The display manager (KDM, GDM, XDM) loads after X11 or Wayland. The DM is just a graphical program to manage the login to the desktop and need a graphical server to load on.
In GDM (GNOME Display Manager), there is an option called "WaylandEnable", if that is set to true, GDM uses Wayland, if it is false or commented out it uses X11.
Wayland is not a Display Server that first statement is alredy wrong. It is a Protocol and the actual Desktops have to program thyr Display managers etc. around that protocol for compatibility.
Thank you for explaining this -- thru showing us an example. It makes total sense. I had basic idea of how X worked, but I'm coming from Windows. And, I want to understand Linux better.
Minor note, over a year later, initramfs loads the root file system. It loads first in case a problem disrupts that sequence (that's why it has itsown mini-toolkit/environment.
I ran into problems with wayland being unable to drag and drop archive contents to my file explorer when extracting... but on x11 worked just fine... wayland is much responsive tho and I use gnome desktop.... if this problem in wayland is fixed then I might use it again
I use X11 because network transparency and accessibility and automation are important, and Wayland sacrificed those things to solve problems I don't have. I could list many examples if youtube's filter would let me, but it blocks long comments... so I'll try to describe just one. I have a bunch of computers, including desktops, notebooks, and servers. I rely on being able to use all of them regardless of where I am or which hardware is in front of me. With X11 I can mix and match freely, but Wayland is designed to prevent that because it's considered unnecessary and a security risk. Like, if I'm at my desk I have a desktop and two notebooks, so I use the desktop's mouse and keyboard for all three, simply moving the cursor off the edge of one screen and onto the next, using a trivial little program called x2x. But frequently I'll grab a notebook to go elsewhere, like a cafe or the loo or a client meeting or even just the living room couch. I can still use every computer, either by exporting a running session as a remote desktop, or running individual programs over the network for remote display, or simply moving the cursor to any screens which happen to be nearby. It all "just works" easily and reliably, even for servers with no screen or keyboard attached. When doing local stuff it's a smooth 60fps with no perceptible lag, and when remote, things are slower but still very usable. But Wayland doesn't do that. In a time when nearly everything in computing is getting more flexible, more interoperable, and more network-transparent... Wayland strives to go in the opposite direction. With Wayland, I can't even use my notebooks while I'm at my desk.
The only annoying thing in wayland is vsync is forced on for everything, so the vsync setting in video games litterally does nothing. Vsync should be enabled for windows and desktop applications, but its annoying it doesnt allow easy changing of vsync of games or 3D applications
That's very "racist" in terms of OS'es. (Does it have a term? OS-ist?). I would also suggest jumping to open source like an illumos distribution, but still respect people who'd stay on proprietary shit.
Ok, I did my research when i made this video but found that the two terms were used interchangeably, I don't have any kind of experience with wayland or x11, i did it only for a month or two and decided to make a video about it. If you can explain in detail it will be of help to anyone reading :)
@@oddstonegames As alluded to, X11 is a windowing system and protocol. A big component of it is the server, but X11 itself isn't the server. Though, the distinction can be confusing, given that X11's canonical implementation is XOrg Server.
There is not really a question whether to go with wayland or X11. its more like have you an nvidia Graphics card oder an AMD/Intel graphics card. With the first one you have no real choice. witch the others the best option for many usecases ist the not deprecated standard - wayland. But you also may have A workload that does currently not support wwayland - so again no choice..
The display manager (KDM, GDM, XDM) loads after X11 or Wayland. The DM is just a graphical program to manage the login to the desktop and need a graphical server to load on.
How does the DM choose whether to load X11 or Wayland on the first boot?
@@neamupanselutelor7309 it depends on how the distro is configured on install
In GDM (GNOME Display Manager), there is an option called "WaylandEnable", if that is set to true, GDM uses Wayland, if it is false or commented out it uses X11.
Sorry, I meant to say in GDM's configuration file.
this was nice to find after watching several videos that were just people reading web pages or spouting off opinions, thanks for this
Wayland is not a Display Server that first statement is alredy wrong. It is a Protocol and the actual Desktops have to program thyr Display managers etc. around that protocol for compatibility.
same with X11, just a protocol and there are display servers that implement it like xorg and xfree86
@@whoman0385 Yeah, that should be correct. So i should Frame what i want to say a bit different so everyone gets what i really want to say.
This is the best explanation of display servers and windows managers I’ve watched! Great video.
Thanks. Helped me a lot to understand. X11 has been such a mystery to me my whole life. Time to learn.
I am glad it helped you!
Apparently there's a primitive version of X11 for Commodore Amiga to ease porting UNIX applications to AmigaOS, though I know nothing about it
Thank you for explaining this -- thru showing us an example. It makes total sense. I had basic idea of how X worked, but I'm coming from Windows. And, I want to understand Linux better.
