UNDERTALE/DELTARUNE Theory: Who Are You?
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- Опубліковано 26 вер 2024
- In this video I try my best to explain how we are able to cross the barrier during the neutral ending of Undertale. It's Not easy but gosh darn it if I don't try my hardest.
Twitter: / rickysswolearms
Twitch: / sock_muppet
matpat been real quiet since this dropped
Yes
Probably because he’s not thinking of it, or his staff hasn’t seen the video yet, so matpat can’t unknowingly rip it off😂
daaaaaaamn
@@Jeff4theRaid googles translation literally only adds 2 a
He’s been quiet about deltarune ever since Tony destroyed him on Twitter.
"Get rid of the bodies of dead children in the basement"
That makes Asgore sound like he owns a white van that he drives around from 3pm to 5pm every Monday to Friday at the park
Thank you for talking about the coffins this detail is incredibly ignored. Also I thought I was (nearly) the only one to think our soul inherited part of Asriel’s so thanks for sharing this with the world.
Ayyy un théoricien français sauvage !
If we’re piloting the first human’s body, why aren’t we recognized by anyone, especially Asgore and Toriel?
This is something ill be covering in my follow up video. Don't worry, I did consider it. in fact it was the first thing i did consider. but to explain it will take alot of time so its a video in itself. lets just say a long time has passed and we aren't exactly the same.
That does make sense. I can’t wait to watch the follow up video!
Perhaps it has something to do with multiple playthroughs and sans in general.
Wait what?¿¿
I miss that in the video, when he says that it's chara body?
I understood that frisk fell and died and the trapped chara+asriel souls just got absorbed by the dead body.
@@sockmuppet568 In the video when you said "I'll cover that later" I thought you meant later in this same video, haha. I can see from the other comments that this caused a lot of confusion, which is a shame, cause this is a great theory. I'm looking forward for the follow up.
20:22 Correction - Asriel never absorbs our SOUL, as we are still able to control it and it does not appear at all in the sequence where Asriel releases all the SOULs he absorbed. The reason why he gets to have full control over the form he chooses this time is because he has more SOUL power inside himself - as well as the six human SOULs, he absorbed all monster SOULs, which together are roughly equivalent to the power of a human SOUL.
(before watching the video) my theory has always been that you *are* Chara, right up until the point where you complete genocide and they realise they and you are different, so they manifest a physical form, and start acting of their own accord, bringing a stop to your unsatisfiable rampage
so uh
what about Frisk? I assume that'll be covered later so Ill leave my comment on most of this theory whenever that shows up, I could believe it though, good job!
One thing I thought was already decntly explained by the game or rather precisely: genocide route flowey, Toriel is the one who takes the human bodies out of their coffin and burries them "properly".
If they woke up and tried going anywhere at least some of the monsters would notice. (or they reset their timelines in their own worlds I guess?)
hello toby
I originally figured Chara was more the middleman than anything else.
First off, I think you're spot-on with your theory and line of thinking and your explanations make the most sense to me out of all theories I've heard. I wanted to share something I've been thinking about lately that I think compliments your theories concerning Asriel and his allusions to the archangel Azrael, although I haven't quite thought it all through yet. I'm not saying Asriel IS Azrael, but I think it's a hint that Asriel is the angel spoken of in Undertale and represents the circle with wings in the emblem.
Other than the name itself, I think there are other allusions between Asriel and Azrael:
Azrael is described as an angel who transports the souls of the deceased to the next realm. This reminds me of how Asriel transports the human's body, and soul, across the barrier to the village.
Azrael is described as a being who can appear frightening or beautiful.
Azrael has also been described as a being who wears a black hooded cloak, resembling the grim reaper, but without a scythe. This is reminiscent of how Ralsei appears when we meet him in Deltarune.
Azrael is described in a poem titled "The Reaper and the Flowers" that you could draw allusions from regarding flowers, but I may be wrong on this point. I found some sources saying this references Azrael but I'm not 100% sure if it's about Azrael, or just the grim reaper.
The last thing that made me think there may be something to this is the prophecy described by Gerson in Undertale: "Legend has it, an 'angel' who has seen the surface will descend from above and bring us freedom. Lately, the people have been taking a bleaker outlook... Callin' that winged circle the 'Angel of Death'. A harbinger of destruction, waitin' to 'free' us from this mortal realm..."
The reason I think this ties into your video is because the prophecy describes the angel as someone who has seen the surface. This would apply to the player character/us, since Asriel's weaker soul flashes in the player character's soul. Asriel saw the surface when he and the human went to the surface, then returned to the underground. Since Asriel's soul exists in ours, you could say Asriel brought freedom to the underground. Gerson also says some people call the angel the "Angel of Death," which bears a striking resemblance to Azrael, the Angel of Death himself.
My thoughts aren't fully formed on this yet, and maybe I'm making connections that simply aren't there. It's a lot of conjecture but if nothing else, I do think Asriel has allusions to the name Azrael. If anyone read this whole thing, thank you!!
This is interesting
That's very very interesting...
Deltarune *isnt* just a game made up by Kris though. I've always hated that theory.
First off, Susie's dialog makes...absolutely no sense. I don't care how good of a storyteller Kris might be; there's no way Susie legitimately has to question whether everything was "A dream"??
