End of an era for this London pie and mash shop - BBC London
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- Опубліковано 26 вер 2024
- Food trends come and go, but the traditional pie and mash has weathered many a culinary storm.
Maybe until now that is. Because after more than a hundred years in business one of London’s oldest pie shops, based in Islington, is about to close saying it can't afford increased business rates and is having to relocate to Essex.
Nicola Ford reports on the end of an era.
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In Paris they subsidise the small independent bookshops because they realise that that is what makes the city was it is. Unfortunately we are too happy to see the soul ripped out of our city
Forget the pie shops, the native people have been run out.
@@fr_reynolds5002 Lol
@Ginger Ginger I'm familiar with the quote. They may actually be the chosen people.
All capitalist systems require an element of protectionism. The French with their dirigiste history are far more forthcoming in that regard.
You have extremists bedding down everywhere and the native white europeans slowly being outnumbered.. Your government(s) have betrayed you.
As an eastern european that moved here a while ago-about 3 years, upon discovering places like F Cooke, Arments, etc... pie 'n' mash shops, I realised that places like this should be treated as Heritage sites. They should be subsidized by the state, helped. They carry history, they are efficient (good comfort food for very low prices), they will also keep a few jobs.
How many times have u been told " go back to your own country " probably about 200 times I'm guessing
Chala 1 your people are hypocrites
@@unknownfrvr6767 Everyone has been killing everyone. The British where just better at it.
Same people who learn and change quicker in they're societies more so then most if not any others..
@@unknownfrvr6767 How can you say he's tasting his own medacine when he did none of what your reffering to?
@@unknownfrvr6767
What nationality hasn't, you brainless twit! You'd best be grateful!
It’s like anything from old England is getting killed off
Joel Smith next thing theyll take make my nan
Well, not directly. Businesses are going to keep getting more expensive to manage, especially due to Brexit.
@@nabilmiah4428 don't talk crap it's down to the local landlords putting up rents and the complete removal of the English working class from the area
@@pastorflaps6819 You literally just reinforced my point about making them more expensive to manage.
Er, Who's "They" exactly?
Working class traditions are disappearing from London so sad
lon don yes the butchers don't sell pigs trover ham hock chitlens or trip I grew up with this grub as a kid
sarah jones oh dear, have you typed without engaging your brain?
sarah jones read the original comment please, race wasn’t mentioned in it, now unless you are a pig then I wouldn’t take offence to it. Think you’ll finds you are clearly making the association between the comment of Cultural Destruction and Race, how very Racist of your
Nobody wants to eat this shitty old people food anyway.
Cos England is a post industrial service sector economy. No working class = no working class traditions. Most Brits are what u call petit bourgeois not proletarian par se.
Be happy cos that means England is a first world country no doubt. If you still got folks doin manual labor, u r second world at best.
Landlords don’t care about tradition, money is what motivates them
Merrill George Landlords often have more than 1 property and in London especially the landlords will more than likely be living a lot better off than most people. Plus if a land lord with a near Central London property is struggling they can sell up and make a cheque.
Could be owned by the council you know...
Money,oil and gold is their god
More important than maintaining culture!
@@merrillgeorge1838 Good, that is hoe capatilism works. Clearly there is not enough demand to keep these shops alive, so if they cannot survive in the free market in the businesses, they will die out, and the invisble hand shall do its work. They are but dead weight on the economy.
Its sad when London loses the elements that make it what it is..
Thanks to the BBC and the Left.
It will collapse then. London hasn't even had a proper mayor now in years.
Sad that a shop selling frozen industrial pies and dehydrated mash go out of business ?
@@alan6 'cause the owners said it is hand made you believe them, like restaurateurs don't lie about the provenance of their food lol. The pies look soggy and undercooked like a used condom lol
TheAvenger62 mate there is literally A documentary on this EXACT place, where they make the pies infront of you. They wouldn’t spend thousands of pounds on this equipment and know the skills just to film a segment. Also I’ve been to this establishment and seen it myself. Use your brain Pal...
So sad that yet another small scale traditional business serving LOCAL food closes whilst ubiquitous characterless food chains like McDonalds and Pizza Hut seem to keep opening up new outlets everywhere. I don't want to eat the same food in a place that looks exactly the same, be it in London or Cardiff or Manchester or Edinburgh. I want to find local individuality.
