Evolution of French TGV Trains: EXPLAINED
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- Опубліковано 27 лип 2024
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- French infrastructure manager SNCF has only recently, in October 2021, opened its high-speed rail network for competition, ie, it finally liberalized this market segment.
In preparation for this step, the TGV premium service inOui and the low-cost Ouigo service were created to replace the 'classic' TGV services. From October last year, Trenitalia competes with these two, serving passengers on the Paris-Lyon-Milan route.
As we already dedicated a few videos to the stories about the development and evolution of Japanese Shinkansen and German ICE trains, where we tried to present the technology, technical characteristics of all series of Shinkansen and ICE trains, as well as circumstances that influenced their design, now we wanted to do the same with the famous French TGV trains!
Therefore, this video brings a comprehensive story about TGV SUD-EST, TGV ATLANTIQUE, TGV Réseau, TGV Duplex, TGV POS, and TGV 2N2 trains .
They all had to be developed in such a way to be interoperable, and capable of running on the new LGVs and conventional railway lines but also on the lines outside the borders of France. Because of this, they are equipped with multi-system equipment for power supply and signaling.
Also, these requirements raised the development of several new technologies and new solutions which gave the French industry a significant technological edge.
High-speed rail technology did not fall out of the sky - it was a result of a close connection between the railway industry, transport research, and entrepreneurial flair.
As an outcome of all this, the first TGV train branded as TGV Sud-Est was introduced in 1980.
Do you think we managed to present the main aspects of the French TGV trains? Tell us in the comments below!
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#France #TGV #Railway
![Lp. Последняя Реальность #107 РОДНОЙ ДОМ [Финал] • Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/IK3QKzKUlHM/mqdefault.jpg)
As a french railway engineering student, given how similar different TGVs look, the fact that you made no mistake listing and presenting them is very impressive ! Glad to have such good quality content on UA-cam
Thanks ☺️
Ingénierie ferroviaire en France ? T'es à l'ESTACA non ?
@@keriank5883 salut kerian, retourne bosser sur le projet de Marc 😂
@@lucascdprod2011 bin tiens xD
ช.?
You forgot the TGV La Poste, the world fastest freight train. It was a modified TGV PES, which painted in yellow and allow easy loading of mail.
The "La Poste" TGVs also had special devices under the floor to measure the weight for the loaders (people) to synchronize the weight on both sides of the cars in order that the final weight on each rail was close to equivalent. If my memory serves me right, they were removed from service in 2009.
The 954 half was preserved. 1 power car and 4 carriages.
China has a faster one now though
@@RichardMigneron They where removed in 2015
I remember seeing it once when I was younger it was parked between gare du nord and stade de france
TGV sud-est will always remain my favourite both in colour and design.
You might have forgotten about the PBKA Thalys version. This is the kind of Thalys train that also runs to Cologne. And the TGV that goes to the UK (that's now slowly replaced by the Siemens e320). But it's still a great video
Also, the original Acela Express is a TGV-derivative. EDIT: As is the new Avelia Liberty also.
And do not forget the original Eurostar class 373 sets, which were also produced by Alstom.
Yeah, it is produced by Alstom but it is not TGV derivate.
@@RailwaysExplained You forgot the TGV La Poste and the future TGV Avelia Horizon.
E300 are a dérivate from TGV Atlantique, but modified to be usable on Uk
Let’s go 🚄🇫🇷
Try our Z2M (TNR) please!
French trains are one of the best trains!
Thank you for the overview.
As a bit of pre-history, until the early 1970s SNCF actually wanted to use gas turbines for their high speed train, considering the difficulties of pantographs during the high speed tests of 1955. So the "TGV 001" test unit was equipped with gas turbines, similar to the earlier ETG and RTG trains. During the 1970s, also considering the oil crisis, they changed their opinion and developed new overhead wire systems and pantographs to work at high speed. A contemporary film about the TGV 001:
ua-cam.com/video/1VTfoSltNRI/v-deo.html
Alstom also developed an articulated train with distributed traction, the AGV. That one however was not ordered by SNCF, it was only built for Italian ntv (italo) so far.
