Name the last season we truly had transformative tier sets. Everyone might be able to come up with 1 season for their spec - and if you look at all of those seasons, at best the season will have like 2 out of 40 truly transformative bonuses. Absolutely nothing changed. They're not going in any direction they haven't been going in for a decade now.
They have in the past and it caused people to wear 2 set from current tier and 2 set from last tier if the 2 set effects were stronger. And it honestly doesn't feel good knowing that by breaking last raids 2 set with an ilvl bump from current raid is making you technically weaker.
They should remove tracks from gear completely and just have the items drop at a base level determined by the content you are doing and you can spend the various crests to upgrade them to whatever the tier cap is it will be controlled by the crest limits. One of the things that people are missing in the discussions is Hero track's basically meaningless this season by trying to stretch out the gearing for mythic raiders they disincentivized the rather larger group of people who did normal/heroic raid and medium keys.
Or get rid of the gear grind. Just no more gear upgrades. One flat ilevel for a piece of gear. Run your 8 highest keys for vault and be done. Having to get flightstones plus crests on different tiers just to keep you in dungeons is stupid.
Part of the "m+ on-ramp" problem is also just that dungeons are way too complicated this expansion. I've been learning prot pally in 2s and 3s as a veteran healer/dps player and good lord the amount of ways new players find to fuck up a key is insane. Missed kicks - and remember the default UI is complete ass for looking at kicks - can kill you in a 2! I can't imagine an actually new player having my current experience and deciding to continue on with m+. It's completely miserable. New players need to be able to learn the dungeons in a way that isn't this complete clusterfuck trial by fire thing we have now.
u simply dont die to a missed kick in +2s. u maybe die if nothing is kicked at all. Player dont search for any information about the dungeon and have like no learning curve when they are playing. And yes, if u do EVERYTHING wrong, maybe ur supposed to die (ingame).
I think the follower dungeons should have you go into a pull, the game pauses and a pop up window comes up saying whats happening in the pull and how youre expected to manage it. It would explain mechanics, tell people they are expected to kick/dispel and could go as far as saying what is prio target etc. At least it would teach new players basic expected strategies and gameplay. Think phone game intro. Game pauses, shows the dangerous mob, shows your kick button flashing, forces you to push it to continue, flashes at later times when the spell is being cast. Something like that
Agreed. A couple look decent but I was expecting them to really look goblin inspired. Pretty disappointed in the art overall for these sets. It looks honestly like some sets didnt make the cut in the past or were additional ideas and theyre just dumping them out now.
Not having gear feels awful in WoW. Making "how you should play the class" gated behind tier set only exacerbates this feeling, so making the switch to class trees feels nice.
stopped raiding in SL and stopped doing M+ in TWW now. I fucking love Delves and would enjoy getting (very low) progress so my character is maxed out at the end of the season (you know the time when 99% of players stopped progressing). Also I love delves but tier 8 is getting very easy and 9-11s are currently useless past the view achievements. I am currently sitting at 608 gs in season1 (180 m+ score lol), I think its really no issue to give out a little more through delves
@Kongaii absolutely! He just never acknowledges or atleast most of the time when he complains, that these problems are for such a small portion of the player base that to expect blizzard to tune or fix according to his perspective is a bit unrealistic
But how can you have fun if +21 keys aren't balanced? How can the game be fun if mythic Ansurek isn't a flawless fight? What else could there possibly be in this game?
Tettles talking about the tier sets was hard to listen to. Felt like he had almost no knowledge of them at all. Low preparation. Turned the pod into him reading stuff on the podcast and the others explaining stuff to him.
I'm confused by people mad at Tettles for being mad at the exploits - don't all players want exploiting stuff removed? I know it only really affects top pushers in this case, but it seems like a common cause we can all get behind. Some exploits might hurt casuals more down the line. Also them fixing these exploits/bugs hurts casuals how - I am one - I would rather not have the meta shift to needing dumb buffs.
One idea that I think could work, is to give a piece of random loot everytime you complete a unique m+ level. Like if you beat a 2 grim batol, you get a guaranteed 597 random piece from the dungeon. So if people are chasing specific trinkets or accessories they actually have a reason to do anything between a 2-7. Like a chance to randomly get a 619 skardyn's grace is a good incentive even for mid level geared characters.
1:25:00 make raid mechanics reasonable so they don't require weakauras and/or macros. It's that simple. Make dungeon trash packs less complex so you don't need 50 weakauras to see what's targetting to know if you're getting overlapped (one shot).
The ring exploit can be done with the weekly ring upgrade quest + a full inventory. Item gets mailed to you and flags the quest as complete without you holding the upgrade item, which allows rares on siren isle to drop the upgrade item as well. That’s how folks are running around with 658 rings, they’re not spending $150 for that shit.
Growl talking about raiding is 110% me, I can watch the video a dozen times, read the guide two dozen times, and even the journal, but until I experience it myself I have zero idea what is going on. The exception is if it can be related to a previous boss I've done.
Other people getting 5500 vers for their keys and making you feel like your runs are invalidated is an extremely high end, niche problem to have. Literally only affects people fighting to be top 0.1%.
It's also completely and utterly stupid. It literally has 0 impact on him what anyone else is doing in their keys. You're not competing for world first keys.
while exploiting is really not great and shouldn´t be encouraged by Blizz, i also think that "sanctity of the saison" nonsense has to stop. It actively hurts us right now as we don´t get any bigger changes in fear of a backlash from the elite that feel like their time has been wasted, good lord, get a life then. Or go do TGP when you want to be competitive. The only priority that should guide the decision making is if it´s fun.
Aiming to turn live M+ into a competitive game mode is what ruined it anyway. All the changes in difficulty/ability bloat in packs/etc was done to increase skill expression for "HiGh key pUshErS" and made everyone else want to avoid it. Blizzard should be trying to make M+ mobs more like Island Expedition packs than raid encounters. People that say they do keys "at the highest level" are just the last people left playing the mini game as their main content.
@@itsDEEZY i think it´s also that the general players that engage with the content get better from expansion to expansion, so they feel like they need to step it up accordingly. But they really missed by a lot, and overall just ended up with really bad design. I think Algethar Academy is probably one of the best examples of what an M+ Dungeon should look like, it had some really big pulls to blast away, some very technical pulls and some more relaxed stuff in between. Now we just have ridiculous pulls in most dungeons, i think the only dungeon this saison i truly like is dawnbreaker as it also has a good mix of all sorts of pulls and death isn´t too punishing. Every other dungeon feels like you have to be looked in for 30min straight which is just waaay too draining. Imagine doing a 30min raidboss. There´s a reason they did make an effort to make even the Raid Endbosses faster over the past expansion.
I get that Tettles didn’t get to give his actual input last episode, but I found the beginning of this one to be very jarring. Also I feel like the discussion that was had last week was a complete thought and it didn’t need rehashed just so he could give his 2 cents. His input felt kind of aggressive and overly negative, which I found very off putting. Additionally, his talking points made it appear as though he didn’t even watch or listen to the previous conversation from last week, which is just strange imo. And finally, he needs to realize that not everyone plays this game for high end sweat. There are a ton of turbo casuals like myself that play WoW simply to have fun. Lighten up and enjoy the game for what it is man.
People need to understand that the 2800 io achievement is for the 1% alts. Once they have the achievement they can just spam keys not care if they brick them. The average player is still bone.
