The trial was mandated by the publisher, if I recall. They demanded a tutorial. Beyond that, the idea of starting in a hut spearing ants and ending in power armor overdosing the President is quite the escalation.
Fallout 2 is my favorite game of all time and honesty it’s a bit refreshing to hear someone not be afraid to point out all the stuff that doesn’t hold up about the UI and whatnot.
as a total F2 fanboy, I had a hard time getting through the first minutes, but over the time, this turned do be a very interesting set of views. thank you and here, have a sub! now to the Deus Ex
Great rumination and surprisingly I agree about most things said, but I think the UI is at least beautiful and I find it easy to use; that said, I can't truly judge it as I've played the game so' so much through out the years. As for the trial, while I hate having to go through it every time, I think it establishes the tone and difficulty of the game very well, that said it's true that going through it with certain types of characters is a real pain, but if you know what you're doing you can get through with any build, it just might require some save scumming. I thought long and hard about what would be a proper remake of Fallout 2 and as far as I'm concerned it would still have to have a top-down isometric camera and the combat has to be turn based. They also can't start hand holding the player. The things that could be added or changed are: 3D graphics, touching the UI without changing the style of it, adding more content and perhaps more specifically flesh out the companions some more. As for Bethesda changing the lore... they're messing about with something that's almost sacred to me, so I can't approve.
Been wanting him to do this so bad. He has his schedule on his website that is decided by his patrons and they haven't voted for him to do NV so don't get your hopes up anytime soon.
I really don't understand how you had trouble forcing yourzelf to get through the game. I had trouble forcing myself to STOP playing last time I played through it.
Agreed. This game was my first true western RPG back in the late 90s and I can't help but judge all other RPGs I play based on this one. A true classic. One thing I wish he discussed was the soundtrack. I still like to listen to Modoc and several other gems by Mark Morgan.
THANK YOU. As someone that played these games since 1 you are spot on sir. People misremember or even worse misinform because they've never actually have. You obviously have and it shows. 100% correct sir.
Hi Lorerunner, just want to say thank you. You are doing awesome content, have been watching all the ruminations even on games i have not yet played. Discovered your channel about a week ago. You seem very intelligent and well spoken. Love from Sweden
On the topic of Lynatte and her similarity to Richardson: go talk to her after you beat the Enclave. You have a new dialogue with her that hammers that point in very well.
You are right about the trial from the point of view of the player but in my opinion it perfectly suits the character background. You are a tribesman, your tribe only has fists and spears therefore the only combat options they can give you in the trial are fists and spears + the sneaky and speechy options.
I know you ll hate me for this. And probably answered this exact question like a billion times now but i have to ask. Do you have any loreruns planned for the future?
What you were saying about number of clicks makes me suspect that you remain unaware of hotkeys (skill hotkeys in particular). They are hidden, after all. So that's one thing that a remake could have -- rebindable keybinds, and perhaps some tutorialization of their usage.
Oh, God. This again. Fallout 2 has not aged poorly. It had an awful UI when it released. Everything that is a problem NOW was also a problem THEN. It was just easier to overlook those problems back then because it was the hot new thing.
I don't think it really was a problem back then. I remember getting into the game with absolutely no problem as a 10-11 year old kid. But when I see people who never played it today they don't know what they're doing and even rats can kill them. :D I don't know if I'd call it aging poorly or maybe it's the people who changed, they're to spoiled by games that make everything super easy by giving you a billion tips before you even do anything. I don't know.
fallout 4 always makes me think of pixar mostly because of the graphics and how cartoony some of the characters and enemies are in terms of design and behavior.
Your not wrong, being a big fan of the gold box ssi games, I found fallout 2's UI manageable. I played 2 before 1 and damn, I stopped playing 1 the first time I tried it because the UI was so horrible. Honestly, if I hadn't played 2 first I can't honestly say for sure I would have completed 1. Going back now, even 2 just isn't worth it, only because of the UI.
Game is unfinished, kind of linear, built in set pieces with poor coordination and I can't help the enclave which are written like stupid one-dimensional tencho bad guys. 6.5/10
I can't seem to find the review for fallout 1. Did you ever make one? I find odd for you of all people to do a review of a serries and not start with the first one?
Hello Mr Lorerunner . Have you tried the mod for skyrim ENDERAL? That mod really blew me away and it could be its own game just by itself. The quality of it far surpass most of the Triple A games today. It has an fantastic story , characters and improved combat mechanics that i believed is the kind of game from what i gathered you would enjoyed playing. I would seriously recommand you try it because that game/mod kept me thinking about in my head over and over after i had completed it. It is that good.
It's weird, i can go back to baldur's gate and icewind dale and be perfectly fine (Even the non enhanced editions) but going from that to something like fallout 1&2 after playing BG just feels clunky and even older. It's probably the terrible UI's.
Rebellion has better UI. Not only that, but you can also tell your AI partner to take over parts of the UI like managing resources and troop deployments so you can focus on diplomacy and shipbuilding.