Then there's also the fact that Susie has *NO REASON* to play along with Kris here. Why would Susie do this? Why would Susie play along with the weird kid's little D&D game? The Susie we see at the start of Chapter 1 has absolutely no reason to do this.
And even *IF* Susie played along, I refuse to believe that the "Game" we'd have seen in Chapter 1 would have anywhere NEAR the impact on susie, if any, it actually did. You mean to tell me that Susie really had a whole change of heart because Kris made them feel for a *playing card*? It just doesn't make sense.
In order for D&D theory (Or TRPG theory as I call it) to make sense, Kris would need to be the DM for it, right? If Kris is the DM of the story, then why on earth do we play through a whole campaign without susie? that's like the dungeon master narrating to themselves about themselves and another character doing their own thing. It doesn't make sense. That kind of stuff happens off screen; not *during* the goddamn session.
*THEN* we have the fact that the 'game' we play in deltarune...really wouldn't be that interesting as a D&D game. There's no unique abilities unlocked, no new spells, the combat is static the entire time. You mean to tell me Susie really was *that* invested in Kris' little D&D game but literally just used the basic Attack command for most of their game? And if you mean to tell me that Susie does this out of spite because they don't actually want to play their game then WHY ARE THEY EVEN PLAYING THE GAME IN THE FIRST PLACE?!?!
This, all of this, doesn't even *TOUCH* chapter 2, which shoots the already bleeding TRPG theory in the head (Spoilers for Chapter 2 past this;)
You mean to tell me that BERDLY joins this TRPG instead of studying?? You mean to tell me F###ING BERDLY JOINS THIS?? Noelle, MAYBE. *MAYBE*. JUST BECAUSE SUSIE IS THERE. BUT B E R D L Y??? Berdly's WHOLE THING is becoming the smartest. WHY THE HELL WOULD HE STOP STUDYING??
And their reactions after the fact... It just doesn't make sense whatsoever. Do you mean to tell me that both Noelle AND Berdly were also JUST AS IMMERSED AS SUSIE WAS and believe it to be a dream?? Why would Berdly be P R E S U M E D D E A D after the weird route??? Why is their arm still broken after the Queen fight??
Why is Noelle so dismissive about their 'dream' (Which, if TRPG theory has to be true, then it was just their D&D session that she was so immersed in that she actually has to question whether it was a dream or not) to susie after the dark world is sealed? THEY KNOW SUSIE ALLREADY KNOWS WHAT HAPPENED BECAUSE SUSIE WAS *T H E R E*???? WHY WOULD THEY BE ALL "The end was really nice tho" and then susie asks and she's like "AHAHA I GOTTA GO BYE NOT GONNA GO INTO THAT" that doesn't make sense if it's just a D&D thing.
Not even to MENTION that if it's all just a game played by Kris and Susie...what's the point? Why do we care?
I know this video was made before Chapter 2 came out but c'mon TRPG theory was bad from the start.
Damn, you only needed the first 3 paragraphs but I respect the effort
Smart
Let’s not forget that relating the Undertale and Deltarune universes is a horrible idea now that we know determination works differently between them. In Undertale, determination is possessed solely by humans, while in Deltarune, determination is possessed by lightners, meaning humans and monsters. This is why Noelle is used to make the fountain. So it’s fair to assume the rules between the games are different.
@@phishb8 Even in Undertale monsters have less determination because their bodies can't handle too much of it because they are made from magic instead of water. But they definitely have determination - as shown by Undyne who generated so much determination that she started melting.
Deltarune went out of it's way to show that the universe operates the same way as in Undertale, it's just a different universe. There is a monster wondering how it is to be made of blood. That's a quite big evidence.
Not to mention the fact Kris physically makes a NEW DARK WORLD.
A few of my ideas behind this was that the other soul was the player, cause there is a clear divide between player and character, more so in deltarune, the other idea is that it is chara, as they narrate the game
But Kris is also a vessel. We control Kris's body using the Soul inside them, which they will rip out whenever they want full control of their body.
kris isnt a vesssel, kris is their own person with a whole life before we (the player) was somehow put in their body
@@333bugfartwa Who says Vessels can't have personalities and lives before we inhabited their body?
@@linkach8898 Yeah, but then Gaster Rick-Rolls us, by giving us a *pregenerated* charater-sheet, instead of the one we made.
@@linkach8898 literally says immediately after you create the vessel that its been destroyed and you cant choose who you are there is no way you played the game because the whole point is that kris is their own person dude
What if, instead of piloting Chara's body like a mech, Frisk's body is one of Gaster's "vessels" that he specifically made to be a host for the dormant Chara/Asriel soul combination? If that's the case, maybe the reason they look so similar to Chara isn't just a stylistic choice.
