Staying In Germany - Yes Or No? Ellie's Thoughts | Part 1
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- Опубліковано 5 вер 2024
- We have lived in Germany for just about 4 years, and throughout many of our videos, everyone has been so supportive of what we've been doing with this channel. Many of you even say we should stay, and that has really touched our hearts!
So one viewer even came out and asked the depth question, why don't we stay in Germany, and even if we do not, will we ever return? Well, we are answering that question today, in-depth, from Ellie's perspective.
Stay tuned for next week's video where you will get Lucas' perspective!
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Living in another country is never going to be easy. Before I moved to Germany, I had been coming over only to see my wife's family, maybe 3 to 4 times a year for the previous 25 years. My German (as I realise now) was at a very basic level, maybe A2 level at best. However, just under 5 years ago we moved here as a family (admittedly only from the UK) with 2 teenage kids who also could speak some, but not very good, German. They both had to integrate themselves into the German school system, having been used to a completely different system in the UK, and also getting used to the culture. Even for my wife who had lived away from Germany for 23 years, it was a big culture shock to return here, especially as her teaching qualification that she gained in the UK was not recognised by the authorities here. She managed to get a teaching job at a Waldorfschule at a so called "Quereinsteige", as the private sector allowed her to teach without having to retrain. In the meantime my German knowledge has also increased and is, I think, around the B2 to C1 level, although I still struggle with the grammar (I suspect Elies German is far better than mine). But I put the effort in to talk to people and get to know them, and although they may appear cold, they are a friendly bunch underneath! I value the working conditions here far above those in the UK, and especially the US, where my work colleagues get 15 days of holiday compared to my 30, as an example (and let's not get into healthcare or pensions). But perhaps it depends on how hard you work on accepting and integrating into another culture (and Germany really isn't that different when you dig down deep). I'm very happy here and will not move back to the UK, but that is my personal decision, your experience definitely differs from mine (and I recognise that we are all different). Grüße aus dem Ruhrgebiet!
I can totally understand your thoughts and decision making process. Good luck on the return.
Thank you so much!
Ihr seit in Amerika zu Hause - no question - and it is your life - live like you want - take the good to your country. So if you can't get familier with the cold direct germans - no future here.
That was a heartfelt video for sure. Have you ever thought about working for the DOD (Department of Defense) schools in Germany? Being a US citizen you won't have to get a visa, etc. Just something to think about. However, I wish you both the very best in your decision to move back to the US. I am looking forward to our upcoming live stream. :).
Thank you so much! Is the DoD what your wife was going to teach at? Like, are they schools on American military bases?
Ah well! Assuming there was nothing Freudian going on in 0:10 ;), I'm sure you've made the right decision. Why build a life in a place where you don't really feel at home? And for practical matters: yes, it was always going to be hard for you to teach German to native German speakers at Gymnasium. Your German is fine, but still some steps away from idiomatic. Having learned, studied, and taught English for well over half a century now, I guess I would still feel somewhat uncomfortable teaching English to native speakers. In any case, it was great having you here, virtually, and I'm looking forward to watching your US-based videos! :)
So basically it is the situation at school while teaching and some issues with culture. My mom was a teacher too. She said looking back it was the dumbest decision she made. She had all the high hopes of helping kids gow and learn. But reality in German schools is different. She coped with it, don't get me wrong. But she was offered other opportunities at university she thought she should have taken. I know from personal experience how mean kids can be. To critcizes your pronunciation is just a game of power. Either you get back and teach the kids they are in no way perfect. And you are not criticizing constantly. Means you hold up a mirror and force them to see it from the side of the recipient. If you don' t feel able to do that (should be in a teacher's tool chest) then that situation becomes untenable. Sometimes one needs to play hardball in Germany. We had several teachers from the US in the 70s because of a lack of German teachers. One was very reserved and eventually he went back. The other learned to fight back and did well. Another option is to teach grown ups. Like language course for immigrants of language institutes who serve the industry.
The other part, the cultural situation, is a thing you need to learn to live with. To live a secluded life is probably not an option. Perhaps talk with other expats like Antoinette Emily, Hayley, Diana Verry how they cope with that.
In the end it should not be only technical things like maternity leave. That you will experience only once or twice in life. You could do that in Germany and then go back as a compromise. But you should live again in the US and see how you will feel. I always enjoy my vacations in the US because of the people. But then it is not a professional situation.
And as a last thought: Have you considered that you might be expecting more than is expectable giving the German way of things? I think not only expats are having the same feelings like you. See the example of another teacher above. Fights with bureaucracy are not limited to non-Germans. It is perhaps a little more tough. But believe me, we Germans are no strangers to unknown procedures and laws we have no love lost at. Or unfriendly and or incompetent staff at authorities. And we have to learn new things too when venturing into unknown territory (I know tautological argument). But it is another straw that might break the camel's back.
One thing which appears to me to complicate things is to be in an expat relationship. That leads to falling back and comparing all the time. And keeps one from from taking the stance: Ok Germany, here I am. I am here to stay and I am like I am. Like being blonde, tall, with an accent or what have you. Just take it. I will not hold back just because of it. I am as good as you are. So there.
Hope this gives you some perspective. And that you make the right decision for you and your future family.
"That can happen in the US, it is just hard to find natives..." what a deep sentence when you think twice about it....
Fifth to eighth graders bring everyone down to their knees. Once they enter a classroom they become loud screeching monsters. And they smell insecurity like bloodhounds. Only people blessed with natural authority can get through. But you could have tried to teach grownups at a language school to gain confidence.