Liberals and marxists, who are in bed with big business despite their claims otherwise, support these big businesses crushing local(especially/only White run) businesses. You need to do more to fight them even if it takes physical intimidation.
@@SéaFid Both parties are in bed with big business, republicans are marginally more in bed with them.
@@RandomVidsforthoughtthere ain't no Republicans in London ya fool
This was a regular haunt of mine as a kid growing up in the 60/70s when visiting all my family in Tottenham and Walthamstow, took my kids there too to show them their roots ,haven't been to London since the last of the old dears went a few years back , it was nice to think it was still there, such a shame, watching the eels squirm around in the trays by the door the smell of warm pies the clatter of trays and the big marble tables with a big gap to the fixed seat (as a kid) the mirrors and tiles and strong malt vinegar soft pastry liquor and slightly lumpy mash oh my I can taste it now , so many memories of that shop and the loved ones I've sat across the table from.
lol people get mad when things go out of business but they don't wanna support the business until it's about to go under.
MrRideutah truth
business rates sent the costs too high, probably not lack of demand
“We look upon the closed door with regret , but we fail to see the ones which open”
thank you for telling the truth ! most of them blame everything on other people but never on them selfs
You tend to take things for granted. It's human.
I've lived in Islington all my life and remember when chapel market use to go all the way to the end,now it's halfway.The truth is the working class man is being driven out of London by market forces and the well off are taking his place.The new generation are experimental with food and let's be honest Pie and mash isn't that flavoursome but each to their own. Still sad to see it go though.
Manze's opened a restaurant in Hoddesdon which was the shop from Walthamstow and it'd thriving. Has been for last 6 to 8 years all the real londoners moved out. I'm a black cabby and London over the last 15 years has changed so much it's just not the same feels like a left wing communist city, central London has a protest everyday the roads are all closed for low traffic neighbourhoods. It's a horrible place to live 15 to 20 years ago it still had that traditional London feel specially places like chapel market. I was at my mates in homerton yesterday it's basically a gender neutral village now 😂.
Bland seems to be a very common theme amongst these shops, tradition is fabulous until it doesn’t sell enough to keep you afloat. Invest in flavour and variation and the vintage decor will take care of the customers
Same thing is happening here in the U.S. Working class staples are being moved out due to high tax rates so that corporate dollar can take over the big cities. Such a damn shame.
It’s not corporate businesses taking over it’s stupid overpriced vegan and coffee shops being opened by hipsters who aren’t even from the city!
Can you explain why it's a bad thing?
@@smashb3766 Those hipsters have to compete just like everyone. The real problem are who those hipsters vote for. They vote Left. And Leftism, by definition, means excessive taxation and regulations. It's not a business friendly ideology. Just the opposite.
@@taserrrIt is a bad thing for people who are not either globalists or communists. It is a bad thing for men. As you will never be a real man, you being a numale, you would not get it tbh. Without traditions among other things a society becomes weak, boys and girls like you surrender easily to invaders.
@@taserrrI mean if you are a Muslim you might think ending old businesses the White locals and elderly enjoy is a good thing. So, my guess is, you are anti-White and/or a numale, a lesser or omega male.
I used to leave in London, SE5, from 2009 til 2017. I went to London to learn English, for a supposed 3 months period of time. I felt so in love with the place I stayed 8 years and only went back home to look after my mother. I've been told the recent years that if I go back where I use to spend most of my London life, I then would cry, apparently since 2017-2018 everything changed and not necessarily for the best.
Mass migration of Islam. Funny how a Christian island can be destroyed by Islam in just a five year span. Gone forever are the things we don’t keep as sacred.
Im indonesian and Ive been wanting to eat this for years ever since i watched it on youtube. Also the jellied eels. It looks delicious. Never been to UK in my life, i will be so sad if by the time i can go there, the shops are closed 😞😞😞
Many new shops are all opening, it's a shame to see the old buildings go as some of them are beautiful and rich with history but if you come to London there are still plenty of Pie Mash shops and new ones opening all the time. It's truly delicious food
What a weird dream
In New Zealand We eat a lot of Mince Beef Meat Pies. New Zealanders love Meat Pies come to New Zealand and You will get Beef Meat Mince Pie
I'm indonesian too, living in London. I'm planning to try F cooke next month
Update: I did try it last week. It was okay, but I got a photo with the owner! Fantastic visit! 😎
Hurry up. England is being destroyed. It’s lovely food.
