@@DanielGullmanFrancis my work schedule does not permit it. Possibly I might request a demo from your dealers when I visit the west coast on a holiday.
Wonderful. Can't wait to hear it. I just auditioned a Premier in my system and was fairly blown away. I have a DCS Vivaldi Apex now and couldn't believe first that the Premier was indeed better, and then that it was so much better in almost every way. This was in my system and to my ears, of course, ymmv.
Awesome to hear! I use the Premier DAC in my system, but I may upgrade to the Cascade as soon as we have a demo unit available... The Premier DAC is so very excellent, were you using a digital director with it as well?
Very smart design! I do like the Select II look better, but nice to further isolate the digital processes, and reduce the number of PSUs in the system (vs with Director).
GM☕️👍 I admire this setup..tho I personally can do without the preamplifier … Now if you could only break that price point …I just got my probable last DAC ..so I’m good . Great unit , I wish you continued success 🥂
The production quality looks excellent. I'm really interested in the difference in sound quality compared to the 1000-1500€ dac. I wonder if all the engineering effort really makes a huge difference in sound quality?
Currently, but in the next two years we expect to release The Sentinel DAC, a new flagship. There will be an upgrade path from the Cascade to the Sentinel.
Hello, from an engineer prospective you didn't mention anything in regards of improvements. Moving away digitial and analogue section may sound great for some people, but there are many good highend examples out there saying exactly the opposite: keeping everything as close/short as possible. Keeping transformers, toroidal isolated does every DAC, even for 2k ... so I hope just having new display, fancy feets and adding another box is NOT the most innovation 😉
I think that argument goes more for clocks. IMO it's always a benefit to get digital noise out of the DAC. My experience the more stuff crammed into a DAC, the worse it sounds.
I hear you. We will have a longer form breakdown video coming out in the next few weeks. Take a deeper look inside and see if we can convince you. We do avoid publishing measurements as they are easy to manipulate. As engineers know, you can make a graph or chart convince anyone of anything. Plus, I won't deny there are a lot of great electronics out there for 2K. We are doing something different for the folks who want the same thing we are interested in. People are so creative and we love to see the many ways and things they come up with. Enjoy!
There are two possibilities here: either this DAC is indeed needed for a true to source representation, in which case this hobby sucks since you need 100K in order to listen to some good sound quality music, or this DAC is not actually needed and can't surpass normal (priced) DACs in terms of SQ, in which case you gotta be nuts to pay such a premium price just for the looks. Either way, it is not OK for a DAC to cost this much.
Rather than adding a DAC to the top tier, IMO, it would have been smarter to prove you guys can make a better DAC for $10K than anyone else. Of course, only if you were truly confident you have the technical chops to pull it off. Remember, most people logically think most manufacturers with a sky is the limit budget can make a great sounding DAC.
There was the Analog DAC, and the Discrete isn't that far off. I wouldn't say these are absolutely better than anything else in the price range though, because R2R DACs, FPGA/DSD, Delta-Sigma chips all sound different.
@highendaudio, yup, but with a 2nd PSU it's $20K, and it's not appreciably better than other DACs in that $ range. MSB is a good manufacturer and their game is the high end, I get it, but there's an argument to be made that making a killer $10K DAC as a demo of its prowess could be a way to increase brand awareness/sales. Just my 2 cents.
@@michaelmityok1001 the second PSU is $20k? Huh? It’s $1450. Trust me, I sell more MSB than anyone. The Discrete with the second PSU is far better than any other dac in that price range. I’ve had dozens in here: dcs and the like. Even the brightback designs and the moola moola.
$95K ? If so, I would rather buy 2 SUV's. Perfect example of the madness of high end audio... There is NO WAY the engineering of a DAC is more complicated than the engineering of an automobile...
Problem with MSB they make you pay 💰 too much at the bottom entry point to buy their DACs which after buying the base model you still have to pay 💰 more for basic upgrades. I’ve have listened to them multiple times and it is a love it hate thing. Now the TOTL was pretty impressive but basically only the so called 1% can buy them.
Thanks for the feedback, it is something we are working on. Our goal is to include more features up front so the upgrades don't add up. Our older sales models had everything customizable, and it really was getting out of hand. It was expensive and difficult to support so many options.
There are already so many good DACs out there at a lower price. This is our specialty, but please check out the broader market. It is a golden age for digital products.
The build quality of Msb Dac is awesome. Looking forward to a demo whenever a store is nearby.
Thank you Rohit, excited for you to audition it. Will you be attending the Munich High End show?
@@DanielGullmanFrancis my work schedule does not permit it. Possibly I might request a demo from your dealers when I visit the west coast on a holiday.
Wonderful. Can't wait to hear it. I just auditioned a Premier in my system and was fairly blown away. I have a DCS Vivaldi Apex now and couldn't believe first that the Premier was indeed better, and then that it was so much better in almost every way. This was in my system and to my ears, of course, ymmv.
Awesome to hear! I use the Premier DAC in my system, but I may upgrade to the Cascade as soon as we have a demo unit available... The Premier DAC is so very excellent, were you using a digital director with it as well?
Very smart design! I do like the Select II look better, but nice to further isolate the digital processes, and reduce the number of PSUs in the system (vs with Director).
