When it comes to artists not playing their classic hits, all I can think of is Lemmy Kilmister of Motorhead saying in an interview "I've played Ace of Spades thousands of times, I'm fucking sick of it, but what am I gonna do, NOT play the song everyone wants to hear? Fuck off. These people paid money and came out to see our show. They wanna hear Ace of Spades, they're gonna fucking hear Ace of Spades."
I am reminded of REM pointedly leaving Shiny Happy People off their Greatest Hits album, or Radiohead not playing Creep for decades, or Nirvana playing one bar of Smells Like Teen Spirit in concert and then doing a different song.
Darude at a Dota event: No we're not gonna play Sandstorm despite Dota pushing it to meme status Eric Prydz: no I'm not gonna play Call On Me despite that song (and its music video) propelling us to fame Thom Yorke: stop requesting Creep. I hate that song
I met a gamer from an old Blizzcon who said "Four vast and trunkless pillars of the gaming industry stand. One which reads Diablo, one which reads World of Warcraft, one which reads Starcraft, and the last which reads Overwatch. Near them, consumed by the insulting graffiti of gamers long past, lies a visage with a predator's smile and cheap suit. Under the pedestal it did say 'My name is Bobby Kotick, douche of douches: look on my works, for they were once mighty, and despair for last night I bought your mom"
Madonna being old actually would help her remember the lyrics better because of how abnormally rehearsed the information is. It’s crystallize memory at that point. Age usually effects acquisition of new memory.
She probably just doesn't want to come out and say "I don't want to sing the old stuff; I want to sing my new songs that reflect who I am now". And I can't really blame her for that; artists always want to evolve - but the fans want what they want, and it's on her to deliver that.
The Linkin Park joke, reminds me of an anecdote from a way old podcast in which they described going to a wrestling show, and one of them was able to bring in a sign that said "Bring back Benoit!".
@@Dracobyte she's doing nothing good in terms of the bands reputation though. Imagine hiring a scientologist to replace a singer who struggled with mental health like Chester did
3:43 I think it's unfair for Pat to say Madonna's lying here. I've seen artists like Tyler the Creator forget lyrics to their songs and ad lib on stage, and the time differential with Like a Virgin is WAY larger.
3:38 Smash Mouth was this way about All Star, at least circa 2013. They played an event wt my college and were generally pretty pissy at request for it from the crowd. When they eventually did play it, people started leaving so I'm guessing they kinda knew that'd be the result
"You think you do but you don't" wasn't just WoW Classic, it was the whole damn game for like 4 years. for context: The game was, and still is, directed by a fella named "Ion Hazzikostas". He got hired on a boss designer first around 2007~2008, and then made director in 2016. He was the director of the game during the expansions of Legion, Battle for Azeroth, Shadowlands, Dragonflight, and now The War Within. "Battle for Azeroth" and "Shadowlands" are far and away the worst the game's ever been, because of a mountain of feature that made the game's progression awkward, keeping up to date a massive chore, and at times random how strong your character could be. All of the "new" features conceived under his direction (with a single exception) were widely hated, and he walked back TONS of them during their expansions, and basically all of them once Dragonflight launched.
The important thing to know is that he was a prominent math doer before he was a fight designer, he got noticed in the first place for proving a boss was mathematically impossible. So basically all his direction for the game is grounded in his ideal way to play the game. Unfortunately, Just so turns out that his ideal for what the game should be has almost no common ground with what the average player wants. Specifically he LOVED build crafting, and all of his systems were designed to force players to build craft. Turns out most players just wanna download the best build from the website *he used to write for* and slap dragons with their friends. The systems all forced you into some subset of the total options available to your character, some by tedious grinds (eventually made free), some by irreversible choices (eventually walked back), and some by vicious RNG (eventually made selectable). All they did was encourage the low end players to curse the misfortune of their birth, and at the extreme high end encourage players to delete and remake their characters until they got the random subset that was the best for high end content.
@@Tyberes "he got noticed in the first place for proving a boss was mathematically impossible." It probably was beatable, vanilla players were notoriously bad at the game in terms of knowing what's ACTUALLY optimal and any hardcore Classic guild probably could've cleared it.
It should be noted that when "You think you do, but you don't" was said, it was during the era of Warlords of Draenor, which had up to that point been considered the worst content Blizz had put out and was responsible for such massive sub loss that Blizz permenantly stopped publicly telling us the sub numbers. So they clearly took it very personally when we basically said to them "hey your shit sucks right now, can we go back to when WoW was actually good?"
@@Tyberes tbf pinning the blame for bfa and shadowlands on ion ignores the fact that the he wasn't the guy who wrote those expacs. Afrasiabi was the mastermind on those three and by the time he was off the WoW team BfA would have been at least half done and SL would have been in early production.