From what I can tell (via Google) this place is still open and still going strong.
O good.
People actually blaming immigrants for old school shops losing popularity 🤣
Ironically these shops were opened by Irish and Italian immigrants ~150 years ago
Master Bob, you are a JERK!
But it's working class Londoners keep the place patronised..!not the Italians
@Félim McAuley not with Southern lreland
@Félim McAuley Not for long.
I think it’s sad that a lot of people are losing a lot of the heritage of British culture. The truth is I do feel that every country has their own culture and traditions. I am proud to be British I am a Sri Lankan by ethnicity. However I am British at heart and soul I am born here.
You need to go back mate
@@Neige-b6y lol how's that Brexit working out for you? The uneducated are usually the most racist and vile
@totoroid Tzz doyoufeelme The whole point of colonising them countries was to help anyway, a multi-ethnic empire was always the goal.
Lol you live in a fantasy it was never to help the colonized it was to benefit the colonizer
@totoroid Only reason Europe is importing r%pists and dangerous muslims is because the politicans are either paid for or blackmailed by literal devil worshippers (there's video proof, google "b0hem!an gr0v3" with normal letters).
absolute shame, such heritage shops should be given special status not just closed
love pie and mash , we need pie and mash shops in Cardiff , there's too many fish shops, pie and mash would be a hit in cardiff.
the boss And in bristol be such a hit .
the boss do you wanna say pie and mash anymore you mongol
I know right
I am asian Pakistani British born and bred and it hurts me to see such places disappear,
Tariq Mahmood i feel the loss! I’m Dutch born Vietnamese and there are many stores in my old town where I used to live in that are turning into hipster restaurants. I don’t feel that Dutch spirit in my town anymore
Where I live we still have an old town market, and it’s been here for 300 years so I hope it never closes.
Anglo Commando I know and it’s a shame
wildebest yes it’s not just UK all over the world is now wrath of Chinese manufacturing power but some idiots believe it happens just for immigration you see in Australia has hard immigration policies but still it facing hard time against Chinese money based immigration
@@bparisfreedomranger9166 oh well that’s what the english australians get for taking over australia
tradition is everything. 300 years.thats special
I'm British and I visited a pie and mash shop recently in Poplar. It tasted awful and I am not surprised they're on their way out
That heartbreaking that is
Nearly 100 years and people grew up eating 🍽 fish and chips 🍟 there after school 🏫 during lunchtime and it brings back memories
80 years of pie and mash 🤗💚 God bless you love
they wont be happy until all the working class London culture is destroyed. all in the name of Money and greed. how sad.
bob bushill. The rates go up because to taxes, taxes in England are high to pay for welfare and the nhs.
This is happening because of socialism , not capitalism
increased rates comes from increased property value which comes from increased cash flow which comes from people with enough money to leverage way the rates are charged and no doubt the land lord was hoping they would leave. keep blaming poor people all you want this is capitalism 101
Bob I totally agree working class culture is going if not already gone how sad such a shame
The government of the last 8 years is Socialist ? Stop talking out your arse .
Most foreigners can probably write better English than you , with your sad delusional pseudonym.
They ultimately closed this location at the end of April 2019, however in September 2019 they then announced a new shop to open in the same area.
oh really? how is that possible
What, another pie and mash shop?
It’s the rent then, same as in Canada, overvalued land in all the Empire.
😞 so sad remember it well... such a beautiful decor...love chapel market... ❤️
Cities these days: Kill tradition for money
What a joke
Once these places go, they are gone for good.
piper.spirit it’s a shame... but I’d say they are all into couscous now.. and food served on a slate lol 😆
@@sarahbrennan1342 Nothing ever lasts forever.
piper.spirit I know... it lasted a good while though... I remember the indoor market there... use to be brilliant ❤️
The recipes can still be kept, so it's not like people won't be able to make these dishes on their own.
That's really a shame when a business that's been around for so long needs to close because of rising taxes and stuff.
I remember this kebab shop near the flat I was living in feltham. last kebab I had there was in 2008. I did a quick google search about 1 year ago and the place is still there standing. I do love it when the community keeps the businesses open.