Likewise one TGV was tested with tilting technology in order to reduce travel times on classic lines, specifically Paris Austerlitz via Limoges to Toulouse (le Capitole). No series production came out of it.
In addition to the Euroduplex currently under construction, the next generation has already been ordered, 100 Avelia Horizon units:
www.alstom.com/press-releases-news/2018/7/alstom-receives-sncf-order-100-next-generation-very-high-speed-trains
The improvements mentioned are: 20% lower cost, shorter power cars and new doubledeck bar car increasing passenger space by 20% at the same length, 30% lower maintenance cost, 20% lower energy consumption. The press release does not mention any equipment for international operation. I assume that's optional.
Wow, I'm floored. You guys did an amazing job explaining the TGV growing family. I was on the first TGV PSE and the first time the line was pushed to 280km/h. You guys did an amazing job wrapping all this together. Congratulations. This is a channel well worth subscribing to.
Thalys changed my life the first time I rode it. It was my first HSR ever. I live in California. So now we gotta finish our HSR here now.
As a dutch person that loves making videos about transport infrastructure, I really hope there will come more highspeed trains in the Netherlands!
ik hoop dat de ICNG snel naar Brussel en Antwerpen komt, momenteel gaat het maar met 160km/h. de ICNG die 200 kan is een beetje sneller maar eigenlijk ook niet spectaculair.
Than you should convert your network to 25Kv AC
@@almerindaromeira8352 true 1,5 kv is hopelessly outdated
Thing is, NL is such a short country that HSR is not the better solution
@@konigdermasai i get your point. HSR needs some distance to get up to speed, but you have to think about the international connections of the Netherlands. Faster travels to and from the Netherlands like Berlin-Amsterdam but also through like Antwerp-Hamburg
I think I used all lines besides the Thalys one and I really can say it's the best transport system I know of. I really love the TGV and everytime I'm using the system I'm so happy it exists. Meanwhile using the ICE is just such a different story. It sucks so much in comparison it really annoys me! Like why the DB is so against Duplex cars? Or can't adopt the Ouigo trains? I don't get it...
But I'm really sceptical if liberating the market is such a good thing. In my opinion the state should provide it. It's much better for the countrys rail network. Because private companies will always just pick the profitable lines. But a good network also inherits non profitable lines. It's state infrastructe for the people not to make profit.
But anyways looking forward for my next TGV ride :)
I fully agree with you on liberate market.
I loved watching TGV videos as a kid, I recognized that there were both single and double decker version, as well as orange vs grey. But nothing beyond that, I had no idea there were so many variations, amazing video!
You did an excellent job! One thing I would have added was that the TGV Atlantique were also refurbished (2005-2010) and received a revised grey livery and new interior made by famous fashion designer Christian LaCroix. Now many of the first Atlantique trainsets are being retired and replaced by new Duplex 2N2 “L’Ocean” versions which is the latest Duplex version after Duplex, DAYSE, and 2N2. Some of the newer model Atlantique’s as of 2021 are being refurbished a second time and are getting the Carmillion paint similar to the Reseau and Sud Est.
Very nice and complete short history of this iconic train 👌🚆
Thanks for watching
Thank you for putting all that information together. I didn't realise there were so many versions of the TGV. Always great to travel on them.
That was also our impression.
French engines are amazing. In India, we have been fortunate to have wap-7000 and wap-20000. Alstome has contributed significantly in Indian railway and metros
Alstom has built the WAP-12 in India. there is no WAP-7000 or WAP-20000. Wap-7 exists which is a passenger locomotive designed in India. Pata nai kya ganja fook ke comment karte hai.
In theory you missed the Thalys PBKA and Eurostar e300 TSMT, but since those weren't built for TGV services, I can see why. Under development and early stages of prototyping is the new TGV-M (Moderne) which is marketed by Alstom as the Avelia Horizon. These trains will use a nearly identical powercar to the one on the Avelia Liberty being built for Amtrak's Acela service in the United States.
You are absolutely right about Thalys and Eurostar. Regarding TGV M - you know, we have to leave some material for future videos 😁
@@RailwaysExplained Clever!!
The first trainset is assembled and will begin its tests (2 power cars 7 cars). For the power cars, they are visually identical to those of the Acela 2. It is inside that this changes, mainly the engines and their placement .