I'd recommend reading or listening to some of Jason Schreier's work on what was going on at Blizzard. After the cancelation of Project Titan, Bobby Kotick and Activision tightened their grip on Blizzard and forced them to hire a CFO. The corporate neck breathing kept ramping up and led to a marked shift in their design philosophy, with more monetization and engagement mechanics that made the game feel more like a chore. After the Microsoft merger began and Kotick was expelled, the WoW team was given a huge infusion of funding and had the freedom to move away from those gameplay elements. Dragonflight and TWW have been largely regarded as a return to form for the game.
Everyone knows that the reason why Blizzard took away Overwatch is because they knew no one would actually move to Overwatch 2 if they had the choice of either.
Worse, it's because they made a promise that you'd never had to pay for more with OW1 after buying the game. So they made OW2 where that's not the case and forced everyone to move over to that as a loophole.
Overwatch 2 was actually Jeff Kaplan's pet project. He never wanted to make the original Overwatch into a Game As Service, he wanted it to be a box product with some short term post-launch support that would eventually transition into more robust Overwatch 2 with a PvE campaign and then eventually set the stage for an MMO. Competing interests from the Activision side, the heavy investment in the game's PvP scene, and difficulty in getting the PvE campaign up and off the ground eventually caused them to completely change what OW2 was going to be and Jeff walked.
There's a lot of stuff in the Jason Schrier book, but one of the craziest is that internally the entire overwatch team was like "it's good that overwatch succeeded, but obviously it's just a starting point to build the mmo we always wanted it to be."
Now I’m not gonna say “you think you do” was justified or aged well, but I do think the sentiment behind that phrasing is true. Most people don’t want OW1 the game, they want to experience OW1 as a sensation again, which you can’t replicate. People are already turning on it and going “yeah no this sucks” which like, yeah it’s not the zeitgeist anymore. You keep chasing that high and you’ll have realized you’d dug yourself 40 ft deep way too late. Tl;Dr: DOOM 2016 was absolutely snubbed at the game awards and OW winning was a fucking embarrassment seconded to PUBG being nominated.
I played OW for a solid 2-3 years and it getting worse over time isn't untrue in some regards, but I really don't think that's the case. There were, in fact, so many patches that people almost universally celebrated. Like nerfing Diva for example, after Dive really popped off. Also as far as new characters, everyone always loved Ana, the very first one, she pretty much feels like a core character.
I've found that a lot of people who clamor for "the old thing" are really desperate for it to make them feel like the old thing did when it was new. And it can't, because we're not the same as we were back then.
Well, at least StarCraft remastered turned out to be pretty great. Too bad that several of the devs of its studio / department where not given enough time or money for Warcraft 3: Reforged.
The music artist(s) that come to mind is the Glitch Mob. Their best album is still Drink the Sea, from 2010 (and the following EP from 2011), and nothing they've done since comes close IMO. Which frustrates me to no end.
OW classic baffles me because there were so many design choices people DETESTED at launch. blizzard just found different holes to dig after that. like, people were tilted in the open beta. maybe if Classic magically transported you into a universe where blizzard put meaningful effort into playtesting, it would be worthwhile
The WoW Classic "you think you want this but you don't" shit is never not funny to me, WoW Classic private servers existed from the moment TBC came out and nowadays there's private servers for not only every expansion but individual patches too. I like to think given that quote was happening during Warlords of Draenor and they were struggling hard basically from them all the way through to Dragonflight (depending on who you ask even from Cata to DF) even without FF14s meteoric rise that they knew releasing WoW Classic would have destroyed the Retail population.
I mean it applies here. Everyone that tried out OW classic pretty much agrees that its dogshit. And everyone who never played overwatch 1 tried it for the first time and also agrees that its ass. Like...they are not wrong.
I think the funny thing about Overwatch classic is it's a monkey's paw scenario. For the longest time people just wanted 6v6 and then they announce this. Every interaction I've had with people who've played the Overwatch classic have said "Yeah this is shit, we wanted to go back but not this far back."
and they're not doing that, there's a 6v6 playtest with modern balancing being held right after the ow classic event is done. like, this is literally just for nostalgia, it's not the actual 6v6 test. im kinda baffled so many people are this misinformed about it.
in retrospect 2016 overwatch was balanced like shit but god fucking damn is it the most fun with the game I've had since it's been renamed to overwatch 2
The crazy part is that they are making it a temporary change. Just reset the game back to Overwatch 1 already, and I can't believe I am saying this but also bring back the loot boxes cuz they are better than the season pass...
the move to an itemshop/battlepasses fucking ruined that game so bad. by no means was it good before that but actually being able to earn and unlock cosmetics by leveling up a few times without paying 100 dollars for 4 skins is sorely missed.
