Unless you have been a victim of a narcissist, you may not understand the pain they inflict on someone. It's unexplainable and one can loose their mind or life as you try to please and forgive them. There's something inhuman about them. Very very wicked in a subtle way. That's why they are so complicated to understand and also for one to realise exactly what they are doing to you. It's a slow death...
I dated a narcissist on and off for a year. .he was extremely good looking and beyond charismatic. .he had a pattern of sabotage I could set my clock to. . I realized eventually that I could and would never win with him. .we would never have the great love I desired or he promised. .I have a hard time moving on because I greatly desired him and because of how much he f'd with my head. .thanks for all your videos. .they've helped immensely
@@emilyl.771 Hi and thanks for your note.. I'm obviously much better and have long ago gotten over the guy.. I do occasionally think about him.. Meaning he pops in my mind now and then.. But i don't obsess and honestly realize what a waste of time he was..and glad i didn't waste any more than a year.. Life is too precious.. And fragile to waste it.. Please take the advice given to anyone in a narcissistic relationship and leave..you won't regret it..in fact in time you will be happy you did..good luck..you deserve better
It's so mind boggling how a narcissist can shame his wife for her faults, yet minimize her improvements, refuse to support her when she tries making changes, and stifle any attempts to improve... All to prove his theory that there must be something wrong with her for being with him!
Jamie Ritchey they were probably his projected shortcomings to begin with and not hers. It’s NEVER enough. The best thing a victim can to protect his/her health and mental well being is run!
Wow, you just perfectly surmised my marriage... Now just to set (and reset) the appropriate boundaries for co-parenting and living in a foreign country (his country)... gah!
He is talking truth....I met my NPD when I was 16 .... perfect age to mould the protégée... then 1 day the protégée starts looking on the internet for answers....NPD NPD NPD ..... the protégée realises I’m not crazy this “fucker” has been fucking with my head for 37 years ..... silent treatment .... fucking hell .... I WOKE THE FUCK UP QUICK...... Freedom is close .... yes modified altered the whole fucking thing.... learning to walk ..... now close to running .... it’s close.... I can almost taste it. ... I refused.... argued..... GO NO CONTACT ....... PROTÉGÉE HAS WOKEN UP GO FUCK YOURSELF NPD ..... LOL I DO THAT SHIT MIRRORING SHIT..... FUCKS HIM UP..... BE GONE FUCKER.... no redirection no other victim to redirect tooooooo ..... praise the lord Amen survivors
They do it both ways... mum used to shame me at home for some things and then when she has friends around she would make those things into bragging things... she overdoes the pain and the admiration.. never can just be on a even level about things....
Here's how I deal with narcissists. I try to avoid them, and if I realize that I am involved with one, I immediately try to isolate them and move them out of my own circle. They are not worth bothering with. You can't fix them and you can't win with them. The problem is realizing when you are dealing with one. Sam has helped me to identify a narcissist in my life, who has been causing problems. That is the first step, and the most important one. Thank you, Sam! Unfortunately, this narcissist is reaching out to harass my household, but I just have to deal with that on it's own level. I am steadfast and refuse to make contact, again.
The problem with narcissists is that they so often have enablers around them. People with low self esteem who feed their narcissistic tendencies, often mistaking it for confidence. This just enhances the narcissists ego, and amplifies their abusive and negative behaviour. This is my experience.
@@cm-yu6gu I agree. However, in my case the narc was a parent, so I didn't really have any control or power to change their behaviour towards me until I grew up unfortunately. But in the adult world narcs are attracted to people with low self esteem so they can initially pose as their saviour. It goes down hill from there😕
Thanks for the comment and the entire thread has described my husband. I think he's a terrible coward for not leaving to go live as he chooses. I'd respect him more if he did. I will not leave for a ton of reasons and at one point I suggested that he buy a condo a couple blocks away and leave me alone to raise our children in peace. I have never forced a man to stay in a relationship with me as I believe that a relationship is an all volunteer program. I have learned that no matter how I act to him he will continue to be a narcissistic abuser.
+Adidas Love Thank you! Very much appreciated. I believe, like with anything, once you learn more about something like this you become better equipped to deal with it.
Wow Sam this is exactly what the narcissist in my life does, I had a feeling he does it to keep control of everything about the relationship and that is exactly what you said. He wants to be in control of the end of the relationship but at the end it has to be my fault and my decision to walk away. He never trusts me, thinks the worst of me which no one else who knows me would ever think, that I am untrustworthy, a liar, crazy, lazy, etc, etc just to not have to think that he is losing a good person, to justify in his head all the name calling, the putdowns and to not get attached to someone he already decided was going to leave him eventually and who is faking loving him and just a fraud in his mind. He is close to not talking to me because I do not abide to the abuse nor his "behave this way or I won't show you love, affection and attention" way of trying to train me, and we end up having constant war fare and fighting every day. I spent so many days trying to actually understand what the hell was going on and if it was me. I know I am not crazy and what he does is not normal nor right for anyone.
Vaknin is always on point. After fifteen years of being married and coexisting with a rabid sociopathic, narcissist--every one of these tactics are golden. I've just left him three months ago and my life is already improving w/no contact being my first step toward healing. Although, he has the children there is nothing I can do to save them right now until I physically, emotionally/mentally and economically stronger. Thanks Vaknin as your advice is always precise!
@@themetamorphosisofgipsy my therapist made me to understand that I needed to heal before I could help my children. In my case they were 12 13 9 and I couldnt talk them into leaving...he had us all very comfortable materially. He only abused me...then would make me look like I was the abuser in their eyes. Mine is a long story...but the divorce though the court granted me custody all my insides told me from experience that if I did take them from him he would kill us all. I felt caught between a rock n a bolder as they say. So I ask the court for joint physical custody which I knew he would never comply with and he never did. The children one by one ended leaving him too and are safe productive in sociaty and thriving now in good relationships because during their adolesant yrs I was there and took time to instruct them in spite of our circumstances. The divorce did tear us all apart except for him...he had another woman already living in our home during the divorce...and eventually married her with 5 children 3yrs later. One reason I am here listening to this video is because after 20 yrs now PTSD has set in. And Im exausted not being able to heal and GET A LIFE! I dont blame the other momma for not responding to your question...only someone who has been through this AND who stayed FOR too LONG a TIME because of the children could understand. Im glad she has help here...I had none! The therapist only help to calm me for that moment...she said she wasnt qualified after hearing my story. And didnt kbow anyone else who could except for god. I ended up hating god for a long time afterwards...prayers didnt help. Church ppl never understood...and saying theyd pray for me felt more like a slap.
was married to a narcissistic husband and i challenged him and did the counter-attack ...that is we stayed together for 23 yrs until his death by suicide because i was finally so tired of him and his ways .. still loved him but i knew I had to be the one to breakaway ... i was truly his backbone and at the end i was the stronger one to be able to leave him and he could not take it and killed himself... could not take the abandonment ... narcissistic people are really the weak ones ... i am proof .. he is dead and after 5 yrs i am still alive
You stayed all that time, finally left him and he got desperate and after all you are saying that he was weak and you survived him. That doesnt sound really fair to me
How do we know who is the narcissist? It seems like that word is being used for anyone we don't like or have problems with? For someone to kill themselves they have to be in horrific pain and desperation, yet some of you show no empathy for their suffering and struggle. It makes me wonder if you are the saints you seem to think you are...
Testing and probing by a narc in abusing his loved one is NOT A JOKE !!!!! One can imagine how BAD a REAL ABUSE could be !!!!!!! For no rhyme or reason during our honeymoon.....he got very angry at me on whatever he was thinking in his own mind silently at the corner of the room !!! Suddenly with no warning....he jumped onto the bed ....like a commando....held my neck and twisted it till a sound clicked in my neck !!! Threw me on a pillow and left me there motionless for an hour !!! He left the room !!! I thought my life was over !!! Thks to GOD..I dare not move for 30 mins...motionless...but every second forward means eternity !!!! I knew if I could just move my fingers very slowly...I could access my situation and how extensive the damage he might had done to me !!! As each second ticked by...I could moved my fingers..then my.hands...arms...shoulders...then neck...slowly lifting up my neck with my hands slowly to prevent further injury if any !!!! Thank God !!!! My neck was alright and that click sound might be the extreme pressure he held onto me ......thank GOD he threw me onto a pillow and he left !!! I managed to get out of the hotel to place a police report on him !!!! WAS THAT TESTING TO SEE HOW I WOULD RESPOND TO WHATEVER HIS SICKO MIND WAS THINKING AT THAT MOMENT OF ANGER ????? Certainly.....NO WAY....anyone in her right mind would NOT like to stick around with him !!!! That is a real psycho narc !!!!!! We finally DIVORCED !!!!!!
