Sabriyah Saeed | Partition of India Debate | Proposition (1/6)
Вставка
- Опубліковано 22 бер 2018
- *The speaker in this video is a competitive debater, and therefore the views expressed may not necessarily represent their beliefs. *
SUBSCRIBE for more speakers ► is.gd/OxfordUnion
Oxford Union on Facebook: / theoxfordunion
Oxford Union on Twitter: @OxfordUnion
Website: www.oxford-union.org/
Thursday 1st March 2018.
The Motion: This House Regrets The Partition of India.
Sabriyah Saeed opens the case for the proposition, as the first speaker of six in the debate.
Motion Carried.
ABOUT THE OXFORD UNION SOCIETY: The Oxford Union is the world's most prestigious debating society, with an unparalleled reputation for bringing international guests and speakers to Oxford. Since 1823, the Union has been promoting debate and discussion not just in Oxford University, but across the globe.
"If two fish are fighting in a river, an Englishman must have passed by" - Native American saying.
Partition was long back. But unfortunately, the Indian subcontinent muslims still have the same habits of medieval Islam of intolerance. In any neighborhood they live, they will implement unspoken sharia.
After British left, it was still possible to live like good neighbors. Now it is virtual battlefield, thanks to the values of Islam practiced in Indian subcontinent. Irrespective of British presence, Indian subcontinent muslims should reform and develop modern values. Blaming British to avoid introspection won't help.
That was good one.
👌
Haha. This maybe true. But Islam was at war with India for 1000 years
He was Capt Fisher in Punchh Birder feeding Angrez King?
As an Indian I don't regret the partition at all and I guess the Pakistanis don't either. Partition gave India especially Hindus a great breathing space. Also, it created a buffer zone between India and Afghanistan. Can you imagine India dealing with the Taliban on the western front. It's very easy to talk about living together and that kumbaya bullshit, but in reality it's very different and that's why I appreciate the honesty of Pakistanis who believe in two nation theory.
Agree
Partition have us Islamic terrorism and radicalism, and robbed many people of their homelands. What good is that? And without Pakistan, the Taliban would likely never exist anyway. And what has the "breathing space" gotten us anyway?
Funny, people who actually caused the 'Partition Mess' inviting others to debate about it.
They didn't created this problem. They just pillaged and threw away. Like they never cared what will happen later. They never matched themselves with us. They were there just to rule and loot by fooling us in hindu muslims. We got used as they wanted.
Muslims voted to created a Islamic nation
They were not forced but when time came to move they all didn’t went to Pakistan
They should go now
They did not cause this. That region was always divided and hostile/violent towards each other. No matter how you slice it, there is no way to avoid conflicts.
@@imanfateh3261 have u ever heard "divide and rule"?
@@pranilpatil4109Forced unity is no better. Remember it used to be a collection of kingdoms fighting with each other before the British came. There was no such thing as India
Pakistan had person like Jinnah
We were blessed to have Dr APJ Abdul Kalam😇🙏
@paul Wesley ya✌
@tyler durden bro i understand ur thinking but not all muslims are bad
There r both.. gud n bad ppl in all religions!
@tyler durden ✌
Jinnah was Indian too.
@@abhishekchavan3542 its not about good or bad people. Its about the core tenets of Islam. Its expantionist and convertionist and socio political in nature. And it doesnt allow reform or criticism. Thats not compatible with secular democracy. In secular democracy religions will have to be up for scrutity.
As a British Pakistani - my grandad migrated to the UK - I and many Pakistanis think it was a mistake preferred Mr ghandis vision of a unified India, would have been a super power today.
And more hindu dominant also
@@saeedaayob9004 yes. We are making our Muslims suffer. So much that our Muslim population is more than entire Pakistan's. So sad, I feel ashamed
@@saeedaayob9004 so what if it was Hindu dominated? India is hindu dominated and more prosperous than its divided part which is muslim dominated/
@@saeedaayob9004 aunty religion religion karke hi apka mulk Gand Marwa raha hai Abhi bhikari hogya
Afghan/Baloch rebellions under the British Raj would have continued for a Unified India. Not all of them accepted Pakistan let alone India. However the people of the Frontier were pro Congress and had no support base for the Muslim League.
It's so nice of her to wear Sari in this debate. She looks beautiful.
Śyēn I know right. so powerful.
Tyrion Lannister pakistani women also wear sari
Perfect for a talk on Pakistan, Syen.
Yes instead of Kim kardashian clothes...be proud of your heritage your country of origin...and wear clothes with pride...
Burka she must wear
Parts of her speech filled my eyes with tears. My family had moved from Lahore. I hope i could visit that city ones. I've heard so much about its beauty.
I LIVE IN LAHORE
It is better. No problem of alcoholic drivers running over people. No fear of women getting raped inside running bus like in your Delhi.
