Great comparison Jon. We went with the MX123. You will not notice the 4db s/n value. Ours is whisper quiet while playing soft notes with the DAC performance outstanding . Native DSD support is a must as we play hours of SACD’s. Auro 3D $elected for ANY source, whether Atmos, DTS:X, or even Redbook CD playing is heads and tails above the other formats. You will never go back after using this immersive audio encoding. We have a 13.2 system vid posted using Carver, Sunfire, and McIntosh power. Hopefully you can check it out to aid in your decision. Again tremendous research on your part my friend.
Jack - it seems McIntosh has clearly added value to the Marantz based design. While functionally the Marantz components and software provide the rich feature set, the McIntosh upgraded circuit such as power supply etc improve the overall output quality.-Jon
Great series and looking forward to the 10k+ lineup! I just recently discovered your channel, but already love the videos and content that you make. 😊 I'm a big fan of making lists like this for myself and comparing different components, be it audio gear, computer hardware or really anything that can be compared in an subjective manner by data. One often frustrating aspect of it, is the fact that data is often missing and different from manufacturer to manufacturer that makes it harder to fully compare unit to unit (as I see that you also have discovered). For this reason, I hope to one day be able to purchase a big amount of devices to measure them an publish the date to make it easier for everyone to make informed decisions🙂 I hope that you gain a big following on this platform and with that, gain the opportunity to compare more units yourself with physical access to them. With a big enough following, a good amount of manufacturers are probably going to be willing to provide you with their devices for review purposes. Keep on talking and shine a light on specs and features, the more it's talked about, the better. If it gets enough attention, manufacturers will have to get better at providing it 😊 Have you taught about making your personal database into a interactive website with the option to apply filters for people to sort through all the processors to easily find what they are looking for? I think the HT community would love something like that! If it gained some traction, it would probably get easier to get more direct info from the different manufacturers to fill in the blank spots on the lists. Wish you the best! -Tim
Tim - thanks so much for that inspiring message. At times I wonder if a different approach would reach a wider audience. However, I feel that I can afford to deliver content for a more niche community as I don’t rely on this channel for income. With that said, the more that subscribe the more companies that will find value in sending demo units for review. The key is to attract suppliers while maintaining the integrity of the review. That is possible and is my aim. I like your concept of posting the database. Public access will also help keep the data update to date will all the latest values as a crowd sourced resource. Again your feedback is appreciated and gives me added energy to press on.-Jon
Jon - another very nicely done video. Continued KUDOS to you, sir! Just one quick note about the volume control....no, the ACURUS MUSE does not have a physical "knob" on the unit, but right there on the on-screen display (which you seem to really like) is the volume up/down options readily available. Looking forward to your next video.
I appreciate your kind words as always and the sensible explanations you provide on the Muse. The digital volume controls is one of those items I just may grow to accept if I were to live with for a while. The key is to be responsive during those emergency situations.
Also congratulations on having a product which I feel is deserving of attention and the praise we delivered in this series which speak to its merits.-Jon
Another great vid! I'm funneling down toward a McIntosh or Anthem, but leaning McIntosh because I grew up in a house with a Marantz 4300 from the early 1970s so I am fond of the legacy look. If I find a place to check out the muse in real life, it could end up on my short list. I don't love the display in the Anthem, if it was as slick as it looks in the marketing pics, or as good as the muse, I'd be more on board there. If you are going to go with a large display, it better be good, otherwise I am happier with an old school 2 line display like what McIntosh uses, because it isn't even trying to be fresh - it is what it is. The muse sets the standard on display and touch UX though.
Thomas - that Marantz 4300 is something special. Not only does it have the best design of any Marantz, it is a quadradial model for early 4-channel playback. I have a similar affinity for Marantz growing up with a 2275 - which does not directly support quadraphonics so you have me beat. Yes - difficult choices - cosmetically I think the McIntosh will outlive the Anthem.-Jon
Great Vedio! Now I planing to upgrading my Home theatre AV receiver. Got a very good price for a used Acurus muse, was plan to get a Onkyo RZ70. But now still thinking which one to buy between these 2. Do you recommend to use Acurus Muse without the ASPEQT? As I can’t find it in my country.
