4:32 - “Hey Ya” is actually even more complicated: you’ve cited an 18-beat progression (composite number or compound rhythm - divisible into 2 • 3 • 3), when “Hey Ya” actually uses 4/4 + 4/4 + *4/4* + 2/4 + 4/4 + 4/4, a 22-beat pattern (2 • [2 + 3]), mimicking the complex (prime) meter of 11/4 (“11/2”). It’s a 5.5-measure vamp, driving the whole song! And like in Bacharach’s song “Say a Little Prayer”, and the Italian song featured, the implied complex meters are nearly impossible to make completely smooth! It is a miracle of composition whenever something like “Hey Ya” comes about. Especially with such a big number like 11 (or 22). In 7/8, you can at least group into three “beats” - 2 + 2 + 3... in 5/4 you have the “Take Five” clave of 3 + 3 + 2 + 2. But in 11? In 13? In 22? You’re chunking together clumps of these elemental beats, and making a rhythm pizza. There’s a reason we almost always chunk them into composites of different-metered measures, whether it be “Say a Little Prayer” (occasional 10/4 and 11/4) or “March of the Pigs” (29/8), or even “Turn It on Again” (13/4, among others), which sounds like 6/4 + 7/4 in the chorus truly. But a song like “In Limbo” by Radiohead, in 18/8, simply sounds like its own meter because it works based on sextuple groupings. When you make it into prime or “complex” meters, they truly feel complex: like they are built out of the slabs of multiple rhythms strewn together. They always strike as ingenious when done right.
@@msfridrichmusic And thank you for subscribing to me! Sometimes I groan at my long-winded explanations lol. I love talking about it, now I’m learning how to truly do it.
As a drummer, I hear something different on the chorus of ``Wuthering Heights''. The drummer plays a simple kick on the downbeats 1 and 3 and snare on the upbeats 2 and 4, but then appends an extra quarter note on the kick. This happens twice, and then the chorus is rounded off with a bar of 2/4. So 5/4, 5/4, and 2/4! This is supported by the fact that the bass player seems -- at least to my untrained ear -- to land on stable notes at the beginning of each 5-beat phrase. Having said that, all elements of the composition contribute to the perception of the time signature, so Tommaso's view is supported by the vocal melody: If we count as he does, the naturally accented syllables of ``home'' and ``window'' land on the first downbeats of his measures. I just choose to hear her as drawing extra attention to those words by placing them on that fifth beat. I suppose notating time signatures is a holistic affair. (Interestingly, Bush said she could not get out of the chorus when she was writing it. This lends support to Tommaso's claim that such choruses trap us in a cycle with no clear beginning.)
Same here. Maybe it’s a drummer thing. Say, did you guys hear Say a Little Prayer like he notated it at the video (4/4 + 3/4 + 4/4) or in some other way? I always thought of it as a clear 4/4 + 4/4 + 3/4 because the third bar is where there’s a shift on the up beats and down beats.
Rush changed time signatures incredibly often in their songs. The way they managed to pull it off is real testament to their talent as musicians. RIP Neil Peart!
"Wuthering Heights" What follows is my interpretation of its time signatures. Intro : 4/4 x2 bars V 1 : 4/4 x6 bars 2/4 × 1 bar Pre - chorus 1 : 4/4 : 4/4 : 2/4 : 4/4 Chorus 1: 5/4 : 5/4 : 2/4 : 5/4 : 5/4 : 4/4 V 2 : repeat as for V 1 Pre - chorus 2 : repeat as for P C 1 Chorus 2 : 5/4 : 5/4 : 2/4 : 5/4 : 5/4 : 2/4 Bridge (or pre - outro) : 4/4 × 5 : 2/4 ×1 : 4/4 ×1 Outro chorus : repeat as for chorus 2 - x 6 cycles. Not so complex but very intelligent, enchanting and haunting song with a lot of paradoxes hidden inside it. Thank you Kate Bush and team! Thank you Tomasso !
Looks like im 2 years too late lol. I love your lessons my friend. You are the only teacher i have found that explains everything that i can understand. Im in two bands and one of them i will experiment with different time signatures. Watching your lessons have really sparked my creative juices. You are awesome brother!!
I'm no musician but this was in my recommended feed. It's a little hard to follow along as I don't know music structure but he presents this in a very interesting way and I can somewhat understand the points. Subbed, you made me think!
@@slimyfister it's a good idea. I actually have access to a guitar. Our state has ordered all non essentials to stay home and quarantine. Might as well see if there's any hope learning.
Errrrmmmm... so apparently I can count odd-time signatures, but I can't count the number of bars :-) That's a bit embarrassing... You're right Pantechnicon.
Very interesting regarding Wuthering Heights. After listening to it a few times I can see the arguments for a few different variations. 4/4 | 3/4 | 2/4 | 3/4 seems to work very nicely but I can also completely see why some people are suggesting 5/4 | 5/4 | 2/4. Personally however my preference is feeling the beat as a half time throughout the track with snares on the 3. The nice thing about this is you can then think of the chorus as this pattern: 4/4 | 4/4 | 2/4 | 4/4 4/4 | 2/4 | 4/4 To me personally this feels really good to groove to the track and everything matches up really nicely with drums, bass and vocals. I don't even need to think about counting for this version as it's all basically 4/4 with the occasional accent bar of 2/4 which makes it just click for me. YMMV of course!
I always love when the time signature of a song changes slightly! Some other examples I know of are Run by Joji, Stand by Sly and the Family Stone and People Make the World Go Round by the Stylistics.
