I think E-M10 II is best value of the small MFT Cams. I really like the mark I but the mark II is quite an upgrade in specs and do not really lack any modern feature you would want. I would even say it is the best value mirrorless cam. viewfinder, touchscreen, tilt screen, 5 axis ibis, electronic shutter, live time and live bulb, cool vintage look, metal case, compact size, built in flash, custom modes, programmable buttons and dials ......
Yeah, I have an EM10ii and it deff punches above its weight, given all the features you mentioned. Even if/when I upgrade to something newer, I plan to keep it since it’s such a pleasant little camera.
I 100% agree. This little gem was the one which reconnected me with photography after a long hiatus, where my camera was a Nikon D7000. I sold to buy an E-M1 Mark II, which, in spite of loving the latter, I immediately regretted it. Fortunately my partner had one too, and was interested in the E-M1 Mark II as well. So I stole my partner’s E-M10 Mark II, bought a second E-M1 Mark II. I will never sell the E-M10, ever. It’s such a joy to use and I am so appreciative of the joy and fulfilment it has brought to me, I will never forget it. I just found a brand new OM-5 bargain, so selling the E-M1…
I do not think the E-M10 ll is the best value one. I am well aware what a fine camera this is and I wanted to buy one for the very reasons you mention. Unfortunately there are lot of videos (some sponsered by mpb) that promote the virtues of some of the older cameras and unfortunately there are lot of photographers with common sense realising that these cameras are capable enough and buy them. Unfortunately I am a little picky about the looks of my cameras and want cameras in nice cosmetic condition so found that a E-M10 ll would cost me more than € 300,- So I ended up buying a mint boxed black E-M5 l for € 150 (shutter count 1400). As I do not like to swap lenses all the time I bought a second E-M5 l, a beautiful silver one for € 120,- Then GAS stroke as I wanted to buy another charger for my Olympus BLS batteries and instead of spending € 59,- (I use only the original ones, charger and batteries) I spent € 109,- for the charger that came with a mint boxed E-M10 l. The Mll cameras are the better, more capable cameras, no doubt and if videography is not the focus for many photographers a better camera will never be needed. But this is no longer a secret and the used camera prices reflect that. Disclaimer: this is not the say that the Mll is the best value camera, this is just to encourage to analyse whether the more money spent really will bring necessary feature or not. ps: I still do think that that the E-M10 ll was a sweet spot in M43 camera design. Good looks, good ergonomics, good feature set, qualitiy feel and reasonable price when new. I value my E-M5 lll as an excellent tool and sometime use some of its capabilities but the E-M5 l for me looks and feel better and 98% of the time does the job.
@@foreverom well I did not pay 300 for mine. and for 300 is not bestvalue i agree. but here were I live I can usually find them with a little bit of patience for around 150€ on a local market places or even in the used section of camera stores. I bought one (small crack in the screen) for 70€ with a panasonic kit lens , one for 85€ with kitlens, one for 150 with grip, kitlens and oly 40-150. one for 300 with kitlens and oly 75-300m. and i sold 2 of them and never managed to get more than 150€ for the body even in very good condition and only a few hundred clicks. so around 150 is the price my argument is based on. EM5 mark I and EM10 I are usually around 100-130€ here
I love that you posted this video. Great tips all around. Regarding the dynamic range, a lot can be done exactly with underexposing, as you mentioned. A lot can happen too in post in this way. Great video, George!
Just a tip for anyone shooting raw and want to maximize the dynamic range of their cameras. Most cameras meter for jpegs even if RAW only enabled. So what I do is create or find the most flat profile in the camera and lower the contrast to the minimum, brightness, if available, to the max, that way I'll be able to see a lot more space on the histogram before clipping points. Keep in mind that a lot of cameras lose color information even before clipping.
Very good point on creating the flat look, I do have a custom picture profile set up on the G2 - included in my previous G2 video but slipped my mind to mention it here. Thanks for leaving the tip!
Sort of true, but it's more complicated than that too. Iso standards mean that raw files should be metered middle grey at 3⅔ stops below clipping the raw under daylight. Some cameras underexpose when they have plenty of shadow detail. No camera should have more than that.. I suspect these older cameras follow the spec closer and don't have a highlight roll-off curve that blends the almost blown to blown so it looks more natural.
