Nothing Is Wrogn
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- Опубліковано 19 вер 2024
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** TODAY'S PUZZLE **
How do you spice up the already-piquant Wrogn genre? By removing the 9 of course (and replacing it with a 0!). Trust Jay Dyer to do something so dastardly. Nothing Is Wrogn is one of those puzzles that leaves you shaking your head with admiration for the audacity and panache of the constructor - check it OUT! (And, despite what the answer-check at the end claimed, we do think Simon's solution is correct!!)
Play it at the link below:
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Rules:
Place the digits 0-8 into cells such that every digit appears exactly once in each row/column/3x3 box. Normal rules apply for all clue constraints in the grid (listed below), with the exception that any clue which has a 0 on it must violate its rule in some way. Correct clue constraints are as follows: Digits in a cage must not repeat and sum to the clue in the top left corner; digits on a thermometer increase from the bulb end; adjacent digits along a green line differ by at least 5; digits on a purple line form a set of non-repeating consecutive digits in any order; cells separated by a black dot contain digits in a 1:2 ratio; cells separated by a white dot contain consecutive digits.
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Thanks for the feature! It was really fun playing around with the paradoxical logic in this one while setting it.
The zeroes doing double duty in those paradox points was highly entertaining!
Yeah the bits of “this can only be true if it contains a 0, therefore it must be false” we’re fascinating Jay!
Amazing puzzle. Please create a Part 2.
This was brilliant, ty so much!
Another absolute sublime construction from you!! Your setting prowess is exceptional.
At the end, if you substitute the 0s for 9s, the solution checker works.
Yup. That's what i did too.
Yep!! Zeros are not recognized in the checker!
I think the name of the puzzle is a clue there 😉
If he had chosen a color other than red for 0s, I suspect it would have been immediately obvious what was wrogn.
My pun-addled brain made me laugh when Simon said "One of these digits has to be the naught-y digit" and I'm sad Simon didn't intend the pun.
😁
Love it!
I love how Simon kept checking to see if he could put a 3 in the corner but missed the first one he could of sung it twice
Yep the puzzle is ruined now.😁
He needed to disobey the expectations and therefore only sing it if there was a 0 on the same clue.
Otherwise there would have been nothing wrogn about it.
Edit: yes I know that it would be more logical to do it the other way around, but that is the fun with wrogn puzzles. They don't like normal logic.
@@blacksarlacc91 😄
I sang it for him!
@@margaretsinclair6697 and probably better
Wrogn puzzles are my absolute favorites, and the twist on this one is so fun.
I remember solving this when it came out. This is a fantastic puzzle and everyone should play it. Jay Dyer really knocked it out of the park with this one.
simon and mark always post abt when i usually start getting ready for bed, so now my nighttime routine consistently includes watching their videos, and i absolutely love it
Same 😄
I love how simon danced around trying to figure out the thermos, it's easier to think "if there's a 1 not in the bulb. it HAS to be broken, because 0 on the bulb breaks it by 0age, and not a 0 breaks the thermo by thermo logic"
No nullage on a broken thermo breaks by the rule set.
@@amoswittenbergsmusings what nullage? Zeroage (interaction with 0)
which is what he had already deduced much earlier but as usual had quite forgotten about
At times I have to wonder if some of these puzzle setters create puzzles with a 3 in the corner with a thought in mind to make Simon happy and hear him sing his song?
After thinking about it, I'm pretty sure its impossible to have a sudoku that doesn't have at least one 3 in the corner of a box
@@deltaangelfire it only gets a song if it’s in the corner of the whole puzzle, not in the corner of any box. There are only 4 corners, which can have 2-4 distinct digits in them. Often there’s no song for us 😢
Great puzzle, even if it was too much for me!
Funny to see Simon get _so close_ to resolving the two thermos 🌡 starting in box 5 and then moving on before the final step ... as soon as you've identified that one of them has a 1 on, and so one of the bulbs has a 0, the right-hand thermo *can't* be the broken one.
Also amusing that by the time he found the logic around the 36-cage being broken - ie, it _must_ have a repeated digit - the logic he had done around the thermo, the white kropki string and the pencilmarks/eliminations forced the r1c3 and r2c4 to be the same digit anyway.
