Street Photography - Inspiration, Influences or copying?
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- Опубліковано 15 бер 2022
- The Raw Society Co-Founder Jorge Delgado-Ureña shares his thoughts and tips about, the influence by other photographers, the red line of copying and why our photography sometimes looks like the work of people that we admire.
With examples of his own photos and another great masters.
Photo credits in order of appearance:
Jorge Delgado-Ureña
Alex Webb
David Alan Harvey
Charles Harbutt
Gilles Peress
Are your photos good?
• How to know if your St...
To learn more visit www.therawsociety.org/
Instagram: / the_raw_society
Instagram: / jorgedelgadophoto
I really, really liked the image by Harbutt. It’s more sparse and less chaotic than a lot of Webb’s work, but it’s still charged with a lot of emotional energy and the emotion is communicated more clearly because there are less elements.
Great video. As photographers we shoot what's in front of the lens. We don't think ( Most of us ) this looks like a Alex Web photo or any other great photographer. We are reacting to the moment. There have been millions of photographs taken, some will look like other photographers work, so be it. Take the the shot. It is your photo. JT
thanks
Lot's of good points Jorge! This channel is a real gem! Spent 20 minutes just looking at the photo of those kids playing on and around the fence. Great composition, depth and colors!
Enough time and effort exploring the world through the lens will eventually chisel all that inspiration and energy that one get from studying the masters into a style of one's own. Even studying your own photos with a small thumbnail preview in lightroom/capture one (or what have you) catalog would probably reveal some secrets in your personal development. Sometimes ripping off someone's style could also be helpful to extract what exactly it is that you like about that particular way of working. Sometimes it can even be helpful to have a youtube fast, giving the brain a vacation from the never ending "how to be a better photographer, what lens is best, what should i spend money on, the best street gear you should buy". Also, not posting anything you shoot, so the work (and your experience around those pictures) can be allowed to mature for a few weeks. Crave the experience of exploring with the camera, not the sharing and digital response. Just speaking out of my own experience of course.
Keep up the good work!
I was looking for this comment! Glad we share the views✨
Great insight. There is a moment when the individual image can only give you so much in terms of voice. It's only when consider multiple images in relationship to each other and what they say as a whole in terms of story or feel that it becomes next level.
Thank you my friend! Agree 100% Also think that Online things are not "long form storytelling friendly" And i thing that we tend to forget about it! :)
Hi Jorge … hope you’re fine!!!! Great channel by the way… I think that kind of comments are all criticisms, sometimes in good ways others in bad ways … in this particular case, I think it’s a positive, and a constructive comment.
The question is…. Are you happy and realized with your own work? If so … forget about that… you don’t need be interrogative about your self in that way!!! This is a big and recurrent question about inspiration, copy past, etc…we all living from inspiration and someday, somebody will be inspired by you… this is life and always will be !!! Keep on good work 👌🏻 Regards from Portugal…
Rui Miguel Cunha
I loved your analysis hermano. In my opinion, we all copy consciously and unconsciously. It's indeed difficult to draw the line when something becomes truely original. I would say definitely creating a body of work in a consistent visual style will help draw the difference between you and others.
Love your channel. I'm really jealous of your ability to discuss things so meaningful.
This has absolutely happened to me. In 2011 I went to Myanmar on a workshop with Steve McCurry and learned so much from him. When I cam back I did a portfolio review at a big photography festival in Toronto and was so disappointed when the instructors started to tell me it reminded them of Steve McCurry. I felt somehow like it was a failure. But when I started to study Henri Cartier-Bresson - who Steve had told me was a major influence of his - I could see the influence it had on Steve over and over again. So this video really resonates with me and is a great reminder to all not to be discouraged when the art of you heroes finds it's way into your work...it simply means you are on the right path. As Issac Newton said: "If I have seen further, it is by standing on the shoulders of giants."
Fantastic videos Jorge! I look forward to each one you post. Please don't stop!