Thanks very much. that is brilliant.,I have been following you for quite a long time. I have the Panasonic G5 so autofocus might have improved a bit. But I might still need to stop down 1 stop to get the highlights no burning out when there is strong sunlight. Another advantage in stopping down a stop is increased saturation of colour.
Oh, btw, lumix 25 1.7 suffers from focus shift from f2 to f4 iirc. And since cameras use widest aperture to focus, the only way to avoid it is to use the constant preview option, which is not available on older Panasonics. There is still an option to use DOF and Shutter Speed preview, but it'll be disabled as soon as you press the shutter button.
I haven't noticed it -- but don't use the lens very much wide open. Is the image then slightly out of focus ? Fwiw I always use single point focus and AFS
Oddly, it seems to me that the focus shift is subject to sample variation. I've owned three copies of the lens, two of which were fine, one of which suffered focus shift. Tested the exact same way, on the same camera body, back-to-back.
@@MikeRinz that's what I always thought, but my experience with 3 copies of the lens proves otherwise, and there are dozens of examples of people in forums saying they own one with focus shift, and dozens of others saying their doesn't have focus shift, and many have shared good test photos that illustrate both. So, there has to be something with elements having either (less likely) variations in manufacturing or (more likely) spacing during assembly that is causing it on some copies but not others. Maybe there is a concave-convex pair that corrects spherical aberration that is getting improperly spaced during assembly some of the time.
Hi George, I just returned from Japan. I took 3 lenses with me for travel and ease of having all of them with me when out and about: 14-42 EZ, 40-150 3.5-5.6, and the 20mm f1.7, the latter found on eBay from Japan like new. I mostly used it at night. And I fell in love with it because when at f/4.0, I got nice light stars 🤩. I brought with me the E-M1 Mark II. Luckily (or unfortunately for my bank account) I found at a Japanese department store, an OM-5 at 2/3 price of a famous American online shop here in the UK. I could not pass and brought it back with me.
I was doing tech support for these camera's when they came out. The G1, G2.... are the only ones I never got to play with. They were more expensive than the FZ-1,10,20. So we never had one in our "lab". But at the time, they were considered the closest thing you can get to an SLR in the Lumix line.
It seems like that was the angle, and functionality wise they feel more advanced than Canon APSC DSLRs at the time, but maybe less equipped in the sensor department
@@GeorgeHoldenWell, that is kind of the thing that Panasonic does. They take something that might not be the best version of something, but make it better by innovating around it. So a lot of times you end up with a product that might not be the best version of something, but you also can't get around the fact that it has some cool and unique features you can't find in any other product.
Having used mft cameras for more than 10 years, the single af trick works, no matter the aperture. Even with my Oly 17mm f1.2 I rarely got unusable pics.
Some good, practical tips. They're great cameras and will provide years of enjoyment I don't have one and likely never will, but I still enjoy watching the videos. @MikeRinz knows his beans.
The SLR style MFT cameras seem to be bargains at this stage. I picked up a used GH4 for a good price and it's video capabilities are quite good for a 10 year old camera. All the rangefinder style cameras like the GX series or the PEN-F seem to be going up in price. Maybe because of the popularity of the X100 series.
I have several M43 bodies. I don’t use the 12MP bodies anymore. The 16 and 20MP sensor bodies are better. I like my LUMIX G9 which is a very capable body that sells for ~$550. I love my GX85/9. Small. Lightweight. EVF. Tilting screen. IBIS. For photography the contrast based DFD is more than adequate. In September I picked up a GX85 in NYC with charger for $300. Very happy with that purchase. It is true the older cameras are inexpensive. To some degree you get what you pay for. 10 year old cameras are as old as I want to go. The technology is adequate for my needs. The newer the body the better the technology. Also the higher the price. It is a matter of how much do you want to spend and what features do you need. Mask On Nurse Marty (Ret)
Good video with spot on tips on how do deal with wide dynamic range challenges. However, I suggest it would be good to cover the advantages of the larger DOF of Micro Four Thirds relative to Full Frame, as well as the disadvantages. In many situations you want a larger DOF while also wanting more light where MFT has the advantage over FF.: landscapes, macro, street scenes, travel. etc. I see both systems has having strengths in a given situation, rather than assuming that bokeh is always a good thing. Thanks for an excellent video.