You’re close to the point but still not there
An invader shop
Mash and Pie is a calories bomb for the the average Londoner. But Mash and Pie was traditionally enjoyed by hard workers of East London who were burning many thousands calories each working day.
It's not really very high calorie. The mash is more or less just potato. No cream , butter or milk, the pies are smallish by modern standards. These are 19th century portions. Londoners have been eating pie and mash for a couple of hundred years, and for most of that time-frame were not generally overweight at all. Actually, Londoners are relatively skinny even today compared with the rest of the country.
Martin Cleary Thanks for the reply
@@MrBlaxjax I think the main selling point was that it was served quick and it was relatively cheap, even for the working class.
That makes sense.....
As someone who's Nan used to take to Kellys down Roman Road, it's something we've been seeing for years, Cookes became a bloomin' Japanese Restaurant on Sundays a few years back, a good signaller toward the downfall of these establishments.
Kelly's is still open...
I really miss my childhood days and pie and mash 😔
same in toronto, rents skyrocketing businesses pushed out
Im glad i came across this. I noticed a huge huge buy up of old properties for rennovations into new luxury housing. And i have never been to a city where i have seen so many apartment construction projects.
The entire British empire is going up with the USA and non British countries staying low, it’s a USA plot I’m sure
Trash just blows around in the wind on the street and nobody is appalled?
It’s a market! There’s always cardboard and pieces of Fresh vegetables blowing about!
It is hard for them to compete when you have cheap chinese, indian, italian and middle eastern food all over london now that just taste better
GUYS ITS STILL OPEN!!!!!
That’s wonderful news
Turns out it's still open..
Relocating to Essex, prime example of Londoners moving on due to negative cultural changes. So sad they couldn’t relocate to the west end to show the tourist real London food.
Mate we've got it up north too. Our towns look a multicultural disaster. So many tea bags walking around like something out of Shaun of the dead.
What do you mean about cultural changes? They are moving because of expensive business rates
Exactly, Andrew. And anyway, what do the idiots want? Do we *force* people to eat pie and mash? Is this what the world has come to, that we should pass laws making people eat food they don't want to?
"show the tourist real London food" That would stop tourism lol
marji very good, myself personally if I go to an area I want the sample the traditional stuff not globalisation food. The robots are already here😂😂
So sad what they have done to London a complete betrayal
Feel sorry for the olders cause that’s their culture. But do you really see the new generation and young people eating pie and mash
@@ttam9205 yeah happly nothing beats good old grub London is being destroyed to be replaced by chains of food and coffee shops and glass faced buildings London is truly loosing its charm its quirks what made London London now sadly we're just turning into a yuppie boring playground where everything costs a fortune
American here, pie and mash is unheard of in my life and I now crave it
*adds eating pie and mash to bucket list*
@@timmy00264 Letting in hordes of middle easterners, whom mostly being young men who want nothing more but to ravage English women and kill their countrymen in the name of their religion as also part of it.
@@WolffenBreon I can tell you right now it isn't middle easterners killing of these businesses
I'm glad I tried this as traditional dish nearly dead
married at the town hall, straight to manzes for the meal.
F. Cooke
And straight to the shitter
Why don't the old codgers sell off their multi-million pound discounted council houses and save the shop 🙄 bloody boomers.
Proper old school grub and genuine real people 👍👍👍
The government should be trying to help places like this, not try and shut them down
Its called "capitalism" what are you, a commie?
With the White Flight from London. Traditional Shops like this are being replaced with Shawarma shops and other ethnicities specialty shops.
So?
More needs to be done to help small businesses. Londoners don't want all our streets to have a Starbucks and Tesco Extra ☹️
It’s okay ull have Nigeria express and curry land
@@bansnabs5523That sounds like a good time
@@bansnabs5523sounds far better tbh
@@fn_flashy9101 I bet u would like a poo vindaloo....there have been more than a few documented cases of this happening...mmmmmmm diversity!
@@staggeringdeath8479 Enjoy your boiled cabbage 😂
that one women was like its bit bland did u really need to say that on tv 😂
It will probably be replaced by a halal ka-bob shop. :(
Thats good lol
Ka-bomb shop*
I hope so!
@@permbee7129 Whites are minority.
@@permbee7129 now that's racism, I bet you would be up in arms if a white guy said east London is too brown and full of filthy halal.