It's the 12-ish key level which is where it becomes so much harder to pug. Absolutely will be a huge benefit to ppl trying to push keys who are pugging or lacking a full push key group
About stats... I think Haste is in a pretty good spot for most specs. You feel the gameplay difference between low haste and high haste. I cannot speak to how it feels for Rogues, Monks, Ferals, etc. If the changes made to haste for those specs "worked" or not. Crit is in an okay spot because a lot of specs have interactions specifically with crit. Like Frost DK, your auto attack critical strikes have a chance to proc Killing Machine. So its not necessarily about crits doing more damage, but how crits interact with your spec. Every spec should have at least one, if not multiple critical strike interactions similar to Killing Machine. Doesn't have to be a random proc, it could be a thing where it says "every time your filler spell crits you knock 1 second off the CD of your major damage CD." Mastery is mostly bad. If you play a tank or a healer, you have a slightly better chance of your mastery being interesting. For the vast majority of dps specs, mastery is just really, really boring. Frost DK is just "do x% more frost damage" or BM Hunter's "your pets do x% more damage." Sure I guess its thematic? But you know what else makes me do more frost damage or my pets do more damage? Main stat. That is what Strength does for FDK. That is what Agility does for BM. Mastery should be interesting, it should inform the play style of the spec. Versatility is bad and boring as hell. It might as well be "this item has slightly higher ilvl." Because Vers effectively does the same thing as a piece of gear having slightly more main stat and slightly more stamina. Tertiaries shouldn't be able to roll onto gear. I like the Tert enchants on cloak and bracers. I see a case to be made for Avoidance, Leech, and Speed. I think that is a good place for Terts to be - just a small bump in one direction or another depending on what you value.
Mythic + needs to create spaces again for people who don't want to be omega challenged every day and assemble 5 flawless sweatlord avengers to time a +6 for champion gear in your vault. This has nothing to do with new players or being bad at the game. I could farm "runed" crest in DF on every class and spec all week. Now i do one dungeon on my main and need a break. Alt friendly my a$$.
1:35:57 You can really hear Squishie's inner FFXIV coming out here (and it makes sense for this fight). Specifically, when approaching scripted fights like Court and Savage/Ultimate encounters in FFXIV, the fights can easily be discussed in learning chunks rather than trying to account for every aspect of the fight. Same with Queen - get Phase 1 down, and maybe we make it to intermission, it's fine if we do, but we'll Yolo it a bit until we're getting there consistently. Maybe this is a WoW mentality of, "no wipes", but I've always found that in XIV, because you go into a Savage/Ultimate encounter full on knowing that you will wipe a ton you're more apt to just try to learn the fight and not be stressed about parts you haven't even seen yet.
The talk about gear really reminds me of back when we had reforging. People taking items to do the math post raid to see if they could keep their stat numbers with the new item only to see it was a downgrade. Having to use addons to do that math for you at the vender. That was really bad for cookie cutter gear sets as everyone wanted the same item so they could get the perfect reforge. As for M+ I wonder how many that do it really enjoy it based on how I see people talking about it.
The bigger issue is that new players don't know what to look at in dungeons. Bosses have the dungeon journal, but trash has nothing that tells you what's up. Experienced players know what to look for, but new players do not. For instance, first pull of stonevault. If you don't realize the mob casting is doing an aoe fear, you won't interrupt it. Nothing but the name of the spell which you have no way to know what the spell does outside of something like wowhead tells you that it's a fear and needs to be kicked, and at a 7, you won't wipe to it, so since it's not dangerous, you won't realize that in the 10, you have to kick it. That mob should be doing some pulsing aoe visual that shows "hey, I'm casting a spell, you have to do something about this or you're going to have a bad time"
@@Valvad0ss one of my friends from classic tried retail for the first time and was struggling hard because his pugs kept failing. He had 0 idea what was going on in any of the keys and wasn't learning anything because he didn't know WHAT he was supposed to learn, cuz nothing in the game tells him what to learn. We took him into a 10 with myself and a few guildies, and showed him what to kick, what abilities you need to defensive, etc. I couldn't imagine being a new player trying to grasp m+.
The problem with the tier sets is they activate on big cds but some specs dont have big cds, look at uhdk vs enhance, you cant say that making dark transformation stronger and casting more doom winds(pretty bad damage cd) are comparable at all.
in response to growl's question: none of us care about the mistletoe buff, it's goofy and silly and fun - and it's probably best for the game to be more fun for the 99.9% of people who AREN'T in title range, haha
The Tier set discussion is hilarious because not one member of the panel brought up how all the Melee bonuses are terrible. The only exception being Rogue sets don't fundamentally fail in design (just in RNG).
@@Zeloh927 it will boost the podcast and will make it more enjoyable, how is that negative? Every episode's comment section has quite a bit of feedback on him, and every next episode he is doing the opposite of what he should've, and being more obtuse and more obnoxious
What i would like to see with tierset is like here you get 2 % crit/haste /mast and ey maybe youre main ability can crit 5 % higher or reduce the cooldown of youre main ability by 1 second ... what i like to see is tiersets that add a tiny bit its nice to have but it wont be insanely broken or way to undertuned just a nice little bonus
As much as it causes problems, I think it makes a LOT of sense to keep your buffs when entering an M+ dungeon. Fitting all your buffing into the start of the dungeon (especially eating) would be a big pain, and I think there's a lot of value in having a clear separation between Prep time and GO TIME. Once you slam that key you're locked in. You could wipe buffs when you zone in, but I think it would just feel really unnatural, and be a huge burden on every single player, very few of whom are ever going to be exploiters. Zenkiki situations suck, and blizzard has taken action before, but I mean 3500 vers just feels like a christmas gift.
I would genuinely say that my season 1 bonuses I enjoy more than what the season 2 ones will be as an enh shaman. I think it’s valid to be apprehensive about s2
The amount you ilvl, stats increase throughout a season is kind of wild. They had to make secondary DRs to account for the gear increase from season to season. Every since the jump increased, they haven't been able to balance healing.
No. They would not refund someone and then ban them. They would ban them period. They mention very clearly in their eula that if you get banned you are entitled to no refunds of any kind.
People seem really down or negative on the tier sets but these sets are more interesting than what we have currently and I'd much rather them focus on tuning specs and hero talents individually so more specs feel better than have some tier sets completely throw some specs way out of line because they are too powerful(some of the sets already look very strong compared to others if high rolled). I'm all for delves giving gilded crests, I think delves did their job in s1, it was a bridge between m0 and heroic/mythic raiding, some very powerful trinkets some of which are still being used now. I certainly had more fun at the start of the season doing delves than bricking keys and not being able to do 10s in pugs for the first couple of weeks.
I think the fact that they are experimenting with adding stepping stones between portals and title was easily the biggest W of them adding that achievement, even if it ends up being arbitrary.
Its honestly crazy the extent that blizzard is willing to outsource their game design. Nothing changes until a popular UA-cam channel brings it to attention.
I'm usually not on this train. But wow, Tettles is being a crybaby in this episode. There are for sure some problems but This is the absolut least of the problems in the game right now but this is the hardest I heard him cry about the game in a long time. and it is not like he would be playing anyway at this point of this season.
what M+ on ramp? honnestly i think that ppl are gearing their toons through delvs because getting into M+ groups is more difficult due to the mass exodus of tank players from the nerfs and the increased responsibility caused by the death affix to make a run succeed as the role that is typically driving the bus in a dungeon.
Re: Roger Brown In order for me to play the game, I would need a UI, that has the same functionality as Cell, plater, Weak auras (just the ui customization), and raider io. So what Blizz, our Blizzard?!?, is gonna make a comparable/better system (likely just worse) in 5 years? I’d rather they invest that dev time into more M+ dungeons, or borrowed power systems, or delves. This “arms race” as growl calls it really only seems to apply to raid bosses. I don’t raid outside of heroic 1-3 times on fresh toons, getting a carry from my guild for fast and easy tier + sockets from vault. I don’t think the devs need to worry about hyper efficient addons in heroic. Bc A.) it’s easy enough you don’t need. B.) no pug group is ever gonna have the coordination for it. And C.) it’s usually the mythic mech that needs the insane tech anyway. There’s ways to make bosses without the need for private auras, that rely more on sound design and visual queues.
