Your commentary at 4:25 on Intel using CPU horsepower in their drivers is spot on… yes it muddies some potential upgrader’s viability, but it will scale going forward.
I don't know - it seems more like spinning it... it's not use "using CPU horsepower", it's "the GPU can't perform to the fullest" - that's why it "scales better", because the cost is (say) per-frame and so the GPU can't be used to the full, while the other cards don't scale because it wasn't the CPU holding them back, but GPU hardware. On the plus side, this might mean that the cards age better, if Intel can actually improve on that overhead.
@@ticlerYou can buy an i5 13400 with 10 cores (6p+4e) for ~$150. Yes, it's not as good of a deal for people who play on older platforms, but arc is still good for people buying new systems (AM5 or modern intel). Not to mention that the number of people amongst pc gamers who upgrade their gpu is very tiny, as most will just buy a laptop or a prebuilt desktop.
Thank you for such comprehensive testing of FSR on these cards. I found that really lacking in other reviews while I imagine it would be the most common configuration.
Thanks for throwing up the dimensions. I absolutely need them for my nuc 12 extreme, which is insanely strict on its 2 slot restriction. I.e. it's EXACTLY 2 slots with exactly zero slack in the dimensions.
10 Gb of memory at this price is excellent. Unfortunately not many models with ARC but the Challenger from Asrock looks pretty good and 2 slots it's great.
I know this is beginner's stuff for you, but could you make a video how to configure the B570 for the best performance (both with and without overclocking)? Before even looking at different games, just the Intel settings, etc to get it up and running? I would appreciate it immensely!
IF it is available at Msrp it's not a "terrible" card (not amazing not terrible - just like eh it's ok) , but good luck trying to find it @ Msrp in 6months imo.
I have my B580 paired with that AliExpress i7 1280p (ES) 10729 motherboard that Wendell reviewed some months ago. The only draw back of that board is that it's PCIe 4x4. I'm playing War Thunder with it on 3x 1440p monitors on DX12 medium settings and I am not dipping below 100 FPS.
I agree the price diff is just too small to justify the B570. That extra 2GB VRAM could be the difference between needing to buy a new card later on or not. Might as well get it now when the price diff is only $30. If you live near a Microcenter, keep checking their site. Over the last month, I've managed to get 4 B580's from there, one of each make/model. I'm using them all and they're great cards.
If you use Arc as your primary card in slot 1 it’s great. I have had issues trying to get Arc to play nice in my second PCIE slot. Making it useless for AV1 transcoding the reason I bought it. Oh well it will go into my file server instead. I’ll just have to copy my footage to it and transcode it over there then copy it back to my main PC.
I got one of the only B580s out in the wild where I live. It has some caveats but overall promising. Was affordable. The problem now is that everything is out of stock. If the B570 is the same you won't really be able to buy it, either.
I watched a bit of Linus's game testing stream yesterday, what is interesting is that cpu utilization is often lower on intel than on an nvidia 4060 system. Older architecture eithwr lack some features the driver is relying on or it's just an IPC issue?
At 150 TDP I'd love to see a single slot version from someone so I can drop multiple into a Linux box with some nice fans in front of it. If they're to pare down the perf just a bit then lean into performance per slot instead of performance per watt.
Personally, I doubt that AMD or Nvidia will even have a sub $250 offering in their upcoming releases, so Intel has at least planted the flag for the ultra budget gamer. I am hoping to see continued driver improvements at the pace set for the Alchemist cards. The B570 as an entry level GPU for a good number of pre-builds might be the path to profitability Intel needs to keep pushing to the next level of GPU performance.
Arc Battlemage was never intended to saturate any market segment. It is only meant to be a stepping stone to establish some mind-share for future launches, further work out optimizations, get more support from game studios, and build some positive reputation. Now because Battlemage is a success, Celestial will likely be a full volume sales push for market-share assuming process nodes and timelines cooperate.
Absolutely no leaks or rumors at all tells me there is no B700. Most likely they are instead focusing those development resources on a successful full fat and ahead of schedule Celestial launch.