It's bullshit that you can't talk down the Enclave in Fallout 2 the same way you could do to the Master in Fallout 1. At least you can convince Richard Grey that he's wrong before he blows his own brains out. And unlike Fallout 3, where the Enclave knows who you are and knows to shoot you at first glance, in Fallout 2, you can infiltrate them, down to the point where everyone from their president to random comm officers and drill chiefs believe you to be one of them. So why not go the extra mile and have a very persuasive Chosen One smooth-talk the Enclave into joining the NCR and dropping their genocidal bullshit plans? Especially when you consider that 1000 idiots in an oil rig and a couple hundred from a military base will wind up dying out due to inbreeding in a couple generations. Meanwhile, if they intermingled with the mutated humans and used their firepower to restore order and civilization to the wasteland, they not only could get more resistance to the harsh conditions of the wasteland, but also gain a larger pool of manpower for workers and cannon fodder. The Chosen One can use that to convince President Richardson that making peace with the NCR is a far better option than allowing less than 2000 people to inherit the Earth and eventually die out from inbreeding. Sure, have the ending where you blow up the Enclave and feel like a badass, but would it kill them to have an ending where the Chosen One, having seamlessly infiltrated the Enclave, persuades its leaders to make peace with the NCR instead of committing genocide? It would have been a lot smarter and it would go a long way to explain how the NCR suddenly became Imperialistic in New Vegas and how they defeated the Brotherhood of Steel. The NCR becoming imperialists and them defeating the Brotherhood would make far more sense, if they have American government remnants lending them power-armored soldiers to make short work of the Brotherhood of Steel while trying to get them to retake as much of old America as possible. Suddenly, the NCR going from democracy to imperialism would make more sense, especially if the Enclave joined them and convinced them that they rightfully own everything from California to New England. You can even explain away the Fallout 3 BoS and Enclave by saying that the BoS in Fallout 3 is what's left of the Brotherhood, fleeing to the Capital Wasteland from the west coast after the NCR and the Enclave tried to eradicate them, and the Enclave in the Capital Wasteland was a detachment of troops sent by NCR Enclave leaders back in the west coast, whose goal is to finish the eradication of the Brotherhood and establish a base at the nation's former capital.
So basically, this game is a lot like Jedi Outcast? If you don't know the game, it will break you. If you know the game, it will be a breeze to go from point A to point B.
It's kind of weird that you feel the game hasn't aged well considering you were around to play it when it was new. I actually played Fallout 2 for the very first time last year and I enjoyed it a ton, though I will admit the UI is horrendous by today's standards, and it was the hardest thing to get used to before I could properly get into the game. The whole first dungeon at the very start of the game was pretty much me learning how to use the UI for a good hour lol.
Rushes through? LOL. I kill every single ant and scorpion for the experience (and the traps if I can). XP is hard to come by in the beginning. At least XP that is relatively easy to get. You certainly can't do more tougher grinds at that level like fighting geckos. UI is kind of crap, but given how much you can do, I'm not sure how else they could have done it. My main gripe is having to change the mouse cursor to inspect things. Or having to switch from targeting circle to information circle to inspect enemies. It's not too bad if you realize you can use hotkeys for lockpicking, traps etc. As for the tone, I don't mind all the 4th wall breaking stuff. And I like the lighter tone. But I can see how that puts other people off. New Vegas made the correct choice by locking stuff like that behind a trait so it's optional. As for Myron, is he really that bad? He's a slime ball for sure. But I find it funny how people can cheer characters like Walter White but hate Myron. Both are drug manufacturers. People just pick on Myron because he's a dweeb. I hate him of course, but he's not evil like the slaver boss in the Den. Metzger.
To be fair, Black Isle/Obsidian tutorials always seemed the weakest part of the game. Kotor 2, Icewind Dale(1 and 2), NWN2... I'm suprised that Pillars of Eternity wasn't that bad.
I think it does treat player like moron but it forshadows future event. Also tutorial companion is less memorable than... those from Dragon Age Origins... and one of those guys was my favourite character in entire game...
Actually I like different origins for different races/professions in DA:O, only pain is that taking some classes (like warrior city elf) gives you doors or chest that can never be opened because you've picked the wrong class. Tutorial companions are also nice because they come up later and it's nice meeting them. Plus city elf and dwarf lower class have great origin stories :) I would say not only moron but very contrived reasons for you being on the ship, never actually meeting your bunkmate and feeling like a first day on the ship while you were actually some time on it. It would benefit from DA:O model where you have your day to day (or special event) and from there you are thrown into the sith attack that makes you land on Taris. NWN2 has a bit of this too but then the biggest problem of this game is giving us like 11 races, 20 classes (might be lower number than this) all being different origin, different age and being from the same boring swamp villaige, and our hero have complicated story. It would be better If we were just generic mercenary and one of our companions (maybe Shandra with her connections to plot) had major role in story.
