I never had problems with cupramine but fish can get ich any time. It happens as easily as common cold and stress. However tangs are like ich magnets and just like you i love keeping them. I had great success getting a bucket of freshwater and getting it to exact same temp as current tank and doing a freshwater dip. I would put the fish in the freshwater and allow it to swim til it start to tip then put back into qt tank. It can take a bit for it to happen so be patient and stay with the fish. Hyposolinity i found more stressful for fish and least successful. Some ich may become resilient to cupramine. But i noticed all marine ich cannot survive freshwater just like how freshwater ich cannot survive saltwater. As long as you keep the fish in bucket long enough to tip that means the freshwater was sucked into the fish and his buoyancy was lost which is perfect because inside and out you killed ich instantly. Hope it bring as much success as it has for me to you. I use this method for marine and salt fish just before i put them into qt tank because it garentee no transfer of ich. And you should change water in qt btw it helps eliminate ich too.
I’m glad your powder blue is an utter nutcase too, powder blues all seem to have the same scitzo personality, they act borderline stressed but every one I’ve seen acts the same.
Hi Travis, have you considered using Chloroquine Phosphate? You should be able to get a prescription from a Vet given what you do. I stopped using Copper and use CP instead for fish that aren't sensitive to it. It's a different medication than Copper so having both might help in the event you run into this issue again. I've used CP against velvet with great success. You also may have a stubborn strain of ich or your copper level dropped below the therapeutic range.
I read a seachem response about the shelf life of cupramine and they were claiming to have tested stuff that was years old and it was still stable and had not degraded.
I hope you get things worked out with the Fox face and your yellow tang. Sorry the clown tang died. I’ve heard clown tangs get super mean once they reach about 4 inches. Good luck Travis. Love your channel
Tank Transfer Method. 100% works and can be done in 10 days and is easier on the fish IMO! I had myself a Clown Tang years ago. Unfortunately lost him to a power failure while on vacation.
Larger foxface from the wild are really prone to eating corals. I’d be very iffy adding one to a display like yours that may be impossible to catch after adding. I’ve had two and both ended up munching sps, chalices, and Montis
My Cupramine is definitely more than 3 years old. That being said I don't use it to treat ick anymore. Why don't you try TTM (tank transfer method)? You have lots of tanks and equipment. It's so easy on both the fish and the fish keeper
TTM just takes 12 days..it’s surprising to me you feel this isn’t the best way to go. (prior to placing in an observation QT tank) Perhaps you’ve since changed your mind.
I’ve found that chloroquine is effective as a treatment/ preventative measures of ich ,velvet & brook, it has helped lower mortality rates in late stages of these conditions. Drop the salinity to 1020 and put a neon cleaner goby in as well,followed by a prazipro treatment that takes salinity & temperature int account I only use copper on fish that cannot tolerant CP. hope this helps. I’ve picked a lot up from your videos. Thanks. Cheers.
If you have quarantine tank all you have to do is raise the temperature slowly to 30 degrees wait 2 weeks job done no need for med,also introduced fish in the dark leave tank for at least 3 days or real moonlight if you have corals. Don't waste time using meds they do more harm..most important is do not stress fish in any way. Quarantine tank this and that just another way for company to sell expensive equipment.
Lost a Blue Hippo in QT, just started to get and add fish to a 225 gallon tank. This is the first tank I have done a QT on and its rough losing a fish...Hope you can get clown tang to make it.
Cupramine can be removed using carbon or CupriSorb. Leave the copper-absorbing media in your tank for at least a week after the copper concentration has reached 0 to ensure all traces of the medication have been completely removed.
I’ve found that the ml dosage on the bottle doesn’t necessarily mean you will be at 0.6 cupramine so don’t go by ml at all go by a hanna checker or another test
If you want to win this battle. Give him a freshwater bath at least 3 min. Than add him into a 5 gal tank or bucket of fresh salt water mix. Add half dose with copper safe. Than add him into a other bucket of Fresh saltwater mix every 10 hours Add formalin -MS. Do this morning and before bed. For 5 days. Feed just enough he eats. Watch ammonia but should not build up in 10 hours.Alter copper safe with formalin- ms don't mix both. Make sure temp and air in bucket. Best to transfer fish in new water so the ick is remove from water. Your ick is immune to copper.