Are Fire strike and Time spy decent ballpark indicators of raw compute performance? For those of us with with some [SyCL] parallel computing hobbies. I've been avoiding getting locked into CUDA and ROCm support is a dumpster fire for RDNA retail users, esp on Linux. I suppose it would be more useful to break this sort of performance into double float single, int32 int64, small types, and mildly branching workloads (GPUs don't love branching logic but they can reasonably handle some.).
I hope the rumors are true and Intel will release the 24GB version of the Battlemage. And hopefully it won't have "Pro" pricing, as that would defeat the whole point of it even existing. What the self-hosted AI crowd need are mid-range cards with plenty of VRAM at GDDR6 192-bit bus speeds(or better but that'll do) for $500 or less. It is not an unreasonable ask. Were they do that, the software environment would be built around them. Stacking used, half burnt out 3090s in a jenga-tower won't be sustainable forever.
That's what I am waiting on. I have an A750 that sure it was a headache not being able to game on it for a year, but I am ready to replace the GPU on server. It doesn't make sense that NVIDIA is taxing folks the way they are.
Sounds like a good cheap card for the people that don't game much but stream movies and watch videos. This what my brother does, cheaper to use his computer to stream with 35 dollar internet than pay 100 dollars for cable and their decoder box.
@@Rentta A Piledriver and RX460 would handle all of that. Also, No computer is needed for a smart TV unless you just want to decouple it from any network connections for privacy reasons.(stream to the computer and output a basic video signal, just using it like an old dumb TV)
still looking for single slot, no extra power, 4+monitor support, if possible passively cooled version for a decent multimonitor office setup with good multimedia support
@@llothar68 they do but they are extremely overpriced, they even did a "luma" series of intel arc video cards but the a310 luma costs 500-600 euro, while proper intel a310 is available only from sparkle with one hdmi and two minidp ports for 130-150 eur, or in two slot version as a380, which is not single slot as required
I'm presently using an AMD 560 RX 4M from VisionTek. It has 4 mini display port outputs that support 1440p. Got it for just a touch over $100 about 3 months ago. It's not going to win any benchmarks, but it works fine and does everything you specified. It takes a single slot and uses bus power. Only caveat is that it uses its fans prodigiously.
@@Rentta yup, ancient quadro or radeon pro or a nvidia 720 into pcie 1x with four hdmi ports, not much to pick from, hence waiting for a a310 successor, that has the required things /one slot slim, no xtra power and 4 monitor support with new codecs built in/
The old days of 3DMark, where you could count on it...shame it isn't that way anymore. It may not only be UL not doing Futuremark justice with the benchmarks - but also actual games being as poorly made as they could be. Intel is doing great so far!
Weird question from weird guy(me). I have a x299 i7-7900x with a quadro p4000. I use it for some light video editing, as a stream pc, some AI shennenigans and cad work. how would the b570 or b580 fair compared to the p4000? Would it make sense to replace or maybe add one of these?
Without Resizable Bar, the ARC cards will not show their full potential. I have not seen any comparisons of the B5xx vs the p4000. Others my have more info...
It has less VRAM, but additionally no OC can give you back better memory bandwidth. Bus bandwidth 160 bit to 192 bit, maybe small difference, but still with the same memory clock you get Bandwidth 380.0 GB/s to 456.0 GB/s. If this card would cost 200$ MSRP it would be probably good 😂
Crazy theory, what if, not saying it's true, but what if scalpers are buying up the B580 because they can make a bigger profit from AMD and Nvidia? Yeah it sounds kinda nuts but think about it, if they buy these cheaper cards with more vram then they nit only get a sell off theses cards, but when the more weell know cards start to surface readily then they could get a larger profit off name alone for those that just have to have teams red or green? You can't con a con man i know there's a reason for why scalping is still happening with Intel, i just don't know the exact reasons, I mean they could just want to round out their supply but could be a deeper cause to it all, would love to hear an educated guess
damit . . . . . damit damit damit . . . . . . I need ultimate efficiency _AmD_ . . at the very least 8300G+799-ish 0M capacity. where is my "single cell" pc?