The quality of Life Index Ranking of Lahore is better than Delhi, Lahore is 204th with score of 105.02 and that of your Delhi is 232nd with score of 81.65
@@sabinayasmin4877 😂😂😂phle toh Lahore tumhare Baap ki Nahi hai...Lahore city Hindu Sikhs ki holy place thi before Islam came to existence...Indian subcontinent ki BAAT Nahi karra...jab Islam bhi Nahi Aaya tha tab .aap vahi Hindu sikho ki aulad ho jinhone Islam qubool Kiya...still majority of them use Hindu Sikh surnames like Rajput Chauhan gujjar bhatti Rao khatri sandhu bhatt butt jutt chaudhary bajwa cheema..phle apni identity crisis theek karlo Arab ho ya Turk ho ya Mongol ho ya kaun ho kyuki apni khudki taareekh kuchnahi hai tumhari...funny people on the earth PAKISTANI😂
@@rithikshetty4693 Lahore belongs to people those who are born in Lahore irrespective of caste and creed.
We are neither Arabs nor Turks, we are Pakistanis.
@Sabana Kanam 😂😂😂okay I don't need to give more explanation to the fake ones who are suffering from identity crisis since 1947😂..bravo! Enjoy! Stay safe
The Calcutta killings were in August 1946?
The rioters shouted religous cries: Allah o Akbar, Sat Sri Akal or Jai Sri Ram. Jai Hind was a new idea and Pakistan Zindabad was even newer.
No they don't fit the leftist agenda
Even during NRC CAA a leader threatened to repeat that horrendous incident in Kolkata yet there was no news on that.
uneducated people shouldn't comment on such topics, the term "hind" predates the term "pakistan" by a millenia. The first indian national army was also known as "aazad hind fauj" in hindi/urdu.
Sir, I do not know your background. However, as you claim that only the educated have a right to comment, you should have known that use of word Hind is not a Millennia old but more than two and half Millennia old term. But I am not going to judge you.
However, your response has nothing to do my comment.
@@pikachu5647You idiot he is talking about the slogan "Jai Hind" not "Hindus".....
A line drawn not in ink, but in blood. That one was deep.
As an Indian i really appreciate her for wearing Sari the true symbol of every south asian women's fashion for thousands of years
Sari is indian and comes from Hindu culture. "South asian" is an empty term.
@@pario850 I agree but I'm just saying that cuz our ancestors knew no borders for them the whole of South Asia today was Bharat then
@@alien_girl900 fair.. I just despise the term South Asia for how its leveraged against Indians. A positive accomplishment= south Asian, holi= south Asian. Makes me livid. And anything negative is automatically Indian or hindu.
@@pario850 yeah same
@@pario850same. Indian Subcontinent is the term. ❤
why didn't the speaker mention Bangladesh ... why was it always west Pakistan ? why not present day Bangladesh ? why is she so focused on the partition of the Punjab why doesn't she consider the partition of Bengal.
Soahum Bagchi because she is pakistani. She does not need to talk about something they lost already. Ha..ha
Soahum Bagchi Jinnah Didn't realise the Blunder he Committed by Dividing a Huge chunk of Muslims between India and Pakistan. He Diluted the Strength of Muslims of India by not taking all Muslims with him.
Awais Khan Your Background and upbringing is Evident from the Language you are using. We in India are more civilised and speak in more Sophisticated way. Your education and upbringing seems to shine through your Language.
Bangladesh got rid of its 2Nation theory madness in 1971 so it is mentioned less
The talk was in reference to the inter- partition years and Bangladesh did not come into existence until 71, so it would be historically incorrect to address the region as that during the referenced era. Any it’s known as east Pakistan and not west.
what she is asking to regret , they are reppeating it in kashmir. Almost all non muslims killed converted or kicked out.
pele spelling seekh le
@@ROHANUDHWANI Thanks for highlighting. I thought in tbis age if autocorrect spellings have become irrelevant and smart people focus mesaage of the content.
kindly search this site on google and read everything from this site to know about islam-(one reason.org)
non muslims? last time i checked, it was clearly the Muslims suffering at the hands of hindu oppression
@@MimiSidd22 Kashmir was 100% Hindus just 300 years back. Slowly all Hindus has been killed converted or kicked out similar to what Arabi baba did in Madeena... Same game continues in rest of India and whenever Hindus retaliate in self defence jihadi propaganda machinery starts playing "Victim card" As such please understand the game plan.. In all fairness Muslims got their fair share of land in 1947 (rather 16^% more land than their fair share) as "Homeland for Muslims of teh sub continent in the form of Pakistan. If any Muslim is not Happy in Indians they are free to go to their legitimate home land in place of creating trouble for rest of humanity.
For all instance, her name could be Harpreet Kaur, and no one would doubt it,proving that Punjabis are the same on both sides of the border, separated by religion.
Not orange it is saffron.
Saffron is not the colour name you dumb it's an autumn-flowering crocus with reddish-purple flowers, native to warmer regions of Eurasia. Enormous numbers of flowers are required to produce a small quantity of the large red stigmas used for the spice. In other word Saffron is Zaffron (which used in biryani and other dishes to colour the food. Don't talk when you don't know.
@@ShafikKhan-zq8kn i think you're not an indian. Where are you from bro?