I have yet to experience the Acurus Muse directly. I hear it is very good and I really like the how they have designed the software and hardware. If you cannot obtain ASPEQT, you may find success using a MiniDSP for at least the subwoofer calibration. -Jon
Well the Anthem AVM70 is a very nice unit when mine was working for a month. The auto update worked but mine "glitched" on the firmware auto update and does not turn on anymore. Anthem will warranty it but I have been (since 4-23-2021) trying to get the papers from Anthem on the RMA but emails & phone calls are becoming no response on emails or Covid 19 recordings on the phone que. Warranty maybe an issue here guys? While it worked I had all 15.2 working and it sounded amazing. Anthem told me it would be 4 to 6 weeks for this to be fixed but I have already lost another week just trying to get the paper work returned to me?
Tahsin- the Muse has Dow mixed digital outputs which could serve additional zones well. Send the digital out to integrated amps / receivers used for the other zones. At this class of product the focus is on the main theater room. So having a zone 2 pre-out is not as common as with lower tier offerings. It does mean that a separate pre-amp needed to attenuate the volume for that zone. If you are using a more modern self-powered speaker like the Klipsch Fives all you need is a 2.0 digital signal. -Jon
Still waiting. I feel like there are models which come close, but there always seems to be some detail missing. Ultimately I will except the best compromise as I may never find the perfect combination. What I decided to do is fill in other holes with my 2021 budget - subwoofers, ceiling speakers etc. so I will be fully “immersive ready.” 2020-21 is a tough period for electronics given all the challenges. By shifting focus during this period my hope is that issues like HDMI 2.1 will fully resolve and more options will be available for format support.-Jon
I’m afraid the way you’re going about deciding which pre-pro to buy is Flawed in my opinion Most of the models you are looking at are upgradable yet you are disqualifying them because they don’t have a certain feature at the moment Most of the features you are eliminating These models are based on features that are not fully developed yet and will not be for at least another year Features such as E arc are not fully implemented yet and it would be premature for any manufacture to include them at this price range hardware is not available at this time to implement these features If I were you I would select the best performing Device that I could afford that has the most Upgradability I think 99% of these models that you were looking at are very upgradable and there is not much question that they will have the features you’re looking for in the near future so I would just Dive in if I were you.
Reginald- what you raise is a good topic for discussion. I agree that most processors are upgradable today via software and a smaller set provide hardware updates via a factory authorized center and yet an even smaller group can send you new hardware components you can install at home. That modern capability provides the potential for us consumers who want a processor to last through multiple generations of feature enhancements. In reality updatable and modular solutions have a finite lifespan and only a few brands have truely delivered on the “future proof” concept. My Sony TA-E9000ES was updatable and Sony did provide a few software updates over a period of about three years until they discontinued the model. Recent examples include the Emotiva RMC-1 whereby owners paid $1000 more for the hardware expandable model in 2019 but have yet to see a module released which the platform supports. The NAD M17 platform did enjoy a hardware update to immersive but that was one update over a long period and now it is behind again. Acurus has delivered with additional channels as well. We have seen some great software updates which add new format support as we have seen with the likes of the McIntosh MX123. So there are cases where the promise has been delivered, but a brand can slow or halt development or decide against one feature if they don’t have the resources. Mono price I recall has stated that won’t implement some formats they feel don’ts have a future. I turn to the Lyngforf announcement from a year ago stating they are developing HDMI 2.1 support but with not promised date or update since. We are at the mercy of the suppliers roadmap as to when or if we get a promised enhancement. Furthermore, a platform can reach its capacity - size, memory or processing power. As a result, a model can reach its end of the road even if the brand is willing to continue. My goal this year is to purchase a processor that matches my criteria as much as possible without having wait for an update that may or may not ever arrive. I would like to play it safe. If I am lucky that unit will enjoy a few updates that will make the experience even better. I am however with you in cheering on manufacturers to deliver on the upgrades. -Jon
My Emotiva RMC 1L is 100% Modular in its constriction is virtually 100% upgradable the RMC 1 is Also 100% upgradable with additional space for three more Module Available 3 months from now there will be a Module replacement for the HDMI inputs two accommodate HDMI 2.1 Since all of the modules inside of the machine are upgradable there is no end to the possibilities of upgradability in these new machines it’s not only emotiva that has this technology virtually the whole industry is going into modular design Especially at the high end of the market Generally the lower end of the market is not modular and construction that’s a feature of high end processors
I know when I buy electronics I pick features and specs and a price I am willing to pay, and sometimes it takes time before something is available. So it is a valid method to have features that may be just coming out, just means @ripewave audio may end up waiting to see what manufactures shake loose
Emotiva may be better than other manufacturers, but I wouldn't bet thousands of dollars on a manufacturer making even a promised upgrade. As many of you know, when the Marantz AV8805 was announced in January 2018, potential customers were told that if you bought the $4,500 pre-pro, an HDMI 2.1 upgrade would be available "when the specification was finalized and hardware was available." Marantz expected the upgrade "to be available sometime in 2020." Obviously, there's still no word on this upgrade from Marantz here in mid-May 2021. I'm also skeptical of Anthem's claims. It was certainly not in the *customer's* best interest for them to release the AVM 70 and 90 in 2021 without full HDMI 2.1 support. However, once again, they can get you to buy now with the *promise* of upgrades. Clearly, the AVM 70 was released before it was ready - with the changing specifications John noticed, the numerous bugs documented here on UA-cam and elsewhere, and the big grandaddy of them all, that ARC (Anthem Room Correction, not HDMI ARC) wasn't available for the AVM 70 to early customers. Wait... what?! ARC is one of the main reasons you buy an Anthem. Shame on you, Anthem!