Fake and misleading reviews all over internet for arc b580 and b570. Please review those video cards with budget CPU like Ryzen 3600 or 5600 and the intel equivalents. People with budget CPU will buy this card, people with high end CPU will buy Nvidia 5070. At the moment GeForce 4060 is the better and the solid choice for the budget CPU
Wendell isn't fake or misleading anyone. He makes explicit mention that older CPUs may not work well with the 580, or 570. He tested with a newer CPU, told people exactly what he was testing, and did it on a straightforward manner. Just because he didn't review the GPU the way you wanted him to review it, doent means his review is fake or misleading. I'm betting he only had the card for a short while before the review embargo lifted, so he tested on newer hardware, and provided appropriate caveats throughout the video. If you dislime his review so much, buy or borrow the card yourself and then post your own review.
Silly comment... Since when has Wendell given a fake review? A 7600(x) is a budget CPU... The 5600 does not perform poorly with the B580 (and probably not the B570). The 3600 is not a budget CPU (it's practically archaic) and doesn't natively support reBAR... However there is software available that can somewhat support reBAR and make it pseudo compatible.
Wendell, you are rapidly becoming the first review I watch for these launches! Fantastic work.
always better than ltt 😂
@@logipilotnot hard🙃
L1 and GN. Pretty much the only ones i have 100% trust in
Same! I like several of the popular channels, but Wendell is usually speaking to my specific use cases!
Your commentary at 4:25 on Intel using CPU horsepower in their drivers is spot on… yes it muddies some potential upgrader’s viability, but it will scale going forward.
I don't know - it seems more like spinning it... it's not use "using CPU horsepower", it's "the GPU can't perform to the fullest" - that's why it "scales better", because the cost is (say) per-frame and so the GPU can't be used to the full, while the other cards don't scale because it wasn't the CPU holding them back, but GPU hardware.
On the plus side, this might mean that the cards age better, if Intel can actually improve on that overhead.
No one buying $220 card is looking or scaling with a 8+ core system. This is a budget card that is not friendly to budget systems.
@@ticlerYou can buy an i5 13400 with 10 cores (6p+4e) for ~$150. Yes, it's not as good of a deal for people who play on older platforms, but arc is still good for people buying new systems (AM5 or modern intel). Not to mention that the number of people amongst pc gamers who upgrade their gpu is very tiny, as most will just buy a laptop or a prebuilt desktop.
Thanks for doing a good first look without going overboard.
Thank you for such comprehensive testing of FSR on these cards. I found that really lacking in other reviews while I imagine it would be the most common configuration.
Thanks for throwing up the dimensions. I absolutely need them for my nuc 12 extreme, which is insanely strict on its 2 slot restriction. I.e. it's EXACTLY 2 slots with exactly zero slack in the dimensions.
The challenger challenging the incumbent.
That _is_ what challengers do. 🤷😄
Holy moly the crypto bots in these comments are going crazy!
More annoying than the boob bots! Jeez!!
It's almost like crypto is a scam or something.
10 Gb of memory at this price is excellent. Unfortunately not many models with ARC but the Challenger from Asrock looks pretty good and 2 slots it's great.
Excellent review.
I know this is beginner's stuff for you, but could you make a video how to configure the B570 for the best performance (both with and without overclocking)? Before even looking at different games, just the Intel settings, etc to get it up and running? I would appreciate it immensely!
For the first time in 20 years we have 3 competing gpu manufacturers that offer compelling products.
I'd love to see this card with 2x m.2 slots and 16 pcie lines utilised. It would be an instant update for my NAS
So the perfect card for everyone who wants the newest codecs support and sometimes plays a game.
IF it is available at Msrp it's not a "terrible" card (not amazing not terrible - just like eh it's ok) , but good luck trying to find it @ Msrp in 6months imo.
It's always funny when another channel starts a pc part drama like they just discovered it, while Wendell already talked about it a week beforehand.
Yes, he discovered it but didn’t follow it up with more testing unfortunately
Hope they get a load more "founders edition" cards out there as I really like the look of intel's cards.
