Well, for interests sake, why don't you do a video on life through the last 1000 years or so. Flight was discovered 117 years ago... I personally can remember using one of the very first computers... and the one of the first of the cell phones... My grandmother (who died in 2018 at the age of 98) could remember African people dressed in skins ... and the first person (pedestrian) to die in a car accident was a woman in 1896 (Bridget Driscoll). The the first person to die in a car accident in the USA was Henry Hale Bliss in 1899. My grandmother's father (my great-grandad who died when I was 12 was the first person to own a car in our little town!. Fortunately (or unfortunately) my family have long list generations with longevity .... 3 times in recent history (including my son and grandson) 5 generations were alive at the same time
To add a Douglas Adams quote: “A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools.”
Rising sea levels will flood the island and seep into the chambers which will cause corrosion and seeping of radiation into the ocean for thousands of years. Future proof has to take in the future of our planet and it’s multi-millennial cycles. Unusable within 100 years and will begin contaminating the ocean within 200-500 years. Possibly the only way to dispose of radioactive waste is incineration into the sun or deposit it onto an unstable planet like Jupiter.
@@foxriley due the residual pressure the Last ice age left In northen Europa Finland is actually rising from se yes faster than seas are rising. If it stays above ground for bit More than 100 yers it Will be filled and by sealing the tomb we are planning a bit More than just closing the front gate and there is still that lvl of clay after that not saying nothing could happen but It's designed To hold below sea lvl.
@@sekofoni Guess sealing it in a deep tomb is the best solution for now, even sending to sun/Jupiter would be high risk unless we developed fail safe tech that could make it to space without possibility of blowing up. Guess we’ll just have to shove it in the ground and keep our fingers crossed. Cost of nuclear has its curse for now until we develop Helium 3 fission tech.
@@pev_ Let's hope that plan works! Altho with things like ground penetrating radar and other technologies to scan what is below the ground getting better and better there will always be a risk
Egypt valley of the dead was a boring desert..... Let's hide all our riches there, they'll never be found... 3-4,000 years later ...."oh, look, a hole, let's take a look. Oh, there's a curse on it, we can handle anything".... Lol
@@nicholasfeiock7873 I never worry about those. Temperature, amount of carbons, and peace (no movement) are the key to the fermenting stage. Bentonite is used for filtering: it somehow glues to the yeast and makes it to fall to the bottom.
You had me at moonshine. Jokes aside, I had no idea clay of any kind could be used to filter things. My gut instinct would be that it would do the exact opposite.
Telling people about the color-changing cats is one of my favorite conversation pieces tbh! Also, it totally makes sense that the only nation with an actual plan to deal with nuclear waste is Finland.
France is also working on a similar project, with Cigeo. Main difference is they start from the supposition that it Will eventually leak, so they choose a spot where even in the worst case scenario (containers and facility barely last a few decades) by the time the radionucleides reach the surface, they'll have decayed and spread to a safe level
@@Grouuumpf Onkalo site is chosen just because if they leak, the radiation propably won't seep to the water supply ... or surface. Deepest Water drillholes in finland are around 200m, but usually far less, 20-150m. The French project has actually roots at Onkalo. Even the Olkiluoto new reactor is french design (and everyone in finland regrets it :) )
@@slavicraptor9106 it's a bacterial infection that is verry acute and severe, without medical help you most likely will die if exposed to it! Many governments have weaponized Anthrax, just look at the UK's fuck up while experimenting with weaponized anthrax for exampel
So as a local living somewhat close to the plant, I have visited it many times. They arrange tours during the summer there. There are actually two tunnels one is the Onkalo and the second one is for the low-level radiation dumb. You can't visit Onkalo for obvious reasons but you can in fact visit the low-level radiation dumb. You get as close as to stand on top of the waste container. The level of radiation there is so low it's barely over the level of normal background radiation.
@dimapez you'd have to direct strike it with a surface piercing tactical warhead. a highly targeted and intentional strike. pretty normal bunkers are nuke-resistant.
@dimapez did you miss the part about this ground being totally stable for millions of years? I’m pretty sure the many doors on a nuclear waste tomb will be water tight 😂
@dimapez your point keeps flip flopping. Is it a tsunami or a shockwave or a direct strike you’re talking about? And if you do some research, you’ll see thousands of nuclear tests have been performed in stable bedrock across the world. Most notably by the USSR.
So in 5000 years, when things have gone full cycle and we are looking at disposing waste from recently discovered nuclear fission, this site looks ideal, it's boring etc.....dig and and oh
@@Noorthia this video is literally about waste from nuclear fission, the phenomenon we have been using to generate power from uranium since Enrico Fermi figured it out in the 40s
We already have new reactors that will burn high level nuclear waste. They take spent fuel with a 30,000 year half life extract the enormous energy it contains and end up with a waste that's just a 30 year 1/2 life.
It’s interesting to see how close to current sea level this island is. If ALL the earths ice melt, it’s estimated to cause a 200 foot rise in sea level. How will secure will this facility (corrosion-wise for example) be when it’s 180 feet under water? One of the advantages of the molten salt thorium reactors is that they can be used as lanthanide-burners. By adding the highly radioactive, waste isotopes into the molten salt, the intense neutron flux causes the lanthanides to decay much faster then their natural half-lives. IMO, that feature by itself should be a reason to investigate molten salt reactors.
Part of me doesn’t worry too much about future civilisations discovering Onkalo, part of that is because by the time they discover the drilling technology needed they would probably have discovered radiation and would be able to detect it, but even if they hadn’t they would notice that place was dangerous when everyone started dying. It would become a danger zone that everyone avoids, like that cave in the Middle East that everyone who enters dies due to it being full of gas. I don’t think any future civilisation would continue trying to explore a cave that everyone dies in, and if they do that’s kinda their own fault.
Finland: "We don't need a warning because this place is so boring no one will ever have a reason to dig here!" Also Finland: "Brilliant! Let's start digging here!"
This gave me an idea: I'll write a metal plate 'grimoire' and hide it in a time capsule. After ten thousand years it will send a signal and be found. If everything goes as planned, the future civilisation can make sense of it. The book tells about a cavern of demons. Then a bunch of occultists or mythbuster sceptics find the place, dig their way into the cavern, and then they begin to bleed and scream for no visible reason. The place is once again sealed, and no one ever finds out what the hell was that. That would be a good practical joke.
Problem with this is, in ten thousand years, the language that you write your grimoire in likely will not have any speakers. 500 years ago the residents of England spoke the language you read in Shakespear. 800 years ago the residents of England spoke early English, which is barely readable to a modern English speaker. 1200 years ago the residents of England spoke Anglo Saxon, which is most definitely a different language and is entirely unreadable to a modern person. Look, in the year 0, the most spoken language in the world was probably Classical Latin, a language which today as far as I'm aware does not have any native speakers. That's only 2,000 years. In 10,000 years this grimoire will be unreadable.
@@indrajithg I'm not sure if you're joking or not, but just in case you're being serious, cancer is a mutation of human cells, which causes uncontrollable division of the cells, eventually resulting in death. Each cancer is specific to that person as it is made with their own cells, meaning that cancer is not contagious in any way shape or form, even if you were to let's say, have a blood transfer from someone with cancer. There are only some very small exceptions like pregnant women passing on some specific cancers onto their children, or bloodlines just possessing a faulty gene that causes cancer at a certain age. A mummy could in theory be carcinogenic(cause cancer) it it is radioactive or has some sort of materials in or around it that cause mutations or damage to the human body, however it can't give cancer like a disease.
the solutions for warnings sounds like an awesome plot for a book or a movie "the precursor civilization, having left no inch of the world un explored, having found ways of doubling their life spand, having built cities capable of sheltering populations of entire kingdoms within its limits and towers of pure glass and fine steel, having said to have cured almost every disease and illness, and having been allowed to explore the heavens and homes of the gods in the sky, chose to preserve this knowledge to us above all else. this land is poison. and to not journey within its bounds"
19.35 he talks about the ice age moulding the bedrock and possibly revealing the nuclear waste. Onkalo is designed to withstand the next ice ages. There are cracks in the bedrock that have been formed by previous ice ages and are thought to crack in the same places in the future. Onkalo is designed so that the natural cracks are taken into consideration and the waste is not deposited in places where the cracks are. My source is me. I've been to olkiluoto and onkalo and have been briefed about the subject there.