Edit: This could also explain why Frisk just showed up in the middle of Flowey's timeline resets, even though everything should have been in a clean loop. Unless Flowey simply waited for longer than he usually did to reset, which is possible, but this still opens up another interpretation.
i think that's the best fit for the theory and that's why no one recognises frisk these human vessels are gasters way of meddling in the games storys
And perhaps upon entering the game we combine the vessel and the soul in undertale or (body and weaker human soul in the case of deltarune (because it is clear that we did just hijack Kris’s soul) ) and gave them an immense boost of determination in order to save and reset
To add on to this, I think we the player are actually Gaster himself. (Remember that the guy everyone assumes is Gaster is just an assumption. He's called "mystery man" in the files) Some of my reasons are better than others I'll admit; but here's by best ones. The first is the "It's rude to talk about someone who's listening" line. We have no evidence that anyone invisible is watching what's happening. Except for ourselves. We are an invisible entity watching things. And logically it makes sense for us to be doing this. A scientist suddenly becomes omniscient, untethered by consequences, free to experiment with the most intriguing subject of all: cause and effect. There's also the black screens we experience when we're not actively playing. Something of a void right? Not a big one, but it's something to think about. There's also the naming thing. The only Easter egg to come over to Deltarune from UT is that the game shuts you down if you try to name yourself, or the human Gaster. It's like, not only have you been lost to the timeline, you've been banished from it. I think this makes more sense than Gaster somehow having control over what you can name yourself/the human and choosing to stop you from using it. And there's also the idea that we've come over from UT into Deltarune. We've exhausted all possibilities for experiments in the underground and so now we've moved to a complete alternate universe to continue our experiments with cause and effect. But this time someone (Chara?) Has put us in a world where our choices don't matter... supposedly. But we maintain our ability to save and load, and have even improved it by gaining the ability to use multiple slots. So we can continue to experiment and find small differences here and there until now where we've discovered a highly specific chain of events that changes things drastically. The snowgrave route. There's also little things like how we literally use our hands to speak in-game that apply as well. I would be interested in hearing what others think about this. (No one's really replied to my theory yet lol)
@@Kjf365 or maybe gaster is Toby as the undertale/deltarune twitter account was speaking very similar to gaster right before deltarune chapter 1 was released
Oh and upon actually watching the video (lol), it would also make sense for Frisk to be able to walk through the barrier if Gaster's soul (a monster) were fundamentally linked to Frisk's human soul. (Which we may have stolen from there on) As opposed to Asriel like the video suggests.
I'm so happy to hear a mature adult voice talking about undertale. This game's story is deep and timeless.
if we where really playing as the 1st human toriel would have recognized them as soon as she saw them , so yea don't think that's the case , i also am a bit frustrated that ppl don't talk about the open caskets at the end of pacifist , the way i understood it is that flowy resurrected them . if asgore wants living humans than why does everything in the underground try to kill you instead of capture you (beside papirus) . in the end of the pacifist run flowy even said that frisk and the 1st fallen have nothing in common beside striped shirts .also the thing is frisk does not pass the barrier in the neutral run , they kind of just appear on the other side after the flowy fight , at least as shown to the player in game .
& we're shown that we fall into the underground threw a hole
& our soul shatters when we die
Also with that hole I'd it covered by the barrier cuz if so there was no indication of such since the barrier is something you can physically see
Monsters attack because it’s their way of greeting each other
Great vid, never thought about it this way! To me it's amazing that even 6 years later we are still finding new conclusions and discussing new theories.
That ending really got to me LMAO
"Ah there we go" this person really figured out toby's full storyline
Besides all the stuff he got wrong let me quote something
“There’s a light inside your soul (singular) that’s still shining in the cold.
Great to see you back! All of your theories are so well-thought-out and relaxing to listen to. S-tier content, all of them.
I always interpreted neutral endings as you not escaping the underground, but also not being in the underground anymore. You’re sort of trapped in an outside existence due to the Omega Flowey fight, living outside the world. The phone calls aren’t you picking up and talking with the characters, they’re voicemails left by Sans and the others.
To the monsters it seems like you killed Asgore, took his soul, and escaped into the surface world, but they don’t know anything about Flowey and the events that transpired.
Maybe sans
cool theory but it ignores the fact that kid kris had no feckin clue who sans and papyrus was at that point. Sans was new in town by the time deltarune happened, meaning that during the events of undertale years prior, kris wouldn't have been able to put sans and papyrus into the story
Actually, Sans appeared in Undertale not very long ago either.
@@freedom-verity what? the theory says that undertale was just kris's imagination as a child. Besides that undermining the whole item menu differences between the dark world and real world, kris wouldn't have known who sans was when they were 8 years old, and therefore it makes no sense for the bone brothers to have been in their imaginary world.
@@thog9501 yes, you're absolutely right, Sans bluntly says that he has never seen Kris before, so this is another dig at this stupid theory.
@@freedom-verity well yeah. Undertale also appears to happen sort of 'after' deltarune. Not sure, just hints in sans's dialogue. In his fight he says "i gave up trying to go back ages ago, and getting to the surface doesn't really appeal anymore either" which implies that the surface is a different place than the place he was trying to go back
@@thog9501 btw Gerson is already dead in Deltarune.
I thought we were able to pass the barrier because when Omega Flowey broke the game, we walk forward to a save point but pass where the barrier used to be. Then when Omega Flowey is beaten and the world is fixed, we're on the opposite side of the barrier
Yeah but omega flowery only appears once. Whereas no matter how many times you complete a neutral run, you always find yourself on the other side of the barrier after flowery takes the souls
@@valentinecure329 I thought that was Flowey purposely letting you pass so that you would keep resetting
@@lonebattledroid4474 then he would have to have done it during when he was being resisted by the human souls in his omega forme, which isn't very likely. for the world to be set back to right after your last save after he supposedly destroyed it, AND he puts you on the other side of the barrier would mean that he expected to lose, which isn't very likely.