Good to see affordable graphics cards again. 🙂
So we thought, the scalpers are at it again!
Too bad these need not so affordable CPU to get the best out of them which mostly isn't the case with Nvidia or AMD
@@Rentta depends on how old the cpu is and varies game to game.
Intel seems to be cornering the budget gaming market and low priced video cards.
I have my B580 paired with that AliExpress i7 1280p (ES) 10729 motherboard that Wendell reviewed some months ago. The only draw back of that board is that it's PCIe 4x4. I'm playing War Thunder with it on 3x 1440p monitors on DX12 medium settings and I am not dipping below 100 FPS.
Hey Wendell!! You are my favorite "Cyberpunk"! Way more cyber than punk although!😜
I agree the price diff is just too small to justify the B570. That extra 2GB VRAM could be the difference between needing to buy a new card later on or not. Might as well get it now when the price diff is only $30. If you live near a Microcenter, keep checking their site. Over the last month, I've managed to get 4 B580's from there, one of each make/model. I'm using them all and they're great cards.
Let em know, king 👏🏾
Great review. How's the Handbrake H.265 hardware encoder performance rendering 4K?
Crazy times when Intel is the underdog/budget option in a market.
Intel DG playing the long game
If you use Arc as your primary card in slot 1 it’s great. I have had issues trying to get Arc to play nice in my second PCIE slot. Making it useless for AV1 transcoding the reason I bought it. Oh well it will go into my file server instead. I’ll just have to copy my footage to it and transcode it over there then copy it back to my main PC.
Never heard a american use the german "selten" before 😂
He's a smart dude.
I got one of the only B580s out in the wild where I live. It has some caveats but overall promising. Was affordable. The problem now is that everything is out of stock. If the B570 is the same you won't really be able to buy it, either.
An ASRock brand GPU combined with an ASRock monitor, my OCD approves 😅
I watched a bit of Linus's game testing stream yesterday, what is interesting is that cpu utilization is often lower on intel than on an nvidia 4060 system. Older architecture eithwr lack some features the driver is relying on or it's just an IPC issue?
With the thermals these cards are getting, are the Arc B series a good candidate for server GPUs?
At 150 TDP I'd love to see a single slot version from someone so I can drop multiple into a Linux box with some nice fans in front of it. If they're to pare down the perf just a bit then lean into performance per slot instead of performance per watt.
Like I said, well done Intel. Open source code for the drivers on Linux. It helps.
Yeah, assuming the closed source windows one and the open source one share slme codebase we can look into why it performes worse on older platforms
@fpgamemearray I don't care about windows anymore. The programs I use run on Linux.
I’d like to see how this performs as a workstation/encoder card say in unraid or truenas
mesa/amdgpu just merged 'good' gpu virtualization support
Personally, I doubt that AMD or Nvidia will even have a sub $250 offering in their upcoming releases, so Intel has at least planted the flag for the ultra budget gamer. I am hoping to see continued driver improvements at the pace set for the Alchemist cards. The B570 as an entry level GPU for a good number of pre-builds might be the path to profitability Intel needs to keep pushing to the next level of GPU performance.
Arc Battlemage was never intended to saturate any market segment. It is only meant to be a stepping stone to establish some mind-share for future launches, further work out optimizations, get more support from game studios, and build some positive reputation.
Now because Battlemage is a success, Celestial will likely be a full volume sales push for market-share assuming process nodes and timelines cooperate.
Can't get either of them for less than $330 Canadian Peso's. I am wondering where the Arc B750/770 are at in development myself.
Absolutely no leaks or rumors at all tells me there is no B700. Most likely they are instead focusing those development resources on a successful full fat and ahead of schedule Celestial launch.
Good cards bad shops. Here the b570 is at 280eur and the b580 intel founder at 440eur(Partner cards starts at 320 but raising fast).
Are Fire strike and Time spy decent ballpark indicators of raw compute performance? For those of us with with some [SyCL] parallel computing hobbies. I've been avoiding getting locked into CUDA and ROCm support is a dumpster fire for RDNA retail users, esp on Linux. I suppose it would be more useful to break this sort of performance into double float single, int32 int64, small types, and mildly branching workloads (GPUs don't love branching logic but they can reasonably handle some.).