Man, "Wuthering Heights" continues to amaze me. I didn't see that coming, but the moment I saw her face I thought, "Oh, of course she has level 5 and it's 'Wuthering Heights'".
I just wrote a song with changing time signatures - not deliberately, just out of complete rhythmic incompetence. Now I watched this video I'm hopeful it will be a smash hit! 😄
This makes me want revisit a couple songs my daughter wrote & recorded in straight 4/4, see if we can spice them up a bit! I think the first simple dropping a beat might work really well.
1:19 LMAO, this had me grabbing at the connection for my headphones immediately. Also, thanks for using an Outkast song as an example. This is hands down my favorite "rap" band ever. Although they're really more of a conglomeration of different genres like soul, R & B, rock, blues and even a touch of jazz imo. Also, as someone who easily gets songs stuck in their head anyway, ear worms are just mean. Please don't do this to me, lols. Just kidding... mostly.
"Rap" shouldn't be in quotation. Outkast (as well as Organized Noise who gave them their sound) were def many things, but they were rooted in Hip Hop and foremost a Hip Hop group. Hip Hop is an incredibly wide ranging genre. Ridiculously so haha...no need to diss 😋❤
Pete Townshend, Slit Skirts: verse in slow 4/4, channel fast 3/4, chorus fast 4/4. The key is the 12-beat fill transition to the chorus which you can choose to hear as either 4 bars of 3 or 3 bars of 4 (or both or neither).
12:42 I really wish you'd said "guitar playing" there so that it was: "Started by guitar players, for guitar players to teaching guitar players everything they need to know about guitar playing". 😀
Wow! Lots of information here. Almost too much to digest in 13 1/2 minutes. Fortunately, I seem to have a lot of time on my hands for music these days. One of your best videos from a songwriting perspective, and that's saying something. Thank you. And stay safe.
You're the "best" Tommaso (and I rarely use the word "best" for anything because it's just an opinion and even my own opinion on art is ever changing, at least subtly).
Happiness Is A Warm Gun has some crazy bars all through it...especially cool when Ringo keeps the plodding 2/4 in the 'chorus' for 9 bars, and the rest of them roll along in a waltz for 12 bars, then they all land together on beat 1 for the end. Awesome.
Well done and stimulating video! A thumb up for mentioning Elio e Le Storie Tese, they're super genius and they deserve to be known outside Italy too! About Wuthering Heights (an amazing song from an amazing artist) what I hear is 4/4 - 4/4 -2/4 - 4/4 - 4/4 - 2/4 - 4/4 at a speed of around 125 bpm. If the song is played at 62 bpm that would be 5/4 - 4/4 - 3/4 repeated. IMHO, but I tested on a DAW and both seem to work.
Storytime: When I was 16 I subbed for a pop-rock band on the drums, which at first it didn’t seem as much of a challenge. A 15 song pop-rock setlist? “Ok”, I thought. But oh boy, what was my surprise when I found this little rascal lerking in the middle of the set: Ghost of York - As Tall as Lions (ua-cam.com/video/4tEi4jQbvME/v-deo.html). The chorus is 4/4+4/4 + 4/4+3/4 + 4/4+2/4 (or 8/4 + 7/4 + 6/4, or 4/4 + 7/8 + 3/4 in half the tempo, it’s really to the taste of the customer lol). Basically, it feels every two bars, the song loses a beat compared to the previous two bars... or something like that, idk. At the time, metric modulation was completely new to me and it seemed like something Satan himself wrote as a personal punishment for my sins. It took me longer than I like to admit to figure out what was going on and learn the damn song.
Yours is quickly becoming my favourite channel on UA-cam. Cheers. Re: the Kate Bush song -- is it possible that the different instruments are playing in different time signatures that still line up? I think the drums are in that last one, but her vocals are in the 3rd one...
I hear it as you do because the distinguishing feature is the snare drum: 1 bar of 4/4 with the snare on beats 2 and 4; one bar of 3/4 with the snare on beat 3; one bar of 2/4 with the snare on beat 2; and one bar of 3/4 with the snare on beat 3; repeated twice. The only other possible patterns I can envisage are three bars long (4/4 + 5/4 + 3/4; or 4/4 + 3/4 + 5/4) or two bars lone (7/4 + 6/4); but that seems needlessly obtuse compared to 4/4 + 3/4 + 2/4 + 3/4.
5:53 ---- 1 beat in 4/4, that's one beat assigned to one quarter. one quarter is 2 eights. 4-1.5= 2.5; 2 quarters and an eight; that's... 4 eights+1 eight= 5 eights. 5/8. You're right! I thought it would be 6/8 for some reason (faulty brain!) I apologize for thinking you were wrong! :D Also 6:08 ---- 13/8, I would count that 1234/2234/3234/5; it would be veery impractical to count that song like this (especially since it's quite fast, a, and b, why would anyone start counting a measure prior to the exception anyways; and c.- it's very rare that I will count 8ths no matter what. Awesome channel, btw!
Checkout the song Down by Fuel which is on the Something Like Human album. It has a massive tempo change and groove change between the verse and chorus. The verse is a slow 70 bpm and the chorus is at 118 bpm. It's has an incredibly dramatic effect, but I'm sure it's tricky to pull off in a live context.
So about Wuthering Heights, I hear it clearly: 4/8 + 4/8 + 2/8 + 4/8 + 4/8 + 2/8 + 4/8 I guess it all depends on what you're focusing on in the song. Great video, thanks for the food for thought.
