I've been obsessively researching premium manual espresso machines, and your channel has been a huge help. Thank you! I know this video is old already, but I wanted to put what I'm looking for in a manual machine out into the void: -58mm portafilter compatible with 3rd party accessories -Decent sturdiness and build quality -No electronics -A workflow that strikes a good balance between high control and simplicity. I want a simple process that allows for customization and mistakes. -Not cost more than the Flair 58
I recently reviewed the Sonic S7 which hits almost all of those, except price. I’d say the Flair 58x (the X has no electronics I believe) is still the best for what you mentioned.
This does have slightly “lifestyle” product vibes to it. Looks well designed and made, seems like the mechanism is probably good for repeatability over minute pressure adjustments.. which for many people is totally fine
My main concern would be the seeming lack of any accurate means for temperature control, where a degree or two can make a huge difference in taste. Preheating that polycarbonate water container in hot water at a precise temperature, ditto the portafilter assembly? That would seem to be a bit of a PITA. And for a 2nd shot, wouldn't you have to go through the same preheating of components again for reproducibility? That sure would slow you down. On the flip side, the quality of construction looks very nice - likely reflected in that price tag. Thorough and unbiased review!
for me - I like the idea of simple, manual shots. The more hands on, the more personal the experience. That said, I like and drink single origin, light/medium roasted coffee. I know that water temperature is as important to the shot as the correct pressure. The SuperKop for me would be a deal breaker because there is no way to control water temperature to the degree I find necessary. Also as you pointed out, the ratchet process does not quite give you the control of the pressure that I would expect to have during the shot production. The manual machine has great lines, and a clean look, but the lofty price tag and before mentioned minuses makes the SuperKop a fail for me.
Manual is a nice way to make espresso as it gives that feedback. Agree this maker looks great. Could imagine this still working in 50 years time and still looking good.
Great video, one question, by manual machines you mean no electronics or manual levers? If no electronics then maybe this one is the most expensive, if manual levers, creminas and strietmans are the upper leve(r)l of pricing, worflow and quality. Either way, great review, i enjoy your videos, keep on sproin`!
To me they join the trend of fighting against electric espresso machine which is a welcome. I like the simplistic design and workflow of the machine. I do agree on the price point though. This is more expensive compare to the Flair and of course the quality is only just as good? The quality is debatable The design of this one is better than the Flair in my opinion
Would love to try the Flair58 someday as I have several 58mm portafilters from my previous machine. But since I got the Robot I’ve had no desire to buy anything else, it’s so good. Have you tried and compared the 58 with the Robot?
I can see the appeal of trying to make something easy, but that direct connection between input pressure and output pour is really at the heart of what I love about manual machines. Also, it's twice the price of my Robot, so not for me. It's a beautiful piece of industrial design though.
I’m with you, and I think there’s room in the market for more because I love to see the design and workflow choices made by folks who build them. In the end, they’ve definitely produced a beauty of a machine, but fell a little short of the competition with features and control. I’ll be interested to see if they catch on more, I believe they’re looking for more global distributors.
I really love the design approach with the metal lever machine in conjunction with the plastic water container above the portafilter. However I am a little bit disappointed that polycarbonate was used as the material for the water container. Polycarbonate has been banned from use in baby bottles due to it containing Bisphenol A (BPA), a substance on the candidate list of"substances of very high concern" by the European Chemicals Agency. Forgive me for quoting wikipedia: "The use of polycarbonate containers for the purpose of food storage is controversial. The basis of this controversy is their hydrolysis (degradation by water, often referred to as leaching) occurring at high temperature, releases bisphenol A." and "Studies have shown that at temperatures above 70 °C, and high humidity, polycarbonate will hydrolyze to bisphenol A (BPA)." Nowadays, there are BPA-free polymere alternatives available on the market (e.g. Tritan). I do not understand why the engineers behind Superkop did not think about using them. Especially when using it with high temperature and humidity.
Cafelat robot still sweeps the floor if you're talking about a pure manual espresso machine. Great workflow, easy finish and no electronic parts to complicate workflow. Top notch shots, unless they are too lightly roasted.