@@valentinecure329 What I mean is when Flowey first got the human souls he made the game crash and deleted the world. Then we walked forward towards the save point and passed where the barrier used to be. Then after the Omega Flowey fight we're on the opposite side of the barrier now and can leave. Then in every other ending he takes the souls but since he can't fight us because the souls would just retaliate again, he deletes the world and pushes us past the barrier and restores the world.
@@lonebattledroid4474 wouldn't that count as destroying the barrier? he can't do that with just 6 souls. Wherever Omega Floweys world is, it must be within the barrier.
Chara was the first human
When they said "reincarnation" they meant that Frisk, a different person, has the same soul as Chara. Just the next one to get it
flowey IS asriel, asriel outright says this when he said "I haven't had a soul for so long" on the true pacifist route. this doesnt seem to affect the rest of the theory tho so its fine, i agree on the other things like asgore "SPARING" the humans.
but this is juust what flowey thinks of himself. flowey isnt asriel. he doesnt have a sould. hes completely empty, only havin asriels esense. unless u make the argumnt that a monster is their essence and not their soul, but tht would change the way we look at souls in the undertale and delta rune universe. but as far as the evidence points, flowy THINKS hes asriel bcuz he has the netiriety of asriels memories, but not his soul. it just makes flowey an even more tragic character tbh.
@@purplestatic4917 this makes sense but asriel has memories of being a flower, but then i kinda agree about the "flowey is just asriel's essence" theory making him more tragic
@@purplestatic4917 The two being separate entities is what Asriel thinks of himself.
…and after getting through a bit more, I’m starting to think all the comics about him being freaked out by Flowey got it all wrong. This post-death “Asriel” only contains his essence (as is tradition for a monster’s dust/essence to be spread across their favorite thing so they might… *live on)* and not his SOUL, which Flowey himself states is the *culmination of your being.*
I never even thought to question how we passed the barrier in a neutral run with all the possible boss monster SOULS unabsorbable (actually that raises the question of Toriel).
This is wack.
@@wildfire9280 it wasn't a problem for Flowey to absorb the soul of a non-monster boss, so it shouldn't be a problem for a human either.
@@freedom-verity Only issue with that is humans can’t absorb souls.
Why is it a widely accepted fact that all the humans that fell down were children? I mean you find a real gun in the underground and in hotland at that, someones made it far before dying, somehow doubt it was a kid(the toy knife and such items being present in earlier areas indicate that the younger victims died earlier)
Toby said this directly. And with how powerful humans are in comparison to monsters, as well as their fear and likely numerous superstitions of them, I doubt an adult human would climb Mt. Ebott, let alone be defeated if they did.
That real gun was held by the same human who wore a cowboy hat. Now we may not have an exact timeline of human history on the surface or how similar it is to our own history, but it appears to have evolved into what we’d consider normal.
Why the possessions of some are littered around across the map, especially in the Ruins, I have no idea, since we know Asgore killed them all. I’m going to have to go with balancing.
@@wildfire9280 I don't understand why wouldn't an adult climb mt ebott lol
Maybe the yellow soul was the first one to climb and maybe it was responsible for the mountains reputation. And it's clear that the human kind of shot their way through the underground until they ran out of bullets at which point they were defeated by asgore in the hotlands
this is genuinely a really good video, ive actually never known that the coffins are open on the pacifist ending, this is severely underrated.
If you interact with the flowers in the first room Frisk will say that it broke their fall. So you are playing as the 8th human.
The narration says "* (Golden Flowers.)
* (They _must have_ broken your fall.)"
That sounds more like someone is _guessing_ at what happened,
rather than stating it as a given fact.
@@King_Luigi I don’t think it’s questioning whether it actually happened or not. It seems more likely that it’s questioning whether that was the soul reason for surviving the fall.
That was probably the most refined, coherent and original lore video i ever watched!
You deserve more subs!
My personal belief is that Deltarune (instead of being another reality or something) is just a retelling of the prophecy in Undertale ( “The Delta Rune”). Where an angel of sorts descends into the underground and frees the monsters. In Deltarune (Chapter 2) Kris descends down and you have the option to “save” those you encounter and take them back to Castle Town.
TL;DR:
Deltarune is nothing more than a retelling of a prophecy from Undertale, made into a cool game.
Interesting theory, to say the least. Funny how it turns Deltarune into a sequel of sorts. I wonder how it relates to the puppet talk regarding Spamton.
Toby said it's neither a sequel nor prequel, that means it's a same-timequel
@@Solesteam it's an alternate universe not a same-timequel
@@theartisticpaperbag6247 Same thing kinda...
Chapter 2 kinda supports your theory.
The whole world-creating power... kinda.
I admit, I never even realized the logical issue until you brought it up, but I like where you've taken it. That being said, if Frisk is the soulless body of Chara that we "control," it explains why they have those moments of acting out or resisting our control, but not why they would have their own name. Looking forward to you addressing Frisk in more detail in the next vid!
