MSP's back Holyrood motion in support of Scottish independence - Holyrood 18th September 2024
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- Опубліковано 10 лис 2024
- MSPs have voted to back a motion in support of Scottish independence.
The Holyrood debate and vote came on the occasion of the 10th anniversary of the 2014 independence referendum.
Tabled by John Swinney, the motion said “it is only with all the powers of a normal
independent nation that Scotland would truly be enabled to take its own decisions
to fully meet the needs of the people of Scotland” - with MSPs voting by 68 to 56 to back it.
A Green amendment which called for the creation of a constitutional convention was also passed.
Meanwhile, Tory, Labour, Liberal Democrat and Alba amendments to the motion fell.
In a set-piece speech on Wednesday morning, the First Minister said Scotland
is now closer to independence than it was 10 years ago, later saying in the Holyrood debate
that the “people of Scotland should have the opportunity to take that decision again”.
“The people of Scotland were able to take their decision (in 2014), and my firm view
in opening this debate today is that the people of Scotland should have the opportunity
to take that decision again,” he said.
“This parliament has confirmed its belief that it should be open to any nation of the United Kingdom
to choose to withdraw from the union by democratic means - that is my view
and I believe the view of this parliament should be respected.”
He added the “challenge” for independence supporters is now to convince more Scots
that their priorities could be better addressed outside of the UK.
Swinney said: “I think we are closer to achieving that than we were in 2014.”
Cmon Scotland believe in yourselves let get independence for our next generation🏴🏴🏴
NI has a legal right to a referendum every 7 years. Why not Scotland ?
They still need the secretary of state for Northern Ireland to give the go ahead.
Not a scintilla of recognition from the unionist parties that in 10 years since voting 55% to 45% to stay in the union, the direction of travel has been one way, an increasing number believing that independence is the solution, no recognition that in every election from 2014 until the 2024 election, the people of Scotland voted for pro-independence majorities in Holyrood and Westminster, yet somehow it is only the independence argument that is rooted in the past. Only the 2014 and the 2024 votes matter. No matter how much we wanted otherwise, we did lose the vote 10 years ago. Once the shock was over, we did start looking forward, looking forward to what was promised, all those powers, those warships, the green investment, the protection of our Parliament and membership of the EU, an equal place in a federal UK shorn of unelected peers. And all those promises have come to nought. The UK marches ever more to the right as we look on in despair, our right to self-determination sneered at and denied and never, ever an answer to "what is the legal route out of this 'voluntary' union?"
It's groundhog day over and over in a UK thirled to permanent austerity and inequality.
A very illuminating debate. It's the union that has not, and can not move on.
Saor Alba.
It's bullshit that Scotland was taken out of the EU against its will. Scotland never got asked the question do you want to leave or remain. Nicola changed it to vote for remain to get independence . The same way the no campaign told Scotland if we voted for independence we would be out of the EU.
The right to vote for I ndependence needs to be counted by a neutral body not the one used normal counting by Idox owned by the Tory Lilley
Saor Alba. I voted this time sno because my snp branch very hard working but snp had been warned.
Vote Labour for change they say…yip change in Westminster government but by god there is no change in our right to be better off and no change in the damned energy costs…yip vote Labour and get the same crap as we’ve had before…yip sounds about right…
Ross is not speaking for every Scottish person .
I can never get my head around the fact that anyone would vote for a foreign government to rule over them, Scottish people who do that can’t really call themselves Scottish in my opinion. 🏴
@@jimso771 they usually call themselves British Scots .nah ye can't have yer cake and eat it yer either one or the other .Scottish never British 🏴
I don't think it matters what they call themselves, the issue is what's best for Scotland. Any rational person can see that at this point in history, Scotland would do much better as an independent country.
@@daleanderin1 that right ya drain dead clown bet your a hun ya fk grow up ya silly we boy
@@ruaraidhmorrison5879
Why did you post this comment?
What motivated you to answer the way you did?
Those Scots lack the confidence and labour minded Scots were more interested in getting the Tory out of the UK gov.
Dross telling the SNP it should have kept its word after the indy vote ........ Bitter together's promises never happened and disappeared faster than the dew in the daytime. I can't remember one promise that was kept.
Richard Leonard might be a Labour Socialist, however, his party is no longer of that bent. He needs to move over to an independence movement.
Yes European country is always ready to open diplomatic with Scotland and other country , yes indented is better
independance independance independance now
Independence, even.