Yes! For this video I decided to go without Rush, Dream Theater and the like to show that changing time signature even in the chorus is not exclusive to prog music. But I do love my Rush and my DT :)
After the first couple tunes, I sort half expected Rush (one of only 2 favorite bands I've ever had) and Dream Theater (who I also love) to be missing from this video. Not even sure why I did, but after reading Tommaso's coment here, I understand the logic now.
Golden brown is 1,2,3 1,2,3 1,2,3 1,2,3,4 in the instrumental and 1,2,3 throughout the verses.So I guess for the instrumental you could count it as 6/8 7/8 but I think of it as 3/4 3/4 3/4 4/4 Which is kind of the same thing.It's just how it sits in your head.
Guilty by Barbra Streisand & Barry Gibb has two bars of 5 in the verses (or maybe 2+3) and then two bars of 3 in the choruses plus a bar of 2 in the outro choruses. Got to concentrate to play that song!
How about songs that are unusual in the verse and/or prechorus strictly to set up a greater feeling of groove once the chorus shows up in 4/4? :) I love your videos because you often address things that I find myself wondering about.
Thanks for the amazing content you provide us for free, we really appreciate it! I'm brazilian and I'd like to suggest you just a little correction in the portuguese title: "a assinatura do tempo" is wrong, use "o compasso" instead 😉
Great video! You did a video on the Tristan chord. It would be great if you would kindly do a 3 part video of one long one on the 3 Aug6 chords and there resolution. : ) I hope you will consider this.
Cardiacs' Jibber and Twitch has a chorus which changes the number of beats in a bar from 4 to 6, but the time it takes for the bar to be completed is the same. Somehow it actually works here
MusicTheoryForGuitar. It’s what I was taught in music theory and musicology. See Groves. Entry on Time also Rhythm and Time Signature. I have worked with many professional conductors such as Sir Charles Mackerras, Carlo Cillario, Hirouki Iwaki. Changes in rhythmic patterns in western music were often discussed in terms of rhythmic groupings. When discussing a complex score like Stravinsky’s Les Noces, references were made to time signatures not rhythmic modulation. ‘Modulation’ was used to discuss movement between key signatures. Things change, academic discourse changes. I was taught in the older tradition.
Other examples from beatles "Lucy in the sky of Diamonds" 3/4 verse and 4/4 chorus in a different tempo. "We can work it out" 4/4 and 3/4 chorus change.
im a drummer and with 'wuthering heights' i go: 4/4 1/4 4/4 3/4 and repeat, if you listen to the bass, it gets obvious that his weight is on the one of the full bars
It's strange, because I always thought Hey Ya adds half a measure or two beats instead of skipping it. Now I can hear it both ways in my head, but adding the beats makes much more sense to me. Also Wuthering Heights clearly is 5/4+5/4+2/4 then 5/4+5/4+4/4 ;)
Great video! As for the Kate Bush, two bars of 5/4, followed by one in 2/4 would be easy to notate and give the right accents, but I actually hear 4/4, 1/4, 4/4, 3/4
The drums in Wurthering Heights clearly suggest 4/4 3/4 2/4 3/4, but otherwise I hear the vocal melody and glockenspiel as being 4/4 3/8 4/8 3/8 4/8 2/8, or maybe it’s just that I haven’t slept. It’s probably that- in the morning I’ll wonder WTF I was thinking. I’m gonna have to come back to this when I’m sane… The 5/4 5/4 2/4 argument is compelling too tho
don't think lack of sleep is getting in the way, writing in multiple metres you usually end up slathering a load of other compounds on top with the other instruments to disguise the interrupted flow
Awesome video, thumbs up:) I did take a challenge, it was something like: 4/4 4/4 3/4 or 6/8 then 4/4 3/4 or 6/8 then 4/4 4/4 3/4 or 6/8, what do you think? I have focused not only on the drums but also on the strong accented notes of the bass guitar, Great video anyway :)
Yes in some cases (more so when one has already had previous teaching on the subject) but in this case it really doesn't work. I'm left unclear. The examples don't really stick out showing what you are teaching. and have more chances of getting learning it wrong. It would make a stronger impact seeing the time change and a bigger effect on learning the lesson and even see how we can implement in in our own music. Hopefully you can make the exception and add them. I'm sure we will appreciate learn from it even more.. I know I will. Thank you.
@@Collect-AI from a teacher's point of view it makes a stronger impact when the student does a little bit of their own work, one shouldn't have to give everything away as that makes for lazy students. he gave you the exact rhythmic scheme of a few seconds of music followed by the example. count the bass drum in the first video, the bass guitar in the second, and notice where the irregularity falls. there is nothing that sticks out more than a bass drum in a Joan Jett song, and the walking bassline in the ABBA song is also very pronounced. stick with it, you'll get it.
I agree to a certain degree and yes I'm coming from a teacher's point of view. I teach holistic therapies, eg clinical massage, fitness, yoga and other forms of therapies to beginners and to other therapists and instructors, and for fun, I also teach fundamental music theory. I think the lessons here are great! I'm even referring the channel to my students and peers. I'm simply giving this suggestion because it will help other students better grasp and learn this lesson and to help build your awesome channel. So yes, one shouldn't have to give everything away as that makes for lazy students. And yes the bass drum in a Joan Jett song and the walking bassline in ABBAs song helps a bit but, to be honest to the new and undeveloped ear it is not helpful since to them 4/4 - 4/4 - 4/4 - 3/4 isn't easy to pick up and if they are lucky maybe would sound like 15/4 which is still confusing. And like some of the comments below many are hearing something different and in many cases, even drummers are even flipping the measures around. So what's going on in the mind and ears of the new student? Our future musicians. A click track accenting on the 1's would even be helpful. It's not making anyone lazy it's guiding then to learn to listen (we need to start to walk before we run) in the right direction instead of having them lost wondering with no direction or worse learning it all wrong and creating bad habits which as I'm sure you know as a fellow teacher are difficult to get rid of in the long run. In the end, what's more important, is that the students are able to ingrain this knowledge write and not start off with bad habits because of confusion and not clearly understanding the material/lessons. This is simply to help and for the love of music.
