The mod is out on the CCM. I hope you all enjoy! Remember, you can play the mod on lower difficulties if you like the changes but want an easier experience. I kinda wanted Hard difficulty to be on the same level as (vanilla) WoL Brutal, and Nightmare to be the same level as WoL Nightmare. For those of you who wanted to see all the major unit/kerrigan/mission changes, you can find them in the changelog below the download link. The Reckoning: (The Ghost Tank Mission) 1. Medivacs replaced with Imperial Intercessors. 2. Added expansions near Stukov and Dehaka 3. After Odin, Mengsk starts to call down nukes frequently for the remainder of the mission. Would be awesome if the “I will not be stopped!” line from sc1 plays right before it all starts. 4. Cutscenes no longer restore Kerrigan hp/energy/cooldowns 2, 3 were Grant's designs. The Reckoning, AKA how it feels to play ZvT on ladder. Shock Divisions and Emperor's Shadows to ruin your plans. If you aren't comfortable managing overseers in many different places then it's time to learn. The ghost nuke AI is a modified version of MindHawk's challenge gauntlet nukes (thanks to MindHawk for letting me use it). Instead of scaling up over time, the nuke count is based on the number of ghost academies that mengsk owns. The idea was to encourage/reward hyper-aggressive play early on, since inevitably the end will be an uber-late-game struggle. Grant mentioned it, but I was pretty happy with how many unit types can use on this mission. Unlike All In, where like 70% of your unit types are useless, you can find a bit of use with everything you have access to (except mutas probably, but making mutas feel useful without making them op is impossible) I'd say Reckoning is tied with All In for the hardest nightmare mission. The timings aren't as tight as All In, and you don't have to fight Kerrigan and a mega leviathan, but it's longer and you have to pay attention to more places at once.
Idk I think if those guys actually use spores and spines to defend against the ghosts instead of snipeable overseers and have to look back to find where you're getting nukes, they'll do better.
For perspective I ran the mission on Brutal later and finished it in under 18 minutes. Did a full map clear and everything. Nightmare is now public for everybody to play, you can download it on the GGG Custom Campaign Manager server! discord.gg/UCDyZyr6gg
I can't think of a more fitting end for a zerg campaign than 2 hours of unending tides of free units slamming their heads against a wall to break the most entrenched position terran money can ever buy one fraction of an inch at a time.
Once upon a time, the solution was mass Broodlord + Infestor. Grant doesn't have those though. The campaign solution was throwing unkillable ultralisks at the enemy until it sticks, and even that was a terrible grind because those ultralisks don't shoot up. So even Grant took 3 hours with the tools given. If ZvT on ladder is like this, I am happy that I do not play ladder.
@@lagg1e the ladder tvz is (in macro anyway) can the Zerg figure out what Terran is doing early to defend enough economy to force Terran into a grindy lategame where Zerg has to throw three maxed armies at the most entrenched position you've ever seen. Despite how that sounds, Zerg lategame is very scary for Terran, as you can't move out onto the map without getting demolished in straight up fights. I think basically it's even early, midgame Terran favoured, lategame Zerg favoured and extreme lategame back to Terran favoured. At least high level anyways.
@@LodeCosZvT is really mmr dependent. If you take a look at Grandmaster league, it's more of a 5 sided war with groups of ghosts and mines in medivacs flying from all sides, while zerg is spamming queens, zerglings, banes, lurkers and trying to get broodlords. It's weird. In platinum league terrans usually can just go thor hellbat and cheese the zerg out of the game. Or the zerg outmacros and wins.
If you think about it, Grant has the UED to thank for how fortified Korhal is now. Mengsk seems to have learned his lesson and fortified his nuclear silos and battlecruiser fleets to a greater degree. No chance the UED could have busted through this version of Korhal without enslaving the swarm first
I wonder if the increased difficulty stemmed from the lack of more siege oriented zerg strains, rather than the lack of broodlords. Sure, broodlords could have helped a lot, but if I remeber correctly, impalers still have that increased range (and deal huge damage against buildings as a plus) and the carrion is more flexible with its flying locusts, allowing some more flank opportunities.
Yeah I don't doubt the difficulty of this mission, but Grant really seems to have (inadvertently) picked the strain that would make this mission the hardest. Even getting raptor lings instead of swarm lings would have made the in trenched tanks easier to get on top of and the choke points less brutal. Which I think is actually a positive for the campaign. Regular hard and brutal feel like you can pick whatever strains you want and charge in with a maxed out army, but with nightmare you have to be very strategic about your army composition.
I'd argue that Grants strains also are perfect for a different problem in the mission with it's constant attacks and nukes, swarmlings let him react to these threats nearly instantly and reinforce his army after defending waves, the lurker let's him hold those chokes a lot better against both the heavy armor and massive infantry balls and the viper is an amazing defense tool for the tanks and thors, even the Odin. This mission is kinda stuck with a pick your poison in terms of Zerg strains. The ones you listed would make sieging the positions easier and get more ground but it'd be harder to keep that ground with lurkers to hold the chokes, vipers to disable the mech or swarmlings to keep up momentum after a push, god knows if he would be able to defend some of his outer bases without these tools too. Hard to say which one would be harder to make work but I think the mission is just really well done with both strains of these units being useful.
@@BartixShieldsmen I absolutely agree, if this would be All In but with zerg, Grant's picks would be the most ideal for defending on that mission, and no doubt that his picks also helped at defending on this one. I think the ideal would be like a 50/50 on offensive and defensive strains, but I really like that this balance isn't required to finish certain missions and instead you might have to change up your playstyle.
One thing i would like improved is Raynor's defense, i mean, i know you are supposed to help him during the big waves, but he should be able to stabilize easily without them. This isn't a real issue, just a nuisance that you need to constantly babysit him, perhaps if he had a science vessel to help him detect would be nice, ot just better defence
That and his lack of upgrading quality. His occasional attack waves never really get any more value, despite being nearly two hours later in the mission. Hell, it'd be better if he just used Orbital Scans to reveal the occasional Emperor's Shadows moving around to nuke your base. If your allies at least had some manner of value, it'd be better. They should never carry the mission, but if you're thinking about incremental value, you'd want them to at least help you get a little bit more done. But they're really there just acting as momentary meat shields for your units to move behind.
@@arbiterally101 you naild it i think if you are going to change a lot of things, buff and nerf stuff you should at least buff raynor he's usless here and in vanilla
I wish that Raynor's forces would scale better, with time or with the number of Mengsk's bases destroyed. Seeing the maxed out Zerg army fight against infinite free Terran mech force, and Jim shows up with one tank and a medivac is honestly kinda pathetic.
@@AbdielKavash That's the thing. Raynor has access to some things even Mengsk doesn't use. Would have loved to see Spectres fighting for control of the periphery against Emperor's Shadows, using stuns to make it easier to engage, or Vultures laying down impromptu mine fields to deny certain streets from Mengsk's ground troops. Pirate aircraft trying to gain even a small amount of air superiority so a jumped up flying dumpster of a Hercules could pull a massive drop on the flanks. They'd still lose against the raw weight of Mengsk's armies, but these sorts of things would emphasize the Raiders as a scrappy force that brought their A-game to the fight they'd all signed up for.
The problem is honestly how the game treats TvT more than anything else. If your opponent is entrenched with tanks, ghosts, turrets and planetaries and you don't even have access to liberators, there is no way to breach it. And Megsk doesn't move his forces out of the position for Jim to do anything with siege tanks and stuff. It's just not feasible to do with incremental upgrades, this requires a complete overhaul of Raynor's faction. But yeah, I would really like for Raynor to have like 3 bunkers and 5 siege tanks in the base. Something that just can't die to infantry, this guy has beaten All In and can't defend 20 supply harass.
