it is about time and speed not distance the same with stopping too. You can put the highway code stopping distance in front of somebody but the stopping distances are useless you can't judge what X amount of distance looks like well. Thats why you should leave stopping time more than distance and go with the 3 second rule. Same thing with indicating really.
Can you make clip about gap selection? Thank you
I got a friend of mine and he has what I believe, a somewhat bizarre style for signalling.
So on a roundabout, he applies the signal perfectly fine, however he seems to cancel it himself way before the steering does (usually just as he's beginning to turn into an exit of a roundabout).
I'm not sure why he does this and have questioned this but hos response is usually "It doesn't cancel the signal soon enough". Though I could argue this isn't normal behaviour, how can I make a good argument that this could lead to issues that might make him re-think his style of signalling is not best?
Or am I wrong and it's actually perfectly safe to cancel it sooner?
The reason I ask is years ago I remember my instructor told me "only (to) cancel the signal after you have completed the manoeuvre" (which atleast in my car, seems to self-cancel it at the perfect time IMHO).
Hi Ashley, I'm learning to drive at the moment and I'm always a tad confused when to signal when overtaking parked cars & bikes. If you're on a single carriage way road with 1 lane each direction even if it's big enough to be a 3 lane road and cars park on the left of it. (the stretch of road I'm thinking of has no road marking indicating the centre of the road (Marston road, Oxford. Clive booth hall bus stop if you'd like to look at it on google maps)) and I don't know whether I should be indicating, I don't because about 15-20 yards later there is an actual right hand turn. Am I doing the right thing not indicating there? And would it be different if there wasn't a road there?
thanks
Dayumn, thought I clicked on a Jason Statham video in the beginning! 😁 Looking snazzy, boss. 👍
I love this thinking regarding “time” of signal.. it’s fabulous! I would appreciate your thoughts about signalling before moving off from the side of of the road? (Apologies if you have already covered it!)
Pisses me off when on roundabout, when you want to turn right, and people coming from right they don't indicate that they turn left, so I stay and wait for them to pass straight because that's where I think they going, and then instead of going straight, they proceed going left, like seriously, is it that hard to indicate that you turn on first exit letting people know that you won't go straight...
do you have to indicate right in a right turn only lane?
I don't. Purely due to the fact that I have no choice but to turn right. Just like I wouldn't indicate on a right hand bend in the road.
very informative vedio keep making these kind of vedios please it helps me a lot thanks 👌
Will do. Thanks :)
4:22 turn indicator off in time looks like she wants to turn left but goes straight and turns off as she passes
Could you include tips for indicating on roundabouts please. I think that is where most confusion occurs. Many people seem to indicate right when exiting roundabouts or fail to indicate at all. This greatly inpedes the flow of traffic.
i once HEARD a car signalling... like the reverse alarm... "WARNING.... THIS VEHICLE IS TURNING LEFT!!"... but you dont know which car is shouting and if every car did that it would be completely useless...
I kinda see what you are saying, however, I am still a big fan of only using the turn signals if anyone is to benefit from it. So, rarely use them late at night - no traffic, no pedestrians, no cyclists, etc, ergo, no one would benefit from the turn signal, so I don't bother using it. My mantra is just that - if there is no one who will benefit from me using a turn signal, then I don't use one.
And that's how people fall into the habit of not using them.
@@szymongorczynski7621 True, I agree. Plus, sometimes you think there's no one because of the blind spot or something when there actually is someone you can't see. I mean what would it cost you to move that thing up or down?! Why not just do such a simple thing just in case?
@@MuratGTR Exactly, I've just passed my test today and I'll use indicators no matter whether there is someone to see them or not.
@@szymongorczynski7621 That's great! I respect people like you :D congratulations by the way :)
@@szymongorczynski7621 It's really sad that people here in the Middle East barely signal, they don't realise the importance of following the rules :(
The moreton roundabout in wirral is a pain for indicating, people in the right hand lane go straight even tho ur ment to be in the left, them road markings have been their since like 70s people dont use common sense they use the arrows and now days people who learned years ago end up causing more accidents for new drivers who learn to use left to go left or straight and anything after 12oclock to the right is to go right or right around annoys me that
For the same reason that a blind spot check is needed on every turn, a signal is also required on every turn. There is no point trying to figure out, ahead of time, if one is unnecessary or not. There exist some people who may want to know or need to know where you're going. You can't be in everyone's state of mind at all times.
A large level of observational skills is required to signal as described in the video. This reduces risk. To signal all the time is the opposite and doesn't require much skill in driving observation. Not many people can grasp this concept, but give it a go as you might improve your driving. Thanks, Ashley.
@10:43 Ah! After the third viewing I finally realized that it is the taxi driver who sets the bad example I should learn from and not the pupil in the car. I did have a hard time figuring out what we did wrong in that situation.
Always signal to let others know of your intentions. There's isn't always a need, especially if you are certain there
are no other vehicles or pedestrians about. No point in signalling to an empty road.
When shouldn’t you signal, more like.
Wouldn’t be the first time I have been sat in the car waiting to get out, see someone approaching and think “I’ll wait till this car passes” only to have them pull off or park without indicating because they haven’t seen someone. Complete fail on them indicating their intentions and inconveniencing others by not indicating. Remember just because you haven’t seen anyone doesn’t mean there aren’t people around
I have my test on tue, when parked on side of road but no one around. Would i get a point for signal? Or do i signal anyway?
