I love the sound of red brass when other trombonists play it. When I do it, I spread the sound like a jar of peanut butter. I went to the Shires booth at a trombone workshop and played on a red-brass bass trombone, and the Shires rep simply took the bass bone away from me and said, "Here", and handed me a yellow brass bass bone.
Loved the video! It is a sorely needed dose of reality for the incurable gearheads among us :) Now, everyone just needs to put the rubber bumper back on their horns before they drop them... again
I haven't even watched this yet, but I can already tell it's going to be my favorite video. For the record, I prefer yellow brass, but gold and red have interesting sound characteristics too. I don't think it matters at all to the audience, but to me as a player, I can tell the difference.
I just watched it, and regarding your comment at the end about preconceived notions, in 2010 I went to Shires with a friend to watch him get fitted for a horn. He's always loved Conn 88H's, so he figured that he was going to get a Shires that played like one, except better. He actually wound up with something much closer to resembling a Bach 42 with a gold brass bell, and he was very surprised by that.
Oh it definitely changes the sound. But people go into thinking the look influences the sound, rather than just playing them. You can also play the same mouthpiece on two different horns and get completely different sounds- so yes, a mouthpiece does change things, but not globally.
I've got an almost new 50A3 with a yellow bell and it can be dark, it can be resonant and I reckon I'll never make it break up. Had always thought that I must get a gold brass instrument because I thought I needed a bit of help to darken the sound. Turns out I really didn't!
Great video! I've played trombone for 55+ years, was a school band director for 38 years, and taught private lessons for the last 20 years or so. I thought I knew what effect different materials had on the sound of an instrument until I sat in as a second set of ears when one of my students was fitted for a Shires. My preconceptions were pretty well destroyed by that session. I was surprised by the difference that some of the components made in her sound. On the other hand, some components and materials really didn't make much difference at all, when I thought they would. I think the bottom line is that, when comparing similar instruments (.547 bore tenors, for example) the most influential element of sound is our own concept of sound.
One thing that can be added is that red/rose brass is more resistant to red rot and depending on your body chemistry that can be very important. I WRECK yellow brass lead pipes.
Yes. Good show Aidan. At the end of the day, you must get a horn that works for you in a majority of situations that you will encounter. As you get older and have more and more funds, you gradually accumulate more instruments that tweak your sound just the slightest bit. Few people will even notice. But also consider ease of playing, production. Try to get that in addition to the often minuscule difference in sound quality. Number one, start with as good of instrument as possible before severely spending for small changes. And follow Aidan’s videos for good practical advice. 😊
Then there is the Conn 48H with the "Electro-D" Bell. Yellow brass substrate, coated in copper, plated with nickle and covered in a dense clear enamel lacquer. Not cosmetic but an intentional multilayered alloy designed to produce very specific core sound qualities before and after the bell at different volume levels.
What do you think is one thing that young musicans need to be doing more of? (Question I stole from the Trombone Retreat Podcast lol, and nice playing in the beginning!)
Which one do you consider the getzen rose bells? They had a more red color than other labeled rose bells. I started bass on a getzen 1062fdr and it felt like it produced a nice sound upclose especially. I was always hesitant to go into the modular horns because I’d end up over thinking everything. Slightly different topic, there is a different in a regular vs screw bell. I had a really cool experience at an ITF when Zach Bond asked me and someone to listen to him try a Thein screw bell. I think they just surprised him bringing it for him to try and I think this was on their first set of Universal horns. I can’t remember the exact details/adjectives but there was a slight improvement in the screw bell.
The getzen rose ones are still rose... Those little copper percentages might change a bit from batch to batch. Screwbells definitely change things. It's hard to quantify, my screwbell is good but behind the bell it's a lot less fun to play. On the other side it sounds great- I had randy hawes try my horn and he sounded a bit more focused but still broad on my setup than his Greenhoe/gold bell.
Hello Aidan! I've been following your channel for several years. I find your videos very interesting, and I have learn a lot with you. I was wondering why you haven't earned a 100K followers plaque. And I have the reason, I think! You never encourage your audience to give you a like for your great videos. That's first. Secondly, you never encourage your viewers to get subscribed. You just end your videos just saying: Bye bye! And it never give the opportunity for the viewer to do so. May be you can do a small effort to advertise more your excellent channel. This is just an advise! I've been playing the tenor trombone for 46 years and I really appreciate your work. As I said, I learned a lot with your videos and I wish a great success for you and your channel!