I really like that the last mission is insanely hard. It isn't a bottleneck mission that makes you want to quit the campaign halfway, because it is the last. It's not like you didn't succeed if you can't win it, you already won 20. Optimally, the player would have learned in those 20 missions, and in finale they get to truly show what thay've got
I think making allies on this mission similar to allies on the Host would feel better. The allies here have 1 big attack that can't do much against the shock divisions and after that send out 1-5 zerglings. Maybe it's just a change for brutal and lower because it would make the allies more useful and the misson easier and you might want to keep nightmare as hard as possible
I was thinking that as progress gets made the other commander's waves got stronger with more varied and later game units that fit their co-op counterparts. How cool would it have been if Stukovs waves started with the infested Marines we see already, but as you get closer to Mengsk's main base he starts sending infested Banshees, Siege Tanks, a couple Apocalypses, Zagara sends more abs, the Strains of zerg units you the player, didn't choose (as a way of both following Kerrigan while doing her own thing at the same time) Abs Raynor was just better... maybe a Tychus or just, more stuff from him in general.
I think allies must set ups a bases, and become more and more stronger (until a certain extent) while they alive, and Mengsk tries to kill them too (and its too hard to save all for too long)
Grant: excited at the beginning and says "Let's see how it goes." Me: *checks the time* *spots the nearly 3 hour video* Yeah, let's SeE hOw It GoEs. *sweats profusely*
3 hours?! Grant, you are a legend for not quitting at all! We, your fans, salute your efforts! And we eagerly await Rhyme to finish LOTV Nightmare edition for more hilarious moments and painful fails of Grant.
@@nikolaysitnikov796 The Host could be insane if the spires are even so slightly buffed. Even on base Brutal they can delete a maxed out army if you don't abuse the SoA (which I assume is going to get heavy nerfs in Nightmare).
I didn't skip, but I did pause a couple times. I was incorrect with my guess of >2h. I was... drastically wrong with my guess of about 1500 enemies killed. And I'm super happy that I called you using Swarm Hosts here. Pretty sure this might not be possible without Swarm Hosts or Brood Lords. This series has been an utter blast to witness, and I am looking forward to LoTV Nightmare :D
Really feels odd that your enemies are competent and insanely strong while your allies are pushovers. Jim's such a neat character and it feels really bad that he's such a joke in this mission. Nightmare could have fixed that but just didn't. Edit: something else I noticed throughout the campaign: alot of these later missions seemed to boil down to using infestor/swarm host when the map runs out of minerals. Feels weird that there aren't more minerals in general to fund your armies? If the point was to make the campaign Heart of the Swarm, not Heart of the Kerrigan, then surely you'd have more minerals to throw at your enemies? Really loved the series overall. I am SO excited for Nightmare LotV when that eventually comes out. Love ya
@sasa asasasa Not even that unit puzzles are a bad thing, I think that's something this mod did well because in the base game all you need is Kerrigan, the army comp doesn't matter. But I definitely agree that some of these missions were basically designed around not using certain units (like mutas throughout the entire campaign) or totally making certain units required (like Abs in the ultralisk mission).
@TheRealRhyme Huh, yeah I guess you're right. I thought I saw them pop up alot more often. Still, the weird thing I'm seeing is that when hosts are used, they have to be used. That is to say, no other unit in the game can be used besides them because they just make free units on maps with low minerals and lots of enemies. I'm just looking back to SC1 and Broodwar (when the zerg really felt like an unstoppable force, a swarm) where the later stage zerg missions were PACKED with money in various enemy-controlled expansions around the map. That's what really allowed you to be the zerg. In SC2 you just don't get that, and I'd figure since the mod was supposed to put the emphasis back into the swarm and have Kerrigan take a back seat, this older style would have been reintroduced. I'd say for alot of the missions the changes you made helped A LOT, but there are still a few weird ones like this that force you into using certain units or you just lose the game. I mostly blame blizzard for designing the swarmhost in the first place, it's easily my least favorite unit in all of starcraft. I feel like it's a bandaid of sorts to make up for low-eco maps, and that carries over in this mod for a few missions.
@@mtfoxtrot5296no other unit Broodlords, my man. Broodlords. You can also try to play mass viper energy with abducts. It's ridiculously hard and apm intensive at times, but somewhat viable.
That was so, so SO many nukes and tanks. @v@ Absolutely living up to the Nightmare name This is the most completely insane mission I have ever seen. It's just magnificent. Congrats to Grant for winning this thing after *almost three hours real time* and Rhyme for making the most horrifying citadel of a base in Starcraft 2 that I'm aware of. That was an awesome show. ^v^
@@lelouchvibritannia7809 Twitch Trolls Grant HoS finale had Mengsk duking it out against Kerrigan in his supermassive flagship - and the entire Military Industrial Complex of over 11 Odins
You can play with the nightmare mod changes on lower difficulties. I agree though that I don't think I could beat this either. I managed to make it all the way to All-In nightmare mode before failing and this looks just as difficult in a different way.
This mission definitely seems built with brood lords in mind. Grant showed you can definitely win without them, but since they're on a non-reversible fork via evolution mission it feels rough to not have access to them.
Definitely props to Rhyme on the mission overall though. Encouraging the use of every single tool the Swarm has access to is the way a final mission should feel.
Tbf, flying locusts, broodlords, or the reworked impalers would've all been really helpful. I've just been wondering the whole series why Grant kept choosing the non-siege option for each of the evolution missions when he knew the last mission was a siege mission. That said, I think the whole evolution system is dumb anyway, but that's a vanilla HoTS problem. If you're trying a new campaign (whether modded, challenge run, or just playing the base campaign for the first time), you've got no idea which of the evolution paths will be more useful later down the line, so you're basically guessing based on the performance of units in a highly scripted and free win mission specifically designed to put the unit in its best possible light. And it's not like in WoL, where you're picking between largely inconsequential units, while getting most of the core of your force, you straight up have to pick between 2 entirely different, very powerful, and highly situational units.
@@JanSenCheng On that note, I will say that the evolution flaw is significantly exacerbated by the nightmare mod being difficult enough to make it a problem. In the actual campaign which the evolution system was built for, the campaign is easy enough even on Brutal, that evolution choice does not bottleneck you on any mission at all. I've never personally felt awful for not being able to change my choices down the line, as I've not played any modded campaigns.
@@JanSenCheng Late, but poor internet on a 3 hr vid is... yeah Anyhow it's a replay ability factor, split choices. While it doesn't allow for mid-campaign flexibility, that's the purpose of Kerri and Mutations.
It's so funny, there are a bunch of moments, like at 2:29:53, where Giant and Kerrigan literally have a conversation, like "what is it this time?" "is that the play?" "no"
Am I the only one who screamed "static defense!!" to the screen when i saw the nukes? I think that would help a lot. Also, is a shame allies can't be better, but i guess is not easy to change that in a good way.
@@jarskil8862 Soviets didn't use "human wave" tactics, ask any reputable historian. The casualty figures are inflated buy counting the people who were encircled at the very start of the war, and not counting the casualties amongst the germans who became POWs. Even though the soviets lost more almost always during the first half of the war, many battles were actully good for the USSR in terms of k/d ratio, for instance the soviets lost either equal or 1/3 less than the germans in Stalingrad, the most important and deadliest battle of the war.
It does kinda feel like you skipped every siege unit in favor of the defense variant, viper instead of broodlord, creep swarmhost instead of flying locusts (which wouldn't have to deal with tanks), lurkers instead of impalers. It would even have helped I think if you had droppods or levi instead of apoc, although apoc did a lot it is hard to use it to focus down buildings it seems.
