Extended Release Oxalic Acid [Expert How-To]
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- Опубліковано 25 лют 2023
- Extended Release Oxalic Acid is a new and promising mite treatment. It is NOT a good knockdown treatment, but rather seems to be a good "keep down" treatment.
Installed before mite populations reach problematic levels, Extended Release Oxalic Acid reduces mite population growth so that other treatments don't need to be used as often, or at all.
Randy Oliver has pioneered this work, and all beekeepers should be grateful to him. You can read his work at scientificbeekeeping.com/.
Link to products used in this video:
www.amazon.com/shop/duckriver...
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Another great video Nathan! Dick is a wealth of knowledge and our club is lucky to have him!!!
👍
Thank you Dick for taking the time to do this you tube video. It was very informative and explained the steps where in the past where I been confused.
Wow! Awesome video! Definitely will be looking into this. Thank you!!!
Thanks Jeff!
Super helpful video and links! Thank you both!
Thanks!
Very good info and presented well
Thanks Michael!
Really interesting. Many thanks for posting
Thanks Sean!
Great video, this is the kind of nuts and bolts information needed.
Thanks!
I really enjoy your videos with Dick loads of info, thank you very much Nathan.👍
Thanks!
really appreciate that you brought up scalability. I'm currently sitting at a hundred hives and don't have quite the time to do small batch treatment.
Yep, I don’t have the time either.
Thank you both Nathan and Dick for taking the time to make and post this video. It was VERY helpful. 👍👍
Thanks!
Very informative and interesting. Thank you both for the video.
Thanks!
Thanks for the tutorial. I’ll be trying this out for sure.
Thanks!
We’ll done
Thanks
Great job guys!!!!!
Thanks Cary
Great information for the control of mites. Looking to add this to my maintenance tools.
Looking at the size of the pot being used to heat the jars of water for the mixture, the induction plate seems bigger than the unit in your Amazon link. If so, what unit is being used?
Also, Dick mention Brady pads, which one was he referring to? I only ask because the one in the Amazon link is currently not available.
Thanks for the videos, and keep sharing.
It is a Nuwave 1300 watt induction cooktop.
Great job…I will definitely be trying this
Thanks!
Thank you for video and work that went into it. SpillTech Universal Maximizer pads come in two thickness light and heavy. Whice one are you using?
Sorry for not responding earlier, but I use the light pads. We buy them from Grainger and I have seen them on Amazon also. DB
Interesting lot of videos Nathan , the journey to become professional begins in earnest, will be watching all throught the year.
I have a question ,may be will get answered, if a bee consumes Crystallised honey , what happens ? Peter 🇦🇺
Peter I don’t know that crystallized honey is bad for bees…I do know that some honeys have a lot of solids in them and make a poorer winter feed especially in really cold climates.
Thanks Nathan, good information there. Thanks for pointing out, the OA extended release is a good tool for maintaining lower mite population, but not necessarily one for dropping population. I learned the hard way early on when shop towels were 1st being experimented with.
You're doing a great job, and I for one am greatful and appreciate how much time you youtubers spend posting these videos.
Thanks Mike!
Did you run tests to know how many sponges would soak up X amount of glycerin? For example if I use 1 pound of Oxalic and 1 pound of glycerin, i need that to be evenly soaked into 9 towel units so that I know they are 50gr each. Or 18 at 25g each so that I can know what to put in the hive. Do you have a reasonable estimate of how much glycerin either a full or half sponge can hold? Or...do these sponges hold a lot more than the 2 pounds and therefore i only need to worry about even distribution because they will soak all of the solution up easily?
The 50 grams each of OA and glycerin are based on Randy Oliver's design as he attempted to duplicate what the Argentinian strips were using, but he eventually modified their recipe so the OA and glycerin were at a one to one weight ration. Even at the 50 gram weights, he found that only a small amount of the OA was consumed from the pads or towels, so there is no need to try to soak up more than 50 grams of OA. I accidently made 40 gram pads and found them to be very effective, so you can do the same by using 11 of the pads in the 2 pound solution instead of 9 pads. I asked Randy if he planned to do trials with lower amounts of OA and he said yes.
Good info
Thanks for stopping by Randy!
I love to see others involved in the science behind bees. I am always doing something different.. I am currently working on a multiple colony hive, some have tried, but I am looking for a solution to get my flow super filled. It seems to be a challenge for me up North.
Experimentation is fun and sometimes productive.
Are the maximizer pads lightweight medium or heavy weight? The link for Amazon is outta stock… I live near new pig manufacturing I’m not if there’s an outlet or someone I know might be able to hook me up. Thanks again for the info.
They are Spill Tech GPC100S pads.