Simon has another video about Onkalo on one of his other channels that goes into detail about those cracks and developing the depository around them.
4 роки тому+210
Question: why would anyone disturb the Onkalo's site in a far distant future? Answer: Probably for the very same reason Onkalo is being built in the first place; because there is some need to build something really, really secure underground where bedrock is very, very old and stable. The island of Olkiluoto is a great choice now, and it may be that in the far future as well. I can only imagine the level of curiosity that will be filling the minds of future geologists and historians when their exploratory drills reveal an extensive, long forgotten underground structure that was built by some unknown culture. What could it be..? It must be investigated!!1!
Yes, I can imagine the TV style show the archaeologist make talking about it. Until they all start dying. I would think a metal tablet in dozens of languages would be the bare minimum. Plus images could go from the top down. No one reads from the bottom up.
Yeah they should've made a warning sign in different languages/pictures and put it with the canisters. If someone's dug that deep the "too boring to attract interest" route obviously didn't work, so you might as well give them some idea of what's there. Maybe modern day languages will be better preserved in the future and it'll be easier for them to translate. Maybe it won't take 10,000 years for someone to dig down there. Why do they place all their hope on it not being found? They should've prepared for the worst and assume it would be found one day.
In the documentary film called "Into eternity" one of the project engineers jokingly says that one of his fears was discovering tons of old barrels and strange signs while they were digging the hole.
What Daa said - exactly what I was thinking! Imagine if today's construction workers got down 200 meters and discovered ancient dug out caverns filled with "mysterious" hollow metallic containers with no apparent seams. How terrifying...and AWESOME...would that be?!
As serious and grim the subject matter is, we had immense amounts of hilarity of watching UA-cam auto-generated subtitles trying to comprehend word "olkiluoto". Cheers from Finland.
When I was still in school, we had a tour at one of the nuclear plants in Finland (not actually sure if it was this one) and we visited the caves for the waste...... it was surreal, those caves were insanely huge and knowing how deep we had to go still blows my mind! Remember seeing one cave already sealed with waste, but the one next to it was still open and it was just ridiculously huge!
Thank you for this video! And the others before ofcourse. I worked as a geologist in the ONKALO from 2004 to 2008 and it was a very interesting project to be part of. I'll let my mates still working there know this piece exists. Ps. The buiding shown when Simon talked about the construction of ONKALO and what lies above is in fact the third power plant (still) in the making of. The tunnel entrance is fairly unremarkable hole in the bedrock.
One thing missing from this video is that this is ONE site, intended to store waste from Finland's ONE nuclear power plant, and that's it. There are 440 reactors used for producing nuclear power in the world. There should be hundreds of such sites operating around the world. The fact that there aren't any others is a way bigger and more urgent problem than anything that might happen at Onkalo in the next 100,000 years.
Finland has multiple reactors, and the waste from all will be stored in the same place. Sweden, designing the exact method used in Finland, have decided where to build the storage waste from four different plants. I'm not sure how far the actual process for construction had come. I'm sure there are other projects going on, with time taken to do it right.
@@ViktorBengtsson years ago i went to a nuclear waste processing plant in my country belgium. what i've always remembered is that they roll the high level waste into complex round bars and bury them in the ground. specifically in clay layers since they are the most stable, or so they claimed.
@Milkman Trusting that future technology will come up with better solutions sounds like typical "I'm going to let it be someone else's problem" and if everyone down the line is going to act same way it's going to end up being disaster until someone does something.
@Milkman we already have a better solution - don't MAKE this waste to begin with, by switching the industry to thorium salt bath reactors! No waste that must be kept safely protected for 100K years, no chance of meltdown or hydrogen gas buildup that explodes, and no chance of any waste being used in a dirty bomb. Research thorium salt bath technology, which has been around for decades, and then contact your representatives and demand the industry be made to switch over, now! For all of our safety! We've had this technology since long before Fukushima or Chernobyl, and yet the industry doesn't want to keep us safe, so they don't switch over!
The left-to-right vs right-to-left thing is so interesting. For example, the product ratings on Japanese shopping websites are often around 3 stars for both the best and worst products - because about half of shoppers will rate 1 star as being the best while the other half will follow Western/online norms and give a wonderful product a 5-star rating. Just made me think of that.
@Marechal Zolotoy I understand the implication, which I guess is the reason they didn't use the proper translation in the video. Google for "onkalo englanniksi".
There used to be tours into the Onkalo. My dad used to work a few summers there when he was young, I think his sister too. He gave me his old "Luolaklaani" (Cave-clan) shirt to me which was the workshirt every tour guide wore.
1:35 - Chapter 1 - The island of death 5:10 - Chapter 2 - Poison planet 8:25 - Mid roll ads 9:50 - Chapter 3 - A warning from the past 13:10 - Chapter 4 - Gone & forgotten 16:05 - Chapter 5 - Building the tomb 18:40 - Chapter 6 - Beyond the infinite
The brotherhood of steel would love the atomic priesthood , protecting the world from its own horrors , that aside great video Simon . Keep it up with the good work .
Hahah I thought of fallout too, just of it devolving into children of atom Even an order made for sane reasons could become a cult in a few hundred years, anything remotely religious will always become exploited by leaders and lead to irrational nonsense haha But yeah I'm sure the BOS would appreciate the effort
The Brotherhood who Steal shall not defile the hallowed halls of ATOM! Unless they wish to join us in worshiping holy ATOM and embrace the on coming division in the Finished Land! Glory upon ATOM! Let this tomb of his allow us to spread his holy word upon those unbeliever's!
@Sahil Sahota Glory to Atom, father of the undying Glow. Your suffering shall exist no longer; it shall be washed away in Atom's Glow, burned from you in the fire of his brilliance. Let us release the unbelievers to his power, so that all shall feel his Glow and be Divided!
@Eino Roine Yea. And at least at the time it was supposed to come into operation initially it was intended to be the most powerful nuclear reactor in the World. Some reactora have peobably passed it by now.
There is a 2010 documentary called INTO ETERNITY that deep dives this subject, very thought provoking highly recommend to anyone who enjoys this video. Well done Simon fantastic. 👍🏻
When speaking about how mindboggling time scales of this length really are, it highlights how incredible it is for Aboriginal people to have lived continuously in Australia for the last 65,000 years.
Imagine if the construction workers got down 200 meters deep and discovered an already existing network of ancient dug out caverns filled with "mysterious" hollow metallic containers. How terrifying...and AWESOME...would that be?!
The saddest part is that it doesn't need to be necessary! We just need to USE the technology we've had for nearly as long as the one used today: thorium salt bath reactors! No chance of having a meltdown, OR an explosion from hydrogen gas buildup, no wastes that need to be protected for 100K years, and no risk of any byproducts being used for a dirty bomb, either. The technology is only a few years younger than what the industry uses today, but they don't care about our safety enough to make the switch! Contact your representatives, by any and all methods: call, write, fax, text, tweet @ them, and use Resistbot. Demand they force the industry to make the switch, before the next Fukushima, Three Mile Island, or Chernobyl happens! We have the technology, already perfected, and the only reason the industry doesn't switch is the almighty dollar!
Gotta say, when we went to visit Olkiluoto and Onkalo on a school field trip I couldn't really appreciate the sheer amount of work that goes into designing and actually digging out that place, but nowadays, and after this video, I do.
Finland:"Let's build a nuclear waste vault here, because there's virtually no reason to visit this place anyway" This guy:"A nuclear vault? You hear that guys? Doesn't that sound interesting?" Finland:"Saatana"
It was really nice place to visit during my time in lukio (upper secondary / gymnasium). Visiting the whole powerplant, reactor hall, and the nearby VLJ-caves (i.e. caves relatively near the Onkalo site meant for medium & low level radiation waste). And no, we were not idiots, we carried plenty of radiation detectors on us. The real irony was that our own classroom in the upper secondary school had higher (background radiation, mostly from radon) radiation levels than what the reactor hall or the caverns did.