You won't get marked down if you signal with nobody around. Try to only signal when needed though as it forces more thorough observations. Good Luck, Ashley
Thank you
Is your student learning in an automatic?
I always remember my Dad quoting some instructor saying to him 'signalling to the birds?' (said in a very condescending tone!!) when using a signal if there is no-one around. You did talk about this when your learner was at lights and about to turn right. Also my Dad said there was no point on indicting to left when you had completed an overtake and were pulling back in. What are your thoughts on that Neal?
My instructor said not to indicate left when pulling back in from an overtake "because he might think you are turning left".
@@Jehannum2000 My dad told me that as well!!
Great videos Ashley
Many thanks, Ashley
7:03 "Don't kill pedestrians" I have to repeat that to myself too. Unless she said go instead of kill. In which case I may need some help.
I love signalling, because it confuses the BMW drivers.
Lol well said
Land rover drivers too
Gary Barlow is a man of many talents.
Observe,signal,observe again then manoeuver.
Please do not forget you may not be able to see the pedestrian who needs to see your signal.
It has become a habit of late, for a signal to be given, around halfway through a manoeuvre. These people might as well not bother at all, for what good it does.
Hi, is that a Rolex or a Invicta?
It looks like a Rolex Sub to me. Possibly pre-ceramic. Cant say for sure.
1:56 when the red light lasted for more than 1 minute
1:15 there is no need to indicate when you are in a turn right only lane
Yes, there is. Not everyone knows the intersection. Not everyone is a driver. Not everyone drove up to the intersection seeing the same signs you did. Pedestrians, Cyclists, Tourists,... they have no idea that you're in a turn-specific lane and they have no idea where you are going.
id like to see traffic lights give us a 5 second countdown for lights that are green turning amber like some ped crossings,
You can always rely on a taxi driver to give an example of bad practice!
I always think, if I was a pedestrian, would a signal be useful. If the answer is yes, then I signal. Signalling isn't for your benefit, it's for others.
Thanks very informative!!!
Nice one. Ashley
If you do not signal because there is no car behind 8.25, there maybe a pedestrian who is waiting to cross the road and will not know which way you are turning.
There wasn't! Rely on your eyes more rather than just signalling!!
What if you look in your mirror and you don’t see no one and you Signal to switch lanes, what if there’s a motorbike in the blind spot?
You’ll hit them. Look properly 👍
4.11 signal clutter, there's no need to have the indicator running when waiting at a turn left traffic light lane
ua-cam.com/video/x-G_MTpstUE/v-deo.html
I was under the impression that cars bought in my city came without indicators. Never see any.
Good demonstration of how taxi drivers think they own the road
Unfortunately, the people that do care about blinkers will already use them, and the people who don’t care about blinkers won’t even see this video. I see people not using their blinkers every day, and tailgaters... Half of the population with a drivers license is crazy.
I think if an accident happened and there was video evidence of a driver not signalling at a junction for e.g. then that driver would be deemed at fault in my opinion.
well we all know one thing....drivers of certain German cars definitely won't be watching this video! 😂
Where can I text you private I got an important question plz let me know thank u
Please direct message me
just do it while driving, it's really practical
Why don’t bmw signal
Why do you think?
Diggin the Polo Neck..
....because the lady loves...Milk Tray...LOL
I signal to let other road users know my intent.
Sorry, but I can never get behind the idea of deciding not to signal. There is ALWAYS the chance that there is a bike or a pedestrian or someone you just haven't seen that will benefit from your signal. If it is not misleading, use your signals. Of course this is not a substitute for checking your surroundings, but I don't feel that one needs to be sacrificed for the other.
One of my pet peeves when people can't be bothered to signal. I call it 'Broken finger syndrome'.
Don't move to this area then!
i signal each time i turn my steering wheel
I do feel you should indicate even if you think there's no one else around, especially with lane changes, someone sat in a blind spot for example, we can all make mistakes. It can also help idiots on the road be less idiotic. A motorbike speeding at 120mph down a sliproad might not be there when you check the mirror could be right next to you as you're crossing the lane. I kind of think of the indicator in these situations as a last resort if I've fucked up, at least I give others a chance to react to my mistake.
Ironic talking about indicators whilst having a Range Rover as the thumbnail!
How’s that ironic? Isn’t a range rover a car as well?
@@jamaica1681 Because Range Rover drivers are the biggest cunts who won't indicate 😂
👍👍👍
Handsome devil!
I think telling someone not to signal 'if there's no one about' is very bad advice. I think one should *always* signal where appropriate, in case there is someone you haven't seen, either vehicle or pedestrian, who will benefit from knowing your intention.
first comment 👍👍
#ohgoodie but you didn't make a "comment". 1st "comment" isn't really a comment. What you thought about the lesson or any part of the video would be a "comment".
You shouldn't tell students not to bother indicating when changing lanes .. very bad advice no wonder there's so many accidents especially on motorways where people think you should just drift in and out of lanes willy nilly.!!! 😡
When driving your car, the time your spending looking at the camera should be spent checking your mirrors. Pay more attention on the road not your camera. Unless your parked up with the car out of gear and handbrake on. Drive safe
He is just glancing quickly like half a second not staring at camera for 5 seconds
It's almost like that guy knows what he is doing...
do you check your mirror's all the time? i bet you fucking dont... so stop typing shit.
Sorry, are you an highly qualified Approved Driving Instructor?
scousers))