Our tri colour are saffron (bhagwa), white and green
@@ShafikKhan-zq8kn Logic isn't your strong suit clearly
@@ShafikKhan-zq8kn you called someone a dumbo. Lmao... What a self-confident but ignorant kid you must be.
Sabriyah Saeed either forgot or omitted to accept that partition bloodbath started with communal
kilings in Rawalpindi in March 1947. It was demonstrating Jinnahs warnings of civil war into action for the reluctant Congress leaders of India to accept the fact partition.
No it started even earlier in Calcutta.
@Adarsh Hoizal direct action day was started by Hindu marwaris....
not by muslims
@Adarsh Hoizal Direct action day was a holiday declared by leage govt.
the programmes were declared. they were congregation on maidan, inter community dialogs, etc.
all on a sudden Hindus attacked on mosques. Killed imam and muezzin.
then for the first time in a riot, people attacked women and children.
Look at the book "bengal got divided" by Jaya chatterjee where she proved that Hindu marwari people were ready for riot a week before.
Dont forget Calcutta Killings
@@jabirlava6149 no. I am from calcutta. Thats not true. It was very much a Muslim mob under Jinnahs command.
This is actually quite enjoyable if you listen to it at 1.25× the speed
i listened at 5 x speed- makes you focus on what the content was-
"jinnas idea for pakistan was not a terrible thing"
I'm originally from Pakistan. I'm on the India side of the argument to give a diverse perspective
eric sukumaran would find it strange to take orders from a girl 6 years his junior
I never studied at Oxford.
These people are well dressed, pompous, intelligent and illogical.
Thank you Oxford for letting me realize that without an oxford education, I'm still more rational and logical than this girls argument
@@vamsavardhanavijay5532 lol 😂
Excellent points, well structured thought. There is still hope while there remain such beautiful minds
There is no hope. These good looking intellectuals are essentially a gateway drug to the fascism under covers of Pakistan.
You're looking in Saari. Indian traditions are really ❤️
lol no sarri isnt indian tradition only you can say souyh asian
Sari is Indian tho
Thanks British people! My grandfather went through hell to leave Lahore and go to Delhi during the partition. It was a naive way to create conflict between Muslims and Hindus. He was separated from two of his siblings and childhood friends. We were all better united!
That'd thr best thing britishers did. I would never want to live in a Muslim.majority country
Why is there so many hate comment.
People should educated themselves and Began to think and understand that this is debate.
@homie beaglePG yes, you have right to argue.. But noone should adopt disrespectful attitude
Pro tip: Don't check the comments, it's filled with toxicity.
Thanks for the advice.
Thank you for the warning.
How do you expect people to not read the comments, if you tell them to not read the comments?
@@Locutus Go figure
She penned down the horrors and wounds of partition perfectly well which is oblivious to the present generation. Maybe, she is right. We should regret it to acknowledge it so that it won't be repeated again!
Oxford is out of touch with reality.
Can you read the description of the video? It's clearly written that since it is a competitive debate, the views expressed may not be the views of the person.
@@sorrymyenglishbad2535 so basically they are dramatizing a real debate?? lmao
Consider a situation
Owner of a house rents his place. Tenants refuse to vacate. Then a third party comes in and divides the house into three parts. How very thoughtful.
And brits regret the partition.
M thinking should I speak for the motion or against the motion.
The Brits couldn't give two shits about South Asia.
@sourabh gupta lol where did you learn that? Extremist channel in your country?
@@turboed1337 If you don't follow that cult yourself just be a nice intellectual and read quran and watch channels of islamic republics. You 'll start saying the words @sourabh gupta said in no time.
@sourabh gupta Talk about hate mongering
@IamDon9999 lol. stop lying. dumb. india was united way before, during the reign of maurya empire
In an alternate universe....
The partition never happened.
Today there exists a country named BHARAT in South Asia.. Which is spread across 4.2 million sq km (#7) with 17000 km land boundary and 9000 km. of coast...
It is home for 155+ crore people i.e. 21% of world population whose ancestors fought side by side and gave their life for freedom from opressors...
They now constitute 3.6 % of world GDP (#5)..
Today world cricket is a one sided event where Tendulkar and Afridi play side by side and all the other countries play for the second position..
In the hallways of this country's parliament there are two large portraits of Gandhi and Jinnah reminding the lawmakers of their history...
Shahrukh, Ahad Raja Mir, Sajal Ali, kareena rule hearts of millions...
Punjabi and Muslim pilgrims don't have to get a visa or use binoculars( at the border) to get a glimpse of their god...
This country is envied by many and its indomitable spirit still baffles the west and China & USA are now worried and hatching plans to divide this country but...
At times Blood Relations can be broken but... People connected by history are meant to be together..
That's right the first large scale partition violence started with great Calcutta killings in Aug 1946. My point was related to viokence spiral in East Punjab was in response to killings in Rawalpindi action
She spoke us the tale, many laughed but few listened.