I've actually been there. It was a few years ago with school. At the time it was just a deep mine. It was cool to be so deep underground I've actually been quite a lot at Olkiluoto with school especially with physics class. I didn't appreciate it that much at the time, now I think it's super cool
Same where, we visited olkiluoto when i was in junior high school (yläaste) and was spoken about this place (somewhere around 04-05). Havent really given a thought to this whole topic until this video
Here's how I figure billions: By the sounds of it, the copper sleeve is 1 meter in diameter with a 5cm wall thickness. Using the diagram in the video, it looks like they will be 4 to 5 meters long. Let's say 5, for the sake of "round" numbers. Area of said pipe would be 8250 cubic cm. (Irrelevant) Weight of the pipe 7340kg (16200lb) Price of scrap copper is ~$3.20/lb 16200×3.2= $51840/pipe at scrap price Length of the mine they are filling up is 60 - 70 km. Call it 65. Lay down a 5 meter pipe with say a 1 meter gap 65000m ÷ 6m = ~10800 pipes in one row. Looks like 10 wide in the diagram 10800 × 10 = 108000 # of pipes × scrap price 108000 × 51840 = ~$5.6 billion Don't forget the solid cap on the end as well, add another 1 to 2. And that's if they only go one layer high. Am I wrong? I'm happy to hear how. 🙂
Molten Salt Reactors aka Thorium reactors, you can burn nuclear waste in them and it produces very little waste at all, and nothing toxic or radioactive
Ah yeah, screaming skulls on black jagged stones would really keep future explorers away.... Remind me, what do Archeologists do around sites picturing skulls and grim facades?
Simon: it ain't so dull if you only look closer, specifically, 450m meters beneath the ground. Me: ah i see, or more precise, i don't. i will get back to you when I've gained the ability to see through half a kilometer of dirt.
So Onkalo is a giant litter box essentially, where is my color changing cat? We are basically sweeping our problems under a rug and saying it'll be ok.
It’s also possible that the nuclear waste will become a desirable if not critical commodity and enormous expenditures will be dedicated to exhuming it for some currently unknown use.
You are closer than you think to the answer. 4th generation nuclear reactors can enrich the ‘waste’ uranium spent fuel and extract the 98% of fissile material remaining that older reactors couldn’t. This will reduce the amount of waste product considerably.
"The vast majority of respondents tested in an eleven-country survey [Brazil, Mexico, Morocco, Kenya, Saudi Arabia, China, India, Thailand, Poland, Ukraine and the USA] had no idea what the symbol meant nor had any knowledge of radiation. In fact, only 6% of those questioned in India, Brazil and Kenya could recognize the trefoil symbol for what it was" (Drop It And Run! by Linda Lodding). I had to go look up a source, because that's a distressing statistic.
just let the last few minutes sink in for a while... this is probably the biggest megaproject any human ever in in existence could have done up until this point in time
Yeah. If people thousands of years in the future hear that this was the site of one of the most expensive buildings in the world, they might want to do some archaeology and investigate. What made the building on this remote island so expensive? Maybe they could find some ruins of a majestic palace, or find ancient technology that was so advanced in the 21st century. But what they will find is probably what they would describe as gates of Hell.
@@TrolledBy You are thinking with present ideology which wont be how people think in the future nor was it how people thought in the past. If they have the technology to find the place with no signs of of any building under the ground or have heard about it. What makes you think they wouldnt have the technology or the advanced knowledge of knowing whats beneath the surface as well? You, me and the rest of the people alive now for sure dont know, but who knows if they have knowledge and machines to scan the whole earth of what atoms consist and where. Or to locate structures underneath the surface with technology. Humans have always been curious of the past hence why we are constantly digging and trying to locate ancient civilizations remains to learn more about the past. But the whole point of the project is to help the future so all we can do at the present is to make sure there is possibility of that for the future generations and civilizations.
@@TrolledBy Your hypothesis makes no sense at all. How could people thousands of years from now have any knowledge of this place?? I am alive at the same time that this facility is operational, I am also fully utilizing the technology of the Information Age and this is the FIRST time I've ever heard of this place. If it's largely unknown in today's world why would its legacy continue for thousands of years? After this project is completed in 100 years, they will disassemble the building and the site will be forgotten. Since when have people ever referred to ancient buildings as expensive?? The cost of the Great Pyramids probably very high but no cares.
Fun fact - as a part of the long-term safety asessment for the Onkalo waste disposal facility, the climate modelling for the next 500 000 years had been done, with the analysis on how the ice sheet might affect the waste stored. Yeah, those analyses were that much scrupulous
Damn it when Simon said "about as healthy as snorting..... Anthrax" I was waiting on my Boi with the blaze to come out and say cocaine. It's weird watching serious Simon after watching Business Blaze.
Actually visited the Onkalo once and went to the low-radiation (suits etc.) level and saw the pits they are stored in! Had to get the bottom of my shoes de-contaminated afterwards as they tripped the radiation meters on the way out lol. It was great trip, the tunnels were nice and cold in the hot summertime.
I really like these sites where we've set out to store nuclear materials long term. They have a legendary quality to them. Should global politics take a wrong turn, or the pandemic wipes out civilization, in thousands of years, these places are going to be mysterious and almost magical in a dangerous way. The truth may dilute into tales of ancient ancestors making deals with demons in exchange for power, and these sites were the price. I love it.
The saddest part of it all is that it really shouldn't be necessary! All we need to do is USE the technology we've had for nearly as long as the one used today: thorium salt bath reactors! Zero chance of having a meltdown, OR an explosion from hydrogen gas buildup, no wastes produced that need to be protected for 100K years (or even 10K years!), and no risk of any byproducts being used for a dirty bomb, either. The technology is only a few years younger than what the industry uses today, but they don't care about our safety enough to make the switch! Contact your representatives, by any and all methods: call, write, fax, text, tweet @ them, and use Resistbot. Demand they force the industry to make the switch, before the next Fukushima, Three Mile Island, or Chernobyl happens! We have the technology, already perfected, and the only reason the industry doesn't switch is the almighty dollar! The best way to make change is to use fierce pressure on both the politicians and the industry, itself. If enough people speak out, change can be made!
Fun fact you can visit the plant during summer. They arrange tours there. You can also visit the underground low-level radiation dump. I think I've been there for like three times now (I live just 20 minute drive from the plant)
I have actually worked on the exact same effort in Sweden, which uses the same design and plan. They have chosen my very town for this effort. I briefly worked with the organisation responsible, known here as the SKB, monitoring the environment at the test sites in the region to check how such efforts affects the geology and ecosystem.
This is your best video yet. Thought provoking, interesting and really well presented. Your time line analogy made these so much easier to understand. Loved it.
Good video! Just a few points though: Within a period of 1,000-10,000 years, the radioactivity of the majority of the high level waste from nuclear reactors decays to that of the originally mined uranium ore , and if you want to check the geologic stability of naturally occurring uranium ore and it's complete absence of impact on the environment when underground, google 'Oklo natural reactor'. This was a formation of 16 seams of uranium ore which 2 billion years ago - through some very quirky geology - sustained a natural nuclear chain reaction (on a 3 hour cycle). The formations did this for a few hundred thousand years, until the percentage of uranium-235 in the ore dropped below 3 percent, upon which they 'shut-down'. In terms of geological stability, over the entire period of their existence they have 'crept' only a matter of a couple of feet - *without* the benefit of encapsulation in copper canisters, concrete and bentonite clay. It's also interesting to consider that *highly* toxic industrial waste is routinely buried in not-so-secure undergound facilities as we speak: Germany for instance buries Cadmium, Arsenic, Mercury and the residues of electro-plating in disused salt mines (google kpluss undergound disposal). These waste products - unlike radioactive waste - DON'T diminish in toxicity *at all* over time and are something that future generation of humans will DEFINITELY want to avoid. Peace out.
Using Wifes phone not her opinions I know not remotely going to happen but if possible before any dangerous chemicals or ore refined or any form of mass production it should be first made possible to either render it safe by breaking it down with additives incineration ion bombardment maybe for radio nuclides to make less toxic or dangerous before it cam be mass produced yes will be costly but alot better than carcinogens being put in drums and tossed in a swamp ( they are killing our planet with dumping poison of all kinds in our oceans out O2 is from the sea ) radio active waste is just dumped and doesn't always make it to designated zones which should be none in the ocean but think about if it is a valid way why not to minimize toxic spills or if it happens we can neutralize it OK I SAID PROBABLY NOT GOING TO HAPPEN
I must say that your topics on all your projects and videos are, to me, amazing. Squarespace appears to be an amazing place to take our dreams into reality. Thanks for it all. I wish you continued success and health in your endeavors.