I have this machine, and I love it. Its simple and when you dont care enought about the variables he pointed out, this one is perfect. I love the fact that you dont need to heat the whole machine up first (my bf has a Pavoni), it gives a very good espresso (had the aeropress before) and when my family comes to stay over, they can make their own espresso without me having to worry that they break anything or to many instructions haha. I would say I am a coffee lover and can distinguish a good espresso. ps. its not that big btw, I have the white one and looks beautiful in my marble beige wooden kitchen
It’s an interesting take on manual espresso but seems to be a bit of a miss. My guess is that it’s the portafilter and basket that are causing thermal loss rather than the water chamber. Without a good way to heat the portafilter (like the flair 58) you’re going to lose a good amount of heat while brewing.
Yeah, the portafilter is a big hunk of metal, it does seem to sap some heat in the early shots, but does warm up and didn’t seem to be a huge sync after a proper warm up.
Looks interesting, but at $1099 Canadian bucks, I'm happy with my Flair58. If I didn't have the 58, I think I might have jumped on this. Great find, thanks!
Yeah I think the direct control of the pressure is the biggest downfall of the Superkop. It doesn’t seem to have a negative effect on the shot, but does hold back the user.
The size alone is definitely a deal breaker for most home bars, but if it was consistent enough, it would be awesome in a small cafe set up for a house blend once calibrated. Additionally, thank you to the Superkop for me now dreaming of a plastic chamber for a Flair. 10/10 would make my workflow so much easier hahaha
I'd love a to try a manual espresso machine but 799 euros... Jesus Christ That's 4 times the ROK EspressoGC, 2 times the Cafelac Robot and 1.5 times the Flair 58 which includes the pressure gauge this seems to be missing AND solves the whole water temperature issue. If I win the lottery one day, sure why not but I'd rather spend that amount of money on the other mentionned manual espresso machines + a good grinder instead. Pass
Just saw this machine on Instagram and was intrigued, and I discovered that you have just uploaded a review of it! Excellent content as usual!!! Still prefer the concept of the Flair 58 though
They really dropped the ball on this. Even a cursory glance at other manual espresso machines on the market are indicative that people want a pressure gauge, a machine that’s temperature stable, and The ability to ramp up pressure as you see fit.(arguably the best part of a manual espresso machine is that you can create different profiles without having to shell out thousands of dollars on a machine equipped with a conical valve) how do they expect this to be competitive with machines like the flair 58? I swear a lot of these manual espresso companies need a way better r&d department
The flair 58 has a really large footprint. This machine can be mounted on the wall and has a small footprint. Personally I think you can do perfectly without the pressure gauge.
@@franswiersma8498 fair points! As far as not having a pressure gauge, of course we can all do well with enough practice. Having a manometer just allows for repeatability, and can keep people from wasting their beans trying to get into a certain pressure zone. The real dealbreaker for me is the low temperature and the inability to profile shots like a traditional lever. The robot, rotar, and a couple of other manual espresso machines have a much smaller footprint than the flare, are more competitively priced, and come with the bells and whistles that this doesn’t. If this machine existed in a vacuum I wouldn’t have as many complaints I am just disappointed by its shortcomings given the competitors can provide more at a reasonable price.
@@franswiersma8498 large? It isn't that large and if you live in a box i can understand it may be an issue. if this is really the USP for this device, it won't sell that many
Thanks Spro, I've been trying to find a good English review of this unit. Most of the videos I found are in Thai. And appreciated your including Celsius on your temp, useful for us who uses metric system.
I have a Superkop. It is so easy to handle, my wife and I almost fight over who pulls the espresso in the morning. As Sprometheus said Superkop produces an espresso great in taste and texture.
I love my Cafelat Robot for my work unit and for traveling. The wall mounted version of this sounded interesting, but the ratchet system was a turnoff. In my head, a wall mounted lever machine (Faema Velox or Streitman ES3), but it isn't necessary.
Looks like a completely redundant machine compared to the competition, I don’t understand the people who make these things, don’t they spend more than an hour researching before they finalise their idea? Blows my mind
First look and I thought it looked similar to the Argos by Odyssey which looks more promising compared to this, works as spring piston or direct lever. They're still working on first batch production so it remains to be seen if it will be a hit. In terms of what I look for in a manual, I'm kinda conflicted, I've got the Flair signature and the Robot. The Robot became my daily driver due to the capability of pulling bigger shots, was going to sell my Flair but I found that side by side, the Flair was pulling more flavourful shots, bringing out the fruity notes. I also found that it was easier to pull shots and mix up the pressure profiles with the Flair. In the end, I decided to keep them both. :)
Yeah, I think it doesn’t at first glance look more like a traditional spring driven lever, and I think that could make it perform a bit better. I have been in touch with Odyssey so I’m really looking forward to trying one of those in the coming months. Having used the Robot, Flair Pro, Rok, Flair 58, Kazak Rota, and now the Superkop the two I’ve kept is the Robot and Kazak. But I think the Kazak is still the best out there.