Only ever had 2 saltwater fish get ich. but with my freshwater system i raised the temp to speed up their life cycle and dose meleflex i think, all i remember is it smiled like viks(this was 7+ yrs ago) and it knocked it out fast. read only real time it is vulnerable is in the free floating stage and that is when to kill it off. raising temp just keeps them at that stage longer. again this was in regards to freshwater don't know how it would fair with salt. Good luck bro
The copper works for this sometime you have to mix it with others chemicals.. I have did this experiment and would antibiotic they have no problem quarantine the fishes
Love your stuff, hope he pulls through, cuppermine should not expire as it is just elemental copper suspended in solution. That said I have no good backup data for that
FIrst off I love your vids. I am not a fan of Ionic copper such as cupramine because it is so harsh. From testing it seems like chelated cooper is not as harsh. I use Coppersafe by mardel. hyposalinity also works great as you said you would use in the vid. I would also get a fresh bottle of that copper you are using. I look forward to your followup vids. P.S my yellow tang is a jerk too lol.
Going through the exact same thing right now...with a Yellow and Purple Tang, a Bellus Angel, and a Moorish Idol in my 55 gallon QT...these 4 fish were treated in Cupramine and Prazipro and looked great. Put them together in the 55 gallon tank to see how they did together and they looked great for 2 days...day three the Moorish Idol developed Black Ick and a day later the Yellow Tang. Now 48 hours later and the Bellus has regular White Ick. Pulling my hair out because I have a new bottle of cupramine and it seemed to have done nothing. I had even tested to make sure the level was therapeutic. Tonight I dosed Coppersafe (Chelated Copper) and Prazipro together because I am at a loss. I feel Like I have had these guys in QT forever and cannot get them out.
My yellow eye tang reject the cupermine treatment i have to now take the copper out fine for 10am to 8pm fine then just flop on the ground i taken the copper out. Do i strip out as much as i can to he fine and treat it with very low dosage.
That poor foxface. I'm wondering the same about the cupramine maybe expiring. I've looked on my bottle and there is no exp date. Hoping everything gets better for him.
I’m going through the exact same thing with my fish in QT - are you sure it’s not flukes? Hypo should kill them if it is, but Cupramine won’t and they’re often resistant to Prazi. So many reefers get Fluke and ich mixed up, because it can look similar at times and the fish will show similar behaviours.
The only product I ever seen work in 30 years of salt water fish is polyp lab medic. Of course if the fish is to far gone or too weak nothing will help.
This is from the seachem FAQ What's the shelf life of your Cupramine™ product? A: Cupramine, like the rest of our line, is designed to have an indefinite shelf life (relatively speaking). The only way this product may not function properly is if something was purposely added to the bottle to contaminate the product or precipitate the ingredients out of solution.
I would put the salinity 1.008-1.009 right away instead of slowly decreasing, the parasites will pop and within 24 hours the white spots are gone, then slowly increase by 0.002 per day up to 1.026 and keep on coppermine for 2+ weeks. This worked for my tangs perfectly.
Hey hex I would love to see you do a quarantine tank Using only fresh Ginger powder and human antibiotics amoxicillin. I Do this treatment right in my main display you could look at my channel quick And you will see that I have a lot of Corals I have a clam, I have sponge, and an assortment of about 50 fish. I just rescued 3 morrish idols that were not eating and skinny My last video is of those idols They went right into my main tank I do not worry about marine ich or any other type of marine diseases as long as I use fresh Ginger powder and amoxicillin it seems I could beat anything. I haven't lost not a fish to disease in quite a long time
Drop some old copper pennies in your filter threw high flow by some I mean like 2$ worth it will kill all the off spring of the ich parasite as they pass threw the pennies and buy one of the cleaner fish and don't feed them except like once a week so the cleaner is hungry enuff to eat the ichs
I don’t think you were at a constant therapeutic level. There’s no way that after 4 weeks of poison in the water column (such as copper) that ICH could function enough to carry out any stages of the life cycle. Unless your Copper is expired OR you let the tank drop below a therapeutic level. If you know it’s ICH, why wouldn’t you tank transfer the fish instead of treating them with a poison?
Never understood why people do not use a UV sterilizer in their tanks. I ran a 300ga reef and never QT any fish and never had ich or any other fish disease. I have used UV on all my tanks and NEVER had ich. First thing I do when I start a tank, add UV.
Are you using the Hanna checker to actually check the levels? Maybe you are not actually at a good dose. Edit: Crap man, just started watching the vid and those were my thoughts and I see others had it too. Ignore me LOL.