Idk, maybe the sets arent super interesting, but as a warrior player, its more interesting to me than getting 5% damage in overpower or MS or bloodthirst, or 5% crit damage, or 5 more rage gen, etc etc Its not like DH's season (2? 3?) With the throw glaive set, but its better than the most banal ones im used to
The 1500ilvl ring isn't from server transfers. It's if you get the item to drop, but don't loot it, it'll get mailed to you. And you can keep getting them mailed endlessly.
Bro the Devl experience on my Devoker and Blood DK are vastly different. Devoker dies in three melee swings in an 11 and my Blood DK is just over here singing payphone.
The reason why the ramp is to steep is because it goes to high. They gotta make mythic plus easer, improve UI, and make progress to visual clarity. If they make the game better, mythic plus will be fine.
As a trickster rogue, bran already tanks, because you can perma tricks of the trade him. Ive been able to solo tier 11 delves with this tactic as a sub trickster rogue.
Yes seasonal buffs "exploit" is a nerd thing. Agree with your idea about wiping them... for +18 and above. Leave them for us regular players to enjoy a faster run (especially with so much other stuff happening this time of year in RL).
@jamalthompson8090 I wonder if there is a tooltip bug, because the given mastery value did not change on the gem after I upped the ilvl. I did not check the character stat panel though, as I just quickly logged in and out.
During Raszageth progression I used the Taivan Trumpet and summoned him each pull for the knock backs to the different platforms. It gives 1 Vers. Technically it wasn't worthless. But I did that for like 400 pulls.
Could the on ramp to m+ be fixed by linking key level to your M+ rating? Like your key can't go higher than a 5 if you aren't higher than a 1k score and the score fluctates based on if you complete or not like pvp score
Is it not just once again implementing a solo queue? If you want to use the system to queue for a +8 you’d need to complete a +7 on the dungeon. If you wanted to skip you’d have join through a premade
In 2019 we didn't have official rating, nor did we have a title for the 0.1% best M+ runners. With the changes to the rules of the game, what used to be "whatever" back in the day is no longer acceptable.
As a destro lock, I had a great time in T11 delves even solo around 600 ilvl. I love having very hard content without a time limit. But yeah, it's very spec dependent, and also people who aren't that good at the game will endlessly whine about there being relevant content they can't do. Because everything needs to be doable while manually clicking like 5 basic abilities
You dont have to buy more than 1 transfer to get max ring, you do it 1 time and you are eligible for catchup and you just farm it on the isle but dont loot it, then u collect as many as u farmed from mail and use them, or at least thats what ive heard from top eu teams
mastery is at least more interesting than vers as its different for each spec and has the potential to be a flavorful way to integrate into your rotation (best examples ww monk and rdruid). in cata their entire goals were to make tanks mitigate actively and to give alternate resources to make your rotation more interesting and mastery added to that flavor. funny you mention tertiary effects baked into secondary stats, it would be interesting to see not only demon hunters running at mach 5 due to mastery stacking or whatever.
At the same time there's currently a lot of issues with mastery basically every non dps spec forego mastery because it doesn't increase dps and a few classes have mastery that doesn't entail every playstyle the spec has available.
There is no on-ramp problem. If the key holder invites a person that is not qualified to be in their key that is their fault. This season I did every single 2,3,4,5,6 etc all the way up to every key on 11. I tried to get invites two or three key levels above my current recorded timed and I didn’t get invited. The system worked exactly as it should. The on-ramp problem is not real and is only created by the key holder inviting unqualified people.
Mastery was invented in Cata to discourage people using the wrong armor type. Prior to Cata you'd see warriors in Mail and Leather pieces and caster shamans/druids in cloth. You only got Mastery for using the assigned armor type in every slot. I think it was also a gimmick to make people imagine "oh my DK will be doing full frost damage bypassing armor" since they killed Armor Pen at the end of WotLK but in reality it just got tuned so it never really mattered like armor pen did. It was supposed to be "flavor" and fixing the armor type problem. It's been stupid ever since.
Hot take for dungeons. Why not make health of mobs n bosses permanently never reset if you die. If you got a boss to 50% and full wipe. Come back to him still at 50% !
Damn I love watching this hearing Tettles say how bad the cheating thing is and it’s made him stop doing keys and I see him on stream exploiting himself 😂😂
Playing without WA is almost impossible nowadays (it's insane how much time needed to set it for main and few other alts), so looking forward UI change.
Listening the first 8 minutes and im already disagreeing with more points than all of last week. Like yeah ofc we would all love 39 tier sets that are so good that they turn into talents. That's not something they try to do or know how to do intentionally and consistantly. MW one from dragonflight changed a lot about the spec and it was worth the time spent to add that, same with havoc amiddrasil set now. Just feels like Tettles wants class changes in the form of tier first and then permanently, which has never been the stated goal of these sets. Feels a lot like he's just been sitting in an echo chamber of chronic complainers for the holidays. I do not think the average quality of the sets has ever been this high, but i guess you can complain about none of them seeming like the best thing ever to be added to the talent tree. Overall all ranged specs seem to get a set that makes their cooldowns bigger, which i've not heard anyone else complain about at all. Makes your meters go brrr and emphazises knowing when to use them and how to route around it.
They should rework stats forsure. Haste is fine. Crit needs a huge buff, you should feel super good when you hit a huge crit. Versatility could use a good buff. Mastery needs to be removed. It's useless. Tracking only Crit, Haste & Vers would be way better and cause less re-gearing for off specs.
Yeah I definitely think the buffs are more of an issue for high end players pushing for leaderboards, for most other people its just a buff that makes stuff easier for a bit, I can definitely see why it would be frustrating for high end players though.
gotta tell ya, i haven't given a single shit about what tier sets do since like....mop maybe? from my casual perspective, if the tier set does something to my game play, then i'll grab an updated WA/read on wow head if i have to push anything weird or new and that's it
12 isn't a break point? It's when affixes are removed. You get 2850 you essentially can avoid affixes for the rest of the season if you want to. Pretty great reward.
You can essentially already do that now - just don't sign up for 11s. This is such an insanely niche benefit, like, this truly only matters to people who exclusively wanna play their own +12 keys - so probably a grand total of like 700 dps players worldwide.
About clearing a delve 11. It is doable with 2ppl. Me and my bf cleared one for achievement purpose way back. Around 600ilvl. He as a brew. Me ret. Bran healer. Didn't really have issues, but couldn't just lol aoe big packs, and speed through. Needed to be a bit careful.
27:00 you dont even have to faction change to max your ring, there is a more easy solution and cheaper solution if you didnt do the weekly quest, just dont hand them in...do rares, have your bags full/dont auto loot enabled, but loot them and you get from time to time the upgrade material(catch up mechniac) congratz you get infinite upgrades in the mailbox, if you leave the island edit: you need to have another character which has at least one upgrade more on the ring, than the char you want to pump up with this "strategy"
So I think yall are misunderstanding the ilvl with the ring thing. My best friend faction transferred some toons over to alliance, because he likes how humans look in plate gear etc, and he got all 3 of those toons to max ilvl ring just from doing the daily farm stuff on siren isle with having 0 idea about the issue. He just thought it was farmable lol
I dont think giving hero gear from lower M+ would be better than just adding in a more deterministic way of getting hero gear from high level delves, such as 10-11s.