Pretty sure Frisk/Chara are not related Kris as Toby has stated it's an alternate universe. It's clear that Kris had his own life prior to our soul getting put into him as people say he has been acting different and when we first save in Deltarune we end up saving our file over Kris's file, implying the player has taken control of his life.
@@GamingYoshi64 I'm not sure how this connects to my comment. But also I think Sock Muppet is talking about the "rules" of souls controlling humans,.that in theory should pay to Kris as they are in a similar position to Frisk. Kris we know has a name beforehand, but Frisk would not of they were the zombified corpse of Chara.
@@jadeceridwen93 my bad misread it and thought you said Kris
@@GamingYoshi64 lol no prob
I hope you're still replying to comments, because I have questions. If Undertale is a world created by Kris when they and Asriel were kids, then how did people who Kris had not yet met, like Sans and Papyrus, appear in Undertale? Sans says he is new in town in Chapter 1, and if the player makes Kris say "Great to see you again", he points out that they have never met.
Also, if the first human is a dead and animated by the player's power, then how would they display free will in the genocide ending? Kris struggles to move without our control, so why can an actual corpse can force us to do its bidding like we are a player character?
Sans is in the game for possibly 2 reasons:
The game isn't finished yet
OR
Sans can go into ANY world, it would explain how he & Paps just "inserted themselves" in Snowdin.
Why even have “Great to see you again” as an option? (Unless it’s based on obvious meta knowledge most players would have, which nullifies my entire question)
@@wildfire9280 It's a meta thing that the player (you) have taken over Kris's body and because we have knowledge of Undertale, we know who he is. I don't think Kris = Frisk/Chara but if this truly is just an alternate universe to Undertale then it's possible Kris is this universes Frisk/Chara.
Honestly while I like your theory, most of it feels like it could be explained slot easier, you know Occam's razor?
Examples:
The first humans coffin is the only one the game actively tells you is empty, the coffin is empty both before and after the pacifist ending, it is established in game (as you said) that toriel took the body and buried it.
(I know you did mention this but) why would our character actively call themselves frisk, if they were the first human, a character who not only has a canon name (chara) but can never be called frisk (as that would activate hard mode which stops at the ruins) there is no reason for them to call themselves that.
(Occam's razor again) I always took the simplest answer for the neutral ending, barrier is a few steps Infront of us, when we go to "floweys world" we walk forward for awhile, when we defeat flowey and go back to our world, we are on the other side of the barrier.
Honestly I like this theory but it just doesn't feel right, there are a few to many stretches in my opinion and it feels like often there's a much simpler answer.
I will say despite this I can't answer where the first humans soul went, or why sans can call us beyond the barrier.
There is an even simpler explanation. Toby Fox just cut the moment with how the monsters sacrifice some kind of Froggit or Gerson for Frisk's departure so as not to spoil the impression of players. The fact that this is exactly the case proves that the very appearance of Frisk on the Surface, which definitely happened, is also cut out.
@@freedom-verity
Personally don't agree with this (atleast not fully) but I will say there's no real evidence against it.
@@pineappleudh6561 I like it better because otherwise it's implied that Flowey was so powerful to let another person pass through the barrier, although he couldn't destroy it because it takes 7 souls to do it. And the appearance of Flowey at the end of the neutral route is mysterious because he couldn't appear after passing through the Barrier. This means that after Frisk "passed" through the Barrier in an unknown period of time, Flowey approached them and began to convince them to return, which he couldn't do. This could only happen if the end of the game is not a passing through the Barrier. The passing through the Barrier itself and how it happened is not shown, Frisk passes through the Barrier and receives a call from the monsters, remembers their meeting with Flowey, which occurred some time after the end of the game and before passing through the Barrier, and decides to go back.
@@freedom-verity
You know that's one thing that's always confused me, in the fake Undertale intro before the omega flowey fight it says "one day they all disappeared without a trace" in relation to monsters and humans,
However we know that flowey only has 6 souls, he literally says he needs one more,
I guess this could just be flowey trying to scare you, make you lose your nerve.
@@pineappleudh6561 yes, the Barrier blocks all this magical effect, it's 100%. Not everyone understands this, but Chara also, "erasing" the world, doesn't do it literally. The Barrier is still standing. They're just destroy the last one who remains in this world, and for them the world ceases to exist.
"We already have two souls inside us"
What about the theory that you don't cross the barrier at the end of the neutral ending? I always thought you just die and the phone call sans makes towards you never reaches you
14:06 body decay exists, just um so you know, i think there is a reason kris always puts there soul back just leting you know bonerific
Me when I first saw the title:
"Me? Me?! I don't even know who I am!!"
But seriously, this video blown my mind
Okay but why then must Asgore kill Frisk at the end of every pkaythrough minus genocide? If he can simply extract Frisks soul then return it?
I knew I could count on you for an actually GOOD theory. This series has great mysteries and it's plagued by some of the worst theories imaginable where it's all biased fan fiction. You're the best.