I don’t and wouldn’t take the ‘your photo reminds me of Alex webb’ as a criticism. Your image is beautiful and technically perfect with you filling the frame and the corners. I would take it as a compliment. I love your content, your narrative is soothing and on point.
Thanks my friend, appreciate your comment! Yes, I don´t see those comments as a bad thing just something that makes me think about perception, style and narrative :)
Often this kind of association to another artist is more in the eye of the beholder, meaning that the observer needs to somehow fit your work into a box, a category that tells them how to relate to the work/picture. I don’t know if it’s a good or bad thing, but definitely easy to fall into, as opposed to engaging with the work on an subjective level: what emotions the picture evokes, what personal first-hand memories it pulls to the surface, what current events it connects to in your mind etc.
That's a great point! Actually I think we as authors also put ourselves in certain categories (stylistic) there for probably we (I) are part of this kind of "shallow" way of understanding other peoples work, I don´t know but it's an interesting conversation! Thank you very much for taking the time to comment!
@@The_Raw_Society It's a pleasure!
Well, as you said during last workshop in Cuba, it's very easy to fall into cliches not just by photographing the obvious tourist kind of stuff but also when, for instance, we learn to use silhouettes to create deep, and then it becomes easier and easier and we go out just trying to get the easy solution; that's pretty much worse than to have pictures that look like master's pictures. I agree that there are limited ways to solve particular situations and in our research and performances we end up making similar things to our referents and masters, that's completely natural and necessary in the process of finding our own voice that will be recognized before for our viewers than ourselves
Great video and topic. I am an amateur photographer and I definitely learn from looking at other photographers work and even videos like this. I have actually tried to recreate pictures that I have seen other photographers do. I guess you could say that I tried to copy them, but the photos never come out the same, and in the process I have learned something in my endeavor to develop my skills and discover my own style as a photographer. And I think that's a good thing if you're using it as a learning tool.
Thanks for sharing Ricard! It's definitely a good thing, with time you'll develop more personal work . Even if you are inside a style that other photographers are you will have your own way of seeing!
Interesante reflexión. Lo que más me ha resonado es la parte donde dices qaue hay que hacer de nuestros proyectos algo personal porque ahí radica la diferencia entre nuestro trabajo y el de los demás. Gracias.
Thank you for this video, 1st of all.
I have started doing street for a few years, and am trying to find my own voice.
I think studying the masters and copying them consciously / sub consciously is fine. This happens in music too, where similarities between artists are pointed out. And if similar bodies of work of different artists resonate with audiences of different times, I think that points to us that there is a legacy in style.
Inspiration is necessary for artists. It's the enginge sustaining personal and orginal projects. Very well explained.
I guess there's a difference between work being a pastiche and making it your own. I'm quite sure there have been few artists acting without influence, as Picasso once said 'good artists copy, great artists steal'
good way to rewrite this, as I saw another photographer say is "good artists copy, great artists emulate"
Deep video, very enjoyable, cheers.
I have noticed the photos look like they were done in a studio in controlled conditions. Very clever technical work.
I would be rather honored to be compared with such masters. But i still wait for it to happen. 😂 Honestly, i am on a very satisfying journey to find my own style and i feel i made some progress in the past 3 years, also by finding inspiration in all kinds of arts, not only photography but also painting for example.
We all stand on the shoulders of giants. Nothing to shame for. That's how art worked since the beginning.
We all stand on the shoulders of giants. Absolutely right! :)
Great video!
Thank you very much!
Great video and great channel. To me this brings a question whereas the line between techniques, their usage and your style. We copy to master techniques, we must do that to experiment, and at what point does the transition occur ? Anyway, just a random thought, keep up the great work. Gracias
Great video. I think is a common question in creatives works. In world of design the are an expresión for this “COCO” in Spanish “Copia o coincidencia”:
Congratulations for your work!!
Sometimes we think our pictures are better than they actually are.
é um privilégio ver os seus videos! :)
obrigado Joao!