That was a blast to solve, thank you so much for sharing it with us. And if you were curious Simon, you could have simply replaced the 0s in the grid with 9s and clicked tick, and the software would have seen it as correct.
Except if the cage totals were taken into account, and they should be wrogn, then the software would be fooled still. For example the "14" cage starting in box 5 would then sum to 24.
@@poppyholly1759 No, the web app does not check the cage totals. Bryan is right. I verified.
The hint says "Puzzle doesn't include solution", which means that the only thing the software checks is that the rules of normal Sudoku are not violated (one of each digit 1-9 in every row/column/box). You could probably fill the grid with numbers 1-9 while violating all the special rules, and it would still tell you that "the solution looks correct (Puzzle doesn't include solution)"
EDIT: Just tried it. Filled it in stupidly with the numbers 1 to 9 once each in every row, column and box, and got the message "Looks good as far as I can tell. (Puzzle doesn't include solution)".
That was hilarious that the 9-cell cage summing to 36 could be easily achieved with all the 0-8 digits, but then it'd contain a 0 and therefore not sum to 36! What a hoot!
Perhaps Simon could check the puzzle by replacing the zeros with nines.
You could change all the zeros to 9's to get the checker to work.
The other clues would be wrong then, the thermos starting with nine for example. The killer cages not adding up etc. I'm not sure how many the checker would pick up but I'm sure there's a few.
@@orosma868 I typed Simons solution into the app and changed the zeros to 9's. It said it was good. I don't think it's checking the clues.
Wonderful wrogn variant along with as usual Simon's crisp and exciting joy in solving it!
That was an awesome puzzle to do! Heaps of great gags - and Jay saved the best punchline to the very end!
Like someone else commented below if you double click the 0s and turn them to 9s, the computer says you're brilliant and gives you a chocolate mint.
I think the puzzle name is a hint 😉
Simon being so pleased about a number aligning is an absolute tonic.
55:15 for me. There's beautiful, beautiful logic all throughout this one. Amazing job, Jay Dyer!
Rules: 04:21
Let's Get Cracking: 06:52
What about this video's Top Tier Simarkisms?!
The Secret: 7x (02:22, 08:52, 08:55, 09:02, 09:05, 09:25, 09:35)
Three In the Corner: 2x (54:40, 55:40)
Bobbins: 1x (03:45)
Nori Nori: 1x (01:59)
And how about this video's Simarkisms?!
Hang On: 11x (19:15, 19:19, 24:31, 29:05, 29:10, 37:40, 42:01, 42:01, 52:58, 53:02, 54:01)
Beautiful: 10x (03:28, 20:29, 20:33, 30:06, 40:17, 40:40, 40:43, 47:40, 56:24, 58:31)
Clever: 7x (00:51, 22:52, 30:48, 47:44, 56:56, 58:16, 58:22)
Ah: 7x (12:30, 20:29, 20:29, 22:14, 29:05, 45:25, 45:25)
Brilliant: 5x (01:51, 32:32, 32:35, 53:23, 58:05)
By Sudoku: 5x (27:41, 32:02, 33:44, 40:23, 55:45)
Goodness: 4x (03:37, 05:37, 33:32, 49:38)
Naughty: 4x (07:56, 07:59, 08:01, 30:17)
Pencil Mark/mark: 4x (16:14, 28:52, 34:38, 50:47)
Lovely: 3x (14:32, 14:32, 22:17)
Obviously: 3x (18:58, 38:17, 38:49)
Sorry: 2x (18:02, 40:39)
Stuck: 2x (44:40, 51:20)
Stunning: 2x (03:37, 56:27)
Wrogn: 2x (00:22, 00:48)
Snake: 2x (02:24, 02:26)
What Does This Mean?: 2x (08:04, 32:12)
Out of Nowhere: 1x (30:09)
In the Spotlight: 1x (55:42)
Off to the Races: 1x (53:39)
Incredible: 1x (01:17)
Our old Friend Sudoku: 1x (34:44)
Bonkers: 1x (04:08)
In Fact: 1x (35:15)
Wow: 1x (11:59)
Let's Take Stock: 1x (43:18)
Panache: 1x (58:10)
Have a Think: 1x (14:59)
Nature: 1x (29:15)
Most popular number(>9), digit and colour this video:
Thirty Six (10 mentions)
One (128 mentions)
Green (36 mentions)
Antithesis Battles:
High (5) - Low (4)
Even (11) - Odd (7)
Higher (2) - Lower (0)
Black (27) - White (17)
Row (11) - Column (10)
FAQ:
Q1: You missed something!