Fallout 2, not aged well? I can see that but then I like oldschool and the fact that F2 is better than F3 and F4. I liked Fallout 1 more because of plot, you go out of vault and explore the world while in Fallout 2 you are a tribesman that can be master of energy weapon, science and big guns. With time i started to think that plots of those two game or rather beginning/origins of our hero should be reversed, in Fallout 1 we are a tribesman and we as the player don't know the world why it is is such state, then we learn that there was atomic war. While in F2 we see the prequel where our grandfather leaves the vault. This whole temple of trials in postapocaliptic feels weird, out of place. plus, you get a subscribe, took me few ruminations to see that you have good content :) Btw, will you do Arcanum? That is also good game but it became too big and for a lot of time it feels empty. Apart from that, good game. Ps. Sorry for your back
@@LandBark Fallout 2's story is really dated for me. Especially with how the whole "evil government" theme really got old. At least I can look at Eden and see that he honestly believes in the shit he says, whereas Richardson is a damn hypocrite for saying that all mutants have to die, when his best soldier is a goddamn mutant. Not only that, but Richardson is way too much a jab at Nixon and it just pisses me off that they had to make the sole remnant of the US be irredeemably evil and not joinable at all. At least with Eden, he's more of a principles zealot who you can serve as a double-agent where you poison the water and bomb the Brotherhood Citadel even as you fight Autumn's troops. You can't even join the Fallout 2 Enclave, even though you INFILTRATE the Enclave in that game. Why shouldn't there be a path for the player to honestly become an Enclave soldier and claw their way up the ranks? At least in KOTOR, when the game railroaded me to work with the Jedi to destroy Darth Malak, I could take over the Sith Empire as an evil player. Fallout 2 doesn't even let you do that.
Fallout 2's a great game and all, but what I really disliked was how the Enclave was handled. There was no grey area with them at all. At most, Dornan and a few other soldiers could be explained as just doing their jobs, but everyone else? Especially Frank Horrigan and President Dick Richardson? They're just assholes, plain and simple. A President whose name is a ringer for Richard Nixon. Troops gunning down innocent vault-dwellers who aren't irradiated. A Secret Service agent who's such an unreasonable beast, he makes Legate Lanius look like a reasonable man. I mean, what's the use with them wanting to wipe out all irradiated humans, when just ruling them by the sword would be more than enough? And basically, the way Interplay's Fallout 2 handled the Enclave influenced how Bethesda's Fallout 3 handled the Enclave, so it's hardly Fallout 3's fault that the Enclave was stupid evil when Fallout 2 introduced them as such. The false choice of working with President Eden even mirrors the false choice of working with the Master back in Fallout 1. In fact, Fallout 3's handling of the Enclave leadership was a bit better than 2s, because at least, this time, the Enclave's leader is willing to break bread with you if you give him the time of day, as flawed as the final result of it was. It would have been so much better, SO MUCH BETTER, had the Enclave been a morally grey faction like the Brotherhood of Steel. Like say, they use the modified FEV as a threat against settlements full of irradiated people and mutants who don't fall in line, but people who do follow them get full assistance, treatment for radiation poisoning, and if they serve loyally, power armor and energy weapons. Imagine if they were fascist murderers, but they're fascist murderers who truly want to restore the 1950's America back into existence, and they're willing to cooperate with people who share that dream. The player can influence the NCR to either work with or against them, and if the player joins them and does enough quests for them, the player becomes officially a part of the Enclave, and they get a full suit of power armor, energy weapons, and even Enclave merchants to supply them with stuff, as well as a steady stream of income from being a soldier and doing quests for them, like say, Sergeant Dornan sends you off to wipe out roving gangs of raiders that respawn now and then to give the player a steady stream of money. The game can then have some Super Mutant schmuck from the first game be the final boss, someone who is trying to pick up from where the Master left off. The player would be trying to put down this mutant army, and they can recruit or fight against several factions, from the NCR, the Brotherhood of Steel, or the Enclave. If you want to wipe out the Enclave, you can, and if you want to join/recruit them, you can. That's what Fallout: New Vegas did, and it was the game that handled the Enclave the best, even though the Enclave had been reduced to a bunch of old farts by that time.