@@r8gib I agree - it is best to purchase based on what is currently available and use it upgradability for the comfort that features you don’t need or know about now may be made available in the future.-Jon
Hello how are you my friend thank you for all formation I want to ask you all this processor it's not good for home theatre listen for THETA DIGITAL EXTREME BOARD THIS IS THE BEST SOUND EVER JESS PROCESSOR NUMBER ONE IN THE WORLD WE CANNOT COMPARE JSON WITH ANY BECAUSE I LISTEN ALL THIS SOUTH IT'S VERY BAD BUT IN A LISTEN WITH THETA SOUND AMAZING please and you talking with processor this is the processor number 1
Hilal- nice to receive feedback on a brand I have yet to fully explore - Theta Digital. So far focus has been under $10,000 USD. Their website has limited information with the latest press release posted 2017. So I may need input for owners and those who have first hand experience. Thanks again. -Jon
Thank you, Jon, for selecting the Muse as the runner-up! Enjoyed this video series!
Well deserving. I appreciate the care Acurus is taking with its designs and execution.-Jon
Great comparison Jon. We went with the MX123. You will not notice the 4db s/n value. Ours is whisper quiet while playing soft notes with the DAC performance outstanding . Native DSD support is a must as we play hours of SACD’s. Auro 3D $elected for ANY source, whether Atmos, DTS:X, or even Redbook CD playing is heads and tails above the other formats. You will never go back after using this immersive audio encoding. We have a 13.2 system vid posted using Carver, Sunfire, and McIntosh power. Hopefully you can check it out to aid in your decision. Again tremendous research on your part my friend.
Jack - it seems McIntosh has clearly added value to the Marantz based design. While functionally the Marantz components and software provide the rich feature set, the McIntosh upgraded circuit such as power supply etc improve the overall output quality.-Jon
Great series and looking forward to the 10k+ lineup! I just recently discovered your channel, but already love the videos and content that you make. 😊
I'm a big fan of making lists like this for myself and comparing different components, be it audio gear, computer hardware or really anything that can be compared in an subjective manner by data. One often frustrating aspect of it, is the fact that data is often missing and different from manufacturer to manufacturer that makes it harder to fully compare unit to unit (as I see that you also have discovered). For this reason, I hope to one day be able to purchase a big amount of devices to measure them an publish the date to make it easier for everyone to make informed decisions🙂
I hope that you gain a big following on this platform and with that, gain the opportunity to compare more units yourself with physical access to them. With a big enough following, a good amount of manufacturers are probably going to be willing to provide you with their devices for review purposes.
Keep on talking and shine a light on specs and features, the more it's talked about, the better. If it gets enough attention, manufacturers will have to get better at providing it 😊
Have you taught about making your personal database into a interactive website with the option to apply filters for people to sort through all the processors to easily find what they are looking for? I think the HT community would love something like that! If it gained some traction, it would probably get easier to get more direct info from the different manufacturers to fill in the blank spots on the lists. Wish you the best! -Tim
Tim - thanks so much for that inspiring message. At times I wonder if a different approach would reach a wider audience. However, I feel that I can afford to deliver content for a more niche community as I don’t rely on this channel for income. With that said, the more that subscribe the more companies that will find value in sending demo units for review. The key is to attract suppliers while maintaining the integrity of the review. That is possible and is my aim.