@@Sprometheus Hey Sprometheus, I know that in your Flair 58 vs Robot comparison you came down on the side of the Flair so I'm curious why you've kept the Robot over it. I love my Robot so I'm biased but I'm curious if your thoughts have changed or if it's just a loaner/logistics issue.
@@Sprometheus Cool, Looking forward to your review of the Argos. Yeah, I've seen your review of the Kazak, I definitely have to take your advice and try it one day. Thanks.
@@Sprometheus I eagerly await your review on the Argos. I pre-ordered mine early on, and have been waiting more than a year now. Worldwide pandemic and shipping/labor issue and manufacturing parts out of China certainly did not help timelines. But I think the owner/designer is really trying his best to work out as many kinks BEFORE releasing it into the world. It seems like he really is doing his best to produce the best machine possible. I eagerly await, and continue to use my PicoPresso in the meantime.
so basically you've got an overpriced manual espresso machine that doesn't show pressure, doesn't preheat itself, can't produce a consistant flow rate and also doesn't have high extraction. Who the hell is going to buy this overpriced heap?
I had a La Pavoni and never could get a decent cup of coffee from it. I ended up going to a "semi automatic" and prefer this to a (manual) machine that requires such a lot of input and adjustment.
Personally without feedback in terms of pressure reading and physical feedback I will never truly think it’s a great option. I tried a few over the years and Flair58 is by far the one I like the most of a home none/open boiler lever machines out there it’s by far the least faff free sub the Streitman CT2 and it’s convenience of being a 58mm should not be underestimated. The boiler lever are easier pulling multiple shots on but then these are more hefty on energy consumption, needs to be heated up, are more expensive and you have more like far more maintenance to do, like descaling boilers and pipes and far more fragile towards the water you use so you cannot experiment as much and tailoring the water for individual coffees.
I thoroughly enjoy your manual espresso videos. I have been using the Mypressi twist (I don't know if this counts as manual?) for 10 years to make my espresso at home. I was surprised that I could get good espresso with a non-pump mechanism (too bad the company doesn't exist anymore). This has been a great stepping stone until I have fully saved up for a pump espresso machine (which I also have been using your videos to help guide my future purchase so thanks again)!
I own a flair 58. One of the nicest features is that you can pump the remaining water out off the puck so it knocks out cleanly. It is a nice machine but electrical machines are much better to work with, especially if the have short warmup time , volumetric dosing and a large drip tray.
Most important in a lever machine is how fun it is. Second I appreciate that lever machines allow for a great shot at a lower price v automatic machines
I can see that from a few perspectives, and to be fair it does fall short for me on the few major things I want from a lever machine, but so does the Flair. For me it’s the Kazak Rota I reach for.
To add, if we see the mechanism of the ratchet and locked- with the locked part- the pressure is controlled to be consistent. The pull do not need the us to add or reduce any pressure force- it is all controlled by the grind size.
I’m just confused about pricing on manual machines. You get a product with fewer complicated parts but still pay the premium? Why not just get a quality electric machine?
No pressure gauge seems like a huge miss, but considering the pressure is not something you can regulate, probably not as big of a deal as it appears. If I understand the ratchet system the pressure for each cycle is probably consistent, with the only variable being the timing between steps. Still, a LOT of money for something that may or may not work for you.
Why cant these espresso machines make water chambers stainless steel or glass? Why do they not care about hot boiling water passing thru plastic? It leaches into the water… endocrine disruptor, cancer💀 so cheap
Interesting in a retro way. But I have the Breville Barista, beats the 9-11 bar pressure on the SuperKop at 15 bar, gives astonishingly great crema, and built in grinder is easy to clean and easy to adjust for different oiliness of beans. Oh yeah, and half the price. its nearly always on sale somewhere.