At 0:47 you mentioned you have killed 4 or 5 Clown Tangs. Don't you think it would be better to therefore leave this species in the ocean? If someone had purchased 4 or 5 puppies/cats/horses/parrots over a given period and each of them had died in the first couple of weeks, you'd report them to the police. Learn a lesson here! Adding a Clown Tang to a tank with resident Powder Blue Tang and the others will only create stress for all the fish and will likely result in the loss of more fish somewhere else anyway.
How about you let me decide what I want to do with my tank and adding a clown tang is no different than adding any other tang. Btw some people eat cats, dogs, horses and probably parrot kabobs.
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Cupramine has an unlimited shelf life.
www.aquariumsupplies.ca/aquarium/skus/me/Cupramine.pdf
I never had problems with cupramine but fish can get ich any time. It happens as easily as common cold and stress. However tangs are like ich magnets and just like you i love keeping them. I had great success getting a bucket of freshwater and getting it to exact same temp as current tank and doing a freshwater dip. I would put the fish in the freshwater and allow it to swim til it start to tip then put back into qt tank. It can take a bit for it to happen so be patient and stay with the fish. Hyposolinity i found more stressful for fish and least successful. Some ich may become resilient to cupramine. But i noticed all marine ich cannot survive freshwater just like how freshwater ich cannot survive saltwater. As long as you keep the fish in bucket long enough to tip that means the freshwater was sucked into the fish and his buoyancy was lost which is perfect because inside and out you killed ich instantly. Hope it bring as much success as it has for me to you. I use this method for marine and salt fish just before i put them into qt tank because it garentee no transfer of ich. And you should change water in qt btw it helps eliminate ich too.
I’m glad your powder blue is an utter nutcase too, powder blues all seem to have the same scitzo personality, they act borderline stressed but every one I’ve seen acts the same.
Hi Travis, have you considered using Chloroquine Phosphate? You should be able to get a prescription from a Vet given what you do. I stopped using Copper and use CP instead for fish that aren't sensitive to it. It's a different medication than Copper so having both might help in the event you run into this issue again. I've used CP against velvet with great success. You also may have a stubborn strain of ich or your copper level dropped below the therapeutic range.
I read a seachem response about the shelf life of cupramine and they were claiming to have tested stuff that was years old and it was still stable and had not degraded.
Good luck with the hypo. It's good to see a hobbyist who is very diligent with their qt process
Sorry to hear about your fish :( One of my macaws has been having health issues recently, so I sympathize with how it feels.
I hope you get things worked out with the Fox face and your yellow tang. Sorry the clown tang died. I’ve heard clown tangs get super mean once they reach about 4 inches. Good luck Travis. Love your channel
Tank Transfer Method. 100% works and can be done in 10 days and is easier on the fish IMO! I had myself a Clown Tang years ago. Unfortunately lost him to a power failure while on vacation.
Larger foxface from the wild are really prone to eating corals. I’d be very iffy adding one to a display like yours that may be impossible to catch after adding. I’ve had two and both ended up munching sps, chalices, and Montis
My Cupramine is definitely more than 3 years old. That being said I don't use it to treat ick anymore. Why don't you try TTM (tank transfer method)? You have lots of tanks and equipment. It's so easy on both the fish and the fish keeper
90% of the time all QT tanks have fish in them. It's not a method I can use and keep fish moving in and out
TTM just takes 12 days..it’s surprising to me you feel this isn’t the best way to go. (prior to placing in an observation QT tank)
Perhaps you’ve since changed your mind.
I’ve found that chloroquine is effective as a treatment/ preventative measures of ich ,velvet & brook, it has helped lower mortality rates in late stages of these conditions. Drop the salinity to 1020 and put a neon cleaner goby in as well,followed by a prazipro treatment that takes salinity & temperature int account I only use copper on fish that cannot tolerant CP. hope this helps. I’ve picked a lot up from your videos. Thanks. Cheers.
6 weeks for ick treatment with cupramine. Then 2 weeks of no treatment.
80 days total for ich treatment in DT (fallow) only.
Would you ever do the Tank transfer method for the qt of fish?
If you have quarantine tank all you have to do is raise the temperature slowly to 30 degrees wait 2 weeks job done no need for med,also introduced fish in the dark leave tank for at least 3 days or real moonlight if you have corals. Don't waste time using meds they do more harm..most important is do not stress fish in any way. Quarantine tank this and that just another way for company to sell expensive equipment.