I'd love to have this meal, looks absolutely delicious. Cheers from across the pond.
Looks disgusting 🤢
@m3gAnac0nda It tastes great, don't knock it till you try it.
Been a sandwich shop in Belgravia for years, a street down from the embassies, which is frequented by embassy staff and diplomats daily, and just as many tradies. Was forced to move right out of central london by soaring prices despite being packed all day.
I've been in there with my old man bloody delicious best pie and mash in britain sad they are closing down such a sentimental pub/restaurant 😢
Aw I saw this on Great Big Story. Kind of sad it no longer exists.
Her pie had been mashed too many times. RIP , end of an era.
I remember this place....great decor and lovely pie but only 1 choice and mash was only so so...no matter what you said the liquor overflowed on your plate - no gravy. No fridge... the cans were in a cold water wooden tub and generally the staff weren't that polite. The clientele were generally pretty old. Where as check out the pie and mash shop in Exmouth Market... the difference is marked and the place is packed out.
I recall the one in Exmouth Market closing decades ago. Are saying another has opened there? I haven't been up there since 2019, so wouldn't know. Are eels on the menu?
It’s a bloody disgrace they have to close down because of business rates
We had to leave our Pub for the same reason the council wanted 52000 a year and yet our street 's are covered in liter because they say they don't have the money to employ enough street cleaners.
So where is that money going ?
"Oh well I was recommended by someone to come here and I really enjoyed it". Why did you finish with half of it left on your plate then?
London has become too expensive. It was bound to effect old skool businesses. Kind of a shame.
Don't get why business or restaurant that are older than 20 year's don't get lower taxes .
Why should they? To create a barrier against new arrivals? That would probably be illegal...
Imagine walking in there with a Scottish £20 note
Aslong as there's some to say "I think you'll find that's legal tender" all is good.
@@Matt19matt19 I'm not Spanish
There's hardly any pie and mash gaffs left in London. It's bloody sad to see 'em all go- (even though I could take or leave the stuff, meself!)
I've been there just because I heard they had been there for so long. Honestly, the food tastes like cardboard. Longevity does not mean it's good.
That woman at the end lol who puts vinegar on mash.. #custom not wanted
fpv scaff Erm... everyone?? The Pie n Mash shops basically pioneered chilli vinegar.
+pgI0897 It comes with liquor gravy you dont put vinegar on it...
eraldorh I can assure I do. Chilli vinegar and lots of it mucker.
If you’re in a pie n mash shop and they don’t have a bottle of chilli vinegar on every bench, it ain’t a pie n mash shop.
I've got to agree with pgl0897, pie and mash with chilli vinegar is a classic
Neither do the brits
Not to be harsh, but The fact that this kind of ‘cuisine’ is celebrated by some people is weird to me- it’s the kind of food that people who experienced war rationing enjoy. People getting sentimental about beige mush, and crying for out old England are just baffling- ‘old England’ was impoverished, and the food reflected that.
wildebest what I was attempting to draw attention to is that some people have Stockholm syndrome for the past- the kind of people who say ‘everything was better in my day’, when ‘their day’ consisted of eating spam, De facto segregation and power outages. Now their’s nothing wrong with 80 year old Vera enjoying pie and mash because it reminds her of when she was 12. But when people say that old England is dying because a pie shop closes, what they’re really saying is that their insulated, isolated, predominantly white working class communities are changing. Would you really rather have overcooked pie and mash, or try the new shawarma place down the street? People see this change as a threat, that diversity and new cultures are dangerous. Old England was a country that ruled over a massive empire, and yet people are scared of the cultures they once exploited; and so still see beige pie and mash as superior to a Bangalore curry etc. I feel personally that what’s ‘threatened’ was never really that good in the beginning. to me ‘Old England’ ideology is plain toxic- Rose tinted glasses on steroids for people stuck in the past.
That much of a tax is insane. If you increase taxes beyond a point it will damage the company and reduce further tax income to the government.
But to be fair, this isn't the first time the British government has got in trouble for overtaxxing something (cough, tea).
what a shame. im Indian but pie and mash is my fave. this place should be protected as a British heritage establishment. lf l ever come to uk i would definitely want to eat here :'( Britain is killing off its own culture.
just go to the rural areas to enjoy some. i love mashed potatoes pie and jellied eel.