That was ridiculous. I watched all of this because I felt like I had to after you suffered through playing it. The fact that you are capable of continuing to play after dealing with map wide ghost/nuke harass for over 2 hours is the greatest display of starcraft skill I have ever seen from you. Thank you for using purple swarm hosts. They are my favorite.
3 hour video, 1:55:25 in game time. Grant makes StarCraft2 history. Not only did we get to see what units pay for themselves when put to the test but we got to see elite skills put to the test. This was by far the most realistic way this chapter went down. Epic, bloody, bare knuckles dug in drawn out fight. The ultimate Terran turtle vs the endless Zerg tide and Grant did not disappoint! 🍻 cheers to Grant and chat!
I know this is like a year late but I finally got caught up on the series. It was a great watch! I've played the original of this map on Brutal over 2000 times as I love it and I'm constantly making editor tweaks to do weird things with it, but it's also given me some knowledge that might help others attempting this. First, Grant mentions letting the full Raynor cutscene play, otherwise he actually dies to the tiny 3:15 attack wave. The other way of doing this is to trigger him immediately at the start - it gives him 2 minutes to build up, he'll sometimes have a tank before the wave hits and definitely will have the bunker and many more marines, with no need to sit through the cutscene. Not 100% sure if that'll work on Nightmare. I know you kept saying Brood Lords, but two other non-restart-the-whole-campaign ideas involving swarm hosts: You could use an overseer to view Dehaka's pathway, and there is a bit of creep there, and you can deep burrow the swarm hosts there. Not sure if it would work, but at least you're not attacking up a ramp into multiple siege breakers, plus you'll get the constant Dehaka spawns taking some hits. The slow advance near the end really helped you due to a flaw in the way attack waves work. Once you killed his factories, and he wanted to do a tank wave, he pulled a bunch of his excellently-placed defensive tanks forward. This also works in regular Brutal although is not as necessary, but you'll sometimes find the final 3 tanks are no longer there. Also, switching to the flying locusts might have helped both on that base as well as the final base - you could loft them right over the big wall from the low ground into his main production. I usually like to help Jim break out on his 15:00 or 20:00 attack wave, then he'll gradually chip away at other stuff. On regular Brutal, Jim can almost always survive the Odin attack, as long as you don't in any way delay the Odin, as he'll have his defenses plus a full attack wave including battlecruiser ready and waiting. And the Odin will tend to spend a full minute killing the battlecruiser while tons of other stuff hit it back. He'll sometimes (maybe 10%) survive Alpha Squadron - and these odds go way up if you send 20-30 zerglings after the tanks once the infantry are out of the way (or burrow them where the tanks will be). And he is crushed like an ant by Sky Fury squadron every single time and requires SIGNIFICANT help.
Bless you and your Ghost stories. Really enjoyed this series with both how good Rhyme is as a designer and how good you are as a player (yes you are I won’t let you self-deprecate!!!), great stuff
Grant, thanks for your videos. I'm glad you are so active in the SC2 community and appreciate your part in promoting these Nightmare (and all +difficulty) mods. PVP SC2 (ladder) typically causes me too much anxiety to play it, so I tend to gravitate to custom campaigns instead. I'd like to offer a suggestion for your vids. I know you've done this before after it being suggested, so I guess this is sort of a reminder; it would be nice if you positioned your face cam to the left, on top of the animated unit cards (or whatever u call it), so that we can see the command card with the spells/abilities :)
Damn man, thats one crazy mission, well played, that was a lot of multitasking required there xD The snipes on overseers really looked painful to handle, and with bases that spread out. You are the vertue of patience for sure! you get 5* as well buddy. ps oh boi Lowco will get a headache on this play through.
When you're playing WW1 French but the enemy is playing WW2 USA. Stealth seeker missile, new Raven buff. I rewinded multiple times and there was NO seeker missile or targeting line visible. "Triple Blackhammer is a Thor'n in my side" - at this point I don't know if it was intentional or not. Well, that was insane. A worthy Finale. Given the length of the video, I planned to watch it in multiple sittings but I ended up watching it all in one. Now I can't imagine how impossible LotV Nightmare will be. Looking forward to it though!
You know one change that would make jim much better. Give him a sensor tower as well as a few missile turrets. As well it'd be cool if he slow pushed up to that intersection jsut north of him
what I always hated about this missing is the fact that Jim is WEAK. would be really cool if he had actually some infrastructure and expanded and be usefull on a battlefield. but to balance it, Mengsk should reeally get Jim's shit pushed it now and then, but you'd actually have a gameplay insentive to help him, not just "uwu, my husbando!" would be also awesome if you could communicate to him, like "Jimi, can you get me some siege tanks?" or "Honey, i'd really appreciate some air" or "I'd really go for some bio now". just some choices, like 3 or 4, for fun and to be tactical. and if you could say to him "ok, let's go" or "no, wait a bit" when he decides to attack.
"Hey GGG uploaded! Lets watch this before class." *Checks video time* "Oh boy can't wait to watch this 3 hour long video over the course of the next two days!"
It's very funny how Grant's composition almost reflected modern military strategy. He had a main expeditionary force that prioritized explosive force, a series of QRF(Quick reaction force) units to respond to enemy threats and unexpected pressure, some defensible locations used as waypoints and forward operating bases, and the composition would have been heavily improved by large, area of effect mass casualty weaponry like siege tanks
Some idea about this nightmare mission: - Ghost drop for nuke is likely at same positions for all the times. If you remember them and plant spore and spine crawlers at those locations then should deal with ghost drop. You cannot guard all of them as some likely drop in enemy base but should reduce area you need to concentrate. - Small group of Zerling and overseer on patrol around the base should easily kill ghost without need to micro. Bad part is that you cannot use all army to attack as it would affect patrol team. - On ghost base that you need to restart many times, most units die from ghost snipe which use energy. There is 2 ways to deal with it: 1. send free units to burn ghost energy. 2. Send high hp unit in and out to be sniped but not killed and heal it back. - Hunter baneling can jump up cliff and not have to struck on ramp. This also could kill side units protect the ramp. - You only use viper to defend but hardly for assault. You can pull siege tank that guard path to your units to kill and blind defend units so your units can get close for the kill.
2:46: 13 honestly feels pretty appropriate using swarm hosts in this last seige..feels like it enscapsultes the zerg very well. no matter how strong the weaponry, eventually an unending tide of relentless death machines will overwhelm and devour you also raynors raiders kills: 404. error
I think half of what was keeping the Ghost count down towards the end was locusts walking over cloaked ghosts and getting shelled by siege tanks. I definitely specifically saw it happen at least once lol
Jeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeesus... well that was a great watch, I've enjoyed a lot watching HotS Nightmare and I'm really REALLY expecting LotV Nightmare, there's a lot I don't know about the intricacies of SC2 yet but watching you has really pushed me to try and finally play it so yeah congrats on doing this and for enduring!
Here you can see how much Giant Eugene Games not sees static defence as an option. A few Spine Crawler and at least one Spore Crawler at the bridge in the middle and the passage near Zargaras gate whould stop most of the nuclear lunches.
I might be misremembering, but I feel like the main appeal of WoL Nightmare for me was the balance changes. A ton of useless units and upgrades suddenly became viable and interesting, but... In HotS Nightmare, pretty much everything got nerfed into the ground. It JUST got harder, but without any really interesting changes to make up for it. The impaler/lurker and the hunter baneling are the only things that stood out to me in the entire campaign. It lost some of the the spectacle in exchange for a slog of a meatgrinder. The increase in difficulty was definitely there though, so mission accomplished I guess. It's just not as cool as the WoL version.