So much information. Great video guys, I'll be trying this when the drones start flying. This fall I tried Thymovar on 2 colonies, they are healthy as of today.
Thanks!
I don't know what they are made of but I wonder if pig mat would work? I think it's similar to the maximizer pads.
PIG mat pads bought through Grainger about are three times the price of Brady or Spill Tech maximizer pads. Dick Brickner
can you tell me how many of the sweedish sponges you use for the 1 pound OA mixture?...
You mix one pound each of OA and glycerin. This is two pounds of solution and I use 9 sponges. Each sponge absorbs 100 grams of the solution and it contains 50 grams of the OA in that solution. Dick Brickner
This seems to be the next treatment for beekeepers. I wonder how long before we can use it in Ohio.
I wish we could get some nationwide rule changes on this. It would simplify things.
With the 1 lb. OA and 1lb. Glycerin, how many maximizer strips did that do? Thanx
The bundle was 18 of the half strips. Dick Brickner
I'm glad you showed this. Especially since they will be likely be allowed in Canada very soon :)
It’s a promising and potentially very useful treatment.
very interesting, would this be something that can be integrated into a swarm box as well? that way treatment begins right away or would the bees avoid the box?
Possibly but I’d let them get open brood first, and OAV would be a better treatment on a swarm with no capped brood.
@@DuckRiverHoney makes sense, thank you for the response. Really enjoyed your videos and caught a couple swarms last year after watching them. Excited for this season. I am trying to think how the industry can get ahead of the varroa in preventing rather than reacting to the mites.
Also leads me to thinking if oxalic can be mixed with glycerin maybe it can be formulated into the building materials of bee keeping equipment.
The problem with long term exposure and treatment whether it’s needed or not is resistance.
Would you suggest using these sponges in a 5 frame nuke if so what size tab would you use
I would use a half sponge and cut it in half to make 2 pieces, one at the front, the other at the back. Dick Brickner
Thank I heard that after I asked the question
When it switched to Dick showing the roll from last year I was confused looking for where the shop towels went lol
Great demo! I The useful life of different carrier materials was helpful to me. I love the idea of swedish shop towel lasting longer, though they may be more expensive than shop towel. Do you or Dick have any experience with hanging oae between frames?
No experience for me. I know Aluen Cap is done that way and that Randy Oliver has experimented with it, but I don’t think it performed as well for him. Take that with a grain of salt, it’s been a while since I read about it.
@@DuckRiverHoney thanks!
Can I ask how many 4"fish by 7 1/2" ish pads are in a 2# batch?
That 2 pounds of solution would contain 1 pound of OA and 1 pound of glycerin. If you intend on making the 50 grams/towel concentration that Randy Oliver uses, you would use 9 full sizes sponges or maximizer pads to get that concentration. Since the sponges and pads have been cut into the 4 x 7.5 size, you would now have 18 of the half pads or sponges soaking up that 2 pounds of solution. Remember, you are putting two of the half pads in the hive.
I don't get it. The 12 half shop towels gets how many grams or ounce of oxalic acid to get the recommended dose per half towel ?
The dose is 18 grams of oxalic acid in one towel, so there are 9 grams in each half towel.
@@R_Brickner thank you
Have a great beekeeping season
Hey Nathan - thanks for the informative video. Was there a link you were going to include with info on how to legally do this. Especially with regard to what Dick mentioned with distributing the finished pads to their club members.
Here’s a link to some of it. Every state is different!!! duckriverhoney.com/bee-blog/extended-release-oxalic-acid-how-to-recipes-resources/
@@DuckRiverHoney thanks!
Do you have to heat up the sugar - oxalic mixture also?
I don't understand this question as I do not use any sugar in my oxalic acid treatments.
I think she talking about oaxlic acid drip 5 grams per frame@@R_Brickner
Thanks for the info. I have never tried applying OA via the drip method and you can not find anyone recommending that method anymore, not only because it is labor intensive, but because it is very ineffective at the approved label dose. Dick Brickner @@normwentz7341
Very good info. How many pads were in the demo. He didn't say. As I understand it the 1:1 ratio was 1 pound of OA to one pound of glycerin to how many pads? Thanks again.
There were 9 full pads (18 half pads in that batch). Made a batch last year with 11 pads which reduced the acid concentration from 50 grams to 40. They still achieved excellent mite control so the 2023 trials will probably include a reduction to 35 or even 30 grams. Dick Brickner
@@R_Brickner Thank you very much.
So was that the number of Swedish sponges?