A1: That could very well be the case! Human speech can be hard to understand for computers like me! Point out the ones that I missed and maybe I'll learn!
Q2: Can you do this for another channel?
A2: I've been thinking about that and wrote some code to make that possible. Let me know which channel you think would be a good fit!
Thanks bot!
CTC please pin these comments
There was also a bobbins at 41:11 xD
How about forms of "doing work"?
41:33 "doing (some) work"
55:59 "(is) doing work"
56:31 56:43 Hold up! Do we need to count the two "Bobbins" Sven coded into the "not quite right" popup?
CTC videos excite me twice as much when it’s a puzzle I’ve already solved even though I’ve already “spoiled the plot of the video” for myself, which is unusual for me when watching videos
It feels great knowing that I solved a puzzle that took Simon CtC a whole 50 minutes, and it’s fun to see his path through it
I agree -- and "the plot of the video" isn't always "what's the solution?" but "what clever baroque way will Simon find to place a digit when the other 8 digits in the same box AND in the same row are already filled in, but using that fact is plain sudoku and therefore not exciting?" 😸
This was a delightful and hilarious ruleset. I enjoyed my solve immensely, despite having to unwind from multiple errors.
Glad we got a “that’s 3 in the corner”, but I’m sad we missed “that’s 3 in the corner”.
Your checker doesn't like zeros. Swap all the 0s to 9s.
Absolutely brilliant, Jay Dyer. Brilliant!
THAT IS INCREDIBLE!! I love the idea of it, and the paradoxes are so clever and beautiful. It flows so smoothly too. Well set and well solved as usual!!
At the end for the check. i tricked mine by replacing the 0s with 9s and it told me it was right. so the software isn't checking the cage totals/repeats, nor any other clue, and likely just checking if there's 1-9 in each row/col/box
What a fantastic puzzle! I almost never try a puzzle in a video over 40 minutes, but as Simon was giving the rules, I immediately saw some deductions. 45 minutes later, I managed to put together the solution. Really beautiful logic, and just the right amount of frustration with liar clues' ambiguity
35:06 - Can't believe you missed the 3 in the corner. Especially since you got the one at 55:43
Since we've had a puzzle with two 3s in corners and only a 50% success rate on recognizing it, the new challenge should be to set a puzzle with two 3s in corners and a 0% success rate on recognizing it. 🤣
Brilliant puzzle - well done Jay & Simon for the solve. Sven probably failed it because of the Zeros. A quick change from them to 9s would confirm that I guess.
That's what I did.
this puzzle kicked my a$$.. 80 minutes, and needed a couple hints from Simon to make my way to the end. and I had the same panic as Simon when checking the solution.. but of course, it's all Wrogn!
25:39 Can actually just place the 0 at r6c4 here - as Simon proved whichever thermo has the 1 in row 7 has to have the zero in its bulb, but if you put that 1 in r7c7 and the zero in its bulb, its tip will be a 6, 7 or 8 and it will be "rihgt" when the zero says it's supposed to be "wrogn"
Same idea! Luckily, Simon figures it out near 47:00 :)
37:00, sorry
What an absolute gem of a puzzle. HOW DOES ANY HUMAN COME UP WITH THIS STUFF?? I mean, there is like 10 different , completely unique and original tricks that has to do with the 0-8 logic COMBINED with the 0 is wrogn logic that just keeps appearing from the very beginning to the very end. absolutely spectactular.
I have been listening to Simon solving puzzles to go to sleep since last year :) works better than any ASMR. Than you CTC ❤
The Wrogn Saga continues!
Best puzzle I've done this year! Took me ages but whenever I got stuck and was just about to give up, I found something to keep going. Superb!
Simon at 39:14 "I do not know where the 1 goes"
1s in columns 1 and 2: "Are we a joke to you?"