So again, the entirety of the ending segment of fallout 2 was just an satire for how the government patriotism is dull and unreasonable. I can understand how you got angry by that, but a lot of fo2 is parodies and satire in comparison to 1 and vegas (i mean, you could time travel and steal the waterchip from vault 13) The really interesting ideas for morality come from the new societies on the wastes like Ncr's expansionism or Vault city's Great condition but at the cost of people's freedom
@@Jrdotan So basically, more of the same anti-patriotic bullshit that permeated works like Warhammer 40K where they satirize 1980s patriotism and 1950s culture. It's not original, and it's not that endearing either. It's telling that Fallout 3 actually had a more nuanced portrayal of the Enclave, which New Vegas followed, instead of them just being militaristic jackasses bent on global genocide. It's bullshit that you can't talk down the Enclave in Fallout 2 the same way you could do to the Master in Fallout 1. At least you can convince Richard Grey that he's wrong before he blows his own brains out. And unlike Fallout 3, where the Enclave knows who you are and knows to shoot you at first glance, in Fallout 2, you can infiltrate them, down to the point where everyone from their president to random comm officers and drill chiefs believe you to be one of them. So why not go the extra mile and have a very persuasive Chosen One smooth-talk the Enclave into joining the NCR and dropping their genocidal bullshit plans? Especially when you consider that 1000 idiots in an oil rig and a couple hundred from a military base will wind up dying out due to inbreeding in a couple generations. Meanwhile, if they intermingled with the mutated humans and used their firepower to restore order and civilization to the wasteland, they not only could get more resistance to the harsh conditions of the wasteland, but also gain a larger pool of manpower for workers and cannon fodder. The Chosen One can use that to convince President Richardson that making peace with the NCR is a far better option than allowing less than 2000 people to inherit the Earth and eventually die out from inbreeding. Sure, have the ending where you blow up the Enclave and feel like a badass, but would it kill them to have an ending where the Chosen One, having seamlessly infiltrated the Enclave, persuades its leaders to make peace with the NCR instead of committing genocide? It would have been a lot smarter and it would go a long way to explain how the NCR suddenly became Imperialistic in New Vegas and how they defeated the Brotherhood of Steel. The NCR becoming imperialists and them defeating the Brotherhood would make far more sense, if they have American government remnants lending them power-armored soldiers to make short work of the Brotherhood of Steel while trying to get them to retake as much of old America as possible. Suddenly, the NCR going from democracy to imperialism would make more sense, especially if the Enclave joined them and convinced them that they rightfully own everything from California to New England. You can even explain away the Fallout 3 BoS and Enclave by saying that the BoS in Fallout 3 is what's left of the Brotherhood, fleeing to the Capital Wasteland from the west coast after the NCR and the Enclave tried to eradicate them, and the Enclave in the Capital Wasteland was a detachment of troops sent by NCR Enclave leaders back in the west coast, whose goal is to finish the eradication of the Brotherhood and establish a base at the nation's former capital.
I can certainly see your point of view, but the thing I took from the enclave during my original FO2 playthrough when it first came out is that yes, sadly some people are just dicks who are so self rightous there is no grey in them. Also, your NV comparison still holds true because as you pointed out, they'll old farts. With age comes wisdom and the ability to look back 30 years into your life and realise... "damn, I was a dick back then..."
So the real answer to that is probably more embarrassing then what you're envisioning. I have nose hairs, and they tickle the crap out of my nose when I talk for long periods of time. I try to remember to 'shave' before recording (and I've gotten better about it) but... yeah. *cough*
Before playing Fallout 2: wow this is a very interesting video, I hope I can play this game soon After playing Fallout 2: wow this guy has absolutely no fucking clue of what he's talking about
Based on your Twitch stream I'd say that your view of the game's tone might be distorted by having the original music turned off. It's a crucial building block of Fallout's atmosphere -- must be a very different experience without it. By the way, you missed a great opportunity of pissing off even more people by not mentioning music.
Well to be fair some of the stuff that goes on in random encounters and some quest is so inane it's kinda funny that I don't blame him for having that impression
Overrated, outdated. good for its time, just IMHO. But I like the suit! it's nice. But what happened to your old black outfit with the gloves? Will you still use that?
The trial was mandated by the publisher, if I recall. They demanded a tutorial. Beyond that, the idea of starting in a hut spearing ants and ending in power armor overdosing the President is quite the escalation.
“It was not what I would call an enjoyable experience”
isn't the choice of the engaging in an encounter governed by survival (outdoorsman or whatever it's called) skill?
Yes, yes it is, though there is equipment that increases the odds that you can avoid an encounter.
Fallout 2 is my favorite game of all time and honesty it’s a bit refreshing to hear someone not be afraid to point out all the stuff that doesn’t hold up about the UI and whatnot.
I'm replaying Fallout right now and I'm still loving it as much as in the past, I'm just so used to it I don't see anything wrong with the game :D
this. some people, like lorerunner, have gone soft though
as a total F2 fanboy, I had a hard time getting through the first minutes, but over the time, this turned do be a very interesting set of views. thank you and here, have a sub! now to the Deus Ex
Great rumination and surprisingly I agree about most things said, but I think the UI is at least beautiful and I find it easy to use; that said, I can't truly judge it as I've played the game so' so much through out the years. As for the trial, while I hate having to go through it every time, I think it establishes the tone and difficulty of the game very well, that said it's true that going through it with certain types of characters is a real pain, but if you know what you're doing you can get through with any build, it just might require some save scumming.
I thought long and hard about what would be a proper remake of Fallout 2 and as far as I'm concerned it would still have to have a top-down isometric camera and the combat has to be turn based. They also can't start hand holding the player.
The things that could be added or changed are: 3D graphics, touching the UI without changing the style of it, adding more content and perhaps more specifically flesh out the companions some more.
As for Bethesda changing the lore... they're messing about with something that's almost sacred to me, so I can't approve.