So sorry to hear he did that to you! Good thing you divorced him. Unfortunately most people who deal with narcs are no longer in their right mind. The narc sees to it. That's why so many people wind up being trapped with a narc. The narc puts them in a place where they can't escape so easily and they don't function the same as they did before they met them. They assault your mind, among other things.
I’m disappointed that Sam didn’t answer your question, but I’m extremely happy that you made the smart move to file a police report and divorce Your partner. That is beyond scary and more people need to be more secure to walk away at the first sign of abuse. Be encouraged and know that you are stronger than you know! Keep sharing your story to help others learn and gain that strength and wisdom to recognize red flags and danger.
Brilliant. I learned something useful today. Now I understand why my narcissist best friend and I are always arguing and in conflict. We are no longer able to communicate peacefully. Thank you for explaining this!
My abuser is my father and my stepmom uses his last "coping style" and scapegoats me to deflect his abuse. So I have two people abusing me, both of whom are my parent figures. Abusers will have hell to pay on the Day of Judgement.
The moment you understand this mf game you move on Never look back It was never love it was an exchange- transaction , don’t be a doormat. RUN Apply NC . Let this avatar disappear
i did the mirroring ...he could never make me lose my self ... i was a challenge to him and he liked that... if i would have been submissive to him ... he would have left me ... i was a challenge to him and he liked it ..kept him amused until i said the game is over ... and he could not take it....
Same here! I saw through him and let him know his true self. I am independent, friendly and a caring people person and he hated that. Now, his own family knows his true colors. They knew but didn't know about Narcissisim. They were aware of his past life and his no Empathy. They knew he felt no Remorse. He's been running all his life. Miserable and unhappy. Sad 😢 I've been so helpful but I Know is almost impossible for my husband to change. He's an empty Shell with no Empathy. He'd favorite is giving me the Silent Treatment. Thank you for sharing.🌴
Yes but when you call them on their abuse and reflect that back to them then they get psychotic. It's a never ending cycle of rage being enacted through emotional, psychological, mental projection and abuse.
Having an "ah, ha" moment... I've always rebelled against the behavior modification this sort of abuse is attempting to motivate... It's like I'm saying, "You want me to change this? Ask me nicely. I'm not changing because you "beat" it into me." During the first half of my marriage, I tried to be submissive, but he was still unsatisfied. I realized he abuses me to test his skewed theories...to prove his unchanging perception of me, regardless of reality. How can you compromise with someone who lives outside reality? It's not possible. Lately, I've become more resistant and self assured. While there are less incidents, there is always conflict just under the surface. He sees my independence and confidence as a sign that our marriage is falling apart. He drowns himself in self pity, withdrawing, and sulking about his failures... That is, until I give him more fuel for his fire.
YOU ARE BRILLIANT!!!! Every single word you said is exactly what happened to me!!!! It feels as if you are talking about my ex. I had no idea these evil people existed and for anyone looking at this video while in a relationship with someone you think might be one, run as fast and as far as you can. They are dangerous and life ruiners!!
I agree completely with this. Persons with NPD have a great deal of difficulty bonding due to their lack of empathy. So they are continually suffering from abandonment anxiety and therefore become abusive simply because they do not 'get it' so. People in relationships with people with NPD, work on your inner feelings, keep yourself calm and explain to the n how exactly you are feeling. Don't just react and get aggressive, an n is human too. Use eye contact, redirection, just like you would with an autistic child. Believe it or not, some NPD's do care and they will state this. They just don't know how to express it. So codependants, work on your 'trauma bonds' experiences please! Don't forget to count to 10 as well........
This is really interesting. I remember vividly the arguments that I used to have with my ex narc. The coping styles I seem to have used was counter dependent with a little bit of mirroring and collusion mixed in, depending on how the argument played out. But it didn't seem to minimize abuse much. I think narcs are so highly intelligent that they will find ways to abuse in spite of coping techniques. He learned quickly how to overcome the coping techniques to dish out the full abuse. I feel as though I trained him to be a better abuser with my "coping" techniques.
It is so hard because they cannot see it. Constant drama, miserableness never worth it. No discussions because the Narcissist is always right. I agree with the lab tests. Abusive then blames the partner, states it is spiritual to only work on your own stuff. Spiritual narcissism are the worse, they use spirituality to abuse even more.
Awesome Sam. Thanks heaps. I have a friend who is really good at dealing with abusers. He is always positive and exaggerates what the abuser says and shows that he hasnt let it riffle him at all. He basically mirrors the absurdity of the comment. He has really good self esteem but even those with low self esteem will increase it using this technique on abusers.
They are great, and when you the chance read the book too. I have realized that this type of personality disorder is an epidemic level. It helped me identify the gal that I was daiting for 4 years as a Cover Narcissist. The cycles of abuse that she played on me was just mind and soul numbing. I just can not imagine what really is going on inside their soul that they have to resort to such abusive acts. One thing is for sure, they have been victimized themselves. They are the victims that are victimizing other people that come in contact with them. Just my opinion.
I'm sure that it is pure hell being in any type relationship with a narcissist, but nothing can compare to the hell of a narcissistic mother. A person would have to live it to even begin to understand. - It can take a lifetime to heal the damage. Some people have to break all contact with the N mother just to psychologically survive.
Narcissistic and psychopathic parents and their children - click on the links: groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/narcissisticabuse/conversations/messages/4727
yes you are right, It is a special kind of hell. I cut contact a year ago and I am still a long way off recovering from it, the worst thing with a narcissist mother is they feel they are entitled to their children and grandchildren so the abuse continues well after breaking contact. They really like to strike when you least expect it so they can catch you in a weak moment, great source of supply for them. And despite it all they can still manage to make US feel guilty!! That's one of the things I struggle with the most, I am 1000% better psychologically for being no contact but the guilt for doing it is difficult to deal with.
Yes it's not true guilt. they 'agree to tow tow the line' so to speak' Only and is a form of a psychological power control. Surely there can not be any satisfaction there for either parties and would only be for financial security reasons'
I remember the umpteenth time my narc ex threatened to leave me over something petty, I finally said calmly "OK, you're right. Maybe it is better if we part ways now. You have a good idea." The look on his face was priceless. His face dropped because I called his bluff. He immediately began to backtrack and ran away from that subject. He still didn't improve the abuse but he did stop threatening to leave after that. He would try to threaten but the words wouldn't come out just stuttering.
My Adult Daughter is in denial with her verbal abuse regarding me, even though I am constantly trying to give her emotional support, she is never at fault. Can't believe she is doing this again.
This is exactly what happened to this former friend that kept abusing me. He kept blackmailing and threatening me and my friends even though he claimed he couldn't even think of the idea of losing me. Just couldn't get it through his head that all the abuse and threats was precisely what was pushing people to walk away from him. Eventually he said he wanted me to kill myself or to ruin everything i love just so i could "feel" what he felt at the thought of not having company.
+loveisallthereis 11 You must stay calm and as Sam described, use the words directed at you in a redirected way. This came to a crescendo in my own relationship as I had my yearly, being told "our marriage should end" and instead of being devestated and upset, as had been 10yrs before ,I simply said you are right the marriage should end! He went into a flat spin and didnt know what to do!
My narc hates his mother and I have endured day long rants and raves about her. I witnessed some of the abuse he experienced as a teen. He was the scapegoat in his family. The only time he and his mother enjoy each others company is when they find someone else to bash together and it is aweful and sick!!
It is also a fear of intimacy and voulnerability - that threats their inner wounded child to emerge. the sexual intimacy causes possibility of attachment to someone, attaching means being dependant on someone, as they are superior to everyone they don't depend on anyone, they are supposed to be self sufficient. So abuse is a form of protecting the fragile self and keeping other people out, by abusing them (actually they protect theselves and others - they want and need to be alone in their world) If abused people stay they are devaluated in the eyes of a narcissist, people narc. cannot admire and by staying victims actually agree with the abuse. No talking sense into a narcissist and telling them you don't appreciate their behaviour will do. You have to walk away demonstrate some sort of boundaries. But whan one does leave it sure taps into the abandonment anxiety - as to I know he/she wold leave me, at the same instance though it goes into - I don't need them anyway, I am so superior.
Projection and Projective Identification - Abuser in Denial groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/narcissisticabuse/conversations/messages/5002 Approach-Avoidance Repetition Complex and Fear of Intimacy groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/narcissisticabuse/conversations/messages/5000
My ex is in prison and has literally pushed everyone away. He use to tell me that he needed me... He would cause arguments because i wouldn't send drugs for him to sell in prison. He would say that i wanted him to come home broke and to live off me.. I see why we would argue so much. I'm so happy i left.