Beautiful puzzle. When they cascade into solving one part helps solve another part is magical.
As always, Simon, you love the wrogn puzzles - and therefore so do I. I actually did get that the bottom row would be the key to the break-in because of the problem of 5, but did not think about the problem of 4. But as soon as you mentioned it, I could see immediately which line had to be the 045 line. Why do I mention this? Is it because I am so smart? NO! I am not so smart - but I have learned so very much from watching this channel that some things that I had to pause the video and rewind and watch again and again and then eventually just take it as true without fully understanding it ... I can now see for myself. Thank you for the fun, instruction, and your thoroughness in explaining what you are thinking. Even an old, hard head like mine will catch on. (And thanks for the video!)
😀
Elegant spoken words from you Emily!!!
@@davidrattner9 Emily ranks for me in the top echelon qua comments in our community.
Amos Wittenberg agree with you amos, along with you and your dedicated limericks and long way and her claps, hearts and amazing dedication!
@@amoswittenbergsmusings agree!
Interesting two-way logic. First finding the zeros based on what clues can't be true and then later, once the zeroes were placed, making sure the clues with zeroes are indeed false. I'm frustrated with myself about constantly forgetting about the second part. I wouldn't mind solving another one of these now that I've learned these lessons.
Simon, a quick way to check the answer was true would have been turning 0s to 9s and then the software gives thumbs up.
This was the first wrogn puzzle I was able to "sort of" do, though I got stuck a number of times and needed a hint or correction. Very very fun puzzle though.
That logic on the bottom 2 thermos was available as soon as the stems were marked: the right one could not start 0-6 (or 0-7) since that would place a 1 on the left hand stem, necessitating a 0 in its bulb; which would place 2 0's in the row.
edit; the right thermo could not start 0-1 because that would make the whole thermo correct (0-1-and a digit bigger than 1), and thus could not contain 0.
Therefore the right thermo could not contain a 0.
At 16:19, when Simon filled the 1678 into the remaining cells of box 9, you could immediately say that R7C7 could not be 1 (because it would force a 0 into the bulb and the thermo be correct--contradiction!).
You could have checked if you had not made a mistake by replacing the zeros with 9s, the software checked for normal sudoku rules, I checked your solution using 9s and your solve was correct.
PHISTOMEFEL'S NORI NORI??? I spited out my G&T! I cannot wait for my Christmas present!
58:00 You could just change all zeros with nines and it will tell you: "Yey, Congrats! Looks good as far as I can tell"
I did it and it told me so.
P.S. Oh, a few people have wrote about this already 😀
Interesting to note the "zero means wrogn" is self-enforcing on the black kropkis, since the zero still can't repeat in a row/column...
I would say It is self enforcing, and it would be even if it could repeat. But I am not sure I understand what you mean.
@@Paolo_De_Leva If you could repeat a 0 in a row you would have to avoid putting a 0•0 since that would be not be "wrogn" (0 x 2 = 0)
@@HunterJE The ratio between 0 and 0 is undefined (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Division_by_zero). It has infinite solutions. It is neither 0,5 nor 2. It is an infinite set, if you like. So, two zeroes on a black dot would make it wrogn.
@@Paolo_De_Leva "the ratio" is undefined, but 0 and 0 could be considered to be "in a 1:2 ratio", since there is an x such that 0 is 1*x and 0 is 2*x.
@@iabervon If you write 0/0 = 2, you arbitrarily choose one of the infinite values of _x_ for the equation 0x = 0. *Undefined* means you are not allowed to choose‼ Moreover, if you really want to ignore this convention, which as far as I know is accepted in any math 101 textbook, the most sensible choice for the value of _x_ would be 0 or 1 (since 0/x = 0 and x/x = 1 for any nonzero value of x). Certainly neither 2, nor 0.5‼
In short, according to a widely accepted convention, you are not supposed to use a fraction to compare the sizes of two zeros. No zero should be considered to be twice as large as another zero, because it simply makes no sense.
53:42, on my phone while doing other stuff. Great logic. I was stuck in the middle and watched enough of the video to put in my head that a zero on one of three black dots in a row ONLY negates the dot(s) that's its touching. Duh!