Have you ever heard a song where each part plays a different rhythm simultaneously over a longer period? I’ve been fascinated with the concept. E.g. Bass plays 6 bars of 2/4, guitar plays 4 bars of 3/4, and drums play 3 bars of 4/4. Like something where it’s obvious they’re playing different rhythms but somehow it works. Is this even a thing or am I crazy?
where i find trouble is throwing it to the grid on say logic or protools. main reason i hate digitally recording. how many wrote a song counting? A good song that is.
Video is unusually sloppy for your normally excellent channel. 2:28- the chorus only "restarts early" in the coda; the real reason for the 3/4 is to get "me" to land on the downbeat. (Pink Floyd used this trick routinely) 4:35- That's not right, "Hey Ya" is 3 bars of 4 + one bar of 2 + two bars of 4 8:08- Feels a lot more like 4+5+2 than 4+3+4, based on the vocal phrasing 10:58- Missed opportunity to discuss all the ways one might count the patterns. Also, you don't mention the band or the song names. Level 6- Rush's "Limelight" which has 7 bars of 3/4 + 4 bars of 4/4, with a 3-chord pattern under it all
![What You Can Do With NEGATIVE HARMONY As A Composer [Music Theory]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/GdCFYTii1Gw/mqdefault.jpg)
Omggg when you said "To cut short the end of..." I was like wtf's wrong with my computer and then you said "see it works". Perfect!
i loved that part too ! :D
I download these videos to listen to later, and sometimes when I download videos, I don't get the full audio. That's what *I* thought happened.
4:32 - “Hey Ya” is actually even more complicated: you’ve cited an 18-beat progression (composite number or compound rhythm - divisible into 2 • 3 • 3), when “Hey Ya” actually uses 4/4 + 4/4 + *4/4* + 2/4 + 4/4 + 4/4, a 22-beat pattern (2 • [2 + 3]), mimicking the complex (prime) meter of 11/4 (“11/2”). It’s a 5.5-measure vamp, driving the whole song!
And like in Bacharach’s song “Say a Little Prayer”, and the Italian song featured, the implied complex meters are nearly impossible to make completely smooth! It is a miracle of composition whenever something like “Hey Ya” comes about. Especially with such a big number like 11 (or 22). In 7/8, you can at least group into three “beats” - 2 + 2 + 3... in 5/4 you have the “Take Five” clave of 3 + 3 + 2 + 2. But in 11? In 13? In 22? You’re chunking together clumps of these elemental beats, and making a rhythm pizza.
There’s a reason we almost always chunk them into composites of different-metered measures, whether it be “Say a Little Prayer” (occasional 10/4 and 11/4) or “March of the Pigs” (29/8), or even “Turn It on Again” (13/4, among others), which sounds like 6/4 + 7/4 in the chorus truly. But a song like “In Limbo” by Radiohead, in 18/8, simply sounds like its own meter because it works based on sextuple groupings.
When you make it into prime or “complex” meters, they truly feel complex: like they are built out of the slabs of multiple rhythms strewn together. They always strike as ingenious when done right.
thank you for your comment!! I didn't think he explained the "hey ya" chorus accurately and was like WTH?
@@msfridrichmusic And thank you for subscribing to me! Sometimes I groan at my long-winded explanations lol. I love talking about it, now I’m learning how to truly do it.
As a drummer, I hear something different on the chorus of ``Wuthering Heights''. The drummer plays a simple kick on the downbeats 1 and 3 and snare on the upbeats 2 and 4, but then appends an extra quarter note on the kick. This happens twice, and then the chorus is rounded off with a bar of 2/4. So 5/4, 5/4, and 2/4! This is supported by the fact that the bass player seems -- at least to my untrained ear -- to land on stable notes at the beginning of each 5-beat phrase. Having said that, all elements of the composition contribute to the perception of the time signature, so Tommaso's view is supported by the vocal melody: If we count as he does, the naturally accented syllables of ``home'' and ``window'' land on the first downbeats of his measures. I just choose to hear her as drawing extra attention to those words by placing them on that fifth beat. I suppose notating time signatures is a holistic affair. (Interestingly, Bush said she could not get out of the chorus when she was writing it. This lends support to Tommaso's claim that such choruses trap us in a cycle with no clear beginning.)
That's VERY interesting, thank you Henry!
5/4 5/4 2/4 for me too !
also hear this
I hear a distinct 5/4 + 4/4 + 3/4
Same here. Maybe it’s a drummer thing. Say, did you guys hear Say a Little Prayer like he notated it at the video (4/4 + 3/4 + 4/4) or in some other way? I always thought of it as a clear 4/4 + 4/4 + 3/4 because the third bar is where there’s a shift on the up beats and down beats.
Rush changed time signatures incredibly often in their songs. The way they managed to pull it off is real testament to their talent as musicians. RIP Neil Peart!
I love Rush=I like Dream Theater=I love ''The Dance of Eternity''
"Wuthering Heights"
What follows is my interpretation of its time signatures.