It's almost like modern Blizzard doesn't know how to do anything other than desperately copy the company's past devs or fuck shit up. Sometimes both. *coughs in Warcraft 3*
@@UCannotDefeatMyShmeat was it someone who hasn't played the game since shadowlands or longer like pat, or one of the "I don't like new things so the player housing announcement has me angry" people?
@Dracobyte Oldie fan from Two Best Friends era so i usually watch when they show niche niiiiche games. i.e Dragons Crown, Darkest Dungeon, Gungeon, 13 Sentinels, Disco to Elysium... Personally i like Fighting Games, rpgs, story driven games, and recently roguelikes.
@willadkins1354 Soz hahahaahahahahah was trying to think fast lmfao. There was This War of Mine, Persona 4 Arena, uhhh uhhhhhhhh.... omg tht randomly good Transformers Game by Platinum?
Been playing OW Classic and man I really don't get why Pat is doubling down on "every patch made the game worse", every match I've played against is just 6 widows or hanzos and you can't do anything to counter them except be a better sniper somehow. They do need to bring back 6v6 proper though.
Its because pat doesnt play OW and has no idea what he is talking about. Everyone agrees that this version is funny for like 5 matches and then you realize how ass it is compared to overwatch 2.
I have no reason to defend Overwatch or Blizzard, but most people saying early Overwatch was the best are just saying it because they didn't play enough to understand how unfun some of its quirks were.
Completely agree. I am bias in that I didn't like the game at launch but many people are able to be critical now without the fresh OW1 hype. Balance is awful but to me it's clear the devs had no clue how the game was going to be played. And the players didn't either, many of them thought widow was bad. Ow2 has issues but it's much better than OW1 launch that people get nostalgic over
The modern era of video games is weird. If someone told me in the ‘90s that in the future video games with get updated versions that made them increasingly worse and less fun to play, I wouldn’t believe it. The journey Blizzard has went on with Overwatch has to be one of the most bizarre in all of video games.
Woolie you missed a perfect opportunity to say Eminem on people who say fuck it fine here's the old thing considering Houdini was LITERALLY him saying fuck it fine here's slim shady
More recent reminder that Thom Yorke independently made a newer 13 minute version of Creep that sounds like ass, just so he could play that version if people requested it. Literally the same tactics as Blizzard lol, you like this dumb song so much huh?? What if I ruin it for you?
Why is this bad and desperate? This seems like a natural thing to do since WoW classic. Also pretty sure most OW players don't seriously want classic. Most want OW1 right before it died with current reworks or just OW2
The insidious thing about this Overwatch Classic is they didn't do anything to the rewards you get. You still get the tiniest of pennies and are FORCECD to drop full-priced game money on a couple of skins. There are still no lootboxes or any real way to earn rewards. You get the basic match gameplay but none of the reason people stuck around to constantly earn free MEANINGFUL rewards every couple of matches. Oh, and the stuff you do earn from the event? One spray. One profile card. One emblem. One other bullshit menu thing. That's all you earn. No skins, you gotta pay for those.
overwatch "classic" holy shit fucking LMAOOOOOOOO this is slurm classic like what the fuck this is one of the most hilarious humbling backdowns I've ever seen. but I still fucking hate it because it shows that they'll crawl back rather than just at least go bloody bankrupt.
I mean I'm sitting here wanting to play Marvel Rivals constantly and I've had zero interest to even download overwatch again so yeah Rivals already won in my mind.
Overwatch "classic" died when they introduced Moira and Brigette, two healers than function without looking at allies and out DPS'd the DPS characters. Segway that into nerfing fun characters over and over in service of inserting more poorly considered characters so they can keep selling lootboxes. When those lootbox sales dried up, selling over half a billion dollars worth of copies by the end of 2016. I've been through enough game cycles now to recognize what choices were made in overwatch post-release were centralized around refocusing players onto new characters and selling them the kind of skins you wish the characters would always have had AFTER they nerf that character to the point of it not being fun to main. Seems like there's a high focus on withholding the things that would give you dopamine and nostalgia vibes ONLY WHEN BLIZZARD HAS DONE BAD.
Honestly as someone who's played every version of OW and OW2 classic OW is ass. Roadhog hooks are ignorant and hero stacking while fun gets old fast. Mid OW was peak tho. OW2 on launch was great and 5v5 isn't awful just 6v6 needs to be balanced better cause double barrier tanks was a slogfest. Also idc for marvel so sadly OW still better to me.
Overwatch Classic kinda served as a reminder of how good we have it now. It’s fun as a nostalgia trip, but I definitely prefer most of the changes we have now.