"You'd be dead as a Norwegian Parrot." I'd have Lovely Plumage though, right Simon? Either way, I don't believe I'd be dead. Just tired after a nice long squawk.
So far Covid hasn't affected the construction of Onkalo. Finland has allowed flying for the people who come from foreign countries and are important for its' construction. For now that is
You are am amazing speaker. The high like ratio on this video compared to others is so high, due to the speech you made at the end. Absolutely excellent.
From my understanding when we visited Olkiluoto from school, there is a chamber working already in olkiluoto, which theb was about 50% full 🤔 two chambers were there, one for clothes and such, and the other with high level waste.
I seem to remember a detail in metallurgy class about when copper and iron are in contact, corrosion happens. Plumbers don't connect pipes made of these two metals because of this. I suggest a placing this stuff in a shaft that goes down into an active and relatively fast-moving subduction zone. Then over time, the crust containing this stuff will pull it downward deeper into the mantle of the earth where it will never be accessible again.
(Meanwhile, in the year 2,435..) Scientist 1: "None of the signage has withstood the test of the elements, but be on your guard. This place seems dangerous, anyway." Scientist 2: "You got that right. Check your subatomic particle sensors through your retinal implants." Scientist 1: "What? Oh. Shit." Scientist 2: "Yeah...I think we have about five minutes to run out of here before we become permanent residents."
Also think about Carter opening King Tuts tomb. There was most likely a warning encraved that could not be translated corectly ( or was it? ). Some speculate about a curse that hit after opening but the curse could also have been a kind warning of diseases that killed the king. How can we know today? Following that path I think that we modern day people have figured out a way to deal with ancient Egyptian threats, so future civilisations might as well find a way to handle nuclear waste... or at least I hope so!
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Ideas... Love Canal and/or Three Mile Island.
How dare you call it comics!!! It’s called MANGA! That’s like calling anime cartoons!!
Ps. I am not serious lol just trolling 😂
Got Finnish name of places pretty right.. although Olkiluoto got worst with more "attempts"... 🤣🤣
Monty Python strikes again. Dead Norwegian Blue parrot.
Well, for interests sake, why don't you do a video on life through the last 1000 years or so. Flight was discovered 117 years ago... I personally can remember using one of the very first computers... and the one of the first of the cell phones... My grandmother (who died in 2018 at the age of 98) could remember African people dressed in skins ... and the first person (pedestrian) to die in a car accident was a woman in 1896 (Bridget Driscoll). The the first person to die in a car accident in the USA was Henry Hale Bliss in 1899. My grandmother's father (my great-grandad who died when I was 12 was the first person to own a car in our little town!. Fortunately (or unfortunately) my family have long list generations with longevity .... 3 times in recent history (including my son and grandson) 5 generations were alive at the same time
To add a Douglas Adams quote: “A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools.”
_"NOTHING is_ IDIOT PROOF _to a_ DETERMINED IDIOT."
Rising sea levels will flood the island and seep into the chambers which will cause corrosion and seeping of radiation into the ocean for thousands of years. Future proof has to take in the future of our planet and it’s multi-millennial cycles. Unusable within 100 years and will begin contaminating the ocean within 200-500 years.
Possibly the only way to dispose of radioactive waste is incineration into the sun or deposit it onto an unstable planet like Jupiter.
@@foxriley due the residual pressure the Last ice age left In northen Europa Finland is actually rising from se yes faster than seas are rising. If it stays above ground for bit More than 100 yers it Will be filled and by sealing the tomb we are planning a bit More than just closing the front gate and there is still that lvl of clay after that not saying nothing could happen but It's designed To hold below sea lvl.
@@sekofoni Guess sealing it in a deep tomb is the best solution for now, even sending to sun/Jupiter would be high risk unless we developed fail safe tech that could make it to space without possibility of blowing up. Guess we’ll just have to shove it in the ground and keep our fingers crossed. Cost of nuclear has its curse for now until we develop Helium 3 fission tech.
@@foxriley Better question is - what would happen to sun or Jupiter, if we start dumping nuclear waste there.
Onkalo actually translates more to: “hollow place” or “burrow”. But gotta love your effort on pronouncing Finnish words💜
He got them pretty right.
en saanu mitään selvää mitä se yritti sanoa videon alussa. "Olkiluoto" oli kyseinen sana
And usually "onkalo" is in stone, a cave..? There are different types of onkalo, but those are bc of the difference in the spoken language..?
@@hyljix mun mielestä se meni yllättävän hyvin..
Miten ois "hole"?
Future archeologists: "We think it's some kind of ritual cave, we can't wait to see what treasures lies below!"
This two comments and this video, reminds me of a fanfic I once read.
Hence the plan to leave no markings. No markings = nobody thinks there is anything below your feet but ground.
@@pev_ Let's hope that plan works! Altho with things like ground penetrating radar and other technologies to scan what is below the ground getting better and better there will always be a risk
Egypt valley of the dead was a boring desert..... Let's hide all our riches there, they'll never be found...
3-4,000 years later ...."oh, look, a hole, let's take a look. Oh, there's a curse on it, we can handle anything".... Lol
@@UberGrunk Someone who has developed a ground penetrating radar would definitely know what radiation is.
“Atomic Priesthood”
*Children of Atom intensifies*
I am a mutant...
eyyyyy
*bask in the glow*
@E Van in today's society, the majority of people dont know how to read a warning label on tide pods and bleach..
Worship the megaton bomb!!!
Bentonite clay: contains dinosaurs, necessary for kitty litter, good moonshine, and storing nuclear waste. The stuff is worth an episode of its own.
Moonshine needs a low acidity and high mineral content right?
@@nicholasfeiock7873 I never worry about those. Temperature, amount of carbons, and peace (no movement) are the key to the fermenting stage. Bentonite is used for filtering: it somehow glues to the yeast and makes it to fall to the bottom.
@@BarafuAlbino ahhhhh I see. Cheers.
@@nicholasfeiock7873 And a nice even temperature lasting, say, about 100,000 years.
You had me at moonshine. Jokes aside, I had no idea clay of any kind could be used to filter things. My gut instinct would be that it would do the exact opposite.
Telling people about the color-changing cats is one of my favorite conversation pieces tbh! Also, it totally makes sense that the only nation with an actual plan to deal with nuclear waste is Finland.
France is also working on a similar project, with Cigeo. Main difference is they start from the supposition that it Will eventually leak, so they choose a spot where even in the worst case scenario (containers and facility barely last a few decades) by the time the radionucleides reach the surface, they'll have decayed and spread to a safe level
At last the world has finally found a use for Finland, to be the rest of worlds dumping ground for high level nuclear waste!
@@Grouuumpf Onkalo site is chosen just because if they leak, the radiation propably won't seep to the water supply ... or surface. Deepest Water drillholes in finland are around 200m, but usually far less, 20-150m. The French project has actually roots at Onkalo. Even the Olkiluoto new reactor is french design (and everyone in finland regrets it :) )
Sweden has a similar idea, planned to be outside of Forsmark power plant.
Finland is actually using the Swedish plan for dealing with the nuclear waste.
An important detail was omitted from this video: the whole chamber is lined with Nokia 3310 phones, guaranteeing it can never be destroyed.
😅🤣😅🤣
I still have a 3310 only reason I don't use it is because it can't WhatsApp
Facts
Yes but unfortunately it dropped signal and lost forever
Underrated comment
"as healthy as snorting a line of anthrax" this may be my new favorite phrase
Fīnalē.
I lol'd at this😄
I'm going to start saying this! 😄🤘🏻
Wtf is anthrax? English isnt my first language
@@slavicraptor9106 it's a bacterial infection that is verry acute and severe, without medical help you most likely will die if exposed to it! Many governments have weaponized Anthrax, just look at the UK's fuck up while experimenting with weaponized anthrax for exampel
As a Finn I'm actually really impressed by your Finnish pronounciation Simon, good work
Simo Wiheltelijä
So as a local living somewhat close to the plant, I have visited it many times. They arrange tours during the summer there. There are actually two tunnels one is the Onkalo and the second one is for the low-level radiation dumb. You can't visit Onkalo for obvious reasons but you can in fact visit the low-level radiation dumb. You get as close as to stand on top of the waste container. The level of radiation there is so low it's barely over the level of normal background radiation.