I just happen to be re-pleying FO2 today and yesterday. Hello from DANMARK.
I love 1, 2 and New Vegas. Even if 1 and 2 are old in their UI and whatnot.
I like to call those 3 Westcoast trilogy.
Will you do a rumination on New Vegas?
Been wanting him to do this so bad. He has his schedule on his website that is decided by his patrons and they haven't voted for him to do NV so don't get your hopes up anytime soon.
Preamble ends around 6:53
I really don't understand how you had trouble forcing yourzelf to get through the game. I had trouble forcing myself to STOP playing last time I played through it.
Agreed. This game was my first true western RPG back in the late 90s and I can't help but judge all other RPGs I play based on this one. A true classic. One thing I wish he discussed was the soundtrack. I still like to listen to Modoc and several other gems by Mark Morgan.
I went back to Fallout 2 midway through fallout 4, and got addicted to F2 again.
Same. I am barely older than the game itself and I was absolutely hooked when I finally understood the controls.
Wheres the new Vegas rumination LORE!
THANK YOU. As someone that played these games since 1 you are spot on sir. People misremember or even worse misinform because they've never actually have. You obviously have and it shows. 100% correct sir.
I know this is a far left field question, but would you do a Rumination Analysis on the game Gothic and perchance Gothic 2?
Hi Lorerunner, just want to say thank you. You are doing awesome content, have been watching all the ruminations even on games i have not yet played. Discovered your channel about a week ago. You seem very intelligent and well spoken. Love from Sweden
You get to choose wether you want a random encounter only if you have (cant remember exact name) surviver/scout skill over 100 or smthng
On the topic of Lynatte and her similarity to Richardson: go talk to her after you beat the Enclave. You have a new dialogue with her that hammers that point in very well.
Whoah, Fallout 2.
It's really strange I don't think the early Fallout games have aged badly at all and I only played them recently. I did prefer 1 over 2 though.
You are right about the trial from the point of view of the player but in my opinion it perfectly suits the character background. You are a tribesman, your tribe only has fists and spears therefore the only combat options they can give you in the trial are fists and spears + the sneaky and speechy options.
I know you ll hate me for this. And probably answered this exact question like a billion times now but i have to ask. Do you have any loreruns planned for the future?
not in the near future! Loreruns are a huge amount of time and money to sink, so not right now.
What you were saying about number of clicks makes me suspect that you remain unaware of hotkeys (skill hotkeys in particular). They are hidden, after all. So that's one thing that a remake could have -- rebindable keybinds, and perhaps some tutorialization of their usage.
About encounters being optional -- that's a function of Outdoorsman skill, not a basic game mechanic.
Oh, God. This again. Fallout 2 has not aged poorly. It had an awful UI when it released. Everything that is a problem NOW was also a problem THEN. It was just easier to overlook those problems back then because it was the hot new thing.
I don't think it really was a problem back then. I remember getting into the game with absolutely no problem as a 10-11 year old kid. But when I see people who never played it today they don't know what they're doing and even rats can kill them. :D I don't know if I'd call it aging poorly or maybe it's the people who changed, they're to spoiled by games that make everything super easy by giving you a billion tips before you even do anything. I don't know.
ive never had any problems with the ui dont know why everyone keeps repeating that it's bad, nobody has given any reasons yet
Another great video Archengeia, keep up the good work.
fallout 4 always makes me think of pixar mostly because of the graphics and how cartoony some of the characters and enemies are in terms of design and behavior.
What's the difference between Fallout 1 and 2 UI? Only thing I can think of is 'take all' button and follower controls.
My favourite game reviewed by my favourite UA-camr. Today is a happy day.
I think you could use some gameplay in the background just for visual reference.
Spader is so versatile!
Your not wrong, being a big fan of the gold box ssi games, I found fallout 2's UI manageable. I played 2 before 1 and damn, I stopped playing 1 the first time I tried it because the UI was so horrible. Honestly, if I hadn't played 2 first I can't honestly say for sure I would have completed 1.
Going back now, even 2 just isn't worth it, only because of the UI.
No map? What about the automap in the Pip-Boy?
Game is unfinished, kind of linear, built in set pieces with poor coordination and I can't help the enclave which are written like stupid one-dimensional tencho bad guys. 6.5/10
or the Japanese mirecal from GitS
I can't seem to find the review for fallout 1. Did you ever make one? I find odd for you of all people to do a review of a serries and not start with the first one?
Hello Mr Lorerunner . Have you tried the mod for skyrim ENDERAL? That mod really blew me away and it could be its own game just by itself.
The quality of it far surpass most of the Triple A games today. It has an fantastic story , characters and improved combat mechanics that i believed is the kind of game from what i gathered you would enjoyed playing.
I would seriously recommand you try it because that game/mod kept me thinking about in my head over and over after i had completed it. It is that good.
I like your suit.
It's weird, i can go back to baldur's gate and icewind dale and be perfectly fine (Even the non enhanced editions) but going from that to something like fallout 1&2 after playing BG just feels clunky and even older.