I can't help but think, if a customer is looking for an 'easy' espresso machine, a manual lever is probably the last thing they will look at... Good thing superkop got a stand and got rid off the wall mount though. That was a really bad idea.
i gotta say, i adore my flair because it fulfills what i need from an espresso machine: AFFORDABLE brews good coffee hugely controllable even to an amateur "maintenance" is basically just cleaning super compact on the countertop
I think the main advantages of manual are price and control. Even compared to something like the Decent; I have greater customization in what minerals I can use in the water with my flair 58. If I were to replace my flair 58 it would have to be something that gave me more options, maybe the ability to pull longer shots, better temperature control, or better pressure control.
I could see a use-case for a ratchet with *smaller steps* during the *continuous downward* pressing of a lever, to provide relief from fighting counter-pressure in the system. It would also be great to be able to flip the mechanism off, to feel the difference. (This machine has neither)
That is the Kazak Rota, I did a full review of it a little bit ago. It’s become a fast favorite of mine in terms of manual espresso. Checks all the boxes.
Thanks for sharing. You say that the result is tasty but not hot enough. Generally, what is the right temperature for a coffee (in the cup) to consider it hot ?
After years, I still love my ROK. It's been my first and only espresso machine, and when I do want that kind of coffee, it's quite good. I think for basically any manual machine, it's not the machine itself but the coffee, water, and grinder that mostly affect what's in the cup.
Hey Asa, it’s Bryan M. We Skateboarded for years through middle school and high school. Gene O told me about your channel and I figured I reach out to you. I have a channel as well that’s not nearly as well thought out as yours. I couldn’t figure if there was a way to directly message you, so to the comments section! If you happen to see this message, I’d be interested in catching up and seeing how life has been treating’ ya.
I've been obsessively researching premium manual espresso machines, and your channel has been a huge help. Thank you!
I know this video is old already, but I wanted to put what I'm looking for in a manual machine out into the void:
-58mm portafilter compatible with 3rd party accessories
-Decent sturdiness and build quality
-No electronics
-A workflow that strikes a good balance between high control and simplicity. I want a simple process that allows for customization and mistakes.
-Not cost more than the Flair 58
I recently reviewed the Sonic S7 which hits almost all of those, except price. I’d say the Flair 58x (the X has no electronics I believe) is still the best for what you mentioned.
This does have slightly “lifestyle” product vibes to it.
Looks well designed and made, seems like the mechanism is probably good for repeatability over minute pressure adjustments.. which for many people is totally fine
If this had a pressure gauge and single action lever pull this would be a great competitor to Flair. Aesthetics and build quality look amazing!
Exactly my thoughts, it is a shame because I love the design of this.
My main concern would be the seeming lack of any accurate means for temperature control, where a degree or two can make a huge difference in taste. Preheating that polycarbonate water container in hot water at a precise temperature, ditto the portafilter assembly? That would seem to be a bit of a PITA. And for a 2nd shot, wouldn't you have to go through the same preheating of components again for reproducibility? That sure would slow you down. On the flip side, the quality of construction looks very nice - likely reflected in that price tag.
Thorough and unbiased review!
for me - I like the idea of simple, manual shots. The more hands on, the more personal the experience. That said, I like and drink single origin, light/medium roasted coffee. I know that water temperature is as important to the shot as the correct pressure. The SuperKop for me would be a deal breaker because there is no way to control water temperature to the degree I find necessary. Also as you pointed out, the ratchet process does not quite give you the control of the pressure that I would expect to have during the shot production.
The manual machine has great lines, and a clean look, but the lofty price tag and before mentioned minuses makes the SuperKop a fail for me.
Manual is a nice way to make espresso as it gives that feedback. Agree this maker looks great. Could imagine this still working in 50 years time and still looking good.
I’ll stick to my Flair 58. Thank you.
Looks like a really simple elegant design. I wonder how well-built it is? Overall sturdiness, dual material design, metal with wood base? ☕️
using the superkop for several months now and no issues at all. Very well build piece of equipment
As always a great video 👍
Great video, one question, by manual machines you mean no electronics or manual levers? If no electronics then maybe this one is the most expensive, if manual levers, creminas and strietmans are the upper leve(r)l of pricing, worflow and quality.
Either way, great review, i enjoy your videos, keep on sproin`!
Thank you my friend! And yeah by manual I mean no electronics, fully hand driven.