That's just what they tell you.
@Cosmo Genesis dump
That's what the Russians said lol
Yeah, most low-level waste is just stuff that isn't actually radioactive, but needs to be given special treatment out of an abundance of caution.
@@rutrho890 ever heard of a geiger counter?
Finland is so metal. They are choosing to be the guardians of a never dying evil buried beneath the ground...
@dimapez sounds like a really good Target to me.
@dimapez you'd have to direct strike it with a surface piercing tactical warhead. a highly targeted and intentional strike.
pretty normal bunkers are nuke-resistant.
@dimapez did you miss the part about this ground being totally stable for millions of years? I’m pretty sure the many doors on a nuclear waste tomb will be water tight 😂
@dimapez with respect, you’re just making it more clear how little you understand this concept.
@dimapez your point keeps flip flopping. Is it a tsunami or a shockwave or a direct strike you’re talking about?
And if you do some research, you’ll see thousands of nuclear tests have been performed in stable bedrock across the world. Most notably by the USSR.
So in 5000 years, when things have gone full cycle and we are looking at disposing waste from recently discovered nuclear fission, this site looks ideal, it's boring etc.....dig and and oh
And they will have advanced drillng machines: melt the underground and pump it up.
Nature can already do that: lava!
@@duudsuufd pump up the nuclear jam
Fission doesnt make waste
@@Noorthia this video is literally about waste from nuclear fission, the phenomenon we have been using to generate power from uranium since Enrico Fermi figured it out in the 40s
We already have new reactors that will burn high level nuclear waste. They take spent fuel with a 30,000 year half life extract the enormous energy it contains and end up with a waste that's just a 30 year 1/2 life.
A sign saying "PERKELE!" would do the job just fine.
🤣🤣🤣
I could just as easily see someone seeing that and going "No, vittu" and shoveling vigorously.
Is gift the same as swedish. Poison?
yes i was thinking the same "PERKELE" the word alone is enough the scare bears away
It’s interesting to see how close to current sea level this island is. If ALL the earths ice melt, it’s estimated to cause a 200 foot rise in sea level. How will secure will this facility (corrosion-wise for example) be when it’s 180 feet under water?
One of the advantages of the molten salt thorium reactors is that they can be used as lanthanide-burners. By adding the highly radioactive, waste isotopes into the molten salt, the intense neutron flux causes the lanthanides to decay much faster then their natural half-lives. IMO, that feature by itself should be a reason to investigate molten salt reactors.
Part of me doesn’t worry too much about future civilisations discovering Onkalo, part of that is because by the time they discover the drilling technology needed they would probably have discovered radiation and would be able to detect it, but even if they hadn’t they would notice that place was dangerous when everyone started dying. It would become a danger zone that everyone avoids, like that cave in the Middle East that everyone who enters dies due to it being full of gas. I don’t think any future civilisation would continue trying to explore a cave that everyone dies in, and if they do that’s kinda their own fault.
Never underestimate the stupidity of a curious mind.
"You will be as dead as a Norwegian parrot" I'm not dead im just pining for the fjords
Not dead, just resting...
Nudge nudge, wink wink...
That one line earned a like for the reference
Finland: "We don't need a warning because this place is so boring no one will ever have a reason to dig here!"
Also Finland: "Brilliant! Let's start digging here!"
Lol... shit...
Finland is really the most boring place ever.Saw it
The builders joked that they would find a previous storage when they started digging :-)
Got em!
@@zapfanzapfan Thanks for the only 'LOL' of my day!
I love that they named it Onkalo. Such an amazing Finnish word.
Perhaps peeps of the future who study this site will be known as ......Onkalogists.
Suomi mainittu, torilla tavataan....
Very descriptive and appropriate
I would've preferred the name 'Reikä', to be honest.
@@mikitz pers
This gave me an idea: I'll write a metal plate 'grimoire' and hide it in a time capsule. After ten thousand years it will send a signal and be found. If everything goes as planned, the future civilisation can make sense of it. The book tells about a cavern of demons. Then a bunch of occultists or mythbuster sceptics find the place, dig their way into the cavern, and then they begin to bleed and scream for no visible reason. The place is once again sealed, and no one ever finds out what the hell was that.
That would be a good practical joke.
Post mortem homicide. Radical
I recommend titanium plating then.
Problem with this is, in ten thousand years, the language that you write your grimoire in likely will not have any speakers.
500 years ago the residents of England spoke the language you read in Shakespear.
800 years ago the residents of England spoke early English, which is barely readable to a modern English speaker.
1200 years ago the residents of England spoke Anglo Saxon, which is most definitely a different language and is entirely unreadable to a modern person.
Look, in the year 0, the most spoken language in the world was probably Classical Latin, a language which today as far as I'm aware does not have any native speakers.
That's only 2,000 years. In 10,000 years this grimoire will be unreadable.
just have it broadcast the screams of animals and humans lol. much more instinctual
@@moritamikamikara3879 its a joke
It makes me sad to know I will not live to see the end of this story.
I think that all the time... Hate the fact that I'll die 100s 1000s 500,000 years before this all ends and I wanna know how so much... LOL
Year 2020: Past Humans gave us Pyramids and mummies !
Year 102 020: Past Humans gave us Cancer and Leukemia....
And a beer named after a class of viruses!
Also Past Humans: “I love this lead seasoning on my spaghetti”
Um, are you sure that cancer doesn't originate from pyramids, and leukemia doesn't originate from mummies? Terrifying thought, isn't it?
Leukemia is a type of cancer
@@indrajithg I'm not sure if you're joking or not, but just in case you're being serious, cancer is a mutation of human cells, which causes uncontrollable division of the cells, eventually resulting in death. Each cancer is specific to that person as it is made with their own cells, meaning that cancer is not contagious in any way shape or form, even if you were to let's say, have a blood transfer from someone with cancer. There are only some very small exceptions like pregnant women passing on some specific cancers onto their children, or bloodlines just possessing a faulty gene that causes cancer at a certain age. A mummy could in theory be carcinogenic(cause cancer) it it is radioactive or has some sort of materials in or around it that cause mutations or damage to the human body, however it can't give cancer like a disease.
the solutions for warnings sounds like an awesome plot for a book or a movie
"the precursor civilization, having left no inch of the world un explored, having found ways of doubling their life spand, having built cities capable of sheltering populations of entire kingdoms within its limits and towers of pure glass and fine steel, having said to have cured almost every disease and illness, and having been allowed to explore the heavens and homes of the gods in the sky, chose to preserve this knowledge to us above all else. this land is poison. and to not journey within its bounds"
get exurb1a on the case
19.35 he talks about the ice age moulding the bedrock and possibly revealing the nuclear waste. Onkalo is designed to withstand the next ice ages. There are cracks in the bedrock that have been formed by previous ice ages and are thought to crack in the same places in the future. Onkalo is designed so that the natural cracks are taken into consideration and the waste is not deposited in places where the cracks are. My source is me. I've been to olkiluoto and onkalo and have been briefed about the subject there.
yea, it has been several times under ice age already
Simon has another video about Onkalo on one of his other channels that goes into detail about those cracks and developing the depository around them.
Question: why would anyone disturb the Onkalo's site in a far distant future?
Answer: Probably for the very same reason Onkalo is being built in the first place; because there is some need to build something really, really secure underground where bedrock is very, very old and stable. The island of Olkiluoto is a great choice now, and it may be that in the far future as well.
I can only imagine the level of curiosity that will be filling the minds of future geologists and historians when their exploratory drills reveal an extensive, long forgotten underground structure that was built by some unknown culture. What could it be..? It must be investigated!!1!
Yes, I can imagine the TV style show the archaeologist make talking about it. Until they all start dying. I would think a metal tablet in dozens of languages would be the bare minimum. Plus images could go from the top down. No one reads from the bottom up.
@@zeusathena26 you say that, but tbh I wouldn’t be surprised if future humans do that...