Roses are red, violets are blue, your pixel knowledge is on point, and your humor is too! 😂
AAHHAHAHHA! Thank you so much!
Minor note, over a year later, initramfs loads the root file system. It loads first in case a problem disrupts that sequence (that's why it has itsown mini-toolkit/environment.
I ran into problems with wayland being unable to drag and drop archive contents to my file explorer when extracting... but on x11 worked just fine... wayland is much responsive tho and I use gnome desktop.... if this problem in wayland is fixed then I might use it again
thank you for explaining in such great details!
You are welcome!
Hyprland dev commented :))
Oh wow! I am glad you watched it. 😄
Wow, thank you. Very well said my friend.
If you running Linux in VM which is the host is also Linux, X11 version of your DE is work better than Wayland's DE
There's zero benefit using Wayland on VM because the underlying GPU is a virtual GPU anyway.
thank you
great video, thumbs up my friend
I tried Wayland before in Manjaro, but it only showed a cursor and a black screen, so I gave up. Xorg works fine for me.
loved the video, thank you very much!
I use X11 because network transparency and accessibility and automation are important, and Wayland sacrificed those things to solve problems I don't have. I could list many examples if youtube's filter would let me, but it blocks long comments... so I'll try to describe just one. I have a bunch of computers, including desktops, notebooks, and servers. I rely on being able to use all of them regardless of where I am or which hardware is in front of me. With X11 I can mix and match freely, but Wayland is designed to prevent that because it's considered unnecessary and a security risk. Like, if I'm at my desk I have a desktop and two notebooks, so I use the desktop's mouse and keyboard for all three, simply moving the cursor off the edge of one screen and onto the next, using a trivial little program called x2x. But frequently I'll grab a notebook to go elsewhere, like a cafe or the loo or a client meeting or even just the living room couch. I can still use every computer, either by exporting a running session as a remote desktop, or running individual programs over the network for remote display, or simply moving the cursor to any screens which happen to be nearby. It all "just works" easily and reliably, even for servers with no screen or keyboard attached. When doing local stuff it's a smooth 60fps with no perceptible lag, and when remote, things are slower but still very usable. But Wayland doesn't do that. In a time when nearly everything in computing is getting more flexible, more interoperable, and more network-transparent... Wayland strives to go in the opposite direction. With Wayland, I can't even use my notebooks while I'm at my desk.
so what's the different between linux and windows in these area?
The only annoying thing in wayland is vsync is forced on for everything, so the vsync setting in video games litterally does nothing. Vsync should be enabled for windows and desktop applications, but its annoying it doesnt allow easy changing of vsync of games or 3D applications
I use X.0rg but I have used X11 in the past. X11R6
Dawg now i understand why since i stopped using wayland my pc stopped freezing forcing me to cut off electricity on the entire pc just to reboot...
Why hello there! :)
Wayland does NOT handle User input. Things like libinput is used for user inputs
thanks!
Boy am I glad we don't have "Weyland" on Solaris! Good old X11R6 (Solaris 10) and X11R7 (Solaris 11 / illumos) and driiivvveee....
Using Solaris is even more funny than using BSD OSes as a desktop. At least FreeBSD and OpenBSD are good for servers. Who tf uses Solaris in 2024?
That's very "racist" in terms of OS'es. (Does it have a term? OS-ist?). I would also suggest jumping to open source like an illumos distribution, but still respect people who'd stay on proprietary shit.
@@NitroNilz the word you are looking for is "elitist", and yes it is, and so what? Enough with mediocrity!
@@AnnatarTheMaia I was referring to "who […] uses Solaris in 2024?" as elitist. Thank you for the word! Down with mediocracy!
22 seconds in an you already have made a considerable mistake. That's quite fast. Neither X11 nor Wayland are display servers.
Display protocol?
Ok, I did my research when i made this video but found that the two terms were used interchangeably, I don't have any kind of experience with wayland or x11, i did it only for a month or two and decided to make a video about it. If you can explain in detail it will be of help to anyone reading :)
@@oddstonegames As alluded to, X11 is a windowing system and protocol. A big component of it is the server, but X11 itself isn't the server.
Though, the distinction can be confusing, given that X11's canonical implementation is XOrg Server.
🤓
@@oddstonegames You just admitted you haven't even used the software you're talking about and made a video about them?
Wayland is X12.
Wayland is X0
X11 makes more sense
I Like this explanation, but it ist not 100% correct :-) still good for understanding some things especially about X11
Imagine using winbugs
god is happy
Wasteland is not a display server, is a protocol
There is not really a question whether to go with wayland or X11.
its more like have you an nvidia Graphics card oder an AMD/Intel graphics card. With the first one you have no real choice. witch the others the best option for many usecases ist the not deprecated standard - wayland.
But you also may have A workload that does currently not support wwayland - so again no choice..
thank you so much!
no worries!
this was superb!
I am glad you liked it!