Lets get it done we're scots for Christ sake ... Scotland the brave ....Not Scotland the serfs
Serfs to the EU
@@Ken-ps9ux Absolute nonsense, equal members in the EU unlike we are in the UK
@@jimso771correct. Scotland is a cash cow to Westminster. They'd be knackered without Scotland. As for Scotlands currency,we would use a thing called fiat currency.
@@jimso771 Absolute nonsense equal members , you are funny. Ill never vote for Independence again
@@Ken-ps9uxAbsolutely not. The EU, despite the name, is a confederation. No constitute nation gives up it's sovereignty. Germany is a current example.
We must look after our children and old people that was drummed in to me when I was a child something you will not get from labour thay have been well found out what Kate said towards end rung a bell
How dare that pesky SNP government want democracy? The audacity
Ye we want our vote to have influence in the world, the audacity lol.
Why let these unionists talk utter pish ?
My sentiments exactly !!!!
It’s about time they learnt the difference between devolved and reserved
matters for a start, I found myself screaming every time someone mentioned “Drugs”
Credit where credit is due, Sarwar managed to read and deliver his Boss’s speech to perfection ( it was a lot of shit, but he stuck to the shit no matter what !!) he’ll go far, preferably straight down to London !!!!
Westminster Red Tory austerity following on from Westminster Blue Tory austerity from 2010 onwards.
Too many commentators confuse support for independence with support for the SNP. The movement is strong, is growing among our young people and offers hope over the despair on offer from the UK.
I agree, and yet they do not even look at their own arguments logically, ie. if they really want to get rid of the SNP, a party who they say has only one policy ~ independence, then they should support independence as by their own logic would remove the only reason for the SNP's existance and thus cancel the SNP's existance!
That would explain why the SNP lost so many seats in the last GE - but i fail to see how to explain the monumental rise in seats of westminster unionist parties and not see it as the death of independence.
@@Ooze-cl5tx Are you unaware of the depth of the desire to kick the Tories out throughout the UK which ended in more votes going to Labour, particularly, and the Lib Dems as UK wide parties.
Labour did not win the last election, rather the Tories comprehensively lost it. I know of not one poll that shows a proportionate drop in support for Independence.
@@ralphhathaway-coley5460 Have the english not banned all polls about Scotish independence?
Sarwar Naefuture & Dross Naejob. Tweedledum & Tweedledee.
Red and Blue Tories.
The unionists should remember that had all the "promises" that were made just before Indref 1 (breaking perdah) had been kept, then we might not have been having this discussion today.
A unionist "promise" isn't worth tuppence.
Why is Douglas Ross still there, he resigned did he not and also lost his seat.
He's waiting till those other Tory MSP's get round to picking a replacement, but knowing DRoss, he'll stretch things out for as long as possible.
It was his Westminster MP's position he lost, he's still got his MSP seat at Holyrood till 2026, by then as he'll no longer be the Scottish Tory leader
& might drop substantially down the MSP list positions. Wouldn't it be loverly if he ended out on his jacksy.
@@indy-biker-stevie I can hardly wait. 😀
Dross is a disgrace. He totally ignored what Kate Forbes asked him ,with the usual Tory ,non-answer.
The reason the police are under pressure is mostly because of NHS cuts to mental health, tell the truth Ross!
@@kevinkevin-ug9po money
I dont think D.Ross has heard about the Barnet formula.