A mi me encantan tus fotos
Muchas graciaS Pepe!! Más sentido común y menos megapixeles! ;)
Thank you Jorge for this very interesting video. Well I believe that the human brain needs to classify things according to what it already knows. And for sure the grand masters work will never look like yours but your work will always look like theirs for the public 🤣You are therefore right to ask the question on how to make your work stand up. I don't think that photographers who are serious about their work copy, they are inspired, they are programmed to detect scenes that are similar to ones they liked. It's at this point that they will produce something different if they did their homework well... They stand out!
this happens frequently within the realms of makeup artistry. Colleges and freshers recreate film makeup or the latest trends using them as promotional images with little to no change or attempt to create something fresh and unique. The skull candy phenomenon was a prime example of this in action and for a while, it was the go-to for its visual impact. Street photography that is spontaneous is interesting and a snapshot of life whereas (for me) when it is staged, it becomes something of a fashion spread and loses some of the impact of the moment.
I almost wish this were a longer video
Very interesting Jorge at times you only have milliseconds to take a picture other times you can previsualize it and hope all the elements come together or there are moments it just happens I think time spent taking photographs over say many years of various scene's gives one a kind of second cense for the moment to fire the shutter even a short second or few seconds later the image as been lost something you said stuck in my mind (take notes walk around work the seen } if we take pictures that look like other great photographers work it shows your on the right road we all only have what we find in the viewfinder to work with practice gives over time and vision the possibility to get more keepers.......Hopefully
Love this: "we all only have what we find in the viewfinder" Thanks my friend!
Habra escuchado webb en algun momento que sus fotos se parecian a las de Gilles Peress o Charles Harbutt ? Buen video . Gracias .
Magnum's photographers have developed this specific style and Cuba is one of the places where they have refined it.
They've done the best possible photos and another thing works for them - their shots carry the patina of time and this makes them even more valuable.
If you go to Cuba you need completely different approach for your photography.
You are a good photographer and I understand your admiration and desire to follow the steps of this great masters.
The hardest thing about art is to overcome the influence of those we admire.
In my opinion influence of great masters are bound to reflect in photographs taken henceforth for the sheer volume of works already available. Any photograph studied minutely can show influence by another!
But it is a fact that a band of photographers exist who lack original concepts and their sole job to remain in the fray is to copy from others.
Nonetheless I find your video very informative and a great learning experience.
Warm regards.
Indeed 'cliches' or prior 'solutions' exist in most genres of photography, let's say you do coastal photography, weddings, intimate landscapes, wildlife... a mountain of 'solutions' pre-exist, are well accepted, desired, taught, encouraged, in the zeitgeist.... also photography has been maturing, most subjects have been photographed a million times over. Several big name photographers became big names because photographs and photographers were scarce, often they were photographing particular subjects for the first time, or used a zone system for the first time, a rangefinder body for the first time, colour film for the first time... (some kind of a first solutions to a visual problem they were trying to solve, that didn't have a prior-solution or whose prior solutions they deemed unsatisfactory). Today we have plenty of good prior-photographic solutions, and there are few photographic frontiers (e.g. inner body photography) were true novel 'solutions' are possible. We are doomed in rehashing prior- solutions to visual problems and this is not necessarily a bad thing.
IMO there is no originality left in photography. Everything has been done a million times. But instead we should strive for authenticity, that is more important. I recently saw a video by Eyexplore in Tokyo and Lukas talked about exactly that.
I heard your argument here. I have been an editorial photographer for more than 30 years and whether I'm influenced by what master photographer or, ' copying ' the style of others is not relevant for me personally. I take photography in my profession as a COMMODITY that sales ( and should have the commercial value to be sold as a commodity on the market ) that's all. Meantime, as far as photographic styles are concerned, ALL INFLUENCIAL STYLES ARE ALREADY THERE, and these established styles does affect the next generation of photographers who come after. The only essential point is whether you're good photographer who is able to take good pictures, that's all. As for MUSIC, after Bach, Beethoven and Mozart, every great masters who came after them were the branches grown out of that HUGE TREES. But Brahms is Brahms, Bruckner is Bruckner, and don't forget the Gustav Mahler. Be an excellent photographer who absorbed all the nutrients from all outstanding photographers past and present, and TAKE A GOOD PHOTOGRAPHS today. I don't see any problem if someone call my photography resemble that of Sebastiao Salgado or James Nachtwey, I only take that as a compliment, therefore, I DON'T SHARE YOUR MENTAL PROBLEM OR DILEMMA. Instagram@frame25_ren
The compliment saying the image looks similar to Alex Webb isn't double edged IMO. Alex's work is very nuanced and his ability to see what unfolds in front of him isn't something most IG photographers are capable of doing. Having said that, it's our responsibility to look at the image and ask the gut wrenching question: How could I have made this my own?