I just had to download this! Sooo good. I instinctively used insults to make my ex go no contact with me. With a casual date I use mirroring mixed with gas lighting. With suspect acquaintances/frenemies I cartoon their snarky comments..or play phone games with them.
I am so glad I have found you. You are the answer to my prayers n I can't thank you enough for helping me to understand what I have gone through with someone who claimed to love me but always abused me like my father did to me n now I can't trust any man again. That pain was to hard for me to handle. Once again thank you for giving me the peace I have been wanting for all of my life
Well communicated. What is described is common sense failure- amongst other disorders a cognitive one. Human relationships would have been much better if people knew that the significant other cannot be made to chose all the time between their own good and somebody else's good. Everything is competitive in the mind of a narcissist. I do not understand the coping styles- they do exist but for what purpose? To cheat about the presence of a relationship that does not exist? Why does someone with an abusive relationship would want to keep it (there is no true relationship- therefore he does not lose anything if he breaks up)?It is also good to understand the narcissist but to the majority of the population not very useful. The main subject is for people being abused to be taught to leave the relationship and not cope with it.
Every point u mentioned..is nothing but the truth!! Since I believe in integrity and transparency... I always fought back verbally (even publicly) when I was abused... there used to be massive arguements, bitter exchanges and name calling (the last one only from my end). The ex narc behaved hardly aggressive while in public during arguements... But behind closed doors he would spew venom, cusses. And then used to go no contact for few days. When I started calling out his actions in public more frequently... he went 'no contact' almost permanently. He hasn't tried making any contacts since 1 year now. Though I still get to know from his frnds that he abuses me at my back... Has launched smearing campaign (although he is now in a relationship with a married woman with kids)... But he still doesn't miss any opportunity to defame me. So I don't think the coping style no. 2 - resisting or criticising the abuser helps in minimizing the abuse. It just results in an early discard by the narc and going 'no contact' forever (although still actively criticising the victim in his social circle). So basically this one is the most effective method to make the coward narc run fast for his life!
Sometimes I didn’t like where I ended up while defending myself and desperately wanting to spark some awareness of how I felt. Just some form of acknowledgement. It’s clear now he very much enjoyed orchestrating my escalation to earthshaking chaos. There’s only one force capable of such deeds. It is that communication which I now believe became my addiction. I want to defeat mercilessly yet would only serve to prove my “craziness”. Perhaps I should feel empowered and validated knowing the devil is trying so hard to destroy me❤️🙏🏽💪🏼😎
This is so sad but very true. My ex narc would always push his abuse to the next level. Take level 1-2 and he would push it to level 3&4....oh you can take that...well let’s try level 5-6. And he always said I was not submissive enough to him....his abuse was to test my submissiveness. I refused to accept the abuse which did lead to constant conflict and hence my discard. I do wonder if this is the final discard or if he will try to return at some point. I think he knows I know who he really is and that I am no longer susceptible to his abuse....maybe this is the end ....
Hello Sam Vaknin, first off, thank you very much for you're great effort and attention to detail in creating a tremendous pool of information regarding narcissism, its multi-faceted inner workings and ramifications. Concerning this video and topic I would like to propose to you a last, but none the least motive for the abuse expressed by a narcissist. One which may point to their very damaged, yet still existent true self. And that would be for the purpose of true intimacy. Given the nature and quality of the narcissist own self narrative and super ego, I feel that a narcissist cannot feel confidently intimate or kinship with people who are truly confident, truly happy or truly at peace with themselves. These kind of people will always feel alien to a narcissist and ultimately make them feel uncomfortable in one way or another. What I am proposing here is that by devaluing, humiliating, pointing out and bringing another person into their own very similar inner reality of true self-denial , self-rejection and self-destruction, a narcissist can enhance their feelings of trust and intimacy with their target and minimize any sense of being at odds, different or alienated with and from them. Misery likes company basically. Again, thank you Mr. Sam Vaknin. Your work I believe is of great interest and help in elucidating and addressing a truly great problem in our world.
The Covert, vulnerable female narcissists should seek therapy for PTSD. They have been abused in every passible way during their childhood into their adult life by their abusive parents. I dated one for 5 years and her mother is the narcissist and her dad is the alcoholic enabler that assaulted and abused her behind the closed doors. Her brother hung himself when he was just a child which I find it to be very suspicious.
The dynamics presented here are all accurate. One thing to add: some narcissists hide these feelings. ie. They very rarely... act them out. When provoked in the extreme...then, and only then.. this behavior will come out. So, sometimes, you will never know ( what's inside of them) .. or will, suddenly.. after years of knowing them.
I know exactly what you have experienced or close to it. Hard to identify it, specially when I was in the relationship with her. The emotions are just one sided and the false thought in my head was telling me that she understand certain things when in a relationship that help keep it together, but how wrong I was. She is void of compassion or understanding , I was sensing it but I could not understand how a person can be void of such basic feelings. Zero empathy toward others or me. sex was all that she could offer, I asked her to buy me a watch with my own money that she owed me , she bought me an iPod. I could not understand why. But I do now. I have so many examples that I can share about this experience, I told her that she is my CNARC because she is my discovery.
Narcissist promotes abuse, when I was being attacked I retaliated and verbally abused her as she did me. It was like a vicious cycle, she tried to control and when I challenged her she would go into narcissistic rage. Destroying my belonging, become physically abusive then call the police on me as if I had done anything to her. I have identified her as Cover Narcissist born to a co dependent abusive father and a narcissistic mother. She most likely is the golden child and her bother committed suicide at an early age of 10-12, when she was only 7-8, I am not sure about the exact age. The parents came from Serbia and moved to Canada but the interesting part was even though she was born in Canada she thought of herself as a superior race, as a Serbian. Also I assume that her brother was the scapegoat. It is very hard to communicate with persons like her, she never shared her thought process as to how she came to certain conclusions specially when it also included me. It was as if she was told to do it and she was obeying. She was never wrong, never apologized for her mistakes or wrong doings. The next day she would act as if nothing has happened and everything is just fine as long as I did not mention anything about the night before, that was like walking on the eggshells. Never cared to have a constructive discussion about the issues. No depth in her thinking. I also have to say she never understood what it meant to be in another person's shoes. I have never met any one with these type of personality deficiencies until I came across your blog and have read your book just to be able to explain my own experiences with this person. How she would used to discredit me to gain herself credit , all thee childish games that just made no sense what so ever. I was questioning why she even bothers to get into a relationship with that type of personality and then I found out why, because of her narcissistic needs. that is how they operate.
Stunned to hear phrases like you always don't follow me you are destroying our relationship etc. Things I have been hearing for years when I didn't want to go along with stuff he wanted. I wish I knew the caricature style but I was so worn out and powerless that not sure if could have been able to impliment it. I was not aware of what was happening but felt responsible for our relationship and his bad feelings. Towards the end of our 27 year he started mirroring my exact words. I couldn't believe it. He was telling me exactly the same phrase I used 1 min ago. I started thinking I was getting crazy and loosing my mind. Tarrible state. At one of our last conversations I secretly taped it with enormous fear to just check my own sanity. After a while I fled in terror as he was becoming scary. He had upped his moves they were physical while for years were under the radar and constant that I couldn't really put my finger on it. Thanks for that video
There is no way my husband will trust me. I have saved his life 5 times and worked so hard. He does extinguish all the joy that i should have. He never follows through with his end of agreements and i always do what i say. This has gone on for 25 years. I am finally divorcing him because i have become bitter, all i can do is criticize him now. I dont want to be this way to anyone, but i am that way now.
"A brutal sense of humor". I love how you word that. it describes my mom to a tee. She has undiagnosed Borderline Personality Disorder or NPD. She's got all the earmarks.
I believe, I am married to a narcissist. I am getting out now, thank God! Sam, I wanted to ask, have you or can you do a video about when a narcissist tests you? My soon to be ex husband, every year, for 7 years right around spring time, would go into this phase of saying he thought he might want a divorce. I would get quite shaken up, of course, we have 5 children. I would try to do everything I could to "make him happy" Until I realized, he was going to do this every year, without feeling bad, without being sorry for my pain etc. I met a women who went through the same thing. she said her ex husband did this to her every fall. What is this all about? Do you have any input on this? It would be appreciated it you do. I tried to tell him how painful this is and he just denied doing this to me and denied his emotional distance for years at a time, then he would pull this I think I might want a divorce, when I decided to just be happy and move on with my life, despite his unhappiness. The 7th year of this, I had had enough of being afraid to loose my family and decided to go with as little contact as possible and told him not to call me, text me etc. He didn't like this one bit! But, I stuck to my guns. My chronic migraines disappeared within 2 weeks! This, 'I think I want a divorce' was so painful, I finally caught on, and now I am on the road to being healthy.