INDEPENDENCE DAYS SINCE 1900
January 1, 1901:
Australia May 20, 1902:
Cuba November 3, 1903:
Panama June 7, 1905:
Norway September 26, 1907:
New Zealand May 31, 1910:
South Africa November 28, 1912:
Albania December 6, 1917:
Finland February 24, 1918:
Estonia November 11, 1918:
Poland December 1, 1918:
Iceland August 19, 1919:
Afghanistan December 6, 1921:
Ireland February 28, 1922:
Egypt October 29, 1923:
Turkey February 11, 1929:
The Vatican City September 23,
1932: Saudi Arabia October 3,
1932: Iraq November 22, 1943:
Lebanon August 15, 1945:
North Korea August 15, 1945:
South Korea August 17, 1945:
Indonesia September 2, 1945:
Vietnam April 17, 1946:
Syria May 25, 1946:
Jordan August 14, 1947:
Pakistan August 15,
1947: India January 4,
1948: Burma February 4,
1948: Sri Lanka May 14, 1948:
Israel July 19, 1949:
Laos August 8, 1949:
Bhutan December 24, 1951:
Libya November 9, 1953:
Cambodia January 1, 1956:
Sudan March 2, 1956:
Morocco March 20, 1956:
Tunisia March 6, 1957:
Ghana August 31, 1957:
Malaysia October 2, 1958:
Guinea January 1, 1960:
Cameroon April 4, 1960:
Senegal May 27, 1960:
Togo June 30, 1960:
Republic of the Congo July 1, 1960:
Somalia July 26, 1960:
Madagascar August 1, 1960:
Benin August 3, 1960:
Niger August 5, 1960:
Burkina Faso August 7, 1960:
Côte d'Ivoire August 11, 1960: Chad August 13, 1960:
Central African Republic August 15, 1960:
Democratic Republic of the Congo August 16, 1960:
Cyprus August 17, 1960:
Gabon September 22, 1960:
Mali October 1, 1960:
Nigeria November 28, 1960:
Mauritania April 27, 1961:
Sierra Leone June 19, 1961:
Kuwait January 1, 1962:
Samoa July 1, 1962: Burundi July 1, 1962:
Rwanda July 5, 1962:
Algeria August 6, 1962:
Jamaica August 31, 1962:
Trinidad and Tobago October 9, 1962:
Uganda December 12, 1963:
Kenya April 26, 1964:
Tanzania July 6, 1964:
Malawi September 21, 1964:
Malta October 24, 1964:
Zambia February 18, 1965:
The Gambia July 26, 1965:
The Maldives August 9, 1965:
Singapore May 26, 1966:
Guyana September 30, 1966:
Botswana October 4, 1966:
Lesotho November 30, 1966:
Barbados January 31, 1968:
Nauru March 12, 1968:
Mauritius September 6, 1968:
Swaziland October 12, 1968:
Equatorial Guinea June 4, 1970:
Tonga October 10, 1970: Fiji March 26, 1971:
Bangladesh August 15, 1971:
Bahrain September 3, 1971:
Qatar November 2, 1971:
The United Arab Emirates July 10, 1973:
The Bahamas September 6, 1968:
Swaziland October 12, 1968:
Equatorial Guinea June 4, 1970:
Tonga October 10, 1970:
Fiji March 26, 1971:
Bangladesh August 15, 1971:
Bahrain September 3, 1971:
Qatar November 2, 1971:
The United Arab Emirates July 10, 1973:
The Bahamas June 29, 1976:
Seychelles June 27, 1977:
Djibouti July 7, 1978:
The Solomon Islands October 1, 1978:
Tuvalu November 3, 1978:
Dominica February 22, 1979:
Saint Lucia July 12, 1979:
Kiribati October 27, 1979:
Saint Vincent and the Grenadines April 18, 1980:
Zimbabwe July 30, 1980:
Vanuatu January 11, 1981:
Antigua and Barbuda September 21, 1981:
Belize September 19, 1983:
Saint Kitts and Nevis January 1, 1984:
Brunei October 21, 1986:
The Marshall Islands November 3, 1986:
The Federated States of Micronesia March 11, 1990:
Lithuania March 21, 1990:
Namibia May 22, 1990:
Yemen April 9, 1991:
Georgia June 25, 1991:
Croatia June 25, 1991:
Slovenia August 21, 1991:
Kyrgyzstan August 24, 1991:
Russia August 25, 1991:
Belarus August 27, 1991:
Moldova August 30, 1991:
Azerbaijan September 1, 1991:
Uzbekistan September 6, 1991:
Latvia September 8, 1991:
Macedonia September 9, 1991:
Tajikistan September 21, 1991:
Armenia October 27, 1991:
Turkmenistan November 24, 1991:
Ukraine December 16, 1991:
Kazakhstan March 3, 1992:
Bosnia and Herzegovina January 1, 1993:
The Czech Republic January 1, 1993:
Slovakia May 24, 1993:
Eritrea October 1, 1994:
Palau May 20, 2002:
East Timor June 3, 2006:
Montenegro June 5, 2006:
Serbia February 17, 2008:
Kosovo July 9, 2011:
And that's just since 1900...
Well done Cuba. 😔we are the last colony of the British empire. We should be like the Palastinians.
We've been paying back £400 million per year until 2036 for Labour in Scotlands PFI deals, And we still build the most in any part of the UK... Freeze yer Granny Anas, sit down.