The changes aren’t flashy, but they’re actually more impactful than a lot of the nightmare WoL changes. Like, firebats, hellions, wraiths, and predators were buffed. Still doesn’t mean anyone uses them. But look at the unit and Kerrigan ability variety Grant used throughout the campaign.
Well no gold star for me, I admit I skipped a fair bit when things seemed to stall, but still watched most of it. Amazing work Grant, that was an impressive long haul mission. Very fitting for The Reckoning, this was an experience to watch.
2:38:20 Dude, you gotta kill the detectors! You wouldn't lose so many Swarm Hosts without Kerrigan if you focused the Science Vessel instead of the Battlecruiser. Also, I couldn't help but notice that multiple times when you've targeted a Siege Tank with your forces, you then redirect them to something else before the Siege Tank actually dies. That seems to have stalled momentum a bit.
did niadras mission get altered much in the end? The ghost waves and Jims lack of being good makes me wish the overseers had the coop ability to turn into wide static detection If only had flying locusts to sneak into that base :(
@@zaxtonhong3958 but idea is that grant's build defo lacked either those or brood lords because it constantly felt ridiculious when he had to push upramp with those lil chokepoints, either flying locust or brood lords would deal with it while also being cherry on a cake
@@zaxtonhong3958 yeah my bad, but definitely feels like creeper hosts just aren't a good choice still :( I suspect carrions would have done that one base in easily compared to how it went for grant, though perhaps early ultras would have worked too
Wow. That was insanity. And I am glad that the swarm host got it in the end, and I am very impressed with your endurance and performance! (I got a gold star ⭐ :D)
I wonder if the Impaler would have been a good choice instead of the broodlord, given how the base breaks especially at the end was such a problem. The nightmare version as far as I remember was the building busting unit. With great bonus damage and still has the massive range. To be honest I just think he needed some form of artillery to push with.
Swarm Hosts are *supposed* to be the zerg siege unit because of their super long range, but they don't work very well here because Mengsk has so many tanks and keeps building new ones. Swarm hosts rely on wearing the enemy down slowly with infinite waves of free units, but the computer gets infinite free units too so it's not really more efficient.
@@benjaminlee985 I agree in theory as the swarm host has always been hard to balance in the game. Given the difficulty of the mod I believe the use of higher damage single target units most likely only one of the two would be useful here to mix in, so as to cover the other areas needed to beat the overall situation across the missions. There were several missions Grant had the most trouble breaking through a fortified position, the planetary fortress being a bane several times over. I remember how effective the impaler was presented in the upgrade mission at doing just that. Still the loss of the luker would be painful. I like how there is no one solution just sharing my thoughts.
Grant: i don't want brood lords, they're too slow Mengsk: Kerrigan has no air to ground option? General, prepare 100 more squads of shock division, i want her entire army burning to ashes (no, mutas don't count because they're useless)
The main thing I'm seeing for the first hour, is Grant slamming cheap (but still costly) zerglings into fortifications by the tens of thousands. While I get it, when you're money starved as he seemed to be at that time, Swarmhosts REALLY come in clutch due to getting a free frontline. Yeah they aren't as numerous as Zerglings in a single wave, but unlike zerglings, you get infinite waves of swarmlings that can do moderate chip damage.
53:35 If they can take down the ultimate hybrid of doom demise and destruction... Kerrigan: SPEAK -...Then they might be able to take down a siege tank
Grant, there's probably some comments that would try and point out things you could improve or criticisms of how you played this or your commentary. I want you to know that what you pulled off was nothing short of awe-inspiring. Each small chink in Mengsk's armor you managed to push through had me on the edge of my seat! So glad I watched the full three hours, and kudos to you and all of the mod-makers involved in the project!
Well after only 1 week of watching I finally finished the video and MY GOD it was worth it! NOW THIS feels like you are fighting an emperor on his home planet that doesnt wanna die and the dominion fighting for its life to not die to the invasion WHAT AN AMAZING END to an amazing mod! now if only I was good enough to beat the regular campaign no anything higher than normal :)
The mod is out on the CCM. I hope you all enjoy!
Remember, you can play the mod on lower difficulties if you like the changes but want an easier experience.
I kinda wanted Hard difficulty to be on the same level as (vanilla) WoL Brutal, and Nightmare to be the same level as WoL Nightmare.
For those of you who wanted to see all the major unit/kerrigan/mission changes, you can find them in the changelog below the download link.
The Reckoning: (The Ghost Tank Mission)
1. Medivacs replaced with Imperial Intercessors.
2. Added expansions near Stukov and Dehaka
3. After Odin, Mengsk starts to call down nukes frequently for the remainder of the mission. Would be awesome if the “I will not be stopped!” line from sc1 plays right before it all starts.
4. Cutscenes no longer restore Kerrigan hp/energy/cooldowns
2, 3 were Grant's designs. The Reckoning, AKA how it feels to play ZvT on ladder. Shock Divisions and Emperor's Shadows to ruin your plans. If you aren't comfortable managing overseers in many different places then it's time to learn. The ghost nuke AI is a modified version of MindHawk's challenge gauntlet nukes (thanks to MindHawk for letting me use it). Instead of scaling up over time, the nuke count is based on the number of ghost academies that mengsk owns. The idea was to encourage/reward hyper-aggressive play early on, since inevitably the end will be an uber-late-game struggle.
Grant mentioned it, but I was pretty happy with how many unit types can use on this mission. Unlike All In, where like 70% of your unit types are useless, you can find a bit of use with everything you have access to (except mutas probably, but making mutas feel useful without making them op is impossible)
I'd say Reckoning is tied with All In for the hardest nightmare mission. The timings aren't as tight as All In, and you don't have to fight Kerrigan and a mega leviathan, but it's longer and you have to pay attention to more places at once.
love you guys. i checked for it just about an hour ago on ccm. Soooo excited to try this. thank yall for all the work.
It works on brutal now too with the changes? I thought WoL only had Casual, Normal, Hard and Nightmare and this would be the same.
@@theassassin100 I am pretty sure this replaces Brutal, but you can play on Hard (with nightmare you can somewhat treat it as Brutal IMO)
I assume you can you also play WoL Nightmare on lower Difficulties?
lower difficulties? Awesome! You're a hero!
Grant taking 3 hours??? Rest In Peace to the other streamers. Get ready for a 60 part series from lowko and Winter
Heart of the Swarm nightmare CO-OP streamer special when?
Wait winter did original nightmare?
@@leoneldiaz78
.
L
@@windrunner8497 yup
Idk I think if those guys actually use spores and spines to defend against the ghosts instead of snipeable overseers and have to look back to find where you're getting nukes, they'll do better.
For perspective I ran the mission on Brutal later and finished it in under 18 minutes. Did a full map clear and everything.
Nightmare is now public for everybody to play, you can download it on the GGG Custom Campaign Manager server! discord.gg/UCDyZyr6gg
Is this vanilla brutal or Nightmare rebalanced brutal?
@@theassassin100 Compare the lengths and take a guess... 😅
@@momom6197 I meant as in if I can play with the balance updates from Nightmare on brutal difficulty and not Nightmare difficulty
@@theassassin100 you can, but it wasn't tested
@@theassassin100 Well, isn't that just Nightmare Nightmare?
I can't think of a more fitting end for a zerg campaign than 2 hours of unending tides of free units slamming their heads against a wall to break the most entrenched position terran money can ever buy one fraction of an inch at a time.
The TvZ experience, equally bullshit and infuriating for both sides.
Once upon a time, the solution was mass Broodlord + Infestor. Grant doesn't have those though. The campaign solution was throwing unkillable ultralisks at the enemy until it sticks, and even that was a terrible grind because those ultralisks don't shoot up. So even Grant took 3 hours with the tools given.