Holly-Ann Guy My husband did this for a few years. It will always come after Christmas. At Christmas he was at his best but after that he behaved as if he were a demon. Threatening to leave, asking for a divorce and being abusive. When i agreed and told him i wanted a divorce too it got worse.
But if the abused becomes wise the narc needs to find others to play with. Suppose everyone becomes wise the narc then has no place to run and must confront reality.
My ex husband pushed his kids away and his family, friends and work colleagues, I was the only one left. He turned to drugs and online gaming until I left him. Now he's moved to Portugal ( we're English) to start a new cycle with fresh new toys. They can't see what they're doing and they never change...ever. X
I really wish that would happen, that’s what they deserve. But they are too good at the game, and if they as charming/good looking as mine was, there’s a never ending supply of lonely women looking for love :(
My abusive psychopathic Npd ex husband creates constant conflict and chaos and sabotages all of the peace happiness and all goodness for my children and I. He is the corrupt dark evil cloud that has ruined everything in our lives
***** Anger and sadness are emotions not examples of empathy. Empathy is being able to recognise these emotions in others. Narcissists do become sad and angry - they are very divorced from other people because of their lack of empathy. Its a very difficult state to be in and can often swing between the two emotions when they are really suffering. They can be extra sensitive - and I agree, only to try and get what they need - so self-sensitive. Some a really great at kicking people when they are down too - nice. So finally seeing that they have controlled and broken someone and using mimic negative empathy, deal the final blow. All to do with existential angst due to the empathy lack I'm afraid.
All victims listen closely to this video. This is us to a t. I brought about every single abandonment and turned it around on them. I pushed and pushed to bring up her concerns. If she dare questioned me about ,this no matter how loving, I would rage abusively at her leaving her to wonder "what just happened". If she tried to get a word in I would rage louder and accuse her of abusing me. I'm sick and twisted it's her fault for always letting me back "in".
David Flynn Thamks for admitting the truth. That is exactly what my husband did to me over and over. And every time it happened I was not prepared for it. Because I dont think that way I was not prepared for it. Im learning.
The displacement mechanism is my friend's daughter and her husband to a T. She always diverts his rage onto another person whom they then attack together.
Oh goodness! I have been “mirroring “ and had no idea it was a thing. He’d either get mad and walk away or try and become the victim . Dang I don’t understand how it is so clear now.
Co-dependent mother def. teamed up with NPD father to scapegoat us children, even picking up his own abuse styles like demeaning and condescending sarcasm. It allowed them to have a semblance of complicity, good laughs at our expense, and it helped her deflate the abuse she would otherwise have to endure. Even when we were physically abused by the NPD, she wouldn't step in to interfere and save us, she'd finish to watch and then ask us to apologize to him because of whatever we did to provoke his wrath. It was her coping mechanism which she thought saved her, but it granted us two abusers instead of one. What's more interesting is that after I myself got married to another narc, I found myself joining my ex-husband in blaming, undermining, criticizing "the other", all the freaking time. It was us against the world. And it got to a point where I started being uncomfortable with it, and tried to bring nuance to his judgmental sweeping statements, probably because I got a taste thanks to him of what it was like to be the object of one of them. I'm glad it's over, because I couldn't imagine myself raising children with that man. It wasn't until I left him the second and last time that I found out about NPD, both pertaining to him and to my dad. A whole world of clarity and sanity unraveled before my eyes. I will never be grateful enough. Alhamoudlillah, Alhamoudlillah...
What about calling him out on what he is doing as scoping mechanism? Even though knowing it landed nowhere with him... he has no self reflection, but it did help me a lot to stay in reality, and eventually leave him. I kept saying out loud when he'd belittle me, used silent treatments, was bullying me.. was grandiose or histrionic.
I feel stuck. So hurt and he left almost a year ago. Our divorce was final a month ago but I can’t seem to shake the breakup. I just can’t believe this happened. I’m trying to move on but idk how to let it go.
this actually makes me sad. He was so terrified of me leaving him, and in the end he was the one who left bc I would call him out on his behaviour. I understood why he did things and why he was always testing and accusing me. I never left his side, never. I think he scared himself the last time and that's why he discarded me. He couldn't go back after that. yet even that I wouldn't hold over his head bc I totally understood why he did it. Sam, do you think a narc runs faster bc he sees the SO loves him unconditionally?
Narcissists, Love and Healing samvak.tripod.com/narcissistlovehealing.html I Love to be Hated - The Masochistic Narcissist samvak.tripod.com/narcissistmasochist.html
I thought I was one for awhile. Is this common when you're in a relationship with one. Just getting out of a relationship with one(I think). She stopped loving me after one BIG mistake(not cheating) and started dating almost immediately. My family hated her.
Unless you have been a victim of a narcissist, you may not understand the pain they inflict on someone. It's unexplainable and one can loose their mind or life as you try to please and forgive them. There's something inhuman about them. Very very wicked in a subtle way. That's why they are so complicated to understand and also for one to realise exactly what they are doing to you. It's a slow death...
I dated a narcissist on and off for a year. .he was extremely good looking and beyond charismatic. .he had a pattern of sabotage I could set my clock to. . I realized eventually that I could and would never win with him. .we would never have the great love I desired or he promised. .I have a hard time moving on because I greatly desired him and because of how much he f'd with my head. .thanks for all your videos. .they've helped immensely
But after all of that, RUN AWAY, RUN FAR, RUN FAST
@@emilyl.771 Hi and thanks for your note.. I'm obviously much better and have long ago gotten over the guy.. I do occasionally think about him.. Meaning he pops in my mind now and then.. But i don't obsess and honestly realize what a waste of time he was..and glad i didn't waste any more than a year.. Life is too precious.. And fragile to waste it.. Please take the advice given to anyone in a narcissistic relationship and leave..you won't regret it..in fact in time you will be happy you did..good luck..you deserve better
@@bachopinbee5991 i did❗ 👍😉🌺
@@puchatek41 SL lives in Woodstock NY
It's so mind boggling how a narcissist can shame his wife for her faults, yet minimize her improvements, refuse to support her when she tries making changes, and stifle any attempts to improve... All to prove his theory that there must be something wrong with her for being with him!
Jamie Ritchey they were probably his projected shortcomings to begin with and not hers. It’s NEVER enough. The best thing a victim can to protect his/her health and mental well being is run!
I once met a narc women and its the same way
Wow, you just perfectly surmised my marriage... Now just to set (and reset) the appropriate boundaries for co-parenting and living in a foreign country (his country)... gah!
He is talking truth....I met my NPD when I was 16 .... perfect age to mould the protégée... then 1 day the protégée starts looking on the internet for answers....NPD NPD NPD ..... the protégée realises I’m not crazy this “fucker” has been fucking with my head for 37 years ..... silent treatment .... fucking hell .... I WOKE THE FUCK UP QUICK...... Freedom is close .... yes modified altered the whole fucking thing.... learning to walk ..... now close to running .... it’s close.... I can almost taste it. ... I refused.... argued..... GO NO CONTACT ....... PROTÉGÉE HAS WOKEN UP GO FUCK YOURSELF NPD ..... LOL I DO THAT SHIT MIRRORING SHIT..... FUCKS HIM UP..... BE GONE FUCKER.... no redirection no other victim to redirect tooooooo ..... praise the lord Amen survivors
They do it both ways... mum used to shame me at home for some things and then when she has friends around she would make those things into bragging things... she overdoes the pain and the admiration.. never can just be on a even level about things....
Ignoring the abuser and using no contact means to me laying down strict boundaries and they don’t like it ,but it gives me my self respect back
Here's how I deal with narcissists. I try to avoid them, and if I realize that I am involved with one, I immediately try to isolate them and move them out of my own circle. They are not worth bothering with. You can't fix them and you can't win with them. The problem is realizing when you are dealing with one. Sam has helped me to identify a narcissist in my life, who has been causing problems. That is the first step, and the most important one. Thank you, Sam! Unfortunately, this narcissist is reaching out to harass my household, but I just have to deal with that on it's own level. I am steadfast and refuse to make contact, again.
I appreciate the video. It's really bad when your narcissist "spouse" is a police officer.
Lord have mercy that's scary. Oh yes.So easy to marry a police officer...try divorcing one!