Is it just me or is everyone trying to take on the flair and failing. Or getting something just as good for a lot more money
To me they join the trend of fighting against electric espresso machine which is a welcome.
I like the simplistic design and workflow of the machine.
I do agree on the price point though. This is more expensive compare to the Flair and of course the quality is only just as good? The quality is debatable
The design of this one is better than the Flair in my opinion
Would love to try the Flair58 someday as I have several 58mm portafilters from my previous machine. But since I got the Robot I’ve had no desire to buy anything else, it’s so good. Have you tried and compared the 58 with the Robot?
@@zero1451987 but you can’t pressure profile witch is a deal breaker for me. It’s so easy on the flair.
@@murraythebaker that is true
@@tomy2988 I only have the flair signature. Because I got one that was used once for £105 and never felt a need to upgrade.
Maybe it's me, but it seems like as soon as the Argos comes out all these companies are going to have real problems.
Honestly if it isnt doing some better than the flair in the cup....why buy it?? Lolol
The whole purpose for me is controllability…..no pressure gauge makes this less attractive
63 C ??? hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm......................
Sending pressurized boiling water through plastic...... yeah im good. They obviously have never heard of microplastics. Hard hard pass
There's no plastic coming off the walls friend 🤣
I can see the appeal of trying to make something easy, but that direct connection between input pressure and output pour is really at the heart of what I love about manual machines. Also, it's twice the price of my Robot, so not for me. It's a beautiful piece of industrial design though.
I’m with you, and I think there’s room in the market for more because I love to see the design and workflow choices made by folks who build them. In the end, they’ve definitely produced a beauty of a machine, but fell a little short of the competition with features and control. I’ll be interested to see if they catch on more, I believe they’re looking for more global distributors.
I really love the design approach with the metal lever machine in conjunction with the plastic water container above the portafilter. However I am a little bit disappointed that polycarbonate was used as the material for the water container. Polycarbonate has been banned from use in baby bottles due to it containing Bisphenol A (BPA), a substance on the candidate list of"substances of very high concern" by the European Chemicals Agency. Forgive me for quoting wikipedia: "The use of polycarbonate containers for the purpose of food storage is controversial. The basis of this controversy is their hydrolysis (degradation by water, often referred to as leaching) occurring at high temperature, releases bisphenol A." and "Studies have shown that at temperatures above 70 °C, and high humidity, polycarbonate will hydrolyze to bisphenol A (BPA)."
Nowadays, there are BPA-free polymere alternatives available on the market (e.g. Tritan). I do not understand why the engineers behind Superkop did not think about using them. Especially when using it with high temperature and humidity.
Cafelat robot still sweeps the floor if you're talking about a pure manual espresso machine. Great workflow, easy finish and no electronic parts to complicate workflow. Top notch shots, unless they are too lightly roasted.
I have this machine, and I love it. Its simple and when you dont care enought about the variables he pointed out, this one is perfect. I love the fact that you dont need to heat the whole machine up first (my bf has a Pavoni), it gives a very good espresso (had the aeropress before) and when my family comes to stay over, they can make their own espresso without me having to worry that they break anything or to many instructions haha. I would say I am a coffee lover and can distinguish a good espresso. ps. its not that big btw, I have the white one and looks beautiful in my marble beige wooden kitchen
It’s an interesting take on manual espresso but seems to be a bit of a miss.
My guess is that it’s the portafilter and basket that are causing thermal loss rather than the water chamber. Without a good way to heat the portafilter (like the flair 58) you’re going to lose a good amount of heat while brewing.
Yeah, the portafilter is a big hunk of metal, it does seem to sap some heat in the early shots, but does warm up and didn’t seem to be a huge sync after a proper warm up.
You could fill a bowl will boiling water and let it sit for a bit.
Looks interesting, but at $1099 Canadian bucks, I'm happy with my Flair58. If I didn't have the 58, I think I might have jumped on this. Great find, thanks!
Pressure gauge and direct control of the pressure, is the reason to buy a manual lever machine
Plus, the price is too high for that, i prefer Flair 58
Yeah I think the direct control of the pressure is the biggest downfall of the Superkop. It doesn’t seem to have a negative effect on the shot, but does hold back the user.
@@Sprometheus yes, as we saw, you don't have "start and stop" sindrome on your extraction, but definitely you don't have control
No pressure bar gauge available.