If ZvT on ladder is like this, I am happy that I do not play ladder.
@@lagg1e I can confirm that this is not ZvT on ladder
@@lagg1e the ladder tvz is (in macro anyway) can the Zerg figure out what Terran is doing early to defend enough economy to force Terran into a grindy lategame where Zerg has to throw three maxed armies at the most entrenched position you've ever seen. Despite how that sounds, Zerg lategame is very scary for Terran, as you can't move out onto the map without getting demolished in straight up fights. I think basically it's even early, midgame Terran favoured, lategame Zerg favoured and extreme lategame back to Terran favoured. At least high level anyways.
@@LodeCosZvT is really mmr dependent. If you take a look at Grandmaster league, it's more of a 5 sided war with groups of ghosts and mines in medivacs flying from all sides, while zerg is spamming queens, zerglings, banes, lurkers and trying to get broodlords. It's weird.
In platinum league terrans usually can just go thor hellbat and cheese the zerg out of the game. Or the zerg outmacros and wins.
Ah nighmare edition will make a good last thing to watch before bed.... ITS HOW LONG?
If you think about it, Grant has the UED to thank for how fortified Korhal is now. Mengsk seems to have learned his lesson and fortified his nuclear silos and battlecruiser fleets to a greater degree. No chance the UED could have busted through this version of Korhal without enslaving the swarm first
Me seeing video title: ”Alright chief, give me the bad news.”
Me seeing the video length: ”That bad, huh?”
Me seeing the vid finally up: HYPE
Me seeing its length: Oh... Oh no.
To shreds you say?
@@kyledahlquist9423 Well, how's his wife holding up?
I wonder if the increased difficulty stemmed from the lack of more siege oriented zerg strains, rather than the lack of broodlords. Sure, broodlords could have helped a lot, but if I remeber correctly, impalers still have that increased range (and deal huge damage against buildings as a plus) and the carrion is more flexible with its flying locusts, allowing some more flank opportunities.
Yeah I don't doubt the difficulty of this mission, but Grant really seems to have (inadvertently) picked the strain that would make this mission the hardest. Even getting raptor lings instead of swarm lings would have made the in trenched tanks easier to get on top of and the choke points less brutal.
Which I think is actually a positive for the campaign. Regular hard and brutal feel like you can pick whatever strains you want and charge in with a maxed out army, but with nightmare you have to be very strategic about your army composition.
I'd argue that Grants strains also are perfect for a different problem in the mission with it's constant attacks and nukes, swarmlings let him react to these threats nearly instantly and reinforce his army after defending waves, the lurker let's him hold those chokes a lot better against both the heavy armor and massive infantry balls and the viper is an amazing defense tool for the tanks and thors, even the Odin. This mission is kinda stuck with a pick your poison in terms of Zerg strains. The ones you listed would make sieging the positions easier and get more ground but it'd be harder to keep that ground with lurkers to hold the chokes, vipers to disable the mech or swarmlings to keep up momentum after a push, god knows if he would be able to defend some of his outer bases without these tools too. Hard to say which one would be harder to make work but I think the mission is just really well done with both strains of these units being useful.
@@BartixShieldsmen I absolutely agree, if this would be All In but with zerg, Grant's picks would be the most ideal for defending on that mission, and no doubt that his picks also helped at defending on this one. I think the ideal would be like a 50/50 on offensive and defensive strains, but I really like that this balance isn't required to finish certain missions and instead you might have to change up your playstyle.
One thing i would like improved is Raynor's defense, i mean, i know you are supposed to help him during the big waves, but he should be able to stabilize easily without them.
This isn't a real issue, just a nuisance that you need to constantly babysit him, perhaps if he had a science vessel to help him detect would be nice, ot just better defence
That and his lack of upgrading quality. His occasional attack waves never really get any more value, despite being nearly two hours later in the mission. Hell, it'd be better if he just used Orbital Scans to reveal the occasional Emperor's Shadows moving around to nuke your base.
If your allies at least had some manner of value, it'd be better. They should never carry the mission, but if you're thinking about incremental value, you'd want them to at least help you get a little bit more done. But they're really there just acting as momentary meat shields for your units to move behind.
@@arbiterally101 you naild it i think if you are going to change a lot of things, buff and nerf stuff you should at least buff raynor he's usless here and in vanilla
I wish that Raynor's forces would scale better, with time or with the number of Mengsk's bases destroyed. Seeing the maxed out Zerg army fight against infinite free Terran mech force, and Jim shows up with one tank and a medivac is honestly kinda pathetic.
@@AbdielKavash That's the thing. Raynor has access to some things even Mengsk doesn't use.
Would have loved to see Spectres fighting for control of the periphery against Emperor's Shadows, using stuns to make it easier to engage, or Vultures laying down impromptu mine fields to deny certain streets from Mengsk's ground troops. Pirate aircraft trying to gain even a small amount of air superiority so a jumped up flying dumpster of a Hercules could pull a massive drop on the flanks. They'd still lose against the raw weight of Mengsk's armies, but these sorts of things would emphasize the Raiders as a scrappy force that brought their A-game to the fight they'd all signed up for.
The problem is honestly how the game treats TvT more than anything else. If your opponent is entrenched with tanks, ghosts, turrets and planetaries and you don't even have access to liberators, there is no way to breach it. And Megsk doesn't move his forces out of the position for Jim to do anything with siege tanks and stuff. It's just not feasible to do with incremental upgrades, this requires a complete overhaul of Raynor's faction.
But yeah, I would really like for Raynor to have like 3 bunkers and 5 siege tanks in the base. Something that just can't die to infantry, this guy has beaten All In and can't defend 20 supply harass.
Can we just appreciate how Grant hold full PG at 1:41:50 on all of us. Grant, my dude, you are a saint
I think he said "F*ck this game" on a stream 3-4 days ago when he's so frustrated that he decided to quit SC1 deathless
You can imagine the pain
Also at 26:13
@@ThanhLe-ti8nx He quitted that?
@@ThanhLe-ti8nx oh my
@@euqinuykcaj oh i missed that
I really like that the last mission is insanely hard. It isn't a bottleneck mission that makes you want to quit the campaign halfway, because it is the last. It's not like you didn't succeed if you can't win it, you already won 20. Optimally, the player would have learned in those 20 missions, and in finale they get to truly show what thay've got
I think making allies on this mission similar to allies on the Host would feel better. The allies here have 1 big attack that can't do much against the shock divisions and after that send out 1-5 zerglings. Maybe it's just a change for brutal and lower because it would make the allies more useful and the misson easier and you might want to keep nightmare as hard as possible
I was thinking that as progress gets made the other commander's waves got stronger with more varied and later game units that fit their co-op counterparts. How cool would it have been if Stukovs waves started with the infested Marines we see already, but as you get closer to Mengsk's main base he starts sending infested Banshees, Siege Tanks, a couple Apocalypses, Zagara sends more abs, the Strains of zerg units you the player, didn't choose (as a way of both following Kerrigan while doing her own thing at the same time)
Abs Raynor was just better... maybe a Tychus or just, more stuff from him in general.
I think allies must set ups a bases, and become more and more stronger (until a certain extent) while they alive, and Mengsk tries to kill them too (and its too hard to save all for too long)
I hope you remember that Tychus be dead at this point in the story.
Grant: excited at the beginning and says "Let's see how it goes."
Me: *checks the time* *spots the nearly 3 hour video* Yeah, let's SeE hOw It GoEs. *sweats profusely*
3 hours?! Grant, you are a legend for not quitting at all! We, your fans, salute your efforts! And we eagerly await Rhyme to finish LOTV Nightmare edition for more hilarious moments and painful fails of Grant.