Don’t y’all have laws that protect historic sites or landmarks? Can’t y’all just do that? Declare it a landmark or a historic site.
It's a pie and mash shop. In order to be considered a historical landmark I'd imagine you need more than just having been there for a really long time as a reason. it's not even like anything important ever happen there it's just a pie and mash shop and an old one that nobody who is an already collecting on their social security eats at so why on Earth would anyone want to put their tax dollars into a restaurant that isn't even serving the majority of people in the area.
I love pie and mash.
This is my first time having a pie 😂😂😂
i remember my first pie
Because of this I went Sainsburys and bought chicken n ham pie n steak pie n mash for dinner tonight lol
Poverty ruins a neighborhood, and so does rich folk.
Any business that becomes part of a the local history should be saved by the gov’t. These establishments contribute to the character of a community
What character no one was eating there aside from the elderly it was a dying business? you don't pour taxes into a place to make it a historical landmark just because it's old it actually needs to be important.
I'm living proof that pie & mash ain't fattening, as a schoolboy in Poplar I 'ad it every day, double on Friday after games, except Monday when it was shut. I weighed in about seven & 'alf stone back then. thirty five years later when I only have it occasionally I weigh nearer twelve stone!!
So very sad 😔 for smaller businesses in Britain.
To be replaced by a bookies no doubt.
Tradition will always be with us I had pie and mash last always eaten it always will
Vinegar!?? On a pie? Is this a joke I'm too Australian to get?
Uk food suck
Increasing rates does not help businesses, it defeats starting up your own thing in the first place.
Pie and mash needed VINEGAR? What's that woman on?
Chilli vinegar is a common condiment in pie and mash shops, what are you on? Talking about something you know nothing about.
I think if they really want to do well in terms of business is to improve the taste and texture of the food. Traditional food is traditional, however it doesn't mean it cannot be improved.
A 100+ year old business like this is a staple of the community and a landmark which deserves special consessions and exemptions from the increased business rates and any other "Give Me More Money You Peasant" increases from the goverment.
Have some sense !!!!
hmmm... In Canada they would be able to apply for a "Cultural Grant" or apply for some funding at the municipal (Town/City) level to keep the restaurant in operation does such a thing not exist in the UK?
SirXavior
Yes but not for the English i’m afraid.
The main problem is our councils are run by foreigners/Africans!! They want our heritage torn down it's happening to our old pubs and our Catholic churches are being rented out to Africans and even removing the statues of st. Mary ,this is sickening,it's the government's fault.
i know i’m old ❤️
it started with the Boleyn ..
The democratic changes to London along with Labour boroughs love for high taxes is a double blow that most pie and mash shops can't keep up with.
Pie mash and gravy absolute heaven
Liquor,me old china!!
Its" liquor" you uncultured swine
Doesn't look too appetizing to be fair
A tax of 45% is insane and they know it. But who replaced the shop? Who could afford to pay it? A big chain?
It's still empty
start serving some chicken kormas and very spicy vindaloo luv, the English luv em!!!
Truth Opinion
There Ain’t no English left.
Yes, business rates have gone up, but what they only hinted at is that custom is down. There is still a demand for it in Essex, but ultimately, there aren't that many people who want their pie and mash any more.
cities should be responsible for ensuring the continuation of businesses like this, just ridiculous
One less reason to come to England from the USA now. I loved this. Now I will be looking elsewhere, not London.
Proper food. Beats all your silly restaurants where you pay £20 for a small plate which is gone in 30 seconds.
"The council say they are happy to discuss with the owner if they can help to keep the shop open"
yeah right, if they were serious they wouldn't go ahead with the rate raise. typical council, full of greedy jobsworths.
if this place was so good then why did it close.
AJBOB3 if you have to ask that question..you won’t understand the answer.
I thought it is a documentary for WWII when I saw the food on the screen....
Sad to see tradition goes, especially if it food u cant find any shop that use the original recipe these days
Bit bland needs vinegar wtf who eats pie with vinegar i know they use chilli vinegar but come on thats different
Depends on the pie a bit of vinger is alright and I can personally never have a shepards pie with out some Hendersons relish
Try it. It's nice in the liquor.
This is what happened to Pier 4 in Boston. Now it’s a luxury apartment complex.