This plastic crapper is a deal-breaker for me.
The Cafelat Robot is still the best.
The size alone is definitely a deal breaker for most home bars, but if it was consistent enough, it would be awesome in a small cafe set up for a house blend once calibrated.
Additionally, thank you to the Superkop for me now dreaming of a plastic chamber for a Flair. 10/10 would make my workflow so much easier hahaha
I'd love a to try a manual espresso machine but 799 euros... Jesus Christ
That's 4 times the ROK EspressoGC, 2 times the Cafelac Robot and 1.5 times the Flair 58 which includes the pressure gauge this seems to be missing AND solves the whole water temperature issue. If I win the lottery one day, sure why not but I'd rather spend that amount of money on the other mentionned manual espresso machines + a good grinder instead. Pass
Just saw this machine on Instagram and was intrigued, and I discovered that you have just uploaded a review of it! Excellent content as usual!!!
Still prefer the concept of the Flair 58 though
The price of 800 Euro really makes this a hard sell imo. The flair 58 is a lot cheaper and does the same thing.
They really dropped the ball on this. Even a cursory glance at other manual espresso machines on the market are indicative that people want a pressure gauge, a machine that’s temperature stable, and The ability to ramp up pressure as you see fit.(arguably the best part of a manual espresso machine is that you can create different profiles without having to shell out thousands of dollars on a machine equipped with a conical valve) how do they expect this to be competitive with machines like the flair 58? I swear a lot of these manual espresso companies need a way better r&d department
The flair 58 has a really large footprint. This machine can be mounted on the wall and has a small footprint. Personally I think you can do perfectly without the pressure gauge.
@@franswiersma8498 fair points! As far as not having a pressure gauge, of course we can all do well with enough practice. Having a manometer just allows for repeatability, and can keep people from wasting their beans trying to get into a certain pressure zone. The real dealbreaker for me is the low temperature and the inability to profile shots like a traditional lever. The robot, rotar, and a couple of other manual espresso machines have a much smaller footprint than the flare, are more competitively priced, and come with the bells and whistles that this doesn’t. If this machine existed in a vacuum I wouldn’t have as many complaints I am just disappointed by its shortcomings given the competitors can provide more at a reasonable price.
@@franswiersma8498 large? It isn't that large and if you live in a box i can understand it may be an issue. if this is really the USP for this device, it won't sell that many
Who is the fake sprometheus?
Thanks Spro, I've been trying to find a good English review of this unit. Most of the videos I found are in Thai. And appreciated your including Celsius on your temp, useful for us who uses metric system.
Odyssey is releasing their manual machine for 800 and that has a gauge and a stramer 🙃
Yep, I’ve been in contact with them. Looking forward to trying one in the coming months.
I have a Superkop. It is so easy to handle, my wife and I almost fight over who pulls the espresso in the morning. As Sprometheus said Superkop produces an espresso great in taste and texture.
I love my Cafelat Robot for my work unit and for traveling. The wall mounted version of this sounded interesting, but the ratchet system was a turnoff. In my head, a wall mounted lever machine (Faema Velox or Streitman ES3), but it isn't necessary.
Looks like a completely redundant machine compared to the competition, I don’t understand the people who make these things, don’t they spend more than an hour researching before they finalise their idea? Blows my mind
May not be for everyone but I use it for mornings that I dun want to think and get a reliable coffee. Again- texture is good.🙏🙏🙏
First look and I thought it looked similar to the Argos by Odyssey which looks more promising compared to this, works as spring piston or direct lever. They're still working on first batch production so it remains to be seen if it will be a hit. In terms of what I look for in a manual, I'm kinda conflicted, I've got the Flair signature and the Robot. The Robot became my daily driver due to the capability of pulling bigger shots, was going to sell my Flair but I found that side by side, the Flair was pulling more flavourful shots, bringing out the fruity notes. I also found that it was easier to pull shots and mix up the pressure profiles with the Flair. In the end, I decided to keep them both. :)
Yeah, I think it doesn’t at first glance look more like a traditional spring driven lever, and I think that could make it perform a bit better. I have been in touch with Odyssey so I’m really looking forward to trying one of those in the coming months. Having used the Robot, Flair Pro, Rok, Flair 58, Kazak Rota, and now the Superkop the two I’ve kept is the Robot and Kazak. But I think the Kazak is still the best out there.