I really liked the 35 cage. "Oh, that's the sum of 0 through 8! Wait, but that zero means it's false, what? Oh!"
I checked it by replacing the 0s with 9s. The software found that to be correct (as far as it could tell), so definitely a software error at the end. It just doesn't handle the 0s.
Now solvers can input the solution for the app to check whatever the ruleset is.
Also zven app automatical check does work when replacing 0s by 9s (it also means constraints are not checked).
I can’t believe the puzzle title is not “Nothing Is Wr0gn”!
Great solve! Simon, you are one of my favorite people too😊
48 minutes for me. I love how often candidate cells for zero would contradict its own rule by making the clues correct.
There were a series of delicious deductions to be made in this puzzle and for me it mostly flowed very smoothly. I did get held up by box 1 because I kept overlooking the fact that 0 and 1 are adjacent numbers. In my defence it's not something I usually have to consider when solving sudokus. Great puzzle, thanks.
Easiest way to double check was to double click all the 0s and make them 9s.
A great solve. I think after completing this type of puzzle it's befitting that the checker should report things are wrogn!
General observation: I have to the best of my recollection *never* seen a thumbs-down on *any* comment. Where do you find such a community??
Remember the dislike bot that used to spring into action milliseconds after the release of a CtC video? It has died of pure frustration,
36:48 the 1 in R7C7 could've been eliminated a lot earlier - as soon as you found there was a 0 on one of the bulbs the 2nd digit couldn't be a 1 because 0 1 X is a correct thermo.
49:05 I immediately notice this cannot have a 4, because 4-5 is impossible since there's always a 5 on the white dot run, and if it's 4-3 the white dot run has to be 7-6-5 leaving R2C2 with no value
Quick check is to replace the zeros with nines and check. as we all know if it passes everything was right with the zeros in it.
I only managed to determine the 5 cage was a 2/3 pair before my brain short circuited, melted, and oozed out my ears
A wonderful caper. Loved watching the solve. Thank you.
It is a really interesting idea. It takes a while to adapt to the ruleset but the logic just flows nicely.
33:52 ... another wonderful false-logic sudoku!
Loved solving this puzzle!
I had a rough night with the 1 year old last night, and seeing a Wrogn puzzle released made me almost giddy.
39:20 or so in... "I do not know where the 1 goes..." says Simon. However, if he'd done his sudoku, he'd notice the 1 could go into either of two squares... but the since the first square is in the first column and there is already a one there, it must go into the third column. By sudoku!
This one took me 75 minutes. Oof, what a brain-bender!
I had to check the video after I reached the end because the program said the puzzle was incorrect, but I ended up with the same solution as Simon, and that's good enough for me.
Bro ok so I was working on this puzzle for 70 minutes, and then I became completely stuck, so I decided to watch simon’s video just for the parts that I already managed to solve…..and for some reason, when Simons mouse cursor hovered over the consecutive dot at 32:20….a lightbulb just lit up in my brain and instantly knew you couldn’t put 8 into row 5 column 3. I went back to my solve and what do you know….finished it about 5-10 minutes later 🎉
I love how the zeroes do double duty. I love Jay Dyer's brain.
63' 😵😵😵
It took me forever to see the negative contraint in box 3 (I hope Simon didn't forget to sing 😁)
At least I finished it...
This was loads of fun! Needed Simon to start up my brain in the beginning, but it quickly rolled out after the 045 triple
What a great puzzle! Proud of & and very happy with my 1h12 solve. Setting such a puzzle.. wow wow 👌
Changing all the zeros into nines would allow the check for correctness (of the pure Sudoku part, I am not sure that the software can check if all the non Sudoku rules are fulfilled).
Many setters are embedding solutions now, which allows for solution checking to work with puzzles like this. For some reason all of that gets removed when puzzles get featured, which is a shame, because it would have avoided the confusion at the end.
There is something profoundly terrifying about Jay Dyer's brain!
Jay Dyer can bust the secret of Sudoku - how will Phistomefel respond to the challenge ...