I did my whole yard last Aug with a rate 75g OA & 75g food grade glycerin per 20 frames in double deeps on cut up sponges, same ratio on my double deep nucs and single nucs, basically actual acid was 75g - 20 frames, 37.5g - 10 frames and 18.75g - 5 frames, I used an portable electric hotplate and candy thermometer a stainless steel saucepan to 155f. my solution went clear at 148f. here's a great tip for small beekeepers like myself, LOCK&LOCK make rectangular box that's perfect for 1/2 -1/4 & 1/8 sized sponges, I just put all cutup sponges in the LOCK&LOCK box slowly poured the hot liquid over them added the lid and flip the box a few times in the next 24 hours til all was absorbed and put on the next day my largest & strongest colony just swarmed into a 10 frame new box I had setup to put a nuc into Feb 23rd 2023, I go 3 more splits off the double deep they left, this colony still had the sponges on it and center circle 1/3 of both sponges still had original color of the sponges which tell there was still some OA present. Great video guys.
Thanks Carl. Where are you at to already have swarms?
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@DuckRiverHoney I'm 110 miles south of Atlanta, 5 miles west of Warner Robins, 200 miles south of and 1100' less elevation than Bob Binnie lowest yards. The trick for such early swarms is my tenant farmer had 70 acres of peanuts just beside my bees and after the harvest and baling the peanut hay, I had 70 acres of Henbit and a few wild turnips blooming in early January thru to March.
I think my concern is… when this becomes legal, will it be allowed to be used with supers on.
The oxalic acid ( apibioxal) you describe is the expensive product. The only reason this would be legal is because a company wants to make money on it. Oxalic acid is oxalic acid no matter how it is stored.
I would expect it to be used with honey supers on since the USDA did not create a tolerance limit for oxalic acid in honey since it occurs naturally in so many food items we eat.
@@R_Brickner I agree. But will that be only with the apibioxal and not just some kind of a oxalic acid? That's my concern
@@beebob1279 The EPA premise presented to Randy Oliver last March gives every beekeeper the opportunity to do their own trials now. If hundreds of beekeepers nationwide who have at least 24 colonies would do the OAER treatment and record the data, we can provide Randy with hundreds of testimonials that this method of application works and help him convince the EPA to totally approve. Dick Brickner
I wonder if any oil absorbent pad other than maximzer brand would work as long as you applied the solution to the same size towel
I believe a lot of different media are being trialed.
Are the Maximizer pads heavy or light weight?
Avoid the extra absorbent ones.
Several commentors addressed the use of the PIG brand of oil absorbent pads and my remark was that they were fairly costly compared to the other brands of pads that the Grainger Company sells. The cost is not an issue if you are using small quantities and you may already have some in your garage or shop. You might also be able to buy small quantities or these at auto parts stores. Any cellulose based pad would probably work, so give them a try. If the bees do not chew them up, then let us know. Dick Brickner
Question: about how long do you heat the glycerin in the microwave to get it to around 150 degrees before you mix in the OA?
Dick is great wish u did more videos with his maintence of his hives and all that.
I’ll see if I can borrow some more of his time. 😃
@@DuckRiverHoney He showed how he checkard boarded and how he stored his frames to keep the bugs out there is a hole lot more to bee keeping then that as u so well know it would be great to get him to show his inspections what he does when are u going to make a new video with you bee keeping inspections have u been able to get into your hives yet I just love watching everything I can on bee keeping, have a Blessed day and thanks again for the videos u make they are great.
Thanks Frances
Maximizer pads contain fire retardants. Bee careful. Read up on it.
Has anyone ever tried pig mat absorbent sheets?
No, but I'm always interested in another method of application.
I haven’t…
I’m sure they are very similar to what’s being used. Just make sure you get the absorb all ones and the specific use ones.
Randy Oliver has. I tried to leave a link but it got taken down. Just Google his name and pig mat and it'll come up.
I’ve got tight controls on posting naked links in comments. I had a bunch of Russian bots posting inappropriate things a while back.
It won't be long before this is legal nation wide.
I hope so
Or before the epa cracks down on it because we can't use something cheap, effective and legitimate without paying them millions first. Gotta grease the right wheels to get something approved in this country.
Please don’t do this in winter. We learned a hard lesson. The Swedish sponges hold moisture in the hive. We lost 1/3 of our hives. The bees were wet and dead clustered under the sponges.
😱
What about Treatment FREE
Hate to bring up that subject Harold, but just about every beekeeper I have known who has gone treatment free for more than one year is also bee free today. Dick Brickner
@@R_Brickner Everyone I know too
You make me nervous adjusting your glasses with oa on your gloves
Thanks, I had to laugh when I saw that. That was a bad morning for sinus drainage. Dick Brickner
😁😁😁😁
I understand I was hoping you wouldn’t rub your eye could bee an experience