It's probably the terrible UI's.
Rebellion has better UI. Not only that, but you can also tell your AI partner to take over parts of the UI like managing resources and troop deployments so you can focus on diplomacy and shipbuilding.
For me is like, the complete oposite
Bg just feels slower and less interactive imo
It's bullshit that you can't talk down the Enclave in Fallout 2 the same way you could do to the Master in Fallout 1. At least you can convince Richard Grey that he's wrong before he blows his own brains out. And unlike Fallout 3, where the Enclave knows who you are and knows to shoot you at first glance, in Fallout 2, you can infiltrate them, down to the point where everyone from their president to random comm officers and drill chiefs believe you to be one of them. So why not go the extra mile and have a very persuasive Chosen One smooth-talk the Enclave into joining the NCR and dropping their genocidal bullshit plans?
Especially when you consider that 1000 idiots in an oil rig and a couple hundred from a military base will wind up dying out due to inbreeding in a couple generations. Meanwhile, if they intermingled with the mutated humans and used their firepower to restore order and civilization to the wasteland, they not only could get more resistance to the harsh conditions of the wasteland, but also gain a larger pool of manpower for workers and cannon fodder. The Chosen One can use that to convince President Richardson that making peace with the NCR is a far better option than allowing less than 2000 people to inherit the Earth and eventually die out from inbreeding.
Sure, have the ending where you blow up the Enclave and feel like a badass, but would it kill them to have an ending where the Chosen One, having seamlessly infiltrated the Enclave, persuades its leaders to make peace with the NCR instead of committing genocide? It would have been a lot smarter and it would go a long way to explain how the NCR suddenly became Imperialistic in New Vegas and how they defeated the Brotherhood of Steel. The NCR becoming imperialists and them defeating the Brotherhood would make far more sense, if they have American government remnants lending them power-armored soldiers to make short work of the Brotherhood of Steel while trying to get them to retake as much of old America as possible.
Suddenly, the NCR going from democracy to imperialism would make more sense, especially if the Enclave joined them and convinced them that they rightfully own everything from California to New England. You can even explain away the Fallout 3 BoS and Enclave by saying that the BoS in Fallout 3 is what's left of the Brotherhood, fleeing to the Capital Wasteland from the west coast after the NCR and the Enclave tried to eradicate them, and the Enclave in the Capital Wasteland was a detachment of troops sent by NCR Enclave leaders back in the west coast, whose goal is to finish the eradication of the Brotherhood and establish a base at the nation's former capital.
So basically, this game is a lot like Jedi Outcast? If you don't know the game, it will break you. If you know the game, it will be a breeze to go from point A to point B.
It's kind of weird that you feel the game hasn't aged well considering you were around to play it when it was new. I actually played Fallout 2 for the very first time last year and I enjoyed it a ton, though I will admit the UI is horrendous by today's standards, and it was the hardest thing to get used to before I could properly get into the game. The whole first dungeon at the very start of the game was pretty much me learning how to use the UI for a good hour lol.
Buddy you need some DPP Yoga for that back!
star wars rebellion!!!!!! must play now
It's a wonderful game.
Rushes through? LOL. I kill every single ant and scorpion for the experience (and the traps if I can). XP is hard to come by in the beginning. At least XP that is relatively easy to get. You certainly can't do more tougher grinds at that level like fighting geckos.
UI is kind of crap, but given how much you can do, I'm not sure how else they could have done it. My main gripe is having to change the mouse cursor to inspect things. Or having to switch from targeting circle to information circle to inspect enemies. It's not too bad if you realize you can use hotkeys for lockpicking, traps etc.
As for the tone, I don't mind all the 4th wall breaking stuff. And I like the lighter tone. But I can see how that puts other people off. New Vegas made the correct choice by locking stuff like that behind a trait so it's optional.
As for Myron, is he really that bad? He's a slime ball for sure. But I find it funny how people can cheer characters like Walter White but hate Myron. Both are drug manufacturers. People just pick on Myron because he's a dweeb. I hate him of course, but he's not evil like the slaver boss in the Den. Metzger.
Still my favourite Fallout. So for Cd Projekt Red I think.
To be fair, Black Isle/Obsidian tutorials always seemed the weakest part of the game. Kotor 2, Icewind Dale(1 and 2), NWN2... I'm suprised that Pillars of Eternity wasn't that bad.
Also Jet is somehow in prewar vaults... which means... MYRON IS A TIMELORD!!!
KOTOR 1 tutorial was so far the biggest failure of a tutorial.
I think it does treat player like moron but it forshadows future event. Also tutorial companion is less memorable than... those from Dragon Age Origins... and one of those guys was my favourite character in entire game...