They do the same with divorce police usual nonsense of deviating tactics
So hard when it’s a parent, pastor for a time, stayed with my mother 18 years then much much less time with the following seven wives.
Adidas Love Yes - he remarried at least 7 times that we know of.
I feel you. He must be very sneaky and stalky. But do not fear. Go NO CONTACT, and change time zone. It will take a while, but you'll get there
The problem with narcissists is that they so often have enablers around them. People with low self esteem who feed their narcissistic tendencies, often mistaking it for confidence. This just enhances the narcissists ego, and amplifies their abusive and negative behaviour. This is my experience.
@@cm-yu6gu I agree. However, in my case the narc was a parent, so I didn't really have any control or power to change their behaviour towards me until I grew up unfortunately. But in the adult world narcs are attracted to people with low self esteem so they can initially pose as their saviour. It goes down hill from there😕
So basically, the narcissist is a coward.
Self-destructive and self-defeating narcissists www.narcissistic-abuse.com/faq69.html
Thanks for the comment and the entire thread has described my husband. I think he's a terrible coward for not leaving to go live as he chooses. I'd respect him more if he did. I will not leave for a ton of reasons and at one point I suggested that he buy a condo a couple blocks away and leave me alone to raise our children in peace. I have never forced a man to stay in a relationship with me as I believe that a relationship is an all volunteer program. I have learned that no matter how I act to him he will continue to be a narcissistic abuser.
How do you feel about all of the animals that you are responsible for killing in your lifetime?
+Laura Pasternack U.K. I'm not leaving because I don't have to. He has been removed. I will not be driven from my own home.
+Adidas Love Thank you! Very much appreciated. I believe, like with anything, once you learn more about something like this you become better equipped to deal with it.
Wow Sam this is exactly what the narcissist in my life does, I had a feeling he does it to keep control of everything about the relationship and that is exactly what you said. He wants to be in control of the end of the relationship but at the end it has to be my fault and my decision to walk away. He never trusts me, thinks the worst of me which no one else who knows me would ever think, that I am untrustworthy, a liar, crazy, lazy, etc, etc just to not have to think that he is losing a good person, to justify in his head all the name calling, the putdowns and to not get attached to someone he already decided was going to leave him eventually and who is faking loving him and just a fraud in his mind. He is close to not talking to me because I do not abide to the abuse nor his "behave this way or I won't show you love, affection and attention" way of trying to train me, and we end up having constant war fare and fighting every day. I spent so many days trying to actually understand what the hell was going on and if it was me. I know I am not crazy and what he does is not normal nor right for anyone.
This was me and narc
Then, my dear sister,LEAVE! And cut HIS TIES to yours. Period
It's a self fulfilling prophecy... there's only so much abuse anyone can take
This is definitely my mother. She thinks there is nothing wrong with her, it's everyone else. She won't get help
I know a person like that...finger always pointing outward...never to themselves.
It's called ego syntonic behavior.
Vaknin is always on point. After fifteen years of being married and coexisting with a rabid sociopathic, narcissist--every one of these tactics are golden. I've just left him three months ago and my life is already improving w/no contact being my first step toward healing. Although, he has the children there is nothing I can do to save them right now until I physically, emotionally/mentally and economically stronger. Thanks Vaknin as your advice is always precise!
@@themetamorphosisofgipsy my therapist made me to understand that I needed to heal before I could help my children. In my case they were 12 13 9 and I couldnt talk them into leaving...he had us all very comfortable materially. He only abused me...then would make me look like I was the abuser in their eyes.
Mine is a long story...but the divorce though the court granted me custody all my insides told me from experience that if I did take them from him he would kill us all. I felt caught between a rock n a bolder as they say. So I ask the court for joint physical custody which I knew he would never comply with and he never did. The children one by one ended leaving him too and are safe productive in sociaty and thriving now in good relationships because during their adolesant yrs I was there and took time to instruct them in spite of our circumstances. The divorce did tear us all apart except for him...he had another woman already living in our home during the divorce...and eventually married her with 5 children 3yrs later. One reason I am here listening to this video is because after 20 yrs now PTSD has set in. And Im exausted not being able to heal and GET A LIFE!
I dont blame the other momma for not responding to your question...only someone who has been through this AND who stayed FOR too LONG a TIME because of the children could understand.
Im glad she has help here...I had none! The therapist only help to calm me for that moment...she said she wasnt qualified after hearing my story. And didnt kbow anyone else who could except for god.
I ended up hating god for a long time afterwards...prayers didnt help. Church ppl never understood...and saying theyd pray for me felt more like a slap.
My mom is the narcissist, she’s abused me verbally my entire life ...over and over
Mine too, I've gone nc after her manipulation with my children, nastiness and hatred towards me. Fuck that, she can go jump
Me too. And that, in turn,makes us grow up and marry one too
@@anadurao8995 I know they are very deceptive
They are soooooooooooooooo NEEDY
marina nononsense omg.that's so true😥
Beyond NEEDY!!! DRAINING!!! NO Contact best thing I ever did!!!
@@mjblue84 right!
I use the fighting back style and not let him abuse me. But after constant defending myself it becomes draining.
i'm sorry, you must leave him
Just leave his headaches
was married to a narcissistic husband and i challenged him and did the counter-attack ...that is we stayed together for 23 yrs until his death by suicide because i was finally so tired of him and his ways .. still loved him but i knew I had to be the one to breakaway ... i was truly his backbone and at the end i was the stronger one to be able to leave him and he could not take it and killed himself... could not take the abandonment ... narcissistic people are really the weak ones ... i am proof .. he is dead and after 5 yrs i am still alive
Good for you, you survived!
Barbara Duggan 👏👏👏
You stayed all that time, finally left him and he got desperate and after all you are saying that he was weak and you survived him. That doesnt sound really fair to me
You killed a man.
How do we know who is the narcissist? It seems like that word is being used for anyone we don't like or have problems with? For someone to kill themselves they have to be in horrific pain and desperation, yet some of you show no empathy for their suffering and struggle. It makes me wonder if you are the saints you seem to think you are...
Testing and probing by a narc in abusing his loved one is NOT A JOKE !!!!! One can imagine how BAD a REAL ABUSE could be !!!!!!! For no rhyme or reason during our honeymoon.....he got very angry at me on whatever he was thinking in his own mind silently at the corner of the room !!! Suddenly with no warning....he jumped onto the bed ....like a commando....held my neck and twisted it till a sound clicked in my neck !!! Threw me on a pillow and left me there motionless for an hour !!! He left the room !!! I thought my life was over !!!
Thks to GOD..I dare not move for 30 mins...motionless...but every second forward means eternity !!!! I knew if I could just move my fingers very slowly...I could access my situation and how extensive the damage he might had done to me !!! As each second ticked by...I could moved my fingers..then my.hands...arms...shoulders...then neck...slowly lifting up my neck with my hands slowly to prevent further injury if any !!!! Thank God !!!! My neck was alright and that click sound might be the extreme pressure he held onto me ......thank GOD he threw me onto a pillow and he left !!! I managed to get out of the hotel to place a police report on him !!!! WAS THAT TESTING TO SEE HOW I WOULD RESPOND TO WHATEVER HIS SICKO MIND WAS THINKING AT THAT MOMENT OF ANGER ????? Certainly.....NO WAY....anyone in her right mind would NOT like to stick around with him !!!! That is a real psycho narc !!!!!!
We finally DIVORCED !!!!!!
So sorry to hear he did that to you! Good thing you divorced him. Unfortunately most people who deal with narcs are no longer in their right mind. The narc sees to it. That's why so many people wind up being trapped with a narc. The narc puts them in a place where they can't escape so easily and they don't function the same as they did before they met them. They assault your mind, among other things.
I’m disappointed that Sam didn’t answer your question, but I’m extremely happy that you made the smart move to file a police report and divorce
Your partner. That is beyond scary and more people need to be more secure to walk away at the first sign of abuse. Be encouraged and know that you are stronger than you know! Keep sharing your story to help others learn and gain that strength and wisdom to recognize red flags and danger.
Brilliant. I learned something useful today. Now I understand why my narcissist best friend and I are always arguing and in conflict. We are no longer able to communicate peacefully. Thank you for explaining this!
My abuser is my father and my stepmom uses his last "coping style" and scapegoats me to deflect his abuse. So I have two people abusing me, both of whom are my parent figures. Abusers will have hell to pay on the Day of Judgement.
I left the crazy-making abuser. Good riddance!
The moment you understand this mf game you move on
Never look back
It was never love it was an exchange- transaction , don’t be a doormat.
RUN
Apply NC .