Yeah they should've made a warning sign in different languages/pictures and put it with the canisters. If someone's dug that deep the "too boring to attract interest" route obviously didn't work, so you might as well give them some idea of what's there. Maybe modern day languages will be better preserved in the future and it'll be easier for them to translate. Maybe it won't take 10,000 years for someone to dig down there. Why do they place all their hope on it not being found? They should've prepared for the worst and assume it would be found one day.
In the documentary film called "Into eternity" one of the project engineers jokingly says that one of his fears was discovering tons of old barrels and strange signs while they were digging the hole.
What Daa said - exactly what I was thinking!
Imagine if today's construction workers got down 200 meters and discovered ancient dug out caverns filled with "mysterious" hollow metallic containers with no apparent seams. How terrifying...and AWESOME...would that be?!
As serious and grim the subject matter is, we had immense amounts of hilarity of watching UA-cam auto-generated subtitles trying to comprehend word "olkiluoto". Cheers from Finland.
When I was still in school, we had a tour at one of the nuclear plants in Finland (not actually sure if it was this one) and we visited the caves for the waste...... it was surreal, those caves were insanely huge and knowing how deep we had to go still blows my mind! Remember seeing one cave already sealed with waste, but the one next to it was still open and it was just ridiculously huge!
Thank you for this video! And the others before ofcourse. I worked as a geologist in the ONKALO from 2004 to 2008 and it was a very interesting project to be part of. I'll let my mates still working there know this piece exists. Ps. The buiding shown when Simon talked about the construction of ONKALO and what lies above is in fact the third power plant (still) in the making of. The tunnel entrance is fairly unremarkable hole in the bedrock.
One thing missing from this video is that this is ONE site, intended to store waste from Finland's ONE nuclear power plant, and that's it.
There are 440 reactors used for producing nuclear power in the world. There should be hundreds of such sites operating around the world. The fact that there aren't any others is a way bigger and more urgent problem than anything that might happen at Onkalo in the next 100,000 years.
Finland has multiple reactors, and the waste from all will be stored in the same place. Sweden, designing the exact method used in Finland, have decided where to build the storage waste from four different plants. I'm not sure how far the actual process for construction had come.
I'm sure there are other projects going on, with time taken to do it right.
@@ViktorBengtsson years ago i went to a nuclear waste processing plant in my country belgium. what i've always remembered is that they roll the high level waste into complex round bars and bury them in the ground. specifically in clay layers since they are the most stable, or so they claimed.
There are 4 active reactors in Finland, 1 under construction and 1 being planned. One test reactor is being decommissioned.
@Milkman Trusting that future technology will come up with better solutions sounds like typical "I'm going to let it be someone else's problem" and if everyone down the line is going to act same way it's going to end up being disaster until someone does something.
@Milkman we already have a better solution - don't MAKE this waste to begin with, by switching the industry to thorium salt bath reactors! No waste that must be kept safely protected for 100K years, no chance of meltdown or hydrogen gas buildup that explodes, and no chance of any waste being used in a dirty bomb.
Research thorium salt bath technology, which has been around for decades, and then contact your representatives and demand the industry be made to switch over, now! For all of our safety! We've had this technology since long before Fukushima or Chernobyl, and yet the industry doesn't want to keep us safe, so they don't switch over!
major props for mentioning those stones in Japan.
The left-to-right vs right-to-left thing is so interesting. For example, the product ratings on Japanese shopping websites are often around 3 stars for both the best and worst products - because about half of shoppers will rate 1 star as being the best while the other half will follow Western/online norms and give a wonderful product a 5-star rating.
Just made me think of that.
“As dead as a Norwegian parrot.” Thank you. This is the best reference
It's just pining for the damn fjords.....
It's not dead, it's resting!
"Quantifying all other scales of dullness" I'm stealing that haha
That described my life to a "T"
A more accurate English translation for "onkalo" is cavity.
According to the scientists who named it and are working on it, they are using this name as "hiding place".
@Marechal Zolotoy I understand the implication, which I guess is the reason they didn't use the proper translation in the video. Google for "onkalo englanniksi".
Or anus
Try "Cavern"
@@va941 Yes, that works as well as cavity does. TY!
10:51 and thus born was the Children of Atom, may we forever bask in his glow
There used to be tours into the Onkalo. My dad used to work a few summers there when he was young, I think his sister too. He gave me his old "Luolaklaani" (Cave-clan) shirt to me which was the workshirt every tour guide wore.
1:35 - Chapter 1 - The island of death
5:10 - Chapter 2 - Poison planet
8:25 - Mid roll ads
9:50 - Chapter 3 - A warning from the past
13:10 - Chapter 4 - Gone & forgotten
16:05 - Chapter 5 - Building the tomb
18:40 - Chapter 6 - Beyond the infinite
The brotherhood of steel would love the atomic priesthood , protecting the world from its own horrors , that aside great video Simon . Keep it up with the good work .
To me it sounded more like a twisted Children of Atom. Over the millenia, the words of warning becoming worshipped words of prophecy.
Hahah I thought of fallout too, just of it devolving into children of atom
Even an order made for sane reasons could become a cult in a few hundred years, anything remotely religious will always become exploited by leaders and lead to irrational nonsense haha
But yeah I'm sure the BOS would appreciate the effort
Where do I sign up to join this Atomic Priesthood? 😂🙋♂️
The Brotherhood who Steal shall not defile the hallowed halls of ATOM! Unless they wish to join us in worshiping holy ATOM and embrace the on coming division in the Finished Land!
Glory upon ATOM! Let this tomb of his allow us to spread his holy word upon those unbeliever's!
@Sahil Sahota Glory to Atom, father of the undying Glow. Your suffering shall exist no longer; it shall be washed away in Atom's Glow, burned from you in the fire of his brilliance. Let us release the unbelievers to his power, so that all shall feel his Glow and be Divided!
So are you going to show us how this was built on Megaprojects? Maybe cover the finances involved behind it on Business Blaze?
I would no joke, watch all of them
@Eino Roine Yea. And at least at the time it was supposed to come into operation initially it was intended to be the most powerful nuclear reactor in the World. Some reactora have peobably passed it by now.
@@Duckquek17 Me too 😃
@Eino Roine So true brother!
@Eino Roine It's the most expensive building in the world
There is a 2010 documentary called INTO ETERNITY that deep dives this subject, very thought provoking highly recommend to anyone who enjoys this video. Well done Simon fantastic. 👍🏻
Very good documentary and an inspired use of Kraftwerk music :-)
I suggest blazing first before watching this documentary ... for scientific purposes 🍁🔥🌬️
Any suggestions where to watch it?
@@benjamin112 in a deep dark cavern in Finland buried under bentonite clay ✅
@@slcpunk2740 😂😂
When speaking about how mindboggling time scales of this length really are, it highlights how incredible it is for Aboriginal people to have lived continuously in Australia for the last 65,000 years.
When I first read the title I read:"Onkalo: Finland's 100,000 Year Nuclear Bomb"
Is that a Norwegian Blue parrot? It's not dead, just pining for the fjords.
it's just resting.😄
@@markrowe8824 lovely plumage the Norwegian Blue
If you hadn't nailed it to its perch it'd be pushing up the daisies. This is an ex-parrot!
@@johnniemiec3286 stunning
An ex-parot
Imagine if the construction workers got down 200 meters deep and discovered an already existing network of ancient dug out caverns filled with "mysterious" hollow metallic containers. How terrifying...and AWESOME...would that be?!
I don't have to write this comment now
4:05 "Snorting a line of Coca..." wait wrong channel
your boy with the blaze is slowly leaking into other channels
Yeah, but that wouldn't be a bad thing like anthrax/radiation.
I really enjoyed the comparisons and analogies to portray deep time. And just how far into the future our decisions as a species will leave an impact.
The saddest part is that it doesn't need to be necessary! We just need to USE the
technology we've had for nearly as long as the one used today: thorium salt bath reactors! No chance of having a meltdown, OR an explosion from hydrogen gas buildup, no wastes that need to be protected for 100K years, and no risk of any byproducts being used for a dirty bomb, either. The technology is only a few years younger than what the industry uses today, but they don't care about our safety enough to make the switch!
Contact your representatives, by any and all methods: call, write, fax, text, tweet @ them, and use Resistbot. Demand they force the industry to make the switch, before the next Fukushima, Three Mile Island, or Chernobyl happens! We have the technology, already perfected, and the only reason the industry doesn't switch is the almighty dollar!