Actually I like different origins for different races/professions in DA:O, only pain is that taking some classes (like warrior city elf) gives you doors or chest that can never be opened because you've picked the wrong class. Tutorial companions are also nice because they come up later and it's nice meeting them. Plus city elf and dwarf lower class have great origin stories :)
I would say not only moron but very contrived reasons for you being on the ship, never actually meeting your bunkmate and feeling like a first day on the ship while you were actually some time on it. It would benefit from DA:O model where you have your day to day (or special event) and from there you are thrown into the sith attack that makes you land on Taris. NWN2 has a bit of this too but then the biggest problem of this game is giving us like 11 races, 20 classes (might be lower number than this) all being different origin, different age and being from the same boring swamp villaige, and our hero have complicated story. It would be better If we were just generic mercenary and one of our companions (maybe Shandra with her connections to plot) had major role in story.
wanamingo and deathclaw. the horror....
Thanks Dr Evil
Fallout 2, not aged well? I can see that but then I like oldschool and the fact that F2 is better than F3 and F4. I liked Fallout 1 more because of plot, you go out of vault and explore the world while in Fallout 2 you are a tribesman that can be master of energy weapon, science and big guns. With time i started to think that plots of those two game or rather beginning/origins of our hero should be reversed, in Fallout 1 we are a tribesman and we as the player don't know the world why it is is such state, then we learn that there was atomic war. While in F2 we see the prequel where our grandfather leaves the vault. This whole temple of trials in postapocaliptic feels weird, out of place.
plus, you get a subscribe, took me few ruminations to see that you have good content :)
Btw, will you do Arcanum? That is also good game but it became too big and for a lot of time it feels empty. Apart from that, good game.
Ps. Sorry for your back
Arcanum is next on the list :) You can see the schedule on lorerunner.com.
Great news! Thanks for the link!
@@LandBark Fallout 2's story is really dated for me. Especially with how the whole "evil government" theme really got old. At least I can look at Eden and see that he honestly believes in the shit he says, whereas Richardson is a damn hypocrite for saying that all mutants have to die, when his best soldier is a goddamn mutant. Not only that, but Richardson is way too much a jab at Nixon and it just pisses me off that they had to make the sole remnant of the US be irredeemably evil and not joinable at all. At least with Eden, he's more of a principles zealot who you can serve as a double-agent where you poison the water and bomb the Brotherhood Citadel even as you fight Autumn's troops. You can't even join the Fallout 2 Enclave, even though you INFILTRATE the Enclave in that game. Why shouldn't there be a path for the player to honestly become an Enclave soldier and claw their way up the ranks? At least in KOTOR, when the game railroaded me to work with the Jedi to destroy Darth Malak, I could take over the Sith Empire as an evil player. Fallout 2 doesn't even let you do that.
That is the whitest blazer I ever did see...
Great review as always. I hope you play Nier Automata. I´d love to hear what you have to say about it
Fallout 2's a great game and all, but what I really disliked was how the Enclave was handled. There was no grey area with them at all. At most, Dornan and a few other soldiers could be explained as just doing their jobs, but everyone else? Especially Frank Horrigan and President Dick Richardson? They're just assholes, plain and simple. A President whose name is a ringer for Richard Nixon. Troops gunning down innocent vault-dwellers who aren't irradiated. A Secret Service agent who's such an unreasonable beast, he makes Legate Lanius look like a reasonable man. I mean, what's the use with them wanting to wipe out all irradiated humans, when just ruling them by the sword would be more than enough? And basically, the way Interplay's Fallout 2 handled the Enclave influenced how Bethesda's Fallout 3 handled the Enclave, so it's hardly Fallout 3's fault that the Enclave was stupid evil when Fallout 2 introduced them as such. The false choice of working with President Eden even mirrors the false choice of working with the Master back in Fallout 1. In fact, Fallout 3's handling of the Enclave leadership was a bit better than 2s, because at least, this time, the Enclave's leader is willing to break bread with you if you give him the time of day, as flawed as the final result of it was.
It would have been so much better, SO MUCH BETTER, had the Enclave been a morally grey faction like the Brotherhood of Steel. Like say, they use the modified FEV as a threat against settlements full of irradiated people and mutants who don't fall in line, but people who do follow them get full assistance, treatment for radiation poisoning, and if they serve loyally, power armor and energy weapons. Imagine if they were fascist murderers, but they're fascist murderers who truly want to restore the 1950's America back into existence, and they're willing to cooperate with people who share that dream. The player can influence the NCR to either work with or against them, and if the player joins them and does enough quests for them, the player becomes officially a part of the Enclave, and they get a full suit of power armor, energy weapons, and even Enclave merchants to supply them with stuff, as well as a steady stream of income from being a soldier and doing quests for them, like say, Sergeant Dornan sends you off to wipe out roving gangs of raiders that respawn now and then to give the player a steady stream of money.
The game can then have some Super Mutant schmuck from the first game be the final boss, someone who is trying to pick up from where the Master left off. The player would be trying to put down this mutant army, and they can recruit or fight against several factions, from the NCR, the Brotherhood of Steel, or the Enclave. If you want to wipe out the Enclave, you can, and if you want to join/recruit them, you can. That's what Fallout: New Vegas did, and it was the game that handled the Enclave the best, even though the Enclave had been reduced to a bunch of old farts by that time.