Thank you! Always refining the process and designs. The Select will always be a favorite in design.
GM☕️👍
I admire this setup..tho I personally can do without the preamplifier …
Now if you could only break that price point …I just got my probable last DAC ..so I’m good .
Great unit , I wish you continued success 🥂
You can bypass (turn off) the preamp/VC section.
Thanks! We try to keep the functionality as flexible as possible. Glad to hear you have your forever DAC, enjoy.
The production quality looks excellent. I'm really interested in the difference in sound quality compared to the 1000-1500€ dac. I wonder if all the engineering effort really makes a huge difference in sound quality?
So in time there will be some trickle down to the Discrete end of the MSB DAC scale?
We are always learning and applying what we know. No updates in the works at the moment, but when we do, I am sure it will be stellar.
.
Aaahh........ there they are, vindication & the fiber connection.
Is this now the top of the line DAC?
Yes
Currently, but in the next two years we expect to release The Sentinel DAC, a new flagship. There will be an upgrade path from the Cascade to the Sentinel.
Cost? Where can I purchase?
MSB SELECT DAC is similar in tech goes for $115,000.00 and yet, it cant beat a true analog setup....
$95K. Suncoast Audio.
@@highendaudio I will take a dozen at that price! ;-) Gorgeous units for sure.
Hello, from an engineer prospective you didn't mention anything in regards of improvements. Moving away digitial and analogue section may sound great for some people, but there are many good highend examples out there saying exactly the opposite: keeping everything as close/short as possible. Keeping transformers, toroidal isolated does every DAC, even for 2k ... so I hope just having new display, fancy feets and adding another box is NOT the most innovation 😉
I think that argument goes more for clocks. IMO it's always a benefit to get digital noise out of the DAC. My experience the more stuff crammed into a DAC, the worse it sounds.
I hear you. We will have a longer form breakdown video coming out in the next few weeks. Take a deeper look inside and see if we can convince you. We do avoid publishing measurements as they are easy to manipulate. As engineers know, you can make a graph or chart convince anyone of anything. Plus, I won't deny there are a lot of great electronics out there for 2K. We are doing something different for the folks who want the same thing we are interested in. People are so creative and we love to see the many ways and things they come up with. Enjoy!
@@chipsnmydip Here here!
There are two possibilities here: either this DAC is indeed needed for a true to source representation, in which case this hobby sucks since you need 100K in order to listen to some good sound quality music, or this DAC is not actually needed and can't surpass normal (priced) DACs in terms of SQ, in which case you gotta be nuts to pay such a premium price just for the looks. Either way, it is not OK for a DAC to cost this much.
As simple as putting the links and the umbilicals one below the other so that one can connect them like a human being:(
Rather than adding a DAC to the top tier, IMO, it would have been smarter to prove you guys can make a better DAC for $10K than anyone else. Of course, only if you were truly confident you have the technical chops to pull it off. Remember, most people logically think most manufacturers with a sky is the limit budget can make a great sounding DAC.
Yeh but that won’t buy them a new Ferrari. 😅
There was the Analog DAC, and the Discrete isn't that far off. I wouldn't say these are absolutely better than anything else in the price range though, because R2R DACs, FPGA/DSD, Delta-Sigma chips all sound different.
They already do. It’s called the Discrete. Add a second PSU and look out!
@highendaudio, yup, but with a 2nd PSU it's $20K, and it's not appreciably better than other DACs in that $ range. MSB is a good manufacturer and their game is the high end, I get it, but there's an argument to be made that making a killer $10K DAC as a demo of its prowess could be a way to increase brand awareness/sales. Just my 2 cents.
@@michaelmityok1001 the second PSU is $20k? Huh? It’s $1450. Trust me, I sell more MSB than anyone. The Discrete with the second PSU is far better than any other dac in that price range. I’ve had dozens in here: dcs and the like. Even the brightback designs and the moola moola.
$95K ? If so, I would rather buy 2 SUV's. Perfect example of the madness of high end audio... There is NO WAY the engineering of a DAC is more complicated than the engineering of an automobile...
Agreed... economy of scale is a real thing in the auto industry. We will keep lowering our prices as our production gets leaner. Cheers.
@@DanielGullmanFrancis ...which is unfortunately not the case for the very niche high end audio market...
@@marcusfordal4973 Indeed!
Problem with MSB they make you pay 💰 too much at the bottom entry point to buy their DACs which after buying the base model you still have to pay 💰 more for basic upgrades. I’ve have listened to them multiple times and it is a love it hate thing. Now the TOTL was pretty impressive but basically only the so called 1% can buy them.
Thanks for the feedback, it is something we are working on. Our goal is to include more features up front so the upgrades don't add up. Our older sales models had everything customizable, and it really was getting out of hand. It was expensive and difficult to support so many options.
Make a lower price DAC!
There are already so many good DACs out there at a lower price. This is our specialty, but please check out the broader market. It is a golden age for digital products.
Over 100K for this.
or $1,000 for a good vinyl (true analog))setup that beats this.
Glad you found a system that suits you! Enjoy.
Only $95,000.00. Yikes! I could get a great car at that price.
Indeed. Or 527 years of Netflix... that would entertain for longer ;)