I think they underestimate how many of us good players don't want to do M+ dungeons the way they have been forcibly arranged.. such that we never view them as a goal for any of our gearing. We're never playing the game thinking to ourselves "oh boy oh boy, I need to keep doing this so I can start M+" The dungeons we want to do were taken away from us "by" the introduction of the M+ system. We don't chase the smaller number of people who do M+ around wagging our finger or complaining.....because we don't want to take their M+ dungeons away from them. But nonetheless, we don't like the M+ system itself. Spending time trying to invent an "onramp" to push players toward M+ isn't going to work when we are steering boats..... boats aren't designed for the freeway no matter what on ramp you make. Our goal is to sail the boats, not get into cars. :)
what do you mean the dungeons "we want to do?" no timer? doing all 8 of the new dungeons in one season? cause personally I play this game FOR m+, all gear I acquire and all activities I do in the game are solely to do higher keys
I agree with Squishei that it feels weird to give the achievement for 12s when that gap up isn't there anymore. Rewards stop at 10, so why not put it there or at 11 (with a change to the rating required to be more in line with that lower target).
What’s funny is the portal to mechagon unless they change it required to get both sides. My main was resto shaman during BFA and I hated motherload for several reason. We’ll have to see if it gets any better. For top I was resto druid main and didn’t mind that dungeon. I do remember running top on non Tryan weeks just because that dungeon had way over tunned bosses. Slow flags I hated in there tho. So many casters just die in there. Just seems like every freaking key they want healers dealing with dispels and freaking out over aoe damage that we can’t be bothered to do damage. I do wonder what changes they will make for mechagon.
Woooo! The Bench out here being the people's champions giving me something to listen to.... very much unlike those uglier and definitely less skilled peasants over at that OTHER podcast ijs.
Edit: sent this before squishey said it LOL OK so wiping buffs would annoy casuals way more than it would benefit tryhard so my cook is, add the wipe to the +12 affix, make it stealth so that it doesn't confuse people, but would functionally work out the best imo
I'm wondering if after you achieve 'harbinger of the gilded' you could then trade in gilded crests for dinars. you've maxxed out your gear, a way to offer some bad luck protection, but for people who have completed everything else gearwise.
How is it possibly an issue to have more avenues to gilded crests that isn't just raid or m+? There are times people might just want to play by themselves every once in a while. Its a win in general.
I feel like the first handful of episodes were amazing and I liked it more than the poddyc because it felt more in touch without max and focused more on m+ and also I generally enjoy growls and tettles content both on and off youtube. But yeah the last, maybe 3 or 4 episodes(?) Feel like they've really taken a sharp left turn, very negative (and I'm a certified hater I quit this season to play infinity Nikki and poe and even I think its a bit much) and drastically more out of touch than the way the podcast started. And you're right, I hadn't considered it but there are def certain points where it feels almost antagonistic towards the non 0.1%. I really don't want to stop tuning in but it's getting harder to sit through each episode
@@FeralKobold Yeah, it's really sad. And what's an extra kicker is that the general quality of recordings have gone down. It went from somewhat coherent and functional, to now it's just a mess all throughout. It's like none of them particularly care anymore and are just fulfilling their contract with Wowhead. I felt the exact same at the beginning and having things like insider wowhead information was really nice and insightful. But recently it has just been "why are you even raiding if you haven't killed Queen yet" or "you didn't actually play at all if you didn't do like 15s". Like, it's actually insane how quickly it spiralled.
I personally think the tier sets are nice. It's nothing overly complicated, I can swap to an alt and have a general idea of their tier set based on the role if I'm a little rustier on them or it's a fresh alt. I don't think S2 of TWW is the one they need to go full on all out with the tier sets. Hero talents are here to stay, and with the "Worldsoul Saga" I'm sure we'll get some NUTS one later on. Also regarding the raid buffs in M+, it sucks but it's primarily a title hunters problem, not the general population of people doing their weekly vault or even just doing 12s. Just my opinion though.
Make mythic+ gear go mythic but only for M+. Just like pvp gear. Do pvp people have max gear in a week? Maybe put a cap on it if they do. Could do the same with delves, which should be way easier to implement. Assuming zones are used for pvp.
pvp players are gated by X amount of conquest they can acquire per week, also gated by sparks for crafted pvp pieces, similar to how it is in pve. though its overall a much better experience then pve
nah, i still think the PvP-Gear seperation is part of what killed PvP in WoW. I do remember in Cata i played a lot of PvP, because i could just hop in and be fine. Now if i want to hop in i get slaughtered and it´s 0 fun. And collecting Gear to actually play M+ is already so much of a slog that even the relatively small investment for the PvP starter gear is much too high a hurdle for me and so i do not PvP anymore.
If they boost up the drops in the m0 and m2 then hopefully we won't have these players trying to skip the low keys trying to get gear quick. Learning all the mechanics for the first time is also hard. They can make it so that you need to do each dungeon at lower keys and level up the difficulty you can enter each dungeon.
I'm happy about the sets, They're basic and maybe boring but man Id hate if a set forced me to play talents I don't want. I play on a steam deck and almost only solo content, all my builds are designed to be as passive as possible. If a set changed that for me I'd be sad 😊 Also, the onramp could maybe also be fixed by allowing delivers getting 6/6 hero without entering M+.
@Growl minute 24 question.. I think its a little more then just a scoreboard nerd problem. PVP has had this issue of ppl only playing the last two weeks of the season (for quite a while too), because why waste time before when rating inflation will make anything you do early on useless at the end. Im not sure the problem is that advanced in PVE.. I think you still have way more players early then late.. and rewards are more item then title driven so that might offset it.
Squishei was definitely cooking about the keywords on the tiersets. If the sets did the exact same thing nobody would be calling Blizzard lazy.
Name the last season we truly had transformative tier sets.
Everyone might be able to come up with 1 season for their spec - and if you look at all of those seasons, at best the season will have like 2 out of 40 truly transformative bonuses.
Absolutely nothing changed. They're not going in any direction they haven't been going in for a decade now.
@@MrOPD all but season 1 of df (even s1 had some)
bullshit. People have been calling out blizz for lazy tiersets this entire season.
blizz attempt at something other than "filler spell does 4 extra dam" is a good thing. 2p have almost always been unspired.
They have in the past and it caused people to wear 2 set from current tier and 2 set from last tier if the 2 set effects were stronger. And it honestly doesn't feel good knowing that by breaking last raids 2 set with an ilvl bump from current raid is making you technically weaker.
Tettles being salty to squishy when he asked about the df monk tier lmao
They should remove tracks from gear completely and just have the items drop at a base level determined by the content you are doing and you can spend the various crests to upgrade them to whatever the tier cap is it will be controlled by the crest limits. One of the things that people are missing in the discussions is Hero track's basically meaningless this season by trying to stretch out the gearing for mythic raiders they disincentivized the rather larger group of people who did normal/heroic raid and medium keys.
Or get rid of the gear grind. Just no more gear upgrades. One flat ilevel for a piece of gear. Run your 8 highest keys for vault and be done. Having to get flightstones plus crests on different tiers just to keep you in dungeons is stupid.
Part of the "m+ on-ramp" problem is also just that dungeons are way too complicated this expansion. I've been learning prot pally in 2s and 3s as a veteran healer/dps player and good lord the amount of ways new players find to fuck up a key is insane. Missed kicks - and remember the default UI is complete ass for looking at kicks - can kill you in a 2! I can't imagine an actually new player having my current experience and deciding to continue on with m+. It's completely miserable. New players need to be able to learn the dungeons in a way that isn't this complete clusterfuck trial by fire thing we have now.
People need to realize that m0 is supposed to be a thing but because the rewards aren’t there everyone is incentivized to do 2s and 3s
u simply dont die to a missed kick in +2s. u maybe die if nothing is kicked at all. Player dont search for any information about the dungeon and have like no learning curve when they are playing. And yes, if u do EVERYTHING wrong, maybe ur supposed to die (ingame).