Fun fact btw: Oskar Barnack, the inventor of the format that is today called full frame, used it because it provided more DOF and faster shutter speeds than the medium or large format cameras of the time. He wanted a camera that can shoot people in movement on the streets. Same logic can be applied when comparing full frame to MFT.
@@weizenobstmusli8232 Yes, and It's also true that 35mm film cameras were developed by using existing 35mm movie film, which came into being because Thomas Edison's laboratory developed a movie camera and projector using existing 70mm film slit in half many years before. So, what we call "full frame" came about because it was available when 35mm SLR "mini cams" (as they were called then) were developed - not through some formal process to find the "perfect" film size. For years they were considered too small a format for professional use. Your point about the advantages of "smaller" formats for use when more DOF is needed is what I was trying to get at in my post. Thanks.
@@gregfeeler6910 Good point. I bought my GH5s for video work. One reason I chose it is because I shoot documentaries, and too little DOF is much more of a problem than pretty bokeh when you are shooting uncontrolled actuality. Plus I feel with the 25mm lens you can get a usable shallow depth o field effect in interview shots, where it is most useful. So getting a lighter cmaera/lens combo with increased depth of field is a win/win for the doco shooter.
I was curious about the quality I could get out of the absolite cheapest mirrorless camera I could get from MPB (we often talk about DSLR cameras, but a lot of people would like to have a smaller / less conspicuous camera to carry around, which I can understand). So, I filtered mirrorless cameras by proce from low to high on MPB, and the absolute cheapest I found was a Lumix G3, which I bought for 44€ (about £36). It was "used" (some marks on it, and it has 83k clicks on the shutter) but besides that, the camera works perfectly (and MPB even forgot a spare battery in the charger lol). It has a decent 16MP MFT sensor, so the following generation grom the 12MP G2, it's much smaller but still doesn't skimp on specs. I was particularly impressed by the EVF in particular which, even if it's not absolutely amazing, is pretty bright, large and detailed for a camera this old (and this cheap). I'm really blown away by the fact that it can take pictures that are still worth printing. When I'm comparing it to my E-M5 mark II, it does not stand a chance : the E-M5's sensor is slightly better and has IBIS, it shoots faster, has MUCH better AF... but it also costs 10x more. For a picture quality that is essensitally the same in good light. The value proposition of the G3 is NUTS (by the way... we're not talking about the E-M5ii nearly enough as we should. Underrated little camera. Built like a tank, full of features, doesn't cost an arm and a leg)
Such a relief, this video. After all those fancy new-gear fanboys. Plus instructive and fun to watch. My first visit to this channel and subscribing. Never subscribed faster!
Well -- I would call a Nikon D800 an absolute hit value nowadays -- it can be gotten for 300-400 Euro/Dollar/ Pound Sterling -- and the image quality is amazing !!!
I do appreciate this video. Might have helped me when I tried to downsize to M43 ahead of a year of travel and was *very* underwhelmed, especially considering how many evangelists for the platform there are. The noise was completely out of control, really couldn't go above 600 ISO and keep usable pictures. And, as you mention, the dynamic range was outright bad. Perhaps going from the a7Rii + Sigma 24-70 Art straight to the EM-10 was destined to fail. I've accepted the fact that I'll have to carry a huge setup if I want to be happy haha
Just a heads up that the GX85 has gone up in price in the used market especially since they're no longer sold new. I bought mine for $360 with the kit lens exactly a year ago and now body only costs more.
I've seen them going on average about £300 at the moment, I think I bought mine for about the same earlier this year - they are very popular for good reason, most of a GX9 for a bit less money
I just snagged a mint GX80 with the collapsable 12-32 and 35-100 lenses for 350€. It was a pretty good offer, but I've seen quite a few similar offers throughout central europe at least.
Sold mine gx80 in 2020 to a friend because i had bought a pen f which i love so much, however i missed this gx80 so much that i bought a new one for 130 dollars with warranty and the 12-32 kit lens. It had only taken less than 20 shots 😊
It's good to keep in mind that even these older sensors still blow phones out of the water for technical quality. The raw can always have AI magic done on it in the future or now, too.
I mean like you said old tiny cams clip highlights. I found shooting like this is the only way to get details in an otherwise blown out sky/ any dynamic scene with bright areas. It also completely eliminates color noise, which I get a-lot of sometimes when using Tone Curve.