Which kind of freedom we got .my grandfather who migrated from gurudaspur village naserke india. He always remembers his native land in his life he wanted to visit his village where he used to live.it may be freedom or privilege for politicians but it was suffering and brutality for a common ppl on the both sides border who have to left their native place
If Jinnah really said u are free to go where u want mosque or tample ,then I what was the necessity of making a new nation Pakistan?
He did really say that.
The point was creating a safe haven for Muslims.
@@syedmohammadaanasfarukh7549 Actually it became safe haven for UN declared terrorist organisation & global terrorist like Osama Bin Laden,Mullah Omar, Hafeez Saeed etc.
Where the Hindus would not dominate other minorities. A distinct nation with all minorities as equal citizens was needed. This was his vision. What happened later, has nothing to do with him.
@@sirkhizer what did he think was going to happen? He created a nation with religion at its core instead of focusing on creating a better environment for Muslims in India itself. He broke a country in two and expected positive results. If that is not stupid, I dont know what is.
JUST SAYING : Saree isn't a pakistani Dress.
when did people start wearing saree 1947? Just asking.
ravindra bhandari should wear burkha
Now you will tell who should wear what. Already stop with these stereotyping comments, it makes you look foolish.
Trigged Pakistanis and many Liberal Indians.. Just accept the Facts for F*ck sake.. Google it , Saree came from Southern india.. And i m a north indian.. And we have salwar kameez over here.. So yeah.. thats also Indian... And NO Jeans nd Shirt is "not indian" but Ain't got TRIGGERED like Some of You..
sher khan I Refer Us As INDIANS and You Refer Yourself as MUSLIMS. .. Thats Where Both The Countries Stands Today. PAKISTANI banna seekh... Muslim toh Hamare tumse bhi zada hain..
From Where we get the entire transcript of this debate??
Please quote the reference from where you said trains carrying from Indian Punjab to Lahore had heaviness. What about trains from Dhaka to Lahore in 1971?
why she had to check the paper after every sentence.
if you want to be in a debate on such critical topic,you have to be an expert on that subject.
it become a boring debate.
Correction: Trains with heavy dead bodies first came from Lahore to Indian Punjab.
Yes post partition riot started from Rawalpindi than Hindu Sikh in Indian Punjab retaliated
@@bettyboossister3918 You already seem to be VERY SICK !
@@bettyboossister3918 Those who cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it
Bits Byrmtes NOT true. It came from the India side first
@@pramedhindra5560 NOT true
We need more debaters in India
Why did she not talk about how Jinnah (father of Islamic Republic of Pakistan) was the chief instigator for the "pure land" (Pakistan)? It was and still is all about religious fundamentalism by the islamists
??? What part of partition has been successful exactly
ac1dP1nk
Bangladesh
Muslim league had no part in freedom struggle against British.
Actually they colluded with Britons. So reverse patriotism.
J C what to study have you ever seen a Muslim league member being arrested in freedom struggle.There were with the British all the way.
Human Being that's true.You should read their history books in Pakistan it's fascinating how they twist stories.
Yass only.rss chuddis were leading at the front . And also all history is Congress written.
TheKashif7896 no both RSS and Muslim league played same role in independence which is nothing.
Very powerful presentation, Sabriyah!
.
.
May I recommend a book called
The Heartbreak Passage
- by Lambert Mascarenhas
at Age 100
- He is 106 today
Goa (in India)
.
Lover's torn apart. Iam torn apart when we have to explain this to our children.
Well articulated and root causes the true reasons for the 70 year-plus animosity between India and Pakistan. Historically, united India has shown to be a true world leader. Our quest was for progress, not religious supremacy. The British knew our strengths and instead subverted our soul to be beholden to our weaknesses. Any diverse population will have many differences in culture, religion and beliefs. United they are a great asset but if divided, have immense potential for chaos. “Us vs them”. British perfectly executed “divide and rule” as an effective strategy to defeat a giant (united India, circa 1500s) and in a final act of malice or fear, split it forever into 2 adversaries who have been spending huge $s/ time in eroding away at each other’s potential for greatness since then.
The problem with these types of debates are that they don't consider the insensitivity of the motion they are debating on. To even say that you don't regret the partition is a very insensitive thing to say. The west, and even the new generation of Indians and Pakistanis cannot even imagine the trauma and the damage caused to people during that time due to the partition. Playing with people's emotions by reducing this issue to a mere privileged class debate and then saving yourself by saying that we are just doing it for the sake of the debate and the views expressed are not our own. I wonder why people are not finding this attitude to be immensely problematic.
There was no partition of India ever happen. Punjab was divided because Gandhi/Nehru were not ready to give Kashmir its independence. So they fooled Punjabi leader and hence tragedy. Bengal was divided in 1905, not in 1947.
too much of relying on notes by sabriyah saeed makes the presentation just a read out
Does that make it wrong?
I agree with you .. the complete narration flow gets ruined because of her reliance on the notes is too much ...
Judge India if Pakistan is perfect.... Even I am not going to Judge Pakistan..... Love from an Indian... Let spread peace, love and humanity because we can't change the past but can change the future.... We will get nothing from hatred but can achieve something good from peace, love and humanity.... That's all....