Gotta say, when we went to visit Olkiluoto and Onkalo on a school field trip I couldn't really appreciate the sheer amount of work that goes into designing and actually digging out that place, but nowadays, and after this video, I do.
Haha, was requesting this on Megaprojects. Glad to see it.
Probably a better fit for this channel tbf.
Very interesting subject.
Was gonna say the same.
Finland:"Let's build a nuclear waste vault here, because there's virtually no reason to visit this place anyway"
This guy:"A nuclear vault? You hear that guys? Doesn't that sound interesting?"
Finland:"Saatana"
windows XP.
Not even the Imperium of Man is that Old
My first thought when he was explaining the time scale
nope, only 10,000 years, not even the emperor, he is almost i think. 80,000
@@KingofAwesomness14 he is much more older than the Empire. About 48.000 years old
Laughs in Necron
@@lryiss9407 heretic
It was really nice place to visit during my time in lukio (upper secondary / gymnasium). Visiting the whole powerplant, reactor hall, and the nearby VLJ-caves (i.e. caves relatively near the Onkalo site meant for medium & low level radiation waste). And no, we were not idiots, we carried plenty of radiation detectors on us. The real irony was that our own classroom in the upper secondary school had higher (background radiation, mostly from radon) radiation levels than what the reactor hall or the caverns did.
I've actually been there. It was a few years ago with school. At the time it was just a deep mine. It was cool to be so deep underground
I've actually been quite a lot at Olkiluoto with school especially with physics class. I didn't appreciate it that much at the time, now I think it's super cool
Same where, we visited olkiluoto when i was in junior high school (yläaste) and was spoken about this place (somewhere around 04-05). Havent really given a thought to this whole topic until this video
I was supposed to go there with the physics class in high school but I overslept and didn't quite catch the bus. It was a sad day. :-(
@@Saareem Oh no :(
Yeah same here. Toured the olkiluoto power plant and the onkalo facilitity with school back in the early 2000's
They are also burying billions of dollars in copper!
Note to self: start "The legend of the buried copper"
Don't tell South Africa...there would be an invasion by our recycling community 🤣
@@celticphoenix2579 No, no. This little secret is staying in my family. In 3000 generations, we'll be rich! 😆
Not to sure about Billions...
Here's how I figure billions:
By the sounds of it, the copper sleeve is 1 meter in diameter with a 5cm wall thickness. Using the diagram in the video, it looks like they will be 4 to 5 meters long. Let's say 5, for the sake of "round" numbers.
Area of said pipe would be 8250 cubic cm. (Irrelevant)
Weight of the pipe 7340kg (16200lb)
Price of scrap copper is ~$3.20/lb
16200×3.2= $51840/pipe at scrap price
Length of the mine they are filling up is 60 - 70 km. Call it 65.
Lay down a 5 meter pipe with say a 1 meter gap
65000m ÷ 6m = ~10800 pipes in one row. Looks like 10 wide in the diagram
10800 × 10 = 108000
# of pipes × scrap price
108000 × 51840 = ~$5.6 billion
Don't forget the solid cap on the end as well, add another 1 to 2.
And that's if they only go one layer high.
Am I wrong? I'm happy to hear how. 🙂
Was thinking the same, someone is deffinently gnna be digging for that copper in the future 😂
the future of the planet rests in the adorable little paws of color changing cats.
I'm Finnish and have never even heard about this.. Also props for pronouncing Onkalo near perfectly!
true, a basic finn would have to do some digging to find out about this.. the happening is more known outside borders than inside
@@Chokwik Dont know about that, when is was in junior high school (yläaste) we visited olkiluoto and was spoken about this place.
@@TopiAS06 ok, maybe the younger gen is schooled about this. good to hear
Where have you been living? In a cave? ;-)
@@Saareem probably yes xD
This guys a genius, i like how his channels are split between themes. Keep up the good work!
Molten Salt Reactors aka Thorium reactors, you can burn nuclear waste in them and it produces very little waste at all, and nothing toxic or radioactive
Im looking forward to the episode 100,000 years from now, detailing how it was rediscovered and what it went through over those 100,000 years.
One of my favorite Terry Pratchett quotes and definitely appropriate, thanks Simon!
GNU Terry Pratchett
I agree
Ah yeah, screaming skulls on black jagged stones would really keep future explorers away....
Remind me, what do Archeologists do around sites picturing skulls and grim facades?
Simon giving me an existential crisis at 2:25am on a Tuesday morning.
Thanks pal 👍🏼
Tbh, I love the idea of the Atomic Priesthood. It's bizarre and unlikely to actually do what it needs to, but it's a fascinating idea.
The Children of Atom
Simon: it ain't so dull if you only look closer, specifically, 450m meters beneath the ground.
Me: ah i see, or more precise, i don't. i will get back to you when I've gained the ability to see through half a kilometer of dirt.
So Onkalo is a giant litter box essentially, where is my color changing cat? We are basically sweeping our problems under a rug and saying it'll be ok.
You've had 7 months to come up with a better idea, so what is it? Let's hear it.
It’s also possible that the nuclear waste will become a desirable if not critical commodity and enormous expenditures will be dedicated to exhuming it for some currently unknown use.
You are closer than you think to the answer. 4th generation nuclear reactors can enrich the ‘waste’ uranium spent fuel and extract the 98% of fissile material remaining that older reactors couldn’t. This will reduce the amount of waste product considerably.
Lucky guess, I guess.
"The vast majority of respondents tested in an eleven-country survey [Brazil, Mexico, Morocco, Kenya, Saudi Arabia, China, India, Thailand, Poland, Ukraine and the USA] had no idea what the symbol meant nor had any knowledge of radiation. In fact, only 6% of those questioned in India, Brazil and Kenya could recognize the trefoil symbol for what it was" (Drop It And Run! by Linda Lodding).
I had to go look up a source, because that's a distressing statistic.
This is possibly the best video simon has ever made. Excellent.
About as healthy as snorting a line of anthrax is gold.
just let the last few minutes sink in for a while... this is probably the biggest megaproject any human ever in in existence could have done up until this point in time
Olkiluoto is not that dull I mean its home to three huge nuclear powerplants I think thats at least somewhat interesting.
Yeah. If people thousands of years in the future hear that this was the site of one of the most expensive buildings in the world, they might want to do some archaeology and investigate. What made the building on this remote island so expensive? Maybe they could find some ruins of a majestic palace, or find ancient technology that was so advanced in the 21st century. But what they will find is probably what they would describe as gates of Hell.
@@TrolledBy You are thinking with present ideology which wont be how people think in the future nor was it how people thought in the past. If they have the technology to find the place with no signs of of any building under the ground or have heard about it. What makes you think they wouldnt have the technology or the advanced knowledge of knowing whats beneath the surface as well? You, me and the rest of the people alive now for sure dont know, but who knows if they have knowledge and machines to scan the whole earth of what atoms consist and where. Or to locate structures underneath the surface with technology. Humans have always been curious of the past hence why we are constantly digging and trying to locate ancient civilizations remains to learn more about the past. But the whole point of the project is to help the future so all we can do at the present is to make sure there is possibility of that for the future generations and civilizations.
@@TrolledBy Your hypothesis makes no sense at all. How could people thousands of years from now have any knowledge of this place??
I am alive at the same time that this facility is operational, I am also fully utilizing the technology of the Information Age and this is the FIRST time I've ever heard of this place.
If it's largely unknown in today's world why would its legacy continue for thousands of years?
After this project is completed in 100 years, they will disassemble the building and the site will be forgotten.
Since when have people ever referred to ancient buildings as expensive?? The cost of the Great Pyramids probably very high but no cares.
Fun fact - as a part of the long-term safety asessment for the Onkalo waste disposal facility, the climate modelling for the next 500 000 years had been done, with the analysis on how the ice sheet might affect the waste stored. Yeah, those analyses were that much scrupulous
“Dead as a Norwegian Parrot” I never imagined there would be a Monty Python reference in this video.
He even talked about a python named Monty on another of his channels and said "get it?"
Always be prepared for a Monty Python reference! Sorta like always having a towel with you. 😄😉
Damn it when Simon said "about as healthy as snorting..... Anthrax" I was waiting on my Boi with the blaze to come out and say cocaine.
It's weird watching serious Simon after watching Business Blaze.