I'm struggling with a 2 year ambivalence in my own work. I've been shooting FT since 1987 and I no longer feel compelled to pick up my cameras. Since age 15, I've always felt the need to shoot. Recently Magnum photographer David Alan Harvey looked at my work on my website (I was on the Green Team at Eddie Adam's in 1992 and DAH and I met/spoke about my work at that time) and he said my recent work looked desperate and uninspired - which is exactly how my internal space is creatively. It's almost depressing and I feel I'm in a creative no mans land. So in essence, if you receive the so called double edged sword of a compliment like that, don't see it as such. At least you're trying to create work that is above the bad to mediocre images that pervades photography these days...
Thank you so much for taking the time to comment Clif! I thing that being uninspired is something that happens to all of us, I also thing that is a temporal thing (hopefully) In any case when I say that is double edge I mean that the compliment part is much appreciated but there is an internal part in your mind (my mind at least) that thinks as you said, "Ok thank you, but how could I have made this my own?"
@@The_Raw_Society Jorge - I think that is the essence of my response - "Great - I've hit the target in what I wanted to capture, but how could I have elevated the image to make it my own?" Thank you for responding - I'm hoping that my feeling uninspired is temporary...
@@cevisuals I'm sure that is temporary my friend! Patience! ;)
I wouldn't even call them visual problems - I'd almost call them visual dilemmas!
The problem has a solution, the dilemma has several.
Really enjoyed the video, great reflection :)
Good point! Love it! visual dilema, Thank you Pedro!
The black square is a famous painting painted by Kazimir Malevich. But as it happened many other painters have painted a black square. Agnes Martin, Ellsworth Kelly, Tomas Rajlich, Mark Rothko to name a few..
So did they all copy Malevich or were inspired by him? Not at all. When talking about a work of art you have to take into account the time it is made and the motivations of the artist. The work might look alike but the intent and meaning can be completely different. Not every black square is the same!
Great channel. Congrats. But regarding the comparison between your photo and Webb or Harvey photo (both arcade shadow photos), there is nothing to compare... Only the concept, but their photos have subject. interesting subjects. Your photo has just the mood. But there is nothing happening there...
Thanks my friend! That is a little bit my point actually! Those kind of pictures (In my case) are not very interesting beyond the mood or the "flashy" aspect of it I prefer the complete body of work that gives context to every picture.
Most of the photos featured here could have been taken by Stevie Wonder.
95% of YT photographers have no idea how is Mr. Harvey, Mr. Webb and Mr. McCurry. Look like you studied them and subconsciously try to mimic them. If you would not know their composition style probably your composition would be different.
Yes you may be right.Can you evidence this with some of your work, cheers.
@@KeithHodgkinson I quit every SM platforms 3 years ago. After over 40 years of doing photography I realized photography became so over saturated and meaningless, least for me, I just started to doing it for myself.
Mmm, more food for thought. It's not as if these photographs are from @insta_repeat. Sure there are similar elements approached with similar thinking and perhaps similar intent, but there are many disparate elements and interpretations competing for your attention that make them totally different photographs. Perhaps we all start with a little copying as we strive to learn, but when we use our own eyes and apply our own intent we make 'our' photographs, no-one else's, no matter how similar. Thanks for working my brain a little harder.
Thank you Trevor for spending the time! There is no just one answer but I think that is nice to think about it!