Agreed
I think you didn't get what she was saying. She's not judging India or Pakistan!
sinha .. wish more people are like you
It would be good if India, Pakistan and Bangladesh could just work together to help develop each other's country, rather than bring each other down. Before the British came to colonise India it was heading to become a wealthy and well developed nation.
@Muzaffar Ahmed and you people believe in gazwae hind, islamic caliphate, muslim ummah... Hindus have right to claim their ancient lands...
Meeting many pakistanis here in canada and seeing how nice and kind they are in person makes me feel better about things.
India is full of Pakistanis
Now we no , everything this is the right time to join our neighbors and embrace them !!
let's not forget that it was actually punjab and bengal that were "partitioned" and where the blood flowed most freely... and who demanded the partition of said provinces??? that's right, Nehru.... Jinnah dismissed the partition of Punjab by asking "what is Punjab without Lahore?" as only one half of Punjab would have it... Nehru wanted to break the political power of Punjab and Bengal provinces to maintain the hegemony of the Hindu Ganges belt which went on to deliver several successive terms in power for congress.. his comeuppance is that now that very same belt is the burgeoning home of a neo-fascist hindutva ideology which has damn near guaranteed electoral failure for congress in the foreseeable future at the hands of BJP and thus proved to be the final nail in the coffin of the charade that was secular india... and what is left after the British raj is ram raj, just as Jinnah had forewarned..
sabriya very well spoken god bless .
Is she narrating or just reading what's just there on the paper?
England did so so wrong to us that we are still torn and paining, it's been 74 years yet it feels like yesterday, the rest of India who didn't have to undergo migration have no idea what happened with us. We who came to West Bengal from the east, lost our homes, our people, our business, our Riches, our life and came here to live a life of hardships. I can never forgive English, period.
But British did not ask for partition. We told them to.
@@raispaceofficial Do u think that british loved us then ? It's the both our failures of unity and their jealousy on us !
@@moulisankarde3034 I dont think its our failure of unity. It was bound to happen. Anywhere Islam has gotten majority they have demanded islamic state. Indonesia, malaysia recently got converted. Although its not politically correct to say this, this is the international and historical truth. And no the British didnt care. They were probably laughing at us.
@@raispaceofficial They can laugh on us but don't forget that they are the caste of thieves 😂 If the thief britain exists, it's only for the wealth of Mother India.
& yes , there is obvious problems of hindu & muslims. But if we got proper leader that time, the case would be solved surely. The name of the leader is BOSE.
Anyone read the book of sister of mohommed ali jinnah....fatimah jinnah
East Pakistan is now known as Bangladesh
No... You don't say. I thought it became Afghanistan.
India was not freed in 1947 at all; it became a Dominion with limited freedom. Both Indian army and Pakistani army were headed by British officers who created the Kashmir problem.
When Pakistan army headed by the British officers invaded Jammu & Kashmir on 20th October 1947, the Indian army was not allowed to protect J&K until 27th October 1947 and it was not allowed to recover the areas lost to Pakistan. The British officer who hoisted the flag of Pakistan in the occupied areas of J&K was awarded OBE by the British Government.
Commenting this 12:05 am 14th of August 2022, partition is unjustly and loss is beyond the arguments. I support undivided India and Britain Masters did wrong to our past generations. We would not forgive them ever in this life for bringing great losses into our region
We are still one at heart no matter what the conflict is between us.
mohit sharma Sharma but not all Hindus think like you right ?
Ikram Ahmed i can't speak for every one but for sure u don't think so that we are , were and could be one.
💕❤️💕
It's matter of grave displeasure that we are debating in the soil of a crook nation whose hungry n greedy wolfs attacked our nation tore into two parts ;became responsible for uncountable blood sheds even on trains.
Two reasons was the there at the time of partition:-
1. Two constitution was prepared for India and Pakistan in which a group of muslim community was not interested to go pakistan and in India same situation created(Atmosphere in terms of Muslim ideas) like pakistan and you can see result is Muslim leauge, other organization formed including separate sariya law,etc. If you see other muslim countries there is single law but in India? By this way situation of muslims is so terrible in past so many years. If you compare in between minorities and majority ? Muslims community is very low(Financial) as comparison to christian in India. Why?
This country's slogan is 'सर्व जन हिताय, सर्व जन सुखाय' but perception was different at the time of partition but it is old matter and we have forgotten all the previous mindset because today is new day.
I always tried to say something for understanding the depth not to hold a white paper.
By the way what is blue?
If I was her mother I'd be ssssssooooo proud....😊😊😊
Why did she do my boi Eric like that 😭
Maybe he cheated on her.. 😂
Yeah that was a public burn, damn.
Nicely presented Sabriyah. Most of us regret partition, the way it happened was so painful.
Exactly, u must also feel the pain like we feel from 1947 till date, when our beloved are killed day in and day out by both indian army and Pak trained militants.
@@zubeera.rather2406 that indeed is a tragedy.