If you go back to the first room after encountering flowey and check the flowers it says they broke your fall which mean that the human we're playing with have just fallen previously but which mean we're playing with another human rather than chara's body
You could say it is talking about chara's first fall but that would be wrong because we see no flowers in the falling scene /frame
Ive heard other people come up the theory that you do only need a human soul, but the monsters think you need both a human and monster soul since thats the only time they've ever seen anyone cross the barrior. It would also be kinda weird for humans to put up a barrier, and if they perhaps needed to cross, was not able to, because of the requirement of both monster and human soul. Instead of just idk making it easier for them
brother i am convinced you are the only person who is seeing the full picture that toby is creating. this theory is so incredibly good, easy sub
So... Asriel is the most important character in Undertale???
No, US, the players are, we set everything in motion, we boot the game, we play it, we choose what to do, everything is consequence of our actions.
@@mugenmarshal01 you are not a character, you are a passenger
@@fault3k if you still don't get it, I'm not sorry.
I’ve never bought into the the “Flowey is emotionless because he doesn’t have a soul” because based off the alarm clock app and post pacifist route, he keeps his emotions and empathy. To me it just seems like he was super traumatized
woah. wooooooooah man
that explains so much i hadnt even known i needed to be explained
good job, really
the details like the bandages really sold it to me i have to admit
I did not find this theory convincing myself, here are some counter points
when chara says "i cannot understand these feelings anymore" it isn't implying that they once could understand it. They are saying they could understand the purpose of the first genocide run but now cannot understand the player's motivation for doing a second one.
it seems like flowey not actually having a soul is meant to explain why he is so immoral / evil, but this didn't need explaining. It's because he had the power to reset the world like we do now.
If asriel's soul is within our soul, how does flowey get it back at the end of the pacifist run when we fight asriel?
I think an alternate explanation for the coffins being open is that the souls and bodies were kept there, and they were opened recently so asgore could get the souls in preparation for takign your final soul. and surely the monsters would have noticed if one of the souls was missing at the start of the game.
The most importatnt point is taht i don't believe humans can live without their souls, at least not indefinitely. Deltarune shows that while kris is able to remove the soul, he appears to be weak and zombie like when he does it. Kris also always returns the soul after removing it, even though there is a lot of evidence implying he does not like beign controlled by it.
Chapter 2 had something else that makes this seem really likely. after the spamton NEO fight the cutscene shows that the encounter had a strong emotional effect on kris (he yells when you pick "no" to the question "are you ok"). I think this shows that kris can relate to spamton, both are puppets, spamton a puppet on strings and kris a puppet to the soul. When spamton lost his strings he died, and kris knows if he lost the soul the same would happen to him.
My theory is that in undertale you play as chara's soul in frisk's body. at the end you escape using asriel / flowey's soul.
Interesting theory and you did point out some things that others ignore, but there are a lot of roles in it
humans being able to create worlds?
*Deltarune Chapter 2 would like to know your location*
It’s revealed determination works differently in Deltarune, and it’s direct mention is often avoided for whatever reason. Lightners, including monsters, should be able to create dark fountains.
why does this only have 6000 views this is such a good video
Deltarune ch2 confirmed so much of this.
I always thought that you took Asgores on neutral. Than I saw a different theory that convinced me you never make it out in the neutral route.
"The way he died" (reverb fart) 2:30
There is just one flaw in this and I'm surprised you overlooked it soooo hard. Everyone who sees Frisk (and knew Chara) do not treat them like Chara and Asriel himself actually acknowledged that Frisk isn't Chara, that she is long gone.
The whole soul thing is going somewhere. Frisk probably has one more soul already and it is probably the combined should of Chara and Asriel. Asriel does say as a flower he was soulless after all. Just a vessel filled with determination, but also asked why Frisk came to Mt Ebot, acknowledging that they are a different kid. An actual 8th kid.
TFW you click this thinking it would have something to do with the player possessing Kris but then you see it was posted on August
HOLY CRAP dude.... I'm so glad someone else had the idea -- that Undertale might actually be a Dark World, with everyone from the town inside. Awesome theorizations, bro.
Undertale can't be a Dark World, and here is some evidence:
- The menu you have when you press C in Undertale is the Light World menu, not the Dark World menu
- When a lightner goes to a Dark World, they have their memories from the Light World, but in Undertale, no one remembers Kris, or Noelle, or Rudy, or any character that only appeared in Deltarune
hes back :D
my favourite small australian (or new zealand) theorist
This is mind-blowing. Thank you for your contribution to opening up the lore !!
That's a fresh perspective, can't wait to hear your future perspective as deltarune progresses!