Intro : 4/4 x2 bars
V 1 : 4/4 x6 bars 2/4 × 1 bar
Pre - chorus 1 : 4/4 : 4/4 : 2/4 : 4/4
Chorus 1: 5/4 : 5/4 : 2/4 : 5/4 : 5/4 : 4/4
V 2 : repeat as for V 1
Pre - chorus 2 : repeat as for P C 1
Chorus 2 : 5/4 : 5/4 : 2/4 : 5/4 : 5/4 : 2/4
Bridge (or pre - outro) :
4/4 × 5 : 2/4 ×1 : 4/4 ×1
Outro chorus : repeat as for chorus 2 - x 6 cycles.
Not so complex but very intelligent, enchanting and haunting song with a lot of paradoxes hidden inside it. Thank you Kate Bush and team! Thank you Tomasso !
Looks like im 2 years too late lol. I love your lessons my friend. You are the only teacher i have found that explains everything that i can understand. Im in two bands and one of them i will experiment with different time signatures. Watching your lessons have really sparked my creative juices. You are awesome brother!!
I'm no musician but this was in my recommended feed. It's a little hard to follow along as I don't know music structure but he presents this in a very interesting way and I can somewhat understand the points. Subbed, you made me think!
Glad to hear this :)
You've been chosen son! no better time than a quarantine to grab a DAW or an instrument
@@slimyfister it's a good idea. I actually have access to a guitar. Our state has ordered all non essentials to stay home and quarantine. Might as well see if there's any hope learning.
@@olliefoxx7165 There will never (hopefully) be another occasion like that to learn to play guitar. Go for it!
@Ollie Foxx : If you do, I am slightly envious in a way. To be starting out on such a great adventure once again.
“Hey ya” is actually 3 bars of 4, then 1 bar of 2, and another 2 bars of 4, isn’t it?
Errrrmmmm... so apparently I can count odd-time signatures, but I can't count the number of bars :-) That's a bit embarrassing... You're right Pantechnicon.
But you have THE best opening line on YT! “Hello internets...” Brilliant.
When hey ya Came out, every DJ in the world cried out at once.
My apologies for making a wrong assumption. :/
MusicTheoryForGuitar 4 bars of 4, 1 bar of 6.
= 22.
22/2 = 11. Hey ya is in 11.
Very interesting regarding Wuthering Heights. After listening to it a few times I can see the arguments for a few different variations. 4/4 | 3/4 | 2/4 | 3/4 seems to work very nicely but I can also completely see why some people are suggesting 5/4 | 5/4 | 2/4.
Personally however my preference is feeling the beat as a half time throughout the track with snares on the 3. The nice thing about this is you can then think of the chorus as this pattern:
4/4 | 4/4 | 2/4 | 4/4
4/4 | 2/4 | 4/4
To me personally this feels really good to groove to the track and everything matches up really nicely with drums, bass and vocals. I don't even need to think about counting for this version as it's all basically 4/4 with the occasional accent bar of 2/4 which makes it just click for me. YMMV of course!
I felt 5 5 2 when listening to the drums, but I can see how the accents in the vocals lean more towards 4 3 2 3
I always love when the time signature of a song changes slightly! Some other examples I know of are Run by Joji, Stand by Sly and the Family Stone and People Make the World Go Round by the Stylistics.
Easy by The Commodores, too.
This is an excellent video. Well done, sir!
Killed it with the lyrics analysis
Man, "Wuthering Heights" continues to amaze me. I didn't see that coming, but the moment I saw her face I thought, "Oh, of course she has level 5 and it's 'Wuthering Heights'".
I just wrote a song with changing time signatures - not deliberately, just out of complete rhythmic incompetence. Now I watched this video I'm hopeful it will be a smash hit! 😄
This makes me want revisit a couple songs my daughter wrote & recorded in straight 4/4, see if we can spice them up a bit! I think the first simple dropping a beat might work really well.
Alan Merrill died from Covid-19 last night. He wrote "I love Rock and Roll".
Yes, I've heard. Sad news.
And today the guy who wrote “Stacey’s Mum” died.
R.I.P. to both of them.
RIP 🙏
Wuthering Heights, I count 2 bars of 4/4, one bar of 2/4. And loop again. Snare then falls on each "3".
That's how I hear it too.
It would be 10/4 then
This really interested me in writing in unusual rhythms - great job!
Great video; Thanks so much! I was studying two of us of the Beatles and wanted to understand this better. Now is much better
1:19 LMAO, this had me grabbing at the connection for my headphones immediately.
Also, thanks for using an Outkast song as an example. This is hands down my favorite "rap" band ever. Although they're really more of a conglomeration of different genres like soul, R & B, rock, blues and even a touch of jazz imo.
Also, as someone who easily gets songs stuck in their head anyway, ear worms are just mean. Please don't do this to me, lols.
Just kidding... mostly.
The bouzouki is such a good-sounding instrument...
"Rap" shouldn't be in quotation. Outkast (as well as Organized Noise who gave them their sound) were def many things, but they were rooted in Hip Hop and foremost a Hip Hop group. Hip Hop is an incredibly wide ranging genre. Ridiculously so haha...no need to diss 😋❤
Thanks for the ideas and knowledge!
I've been accused in my early days of cheerful, moving songs with depressing lyrics.
When they accuse you of something, most likely they do it because it's good stuff. Keep doing it ;)
@@MusicTheoryForGuitar I'll accept that theory. :)
Great video with amazing content. Rhythm modulations are not discussed very often....
WHOA!!! Great video, Tommaso!! I love it!!! :)
Glad you liked it!!
What a great video! Thank you for posting this!
The 4th example for Wuthering Heights is what I hear, too.