@@shishantverma2800 you will also feel the pain how you lynching poor muslim and force him say jai shri ram
@@syafiqfirdaus1620 Well you will also feel pain in how Hindus can’t build temple on their own soil and their daughters abducted and force converted.
@@UPSCiS5698 Iam a supporter of humanity not communalism
I know the British loves to watch India and Pakistan fight...
Just go through the Book " India Wins Freedom " by Maulana Abul Kalam Azad and another book " Partition of India Legend and Reality" by H.M. Serwai, former Advocate General Maharashtra and get convinced who were the persons who are responsible for the partition of the British colonial sub continent.
I'm Indian and I think partition was great . I mean if India and Pakistan were one country we'd be having civil war instead of war between two seperate nations . Fighting wars at the border is relatively easy ..you know who your enemy is..who the hell would want a incessant civil war . The only way India and Pakistan could have been kept nominally as one "country" ...it would only be possible under some sort of very loose federation which would defeat the purpose of having one nation in the first place .
Partition allowed Pakistan to rally under it's Islamic culture while India united under it's Hindu identity . Nation states usually cohere under a single identity and religion is one of the strongest identities a person is attached to . Just look around the world and show me any working nation that has a significant minority.....the ones that have usually turn into Lebanon which had a 15 year long civil war or something like the prepartition India where regions break away n stuff . I for one , am happy for partition ........Pakistan and India are better off it . We both went our seperate ways and doing stuff we like . It was an unhappy marriage anyway ...lol
Bharat mata ki Jai and Pakistan Paindabaad
:-)
And it's been a great source of AD revenue for Google and Facebook - without partition 90% of internet comments would not have been made.
civil war already chal rahi hai india bus uska roop badal chuka hai ab hatho main gun deemag main gobar bhara hua hai
Makes sense
@@nitinchaudhary9993 kahaan civil war hai ? ab kaahe ki civil war ...Hindus and Muslims have had their own countries since 1947 . Toh civil war ?
Hinduism is not a genuine religion like the others, a collection of gods, this sort of system naturally existed thousands of years ago, all of it being termed under 1 religion when British Came. The Hindus would've died fighting each other if it weren't for muslims, looking at the entire caste system and Brahminism.
Spoken beautifully.. Love from India..
A Unified India could have saved Soviet Union from falling.
Jinnah was facing serious disease but he was fighting for safe future dreams of Muslim.We never forget Jinnah struggle.
When Sabriyah says, "it wasn't ours", she is right. It was more like a neo Roman military retreat than a British willingness to give up power. Churchill had sent Stafford Cripps to India in the middle of the war to assess the situation. Cripps returned after a trip of personal awakening to the reality of British rule and suggested to Churchill that Britain grant independence to India. Churchill rejected this proposal though and when the inevitable just a couple of years later it was in the this same spirit of mean minded churlishness that, just as the Belgians did in the Congo, took a certain delight in the unfolding violence and chaos. It was a kind of, we told you so, mentality confirming to the "superior" Europeans that "lesser peoples" could never rule themselves. The fact that it was Europeans that had created the conditions that led to violence in the first place, was conveniently ignored.
Where's she from? Unless she's from East Punjab she's not lost anything. Cozy home.
if jinnah was secular
then why he wanted pakistan
kashmiris are in trouble because
of pakistan
balochistan in trouble of pakistan
becuz he wanted to be the leader of the new independent company, which would have been impossible when there were Gandhis and Nehru and Patel etc.
Excuse me but isn't it India that's wreaking all the havoc in Kashmir? Didn't India kill around 1,000 people in Bombay riots? Didn't India kill more than 2,000 Muslims in Gujrat Riots? Didn't India massacred 15,000 sikhs in 1984? Isn't India trying to take citizenship away from the Muslims? Isn't the caste system, which is probably the worst form of racism, still prevalent in India? I don't know why here in the west Indians are presented as the peace loving and kind people when in reality, they are quite fascistic.
@@mazymetric8267 get well soon bro
and how did u conclude that Jinnah was secular?
@@hjedits657
watch his speech from 11th aug 1947 where he says people from all religions can worship
their own god, and go their temples, churches etc.
the lands shall question the blood spilt,
and shall reunite under flag once again,
The world shall be taken by awe,
As a forgotten empire rises again.
Hey guys , hope it's dramatic, I took a whole five minutes to think and write it down. Hope this comes true.
Happy new year BTW.
Sounds good enough to quote! Is it yours or is it a quote? If it is yours, do write the full poem. I will add to my grandkids’ reading list. If it is a quote, do share the source.
@@chandraravikumar
Hello! Thanks for the appreciation. Yes, i wrote it. It's supposed to be a quatrain. Just like the ones by Nostradamus.
It's funny when people of Indian subcontinent go abroad they wear western outfits daily and choose to represent their country on special occasions by wearing their countries outfit...
Indian girls age wearing skirts (nothing wrong), but this cute Pakistani girl wearing Saree.
Hats off to you Sabriyah Saeed.
Nothing wrong but still judging 👏
@@MsArc88 Yes, being human its natural.