The Wreckoning really did come for Grant in the end. Now we have a new record for the longest Nightmare mission time.
It's not going to be beat by LotV either, since the last mission is a timed one.
@@nikolaysitnikov796 The Host could be insane if the spires are even so slightly buffed. Even on base Brutal they can delete a maxed out army if you don't abuse the SoA (which I assume is going to get heavy nerfs in Nightmare).
For the defenses of the Imperial Palace, Mengsk hired Rogal Dorn to make the Siege of Terra look like a schoolboys' fight
What Kerrigan needs to do is hire some Protoss mercenaries. They can build canons, that can both detect and kill ghosts, and some probes.
I didn't skip, but I did pause a couple times.
I was incorrect with my guess of >2h.
I was... drastically wrong with my guess of about 1500 enemies killed.
And I'm super happy that I called you using Swarm Hosts here. Pretty sure this might not be possible without Swarm Hosts or Brood Lords.
This series has been an utter blast to witness, and I am looking forward to LoTV Nightmare :D
Really feels odd that your enemies are competent and insanely strong while your allies are pushovers. Jim's such a neat character and it feels really bad that he's such a joke in this mission. Nightmare could have fixed that but just didn't.
Edit: something else I noticed throughout the campaign: alot of these later missions seemed to boil down to using infestor/swarm host when the map runs out of minerals. Feels weird that there aren't more minerals in general to fund your armies? If the point was to make the campaign Heart of the Swarm, not Heart of the Kerrigan, then surely you'd have more minerals to throw at your enemies?
Really loved the series overall. I am SO excited for Nightmare LotV when that eventually comes out. Love ya
Grant used swarm hosts on a whopping 2 missions. And infestors on a whopping 1 mission. wdym "a lot of these later missions"
Infestor doesn't even work when you run out of minerals because infested marines cost minerals in this mod.
@sasa asasasa Not even that unit puzzles are a bad thing, I think that's something this mod did well because in the base game all you need is Kerrigan, the army comp doesn't matter. But I definitely agree that some of these missions were basically designed around not using certain units (like mutas throughout the entire campaign) or totally making certain units required (like Abs in the ultralisk mission).
@TheRealRhyme Huh, yeah I guess you're right. I thought I saw them pop up alot more often.
Still, the weird thing I'm seeing is that when hosts are used, they have to be used. That is to say, no other unit in the game can be used besides them because they just make free units on maps with low minerals and lots of enemies. I'm just looking back to SC1 and Broodwar (when the zerg really felt like an unstoppable force, a swarm) where the later stage zerg missions were PACKED with money in various enemy-controlled expansions around the map. That's what really allowed you to be the zerg. In SC2 you just don't get that, and I'd figure since the mod was supposed to put the emphasis back into the swarm and have Kerrigan take a back seat, this older style would have been reintroduced. I'd say for alot of the missions the changes you made helped A LOT, but there are still a few weird ones like this that force you into using certain units or you just lose the game. I mostly blame blizzard for designing the swarmhost in the first place, it's easily my least favorite unit in all of starcraft. I feel like it's a bandaid of sorts to make up for low-eco maps, and that carries over in this mod for a few missions.
@@mtfoxtrot5296no other unit
Broodlords, my man. Broodlords.
You can also try to play mass viper energy with abducts. It's ridiculously hard and apm intensive at times, but somewhat viable.
That was so, so SO many nukes and tanks. @v@ Absolutely living up to the Nightmare name
This is the most completely insane mission I have ever seen. It's just magnificent. Congrats to Grant for winning this thing after *almost three hours real time* and Rhyme for making the most horrifying citadel of a base in Starcraft 2 that I'm aware of.
That was an awesome show. ^v^
"Kerrigan, you were supposed to be a Ghost, why aren't you as good as them?" She was, hence the nerfs xD
And yet, I still remember the Mengsk Dreadnaught as an absolute highlight
Mengsk Dreadnaught? What’s this?
@@lelouchvibritannia7809 Twitch Trolls Grant HoS finale had Mengsk duking it out against Kerrigan in his supermassive flagship - and the entire Military Industrial Complex of over 11 Odins
@@yochaiwyss3843 it's actually more than 30 odins over the course of that game, each odin was like 10 bucks so that's 300 bucks alone
@@anvietanh6723 I honestly feel that the twitchtrolls version was more entertaining than this one
2:36:58
That factory made a siege tank ... Long after its tech reactor was destroyed.
Mengsk, that's illegal.
That final area bust was insane.
So many mechanical units
Holy hell. No way id be able to beat something as insane as this. Even if it took long that was really awesome to watch. Well done and thanks Grant!!
You can play with the nightmare mod changes on lower difficulties. I agree though that I don't think I could beat this either. I managed to make it all the way to All-In nightmare mode before failing and this looks just as difficult in a different way.
You did kinda pass up on all three Zerg siege units with impaler, broodlord and flying locusts
This mission definitely seems built with brood lords in mind. Grant showed you can definitely win without them, but since they're on a non-reversible fork via evolution mission it feels rough to not have access to them.
Definitely props to Rhyme on the mission overall though. Encouraging the use of every single tool the Swarm has access to is the way a final mission should feel.
Tbf, flying locusts, broodlords, or the reworked impalers would've all been really helpful. I've just been wondering the whole series why Grant kept choosing the non-siege option for each of the evolution missions when he knew the last mission was a siege mission.
That said, I think the whole evolution system is dumb anyway, but that's a vanilla HoTS problem. If you're trying a new campaign (whether modded, challenge run, or just playing the base campaign for the first time), you've got no idea which of the evolution paths will be more useful later down the line, so you're basically guessing based on the performance of units in a highly scripted and free win mission specifically designed to put the unit in its best possible light. And it's not like in WoL, where you're picking between largely inconsequential units, while getting most of the core of your force, you straight up have to pick between 2 entirely different, very powerful, and highly situational units.
@@JanSenCheng On that note, I will say that the evolution flaw is significantly exacerbated by the nightmare mod being difficult enough to make it a problem. In the actual campaign which the evolution system was built for, the campaign is easy enough even on Brutal, that evolution choice does not bottleneck you on any mission at all. I've never personally felt awful for not being able to change my choices down the line, as I've not played any modded campaigns.
@@JanSenCheng Late, but poor internet on a 3 hr vid is... yeah
Anyhow it's a replay ability factor, split choices. While it doesn't allow for mid-campaign flexibility, that's the purpose of Kerri and Mutations.
It's so funny, there are a bunch of moments, like at 2:29:53, where Giant and Kerrigan literally have a conversation, like "what is it this time?" "is that the play?" "no"
Am I the only one who screamed "static defense!!" to the screen when i saw the nukes? I think that would help a lot. Also, is a shame allies can't be better, but i guess is not easy to change that in a good way.
I like how the ending basically devolved into Trench warfare with the Swarmhosts.
More like Soviet humanwave tactics
"If we have more men than they have bullets, we cant lose"
@@jarskil8862 Soviets didn't use "human wave" tactics, ask any reputable historian. The casualty figures are inflated buy counting the people who were encircled at the very start of the war, and not counting the casualties amongst the germans who became POWs. Even though the soviets lost more almost always during the first half of the war, many battles were actully good for the USSR in terms of k/d ratio, for instance the soviets lost either equal or 1/3 less than the germans in Stalingrad, the most important and deadliest battle of the war.
Without using spores and spines, the nuking ghosts are incredibly difficult to deal with. Your issue with static defense is biting you in the ass.
It does kinda feel like you skipped every siege unit in favor of the defense variant, viper instead of broodlord, creep swarmhost instead of flying locusts (which wouldn't have to deal with tanks), lurkers instead of impalers. It would even have helped I think if you had droppods or levi instead of apoc, although apoc did a lot it is hard to use it to focus down buildings it seems.