Rah rah ;-)
Pete Townshend, Slit Skirts: verse in slow 4/4, channel fast 3/4, chorus fast 4/4. The key is the 12-beat fill transition to the chorus which you can choose to hear as either 4 bars of 3 or 3 bars of 4 (or both or neither).
Tomaso.. one word.. AWESOME!
grazie
This was super fun, I'd love to see more examples!
for me Kate bush song is 4 4 2 4 4 2 4 this are the accents, however great contents as always very ispiring.
That was very intuitive and educational, thank you.
Glad you enjoyed it!
12:42 I really wish you'd said "guitar playing" there so that it was: "Started by guitar players, for guitar players to teaching guitar players everything they need to know about guitar playing". 😀
Wow! Lots of information here. Almost too much to digest in 13 1/2 minutes. Fortunately, I seem to have a lot of time on my hands for music these days. One of your best videos from a songwriting perspective, and that's saying something. Thank you. And stay safe.
Just love your videos,
Thank you for sharing your vast knowledge.
My pleasure!
You're the "best" Tommaso (and I rarely use the word "best" for anything because it's just an opinion and even my own opinion on art is ever changing, at least subtly).
You speak music!! No more words!! 😊👍🏻
😊 thank you
MusicTheoryForGuitar, keep up the good work sir. 😊👍🏻
Mindy Smith - Take Me Back Chorus | 5/4 + 6/4 + 5/4 + 6/4 + 5/4 +6/4 + 3/4
Happiness Is A Warm Gun has some crazy bars all through it...especially cool when Ringo keeps the plodding 2/4 in the 'chorus' for 9 bars, and the rest of them roll along in a waltz for 12 bars, then they all land together on beat 1 for the end. Awesome.
Bravo! Great examples!
Well done and stimulating video! A thumb up for mentioning Elio e Le Storie Tese, they're super genius and they deserve to be known outside Italy too!
About Wuthering Heights (an amazing song from an amazing artist) what I hear is 4/4 - 4/4 -2/4 - 4/4 - 4/4 - 2/4 - 4/4 at a speed of around 125 bpm. If the song is played at 62 bpm that would be 5/4 - 4/4 - 3/4 repeated. IMHO, but I tested on a DAW and both seem to work.
I think it's pretty obvious that it's 4 4 2 4 4 2 4, just listen to the snare, it's playing at 3 every time, except on the 2/4 bar...
@@flyingsteaks yes, so it seems to me
Storytime: When I was 16 I subbed for a pop-rock band on the drums, which at first it didn’t seem as much of a challenge. A 15 song pop-rock setlist? “Ok”, I thought.
But oh boy, what was my surprise when I found this little rascal lerking in the middle of the set: Ghost of York - As Tall as Lions (ua-cam.com/video/4tEi4jQbvME/v-deo.html).
The chorus is 4/4+4/4 + 4/4+3/4 + 4/4+2/4 (or 8/4 + 7/4 + 6/4, or 4/4 + 7/8 + 3/4 in half the tempo, it’s really to the taste of the customer lol). Basically, it feels every two bars, the song loses a beat compared to the previous two bars... or something like that, idk.
At the time, metric modulation was completely new to me and it seemed like something Satan himself wrote as a personal punishment for my sins. It took me longer than I like to admit to figure out what was going on and learn the damn song.
Yours is quickly becoming my favourite channel on UA-cam. Cheers. Re: the Kate Bush song -- is it possible that the different instruments are playing in different time signatures that still line up? I think the drums are in that last one, but her vocals are in the 3rd one...
Great video and explanation, thanks!
I hear it as you do because the distinguishing feature is the snare drum: 1 bar of 4/4 with the snare on beats 2 and 4; one bar of 3/4 with the snare on beat 3; one bar of 2/4 with the snare on beat 2; and one bar of 3/4 with the snare on beat 3; repeated twice. The only other possible patterns I can envisage are three bars long (4/4 + 5/4 + 3/4; or 4/4 + 3/4 + 5/4) or two bars lone (7/4 + 6/4); but that seems needlessly obtuse compared to 4/4 + 3/4 + 2/4 + 3/4.
Thanks for the video Tommaso! :)
Tommmaso, again so great 😃👍
I love your lessons ❤️
Stay healthy!
EDIT: listening to the Kate Bush song simply made me crazy without any result ... 😜
Kate Bush will do that to you :)
MusicTheoryForGuitar hehe, that would be the reason instead of my musical incompetence ... 😉
5:53 ---- 1 beat in 4/4, that's one beat assigned to one quarter. one quarter is 2 eights. 4-1.5= 2.5; 2 quarters and an eight; that's... 4 eights+1 eight= 5 eights. 5/8. You're right! I thought it would be 6/8 for some reason (faulty brain!) I apologize for thinking you were wrong! :D
Also 6:08 ---- 13/8, I would count that 1234/2234/3234/5; it would be veery impractical to count that song like this (especially since it's quite fast, a, and b, why would anyone start counting a measure prior to the exception anyways; and c.- it's very rare that I will count 8ths no matter what.
Awesome channel, btw!
Thanks for this lesson my friend. Throughly enjoyed it 🙂
Glad to hear it!
Checkout the song Down by Fuel which is on the Something Like Human album. It has a massive tempo change and groove change between the verse and chorus. The verse is a slow 70 bpm and the chorus is at 118 bpm. It's has an incredibly dramatic effect, but I'm sure it's tricky to pull off in a live context.
Two words: Gentle Giant. Not at all uncommon for them to have multiple signatures at once -- polyrhythms all over. God I love them.