Let this avatar disappear
i did the mirroring ...he could never make me lose my self ... i was a challenge to him and he liked that... if i would have been submissive to him ... he would have left me ... i was a challenge to him and he liked it ..kept him amused until i said the game is over ... and he could not take it....
your comment rings true for me too.
Same here! I saw through him and let him know his true self. I am independent, friendly and a caring people person and he hated that. Now, his own family knows his true colors. They knew but didn't know about Narcissisim. They were aware of his past life and his no Empathy. They knew he felt no Remorse. He's been running all his life. Miserable and unhappy. Sad 😢 I've been so helpful but I Know is almost impossible for my husband to change. He's an empty Shell with no Empathy. He'd favorite is giving me the Silent Treatment. Thank you for sharing.🌴
I turned the tables on mine and it rocked her fuckin' world.
Wooow! You did well! You got under his thin skin and got away! Amazing champ!
Yes but when you call them on their abuse and reflect that back to them then they get psychotic. It's a never ending cycle of rage being enacted through emotional, psychological, mental projection and abuse.
Having an "ah, ha" moment...
I've always rebelled against the behavior modification this sort of abuse is attempting to motivate... It's like I'm saying, "You want me to change this? Ask me nicely. I'm not changing because you "beat" it into me." During the first half of my marriage, I tried to be submissive, but he was still unsatisfied. I realized he abuses me to test his skewed theories...to prove his unchanging perception of me, regardless of reality. How can you compromise with someone who lives outside reality? It's not possible. Lately, I've become more resistant and self assured. While there are less incidents, there is always conflict just under the surface. He sees my independence and confidence as a sign that our marriage is falling apart. He drowns himself in self pity, withdrawing, and sulking about his failures... That is, until I give him more fuel for his fire.
Jamie Ritchey Keep holding up, since u didn't mention planning to leave. Looks like you're learning to manage the situation.
It won't stop, I've done all of this and the abuse just gets worse.
YOU ARE BRILLIANT!!!! Every single word you said is exactly what happened to me!!!! It feels as if you are talking about my ex. I had no idea these evil people existed and for anyone looking at this video while in a relationship with someone you think might be one, run as fast and as far as you can. They are dangerous and life ruiners!!
Makes me tougher; if they abandon me, I'll be able to handle more than I could before, to look on the bright side.
I agree completely with this. Persons with NPD have a great deal of difficulty bonding due to their lack of empathy. So they are continually suffering from abandonment anxiety and therefore become abusive simply because they do not 'get it' so. People in relationships with people with NPD, work on your inner feelings, keep yourself calm and explain to the n how exactly you are feeling. Don't just react and get aggressive, an n is human too. Use eye contact, redirection, just like you would with an autistic child. Believe it or not, some NPD's do care and they will state this. They just don't know how to express it. So codependants, work on your 'trauma bonds' experiences please! Don't forget to count to 10 as well........
Yeah its a sad perdicament for everyone involved
This is really interesting. I remember vividly the arguments that I used to have with my ex narc. The coping styles I seem to have used was counter dependent with a little bit of mirroring and collusion mixed in, depending on how the argument played out. But it didn't seem to minimize abuse much. I think narcs are so highly intelligent that they will find ways to abuse in spite of coping techniques. He learned quickly how to overcome the coping techniques to dish out the full abuse. I feel as though I trained him to be a better abuser with my "coping" techniques.
They're not highly intelligent as a matter of fact I've known more idiots narcs then intelligent ones.
It is so hard because they cannot see it. Constant drama, miserableness never worth it. No discussions because the Narcissist is always right. I agree with the lab tests. Abusive then blames the partner, states it is spiritual to only work on your own stuff. Spiritual narcissism are the worse, they use spirituality to abuse even more.
This guy is amazingly intelligent
Why in Gods name would you go through so much game playing just to "teach" the narcessist or avert abuse. Please just leave.
Wow I didn’t realize I was pulling out of him / having him face his fears and triggers of this level. Thank you
Awesome Sam. Thanks heaps. I have a friend who is really good at dealing with abusers. He is always positive and exaggerates what the abuser says and shows that he hasnt let it riffle him at all. He basically mirrors the absurdity of the comment. He has really good self esteem but even those with low self esteem will increase it using this technique on abusers.
These videos are a great help, my Mother is the absolute definition of a Narcissist.
They are great, and when you the chance read the book too. I have realized that this type of personality disorder is an epidemic level. It helped me identify the gal that I was daiting for 4 years as a Cover Narcissist. The cycles of abuse that she played on me was just mind and soul numbing. I just can not imagine what really is going on inside their soul that they have to resort to such abusive acts. One thing is for sure, they have been victimized themselves. They are the victims that are victimizing other people that come in contact with them. Just my opinion.
I'm sure that it is pure hell being in any type relationship with a narcissist, but nothing can compare to the hell of a narcissistic mother. A person would have to live it to even begin to understand. - It can take a lifetime to heal the damage. Some people have to break all contact with the N mother just to psychologically survive.
Narcissistic and psychopathic parents and their children - click on the links:
groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/narcissisticabuse/conversations/messages/4727
yes you are right, It is a special kind of hell. I cut contact a year ago and I am still a long way off recovering from it, the worst thing with a narcissist mother is they feel they are entitled to their children and grandchildren so the abuse continues well after breaking contact. They really like to strike when you least expect it so they can catch you in a weak moment, great source of supply for them. And despite it all they can still manage to make US feel guilty!! That's one of the things I struggle with the most, I am 1000% better psychologically for being no contact but the guilt for doing it is difficult to deal with.
Yes it's not true guilt. they 'agree to tow tow the line' so to speak' Only and is a form of a psychological power control. Surely there can not be any satisfaction there for either parties and would only be for financial security reasons'
I remember the umpteenth time my narc ex threatened to leave me over something petty, I finally said calmly "OK, you're right. Maybe it is better if we part ways now. You have a good idea." The look on his face was priceless. His face dropped because I called his bluff. He immediately began to backtrack and ran away from that subject. He still didn't improve the abuse but he did stop threatening to leave after that. He would try to threaten but the words wouldn't come out just stuttering.
Mine did that and I said ok..backtracked but I refused...I'm out on my own and happier
Most messed up way of thinking I've ever seen.
My Adult Daughter is in denial with her verbal abuse regarding me, even though I am constantly trying to give her emotional support, she is never at fault. Can't believe she is doing this again.
This is exactly what happened to this former friend that kept abusing me. He kept blackmailing and threatening me and my friends even though he claimed he couldn't even think of the idea of losing me. Just couldn't get it through his head that all the abuse and threats was precisely what was pushing people to walk away from him. Eventually he said he wanted me to kill myself or to ruin everything i love just so i could "feel" what he felt at the thought of not having company.
I have used all these methods ... I drew the line at no.5 as it was directed at my children!
+loveisallthereis 11 You must stay calm and as Sam described, use the words directed at you in a redirected way. This came to a crescendo in my own relationship as I had my yearly, being told "our marriage should end" and instead of being devestated and upset, as had been 10yrs before ,I simply said you are right the marriage should end! He went into a flat spin and didnt know what to do!
+Louise Kullar ps. I have left my 27yr marriage ...it wore me out and I lost my sense of self! lm still recovering!
My narc hates his mother and I have endured day long rants and raves about her. I witnessed some of the abuse he experienced as a teen. He was the scapegoat in his family. The only time he and his mother enjoy each others company is when they find someone else to bash together and it is aweful and sick!!
OMG everything you said is nothing but the truth.
It is also a fear of intimacy and voulnerability - that threats their inner wounded child to emerge.
the sexual intimacy causes possibility of attachment to someone, attaching means being dependant on someone, as they are superior to everyone they don't depend on anyone, they are supposed to be self sufficient. So abuse is a form of protecting the fragile self and keeping other people out, by abusing them (actually they protect theselves and others - they want and need to be alone in their world)
If abused people stay they are devaluated in the eyes of a narcissist, people narc. cannot admire and by staying victims actually agree with the abuse. No talking sense into a narcissist and telling them you don't appreciate their behaviour will do. You have to walk away demonstrate some sort of boundaries. But whan one does leave it sure taps into the abandonment anxiety - as to I know he/she wold leave me, at the same instance though it goes into - I don't need them anyway, I am so superior.
Projection and Projective Identification - Abuser in Denial
groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/narcissisticabuse/conversations/messages/5002
Approach-Avoidance Repetition Complex and Fear of Intimacy
groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/narcissisticabuse/conversations/messages/5000
My ex is in prison and has literally pushed everyone away. He use to tell me that he needed me... He would cause arguments because i wouldn't send drugs for him to sell in prison. He would say that i wanted him to come home broke and to live off me.. I see why we would argue so much. I'm so happy i left.
that describes me perfectly
Right on, Sam! Even something as simple as not wanting to go to "game night"' led to verbal abuse and the silent treatment.