That was ridiculous. I watched all of this because I felt like I had to after you suffered through playing it. The fact that you are capable of continuing to play after dealing with map wide ghost/nuke harass for over 2 hours is the greatest display of starcraft skill I have ever seen from you. Thank you for using purple swarm hosts. They are my favorite.
This is my favorite episode of yours yet. That last hour was riveting. Keep up the good work Grant and Rhyme!
3 hour video, 1:55:25 in game time. Grant makes StarCraft2 history. Not only did we get to see what units pay for themselves when put to the test but we got to see elite skills put to the test. This was by far the most realistic way this chapter went down. Epic, bloody, bare knuckles dug in drawn out fight. The ultimate Terran turtle vs the endless Zerg tide and Grant did not disappoint! 🍻 cheers to Grant and chat!
This mission just feels right as the end of Mengsk. Such a fortress of a map.
I know this is like a year late but I finally got caught up on the series. It was a great watch! I've played the original of this map on Brutal over 2000 times as I love it and I'm constantly making editor tweaks to do weird things with it, but it's also given me some knowledge that might help others attempting this.
First, Grant mentions letting the full Raynor cutscene play, otherwise he actually dies to the tiny 3:15 attack wave. The other way of doing this is to trigger him immediately at the start - it gives him 2 minutes to build up, he'll sometimes have a tank before the wave hits and definitely will have the bunker and many more marines, with no need to sit through the cutscene. Not 100% sure if that'll work on Nightmare.
I know you kept saying Brood Lords, but two other non-restart-the-whole-campaign ideas involving swarm hosts: You could use an overseer to view Dehaka's pathway, and there is a bit of creep there, and you can deep burrow the swarm hosts there. Not sure if it would work, but at least you're not attacking up a ramp into multiple siege breakers, plus you'll get the constant Dehaka spawns taking some hits.
The slow advance near the end really helped you due to a flaw in the way attack waves work. Once you killed his factories, and he wanted to do a tank wave, he pulled a bunch of his excellently-placed defensive tanks forward. This also works in regular Brutal although is not as necessary, but you'll sometimes find the final 3 tanks are no longer there.
Also, switching to the flying locusts might have helped both on that base as well as the final base - you could loft them right over the big wall from the low ground into his main production.
I usually like to help Jim break out on his 15:00 or 20:00 attack wave, then he'll gradually chip away at other stuff.
On regular Brutal, Jim can almost always survive the Odin attack, as long as you don't in any way delay the Odin, as he'll have his defenses plus a full attack wave including battlecruiser ready and waiting. And the Odin will tend to spend a full minute killing the battlecruiser while tons of other stuff hit it back. He'll sometimes (maybe 10%) survive Alpha Squadron - and these odds go way up if you send 20-30 zerglings after the tanks once the infantry are out of the way (or burrow them where the tanks will be). And he is crushed like an ant by Sky Fury squadron every single time and requires SIGNIFICANT help.
Bless you and your Ghost stories.
Really enjoyed this series with both how good Rhyme is as a designer and how good you are as a player (yes you are I won’t let you self-deprecate!!!), great stuff
Grant, thanks for your videos. I'm glad you are so active in the SC2 community and appreciate your part in promoting these Nightmare (and all +difficulty) mods. PVP SC2 (ladder) typically causes me too much anxiety to play it, so I tend to gravitate to custom campaigns instead. I'd like to offer a suggestion for your vids. I know you've done this before after it being suggested, so I guess this is sort of a reminder; it would be nice if you positioned your face cam to the left, on top of the animated unit cards (or whatever u call it), so that we can see the command card with the spells/abilities :)
Yeah I think snipe needs a slight nerf maybe higher energy cost cause thats insane the amount one ghost just pops off
Damn man, thats one crazy mission, well played, that was a lot of multitasking required there xD
The snipes on overseers really looked painful to handle, and with bases that spread out.
You are the vertue of patience for sure!
you get 5* as well buddy.
ps oh boi Lowco will get a headache on this play through.
The final push. Build a spore crawler and have detection?
When you're playing WW1 French but the enemy is playing WW2 USA.
Stealth seeker missile, new Raven buff. I rewinded multiple times and there was NO seeker missile or targeting line visible.
"Triple Blackhammer is a Thor'n in my side" - at this point I don't know if it was intentional or not.
Well, that was insane. A worthy Finale. Given the length of the video, I planned to watch it in multiple sittings but I ended up watching it all in one. Now I can't imagine how impossible LotV Nightmare will be. Looking forward to it though!
cant wait to see how much more the difficulty can be raised with the protoss campaign
You know one change that would make jim much better. Give him a sensor tower as well as a few missile turrets. As well it'd be cool if he slow pushed up to that intersection jsut north of him
what I always hated about this missing is the fact that Jim is WEAK.
would be really cool if he had actually some infrastructure and expanded and be usefull on a battlefield.
but to balance it, Mengsk should reeally get Jim's shit pushed it now and then, but you'd actually have a gameplay insentive to help him, not just "uwu, my husbando!"
would be also awesome if you could communicate to him, like "Jimi, can you get me some siege tanks?" or "Honey, i'd really appreciate some air" or "I'd really go for some bio now". just some choices, like 3 or 4, for fun and to be tactical. and if you could say to him "ok, let's go" or "no, wait a bit" when he decides to attack.
1:07:18 ''am I just a better gamer''
10 sec later ''dies''
"Hey GGG uploaded! Lets watch this before class."
*Checks video time*
"Oh boy can't wait to watch this 3 hour long video over the course of the next two days!"
It's very funny how Grant's composition almost reflected modern military strategy. He had a main expeditionary force that prioritized explosive force, a series of QRF(Quick reaction force) units to respond to enemy threats and unexpected pressure, some defensible locations used as waypoints and forward operating bases, and the composition would have been heavily improved by large, area of effect mass casualty weaponry like siege tanks
Some episodes were longer than average movie, this one will feel like extended edition.
Some idea about this nightmare mission:
- Ghost drop for nuke is likely at same positions for all the times. If you remember them and plant spore and spine crawlers at those locations then should deal with ghost drop. You cannot guard all of them as some likely drop in enemy base but should reduce area you need to concentrate.
- Small group of Zerling and overseer on patrol around the base should easily kill ghost without need to micro. Bad part is that you cannot use all army to attack as it would affect patrol team.
- On ghost base that you need to restart many times, most units die from ghost snipe which use energy. There is 2 ways to deal with it: 1. send free units to burn ghost energy. 2. Send high hp unit in and out to be sniped but not killed and heal it back.
- Hunter baneling can jump up cliff and not have to struck on ramp. This also could kill side units protect the ramp.
- You only use viper to defend but hardly for assault. You can pull siege tank that guard path to your units to kill and blind defend units so your units can get close for the kill.
also on last part pushes its vrey important to take infrastruture fast. Some amount of units should be microed to do it.
You probably are supposed to have at least one siege evolution (carrion, impaler or broodlords) but you picked the alternatives for all three lol
Thank you for this series and another awesome mod. It was a blast to watch. I will try it on hard, cause I suck and enjoy it to the fullest
Well, this was a really long but exciting and fun ride :)
Thank you very much for your dedication to finishing this mission no matter the cost.
2:46: 13 honestly feels pretty appropriate using swarm hosts in this last seige..feels like it enscapsultes the zerg very well. no matter how strong the weaponry, eventually an unending tide of relentless death machines will overwhelm and devour you
also raynors raiders kills: 404. error
I think half of what was keeping the Ghost count down towards the end was locusts walking over cloaked ghosts and getting shelled by siege tanks. I definitely specifically saw it happen at least once lol
That last half hour was a real headbanger of Grant complaining about tanks and me screaming vipers lol. But he won so yay.