So about Wuthering Heights, I hear it clearly: 4/8 + 4/8 + 2/8 + 4/8 + 4/8 + 2/8 + 4/8 I guess it all depends on what you're focusing on in the song. Great video, thanks for the food for thought.
Un placer tenerte maestro
I saw Kate Bush, listened briefly to some explanations and fast forwarded to, "Wuthering Heights".
Brilliant 👌🤘
Thanks
Listen to the time changes in the song Chain Lightning by RUSH from the Presto album. It’s interesting.
Yes! For this video I decided to go without Rush, Dream Theater and the like to show that changing time signature even in the chorus is not exclusive to prog music. But I do love my Rush and my DT :)
After the first couple tunes, I sort half expected Rush (one of only 2 favorite bands I've ever had) and Dream Theater (who I also love) to be missing from this video. Not even sure why I did, but after reading Tommaso's coment here, I understand the logic now.
"Golden Brown" by The Stranglers has some extra beats in the instrumental parts. Maybe 6/8 to 7/8?
Golden brown is 1,2,3 1,2,3 1,2,3 1,2,3,4 in the instrumental and 1,2,3 throughout the verses.So I guess for the instrumental you could count it as 6/8 7/8 but I think of it as 3/4 3/4 3/4 4/4 Which is kind of the same thing.It's just how it sits in your head.
Yes! Some call it 13/8... but that’s a giant number to chunk.
@@johnbanjo5772 I think it's better to count it as 3 measures of 6/8 and one of 7/8
You are fantasticteacher
Big fun Tommaso. You stay healthy!
Genesis 'Turn It On Again'. It's all over the place but still flows like it's 4/4.
Great video! Keep them coming!
Thanks! Will do!
Free will by rush has a bar of 3/4 in the 4/4 chorus
I hear wuthering heights as 4/8, 4/8, 2/8, 4/8, 4/8, 2/8, 4/8 :II That is also how the drums play.
A great example is Solsbury Hill from Peter Gabriel. 7/4 metric at end of chorus is 4/4.
10:10 when the drums start, counting with the high-hat and guided by the bass and voice, I hear an obvious 4 4 2 4 4 2 4 4 4 2 4 4 2 4..end
Guilty by Barbra Streisand & Barry Gibb has two bars of 5 in the verses (or maybe 2+3) and then two bars of 3 in the choruses plus a bar of 2 in the outro choruses. Got to concentrate to play that song!
A couple of really good Buffalo Springfield songs do this. They go waltzing in the chorus...or the verse. I'm too tired to check.
How about songs that are unusual in the verse and/or prechorus strictly to set up a greater feeling of groove once the chorus shows up in 4/4? :)
I love your videos because you often address things that I find myself wondering about.
Thanks for the amazing content you provide us for free, we really appreciate it!
I'm brazilian and I'd like to suggest you just a little correction in the portuguese title: "a assinatura do tempo" is wrong, use "o compasso" instead 😉
I love this video
Great video! You did a video on the Tristan chord. It would be great if you would kindly do a 3 part video of one long one on the 3 Aug6 chords and there resolution. : ) I hope you will consider this.
Cardiacs' Jibber and Twitch has a chorus which changes the number of beats in a bar from 4 to 6, but the time it takes for the bar to be completed is the same. Somehow it actually works here
This isn’t rhythm modulation. It’s time signature changes. Rhythms exist within time signatures. Or totally without time signatures.
You may be right. Source?
MusicTheoryForGuitar. It’s what I was taught in music theory and musicology. See Groves. Entry on Time also Rhythm and Time Signature. I have worked with many professional conductors such as Sir Charles Mackerras, Carlo Cillario, Hirouki Iwaki. Changes in rhythmic patterns in western music were often discussed in terms of rhythmic groupings. When discussing a complex score like Stravinsky’s Les Noces, references were made to time signatures not rhythmic modulation. ‘Modulation’ was used to discuss movement between key signatures. Things change, academic discourse changes. I was taught in the older tradition.
Great Video,Again 🤘👌💪
Thanks again!
Other examples from beatles "Lucy in the sky of Diamonds" 3/4 verse and 4/4 chorus in a different tempo. "We can work it out" 4/4 and 3/4 chorus change.
im a drummer and with 'wuthering heights' i go: 4/4 1/4 4/4 3/4 and repeat, if you listen to the bass, it gets obvious that his weight is on the one of the full bars
I've been looking for an example of verse in 4/4, ENTIRE CHORUS in 3/4, then back to 4/4 for the verse.
"The house jack built" by Metallica? Not 100% sure, so check if it's what you want
@@MusicTheoryForGuitar thx so much! Checking it out.
"Death and All His Friends" is a fun example, with verses in 4|4 and the chorus sneaking into 7|4
Isn't the metric in Hey Ya always like this in the entire song?
Check out "cheques" from L.Spinetta. in the instrumental chorus they skip half beat
It's strange, because I always thought Hey Ya adds half a measure or two beats instead of skipping it. Now I can hear it both ways in my head, but adding the beats makes much more sense to me.