I think the follower dungeons should have you go into a pull, the game pauses and a pop up window comes up saying whats happening in the pull and how youre expected to manage it. It would explain mechanics, tell people they are expected to kick/dispel and could go as far as saying what is prio target etc. At least it would teach new players basic expected strategies and gameplay. Think phone game intro. Game pauses, shows the dangerous mob, shows your kick button flashing, forces you to push it to continue, flashes at later times when the spell is being cast. Something like that
The real most disappointing thing about the tier sets is that they don’t have a cool goblin engineering theme, they look like shadowlands sets
Agreed. A couple look decent but I was expecting them to really look goblin inspired. Pretty disappointed in the art overall for these sets. It looks honestly like some sets didnt make the cut in the past or were additional ideas and theyre just dumping them out now.
Not having gear feels awful in WoW. Making "how you should play the class" gated behind tier set only exacerbates this feeling, so making the switch to class trees feels nice.
common Attack W dorkiRoll
Oh, no. Tettles is back
stopped raiding in SL and stopped doing M+ in TWW now. I fucking love Delves and would enjoy getting (very low) progress so my character is maxed out at the end of the season (you know the time when 99% of players stopped progressing). Also I love delves but tier 8 is getting very easy and 9-11s are currently useless past the view achievements.
I am currently sitting at 608 gs in season1 (180 m+ score lol), I think its really no issue to give out a little more through delves
Tettles, people play this gam for fun to. You know that right? Its important to me that you know that
Is his fun invalid?
@Kongaii absolutely! He just never acknowledges or atleast most of the time when he complains, that these problems are for such a small portion of the player base that to expect blizzard to tune or fix according to his perspective is a bit unrealistic
@@Kongaii he only play the game cus its his job now.
But how can you have fun if +21 keys aren't balanced? How can the game be fun if mythic Ansurek isn't a flawless fight? What else could there possibly be in this game?
Tettles talking about the tier sets was hard to listen to. Felt like he had almost no knowledge of them at all. Low preparation.
Turned the pod into him reading stuff on the podcast and the others explaining stuff to him.
I'm confused by people mad at Tettles for being mad at the exploits - don't all players want exploiting stuff removed? I know it only really affects top pushers in this case, but it seems like a common cause we can all get behind. Some exploits might hurt casuals more down the line. Also them fixing these exploits/bugs hurts casuals how - I am one - I would rather not have the meta shift to needing dumb buffs.
yeah but he was so adamant against mistletoe buff, wich is not an explioit
These people are delusional casuals stuck in an echo chamber. They are irrelevant
One idea that I think could work, is to give a piece of random loot everytime you complete a unique m+ level. Like if you beat a 2 grim batol, you get a guaranteed 597 random piece from the dungeon. So if people are chasing specific trinkets or accessories they actually have a reason to do anything between a 2-7. Like a chance to randomly get a 619 skardyn's grace is a good incentive even for mid level geared characters.
1:25:00 make raid mechanics reasonable so they don't require weakauras and/or macros. It's that simple.
Make dungeon trash packs less complex so you don't need 50 weakauras to see what's targetting to know if you're getting overlapped (one shot).
You got a point there but there are weakauras for people which remind them to buff or not release spirit for a reason. People are dumb.
Facts
There's a reason everybody had good things to say about the last episode and this one starts off immediately worse. I wonder what that is 🤔
squishy couldnt be more wrong about lower keys. Sometimes the affixes are nasty af. I hate doing alt keys because of the under 12 affixes.
The ring exploit can be done with the weekly ring upgrade quest + a full inventory. Item gets mailed to you and flags the quest as complete without you holding the upgrade item, which allows rares on siren isle to drop the upgrade item as well. That’s how folks are running around with 658 rings, they’re not spending $150 for that shit.
Growl talking about raiding is 110% me, I can watch the video a dozen times, read the guide two dozen times, and even the journal, but until I experience it myself I have zero idea what is going on. The exception is if it can be related to a previous boss I've done.
Other people getting 5500 vers for their keys and making you feel like your runs are invalidated is an extremely high end, niche problem to have. Literally only affects people fighting to be top 0.1%.
It's also completely and utterly stupid. It literally has 0 impact on him what anyone else is doing in their keys. You're not competing for world first keys.
while exploiting is really not great and shouldn´t be encouraged by Blizz, i also think that "sanctity of the saison" nonsense has to stop. It actively hurts us right now as we don´t get any bigger changes in fear of a backlash from the elite that feel like their time has been wasted, good lord, get a life then. Or go do TGP when you want to be competitive. The only priority that should guide the decision making is if it´s fun.
@@EulrichI agree with this
Aiming to turn live M+ into a competitive game mode is what ruined it anyway. All the changes in difficulty/ability bloat in packs/etc was done to increase skill expression for "HiGh key pUshErS" and made everyone else want to avoid it.
Blizzard should be trying to make M+ mobs more like Island Expedition packs than raid encounters.
People that say they do keys "at the highest level" are just the last people left playing the mini game as their main content.
@@itsDEEZY i think it´s also that the general players that engage with the content get better from expansion to expansion, so they feel like they need to step it up accordingly. But they really missed by a lot, and overall just ended up with really bad design.
I think Algethar Academy is probably one of the best examples of what an M+ Dungeon should look like, it had some really big pulls to blast away, some very technical pulls and some more relaxed stuff in between.
Now we just have ridiculous pulls in most dungeons, i think the only dungeon this saison i truly like is dawnbreaker as it also has a good mix of all sorts of pulls and death isn´t too punishing. Every other dungeon feels like you have to be looked in for 30min straight which is just waaay too draining. Imagine doing a 30min raidboss. There´s a reason they did make an effort to make even the Raid Endbosses faster over the past expansion.
“Thanks for invalidating my entire season of pushing keys”. He said, while the season still has about 2 months till it’s done.
I get that Tettles didn’t get to give his actual input last episode, but I found the beginning of this one to be very jarring. Also I feel like the discussion that was had last week was a complete thought and it didn’t need rehashed just so he could give his 2 cents. His input felt kind of aggressive and overly negative, which I found very off putting. Additionally, his talking points made it appear as though he didn’t even watch or listen to the previous conversation from last week, which is just strange imo.
And finally, he needs to realize that not everyone plays this game for high end sweat. There are a ton of turbo casuals like myself that play WoW simply to have fun. Lighten up and enjoy the game for what it is man.
People need to understand that the 2800 io achievement is for the 1% alts. Once they have the achievement they can just spam keys not care if they brick them. The average player is still bone.
It's the 12-ish key level which is where it becomes so much harder to pug. Absolutely will be a huge benefit to ppl trying to push keys who are pugging or lacking a full push key group
12:30 I don’t think they realize the affixes go away at 12? Now that 12 doesn’t scale crazy AND doesn’t have affixes, maybe 12 is easier than 11?
About stats...
I think Haste is in a pretty good spot for most specs. You feel the gameplay difference between low haste and high haste. I cannot speak to how it feels for Rogues, Monks, Ferals, etc. If the changes made to haste for those specs "worked" or not.
Crit is in an okay spot because a lot of specs have interactions specifically with crit. Like Frost DK, your auto attack critical strikes have a chance to proc Killing Machine. So its not necessarily about crits doing more damage, but how crits interact with your spec. Every spec should have at least one, if not multiple critical strike interactions similar to Killing Machine. Doesn't have to be a random proc, it could be a thing where it says "every time your filler spell crits you knock 1 second off the CD of your major damage CD."
Mastery is mostly bad. If you play a tank or a healer, you have a slightly better chance of your mastery being interesting. For the vast majority of dps specs, mastery is just really, really boring. Frost DK is just "do x% more frost damage" or BM Hunter's "your pets do x% more damage." Sure I guess its thematic? But you know what else makes me do more frost damage or my pets do more damage? Main stat. That is what Strength does for FDK. That is what Agility does for BM. Mastery should be interesting, it should inform the play style of the spec.