How about the gold plated bells, like how the Canadian Brass all had the in the 80-90's? A friend's gold plated Trombone was definitely heavier (weight) than a normal Trombone. I didn't hear it being played so I can't say if if sounds different or not.(Correct me if I'm mistaken about anything. I think he said it was all gold plated)
If it was heavier, it would be due to a heavier gauge brass being used. Gold plate is crazy thin, maybe a few microns. If there were even a couple ounces of gold used over an entire horn I would be surprised. With gold plate you basically get a silver plated instrument that looks cooler.
Hey Aiden, I’m going to send my bass in here pretty quick and I had a thought because where I’m sending it does delacquering as well. How would you say a delacquered bell vs standard plays and how often you would have to polish it? I’m also considering having the slide done, but I’m not sure what effect that would have. I don’t plan on ever selling the horn, so resale value isn’t a big thing for me.
I love the sound of red brass when other trombonists play it. When I do it, I spread the sound like a jar of peanut butter. I went to the Shires booth at a trombone workshop and played on a red-brass bass trombone, and the Shires rep simply took the bass bone away from me and said, "Here", and handed me a yellow brass bass bone.
Loved the video! It is a sorely needed dose of reality for the incurable gearheads among us :) Now, everyone just needs to put the rubber bumper back on their horns before they drop them... again
I think gold brass and rose brass looks better but never thought the alloy mattered that much
I haven't even watched this yet, but I can already tell it's going to be my favorite video. For the record, I prefer yellow brass, but gold and red have interesting sound characteristics too. I don't think it matters at all to the audience, but to me as a player, I can tell the difference.
I just watched it, and regarding your comment at the end about preconceived notions, in 2010 I went to Shires with a friend to watch him get fitted for a horn. He's always loved Conn 88H's, so he figured that he was going to get a Shires that played like one, except better. He actually wound up with something much closer to resembling a Bach 42 with a gold brass bell, and he was very surprised by that.
This seems to happen all the time!
Very good video! Thanks for that! Exactly what I've seen a lot...
I think its more for looks. I think the sound is influenced more by the width, depth of cup, throat diameter and edge shape of the mouthpiece.
Oh it definitely changes the sound. But people go into thinking the look influences the sound, rather than just playing them.
You can also play the same mouthpiece on two different horns and get completely different sounds- so yes, a mouthpiece does change things, but not globally.
I've got an almost new 50A3 with a yellow bell and it can be dark, it can be resonant and I reckon I'll never make it break up. Had always thought that I must get a gold brass instrument because I thought I needed a bit of help to darken the sound. Turns out I really didn't!
Great video! I've played trombone for 55+ years, was a school band director for 38 years, and taught private lessons for the last 20 years or so. I thought I knew what effect different materials had on the sound of an instrument until I sat in as a second set of ears when one of my students was fitted for a Shires. My preconceptions were pretty well destroyed by that session. I was surprised by the difference that some of the components made in her sound. On the other hand, some components and materials really didn't make much difference at all, when I thought they would.
I think the bottom line is that, when comparing similar instruments (.547 bore tenors, for example) the most influential element of sound is our own concept of sound.
Exactly right! I can play a dozen different horns, and even though they all have small differences. I sound like me on all of them.
One thing that can be added is that red/rose brass is more resistant to red rot and depending on your body chemistry that can be very important. I WRECK yellow brass lead pipes.
Yup, there's a reason they're used on a lot of valved brass. And it's not so much for the sound difference!
Yes. Good show Aidan. At the end of the day, you must get a horn that works for you in a majority of situations that you will encounter. As you get older and have more and more funds, you gradually accumulate more instruments that tweak your sound just the slightest bit. Few people will even notice. But also consider ease of playing, production. Try to get that in addition to the often minuscule difference in sound quality. Number one, start with as good of instrument as possible before severely spending for small changes. And follow Aidan’s videos for good practical advice. 😊
Good point... I remember the 112h being reallllly bright even though red brass is "darker"
Yup, that's why I hate generalizations
Then there is the Conn 48H with the "Electro-D" Bell. Yellow brass substrate, coated in copper, plated with nickle and covered in a dense clear enamel lacquer. Not cosmetic but an intentional multilayered alloy designed to produce very specific core sound qualities before and after the bell at different volume levels.