Also Wuthering Heights clearly is 5/4+5/4+2/4 then 5/4+5/4+4/4 ;)
Great video! As for the Kate Bush, two bars of 5/4, followed by one in 2/4 would be easy to notate and give the right accents, but I actually hear 4/4, 1/4, 4/4, 3/4
The drums in Wurthering Heights clearly suggest 4/4 3/4 2/4 3/4, but otherwise I hear the vocal melody and glockenspiel as being 4/4 3/8 4/8 3/8 4/8 2/8, or maybe it’s just that I haven’t slept. It’s probably that- in the morning I’ll wonder WTF I was thinking. I’m gonna have to come back to this when I’m sane…
The 5/4 5/4 2/4 argument is compelling too tho
don't think lack of sleep is getting in the way, writing in multiple metres you usually end up slathering a load of other compounds on top with the other instruments to disguise the interrupted flow
Awesome video, thumbs up:) I did take a challenge, it was something like: 4/4 4/4 3/4 or 6/8 then 4/4 3/4 or 6/8 then 4/4 4/4 3/4 or 6/8, what do you think? I have focused not only on the drums but also on the strong accented notes of the bass guitar, Great video anyway :)
For me, "Wuthering Heights" chorus seems to have a 4-4-2-4-2-2-2-4 beats structure.
Although as always this is really great it would be even better if you display the time signatures on the videos/examples as they are playing.
I made the precise choice to not do that. I think people learn more if you present them with a little challenge. Just my opinion of course.
Yes in some cases (more so when one has already had previous teaching on the subject) but in this case it really doesn't work. I'm left unclear. The examples don't really stick out showing what you are teaching. and have more chances of getting learning it wrong.
It would make a stronger impact seeing the time change and a bigger effect on learning the lesson and even see how we can implement in in our own music. Hopefully you can make the exception and add them. I'm sure we will appreciate learn from it even more.. I know I will. Thank you.
@@Collect-AI from a teacher's point of view it makes a stronger impact when the student does a little bit of their own work, one shouldn't have to give everything away as that makes for lazy students. he gave you the exact rhythmic scheme of a few seconds of music followed by the example. count the bass drum in the first video, the bass guitar in the second, and notice where the irregularity falls. there is nothing that sticks out more than a bass drum in a Joan Jett song, and the walking bassline in the ABBA song is also very pronounced. stick with it, you'll get it.
I agree to a certain degree and yes I'm coming from a teacher's point of view. I teach holistic therapies, eg clinical massage, fitness, yoga and other forms of therapies to beginners and to other therapists and instructors, and for fun, I also teach fundamental music theory. I think the lessons here are great! I'm even referring the channel to my students and peers. I'm simply giving this suggestion because it will help other students better grasp and learn this lesson and to help build your awesome channel.
So yes, one shouldn't have to give everything away as that makes for lazy students. And yes the bass drum in a Joan Jett song and the walking bassline in ABBAs song helps a bit but, to be honest to the new and undeveloped ear it is not helpful since to them 4/4 - 4/4 - 4/4 - 3/4 isn't easy to pick up and if they are lucky maybe would sound like 15/4 which is still confusing. And like some of the comments below many are hearing something different and in many cases, even drummers are even flipping the measures around. So what's going on in the mind and ears of the new student? Our future musicians.
A click track accenting on the 1's would even be helpful. It's not making anyone lazy it's guiding then to learn to listen (we need to start to walk before we run) in the right direction instead of having them lost wondering with no direction or worse learning it all wrong and creating bad habits which as I'm sure you know as a fellow teacher are difficult to get rid of in the long run.
In the end, what's more important, is that the students are able to ingrain this knowledge write and not start off with bad habits because of confusion and not clearly understanding the material/lessons. This is simply to help and for the love of music.
@@Collect-AI Damn dawg why don't you write a novel next time?
Have a listen to Hold On by YES
thanks for this Tommaso, time to make some earworms
Have you ever heard a song where each part plays a different rhythm simultaneously over a longer period? I’ve been fascinated with the concept. E.g. Bass plays 6 bars of 2/4, guitar plays 4 bars of 3/4, and drums play 3 bars of 4/4. Like something where it’s obvious they’re playing different rhythms but somehow it works.
Is this even a thing or am I crazy?
It is a thing, it's called "polymeter". Bands like Meshuggah do it in several songs.
Helium and the Tense Stories
I wish I could hear the one best or 2 beat missing.. should I be listening for the drum or the instruments?
30 centimetri di dimensione artistica
12 inches is 1 foot...
o mio dio Elio e le storie tese😍
Non potevo non citarli :)
I hear it as 1 2 *3* 4, 1 2 *3* 4, 1 2 *3* 4. Three bars of 4/4 with emphasis on the 3rd beat of each bar.
Where’s Them Bones from Alice In Chains?
where i find trouble is throwing it to the grid on say logic or protools. main reason i hate digitally recording. how many wrote a song counting? A good song that is.
One of my favorites has gotta be Take Me Out by Franz Ferdinand
What is the difference, if any, between a chorus, a bridge and a middle eight?
Video is unusually sloppy for your normally excellent channel.
2:28- the chorus only "restarts early" in the coda; the real reason for the 3/4 is to get "me" to land on the downbeat. (Pink Floyd used this trick routinely)
4:35- That's not right, "Hey Ya" is 3 bars of 4 + one bar of 2 + two bars of 4
8:08- Feels a lot more like 4+5+2 than 4+3+4, based on the vocal phrasing
10:58- Missed opportunity to discuss all the ways one might count the patterns. Also, you don't mention the band or the song names.
Level 6- Rush's "Limelight" which has 7 bars of 3/4 + 4 bars of 4/4, with a 3-chord pattern under it all
Rush - Limelight. Starts in 3/4 and ends in 4/4.
A better example of an extra beat is "Superfreak", they add an extra beat at the end.
At the last one I hear the chorus 4/4 + 4/4 + 2/4 + 4/4 + 4/4 + 2/4 + 4/4.
Or you can divide all that by 2 e listen only de kick. Than you’ll get 5/4 + 5/4 + 2/4
Hey, just wanted to know about if the song is 4/4 but the chorus is 6/6... Will it be still symmetrical?