Versatility is bad and boring as hell. It might as well be "this item has slightly higher ilvl." Because Vers effectively does the same thing as a piece of gear having slightly more main stat and slightly more stamina.
Tertiaries shouldn't be able to roll onto gear. I like the Tert enchants on cloak and bracers. I see a case to be made for Avoidance, Leech, and Speed. I think that is a good place for Terts to be - just a small bump in one direction or another depending on what you value.
It’s pretty sad how nearly every UA-cam comment here is essentially, “Well, it doesn’t affect me so it doesn’t matter.”
Mythic + needs to create spaces again for people who don't want to be omega challenged every day and assemble 5 flawless sweatlord avengers to time a +6 for champion gear in your vault. This has nothing to do with new players or being bad at the game. I could farm "runed" crest in DF on every class and spec all week. Now i do one dungeon on my main and need a break. Alt friendly my a$$.
1:35:57 You can really hear Squishie's inner FFXIV coming out here (and it makes sense for this fight). Specifically, when approaching scripted fights like Court and Savage/Ultimate encounters in FFXIV, the fights can easily be discussed in learning chunks rather than trying to account for every aspect of the fight.
Same with Queen - get Phase 1 down, and maybe we make it to intermission, it's fine if we do, but we'll Yolo it a bit until we're getting there consistently.
Maybe this is a WoW mentality of, "no wipes", but I've always found that in XIV, because you go into a Savage/Ultimate encounter full on knowing that you will wipe a ton you're more apt to just try to learn the fight and not be stressed about parts you haven't even seen yet.
The talk about gear really reminds me of back when we had reforging. People taking items to do the math post raid to see if they could keep their stat numbers with the new item only to see it was a downgrade. Having to use addons to do that math for you at the vender. That was really bad for cookie cutter gear sets as everyone wanted the same item so they could get the perfect reforge. As for M+ I wonder how many that do it really enjoy it based on how I see people talking about it.
The bigger issue is that new players don't know what to look at in dungeons. Bosses have the dungeon journal, but trash has nothing that tells you what's up. Experienced players know what to look for, but new players do not.
For instance, first pull of stonevault. If you don't realize the mob casting is doing an aoe fear, you won't interrupt it. Nothing but the name of the spell which you have no way to know what the spell does outside of something like wowhead tells you that it's a fear and needs to be kicked, and at a 7, you won't wipe to it, so since it's not dangerous, you won't realize that in the 10, you have to kick it.
That mob should be doing some pulsing aoe visual that shows "hey, I'm casting a spell, you have to do something about this or you're going to have a bad time"
Cooking
@@Valvad0ss one of my friends from classic tried retail for the first time and was struggling hard because his pugs kept failing. He had 0 idea what was going on in any of the keys and wasn't learning anything because he didn't know WHAT he was supposed to learn, cuz nothing in the game tells him what to learn. We took him into a 10 with myself and a few guildies, and showed him what to kick, what abilities you need to defensive, etc. I couldn't imagine being a new player trying to grasp m+.
The problem with the tier sets is they activate on big cds but some specs dont have big cds, look at uhdk vs enhance, you cant say that making dark transformation stronger and casting more doom winds(pretty bad damage cd) are comparable at all.
in response to growl's question: none of us care about the mistletoe buff, it's goofy and silly and fun - and it's probably best for the game to be more fun for the 99.9% of people who AREN'T in title range, haha
What about the buff is “fun”?
How does the mistletoe buff make game more fun for you?
Damn that is poor attempt at trolling.
these last two episode have felt like a fever dream now that tettles is back
The Tier set discussion is hilarious because not one member of the panel brought up how all the Melee bonuses are terrible. The only exception being Rogue sets don't fundamentally fail in design (just in RNG).
lmao the two intros. this podcast is underrated.
Replace Tettles and it will be rated.
@@Aectanum You really woke up today, starting the new year, only to immediately be a weird boy by writing a negative comment?
@@Zeloh927 it will boost the podcast and will make it more enjoyable, how is that negative?
Every episode's comment section has quite a bit of feedback on him, and every next episode he is doing the opposite of what he should've, and being more obtuse and more obnoxious
What i would like to see with tierset is like here you get 2 % crit/haste /mast and ey maybe youre main ability can crit 5 % higher or reduce the cooldown of youre main ability by 1 second ... what i like to see is tiersets that add a tiny bit its nice to have but it wont be insanely broken or way to undertuned just a nice little bonus
feels boring that way, not having any real change after you get it.
As much as it causes problems, I think it makes a LOT of sense to keep your buffs when entering an M+ dungeon. Fitting all your buffing into the start of the dungeon (especially eating) would be a big pain, and I think there's a lot of value in having a clear separation between Prep time and GO TIME. Once you slam that key you're locked in. You could wipe buffs when you zone in, but I think it would just feel really unnatural, and be a huge burden on every single player, very few of whom are ever going to be exploiters. Zenkiki situations suck, and blizzard has taken action before, but I mean 3500 vers just feels like a christmas gift.
I would genuinely say that my season 1 bonuses I enjoy more than what the season 2 ones will be as an enh shaman. I think it’s valid to be apprehensive about s2
The amount you ilvl, stats increase throughout a season is kind of wild. They had to make secondary DRs to account for the gear increase from season to season. Every since the jump increased, they haven't been able to balance healing.
The point of ksl is to have a reward without having a reward. Its there to give sweats the none deplete and normal m+ players a little extra to do.
I love the idea of 12+ wipe buffs and make everything even for pushers 11 below do whatever
No. They would not refund someone and then ban them. They would ban them period. They mention very clearly in their eula that if you get banned you are entitled to no refunds of any kind.
People seem really down or negative on the tier sets but these sets are more interesting than what we have currently and I'd much rather them focus on tuning specs and hero talents individually so more specs feel better than have some tier sets completely throw some specs way out of line because they are too powerful(some of the sets already look very strong compared to others if high rolled).
I'm all for delves giving gilded crests, I think delves did their job in s1, it was a bridge between m0 and heroic/mythic raiding, some very powerful trinkets some of which are still being used now. I certainly had more fun at the start of the season doing delves than bricking keys and not being able to do 10s in pugs for the first couple of weeks.
I think the fact that they are experimenting with adding stepping stones between portals and title was easily the biggest W of them adding that achievement, even if it ends up being arbitrary.
27:41 just ask Maximum to ask them. Blizzard always does something when he brings it up.
Its honestly crazy the extent that blizzard is willing to outsource their game design. Nothing changes until a popular UA-cam channel brings it to attention.
I'm usually not on this train. But wow, Tettles is being a crybaby in this episode. There are for sure some problems but This is the absolut least of the problems in the game right now but this is the hardest I heard him cry about the game in a long time. and it is not like he would be playing anyway at this point of this season.
Pod would be better without him honestly. This episode just confirmed it. Boo hoo, don't act like a spoiled brat.
what M+ on ramp? honnestly i think that ppl are gearing their toons through delvs because getting into M+ groups is more difficult due to the mass exodus of tank players from the nerfs and the increased responsibility caused by the death affix to make a run succeed as the role that is typically driving the bus in a dungeon.
Re: Roger Brown
In order for me to play the game, I would need a UI, that has the same functionality as Cell, plater, Weak auras (just the ui customization), and raider io.
So what Blizz, our Blizzard?!?, is gonna make a comparable/better system (likely just worse) in 5 years?
I’d rather they invest that dev time into more M+ dungeons, or borrowed power systems, or delves.
This “arms race” as growl calls it really only seems to apply to raid bosses. I don’t raid outside of heroic 1-3 times on fresh toons, getting a carry from my guild for fast and easy tier + sockets from vault.
I don’t think the devs need to worry about hyper efficient addons in heroic. Bc A.) it’s easy enough you don’t need. B.) no pug group is ever gonna have the coordination for it. And C.) it’s usually the mythic mech that needs the insane tech anyway.