@@Sprometheus Hey Sprometheus, I know that in your Flair 58 vs Robot comparison you came down on the side of the Flair so I'm curious why you've kept the Robot over it. I love my Robot so I'm biased but I'm curious if your thoughts have changed or if it's just a loaner/logistics issue.
@@Sprometheus Cool, Looking forward to your review of the Argos. Yeah, I've seen your review of the Kazak, I definitely have to take your advice and try it one day. Thanks.
@@Sprometheus I eagerly await your review on the Argos. I pre-ordered mine early on, and have been waiting more than a year now. Worldwide pandemic and shipping/labor issue and manufacturing parts out of China certainly did not help timelines. But I think the owner/designer is really trying his best to work out as many kinks BEFORE releasing it into the world. It seems like he really is doing his best to produce the best machine possible. I eagerly await, and continue to use my PicoPresso in the meantime.
Oh, I forgot to mention, I liked Superkop so much, that I recently negotiated to become their distributor for Australia.
Just ordered one. Zero faff wins it for me. I don't care about pressure guages if the espresso is as good as the reviews say it is.
so basically you've got an overpriced manual espresso machine that doesn't show pressure, doesn't preheat itself, can't produce a consistant flow rate and also doesn't have high extraction. Who the hell is going to buy this overpriced heap?
I had a La Pavoni and never could get a decent cup of coffee from it. I ended up going to a "semi automatic" and prefer this to a (manual) machine that requires such a lot of input and adjustment.
although I'm not into levers or manual coffee devices I must say this is an insanely interesting machine !! it looks fabulous too
Yikes! Boiling water in toxic BPA leaching polycarbonate chamber ⁉️
They should make a version of the waterchamber with insulation trough aluminum
You lost me at a polycarbonate water chamber. That does not lend itself to being a heirloom piece.
Personally without feedback in terms of pressure reading and physical feedback I will never truly think it’s a great option. I tried a few over the years and Flair58 is by far the one I like the most of a home none/open boiler lever machines out there it’s by far the least faff free sub the Streitman CT2 and it’s convenience of being a 58mm should not be underestimated. The boiler lever are easier pulling multiple shots on but then these are more hefty on energy consumption, needs to be heated up, are more expensive and you have more like far more maintenance to do, like descaling boilers and pipes and far more fragile towards the water you use so you cannot experiment as much and tailoring the water for individual coffees.
I really like the idea of manual espresso machines, but we're going to need to engineer one into a bench press or squat rack with these prices. 😬
Polycarbonate comes in touch with hot water every time? 🤔
I thoroughly enjoy your manual espresso videos. I have been using the Mypressi twist (I don't know if this counts as manual?) for 10 years to make my espresso at home. I was surprised that I could get good espresso with a non-pump mechanism (too bad the company doesn't exist anymore). This has been a great stepping stone until I have fully saved up for a pump espresso machine (which I also have been using your videos to help guide my future purchase so thanks again)!
I own a flair 58. One of the nicest features is that you can pump the remaining water out off the puck so it knocks out cleanly. It is a nice machine but electrical machines are much better to work with, especially if the have short warmup time , volumetric dosing and a large drip tray.
Looks like a fantastic product 🙂 would love to give it a try at some point.
Most important in a lever machine is how fun it is. Second I appreciate that lever machines allow for a great shot at a lower price v automatic machines
Polycarbonate? Bisphenol?
Oh no!...
I don't see the point of getting this over any of the Flair's machine.
I can see that from a few perspectives, and to be fair it does fall short for me on the few major things I want from a lever machine, but so does the Flair. For me it’s the Kazak Rota I reach for.
@@Sprometheus Just watched your video about it. That thing looks like a piece of art
Expensive. Buy a gaggia for half
Robot 🤖 ftw!
I do like my Robot, but to be honest when I want manual espresso I reach for the Kazak Rota
@@Sprometheus can I ask why,? is that becasue Kazak Rota makes better espresso?
To add, if we see the mechanism of the ratchet and locked- with the locked part- the pressure is controlled to be consistent. The pull do not need the us to add or reduce any pressure force- it is all controlled by the grind size.
I’m just confused about pricing on manual machines. You get a product with fewer complicated parts but still pay the premium? Why not just get a quality electric machine?