The Acela 2 uses a derivative of the Prima motors, motors suspended from the body (via parts of course). The TGV M will use a brand new Asynchronous motor of reduced size, but outputting a higher power... and it will be suspended from the bogie. As for the control system, probably the usual OniX.
My favourite of all the TGVs were the PSE sets in their original orange and grey livery.
And in the near future, there will be a new train : TGV M, very modern, with an emphasis en energy efficiency, maintenance and capacity ( but no increase in speed ). Should be available in 2024 ( production already started )
Thanks for the video. The French TGV is an iconic piece of rolling stock. I would really like to travel on one in the future. Keep up the good work👍
SNCF is the best! The OG diesel(turbine?) tgv power car is off a highway exit ramp outside of Strasbourg!
Amazing breakdown of the history of the TGV! Thanks!
Thank youi for another great and informative video. Love your channel 💗
Great video. For a few that were missed outside of the ones other commenters have mentioned:
Eurotrain: A test train created for the THSR which used ICE power cars and TGV duplex carriages.
TGV P01: A TVG with tilting technology.
AGV Eilsa: Prototype of the TGV successor/Avelia predecessor. It had an EMU formation with distributed traction instead of a power car-carriages formation.
Acela Express: American version using TGV and LRC technology.
Avelia Liberty
: Acela successor based on upcoming TGV M/Avelia Horizon.
I wouldn’t call the avelia liberty a successor to the Acela
@@No-le9qf Why not?
@@HeavyRayne it’s not American it’s a off the shelf trainset and only similarity’s it’s has with the Acela is the trackage it run on and who operate those trains
At 6:49, the picture shows a TGV sud-est, despite it is written TGV réseau. The difference is the roof of the driving cabin, which is lower than the rest of the roof. The next seconds show a real TGV réseau with the front light imbedded in the high roof.
For the Thalys, there are 3-current ones with the same shape as its predecessor and 4-current ones with a more aerodynamic (round) design. We can see a coupling of the 2 kinds at 08:08.
I small correction to the map showing different train protection systems: the system in Finland is called ATP-VR/RHK, there is one wrong letter there.
Too bad you didn't have a French sponsor to do a three-part history of French railways! ;)
Yeah. To bad 😁
Love this channel! Greetings from Slovenia
Great presentation... great topic...
Thank you ☺️
Great video. My favourite is Duplex for sure, no matter it is Euro Duplex or Regular Duplex
A journey in the high room of the Duplex is a wonderful memory.
The Euroduplex does have wider passenger cars than the previous Duplex on the second floor.
lol, i also didn't now there where so many variants.
thanks for this very informative video.
My favourite TGV train model was that one who reaches the speed at 575 km/h and who connected Paris to Alpine region to Marseilles! !!!!! 🚅🚆🚅🚆🚅🚆🚆🚅🚆
Superb video as usual! Thanks. Just lacking the AGV (but operating only in Italy) and the next generation of TGV, which will be also used as Acelia Liberty in the US!
While the power units of Avelia Horizon are similar to the Avelia Liberty for Amtrak, the middle cars will be the same as Duplex but longer. Also the bar car of the Duplex trains so far has a technical compartment in the lower deck so it's single deck; the new Avelia Horizon appear to be doubledeck throughout.
@@uncinarynin Thanks for the detailed answer.
We will talk about AGV in the video about Italian HSR 😁
You have the strongest serbian accent that I've heard in my life, it made listening to the narration very peculiar
I’m surprised EU didn’t impose a TVG electrical and signaling standard. Why does Belgium, Italy and Switzerland have different standards?
PS1- Alstom designed a great TVG train set kiss!
PS2 - TVG Duplex trains are great looking.
Because trains are much older than the EU. There are projects about adopting common standards such as the ERTMS but other things like electrification is very hard to change as countries would need to change all their locomotives. Plus even with France there are two different voltages!
ETCS is the standard for new high speed lines but converting all the existing lines would be very expensive and take a long time, so the trains still need to be equipped for multiple systems.