There’s ways to make bosses without the need for private auras, that rely more on sound design and visual queues.
Idk, maybe the sets arent super interesting, but as a warrior player, its more interesting to me than getting 5% damage in overpower or MS or bloodthirst, or 5% crit damage, or 5 more rage gen, etc etc
Its not like DH's season (2? 3?) With the throw glaive set, but its better than the most banal ones im used to
Agreed, the tier sets in season 2 look better than what we have in season 1
I hope they don't wipe buffs at the start of dungeons. Song of the Anvil is one of the best buffs in the game "If you don't die, have no repair bill!"
The 1500ilvl ring isn't from server transfers. It's if you get the item to drop, but don't loot it, it'll get mailed to you. And you can keep getting them mailed endlessly.
100% don't condone doing it, and hope people exploiting it catch a ban.
Bro i remember doing that shit with the Throne of Thunder quest items in MoP. It's fucking hilarious they're still doing this
@@EricFinesPhotographythey won’t lmao
@@Massive-rat-hypocrite what makes you think that? They rolled back and banned people for the rogue exploit?
Bro the Devl experience on my Devoker and Blood DK are vastly different. Devoker dies in three melee swings in an 11 and my Blood DK is just over here singing payphone.
yeah.... because one is a tank and literally is a meatshield.
cus bloods meant to take damage, dev has tools to kite, many tools in fact
One is a tank wtf
The reason why the ramp is to steep is because it goes to high. They gotta make mythic plus easer, improve UI, and make progress to visual clarity. If they make the game better, mythic plus will be fine.
As a trickster rogue, bran already tanks, because you can perma tricks of the trade him. Ive been able to solo tier 11 delves with this tactic as a sub trickster rogue.
As an unholy dk I just press Outbreak to apply my diseases, wait 6 seconds and healer Brann has perma aggro -> easy delve
Yes seasonal buffs "exploit" is a nerd thing. Agree with your idea about wiping them... for +18 and above. Leave them for us regular players to enjoy a faster run (especially with so much other stuff happening this time of year in RL).
Does the circlet ilvl adjust the values of the gems?
I believe so, yes
@jamalthompson8090 I wonder if there is a tooltip bug, because the given mastery value did not change on the gem after I upped the ilvl. I did not check the character stat panel though, as I just quickly logged in and out.
During Raszageth progression I used the Taivan Trumpet and summoned him each pull for the knock backs to the different platforms. It gives 1 Vers. Technically it wasn't worthless. But I did that for like 400 pulls.
Poddy New Year everyone!
Could the on ramp to m+ be fixed by linking key level to your M+ rating? Like your key can't go higher than a 5 if you aren't higher than a 1k score and the score fluctates based on if you complete or not like pvp score
Is it not just once again implementing a solo queue? If you want to use the system to queue for a +8 you’d need to complete a +7 on the dungeon. If you wanted to skip you’d have join through a premade
In 2019 we didn't have official rating, nor did we have a title for the 0.1% best M+ runners. With the changes to the rules of the game, what used to be "whatever" back in the day is no longer acceptable.
No addons would be insane. Like.. Plunderstorm PvP feels fresh and good af
As a destro lock, I had a great time in T11 delves even solo around 600 ilvl. I love having very hard content without a time limit. But yeah, it's very spec dependent, and also people who aren't that good at the game will endlessly whine about there being relevant content they can't do. Because everything needs to be doable while manually clicking like 5 basic abilities
You dont have to buy more than 1 transfer to get max ring, you do it 1 time and you are eligible for catchup and you just farm it on the isle but dont loot it, then u collect as many as u farmed from mail and use them, or at least thats what ive heard from top eu teams
mastery is at least more interesting than vers as its different for each spec and has the potential to be a flavorful way to integrate into your rotation (best examples ww monk and rdruid). in cata their entire goals were to make tanks mitigate actively and to give alternate resources to make your rotation more interesting and mastery added to that flavor. funny you mention tertiary effects baked into secondary stats, it would be interesting to see not only demon hunters running at mach 5 due to mastery stacking or whatever.
Mastery for Resto Shaman for example is worse than Vers.
At the same time there's currently a lot of issues with mastery basically every non dps spec forego mastery because it doesn't increase dps and a few classes have mastery that doesn't entail every playstyle the spec has available.
To fix the on ramp they need to make depletes more worthwhile to complete. Reinstate 3 boxing, and still give a piece of gear for a deplete.
7:40 "the bar (for tier sets) is pretty low from season 1"
Too bad the havoc tierset for s2 brought a shovel
There is no on-ramp problem. If the key holder invites a person that is not qualified to be in their key that is their fault. This season I did every single 2,3,4,5,6 etc all the way up to every key on 11. I tried to get invites two or three key levels above my current recorded timed and I didn’t get invited. The system worked exactly as it should. The on-ramp problem is not real and is only created by the key holder inviting unqualified people.
Mastery was invented in Cata to discourage people using the wrong armor type. Prior to Cata you'd see warriors in Mail and Leather pieces and caster shamans/druids in cloth. You only got Mastery for using the assigned armor type in every slot. I think it was also a gimmick to make people imagine "oh my DK will be doing full frost damage bypassing armor" since they killed Armor Pen at the end of WotLK but in reality it just got tuned so it never really mattered like armor pen did. It was supposed to be "flavor" and fixing the armor type problem. It's been stupid ever since.
Hot take for dungeons. Why not make health of mobs n bosses permanently never reset if you die. If you got a boss to 50% and full wipe. Come back to him still at 50% !
Damn I love watching this hearing Tettles say how bad the cheating thing is and it’s made him stop doing keys and I see him on stream exploiting himself 😂😂
Playing without WA is almost impossible nowadays (it's insane how much time needed to set it for main and few other alts), so looking forward UI change.
Listening the first 8 minutes and im already disagreeing with more points than all of last week.
Like yeah ofc we would all love 39 tier sets that are so good that they turn into talents. That's not something they try to do or know how to do intentionally and consistantly. MW one from dragonflight changed a lot about the spec and it was worth the time spent to add that, same with havoc amiddrasil set now. Just feels like Tettles wants class changes in the form of tier first and then permanently, which has never been the stated goal of these sets. Feels a lot like he's just been sitting in an echo chamber of chronic complainers for the holidays. I do not think the average quality of the sets has ever been this high, but i guess you can complain about none of them seeming like the best thing ever to be added to the talent tree.
Overall all ranged specs seem to get a set that makes their cooldowns bigger, which i've not heard anyone else complain about at all. Makes your meters go brrr and emphazises knowing when to use them and how to route around it.
They should rework stats forsure. Haste is fine. Crit needs a huge buff, you should feel super good when you hit a huge crit. Versatility could use a good buff. Mastery needs to be removed. It's useless. Tracking only Crit, Haste & Vers would be way better and cause less re-gearing for off specs.
Yeah I definitely think the buffs are more of an issue for high end players pushing for leaderboards, for most other people its just a buff that makes stuff easier for a bit, I can definitely see why it would be frustrating for high end players though.
I enjoyed 2/3 of this podcast
Also, I personally only do +5s to get KSM, so yes people do keys below 7
The people that are bad at mythic + won't even do them if they progress their gear drom Delves. The lack of progression from delves is the real issue.
gotta tell ya, i haven't given a single shit about what tier sets do since like....mop maybe? from my casual perspective, if the tier set does something to my game play, then i'll grab an updated WA/read on wow head if i have to push anything weird or new and that's it
My thoughts and prayers go out to all the 25 people affected by the m+ exploits
how to get the garrison buff?
12 isn't a break point? It's when affixes are removed.
You get 2850 you essentially can avoid affixes for the rest of the season if you want to. Pretty great reward.
You can essentially already do that now - just don't sign up for 11s.