I actually have a counter theory to this. I think we the player are actually Gaster himself. (Remember that the guy everyone assumes is Gaster is just an assumption. He's just called "mystery man" in the files) And if we are Gaster, then it would provide an explanation for why Frisk can cross the barrier without taking the soul of a monster, and why there's no visual representation of it in the heart we see. We don't technically exist. We're a monster lost to the timeline. Some of my reasons are better than others I'll admit; but here's by best ones. The first is the "It's rude to talk about someone who's listening" line. We have no evidence that any invisible person is watching what's happening. Except for ourselves. We are an invisible entity watching things. And logically it makes sense for us to be doing this. A scientist suddenly becomes omniscient, untethered by consequences, free to experiment with the most intriguing subject of all: cause and effect. There's also the black screens we experience when we're not actively playing. Something of a void right? Not a big one, but it's something to think about. There's also the naming thing. The only Easter egg to come over to Deltarune from UT is that the game shuts you down if you try to name yourself, or the human Gaster. It's like, not only have you been lost to the timeline, you've been banished from it. I think this makes more sense than Gaster somehow having control over what you can name yourself/the human and choosing to stop you from using it. And there's also the idea that we've come over from UT into Deltarune. We've exhausted all possibilities for experiments in the underground and so now we've moved to a complete alternate universe to continue our experiments with cause and effect. But this time someone (Chara?) Has put us in a world where our choices don't matter... supposedly. But we maintain our ability to save and load, and have even improved it by gaining the ability to use multiple slots. So we can continue to experiment and find small differences here and there until now where we've discovered a highly specific chain of events that changes things drastically. The snowgrave route. There's also little things like how we literally use our hands to speak in-game that apply as well. All of this would actually be far less obtrusive to the story the game's told thus far. Frisk is still an 8th human, Chara's essence (not soul) just sorta took a ride on that 8th human's soul, Chara can still be separate. All of it. I would be interested in hearing what others think about this. (No one's really replied to my theory yet lol)
Finally, a video that is not SANdS UNDERLTAE. Best undertale video i've ever seen, i wish all undertale videos were that interesting.
I personally think that frisk fell down into the underground and died with their body now in control of chara, or us who named chara in the begging of the game.
I knew about most of this since the start, but no one believed me.
Great video, great editing, great theories. I'm subscribing!
this is the first underale/ deltarune theory ive ever herd tht actually has convinced me somewhat. i feel like we jst need 2 wait 4 the rest of deltarunes chapters and more lore 2 come out 4 u 2 uncover all of the lore
Love to see my boy Sock Muppet finally popping off after so much work he's done
ALL THAT to understand how did we go through the Barrier
I haven't watched the video yet but my theory is that you are controlling chara, that controls frisk, but you and Chara aren't really separated in the normal/pacifist routes, and when they are, they are a metaphor for the player
I love how bonerific completely broke the entire time lines just to try to save the last 30 seconds of the neutral route
i love how you said:you know what?asgore get rid of the dead kids bodies in the basement 10:33
there were mummy wrappings inside charas grave, implying that he was wrapped in mummy wrappings after he died. Plus a grave isnt really a good place to keep kids alive in.
during the genocide run, the narrorator says, "its me chara", instead of "its me Asriel".
if our soul is missing during the Asriel dreemur fight, then whos narrarating for us during that fight?
If asriel gave back those sould to the people they belonged, and asriel could sense the feelings of each soul inside him, he would know that that soul belonged to him and would keep it instead of giving it back to frisk.
also, WHY DOES THE HUMAN SAY THEY ARE FRISK AND NOT CHARA?
i really enjoyed watching this, and you actually managed to convince me on this theory, which i was not expecting. you had really good points. i’d love to see more undertale/deltarune videos like this from you, keep it up!
I'll definitely be watching your carrier with interest Mr. Sock Muppet Man.
17:40 i'm not sure what the text at the bottom is supposed to mean but it's such a non-sequitur that it can't help but be funny
This soul talk reminds me of Ask Frisk and Company, they came to a similar conclusion. AFAK had flowey's 'soul' be tied up in the ghost of 'chara', and when Chara let go of their anger (and Frisk) Asriel's soul merged into Flowey to bring Asriel back. Your theory has similar notes. saying that most people 'used' to agree that Frisk was only able to load and save due to Chara's soul. My personal theory has been that Deltarune happens in a world where Ariel/Chara succeeded in their plan to free the monsters, meaning the monsters were already on the surface long before the events of undertale could happen. Kris could be an older Frisk who never had the undertale adventure but I think the souls of 'Chara' and 'Asriel' are still involved, hence the three save files.
Wow, thats was cool.
Fantastic analysis, keep it up
Hey, have you thought about exploring Omori as a side thing to this? The world itself is a lot bigger than Undertale though debatably the mysteries behind it are a little more straight forward.
I'll look into it, ill ad it to my list
@@sockmuppet568 thank you I can’t wait to watch it in 9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 eons
After some research I found something chara soul was inside aerial’s body meaning that chara didn’t care anymore because if the most determined human has control of the underground chara became non determined theory needs more evidence.
HOLY HANDGRENADES! THAT'S PROBABLY WHY HE MUMMIFIED THE SOULS AND NOT BURIED THEM!
but... why is frisk and Chara different coloured in clothes and skin?
My theory is that Chara is still down there buried in the ground rotting thanks to Toriel burying the body with all the worms and decomposing microorganisms but it's a kind of soul inception, since Asriel took Chara's soul and not the other way around, Frisk could have landed on Asriel's soul (probably floating around near the entrance and Frisk happened to be the unlucky one to land on it on their way down) and absorbed both souls accidentally hence why Frisk goes by their own name at the end of the pacifist route, why the soul is a pure red one and doesn't flicker white or something. It also would somewhat explain why not every human with a red soul can manipulate time, because frisk has a sandwich of Souls and when flowey becomes omega flowey he has multiple more souls. As to how Kris can reset, that might have to do with his possible studying of magic according to his internet search history, which would also explain why there's different *white* save point stars in that game, the same colour as the magical monster souls. As for why chara suddenly is "awakened" during genocide, that might be because Frisk entirely gives up due to possibly being a slightly less impressionable and more kind hearted person than Chara who wasn't exactly the best person as Asriel states is being molded into a heartless killer and what is awakened isn't Chara literally waking up but instead is Chara coming to a realization of their "purpose" in coming back as the guide to your puppet.