ERTMS lvl2
If you search for "Ferrovie dello Stato italiane trazione elettrica (Italian State Railways electric traction)" you will find two links of the RFI that explain why we have 3kV DC, they are safe and also have an English translation. Unfortunately I can't send the links, sometimes youtube gives problems even just sharing the videos of the same platform
@@fb55255 If you want to nitpick there are 4.... the 750/850V DC used in the metros and on the yellow train of Cerdagne, and the 11kV 50Hz on the Montenvers train.😂
Une très bonne présentation du TGV bien expliquée c'est vrai qu'il manque le tgv la poste mais aussi une rame pse qui a été transformée en tgv pendulaire mais bien sur la question financière a avorté le plan il était prévu pour paris Toulouse qui a beaucoup de virage donc l'idée de train pendulaire était un bonne idée vue le prix du tracé l'idée a été mis aux oubliettes
By the way there is new type of TGV in production. They are considered as the 5th generation of TGVs and they are going released in late 2023 I believe.
These TGVs are going to be more aerodynamic and the 2 locomotives will be smaller in length just so they can add a extra passenger car to the train
I was thinking that nowadays they may make all the bogies have motors like other modern high speed trains seem to have hence no need for locomotives but then again tgv are the fastest trains with wheels.
@@PeteS_1994 This is because the power electronics must be distributed over the train, in the case of distributed motorization. And this electronics takes up space, so you cannot do duplex without exceeding the gauge (See the Coradia stream bi -level for Germany or Luxembourg).
The SNCF also uses concentrated power coaches to facilitate maintenance and separates the maintenance of coaches from those of coaches that are not aligned with time.
So it's not a question of motors (moreover the AGV uses PMSMs and the TGV-M uses new asynchronous even smaller than those of euroduplex).
Ive been on one. Cant remember it, all i remember is that we got where we needed to go in 2 hrs.
You've forgot to mention TMST... A.K.A BR Class 373 another comment mentions PBKA Thalys
The American Acela and Avelia are like Korean TGV based off of TGV as well with the Avelia Liberty literally being an alternative.
The Acela is a much more remote derivative. Its power cars are heavier and share components with the Astride locomotive, while the tilting trailers have nothing in common with the TGV (they're mostly a derivative of Bombardier's LRC).
Hi! Very nice and interesting video! Greetings from Italy. Stefano
Theres one in korea
Its called the KTX / Korean Train eXpress
The lack of music on the background helps me to concentrate on the videos speech, that is fantastic. I am a music lover, tried music on my videos but with speech turns anoying and i have to dispute author rights to make things even worst.
i love the og TGV, such an iconic train.
Next: a 10-part history of the Serbian railways!
I wonder why TGV still continue with the locomotive based design, even Korea started moving into a distributed power and passenger cab design (similar to later ICEs).
Because in double-deck cars (complying with the restrictive loading gauge) there is not enough empty space whatsoever to fit traction equipment (and it would make the axle load too heavy). You'd need to completely redesign the architecture of the train and in the end I don't think you would have more space for passengers as an optimized design like the TGV M.
It's a different problem from single-deck trains, which have enough space under the floor and on the roof to fit all equipment and can optimize the space on board this way.
i wondert what the aerodynamica coefficient is of the tgv's versus shinkansen's strain sets. They look very different.
The shape of the newer generation shinkansen, with their elongated noses, is in large parts determined by the need to reduce tunnel boom. This is a loud sound that occurs when a train enters a tunnel at speed. In France, this is less of a problem because the tunnels have a larger cross section, so tunnel boom is reduced. That means the shape of the TGV's can be optimized for other things.
You forgot the LRTS Horizon Express trains that run throughout Lego City and out as far as Ninjago City, Newbury, and Heartlake City.
They are beautiful trains. Next time we are in Europe we will make sure to ride some of them.
Wow super cool 👍
nice video
Now tgw and inverted maglev hyperlooping trains and hyper pods pvt
I was wondering: Alstom also built the AGV - Automotrice à Grande Vitesse - with no motor cars at either end. But these were only sold to an Italian high-speed rail operator. Has anyone an idea why this variant of the TGV didn't succeed or sell any better? Is it still been developped by Alstom or shelved?