Yup, I'm selling one! I thought they were just nickel bells until I was corrected.
What do you think is one thing that young musicans need to be doing more of? (Question I stole from the Trombone Retreat Podcast lol, and nice playing in the beginning!)
That's a really hard question!! I'd probably say listening, but young musicians basically need to be doing more of everything... Hmmm
All I’ve learnt from watching this video is that Paul Bettany used to play Trombones.
I guess I have a passing resemblance. Not the money to back it up though!
Which one do you consider the getzen rose bells? They had a more red color than other labeled rose bells. I started bass on a getzen 1062fdr and it felt like it produced a nice sound upclose especially. I was always hesitant to go into the modular horns because I’d end up over thinking everything.
Slightly different topic, there is a different in a regular vs screw bell. I had a really cool experience at an ITF when Zach Bond asked me and someone to listen to him try a Thein screw bell. I think they just surprised him bringing it for him to try and I think this was on their first set of Universal horns. I can’t remember the exact details/adjectives but there was a slight improvement in the screw bell.
The getzen rose ones are still rose... Those little copper percentages might change a bit from batch to batch.
Screwbells definitely change things. It's hard to quantify, my screwbell is good but behind the bell it's a lot less fun to play. On the other side it sounds great- I had randy hawes try my horn and he sounded a bit more focused but still broad on my setup than his Greenhoe/gold bell.
Always top tier content.
uh was the rose brass one a contra cuase that’s cool. if it’s on sale what’s the price?
A new Laetzsch contra like mine is $18,000
@@AidanRitchie woah forgot how expensive they are lol
Hello Aidan! I've been following your channel for several years. I find your videos very interesting, and I have learn a lot with you. I was wondering why you haven't earned a 100K followers plaque. And I have the reason, I think! You never encourage your audience to give you a like for your great videos. That's first. Secondly, you never encourage your viewers to get subscribed. You just end your videos just saying: Bye bye! And it never give the opportunity for the viewer to do so. May be you can do a small effort to advertise more your excellent channel. This is just an advise! I've been playing the tenor trombone for 46 years and I really appreciate your work. As I said, I learned a lot with your videos and I wish a great success for you and your channel!
i love this video, but was wondering what grip you use because i have been looking for one to use on my bass?
This one is the get-a-grip I think, which is no longer available. Check out the Calder Pips Grip
How about the gold plated bells, like how the Canadian Brass all had the in the 80-90's? A friend's gold plated Trombone was definitely heavier (weight) than a normal Trombone. I didn't hear it being played so I can't say if if sounds different or not.(Correct me if I'm mistaken about anything. I think he said it was all gold plated)
If it was heavier, it would be due to a heavier gauge brass being used. Gold plate is crazy thin, maybe a few microns. If there were even a couple ounces of gold used over an entire horn I would be surprised. With gold plate you basically get a silver plated instrument that looks cooler.
@@AidanRitchie Got it! Thanks for the clarification.
Clearly, it doesn’t matter to me!
My 2107 7B King is rose brass. But being 30 years old, it looks more orange than rose brass.
That'll mostly be the lacquer- King used a colored lacquer for a long time.
Hey Aiden, I’m going to send my bass in here pretty quick and I had a thought because where I’m sending it does delacquering as well. How would you say a delacquered bell vs standard plays and how often you would have to polish it? I’m also considering having the slide done, but I’m not sure what effect that would have. I don’t plan on ever selling the horn, so resale value isn’t a big thing for me.
I personally enjoy a nice unlacquered horn, and if they have original thicker lacquer they can respond better that way.
@@AidanRitchie can you give me some more info? We can move to email/another form of communication
@@tylerjack6018 send a thing to my lesson form
Weril mentioned 🇧🇷 🇧🇷
👍
👍
❤❤❤