Do you use a hanna copper checker? On reef2reef some of the guys have said some batches cupramine is weak. The hanna checker will verify the level.
Its on my list to get now that this problem came up
Cool man! Yeah that's crazy though the higher dosage didn't knock it out. Love your videos!
This is 100% correct!
Lost a Blue Hippo in QT, just started to get and add fish to a 225 gallon tank. This is the first tank I have done a QT on and its rough losing a fish...Hope you can get clown tang to make it.
I've seen reefers refrigerate there bottles of cupramine between uses, not sure in shelf life.
Thanks.for sharing the good and the bad.
Cupramine can be removed using carbon or CupriSorb. Leave the copper-absorbing media in your tank for at least a week after the copper concentration has reached 0 to ensure all traces of the medication have been completely removed.
I’ve found that the ml dosage on the bottle doesn’t necessarily mean you will be at 0.6 cupramine so don’t go by ml at all go by a hanna checker or another test
Great video. Can't believe copper didn't kill the ick. Hypo always works, yay chemistry lol
Great video
If you want to win this battle. Give him a freshwater bath at least 3 min. Than add him into a 5 gal tank or bucket of fresh salt water mix. Add half dose with copper safe. Than add him into a other bucket of Fresh saltwater mix every 10 hours Add formalin -MS. Do this morning and before bed. For 5 days. Feed just enough he eats. Watch ammonia but should not build up in 10 hours.Alter copper safe with formalin- ms don't mix both. Make sure temp and air in bucket. Best to transfer fish in new water so the ick is remove from water. Your ick is immune to copper.
Wow that’s crazy. I’ve always had success with cupramine
Can cupramine kill anchorworms?
Only ever had 2 saltwater fish get ich. but with my freshwater system i raised the temp to speed up their life cycle and dose meleflex i think, all i remember is it smiled like viks(this was 7+ yrs ago) and it knocked it out fast. read only real time it is vulnerable is in the free floating stage and that is when to kill it off. raising temp just keeps them at that stage longer. again this was in regards to freshwater don't know how it would fair with salt. Good luck bro
The copper works for this sometime you have to mix it with others chemicals.. I have did this experiment and would antibiotic they have no problem quarantine the fishes
It's also I keep hearing a lot of people say how they've lost fish iN quarantine and/or got sick even after in their main displays
Love your stuff, hope he pulls through, cuppermine should not expire as it is just elemental copper suspended in solution. That said I have no good backup data for that
FIrst off I love your vids. I am not a fan of Ionic copper such as cupramine because it is so harsh. From testing it seems like chelated cooper is not as harsh. I use Coppersafe by mardel. hyposalinity also works great as you said you would use in the vid. I would also get a fresh bottle of that copper you are using. I look forward to your followup vids. P.S my yellow tang is a jerk too lol.
Use potassium permanganate dips .... old school but works
Going through the exact same thing right now...with a Yellow and Purple Tang, a Bellus Angel, and a Moorish Idol in my 55 gallon QT...these 4 fish were treated in Cupramine and Prazipro and looked great. Put them together in the 55 gallon tank to see how they did together and they looked great for 2 days...day three the Moorish Idol developed Black Ick and a day later the Yellow Tang. Now 48 hours later and the Bellus has regular White Ick. Pulling my hair out because I have a new bottle of cupramine and it seemed to have done nothing. I had even tested to make sure the level was therapeutic. Tonight I dosed Coppersafe (Chelated Copper) and Prazipro together because I am at a loss. I feel Like I have had these guys in QT forever and cannot get them out.
I’ve had this issue with “old” prazi pro. New bottle took care of the flukes.
My yellow eye tang reject the cupermine treatment i have to now take the copper out fine for 10am to 8pm fine then just flop on the ground i taken the copper out. Do i strip out as much as i can to he fine and treat it with very low dosage.
Hi Travis you got q a get cleaner wras and shrimp together with fox face the do great job work for me
That poor foxface. I'm wondering the same about the cupramine maybe expiring. I've looked on my bottle and there is no exp date. Hoping everything gets better for him.
i really like those brackish fish you have. what was your acclimation and qt process on them.?
thanks
Do you do hypo or copper on all fish during quarantine or only when they show signs of ich?
as far as I understand the cupramine and others like waterlife cuprazin does expire usually after 1.5 years from new
Just wondering, how do you catch your sick fish in the DT without chasing it or breaking down the live rock aquascape? thanks.