Very true, however I think part of the reason people are drawn to micro four thirds is the smaller size. I agree though, one of the mentioned DSLRs would deliver amazing image quality, and they're affordable these days
@@GeorgeHolden yes , cheaper then some old Panasonic 4/3 , yes the size , every magnum photographer , or almost every used a small camera , be it film or digital , because it had to be with them all the time and ready to go , and its easier to do that with smaller body . I am in to that as well , i have couple of small cameras Canon G1x , Sony 5100. So what i say , as a family photographer , for that is what i mostly do , is there is no reason to discriminate , i sometimes use my phone camera as well , but that being said . When i pull out my fully equipped Canon 5D classic , all with strap , big lens , big flash , big battery , angle finder .... people call can we get those images , if for example it was a kids party or something . But if i take Canon G1X , they wont do that , there is this Psychological thing where people think bigger is better . I remember one time on the pool , some girls were giggling in wet i puled out that big 300mm Canon lens and 5D , they were 20m away , but instantly they started posing for me , those images are soft porn , sure i played a little , nice light , nice girls ... you know how it goes . And they loved the camera , they hugged it , it was all they were able to think about . something i never get from my family , i have to hunt them down force them to pose . It just how it goes . I love taking pictures of people that want their image taken , but usually its younger people , and they do react to size . There is that part of it , and i guess laways will be . Small camera will never be better in that segment . If you get what i mean .
I have Olympus EM10ii and I’ve been thinking so many times to move to asp-c but then I just can’t find the reasons since I’m a 100% amateur who only takes stills of family… these UA-cam videos are just feeding Gear Acquisition Syndrome and selling you the fear of not having the latest tech (ergo everyone else who has it will be more successful than you). Fuck that mentality!
The creepy you in the closet. I watched all the way to the end wondering if we'd get a reveal as to what that was about (beyond a really well done effect). I want my payoff!!! :)
Have you watched the video yet? I think you'll find this video doesn't actively promote older cameras but helps those that have issues with their performance
@Concuber11 yes, you're definitely just paranoid. It's actually just tiring to see these comments but I gotta say only a few old camera models actually get higher prices. Stuff like the Fujifilm X100 series, any of those, get exorbitant prices even on the secondhand market because for the main reason that there aren't as many stocks of those as other cameras. Add to that the fact that these Fujifilm cameras are sought after for their jpeg colors and Fujifilm film simulations straight out of camera. Fujifilm just doesn't produce as many cameras as other popular brands. For example, in these kinds of video, cameras such as those from Lumix and Olympus, you can usually find A LOT of them being sold online, it just doesn't make sense to drive up prices, unless these sellers don't want any buyers at all. And these cameras obviously have less specs and features than newer ones, they're just not that unique at all. Even the original Olympus OMD EM-5, which has been regarded as one of the more important camera releases in years, have not seen significant price increases on the used market. I even saw one go down in price as months go by! So yeah, TLDR, supply and demand, and how unique a camera is, determines if it will go up in price or not, and if it does, it's mostly not any UA-camrs' fault.
I think E-M10 II is best value of the small MFT Cams. I really like the mark I but the mark II is quite an upgrade in specs and do not really lack any modern feature you would want. I would even say it is the best value mirrorless cam. viewfinder, touchscreen, tilt screen, 5 axis ibis, electronic shutter, live time and live bulb, cool vintage look, metal case, compact size, built in flash, custom modes, programmable buttons and dials ......
Very good point, I was comparing it with the later models from Olympus and Fuji the other day, seems like the sweet spot in most areas!
Yeah, I have an EM10ii and it deff punches above its weight, given all the features you mentioned. Even if/when I upgrade to something newer, I plan to keep it since it’s such a pleasant little camera.
I 100% agree. This little gem was the one which reconnected me with photography after a long hiatus, where my camera was a Nikon D7000. I sold to buy an E-M1 Mark II, which, in spite of loving the latter, I immediately regretted it. Fortunately my partner had one too, and was interested in the E-M1 Mark II as well. So I stole my partner’s E-M10 Mark II, bought a second E-M1 Mark II. I will never sell the E-M10, ever. It’s such a joy to use and I am so appreciative of the joy and fulfilment it has brought to me, I will never forget it.