German here. Could you elaborate on the teaching difference part?
Sehe das mal an: ua-cam.com/video/uvNvaG5--jU/v-deo.html
Oder vielleicht das: ua-cam.com/video/ol_Zt2L1MV0/v-deo.html
Why did Lukas and You not have gone to the southwest of Germany, when these were your roots? I think You would have liked it more than NRW. The people in the SW are more polite.
We moved to NRW for a couple reasons, some of which was out of our control. At the time, Essen Uni was the only school Ellie found that had the Masters program she wanted. Additionally, Lucas' old boss from the USA knew a chemist in Bochum who could give Lucas a job. So ultimately we moved to NRW because of school and employment options, based on our limited knowledge at the time.
Thanks for giving us an inside in your thoughts :)
I really think that when you aren't feeling happy and somewhat at home here, it's better to move back to the States.
No good healthcare and maternity leave system can make up for feeling unhappy ;)
I mean, you can always come back for a visit and good friends will stay even if you don't see each other on a regular basis.
Are you going to work as a teacher in the US? And do you need to get your German Masters accredited or is it accepted without further investigation?
Because I know a Kenyan friend of mine has to get her Kenyan Bachelor's degree accredited in Germany first before she can apply for her Master... No idea, how this is handled in other countries...
I also had to get my American bachelors accredited here in Germany before I could study my masters. I think that was because I wanted to continue my education, much like your friend did. Lucas thinks, though, that if I have a Master's and want to apply for a job, no one will question where I got it (well, unless it looks like a made-up school or something). But I wonder if that will only matter if I try to get my doctorate degree. We will see! I do hope to teach in the US, but not sure if I want to start now, or in a year after we get married.
I've followed you vaguely. I saw some of the comments on your latest video and it felt like the people were personally offended from you wanting to go back to the US: We only see what you want us to see and know and that may be only be one part of the whole picture. I'm sure you have considered your steps very thoroughly and you do not owe anybody an explanation. It's your decision.
About you beeing anxious teaching native speakers German: maybe an international school or private schools would be an option - if you wanted to come back one day - where the students are not native speakers. Like boarding schools for expats.
Wishing you all the best and good luck and keep your heads up. Everything will be fine.
Teaching German to German kids sounds like a nightmare. At first. I faintly remember the time I had finished my Abitur and was with the army. I was just out of school myself and had to teach young nurses about medical subjects. And these nurses had actually finished their Ausbildung so in my opinion they were better qualified than I was in these matters. I certainly tried to prepare for class every day as well as I could. Looking back there never was a problem. But at that time I was terrified too. And nobody cared for my opinion.
That is unfortunate. I understand how you feel and am glad you can sympathize with me!
Just find a place you both can call home, where you feel safe and where you being looked after. You and your future family. I'm not saying the USA is a no, no . But you have to got the money for staying in the states to 'feel' safe? Alternatively there are about 277+ other countries to choose from. Good luck . Always love you.❤❤❤
Thanks for sharing! I don't mean feel safe in the sense of "Sicherheit" like from guns and wars and disasters and things, but I mean emotionally safe and well. More like comfortable, I guess you could say. We want to be in a place that we feel emotionally comfortable, not just secure from life-threats
We have talked about moving to Canada, but for right now, we are going to the US!
@@EllieandLucas Well I can understand that you are emotionally attached to the country you are born in but I don't understand that you are comfortable with that emotion. I thought that you are moving to another country because you are emotionally and physically uncomfortable with the USA. But that is just me thinking perhaps. I moved away from Germany for that very reason and now call Australia the place where I meant to be. Luv ya
The decision to live and work in a foreign country, possibly to start a family, is a difficult one. One should go where one feels comfortable, where family and friends are and where one is most familiar with the customs and traditions.
It is not bad that you have made this decision. It's your life, so don't let anyone tell you what to do. Maybe there will come a point when you both say, hey I want to go back. So all good. 👍🏻
We, too, think it would be cool to return to Germany at some point! We will see!
I think that she want stay in Germany, he not because hi have dificulties to come out from the american buble.
Yes, we Germans are critical. It is part of our culture and we can deal with it. It is our form to develope. If you feel uncomfortable with that even after years I guess it is a right decision to leave. Canada seems to be a nice option for you later in life. Keep that in mind! It is also easier for you to visit your family, not so far away. I wish you good luck. You can still visit Germany/Europe sometimes for vacations.
We agree with all of that!
The critisism and the unfriendliness of the people here is also something I hate. Almost everyday when I am riding my bike in Berlin a completely stranger throws a stupid comment at the head, because he things I am doing something wrong.
A culture shock for me in the US was the amount of homeless people, especially in San Francisco and in Washington.
That is a really good point- the amount of homeless. I feel I see them more in Germany, but I also never lived in cities in the US with more than 40,000 people. In Germany, I have only stayed for months in cities with over 70,000 people (Marburg), but also cities that have over 580,000 people (Essen, Leipzig, and Berlin). I am sorry you experience the unfriendly strangers, too.
Îf Germany could never be your home, you have made the right decision. Living in a place where you do not feel completely happy is for the birds.
It sound like it wasn't an easy decision for you...at least to leave right now...
It definitely was not easy! I feel like my heart is in two different continents!
.....this made me very sad
Hey, I got an idea. Why don’t you work on a US military base in Germany and then you have the best of both worlds. You’re still with the Americans and the Germans. Good luck. Stay in Germany 🇩🇪. Show us some more videos of Garmisch. Danke Schoen!