So again, the entirety of the ending segment of fallout 2 was just an satire for how the government patriotism is dull and unreasonable. I can understand how you got angry by that, but a lot of fo2 is parodies and satire in comparison to 1 and vegas (i mean, you could time travel and steal the waterchip from vault 13)
The really interesting ideas for morality come from the new societies on the wastes like Ncr's expansionism or Vault city's Great condition but at the cost of people's freedom
@@Jrdotan So basically, more of the same anti-patriotic bullshit that permeated works like Warhammer 40K where they satirize 1980s patriotism and 1950s culture. It's not original, and it's not that endearing either. It's telling that Fallout 3 actually had a more nuanced portrayal of the Enclave, which New Vegas followed, instead of them just being militaristic jackasses bent on global genocide.
It's bullshit that you can't talk down the Enclave in Fallout 2 the same way you could do to the Master in Fallout 1. At least you can convince Richard Grey that he's wrong before he blows his own brains out. And unlike Fallout 3, where the Enclave knows who you are and knows to shoot you at first glance, in Fallout 2, you can infiltrate them, down to the point where everyone from their president to random comm officers and drill chiefs believe you to be one of them. So why not go the extra mile and have a very persuasive Chosen One smooth-talk the Enclave into joining the NCR and dropping their genocidal bullshit plans?
Especially when you consider that 1000 idiots in an oil rig and a couple hundred from a military base will wind up dying out due to inbreeding in a couple generations. Meanwhile, if they intermingled with the mutated humans and used their firepower to restore order and civilization to the wasteland, they not only could get more resistance to the harsh conditions of the wasteland, but also gain a larger pool of manpower for workers and cannon fodder. The Chosen One can use that to convince President Richardson that making peace with the NCR is a far better option than allowing less than 2000 people to inherit the Earth and eventually die out from inbreeding.
Sure, have the ending where you blow up the Enclave and feel like a badass, but would it kill them to have an ending where the Chosen One, having seamlessly infiltrated the Enclave, persuades its leaders to make peace with the NCR instead of committing genocide? It would have been a lot smarter and it would go a long way to explain how the NCR suddenly became Imperialistic in New Vegas and how they defeated the Brotherhood of Steel. The NCR becoming imperialists and them defeating the Brotherhood would make far more sense, if they have American government remnants lending them power-armored soldiers to make short work of the Brotherhood of Steel while trying to get them to retake as much of old America as possible.
Suddenly, the NCR going from democracy to imperialism would make more sense, especially if the Enclave joined them and convinced them that they rightfully own everything from California to New England. You can even explain away the Fallout 3 BoS and Enclave by saying that the BoS in Fallout 3 is what's left of the Brotherhood, fleeing to the Capital Wasteland from the west coast after the NCR and the Enclave tried to eradicate them, and the Enclave in the Capital Wasteland was a detachment of troops sent by NCR Enclave leaders back in the west coast, whose goal is to finish the eradication of the Brotherhood and establish a base at the nation's former capital.
I can certainly see your point of view, but the thing I took from the enclave during my original FO2 playthrough when it first came out is that yes, sadly some people are just dicks who are so self rightous there is no grey in them. Also, your NV comparison still holds true because as you pointed out, they'll old farts. With age comes wisdom and the ability to look back 30 years into your life and realise... "damn, I was a dick back then..."
I've owned this game for 8 years yet I've never played it.
i dont see any problem with the ui, its actually one of the best ive seen, why do you think its bad
Awesome!
Dude we like the same games and music. Come over
Oh, Lord, Arch. Don't even get started on Paradox and their shitty, shitty UIs.
FWIW, though, Stellaris actually has a pretty serviceable UI.
Brother, I love your videos. I really do. But why do u always pick your nose and then look at it, AND then throw it in the air?!
So the real answer to that is probably more embarrassing then what you're envisioning. I have nose hairs, and they tickle the crap out of my nose when I talk for long periods of time. I try to remember to 'shave' before recording (and I've gotten better about it) but... yeah. *cough*
Lorerunner Fair enough! Love your stuff! wish all the best for you and your future UA-cam career. Much love brother.
Before playing Fallout 2: wow this is a very interesting video, I hope I can play this game soon
After playing Fallout 2: wow this guy has absolutely no fucking clue of what he's talking about
LOL fanboy detected.
Based on your Twitch stream I'd say that your view of the game's tone might be distorted by having the original music turned off. It's a crucial building block of Fallout's atmosphere -- must be a very different experience without it.
By the way, you missed a great opportunity of pissing off even more people by not mentioning music.
Well yes, Mark Morgan creates some very atmospheric soundtrack unlike Inon Zur which is more plain music.
Well to be fair some of the stuff that goes on in random encounters and some quest is so inane it's kinda funny that I don't blame him for having that impression
Overrated, outdated. good for its time, just IMHO.
But I like the suit! it's nice. But what happened to your old black outfit with the gloves? Will you still use that?
Brainwashed by Bethesda. Also, hugely uninformed.