Meanwhile me waiting for a B310 for my server 😂😂😂
How are these cards for Folding@home? From what I saw and read alchemist did not run well if at all on the cards.
I hope the rumors are true and Intel will release the 24GB version of the Battlemage. And hopefully it won't have "Pro" pricing, as that would defeat the whole point of it even existing. What the self-hosted AI crowd need are mid-range cards with plenty of VRAM at GDDR6 192-bit bus speeds(or better but that'll do) for $500 or less. It is not an unreasonable ask. Were they do that, the software environment would be built around them. Stacking used, half burnt out 3090s in a jenga-tower won't be sustainable forever.
That's what I am waiting on. I have an A750 that sure it was a headache not being able to game on it for a year, but I am ready to replace the GPU on server. It doesn't make sense that NVIDIA is taxing folks the way they are.
Does it fit into Minisforum MS-01 ?
Sounds like a good cheap card for the people that don't game much but stream movies and watch videos. This what my brother does, cheaper to use his computer to stream with 35 dollar internet than pay 100 dollars for cable and their decoder box.
wouldnt the gpu built-in with am5 not be sufficient then?
@@mrc4nlit absolutely would
he has a 65" smart TV for movies and stuff and a 27" monitor to have social media and chat stuff on, got to stay connected
@@nonameentered1918 Even AM4 stuff would be fine for the most part.
@@Rentta A Piledriver and RX460 would handle all of that.
Also, No computer is needed for a smart TV unless you just want to decouple it from any network connections for privacy reasons.(stream to the computer and output a basic video signal, just using it like an old dumb TV)
Wow i have never clicked on a video this fast!!
In Argentina b580 is almost 400usd cash
B570 315 dolares cash
still looking for single slot, no extra power, 4+monitor support, if possible passively cooled version for a decent multimonitor office setup with good multimedia support
Does Matrox still exist? They did stuff like that
@@llothar68 they do but they are extremely overpriced, they even did a "luma" series of intel arc video cards but the a310 luma costs 500-600 euro, while proper intel a310 is available only from sparkle with one hdmi and two minidp ports for 130-150 eur, or in two slot version as a380, which is not single slot as required
Used quadro card maybe ?
I'm presently using an AMD 560 RX 4M from VisionTek. It has 4 mini display port outputs that support 1440p. Got it for just a touch over $100 about 3 months ago. It's not going to win any benchmarks, but it works fine and does everything you specified. It takes a single slot and uses bus power. Only caveat is that it uses its fans prodigiously.
@@Rentta yup, ancient quadro or radeon pro or a nvidia 720 into pcie 1x with four hdmi ports, not much to pick from, hence waiting for a a310 successor, that has the required things /one slot slim, no xtra power and 4 monitor support with new codecs built in/
Maybe, just maybe, Nvidia will give the 5060 more VRAM because of this...
nah they wouldn't.
Rumour of them waiting until 3gb modules in gddr7 exist so they can do a 12gb 5060 instead of 8 or 16gb being the only options with 2gb modules
Yeah they probably will use the neural compression and materials as an excuse to why 8GB is still enough in 2025 and onwards
@ ururur G7
The old days of 3DMark, where you could count on it...shame it isn't that way anymore. It may not only be UL not doing Futuremark justice with the benchmarks - but also actual games being as poorly made as they could be. Intel is doing great so far!
This is the first B570 review I've seen. This card will probably be priced way above MSRP.
Weird question from weird guy(me). I have a x299 i7-7900x with a quadro p4000.
I use it for some light video editing, as a stream pc, some AI shennenigans and cad work. how would the b570 or b580 fair compared to the p4000? Would it make sense to replace or maybe add one of these?
Without Resizable Bar, the ARC cards will not show their full potential. I have not seen any comparisons of the B5xx vs the p4000. Others my have more info...
If you get this card, make sure your x299 motherboard supports resizable bar. Not all OEMs released bios updates for x299 to add it.