Wow. I have watched many of your videos. I really found this one helpful. Thank you very much.
I just had to download this! Sooo good. I instinctively used insults to make my ex go no contact with me. With a casual date I use mirroring mixed with gas lighting. With suspect acquaintances/frenemies I cartoon their snarky comments..or play phone games with them.
+Sam Vaknin This also explains why couples scapegoat a chosen child.
Golden Child and Scapegoat Black Sheep: Narcissistic Parent's Projected Splitting ua-cam.com/video/C5HO-Ogd-2c/v-deo.html
+Sam Vaknin Thank you. Yes, this makes total sense. Thank you for the insight
+Rorschach 12 the answer is way too long to do here.
+Rorschach 12 If someone is dependent on someone else's opinion for their self-esteem, they're going to have low self-steam anyway.
+Laura Pasternack U.K. You sound very enmeshed in your family system. I hope you get over it
Wow, Mr. Vaknin, thank you once again. Very informative!!
Your explanations are very well structured. thank you for your videos!
This makes so much sense to me . thank you
Incredibly educational. Clear, full of information, and really rings many bells.Thank you.
I am so glad I have found you. You are the answer to my prayers n I can't thank you enough for helping me to understand what I have gone through with someone who claimed to love me but always abused me like my father did to me n now I can't trust any man again. That pain was to hard for me to handle. Once again thank you for giving me the peace I have been wanting for all of my life
I don't know why I'm enjoying this video so much. Maybe that's my coping mechanism right now.
This video was really helpful. Could you possibly make a video going in depth on each method?
Coming up.
Well communicated. What is described is common sense failure- amongst other disorders a cognitive one. Human relationships would have been much better if people knew that the significant other cannot be made to chose all the time between their own good and somebody else's good. Everything is competitive in the mind of a narcissist. I do not understand the coping styles- they do exist but for what purpose? To cheat about the presence of a relationship that does not exist? Why does someone with an abusive relationship would want to keep it (there is no true relationship- therefore he does not lose anything if he breaks up)?It is also good to understand the narcissist but to the majority of the population not very useful. The main subject is for people being abused to be taught to leave the relationship and not cope with it.
Exactly👋👋👋
My insecurities coming to light. It's kind of uncomfortable but I needed to hear this❤️
I'm glad I stumbled onto this video. Thank you for sharing!
Thanks !!! Sam !!! LIFE IS GREAT NOW !!!!!
Every point u mentioned..is nothing but the truth!! Since I believe in integrity and transparency... I always fought back verbally (even publicly) when I was abused... there used to be massive arguements, bitter exchanges and name calling (the last one only from my end). The ex narc behaved hardly aggressive while in public during arguements... But behind closed doors he would spew venom, cusses. And then used to go no contact for few days. When I started calling out his actions in public more frequently... he went 'no contact' almost permanently. He hasn't tried making any contacts since 1 year now. Though I still get to know from his frnds that he abuses me at my back... Has launched smearing campaign (although he is now in a relationship with a married woman with kids)... But he still doesn't miss any opportunity to defame me. So I don't think the coping style no. 2 - resisting or criticising the abuser helps in minimizing the abuse. It just results in an early discard by the narc and going 'no contact' forever (although still actively criticising the victim in his social circle). So basically this one is the most effective method to make the coward narc run fast for his life!
MY CAT IS A NARCISSIST
So is my goldfish.
do yoi think personality disorders can lay dormant and then be triggered by events ,
looking forward to your new treatment interesting stuff sam
Sometimes I didn’t like where I ended up while defending myself and desperately wanting to spark some awareness of how I felt. Just some form of acknowledgement. It’s clear now he very much enjoyed orchestrating my escalation to earthshaking chaos. There’s only one force capable of such deeds. It is that communication which I now believe became my addiction. I want to defeat mercilessly yet would only serve to prove my “craziness”. Perhaps I should feel empowered and validated knowing the devil is trying so hard to destroy me❤️🙏🏽💪🏼😎
I love that last sentence! It’s like we agitate their dark souls by simply just being a good person.
This is so sad but very true. My ex narc would always push his abuse to the next level. Take level 1-2 and he would push it to level 3&4....oh you can take that...well let’s try level 5-6. And he always said I was not submissive enough to him....his abuse was to test my submissiveness. I refused to accept the abuse which did lead to constant conflict and hence my discard. I do wonder if this is the final discard or if he will try to return at some point. I think he knows I know who he really is and that I am no longer susceptible to his abuse....maybe this is the end ....
Oh boy. You are so accurate in your videos.
Hello Sam Vaknin, first off, thank you very much for you're great effort and attention to detail in creating a tremendous pool of information regarding narcissism, its multi-faceted inner workings and ramifications. Concerning this video and topic I would like to propose to you a last, but none the least motive for the abuse expressed by a narcissist. One which may point to their very damaged, yet still existent true self. And that would be for the purpose of true intimacy.
Given the nature and quality of the narcissist own self narrative and super ego, I feel that a narcissist cannot feel confidently intimate or kinship with people who are truly confident, truly happy or truly at peace with themselves. These kind of people will always feel alien to a narcissist and ultimately make them feel uncomfortable in one way or another. What I am proposing here is that by devaluing, humiliating, pointing out and bringing another person into their own very similar inner reality of true self-denial , self-rejection and self-destruction, a narcissist can enhance their feelings of trust and intimacy with their target and minimize any sense of being at odds, different or alienated with and from them. Misery likes company basically.
Again, thank you Mr. Sam Vaknin. Your work I believe is of great interest and help in elucidating and addressing a truly great problem in our world.
The Covert, vulnerable female narcissists should seek therapy for PTSD. They have been abused in every passible way during their childhood into their adult life by their abusive parents. I dated one for 5 years and her mother is the narcissist and her dad is the alcoholic enabler that assaulted and abused her behind the closed doors. Her brother hung himself when he was just a child which I find it to be very suspicious.
Men this is a fantastic video that explain in a great way this narc issues. Thanks a lot Sir. Now I can handle these MOFOS in a better way.
I'm a narcissist and I don't know what to do about it
The dynamics presented here are all accurate. One thing to add: some narcissists hide these feelings. ie. They very rarely... act them out. When provoked in the extreme...then, and only then.. this behavior will come out. So, sometimes, you will never know ( what's inside of them) .. or will, suddenly.. after years of knowing them.
Covert narcissist www.narcissistic-abuse.com/faq66.html
I know exactly what you have experienced or close to it. Hard to identify it, specially when I was in the relationship with her. The emotions are just one sided and the false thought in my head was telling me that she understand certain things when in a relationship that help keep it together, but how wrong I was. She is void of compassion or understanding , I was sensing it but I could not understand how a person can be void of such basic feelings. Zero empathy toward others or me. sex was all that she could offer, I asked her to buy me a watch with my own money that she owed me , she bought me an iPod. I could not understand why. But I do now. I have so many examples that I can share about this experience, I told her that she is my CNARC because she is my discovery.
Narcissist promotes abuse, when I was being attacked I retaliated and verbally abused her as she did me. It was like a vicious cycle, she tried to control and when I challenged her she would go into narcissistic rage. Destroying my belonging, become physically abusive then call the police on me as if I had done anything to her. I have identified her as Cover Narcissist born to a co dependent abusive father and a narcissistic mother. She most likely is the golden child and her bother committed suicide at an early age of 10-12, when she was only 7-8, I am not sure about the exact age. The parents came from Serbia and moved to Canada but the interesting part was even though she was born in Canada she thought of herself as a superior race, as a Serbian. Also I assume that her brother was the scapegoat. It is very hard to communicate with persons like her, she never shared her thought process as to how she came to certain conclusions specially when it also included me. It was as if she was told to do it and she was obeying. She was never wrong, never apologized for her mistakes or wrong doings. The next day she would act as if nothing has happened and everything is just fine as long as I did not mention anything about the night before, that was like walking on the eggshells. Never cared to have a constructive discussion about the issues. No depth in her thinking. I also have to say she never understood what it meant to be in another person's shoes. I have never met any one with these type of personality deficiencies until I came across your blog and have read your book just to be able to explain my own experiences with this person. How she would used to discredit me to gain herself credit , all thee childish games that just made no sense what so ever. I was questioning why she even bothers to get into a relationship with that type of personality and then I found out why, because of her narcissistic needs. that is how they operate.