@Sunil Bhardwaj LOL why should I bother about their religion? I am Atheist. I dont hv concern even if she wears more revealing dresses (No offense to Her)
@Dave 1977 That is true. It is most stupid mindset. LOL how can they even coexist with other religions with such mind set.
@@kaitabm2181 Hi there fellow atheist. I also don't care what anyone wears. But her religion is the only religion which wants to kill me for not following their cult. Coexistence with her religion is not possible cause her religion doesn't allow an atheist to coexist with them.
It's a debate not a prime time news hour, lack in the delivery outweighs the smug smartness of the argument!
The argument isn't if the countries that resulted from Partition are failing, it is was partition a good idea. They all are. How can you prove that not splitting it would be more successful?
Is it debate going on in Britain. How ironic ?!?!?
good debate, but very short on any nuance or real insight. points against Pakistan or partition have all been heard before and the indian perspective of partition has done well to embed itself so well within academic circles. however it doesn't mean it the correct or only perspective
1) india has never existed as a single political, cultural or religious entity in its entire history.
despite this there is no denying there is a larger tapstry to which all the disparate groups tie into - i think this is much is plain to see. however my main issue is with which india prior to 1947 is being judged through the current lens of rabid nationalism being fostered in modern india today. indian nationalism prior to 1947 developed only as a response to british colonialism, it never existed as it being promoted today, to bring together all people under the banner of india - because that sentiment never existed prior to 1947. ask any hindu, moslem or any other group, there was never a feeling a shared identity between them prior to 1947 only in that they shared the same land. this isn't enough of a reason to force people to live together.
the peripheries of the indian subcontinant, which make up modern day pakistan, was overwhelmingly muslim in its population - if the people in that region felt they belonged as a distinct people within the indian subcontinent - inheritors to a millennia old into-islamic culture and tradition - in my opinion at the dissolution of the british raj they had every right to self determination and for freedom from both the british and from hindu majoritarianism.
2) india itself only ever existed to describe a geographic land space i.e. the land east of the river indus
in this account it is no different to europe, south america, Africa etc . if south America can have 12 sovereign states, and europe 50, then why can multiple independent nation states exist in the Indian Subcontinant. the reasons pretty obvious - indian right wing hindutva thought, which advocates the entire subcontinent belonging to a hindu Rashtra - has never really accepted the plurisy of india outside of a hindu one, and hence despise that there are defined safe spaces in the indian subcontinent which are not hindu in their cultural expression i.e. pakistan - and has done all it can for the past 70 years to undermine this.
3) events and history post 1947 cant be used to undermine pakistan
yes pakistan at this moment is being run poorly, with a magnitude of issues, political instability etc - but these are their problems and cant be used 70 years on to undermine their indepedance as a sovereign nation state. its like saying because the USA has a gun problem, they should have never gained independence from the British in 1776
Good comment.
India existed From 1947. Bharat existed from 5000 years. Bharat is older than the entire Muslim and Christian religion combined. Don't dare to insult my motherland.
India comes from name Indus. So technical India also exists for thousand years.
@@amarjeetpaul5418 India never existed as a single nation except during the time of Ashoka, Aurangzeb and the British. The land towards the east of river indus was loosely called as India. India has always been ruled by multiple kingdoms. Also, Islam not being older than ‘Bharat’ does not make it a false religion. Being old or young has nothing to do with being true.
During Partition close to 10 percent of pakistans poulation were minorities, india had around 5% of minorities, today in india muslim population is 15 % of the total indian population, muslim population has grown and stabilised, in case of pakistan less than 1 % of population minorites survive, so where are muslims better off now? What has pakistan done to its hindus, , sikhs and christians? killed,raped and driven away right?
It is such a shame that such important topics are disscussed in the country which actually created these problems.
Please Read books written by Allama Mashriqi's grandson, Nasim Yousaf (Historian and Scholar):
1) "Mahatma Gandhi & My Grandfather, Allama Mashriqi: A Groundbreaking Narrative of India's Partition"
2) Hidden Facts Behind British India's Freedom: A Scholarly Look Into Allama Mashraqi and Quaid-E-Azam's Political Conflict
Partition was hard for India in 1947. 70 years later it turns out it was a tumor that had to be removed and India is better off because of it.
The Tumour is Re-growing and it has reached 16% of the total Population.
@Dave 1977 i know that mate.
@@seventhuser904 fuck off mate
@@seventhuser904 fuck off seriously
In Oxford and reading from a written piece, common madam......
These darn britishers left us with misunderstandings and ruins
The Dispute over Aksai chin is also a big issue left by these dumb officials
I am all for ONE UNITED INDIA but the British did the damage to Indian people of the time, so it was inevitable for it to happen. Meanwhile to this day Indian Hindus talk shit out of their backsides about Pakistan as you will see in the comments.
My goodness, what an elegant opening.
It's not orange, it's saffron! 🇮🇳
Many Pakistani said that MD Jinnah created Pakistan for Muslim rights, but it's completely bullshit because in 1937 Jinnah said that Muslim right is in danger, and guess what, he loose the election in a heavy margin even in the Muslim majority areas of Punjab and Bengal. Also does MD Jinnah seems like a communal man??? Netaji Subhash Chandra Bose probably has more knowledge about Islam than Jinnah Saab. MD Jinnah was a secular person and used to be more British than the Britishers.