@@rgbplague7834Asrock x299 taichi clx thankfully does
Would been the perfect 199$ smash hit! But it's 220$
i cant wait for people to admit that raytracing is a meme and just focus on pathtracing as it makes a real difference.
Needs to be considerably cheaper than the B580 to justify purchasing. Pricing this card $20 less than the B580 makes no sense.
It has less VRAM, but additionally no OC can give you back better memory bandwidth. Bus bandwidth 160 bit to 192 bit, maybe small difference, but still with the same memory clock you get Bandwidth 380.0 GB/s to 456.0 GB/s. If this card would cost 200$ MSRP it would be probably good 😂
I have already seen someone doing 2850mhz core speed with a B570, I'm sure Wendell did better the way he is talking.
Can anyone buy the b580 for 250? What's the point if none are available.
Crazy theory, what if, not saying it's true, but what if scalpers are buying up the B580 because they can make a bigger profit from AMD and Nvidia? Yeah it sounds kinda nuts but think about it, if they buy these cheaper cards with more vram then they nit only get a sell off theses cards, but when the more weell know cards start to surface readily then they could get a larger profit off name alone for those that just have to have teams red or green? You can't con a con man i know there's a reason for why scalping is still happening with Intel, i just don't know the exact reasons, I mean they could just want to round out their supply but could be a deeper cause to it all, would love to hear an educated guess
Mesa ANV late i guess.
SR-IOV support on any of these new gen devices?
So far Intel hasn't had that on any of the consumer cards, so I doubt it. It would be amazing though!
@foobar6846 it's on older i915 devices, and obviously the flex series. Agreed, would be amazing to see these new ones support it
intel used to make cool stuff.. maybe they can once again
I want Intel to launch 34GB vram card for ollama. Nothing else matters... does not need to be super fast, just a sh-t load of VRAM. please!
$400 intel bundle
$250 1440p card
Happy kids.
Happy parents. 🤷♂️
10 GB just ain't making it. :/
I have a RX 6700 10GB, it does pretty well for itself.
Any machine learning numbers for these cards? I'd be interested in what the raw compute can do for them.
Wendel if you have any good 9070xt news DM me I won’t tell another soul. Just give me a price.
nice
Please tell no more stupid overhead like b580 😢
Gotta put in chapters man.
Are you paying for this content?
Why would anybody buy this over a B580 that is only $30 more? AMD failed AGAIN in it's pricing. At $199, it might have sold.
B570 the quality is not.............. amazing. 😓
I would just get a 3060 so I can do some AI stuff but seems like Intel is on a good path
They need multi gpu
If only Intel would actually want to sell them at MSRP
Not really Intel's doing if the prices go up. They set the MSRP at $250.00.
This will make a great paper weight.
damit . . . . . damit damit damit . . . . . . I need ultimate efficiency _AmD_ . . at the very least 8300G+799-ish 0M capacity.
where is my "single cell" pc?
Fake and misleading reviews all over internet for arc b580 and b570. Please review those video cards with budget CPU like Ryzen 3600 or 5600 and the intel equivalents. People with budget CPU will buy this card, people with high end CPU will buy Nvidia 5070.
At the moment GeForce 4060 is the better and the solid choice for the budget CPU
Wendell isn't fake or misleading anyone. He makes explicit mention that older CPUs may not work well with the 580, or 570. He tested with a newer CPU, told people exactly what he was testing, and did it on a straightforward manner.
Just because he didn't review the GPU the way you wanted him to review it, doent means his review is fake or misleading.
I'm betting he only had the card for a short while before the review embargo lifted, so he tested on newer hardware, and provided appropriate caveats throughout the video. If you dislime his review so much, buy or borrow the card yourself and then post your own review.
hardware unboxed has covered the ryzen 5600 numbers in thier video.
Silly comment... Since when has Wendell given a fake review?
A 7600(x) is a budget CPU... The 5600 does not perform poorly with the B580 (and probably not the B570). The 3600 is not a budget CPU (it's practically archaic) and doesn't natively support reBAR... However there is software available that can somewhat support reBAR and make it pseudo compatible.