I just found a brand new OM-5 bargain, so selling the E-M1…
I do not think the E-M10 ll is the best value one. I am well aware what a fine camera this is and I wanted to buy one for the very reasons you mention. Unfortunately there are lot of videos (some sponsered by mpb) that promote the virtues of some of the older cameras and unfortunately there are lot of photographers with common sense realising that these cameras are capable enough and buy them.
Unfortunately I am a little picky about the looks of my cameras and want cameras in nice cosmetic condition so found that a E-M10 ll would cost me more than € 300,- So I ended up buying a mint boxed black E-M5 l for € 150 (shutter count 1400). As I do not like to swap lenses all the time I bought a second E-M5 l, a beautiful silver one for € 120,-
Then GAS stroke as I wanted to buy another charger for my Olympus BLS batteries and instead of spending € 59,- (I use only the original ones, charger and batteries) I spent € 109,- for the charger that came with a mint boxed E-M10 l.
The Mll cameras are the better, more capable cameras, no doubt and if videography is not the focus for many photographers a better camera will never be needed. But this is no longer a secret and the used camera prices reflect that.
Disclaimer: this is not the say that the Mll is the best value camera, this is just to encourage to analyse whether the more money spent really will bring necessary feature or not.
ps: I still do think that that the E-M10 ll was a sweet spot in M43 camera design. Good looks, good ergonomics, good feature set, qualitiy feel and reasonable price when new.
I value my E-M5 lll as an excellent tool and sometime use some of its capabilities but the E-M5 l for me looks and feel better and 98% of the time does the job.
@@foreverom well I did not pay 300 for mine. and for 300 is not bestvalue i agree. but here were I live I can usually find them with a little bit of patience for around 150€ on a local market places or even in the used section of camera stores.
I bought one (small crack in the screen) for 70€ with a panasonic kit lens , one for 85€ with kitlens, one for 150 with grip, kitlens and oly 40-150. one for 300 with kitlens and oly 75-300m. and i sold 2 of them and never managed to get more than 150€ for the body even in very good condition and only a few hundred clicks. so around 150 is the price my argument is based on.
EM5 mark I and EM10 I are usually around 100-130€ here
I love that you posted this video. Great tips all around. Regarding the dynamic range, a lot can be done exactly with underexposing, as you mentioned. A lot can happen too in post in this way. Great video, George!
Just a tip for anyone shooting raw and want to maximize the dynamic range of their cameras. Most cameras meter for jpegs even if RAW only enabled. So what I do is create or find the most flat profile in the camera and lower the contrast to the minimum, brightness, if available, to the max, that way I'll be able to see a lot more space on the histogram before clipping points. Keep in mind that a lot of cameras lose color information even before clipping.
Very good point on creating the flat look, I do have a custom picture profile set up on the G2 - included in my previous G2 video but slipped my mind to mention it here. Thanks for leaving the tip!
Sort of true, but it's more complicated than that too. Iso standards mean that raw files should be metered middle grey at 3⅔ stops below clipping the raw under daylight. Some cameras underexpose when they have plenty of shadow detail. No camera should have more than that.. I suspect these older cameras follow the spec closer and don't have a highlight roll-off curve that blends the almost blown to blown so it looks more natural.
Thanks very much. that is brilliant.,I have been following you for quite a long time. I have the Panasonic G5 so autofocus might have improved a bit. But I might still need to stop down 1 stop to get the highlights no burning out when there is strong sunlight. Another advantage in stopping down a stop is increased saturation of colour.
Great point, that is also worth noting for those considering bumping up ISO as the higher ISO, often the worse the saturation
Oh, btw, lumix 25 1.7 suffers from focus shift from f2 to f4 iirc. And since cameras use widest aperture to focus, the only way to avoid it is to use the constant preview option, which is not available on older Panasonics. There is still an option to use DOF and Shutter Speed preview, but it'll be disabled as soon as you press the shutter button.
I haven't noticed it -- but don't use the lens very much wide open. Is the image then slightly out of focus ?
Fwiw I always use single point focus and AFS
Oddly, it seems to me that the focus shift is subject to sample variation. I've owned three copies of the lens, two of which were fine, one of which suffered focus shift. Tested the exact same way, on the same camera body, back-to-back.
@@sdrtcacgnrjrc yes, cameras focus with an aperture wide open and the plain of focus shifts when the aperture is closed.
@@StephenStrangways focus shift is caused by the lens design and not a sample variation problem.