So essentially what your saying is that when we play through Undertale
We are piloting a bone mech that's wearing meat armor?
I just had a thought regarding how Frisk got the Chara/Asriel soul.
What if the fall into the underground killed Frisk? They fell, died, and their soul was destroyed. Then Chara's remaining soul, buried under the flowerbed, saw a now empty vessel and jumped in. Frisk is still Frisk, but their soul is now the Asriel/Chara soul. This would also explain why they're strong enough to fight through people like Undyne & Asgore.
Alphys: *injects Determination into spaghetti*
Alphys the next day: Why does the spaghetti say Nyeh heh heh?
Breaking News: Aussie solves Undertale
Game theorists: We will watch your career with great success.
My brain is going softer each time I rewatch this, amazing video!!!
Dude underrated channel my English is bad i cant understand too much but your edits are so good
Because of the obvious parallelism I think that Frisk acts as a vessel in Undertale in the same way Kris does in Deltarune. That would explain how the red soul represents both Chara and Frisk and also Chara's presence during the playthrough (as a consequence of the union of Asriels' soul with Chara's)
Simple solution for your name being Frisk: At the start of UNDERTALE, your corpse changed, your personality was reseted, we're not anymore Chara or Asriel, we're a new form, we're Frisk.
I assumed that the reason we could cross the barrier was because the six human souls made an opening for us. A being can cross if it has the power of a human and a monster soul, but I figured this meant it required a certain amount of "soul power." A monster soul has very little soul power compared to a human, and the barrier works so that the soul power required to pass it is just barely more than that of a single human. Therefore, even though 6 human souls can't break the barrier, they can let one person through.
I definitely agree that the 6 other humans are probably alive and left. I'm a bit iffy on connecting Deltarune and Undertale the way you did at the end of the video, but overall very good vid.
I had always just assumed that trying to cross the barrier without the required souls would result in death, and for this reason, all neutral runs ended with "Frisk" dying. The voicemails are sad regardless, but I think this assumption made them seem a lot sadder to me. The characters were trying to talk to them thinking that they were out there and free, maybe living their best life, when really they weren't living at all
Omg that's so sad 😭
Nah it doesn't make sense, since after human souls escape flowey leaving him in vulnerable state, we talk to him, so Frisk most likely is alive, the explanation is simple the human souls moved us and Flowey onto the surface.
A very well made theory, I always had something similiar in my head as a headcanon
The Real reason you can cross the barrier without a monster soul is because your just that determined
They already breaks logic by just refusing to die from being blasted by a goat with 7 human souls enough to break the barrier
It says all monster souls would equal 1 human in the waterfall area and you cant do true pacifist if any monsters are dead because all the monsters have to be alive to equate a human soul to make 7
Determination kinda just says no U to everything
Even death
This is mostly a joke but also not because Determination defies logic because they are just that determined
Before you fight omega flowey your behind the barrier. When your transported back to your world after beating omega flowey your past the barrier. You go through the barrier because of flowey.
I am me, me am I.
You are the player. It’s not that complicated.
It’s then the morale delima of “you are hijacking a body, are you a good person?”
I don't pretend to know what this means for Frisk being the first child rather than 8th, but in one of the True Pacifist endings if you choose to live with Toriel and meet some other predicate (I think it's to properly spare EVERY monster), Chara will burst out of your wardrobe and take a piece of the pie Toriel leaves for you.
If we're going off of Undertale being a game between Kris and Asriel in Deltarune, then this could very well be how Kris interprets getting up in the night and sneaking a piece of pie (yet again).
Alternatively going off a more generalized view point, this could be a red flag indication that it is (probably a genocide) Chara possessing Kris during the moments where the player/soul is removed, which really doesn't seem that big a stretch considering the change in font at the end of Creating a Vessel.
this theory is fucking bonkers and absolutely brilliant
i always figured that asriel took out the body to bury it hence his watering the flowers.
Oh if we had Asriel's soul in us the entire time then that would explain the flashback at the beginning of the trash zone
Pleas you are so good at analyzing and talking about topics like these... Please come back... I love your content (especially the petscop videos)
this theory was incredible wow
Miss ya man
dude when his theory dosen’t make sense: GasTEr. WDgAsTEr
What if Frisk didn't get out of the barrier and that they died or possibly got trapped in the middle of it since that had some but not quite enough power to cross through so they could have gotten stuck partway through and they possibly passed away inside of it. Also the barrier seems to jam phone service,because even after a neutral run when you go back to the core Undyne still has phone battery as she calls you at the core entrance. And it probably isn't the core because Alphys can still call you. Another possibility is that when you fight Omega Flowey you could have lost or dropped your phone and forgot about it. so my order of events is Omega Flowey,possibly dropped/lost cell phone,The human tries to cross the barrier,Fails, and is forever trapped in between it.
undertale/deltarune got me questioning who I am