I like your concept of posting the database. Public access will also help keep the data update to date will all the latest values as a crowd sourced resource. Again your feedback is appreciated and gives me added energy to press on.-Jon
Jon - another very nicely done video. Continued KUDOS to you, sir!
Just one quick note about the volume control....no, the ACURUS MUSE does not have a physical "knob" on the unit, but right there on the on-screen display (which you seem to really like) is the volume up/down options readily available.
Looking forward to your next video.
I appreciate your kind words as always and the sensible explanations you provide on the Muse. The digital volume controls is one of those items I just may grow to accept if I were to live with for a while. The key is to be responsive during those emergency situations.
Also congratulations on having a product which I feel is deserving of attention and the praise we delivered in this series which speak to its merits.-Jon
@@ripewave Agree with your volume comment
Another great vid! I'm funneling down toward a McIntosh or Anthem, but leaning McIntosh because I grew up in a house with a Marantz 4300 from the early 1970s so I am fond of the legacy look. If I find a place to check out the muse in real life, it could end up on my short list. I don't love the display in the Anthem, if it was as slick as it looks in the marketing pics, or as good as the muse, I'd be more on board there. If you are going to go with a large display, it better be good, otherwise I am happier with an old school 2 line display like what McIntosh uses, because it isn't even trying to be fresh - it is what it is. The muse sets the standard on display and touch UX though.
Thomas - that Marantz 4300 is something special. Not only does it have the best design of any Marantz, it is a quadradial model for early 4-channel playback. I have a similar affinity for Marantz growing up with a 2275 - which does not directly support quadraphonics so you have me beat. Yes - difficult choices - cosmetically I think the McIntosh will outlive the Anthem.-Jon
we have a legend right here folks
Great Vedio!
Now I planing to upgrading my Home theatre AV receiver. Got a very good price for a used Acurus muse, was plan to get a Onkyo RZ70. But now still thinking which one to buy between these 2. Do you recommend to use Acurus Muse without the ASPEQT? As I can’t find it in my country.
I have yet to experience the Acurus Muse directly. I hear it is very good and I really like the how they have designed the software and hardware. If you cannot obtain ASPEQT, you may find success using a MiniDSP for at least the subwoofer calibration. -Jon
Thanks
Well the Anthem AVM70 is a very nice unit when mine was working for a month. The auto
update worked but mine "glitched" on the firmware auto update and does
not turn on anymore. Anthem will warranty it but I have been (since
4-23-2021) trying to get the papers from Anthem on the RMA but emails
& phone calls are becoming no response on emails or Covid 19 recordings on the phone que.
Warranty maybe an issue here guys? While it worked I had all 15.2
working and it sounded amazing. Anthem told me it would be 4 to 6 weeks
for this to be fixed but I have already lost another week just trying to
get the paper work returned to me?
One big disadvantage of the acurus muse is that it cannot do zone 2 audio - is that correct?
Tahsin- the Muse has Dow mixed digital outputs which could serve additional zones well. Send the digital out to integrated amps / receivers used for the other zones. At this class of product the focus is on the main theater room. So having a zone 2 pre-out is not as common as with lower tier offerings. It does mean that a separate pre-amp needed to attenuate the volume for that zone. If you are using a more modern self-powered speaker like the Klipsch Fives all you need is a 2.0 digital signal. -Jon
Any choice yet or still waiting?
Still waiting. I feel like there are models which come close, but there always seems to be some detail missing. Ultimately I will except the best compromise as I may never find the perfect combination. What I decided to do is fill in other holes with my 2021 budget - subwoofers, ceiling speakers etc. so I will be fully “immersive ready.” 2020-21 is a tough period for electronics given all the challenges. By shifting focus during this period my hope is that issues like HDMI 2.1 will fully resolve and more options will be available for format support.-Jon
I’m afraid the way you’re going about deciding which pre-pro to buy is Flawed in my opinion
Most of the models you are looking at are upgradable yet you are disqualifying them because they don’t have a certain feature at the moment Most of the features you are eliminating These models are based on features that are not fully developed yet and will not be for at least another year Features such as E arc are not fully implemented yet and it would be premature for any manufacture to include them at this price range hardware is not available at this time to implement these features If I were you I would select the best performing Device that I could afford that has the most Upgradability I think 99% of these models that you were looking at are very upgradable and there is not much question that they will have the features you’re looking for in the near future so I would just Dive in if I were you.