@@MikeRinz that's what I always thought, but my experience with 3 copies of the lens proves otherwise, and there are dozens of examples of people in forums saying they own one with focus shift, and dozens of others saying their doesn't have focus shift, and many have shared good test photos that illustrate both.
So, there has to be something with elements having either (less likely) variations in manufacturing or (more likely) spacing during assembly that is causing it on some copies but not others. Maybe there is a concave-convex pair that corrects spherical aberration that is getting improperly spaced during assembly some of the time.
Hi George,
I just returned from Japan. I took 3 lenses with me for travel and ease of having all of them with me when out and about:
14-42 EZ, 40-150 3.5-5.6, and the 20mm f1.7, the latter found on eBay from Japan like new.
I mostly used it at night. And I fell in love with it because when at f/4.0, I got nice light stars 🤩.
I brought with me the E-M1 Mark II.
Luckily (or unfortunately for my bank account) I found at a Japanese department store, an OM-5 at 2/3 price of a famous American online shop here in the UK. I could not pass and brought it back with me.
You have to buy one when you find a great deal!
I was doing tech support for these camera's when they came out. The G1, G2.... are the only ones I never got to play with. They were more expensive than the FZ-1,10,20. So we never had one in our "lab". But at the time, they were considered the closest thing you can get to an SLR in the Lumix line.
It seems like that was the angle, and functionality wise they feel more advanced than Canon APSC DSLRs at the time, but maybe less equipped in the sensor department
@@GeorgeHoldenWell, that is kind of the thing that Panasonic does. They take something that might not be the best version of something, but make it better by innovating around it. So a lot of times you end up with a product that might not be the best version of something, but you also can't get around the fact that it has some cool and unique features you can't find in any other product.
M43 Guy is back!
He's always lurking around
Having used mft cameras for more than 10 years, the single af trick works, no matter the aperture. Even with my Oly 17mm f1.2 I rarely got unusable pics.
Especially on the wider focal length lenses, which I suppose most MFT lenses are by design
Ok, you got me in the whisper! I subscribed!
Thanks for subbing!
Some good, practical tips. They're great cameras and will provide years of enjoyment I don't have one and likely never will, but I still enjoy watching the videos. @MikeRinz knows his beans.
Cheers!
The SLR style MFT cameras seem to be bargains at this stage. I picked up a used GH4 for a good price and it's video capabilities are quite good for a 10 year old camera. All the rangefinder style cameras like the GX series or the PEN-F seem to be going up in price. Maybe because of the popularity of the X100 series.
I have several M43 bodies. I don’t use the 12MP bodies anymore. The 16 and 20MP sensor bodies are better. I like my LUMIX G9 which is a very capable body that sells for ~$550. I love my GX85/9. Small. Lightweight. EVF. Tilting screen. IBIS. For photography the contrast based DFD is more than adequate. In September I picked up a GX85 in NYC with charger for $300. Very happy with that purchase.
It is true the older cameras are inexpensive. To some degree you get what you pay for. 10 year old cameras are as old as I want to go. The technology is adequate for my needs. The newer the body the better the technology. Also the higher the price. It is a matter of how much do you want to spend and what features do you need.
Mask On Nurse Marty (Ret)
They're definitely the less attractive option to those looking for something compact and aesthetic, as much as we hate to admit, looks matter!
@@martingreenberg870 I agree. Although I have a few cameras from mid to late 2000s which still work quite well considering their age and lack of tech.
@@GeorgeHolden They do. But if looks are not your absolute priority there are some incredible bargains to be had. Great video 👍🏼
Good video with spot on tips on how do deal with wide dynamic range challenges. However, I suggest it would be good to cover the advantages of the larger DOF of Micro Four Thirds relative to Full Frame, as well as the disadvantages. In many situations you want a larger DOF while also wanting more light where MFT has the advantage over FF.: landscapes, macro, street scenes, travel. etc. I see both systems has having strengths in a given situation, rather than assuming that bokeh is always a good thing. Thanks for an excellent video.
Fun fact btw: Oskar Barnack, the inventor of the format that is today called full frame, used it because it provided more DOF and faster shutter speeds than the medium or large format cameras of the time. He wanted a camera that can shoot people in movement on the streets. Same logic can be applied when comparing full frame to MFT.