I think it is the design I paying for it. I mean the engineering of it.
No pressure gauge seems like a huge miss, but considering the pressure is not something you can regulate, probably not as big of a deal as it appears. If I understand the ratchet system the pressure for each cycle is probably consistent, with the only variable being the timing between steps. Still, a LOT of money for something that may or may not work for you.
The Strietman CT2 manual lever espresso is actually $2800 USD (that's the most expensive one I know of)
Why cant these espresso machines make water chambers stainless steel or glass? Why do they not care about hot boiling water passing thru plastic? It leaches into the water… endocrine disruptor, cancer💀 so cheap
Interesting in a retro way. But I have the Breville Barista, beats the 9-11 bar pressure on the SuperKop at 15 bar, gives astonishingly great crema, and built in grinder is easy to clean and easy to adjust for different oiliness of beans. Oh yeah, and half the price. its nearly always on sale somewhere.
I can't help but think, if a customer is looking for an 'easy' espresso machine, a manual lever is probably the last thing they will look at... Good thing superkop got a stand and got rid off the wall mount though. That was a really bad idea.
i gotta say, i adore my flair because it fulfills what i need from an espresso machine:
AFFORDABLE
brews good coffee
hugely controllable even to an amateur
"maintenance" is basically just cleaning
super compact on the countertop
Yeah price point is a huge deal in manual espresso, it just seems like as it approaches an electric pump driven price it can be hard to justify.
@@Sprometheus we are lucky to live in an era where delicious coffee at home is so accessible
I think the main advantages of manual are price and control. Even compared to something like the Decent; I have greater customization in what minerals I can use in the water with my flair 58. If I were to replace my flair 58 it would have to be something that gave me more options, maybe the ability to pull longer shots, better temperature control, or better pressure control.
Thanks for your great reviews! Btw: what’s the name of that white coffee grinder next to the Superkop? Cheers!
I could see a use-case for a ratchet with *smaller steps* during the *continuous downward* pressing of a lever, to provide relief from fighting counter-pressure in the system. It would also be great to be able to flip the mechanism off, to feel the difference. (This machine has neither)
Lever machine with optional steam input to heat the group head. Steam can be generated using electricity, stove, sunshine, radioisotope whatever.
$x3...pass.
Superkop, meet the kop, that can't be stopped
Don't ever want to hassle with pre-heating, call me a Nomad..
Neat machine. Bummer it has a wooden base, I'd be worried about warping and wear etc as it is used more and more.
SUPER
KOP
SUPER
KOP
What is the machine shown at 5'56"?
That is the Kazak Rota, I did a full review of it a little bit ago. It’s become a fast favorite of mine in terms of manual espresso. Checks all the boxes.
☕☕☕
Love Is Important
☕️ ❤️
Thanks for sharing.
You say that the result is tasty but not hot enough.
Generally, what is the right temperature for a coffee (in the cup) to consider it hot ?
I'm guessing it was hot enough although if not you can still compensate by doing a longer pre infusion.
Cool idea, but I will keep my Robot.
Thank you my friend.
Of course, and thank you for watching! Cheers.
Thanks for reviewing 🙌🙌🙌
First
🥇
Thank you for the review
Thank you for this
Glowing
After years, I still love my ROK. It's been my first and only espresso machine, and when I do want that kind of coffee, it's quite good. I think for basically any manual machine, it's not the machine itself but the coffee, water, and grinder that mostly affect what's in the cup.
Same here! Proud lover of my ROK for years now. Their customer service has always been phenomenal as well.
@@_guillermo Owner of Rok here, the fact that you can upgrade old Rok to newer version is a huge plus.
No not really the case, temperature is a big deal and thus machines have an impact.
Hey Asa, it’s Bryan M. We Skateboarded for years through middle school and high school. Gene O told me about your channel and I figured I reach out to you. I have a channel as well that’s not nearly as well thought out as yours. I couldn’t figure if there was a way to directly message you, so to the comments section! If you happen to see this message, I’d be interested in catching up and seeing how life has been treating’ ya.
Given the price point, the surface finish of the machined parts looked sub par. No way I would pay that much for what it is.
Somewhat off subject. @sprometheus, could I get a list of your top five favorite coffee roasters? Thanks.
It's the Kop that's babe be stopped