This is such an insanely niche benefit, like, this truly only matters to people who exclusively wanna play their own +12 keys - so probably a grand total of like 700 dps players worldwide.
About clearing a delve 11. It is doable with 2ppl.
Me and my bf cleared one for achievement purpose way back. Around 600ilvl. He as a brew. Me ret. Bran healer. Didn't really have issues, but couldn't just lol aoe big packs, and speed through. Needed to be a bit careful.
27:00 you dont even have to faction change to max your ring, there is a more easy solution and cheaper solution
if you didnt do the weekly quest, just dont hand them in...do rares, have your bags full/dont auto loot enabled, but loot them and you get from time to time the upgrade material(catch up mechniac)
congratz you get infinite upgrades in the mailbox, if you leave the island
edit: you need to have another character which has at least one upgrade more on the ring, than the char you want to pump up with this "strategy"
So I think yall are misunderstanding the ilvl with the ring thing.
My best friend faction transferred some toons over to alliance, because he likes how humans look in plate gear etc, and he got all 3 of those toons to max ilvl ring just from doing the daily farm stuff on siren isle with having 0 idea about the issue. He just thought it was farmable lol
I got the achievement for looting 500+ Bountiful Delves... reward was.. nothing. Never again.
u can read on the AV if u get something?
I dont think giving hero gear from lower M+ would be better than just adding in a more deterministic way of getting hero gear from high level delves, such as 10-11s.
I think they underestimate how many of us good players don't want to do M+ dungeons the way they have been forcibly arranged.. such that we never view them as a goal for any of our gearing. We're never playing the game thinking to ourselves "oh boy oh boy, I need to keep doing this so I can start M+"
The dungeons we want to do were taken away from us "by" the introduction of the M+ system. We don't chase the smaller number of people who do M+ around wagging our finger or complaining.....because we don't want to take their M+ dungeons away from them. But nonetheless, we don't like the M+ system itself.
Spending time trying to invent an "onramp" to push players toward M+ isn't going to work when we are steering boats..... boats aren't designed for the freeway no matter what on ramp you make. Our goal is to sail the boats, not get into cars. :)
what do you mean the dungeons "we want to do?" no timer? doing all 8 of the new dungeons in one season? cause personally I play this game FOR m+, all gear I acquire and all activities I do in the game are solely to do higher keys
@@jaded-harper Read the entirety of my second paragraph....which makes your outrage unnecessary.
I agree with Squishei that it feels weird to give the achievement for 12s when that gap up isn't there anymore. Rewards stop at 10, so why not put it there or at 11 (with a change to the rating required to be more in line with that lower target).
What’s funny is the portal to mechagon unless they change it required to get both sides. My main was resto shaman during BFA and I hated motherload for several reason. We’ll have to see if it gets any better. For top I was resto druid main and didn’t mind that dungeon. I do remember running top on non Tryan weeks just because that dungeon had way over tunned bosses. Slow flags I hated in there tho. So many casters just die in there. Just seems like every freaking key they want healers dealing with dispels and freaking out over aoe damage that we can’t be bothered to do damage. I do wonder what changes they will make for mechagon.
Woooo! The Bench out here being the people's champions giving me something to listen to.... very much unlike those uglier and definitely less skilled peasants over at that OTHER podcast ijs.
Edit: sent this before squishey said it LOL
OK so wiping buffs would annoy casuals way more than it would benefit tryhard so my cook is, add the wipe to the +12 affix, make it stealth so that it doesn't confuse people, but would functionally work out the best imo
I'm wondering if after you achieve 'harbinger of the gilded' you could then trade in gilded crests for dinars. you've maxxed out your gear, a way to offer some bad luck protection, but for people who have completed everything else gearwise.
Or give them to alts, or trade them for valorstones. Or literslly anything besides just watching them go up with nothing to do.
@@deseanroot75they created war bands only to not let us send crests or flightstones to alts. A failure of the warband system really
How is it possibly an issue to have more avenues to gilded crests that isn't just raid or m+? There are times people might just want to play by themselves every once in a while.
Its a win in general.
This year's been a real bench
The negativity, ego stroking and just general aggro towards the community this podcast has been steadily increasing, is really a let down.
I feel like the first handful of episodes were amazing and I liked it more than the poddyc because it felt more in touch without max and focused more on m+ and also I generally enjoy growls and tettles content both on and off youtube. But yeah the last, maybe 3 or 4 episodes(?) Feel like they've really taken a sharp left turn, very negative (and I'm a certified hater I quit this season to play infinity Nikki and poe and even I think its a bit much) and drastically more out of touch than the way the podcast started. And you're right, I hadn't considered it but there are def certain points where it feels almost antagonistic towards the non 0.1%. I really don't want to stop tuning in but it's getting harder to sit through each episode
@@FeralKobold Yeah, it's really sad. And what's an extra kicker is that the general quality of recordings have gone down. It went from somewhat coherent and functional, to now it's just a mess all throughout. It's like none of them particularly care anymore and are just fulfilling their contract with Wowhead.
I felt the exact same at the beginning and having things like insider wowhead information was really nice and insightful. But recently it has just been "why are you even raiding if you haven't killed Queen yet" or "you didn't actually play at all if you didn't do like 15s". Like, it's actually insane how quickly it spiralled.
I personally think the tier sets are nice. It's nothing overly complicated, I can swap to an alt and have a general idea of their tier set based on the role if I'm a little rustier on them or it's a fresh alt. I don't think S2 of TWW is the one they need to go full on all out with the tier sets. Hero talents are here to stay, and with the "Worldsoul Saga" I'm sure we'll get some NUTS one later on.
Also regarding the raid buffs in M+, it sucks but it's primarily a title hunters problem, not the general population of people doing their weekly vault or even just doing 12s. Just my opinion though.
Make mythic+ gear go mythic but only for M+. Just like pvp gear.
Do pvp people have max gear in a week? Maybe put a cap on it if they do.
Could do the same with delves, which should be way easier to implement. Assuming zones are used for pvp.
pvp players are gated by X amount of conquest they can acquire per week, also gated by sparks for crafted pvp pieces, similar to how it is in pve. though its overall a much better experience then pve
nah, i still think the PvP-Gear seperation is part of what killed PvP in WoW. I do remember in Cata i played a lot of PvP, because i could just hop in and be fine. Now if i want to hop in i get slaughtered and it´s 0 fun. And collecting Gear to actually play M+ is already so much of a slog that even the relatively small investment for the PvP starter gear is much too high a hurdle for me and so i do not PvP anymore.
If they boost up the drops in the m0 and m2 then hopefully we won't have these players trying to skip the low keys trying to get gear quick. Learning all the mechanics for the first time is also hard. They can make it so that you need to do each dungeon at lower keys and level up the difficulty you can enter each dungeon.
I'm happy about the sets, They're basic and maybe boring but man Id hate if a set forced me to play talents I don't want.
I play on a steam deck and almost only solo content, all my builds are designed to be as passive as possible.
If a set changed that for me I'd be sad 😊
Also, the onramp could maybe also be fixed by allowing delivers getting 6/6 hero without entering M+.
any chat linked item can be faked to have giga insane ilvl, stats and other shenanigans
This has been the least fun season in m+ I have ever experienced. I’ve played since 2004. Glad to hear some of these problems being talked about.
29:00 dont forget about Jaina mythic exploit. The whole world exploited this bug to farm mount lol and Blizzard didn't fix it at all or ban anyone
@Growl minute 24 question.. I think its a little more then just a scoreboard nerd problem. PVP has had this issue of ppl only playing the last two weeks of the season (for quite a while too), because why waste time before when rating inflation will make anything you do early on useless at the end. Im not sure the problem is that advanced in PVE.. I think you still have way more players early then late.. and rewards are more item then title driven so that might offset it.