Multiple nets and dont be slow
I’m going through the exact same thing with my fish in QT - are you sure it’s not flukes? Hypo should kill them if it is, but Cupramine won’t and they’re often resistant to Prazi. So many reefers get Fluke and ich mixed up, because it can look similar at times and the fish will show similar behaviours.
Its not flukes definitely ick
Can I ask how you’ve come to that conclusion, because it might help me. I don’t have the typical tiny white spots like you get with ich.
The only product I ever seen work in 30 years of salt water fish is polyp lab medic. Of course if the fish is to far gone or too weak nothing will help.
The ich mightive been a different strain or mutated into one making the cupramine not effective
This is from the seachem FAQ What's the shelf life of your Cupramine™ product?
A: Cupramine, like the rest of our line, is designed to have an indefinite shelf life (relatively speaking). The only way this product may not function properly is if something was purposely added to the bottle to contaminate the product or precipitate the ingredients out of solution.
Guess we will find out when the hanna copper test gets here. I still have the original tank the foxface was in up and running
Why don’t you do the tank transfer method.?
Yes many times but with 6 tanks already up and running with fish i dont have room to do that
Did the fox make it?
What is the recommended level of hyposalinity?
Between 1.019 and 1.021
1.009-1.010 is the range i keep mine at
@@FishOfHex
Wow!That's really low!How well does it work for you?
I would put the salinity 1.008-1.009 right away instead of slowly decreasing, the parasites will pop and within 24 hours the white spots are gone, then slowly increase by 0.002 per day up to 1.026 and keep on coppermine for 2+ weeks. This worked for my tangs perfectly.
Been working perfectly for years
If the cupramine expired due to evaporation wouldn't the concentration increase?
Cant be evaporating with a closed lid
Hey hex I would love to see you do a quarantine tank Using only fresh Ginger powder and human antibiotics amoxicillin. I Do this treatment right in my main display you could look at my channel quick And you will see that I have a lot of Corals I have a clam, I have sponge, and an assortment of about 50 fish. I just rescued 3 morrish idols that were not eating and skinny My last video is of those idols They went right into my main tank I do not worry about marine ich or any other type of marine diseases as long as I use fresh Ginger powder and amoxicillin it seems I could beat anything. I haven't lost not a fish to disease in quite a long time
My personal pharmacist said pills break down at around 3 years and to toss them
I have already tossed out and ordered a new bottle
Old yellow needs to eat :( Tank looks great 👍
Metroplex with focus
But , and de temperatura, Washington 30
Drop some old copper pennies in your filter threw high flow by some I mean like 2$ worth it will kill all the off spring of the ich parasite as they pass threw the pennies and buy one of the cleaner fish and don't feed them except like once a week so the cleaner is hungry enuff to eat the ichs
How did you get to know i need ick’s solution 😂
high temperatures kill ick. I think it's over 84 or 85 degrees for a week.
I don’t think you were at a constant therapeutic level. There’s no way that after 4 weeks of poison in the water column (such as copper) that ICH could function enough to carry out any stages of the life cycle. Unless your Copper is expired OR you let the tank drop below a therapeutic level. If you know it’s ICH, why wouldn’t you tank transfer the fish instead of treating them with a poison?
Never understood why people do not use a UV sterilizer in their tanks. I ran a 300ga reef and never QT any fish and never had ich or any other fish disease. I have used UV on all my tanks and NEVER had ich. First thing I do when I start a tank, add UV.
UV doesnt stop ick, you got lucky thats it.
Are you using the Hanna checker to actually check the levels? Maybe you are not actually at a good dose.
Edit: Crap man, just started watching the vid and those were my thoughts and I see others had it too. Ignore me LOL.
Im surprised your clown died since they are pretry hardy fish.
At 0:47 you mentioned you have killed 4 or 5 Clown Tangs. Don't you think it would be better to therefore leave this species in the ocean? If someone had purchased 4 or 5 puppies/cats/horses/parrots over a given period and each of them had died in the first couple of weeks, you'd report them to the police. Learn a lesson here! Adding a Clown Tang to a tank with resident Powder Blue Tang and the others will only create stress for all the fish and will likely result in the loss of more fish somewhere else anyway.
How about you let me decide what I want to do with my tank and adding a clown tang is no different than adding any other tang. Btw some people eat cats, dogs, horses and probably parrot kabobs.
you shouldnt be using cupramine for ick you dumbass. It's so easy to cure, and you pick the wrong way
O yea? Teach me! Let me guess garlic and TLC?