Actually visited the Onkalo once and went to the low-radiation (suits etc.) level and saw the pits they are stored in! Had to get the bottom of my shoes de-contaminated afterwards as they tripped the radiation meters on the way out lol. It was great trip, the tunnels were nice and cold in the hot summertime.
I really like these sites where we've set out to store nuclear materials long term. They have a legendary quality to them. Should global politics take a wrong turn, or the pandemic wipes out civilization, in thousands of years, these places are going to be mysterious and almost magical in a dangerous way. The truth may dilute into tales of ancient ancestors making deals with demons in exchange for power, and these sites were the price. I love it.
The saddest part of it all is that it really shouldn't be necessary! All we need to do is USE the technology we've had for nearly as long as the one used today: thorium salt bath reactors! Zero chance of having a meltdown, OR an explosion from hydrogen gas buildup, no wastes produced that need to be protected for 100K years (or even 10K years!), and no risk of any byproducts being used for a dirty bomb, either. The technology is only a few years younger than what the industry uses today, but they don't care about our safety enough to make the switch!
Contact your representatives, by any and all methods: call, write, fax, text, tweet @ them, and use Resistbot. Demand they force the industry to make the switch, before the next Fukushima, Three Mile Island, or Chernobyl happens! We have the technology, already perfected, and the only reason the industry doesn't switch is the almighty dollar!
The best way to make change is to use fierce pressure on both the politicians and the industry, itself. If enough people speak out, change can be made!
This comment is a year late, but in a sense, we have made deals with demons in exchange for limitless power, but that power came at a heavy cost.
Fun fact you can visit the plant during summer. They arrange tours there. You can also visit the underground low-level radiation dump. I think I've been there for like three times now (I live just 20 minute drive from the plant)
I have actually worked on the exact same effort in Sweden, which uses the same design and plan. They have chosen my very town for this effort. I briefly worked with the organisation responsible, known here as the SKB, monitoring the environment at the test sites in the region to check how such efforts affects the geology and ecosystem.
This is your best video yet. Thought provoking, interesting and really well presented. Your time line analogy made these so much easier to understand. Loved it.
You want a timeline analogy? If the age of earth spanned a football field, the sum total of human existence spans 4 millimetres.
Good video! Just a few points though: Within a period of 1,000-10,000 years, the radioactivity of the majority of the high level waste from nuclear reactors decays to that of the originally mined uranium ore , and if you want to check the geologic stability of naturally occurring uranium ore and it's complete absence of impact on the environment when underground, google 'Oklo natural reactor'. This was a formation of 16 seams of uranium ore which 2 billion years ago - through some very quirky geology - sustained a natural nuclear chain reaction (on a 3 hour cycle). The formations did this for a few hundred thousand years, until the percentage of uranium-235 in the ore dropped below 3 percent, upon which they 'shut-down'. In terms of geological stability, over the entire period of their existence they have 'crept' only a matter of a couple of feet - *without* the benefit of encapsulation in copper canisters, concrete and bentonite clay. It's also interesting to consider that *highly* toxic industrial waste is routinely buried in not-so-secure undergound facilities as we speak: Germany for instance buries Cadmium, Arsenic, Mercury and the residues of electro-plating in disused salt mines (google kpluss undergound disposal). These waste products - unlike radioactive waste - DON'T diminish in toxicity *at all* over time and are something that future generation of humans will DEFINITELY want to avoid. Peace out.
Using Wifes phone not her opinions I know not remotely going to happen but if possible before any dangerous chemicals or ore refined or any form of mass production it should be first made possible to either render it safe by breaking it down with additives incineration ion bombardment maybe for radio nuclides to make less toxic or dangerous before it cam be mass produced yes will be costly but alot better than carcinogens being put in drums and tossed in a swamp ( they are killing our planet with dumping poison of all kinds in our oceans out O2 is from the sea ) radio active waste is just dumped and doesn't always make it to designated zones which should be none in the ocean but think about if it is a valid way why not to minimize toxic spills or if it happens we can neutralize it OK I SAID PROBABLY NOT GOING TO HAPPEN
I'd like to return this dead Norwegian parrot.
Nah, mate... it's not dead...it's just stunned.
Norwegian blues stun easily!
Beautiful plumage innit
He’s pining for the fjords.
This parrot what I purchased not half an hour ago from this very boutique...
Just for anyone wondering most pictures here are not of Onkalo. The pictures are of the reactors. Onkalo is just a door on a rock from the outside.
I have both anxiety and panic disorder, and oddly I found this soothing. My problems seem so small.
The Norwegian (Blue) Parrot isn't dead, it's resting.
lovely plumage !!
He's pining for the fjords!
It has shuffled off its mortal coil, bereft of life it is a stiff......
As dead as a Norwegian parrot 🤣
Love the reference
Also im a Norwegian.......Allegedly
It's sleeping
'e's resting.
@@samiraperi467 or pining. Definitely not pushing up the daisies. 😆
He's pining for the fjords!
lovely plumage !!
"Once it finally beging operation..." - 'Looking at the newest Olkiluoto* Yes, prehaps in 2077.
I must say that your topics on all your projects and videos are, to me, amazing. Squarespace appears to be an amazing place to take our dreams into reality. Thanks for it all. I wish you continued success and health in your endeavors.
Despite how scary this subject is I loved the Norwegian parrot reference from Monty Python's flying circus.
"You'd be dead as a Norwegian Parrot."
I'd have Lovely Plumage though, right Simon? Either way, I don't believe I'd be dead. Just tired after a nice long squawk.
Last time I was this early, 3.6 roentgen wasn't great but wasn't terrible
Neither did RBMK core reactor explode
It was about the amount of a chest ex ray.
So far Covid hasn't affected the construction of Onkalo. Finland has allowed flying for the people who come from foreign countries and are important for its' construction. For now that is
You are am amazing speaker. The high like ratio on this video compared to others is so high, due to the speech you made at the end. Absolutely excellent.
Holy s... Simon went reeeeeeeally poetic this time haha
Great video, man! Keep them coming
I would have been here sooner but youtube decided to clockwork orange my optical receptors with advertisements. Oh, I am sorry Simon. Please go on.
Firefox with uBlock and Sponsorblock. I never see ads, not even the sponsor segments that are PART OF THE VIDEO.
Sounds like cause for lashings of the ultra violent !
20:45 Point made, but Rage Against The Machine predicted it over 16 years before it happened...
And the simpsons. Why didn't we listen?!
At least finland isn’t just ignoring the problem like many others.
I would say this is one of your most interesting videos to date. I almost tried to like it a second time.
From my understanding when we visited Olkiluoto from school, there is a chamber working already in olkiluoto, which theb was about 50% full 🤔 two chambers were there, one for clothes and such, and the other with high level waste.
I seem to remember a detail in metallurgy class about when copper and iron are in contact, corrosion happens. Plumbers don't connect pipes made of these two metals because of this.
I suggest a placing this stuff in a shaft that goes down into an active and relatively fast-moving subduction zone. Then over time, the crust containing this stuff will pull it downward deeper into the mantle of the earth where it will never be accessible again.
I might be as dead as a Norweigan parrot, but I'll still have beautiful plumage!
Image the poor archeologist who opens this in a few thousand years...
(Meanwhile, in the year 2,435..)
Scientist 1: "None of the signage has withstood the test of the elements, but be on your guard. This place seems dangerous, anyway."
Scientist 2: "You got that right. Check your subatomic particle sensors through your retinal implants."
Scientist 1: "What? Oh. Shit."
Scientist 2: "Yeah...I think we have about five minutes to run out of here before we become permanent residents."
Also think about Carter opening King Tuts tomb. There was most likely a warning encraved that could not be translated corectly ( or was it? ). Some speculate about a curse that hit after opening but the curse could also have been a kind warning of diseases that killed the king. How can we know today? Following that path I think that we modern day people have figured out a way to deal with ancient Egyptian threats, so future civilisations might as well find a way to handle nuclear waste... or at least I hope so!
@@muttergnadenlos5731 I guess we ought to hang around that long and find out 😁
That's how Suicide Squad 2 starts.Why do you think Enchantress glows like that?
@@joonahautala6208 "let's get this on to a tray"
4:37-4:41: Remarkable bird, the Norwegian Blue; beautiful plumage!