You fail to mention the £28 billion the tories took wind fall of oil companies and £28 billion labour wind fall of oil companies Scotland is getting a bum deal new oil fields have been found in north see are huge and unreported on I wonder why
Aye is my vote
Dross said he refused to talk Scotland down then promptly rhymed off a list of points to talk Scotland down. Undoubtedly most of his points completely inaccurate as is to be expected from a self serving lier
They were!
Lennox is right about land reform! Besides that "old labour" point I don't agree that Scotland doesn't want independence. We do!
Alba shaor a nis 🏴
Is Douglas Ross blind? 😂
Nope. Just thick as 💩
Swinny what a baw bag
The Holyrood parliament is not a real parliament it's a colonial branch office of the occupation. With no powers of its own.
❤ comment. So true!!!
Agree.
Why can't the wiffie with bleeched hair see that!!?
🌌🌎🏴💙🦅🙏
English quisling branch offices = Scotland's shame.
Aye must upset a lot most of the Redcoats at Culloden were Scots,Germans,Dutch and French Heuganot.
There were even some English there. If they were Black, some haters would be RACIST by their own reckoning.
Vidkun Quisling was a nationalist.
🏴💜🌿
That Lib dem guy Cole Hamilton wants Scotland to end
All we have to say to them is Nick cleg
If you support independence sign up to Salvo
I've signed but I know it won't happen in my lifetime😔 the kids come after won't be interested. The EU route will take years and years snp supporters claim. Scotland governed well under Alex Salmond and many friendly competition NS was actually his policies I'm reminded.
@@GracielaGordon-v2w support for independence in young Scots is around 60% these youngsters didn’t get the chance to vote in 2014
Maybe there would be less drug deaths in Scotland if the English Police forces across the North of England did their jobs and arrest the drug gangs that transport most of the drugs that land in Scotland, before they cross the border. It appears that the quantities of drugs are arriving in Scotland by design, getting a free pass by the English Cops and therefore the English Government..
Scotland needs Independence and proper border posts with England, if only to protect our people from drugs.
Half these wankers don’t even know that drugs are a reserved matter !!!!
Your ex first ministers family are drug importers to Scotland and I would put money on them not coming via England.
Feck of Swinney and try and sort out your snp mess first and i voted yes inn 14 get Scotland sorted
In five years to eight years pensions under labour may be scrapped a bit ironic
Question to Ash Reagan was hilarious 😅
Did she really just say we have the talent !!! this proves the snp are not only deluded but actually have real intellectual challenges !
What you think the crazy racist mobs over border voting for those clowns have more talent lol ?!! Cos that's your alternative if you vote any of the English parties.
UDI. What are the English going to to, invade?
And just to deal with possible ignorant comments, the military swear allegiance to the King.
The King of England and Scotland are one. But, the Crown of Scotland belongs to the people not the monarch. Charles is King of Scotland by sufference. Not default. And I'm fairly sure he knows that. He maybe daft but he ain't stupid.
Declaring UDI maybe complicated in the short term but it is not without precedent.
The Royal Regiment of Scotland would be in a better position to become the army of Scotland than the Army of the Irish Republic, or Irish Free State as it was. As, Scotland would still have a King. Just like Australia, Canada, New Zealand etc.
Scotland has resources equivalent to or better than Norway, a country with a comparable population.
The economics are robust and sustainable.
Only political fear reigns supreme.
I say, time to gird your loins and get on with it.
By the way. I am an AngloScot. Saor Alba.
Really the SNP couldn’t run a Bath, wasted millions on ferry’s and plastics bottle return scheme, council budgets have been cut to the bone, the NHS and police Scotland along with the fire service are all underfunded ( these are funded from the Scottish government) they’ve also spent millions in overseas jolly’s with nothing to show for it, they’ve also gone against the people of Scotland with things like the gender reform bill and hate crime laws which weren’t important
Regarding independence there’s no costing on how they can afford this , North Sea oil and gas is decreasing, how will they pay pensioners as this is paid from the tax payers of today
Right, and the wonderful Westminster tories were so good at financially managing PEP supplies costing the UK billions, straight into their own and their mates pockets, The Rwanda immigrant flights, and all they money the paid to Rwanda to make them agree to take them, the tories offering peerages to anyone who donates more than £3m to the tory party scandal, all the second job and expenses scandals etc etc. Not to mention that the rest of UK councils are at least as badly financed if not actually going bankrupt.