Reginald- what you raise is a good topic for discussion. I agree that most processors are upgradable today via software and a smaller set provide hardware updates via a factory authorized center and yet an even smaller group can send you new hardware components you can install at home. That modern capability provides the potential for us consumers who want a processor to last through multiple generations of feature enhancements. In reality updatable and modular solutions have a finite lifespan and only a few brands have truely delivered on the “future proof” concept.
My Sony TA-E9000ES was updatable and Sony did provide a few software updates over a period of about three years until they discontinued the model. Recent examples include the Emotiva RMC-1 whereby owners paid $1000 more for the hardware expandable model in 2019 but have yet to see a module released which the platform supports. The NAD M17 platform did enjoy a hardware update to immersive but that was one update over a long period and now it is behind again. Acurus has delivered with additional channels as well. We have seen some great software updates which add new format support as we have seen with the likes of the McIntosh MX123. So there are cases where the promise has been delivered, but a brand can slow or halt development or decide against one feature if they don’t have the resources. Mono price I recall has stated that won’t implement some formats they feel don’ts have a future. I turn to the Lyngforf announcement from a year ago stating they are developing HDMI 2.1 support but with not promised date or update since. We are at the mercy of the suppliers roadmap as to when or if we get a promised enhancement. Furthermore, a platform can reach its capacity - size, memory or processing power. As a result, a model can reach its end of the road even if the brand is willing to continue.
My goal this year is to purchase a processor that matches my criteria as much as possible without having wait for an update that may or may not ever arrive. I would like to play it safe. If I am lucky that unit will enjoy a few updates that will make the experience even better. I am however with you in cheering on manufacturers to deliver on the upgrades. -Jon
My Emotiva RMC 1L is 100% Modular in its constriction is virtually 100% upgradable the RMC 1 is Also 100% upgradable with additional space for three more Module Available 3 months from now there will be a Module replacement for the HDMI inputs two accommodate HDMI 2.1 Since all of the modules inside of the machine are upgradable there is no end to the possibilities of upgradability in these new machines it’s not only emotiva that has this technology virtually the whole industry is going into modular design Especially at the high end of the market Generally the lower end of the market is not modular and construction that’s a feature of high end processors
I know when I buy electronics I pick features and specs and a price I am willing to pay, and sometimes it takes time before something is available. So it is a valid method to have features that may be just coming out, just means @ripewave audio may end up waiting to see what manufactures shake loose
Emotiva may be better than other manufacturers, but I wouldn't bet thousands of dollars on a manufacturer making even a promised upgrade. As many of you know, when the Marantz AV8805 was announced in January 2018, potential customers were told that if you bought the $4,500 pre-pro, an HDMI 2.1 upgrade would be available "when the specification was finalized and hardware was available." Marantz expected the upgrade "to be available sometime in 2020." Obviously, there's still no word on this upgrade from Marantz here in mid-May 2021. I'm also skeptical of Anthem's claims. It was certainly not in the *customer's* best interest for them to release the AVM 70 and 90 in 2021 without full HDMI 2.1 support. However, once again, they can get you to buy now with the *promise* of upgrades. Clearly, the AVM 70 was released before it was ready - with the changing specifications John noticed, the numerous bugs documented here on UA-cam and elsewhere, and the big grandaddy of them all, that ARC (Anthem Room Correction, not HDMI ARC) wasn't available for the AVM 70 to early customers. Wait... what?! ARC is one of the main reasons you buy an Anthem. Shame on you, Anthem!
@@r8gib I agree - it is best to purchase based on what is currently available and use it upgradability for the comfort that features you don’t need or know about now may be made available in the future.-Jon
Hello how are you my friend thank you for all formation I want to ask you all this processor it's not good for home theatre listen for THETA DIGITAL EXTREME BOARD THIS IS THE BEST SOUND EVER JESS PROCESSOR NUMBER ONE IN THE WORLD WE CANNOT COMPARE JSON WITH ANY BECAUSE I LISTEN ALL THIS SOUTH IT'S VERY BAD BUT IN A LISTEN WITH THETA SOUND AMAZING please and you talking with processor this is the processor number 1
Hilal- nice to receive feedback on a brand I have yet to fully explore - Theta Digital. So far focus has been under $10,000 USD. Their website has limited information with the latest press release posted 2017. So I may need input for owners and those who have first hand experience. Thanks again. -Jon