Pakistan was created basically for his ego, putting idea about Islam is in danger and rigging of 1945 election.
It is ironic that we never held a debate before 1947 to discuss if Partition would be the preferable means of splitting up. As 1948 was approaching--the original date of the--it was considered a fait accompli by the elites of both countries--the common man had no say in the matter. He would pay the price for it but he was considered too ignorant to fathom such weighty matters as whether religion could be the basis of the formation of the modern nation state. All evidence was to the contrary. Evidence such as was offered in the formation of the French Republic, the United States of India, Germany, etc. where time and time again it was proved that the modern nation state could only thrive as a liberal democracy where there is a clear separation between the state and identity politics--religion, race(Aryan supremacy), skin color, language, etc. Yet, Jinnah and his ilk succeeded in peddling the Two Nation Theory--which held that Muslims were only safe in a separate country--quietly acquiesced by Nehru and his ilk, who were only too happy to see the gadfly Jinnah go. That would clear the way for Nehru's ambitions without Jinnah being a constant pebble in his shoe. The Two Nation Theory was an abject failure as the last seventy years of Pakistan demonstrates but no one wants to admit it, not the least of the six speakers in the Oxford Union debate where there was not a mention of it. It quietly forms the basis of the nationalists in India who similarly believe in a distilled state for Hindus. The TNT goes out the window when Hindus and Muslims live and mingle amicably in the U.S., U.K., or Canada. This is enough evidence for some romantics who believe that if Pakistan and India were to kiss and make up, the combined entity could rule the world.
Everything is nice in the talk except the partition
First you should check your DNA you have a Hindu DNA or middle east DNA.....Islam came at 1000 ad by invaders.....you all are converted Muslims but you think you all belongs to Arab,turkey and mughals....you have to first learn about your race and identities then giving lectures......
that doesn't matter, u can be a hindu yesterday and convert. Islam is a fairly new religion, no one was muslim at one point, when Islam then people converted from different faiths. So that doesn't matter what our forefathers were before. what matters is what it is now.
Matt Walker DNA report reveals everything whether you have a Punjabi DNA or Kerala DNA.....yeah it is a dominant religion by inbreeding.....if I am from south Africa I am calling myself Arab Muslim that doesn't not make me Arab muslim or I am following their culture..... wherever they are in majority they show their peace in religion.....two countries were made bcz of this religion if any muslim have problem in India can go to those countries that is why partian happened.......
lets chat your religion has dark history and I donot consider it as a peaceful religion.....500 people in pakistan converted at gun point to Islam what type of religion.....your religion ideology definitely lead to world war 3.....
P K u dont have to like it and that is fine.
Beast mode. Irrespective of what DNA u r dealing with ......u r dealing with lower levels of intelligence and weaker people..
I am NOT being mean but honest
Such a beautyful representation of history from a most beautyful woman. Sadly I see the citizens of Pakistan suffer under a regime that is unworthy of their loyalty.
Happy new year😀🎉🎉
Why don't u hold that paper bcz Ur just reading
Maulik Dhameliya Great point
Someone else probably wrote it for her
She studies in OXFORD university!! you bunch of clowns studied where?
007MRRAJAA America is the Greatest Country on Earth!!
@@007MRRAJAA ePIC!!
She is correct, most of the part. She come from a right place. I agree with her totally.
It is my belief that india was not portion for the benefit of Indians who were of different religion. However, india was partition for the benefit of the British who wanted a buffer against Russia. In addition, the india/Pakistan war was driven by entities out of both countries who wanted to destabilize both countries for their benefit (sales of arms).
Did anyone notice, she's actually speaking of the British tyranny in India in front of British people.
Partition was the best thing ever happened to Hindus of Indian sub-continent. It proved beyond doubt that Hindus as a singular cultural entity, are the best social, cultural (and now political too..) mangers in the world... After all, it is not a joke to create a functional democracy of 1.3 billion people.
what functional democracy do you talk about you twat. This democracy is nothing short of a cult that uses the same principles of a cult to trap its population. HINDU OR MUSLIM. in a constant state of fear from the government. Not only that but the riots that still happen to this day are all caused by your hindu government
@@aayushthorat314 I was about so say the same thing. What functional democracy?
The one thing that everyone is agreed on....That hall needs some decent heating!
Useless debate doesn't meaning this time go ahead debate on future problem let's this debate deep sleep inour history
we learn from history and not repeat mistakes done in the past!!
What happened during Partition and the subsequent events and the eventual paths of India and Pakistan (and, later, Bangladesh) showed how divorced from reality were both Jinnah and Nehru as to how the vast population of the Indian subcontinent really felt.Partition was a blunder of monumental proportions and for this blame leis with the Muslim League, the Congress - for not insisting that there HAD to be another solution -,and the British establishment for so cowardly carrying it out.