Grant really needs someone to tell him what it means to break a siege.
Jeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeesus... well that was a great watch, I've enjoyed a lot watching HotS Nightmare and I'm really REALLY expecting LotV Nightmare, there's a lot I don't know about the intricacies of SC2 yet but watching you has really pushed me to try and finally play it so yeah congrats on doing this and for enduring!
Here you can see how much Giant Eugene Games not sees static defence as an option. A few Spine Crawler and at least one Spore Crawler at the bridge in the middle and the passage near Zargaras gate whould stop most of the nuclear lunches.
almost 3 hours HOLY SHIT
i'm scared what could happen in lotv nightmare
I watched this over the span of three days and it was worth it, I loved this series
I might be misremembering, but I feel like the main appeal of WoL Nightmare for me was the balance changes. A ton of useless units and upgrades suddenly became viable and interesting, but... In HotS Nightmare, pretty much everything got nerfed into the ground. It JUST got harder, but without any really interesting changes to make up for it. The impaler/lurker and the hunter baneling are the only things that stood out to me in the entire campaign. It lost some of the the spectacle in exchange for a slog of a meatgrinder.
The increase in difficulty was definitely there though, so mission accomplished I guess. It's just not as cool as the WoL version.
The changes aren’t flashy, but they’re actually more impactful than a lot of the nightmare WoL changes.
Like, firebats, hellions, wraiths, and predators were buffed. Still doesn’t mean anyone uses them.
But look at the unit and Kerrigan ability variety Grant used throughout the campaign.
This is 1 hour longer than Nightmare Wings of Liberty finale which was All in Ground version.
Jesus
Every time Grant is in pain because of Jim I will be here to remind everyone that "Jim" means "burden" in Korean.
That was amazing!! GG GGG!!! The only change I would make to this finale would be to give Jim 3/3!
Well no gold star for me, I admit I skipped a fair bit when things seemed to stall, but still watched most of it. Amazing work Grant, that was an impressive long haul mission. Very fitting for The Reckoning, this was an experience to watch.
2:38:20
Dude, you gotta kill the detectors! You wouldn't lose so many Swarm Hosts without Kerrigan if you focused the Science Vessel instead of the Battlecruiser.
Also, I couldn't help but notice that multiple times when you've targeted a Siege Tank with your forces, you then redirect them to something else before the Siege Tank actually dies. That seems to have stalled momentum a bit.
'Jimothy' - I like that. It rhymes with 'liability'.
that's great game! One thing I think would have helped you is putting your zerglings+overseers on patrol around the bases to watch out for ghosts.
did niadras mission get altered much in the end?
The ghost waves and Jims lack of being good makes me wish the overseers had the coop ability to turn into wide static detection
If only had flying locusts to sneak into that base :(
They aren’t mutually exclusive. The flying competes with the teleport. You can have flying locusts that hit up if you pick carrion
@@zaxtonhong3958 but idea is that grant's build defo lacked either those or brood lords because it constantly felt ridiculious when he had to push upramp with those lil chokepoints, either flying locust or brood lords would deal with it while also being cherry on a cake
@@zaxtonhong3958 yeah my bad, but definitely feels like creeper hosts just aren't a good choice still :( I suspect carrions would have done that one base in easily compared to how it went for grant, though perhaps early ultras would have worked too
That was a meat grinder! XD
Thanks for going through and the load of fun! ^^
A "Select Idle Queen" button would be nice to have when playing zerg
Just imagine like ONE brood lord on that right-side base, or flying swarm host locusts!
22:58 ICONIC voiceline.
Wow. That was insanity.
And I am glad that the swarm host got it in the end, and I am very impressed with your endurance and performance!
(I got a gold star ⭐ :D)
Holy crap, 3hrs is nuts. See yall on the other side.
I stayed for the big relief energy at the end and was not disappointed :D
THIS is the essence of Nightmare Edition! The stuff of nightmares!
Watched the entire vid start to finish in one go, best use of an afternoon I've had. XD
The dominion military budget is really something huh
three hours for the finale :)
congrats grant ! I'll watch this one when I'll can after work :)
What a marathon! Kerrigan killed more than Reynor's whole army...
Awesome playthrough. So awesome and I hope LotV is possible to balance!
Omg you are so good at this game. Freaking amazing. Took this long for me on brutal. Your videos are so good
So an xmas present for grant is an alarm clock that plays up ghost quotes and nuclear launch detected.
I know it's nightmare but it would have been nice to see Jim able to do something
Great job Grant and great job Rhyme! I can't wait to play through the mod on Hard (and never even think about touching Nightmare).
That looked grueling but bravo to Rhyme for creating the mod and to you Grant for conquering it.
That was quite the finale! Very well done and very entertaining!
Death, taxes and that one tank constantly going to that one spot
I wonder if the Impaler would have been a good choice instead of the broodlord, given how the base breaks especially at the end was such a problem.
The nightmare version as far as I remember was the building busting unit. With great bonus damage and still has the massive range.
To be honest I just think he needed some form of artillery to push with.
Swarm Hosts are *supposed* to be the zerg siege unit because of their super long range, but they don't work very well here because Mengsk has so many tanks and keeps building new ones. Swarm hosts rely on wearing the enemy down slowly with infinite waves of free units, but the computer gets infinite free units too so it's not really more efficient.
@@benjaminlee985 I agree in theory as the swarm host has always been hard to balance in the game. Given the difficulty of the mod I believe the use of higher damage single target units most likely only one of the two would be useful here to mix in, so as to cover the other areas needed to beat the overall situation across the missions.
There were several missions Grant had the most trouble breaking through a fortified position, the planetary fortress being a bane several times over. I remember how effective the impaler was presented in the upgrade mission at doing just that. Still the loss of the luker would be painful. I like how there is no one solution just sharing my thoughts.
I'd love to see Serral play this campaign. I don't care if he doesn't say a word the whole time.
Cant wait for Legacy of the Void: NIGHTMARE Difficulty...
Grant: i don't want brood lords, they're too slow
Mengsk: Kerrigan has no air to ground option? General, prepare 100 more squads of shock division, i want her entire army burning to ashes
(no, mutas don't count because they're useless)
The main thing I'm seeing for the first hour, is Grant slamming cheap (but still costly) zerglings into fortifications by the tens of thousands. While I get it, when you're money starved as he seemed to be at that time, Swarmhosts REALLY come in clutch due to getting a free frontline. Yeah they aren't as numerous as Zerglings in a single wave, but unlike zerglings, you get infinite waves of swarmlings that can do moderate chip damage.
Over and under.
Good work Grant. I just watch this (3 sitting mind you) and I'm tired.
i'm glad we can skip to the end. 3 hour video far too long. it was nice seeing a harder story mode. fantastic job finishing this!
53:35 If they can take down the ultimate hybrid of doom demise and destruction...
Kerrigan: SPEAK
-...Then they might be able to take down a siege tank
Grant, there's probably some comments that would try and point out things you could improve or criticisms of how you played this or your commentary.
I want you to know that what you pulled off was nothing short of awe-inspiring. Each small chink in Mengsk's armor you managed to push through had me on the edge of my seat! So glad I watched the full three hours, and kudos to you and all of the mod-makers involved in the project!
Well after only 1 week of watching I finally finished the video and MY GOD it was worth it! NOW THIS feels like you are fighting an emperor on his home planet that doesnt wanna die and the dominion fighting for its life to not die to the invasion WHAT AN AMAZING END to an amazing mod! now if only I was good enough to beat the regular campaign no anything higher than normal :)