@@weizenobstmusli8232 Yes, and It's also true that 35mm film cameras were developed by using existing 35mm movie film, which came into being because Thomas Edison's laboratory developed a movie camera and projector using existing 70mm film slit in half many years before. So, what we call "full frame" came about because it was available when 35mm SLR "mini cams" (as they were called then) were developed - not through some formal process to find the "perfect" film size. For years they were considered too small a format for professional use. Your point about the advantages of "smaller" formats for use when more DOF is needed is what I was trying to get at in my post. Thanks.
Thanks and also good point, I've certainly covered the benefits in the past
@@GeorgeHolden It's hard to cover everything every time, no? Thanks. 🙂
@@gregfeeler6910 Good point. I bought my GH5s for video work. One reason I chose it is because I shoot documentaries, and too little DOF is much more of a problem than pretty bokeh when you are shooting uncontrolled actuality. Plus I feel with the 25mm lens you can get a usable shallow depth o field effect in interview shots, where it is most useful. So getting a lighter cmaera/lens combo with increased depth of field is a win/win for the doco shooter.
James Popsys uses this, or maybe even the GX1, as a second camera.
I believe it's the GX1!
I was curious about the quality I could get out of the absolite cheapest mirrorless camera I could get from MPB (we often talk about DSLR cameras, but a lot of people would like to have a smaller / less conspicuous camera to carry around, which I can understand).
So, I filtered mirrorless cameras by proce from low to high on MPB, and the absolute cheapest I found was a Lumix G3, which I bought for 44€ (about £36). It was "used" (some marks on it, and it has 83k clicks on the shutter) but besides that, the camera works perfectly (and MPB even forgot a spare battery in the charger lol). It has a decent 16MP MFT sensor, so the following generation grom the 12MP G2, it's much smaller but still doesn't skimp on specs.
I was particularly impressed by the EVF in particular which, even if it's not absolutely amazing, is pretty bright, large and detailed for a camera this old (and this cheap). I'm really blown away by the fact that it can take pictures that are still worth printing.
When I'm comparing it to my E-M5 mark II, it does not stand a chance : the E-M5's sensor is slightly better and has IBIS, it shoots faster, has MUCH better AF... but it also costs 10x more. For a picture quality that is essensitally the same in good light. The value proposition of the G3 is NUTS
(by the way... we're not talking about the E-M5ii nearly enough as we should. Underrated little camera. Built like a tank, full of features, doesn't cost an arm and a leg)
For sure the E-M5ii is a great option!
Such a relief, this video. After all those fancy new-gear fanboys. Plus instructive and fun to watch. My first visit to this channel and subscribing. Never subscribed faster!
Glad it was helpful! 😄
I‘m 66 yo, still use GH2, GX85, G91, S5 and believe in Sir Winston: No sports!
Nice collection!
Well -- I would call a Nikon D800 an absolute hit value nowadays -- it can be gotten for 300-400 Euro/Dollar/ Pound Sterling -- and the image quality is amazing !!!
I do appreciate this video. Might have helped me when I tried to downsize to M43 ahead of a year of travel and was *very* underwhelmed, especially considering how many evangelists for the platform there are. The noise was completely out of control, really couldn't go above 600 ISO and keep usable pictures. And, as you mention, the dynamic range was outright bad. Perhaps going from the a7Rii + Sigma 24-70 Art straight to the EM-10 was destined to fail. I've accepted the fact that I'll have to carry a huge setup if I want to be happy haha
Thanks! Sometimes it is that way, big cameras have their advantages 😂
Just a heads up that the GX85 has gone up in price in the used market especially since they're no longer sold new.
I bought mine for $360 with the kit lens exactly a year ago and now body only costs more.
300-400GBP for a used GX80 now
I've seen them going on average about £300 at the moment, I think I bought mine for about the same earlier this year - they are very popular for good reason, most of a GX9 for a bit less money
I just snagged a mint GX80 with the collapsable 12-32 and 35-100 lenses for 350€. It was a pretty good offer, but I've seen quite a few similar offers throughout central europe at least.
Yeah eBay bundles are pretty good if you keep an eye out
Sold mine gx80 in 2020 to a friend because i had bought a pen f which i love so much, however i missed this gx80 so much that i bought a new one for 130 dollars with warranty and the 12-32 kit lens. It had only taken less than 20 shots 😊
It's good to keep in mind that even these older sensors still blow phones out of the water for technical quality. The raw can always have AI magic done on it in the future or now, too.