When the AGV was ready for production, SNCF had already settled on doubledeck trains and found further developments of the Duplex concept to be more efficient (because they have a higher capacity).
My guess would be it's propulsion is different from the traditional TGVs and probably SNCF was waiting for something more innovative like the Avelia Horizon.
SNCF decided to increase the capacity by trains with Duplex to increase turnover per unit and avoid multiple units.
Sncf thought reduce tolls by trains but the tax increases anyway.
Beside of that, some major lines, out of Paris, lost a lot of trains due to the arrival of Duplex. Instead of purposing 350~ seats by train, the Duplex purposes more than 500 and it's hard to complete them fully.
So now, they reduce the frequency on certains lines...
AGV would be great for HSL that don't deserve Paris but our network in France is joining Paris anyway instead of others medium size cities relations.
AGV is the main NTV Italo's high speed trainset in Italy.
We will cover that in the video about Italian HSR.
What does the future hold? Is there going to be a completely new design of TGV sometime soon?
TGV POS? Not the most fortunate acronym in English‼️😱😂😂😂
A mighty effort at a comprehensive review nonetheless. Thank you 🙏
I found funny Czech high speed rail use acronym VRT (vysokorychlostní trať) which means in Czech drill hole.
You can’t forget the absaloute beast of the class 373
Awesome the TGV 👍Has more versions than the ICE ❗
The old Eurostar was also a TGV
I missed the PBKA for Thalys services into Germany.
Isn't there the other SNCF Service ouigo
Please make a video on Indian Railways as well😊
I will try the Thalys (Amsterdam to Paris) and Euroduplex trainssets between Paris and Frankfurt this summer.
Ad a yet unknown ICE betweem Frankfurt and Vienna and Railjet between Vienna and Prague.
I think it's the ICE-T (tilting) that is used to Vienna, but maybe other variants can also run in Austria.
0:44 oh god .. well r.i.p it was nice knowing you tgv...
Wireless tgv on top cum maglev traction dual power powered trains setup in india in hypertubes
Je demande pourquoi avez-vous ignoré le TGV Al-Boraq dans votre vidéo.
We have a dedicated video of Al-Boraq:
ua-cam.com/video/6Ogz2YaDTzI/v-deo.html
In Orange sah der TGV am schönsten aus.
Of the four trains I like the orange colored ones more.
What about Eurostar?
It is not TGV service so we did not included it.
@@RailwaysExplained But the vehicles were based on the design and you covered those in Morocco and South Korea that also were so I was surprised you didn't also talk about Eurostar.
You forgot to tell about the TGV in Oui service from Munich germany to paris france.
What about the TMST(Eurostar)?
Please make video on Konkan railway and Kashmir railways (official name is USBRL)in India, in my opinion it is world's one of the difficult projects
I feel like this one started in the middle. Would have been nice to start like Shinkansen: like what was the maiden trip? Which year
You forgot Italy for tri-current TGVs and you haven't mentioned Thalys PBKA and Eurostar trainsets...
Isn't Italy mentioned at 7:38 (with 3kV DC for Milan)?
The section about Thalys was very confusing and too short in my opinion, you basically said all Thalys are the same sets but they use 2 different ones (: PBA and PBKA, respectively based on old and new generation power cars)...
why you to get everything even for tgv train à grande vitesse 574,8 KM/H
The TGV in Luxembourg is dying out because of airplanes being faster and often cheaper to travel.
And the tgv m is very new not out yet made by alstom 2023 still in progress
what abot frecciarossa trains next?
Will be soon
I don’t think that the remaining TGV PSE are in the orange livery which is a shame because it was pretty cool and it could stand out to the other TGVs
Currently, all PSEs are scrapped. Only 2 sets are kept.
The "Patrick" train, the first TGV PSE .... it has 3 liveries ... we see it at 4:57.
And the SNCF employees have another train and it will be in orange livery. It will be used for films or trips for fans.
@@Lodai974 the second saved set is n°16 I think, the one from the 1980 record.
Is TGV series are compatible at Indonesia?
1435 mm gauge in indonesia? for the rest, everything is adaptable (current type ,template etc ...)