Everything (controlling abusive behavior) always occurred behind closed doors or on the phone.
Very good video. Thanks for breaking it down in to more specific examples.
Stunned to hear phrases like you always don't follow me you are destroying our relationship etc. Things I have been hearing for years when I didn't want to go along with stuff he wanted. I wish I knew the caricature style but I was so worn out and powerless that not sure if could have been able to impliment it. I was not aware of what was happening but felt responsible for our relationship and his bad feelings. Towards the end of our 27 year he started mirroring my exact words. I couldn't believe it. He was telling me exactly the same phrase I used 1 min ago. I started thinking I was getting crazy and loosing my mind. Tarrible state. At one of our last conversations I secretly taped it with enormous fear to just check my own sanity. After a while I fled in terror as he was becoming scary. He had upped his moves they were physical while for years were under the radar and constant that I couldn't really put my finger on it. Thanks for that video
There is no way my husband will trust me. I have saved his life 5 times and worked so hard. He does extinguish all the joy that i should have. He never follows through with his end of agreements and i always do what i say. This has gone on for 25 years. I am finally divorcing him because i have become bitter, all i can do is criticize him now. I dont want to be this way to anyone, but i am that way now.
"A brutal sense of humor". I love how you word that. it describes my mom to a tee. She has undiagnosed Borderline Personality Disorder or NPD. She's got all the earmarks.
The male narcissist's mother www.narcissistic-abuse.com/faq64.html
I believe, I am married to a narcissist. I am getting out now, thank God! Sam, I wanted to ask, have you or can you do a video about when a narcissist tests you? My soon to be ex husband, every year, for 7 years right around spring time, would go into this phase of saying he thought he might want a divorce. I would get quite shaken up, of course, we have 5 children. I would try to do everything I could to "make him happy" Until I realized, he was going to do this every year, without feeling bad, without being sorry for my pain etc. I met a women who went through the same thing. she said her ex husband did this to her every fall. What is this all about? Do you have any input on this? It would be appreciated it you do. I tried to tell him how painful this is and he just denied doing this to me and denied his emotional distance for years at a time, then he would pull this I think I might want a divorce, when I decided to just be happy and move on with my life, despite his unhappiness. The 7th year of this, I had had enough of being afraid to loose my family and decided to go with as little contact as possible and told him not to call me, text me etc. He didn't like this one bit! But, I stuck to my guns. My chronic migraines disappeared within 2 weeks! This, 'I think I want a divorce' was so painful, I finally caught on, and now I am on the road to being healthy.
Read about unpredictability as a tool of abuse here: www.narcissistic-abuse.com/abuse.html
Holly-Ann Guy My husband did this for a few years. It will always come after Christmas. At Christmas he was at his best but after that he behaved as if he were a demon. Threatening to leave, asking for a divorce and being abusive. When i agreed and told him i wanted a divorce too it got worse.
This is exactly what I’m going through now
This is outstanding.
But if the abused becomes wise the narc needs to find others to play with.
Suppose everyone becomes wise the narc then has no place to run and must confront reality.
My ex husband pushed his kids away and his family, friends and work colleagues, I was the only one left. He turned to drugs and online gaming until I left him. Now he's moved to Portugal ( we're English) to start a new cycle with fresh new toys. They can't see what they're doing and they never change...ever. X
I really wish that would happen, that’s what they deserve. But they are too good at the game, and if they as charming/good looking as mine was, there’s a never ending supply of lonely women looking for love :(
They always move on to the next victim, control and supply needed !
.Thank you Sam, Boston USA, Your work is very important .I've learned so much , very grateful .
Really healing me heat as a past narc
Stunning, insightful well explained. Wonderful that Sam share this very important information. Will help a lot of people in a great way.
My abusive psychopathic Npd ex husband creates constant conflict and chaos and sabotages all of the peace happiness and all goodness for my children and I. He is the corrupt dark evil cloud that has ruined everything in our lives
Absolutely brilliant! Thank you so very much for posting!
I am thinking of relabelling NPD as NEED or RED so Non-existant empathic disorder, or Reduced Empathy Disorder.
Empathy in personality disorders www.narcissistic-abuse.com/personalitydisorders68.html
***** Anger and sadness are emotions not examples of empathy. Empathy is being able to recognise these emotions in others. Narcissists do become sad and angry - they are very divorced from other people because of their lack of empathy. Its a very difficult state to be in and can often swing between the two emotions when they are really suffering. They can be extra sensitive - and I agree, only to try and get what they need - so self-sensitive. Some a really great at kicking people when they are down too - nice. So finally seeing that they have controlled and broken someone and using mimic negative empathy, deal the final blow. All to do with existential angst due to the empathy lack I'm afraid.
this was excellent. thank you Sam
Omg, that last part sounded just like my half-brother and his wife, a fashion-designer, descended from Freud!!!
An awesome lesson. Thanks. But I rather leave his ass and find someone new then he can suffer in his own neuroses.
very hard core!
All victims listen closely to this video. This is us to a t. I brought about every single abandonment and turned it around on them. I pushed and pushed to bring up her concerns. If she dare questioned me about ,this no matter how loving, I would rage abusively at her leaving her to wonder "what just happened". If she tried to get a word in I would rage louder and accuse her of abusing me. I'm sick and twisted it's her fault for always letting me back "in".
David Flynn Thamks for admitting the truth. That is exactly what my husband did to me over and over. And every time it happened I was not prepared for it. Because I dont think that way I was not prepared for it. Im learning.
Very informative video. Thanks
Dude, thank you for explaining this.
The displacement mechanism is my friend's daughter and her husband to a T. She always diverts his rage onto another person whom they then attack together.
He is losing my children already lost me I feel so bad and sorry for him after40 years of marriage I'm still here but I'm not as before
Oh goodness! I have been “mirroring “ and had no idea it was a thing. He’d either get mad and walk away or try and become the victim . Dang I don’t understand how it is so clear now.
Very insightful.
Co-dependent mother def. teamed up with NPD father to scapegoat us children, even picking up his own abuse styles like demeaning and condescending sarcasm. It allowed them to have a semblance of complicity, good laughs at our expense, and it helped her deflate the abuse she would otherwise have to endure. Even when we were physically abused by the NPD, she wouldn't step in to interfere and save us, she'd finish to watch and then ask us to apologize to him because of whatever we did to provoke his wrath. It was her coping mechanism which she thought saved her, but it granted us two abusers instead of one.
What's more interesting is that after I myself got married to another narc, I found myself joining my ex-husband in blaming, undermining, criticizing "the other", all the freaking time. It was us against the world. And it got to a point where I started being uncomfortable with it, and tried to bring nuance to his judgmental sweeping statements, probably because I got a taste thanks to him of what it was like to be the object of one of them. I'm glad it's over, because I couldn't imagine myself raising children with that man. It wasn't until I left him the second and last time that I found out about NPD, both pertaining to him and to my dad. A whole world of clarity and sanity unraveled before my eyes. I will never be grateful enough. Alhamoudlillah, Alhamoudlillah...
What about calling him out on what he is doing as scoping mechanism? Even though knowing it landed nowhere with him... he has no self reflection, but it did help me a lot to stay in reality, and eventually leave him. I kept saying out loud when he'd belittle me, used silent treatments, was bullying me.. was grandiose or histrionic.
I completely get this so upset I find all this out now.
I feel stuck. So hurt and he left almost a year ago. Our divorce was final a month ago but I can’t seem to shake the breakup. I just can’t believe this happened. I’m trying to move on but idk how to let it go.
So the abuser does not seek to make the victim feel bad, but tries to calm his anxiety? Or are there cases where he does it just for evil? 🤔
samvak.tripod.com/journal65.html
@@samvaknin Thank you very much Sam! You are being very helpful in my recovery
My X Narc was raised by Orphans . His parents
Met in an Orphanage as children
this actually makes me sad. He was so terrified of me leaving him, and in the end he was the one who left bc I would call him out on his behaviour. I understood why he did things and why he was always testing and accusing me. I never left his side, never. I think he scared himself the last time and that's why he discarded me. He couldn't go back after that. yet even that I wouldn't hold over his head bc I totally understood why he did it. Sam, do you think a narc runs faster bc he sees the SO loves him unconditionally?
Narcissists, Love and Healing samvak.tripod.com/narcissistlovehealing.html
I Love to be Hated - The Masochistic Narcissist samvak.tripod.com/narcissistmasochist.html
I thought I was one for awhile. Is this common when you're in a relationship with one. Just getting out of a relationship with one(I think). She stopped loving me after one BIG mistake(not cheating) and started dating almost immediately. My family hated her.