Very true!
Did I miss something, what’s with the whispering and weird clone at the door segments? Just ehh?
It's a throwback to my old micro four thirds guy character 😅
I had an older camera. It worked. Then I got a newer camera. It also works
Story of life
under expose + ai denoise and add grain after to even out the lack of texture that comes with denoise.
At that point it's worth just exposing correctly
I mean like you said old tiny cams clip highlights. I found shooting like this is the only way to get details in an otherwise blown out sky/ any dynamic scene with bright areas. It also completely eliminates color noise, which I get a-lot of sometimes when using Tone Curve.
how about Canon 5D classic , or 5D mk2 , or 6D , or Nikon D700 , D3 .... they are bigger but you will get that DR .
Very true, however I think part of the reason people are drawn to micro four thirds is the smaller size. I agree though, one of the mentioned DSLRs would deliver amazing image quality, and they're affordable these days
@@GeorgeHolden yes , cheaper then some old Panasonic 4/3 , yes the size , every magnum photographer , or almost every used a small camera , be it film or digital , because it had to be with them all the time and ready to go , and its easier to do that with smaller body .
I am in to that as well , i have couple of small cameras Canon G1x , Sony 5100.
So what i say , as a family photographer , for that is what i mostly do , is there is no reason to discriminate , i sometimes use my phone camera as well , but that being said .
When i pull out my fully equipped Canon 5D classic , all with strap , big lens , big flash , big battery , angle finder .... people call can we get those images , if for example it was a kids party or something .
But if i take Canon G1X , they wont do that , there is this Psychological thing where people think bigger is better .
I remember one time on the pool , some girls were giggling in wet i puled out that big 300mm Canon lens and 5D , they were 20m away , but instantly they started posing for me , those images are soft porn , sure i played a little , nice light , nice girls ... you know how it goes .
And they loved the camera , they hugged it , it was all they were able to think about .
something i never get from my family , i have to hunt them down force them to pose . It just how it goes .
I love taking pictures of people that want their image taken , but usually its younger people , and they do react to size . There is that part of it , and i guess laways will be . Small camera will never be better in that segment . If you get what i mean .
I have Olympus EM10ii and I’ve been thinking so many times to move to asp-c but then I just can’t find the reasons since I’m a 100% amateur who only takes stills of family… these UA-cam videos are just feeding Gear Acquisition Syndrome and selling you the fear of not having the latest tech (ergo everyone else who has it will be more successful than you). Fuck that mentality!
The creepy you in the closet. I watched all the way to the end wondering if we'd get a reveal as to what that was about (beyond a really well done effect). I want my payoff!!! :)
More of a throwback to the micro four thirds crowd!
@@GeorgeHolden ohhhh. I'm outside of this inside joke. ;)
I didn't get it either but found it delightfully disturbing!
Hello :)
Oh hey!
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Stop making videos about older cameras you’re just driving up the price and making poor photographers pissed.
Have you watched the video yet? I think you'll find this video doesn't actively promote older cameras but helps those that have issues with their performance
@ I think I’m just paranoid
@Concuber11 yes, you're definitely just paranoid. It's actually just tiring to see these comments but I gotta say only a few old camera models actually get higher prices. Stuff like the Fujifilm X100 series, any of those, get exorbitant prices even on the secondhand market because for the main reason that there aren't as many stocks of those as other cameras. Add to that the fact that these Fujifilm cameras are sought after for their jpeg colors and Fujifilm film simulations straight out of camera. Fujifilm just doesn't produce as many cameras as other popular brands. For example, in these kinds of video, cameras such as those from Lumix and Olympus, you can usually find A LOT of them being sold online, it just doesn't make sense to drive up prices, unless these sellers don't want any buyers at all. And these cameras obviously have less specs and features than newer ones, they're just not that unique at all. Even the original Olympus OMD EM-5, which has been regarded as one of the more important camera releases in years, have not seen significant price increases on the used market. I even saw one go down in price as months go by!
So yeah, TLDR, supply and demand, and how unique a camera is, determines if it will go up in price or not, and if it does, it's mostly not any UA-camrs' fault.
Fair enough 😂
Then why don’t you be rich?
The prices of these junk are high rocket bcuz of these videos
Have you watched the video? May not be what you think