Actually all the costings for Scotland's funding were independently audited and published during the last indy ref. but I doubt you bothered to look at that.
As for paying pensioners that is a UK wide problem which has been tackled ineffectually since Maggie's time and since resulting in the raising of pension age and reduction of pensions paid, see the scrapping of the AC (additional Component) the earnings related addition to the basic UK state pension in 2002 and the continual rise in the pension age .......... by that comparison if the SNP can't run a bath, Westminster does not even know what a bath is, never mind run one!
Oh yes the gender reform bill was actually a Green Party policy which was part of the coalition agreement, and was only moved in Holywood after years of public consultations, when most detractors did not really bother stating their concerns then.
@@ralphhathaway-coley5460 Thank you for so exactly stating the case! Well done!
@@WVislandia Thanks! Alba shaor a nis.
@WVislandia He basically said its OK for the Scottish government to be shite, because the Westminster government is shite. What happened to building a better and fairer Scotland. Do you feed and clothe the foke down the road or do you look after your own first. It's all about priorities. The Scottish government prioritise looking good away above doing good. As for things like gender recognition, ask yourself why were queers called queers?. Maybe the education system and health care services are more fucked than you realise.
Both snp & English Parties couldn't do what you claim then, so we need a fresh approach with Scotland's interests at the heart, with the full powers ok
Hollyrood doesn't have it's own powers let that sink in so your suggestions are welcomed.
Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Free scotland from the Irish colonisers
Irish colonisers?? I missed that class in school when did that happen!
@StephenCoogan-by1mu scotland, named after Scotti, irish invaders snd colonisers
@StephenCoogan-by1mu But more latterly the influx of Irish immigrants that have taken over , Free Scotland from the Irish
@@lynxonyx-w3j to be honest I was hoping for a date or some reference point ? Maybe even when you gained your independence from the Irish something a little more tangible instead of stutter
@StephenCoogan-by1mu how many of Irish decent live in Scotland?
A date? The Irish have been coming over in droves for hundreds of years.
I guess you're an snp supporter with Irish ancestry who is blinkered to the truth ?
You don't think there has been mass I.migrarion by the Irish. Scotlands biggest club celtic is Irish ffs
Bring back Salmond for final push a real politician he will run circles around this lot and put fear in to opposition
Westminster TO INTERNATIONAL COURT! LEGALLITY. THE TRUTH OF GOVES MISUSED COVID MONEY. STILL WAITING FOR THE POLLING RESULT!! SOME NONSENSE 50/50%. IS THIS WHY HE IS SO QUIET, THE TORIES PAID BIG MONEY TO KEEP IT QUIET!!
Certainly in a supporting role but not as leader. Let him got to westminster where he has skill.
@@32swordy32 i believe none of our politicians should be down there its doing no good falling on deaf ears comes to mind
He would
...but would also be a plonker on signing that document with Cameron and fluffing it at debate night. Still I put faith in his abilities to rock the boat. The only boat NS rocked was the people's.
Annie Wells to fill the shelves at Tesco
🤣🤣🤣
Scottish people replaced by Sheep , the rest became sheep
The SNP didn’t fail on ferries they give jobs to our on boys forgetting the ship yards are full of unions and labour men
The whole Scottish economy should be run by union men.
@@therealrobertbirchall you fail to look past your nose BROTHER Starmer is in power two minutes look what he has done BROTHER now back to work BROTHER
Unfortunate the media had more influence over the details which help give clarity to the people lack of understanding .
@@GracielaGordon-v2w 👍
With Swinney and the dull SNP in charge, Scotland hasn't got a chance. Wake me up when this lot is gone, cause I'm not listening to more of their drivel.
You should listen and educate yourself. When independent the people of Scotland will choose the government. It might be a completely newly formed party, who knows!
@@caprcailhahaha sure buddy! I don’t think we’ll have a choice either way you genius snp is just as corrupt as London
Their independence scheme was always a power grab then they pretend like they actually care I don’t know why anyone would put up with them
@@caprcaildoesn’t make sense why would the noble(and not at all power hungry) snp allow themselves to be voted out after independence. At least that’s what we’d do if our country wasn’t so stupid
OMG! has Swinney got a double at Holrood? i.e. the specy baldie boy behind him.
Kevin Stewart for First Minister