@@Lodai974 yes Indonesia has 1435 mm gauge at Kalimantan & Sulawesi island but obviously Java island now has 1435 mm but it was for China HSR as Jakarta Bandung high speed rail (KCIC)
@@odiliusrailfans so yes TGV can use KCIC tracks because Chinese TGV are come from French, German and Japanese TGVs.
For the Sulawesi and Borneo tracks, probably yes but it is better to have HSL. it allows to use the potential of bullet trains
@@Lodai974 this is the biggest problem, most people and railfans prefer products from America, China, Japan and South Korea, the rest are local products, namely INKA Manufacturing. But if I look at it from a social perspective, there are a lot of Indonesians who are anti-Western (European) countries, due to past factors where Spain, Portugal, the Netherlands, UK and France has colonized Indonesia, it is very unlikely that they will invite Manufacturing investors such as Alstom, Siemens, CAF and Talgo to establish a branch company in Indonesia and bring TGV, AGV, Avril, Oaris or Velaro technology to my country. But there is a Switzerland Manufacturer called Stadler Rail which will build a manufacturing company in Banyuwangi.
@@odiliusrailfans This is the weird side, Japan having invaded Indonesia during WWII...
but let's move on, it's also because American or Japanese trains are in Hollywood or Japanese production films (mainly in animes).moreover, as you say, Europeans are no longer popular in Indonesia, whatever the reasons.
After the Europeans are well established in Asia, many metros are designed by Alstom (Family Metropolis), Siemens, or CAF .... (India, Singapore, Hong Kong, Taiwan, China, Sydney, etc ...). .
...or had partly European metros (like the Seoul metro series 4000-5000-6000-7000 which had Korean trains but with Alstom or ABB engines)
Eventually, the TGV duplex model dominated.
You forgot tgv m also called tgv avelia
It's a very new high speed train from alstom 2023
Is this the same guy that does simply Railway?
Imagine if you coupled three Atlantic version together.
you forgot the TGV duplex carmillion
Why are some French lines not operated by AGV type?
I thought AGV would be the successor to TGV in the near future.
the sncf wants to keep the concentrated motorization to facilitate maintenance.
In fact, the power cars are numbered, not the coachs. The power cars are never with the same duplex coach all their life, but keep changing.
@@Lodai974 No it's quite rare that power cars swich sets. It mostly happened after one was destroyed and of course for the POS/RD and Ouigo/neoduplex swaps. There 3 spare power cars (one Réseau, one Duplex and one 2N2) to use when one is disabled, but it takes some time to swap a power car so they don't do it regularly. Most sets run with the same power cars all their life.
@@joriss5 There is a reserve set of two power cars for each series. They are used to replace the power cars , in the cases listed by u and for heavy maintenance operations (mid-life for example)
Ah the new power car of TGV-M (Avelia Horizon) has left the factory and is on its way to La Rochelle.It's the same as the Avelia Liberty
Not bad video, of course the story of TGV is a long time so it's difficult to sort everything. What you missed: the first World record for TGV PSE at 380 km/h, and the last record for TGV at 574,8 km/h
He did mention the last record tho.
They couldn’t pick a corporate design color palette and stick with it?
2:24 and im also going to guess a shed load of public funding..
You should see my collection!
Should never have got rid of the orange/white -or should have been painted the same scheme as Air France.
Thumbs up 👍👍👍
Nicely filmed
Waw mantap kawan
TGV never Gives Pleasure Like Amtrak's P42 Diesel Power Car & Stainless Steel Coaches.
First of all, mass passenger transport vehicles: Coach [BuS], Train [Power Car(Locomotive), Push Pull Train], Passenger Aircraft, Cruise Ship are MANLY & MACHO industrial products.
Sob, all this 4 vehicle must have hard & agresive looks. GE GENESlS P42 power car has maybe simple design but Agressive. Nathan K5LA horn excellent. Track noise superb. Stainless steel Coaches durable, safety, enviroment-friendly.
Moc rychlé titulky,proč to nemá dabing ???
Sud est
Modern livery duplex
Old/antlantique duplex
Thalis PKA
PBKA is the duplex lookalike
12:30 april
TGV la Poste...?
You forgot the TGV TMST
TGV SNCF ❤
is it me or TGV motor car looks like a godzilla 😅