I feel like there are some weird tricks you could do with using 0-8 in a non-wrogn puzzle. You'd be able to put 5 on a green line (but not 4), you could put 1 in the middle of consecutive white dots, etc. Most of the tricks would basically just be shifting the normal secrets down one number, but cages and little killers could get pretty interesting.
I fear I will be yelling THE ONLY ODD DIGIT LEFT FOR THE WHITE DOT IS 1 for all eternity
This one was a lot of fun to do! I had the same "Ow no" as you at the end, and then doubleclickreplaced all the 0s by 9s and then said it was correct when ticking the check box :)
If you turn all 0s to 9s, the software will accept the answer as correct, but not if 0s are 0s, so apparently the 0s even want to break that rule.
This one definitely reminds me of the "lady or tiger" puzzles popularized by R. Smullyan.
Swapping the zeros for nines confirms it's correct.
This puzzle was great fun. Loved the logic that unwinds around the zeroes.
I believe the rules should state that any clue which has a zero in it must violate its rule in "at least one way" instead of "some way," since the latter implies singular.
If I input your solution and then change all 0's to 9's I get a solution looks good as far as I can tell. So it's literally just the 0's it doesn't like. So no, it's not checking the killer totals.
You can check the solution using the software by changing all the 0s to 9s. It says correct then
If you replace the zeros with 9's, you'll a "correct" from the software.
hi, i usually solve the puzzles along with you, many times stopping the video and continuing solving until I finish the puzzle, or get stuck and continue til your next clue. in this one, when I finished and didn't get the check, went back to the video, and as I saw you had the same dilemma, i went back and replaced the zeros for nines, and voila, the checker did function right this time.
A completely unexpected 29:17 for me. Once I got the 'if this is wrong then that must be right' concept I literally just flew through the whole puzzle. Was as amazed when the checker told me it was wrong but as it didn't highlight anything like it normally does when you switch two numbers I figured I could try replace the 0s with 9s and I got the cheer.
If you change the zeros to 9s and click submit, the software takes the answer.
26:10 Not sure if he gets back around to it with this logic (edit: he does at 36:30), but you can determine the 0 in box 5 at this point. You can exclude the 1 from R7C7 because that forces a 0 in R6C6 and creates a paradox because the bulb will be in order and have a 0. That means the 1 is in C7R1-3 and thus the thermo is broken and requires a 0 in R6C4.
"Let's do the green. Now... let's erase the green."
Simon being half blind to same-row-exclusions by exclusive pairs, part 821.
Trying changing all the 0s to 9s and see if the software recognizes it as a valid solution.
replace 0's with 9's at the end and the software recognises the solution
Yeah, because it doesn't do answer checking, it literally only checks whether what it receives at the end is a valid sudoku grid, i. e. every row, column, and box have 1-9 once each.
They do have a way to include a given solution in their software now afaik where the software checks whether that exact solution was given but it's absent here.
wow the negative constraint for the 14 cage and the white dot in box 4 was really pretty
When I finished the puzzle, I double-clicked the 0's and turned them all into 9's. The software treated that as correct. So the issue with the checker is that it doesn't think 0's are "right".
I have to admit, those white dots in box 4 had me giggling like a maniac at three in the morning!
Random thought: Sudoku is kind of like correspondence chess, except your opponent has written down every move they intend to make
When the tick failed me at first I thought I had made a mistake at some point, so I backed up a bit and tried again, only to end up with the same answers again, so I just highlighted all of the 0s and turned them into 9s and it accepted the solve. So the software is looking for a each 1-9 digit in each row, collum and box but can't find any 9s, so displaying the puzzle as incomplete.
53:34 for me. Lovely Wrogn puzzle!
I'd been totally unable to get a handle on this one until starting the video, just didn't think of how the lack of 9s would affect the GWs, and somehow even though I'd figured out the 36 cage it never occurred to me that 16 was an impossible total `^^ But it went pretty smoothly after that! Though I needed a lot of pencil marking esp. in the beginning, lol... Very fun once you get a handle on it
You could probably have gotten the software to be happy with your solution by replacing the 0s with 9s
For the checking. It should highlight the cells that it thinks are wrong. I think it highlights wrong cells them in red but your zeros are already red so I suspect that it just doesn't like the zeros and the highlighting just doesn't show up.