Pat saying “The game got worse with every patch” makes me remember that he hasn’t played the game in seven years and I don’t particularly care about his opinions on it
Not sure what you're talking about. 1.0 Overwatch was *the* casual experience. People played because it was fun, the progression felt well and each character felt distinct. Now, every single healer follows a nearly similar formula, every tank is given too much responsibility and every DPS must either one shot the target or not bother. I played with plenty of people recently, ones that didn't witness release OW. You know what their most common line was? "X is broken/overpowered!" Yes. It is. But just like everything being OP in COD MW2 cancelled itself out and made it silly but fun, so it does here. Everything is busted. Therefore, nothing is But devs listened to the 0.5% of the playerbase - the competitive sweatlords that wanted to not have a casual game. And we ended up in a trash pile we are now. Where balancing and nerfing was more important than having fun
@@jpjfrey5673Not to be rude, but a lot of this is just wrong. The devs have actively worked to remove all one-shots except Widow. Hanzo only recently got some one shot potential back and the devs made it clear that was temporary until they have something else for him. Plenty of non- oneshot DPS are viable. Hell tracer has been meta for a lot of OW2 It's very clear that the devs, like most devs, try to balance for everyone. Not saying they always succeeded but it's clear that was their intent. Otherwise characters like Sojurn and Kirko would have been dumpstered immediately with how much they dominated high rank. Instead they tried to raise lower the skill floor and keep the skill ceiling worth it by making body shots more rewarding and headshots slightly less. No problem having a different opinion on OW1 though. I will say that with OW classic, it's clear that a big part of the fun was people not knowing how to play the game
I would legit go back if they brought back old Sombra (before recent rework) she was the last bit of fun I found in even OW2 and they ruined her because bronze players got pissy. Hopefully Marvel Rivals destroys OW completely.
Y'know it's just how it is but ever since I recently actually started playing OW2, hearing them talk about it is kinda painful. Like people complaining about a pothole that was fixed years ago.
yeah it's a little painful hearing them talk out of their ass lol. especially when the actual proper 6v6 tests are coming out right after the classic event is done. like blizz went out and wrote in big letters that classic is like a nostalgia event and not the actual playtest. sometimes i wish they'd do some like even surface level research before talking about it. it's still like a cynical move putting release overwatch back for a few weeks, but not for the reason they're saying lmao.
I am sorry but this is really a redditor approach when everytime blizzard does basically anything you shit on it because upvotes to the right. Thats what pat is doing here. He doesnt play the game, he doesnt know what the community thinks. This is nothing but a neat little option to play the really old version of the game that will never come back and that millions have never had the chance to play. Its fun for a handful of matches and then it does indeed fall apart when compared to current overwatch 2. So yall are just really really laser-focused on trying to shit on something thats basically just entirely positive for the community that actually plays the game. This isnt even the actual 6v6 test yet, that comes later this year. So all you did here was hear the name blizzard and overwatch and figured youll just talk some shit for the updoots. Yall can defo do better than that.
I find this funny cause I’ve heard nothing of this laundering news though I’ve been in the petty parts of the overwatch community and still budding rivals community so I guess it doesn’t mean much rn lol.
Every time I hear about Madonna for the past 25 years, I think of Kenny from South Park ranting about her on his deathbed after the Make-a-Wish Foundation stupidly suggested meeting her as his last wish
When it comes to artists not playing their classic hits, all I can think of is Lemmy Kilmister of Motorhead saying in an interview "I've played Ace of Spades thousands of times, I'm fucking sick of it, but what am I gonna do, NOT play the song everyone wants to hear? Fuck off. These people paid money and came out to see our show. They wanna hear Ace of Spades, they're gonna fucking hear Ace of Spades."
I like the idea of him just going “buy the fucking song if you wanna hear it so bad”
"Just don't come to our concerts if you want to hear us play your favorite songs." - @UCannotDefeatMyShmeat
That's a bold move, Cotton.
I am reminded of REM pointedly leaving Shiny Happy People off their Greatest Hits album, or Radiohead not playing Creep for decades, or Nirvana playing one bar of Smells Like Teen Spirit in concert and then doing a different song.
Darude at a Dota event: No we're not gonna play Sandstorm despite Dota pushing it to meme status
Eric Prydz: no I'm not gonna play Call On Me despite that song (and its music video) propelling us to fame
Thom Yorke: stop requesting Creep. I hate that song
It helps that he basically makes up new lyrics for his songs every time.
"I don't remember the lyrics" from Madonna has the same energy as "Who's Goku?" from Toriyama
I met a gamer from an old Blizzcon who said "Four vast and trunkless pillars of the gaming industry stand. One which reads Diablo, one which reads World of Warcraft, one which reads Starcraft, and the last which reads Overwatch. Near them, consumed by the insulting graffiti of gamers long past, lies a visage with a predator's smile and cheap suit. Under the pedestal it did say 'My name is Bobby Kotick, douche of douches: look on my works, for they were once mighty, and despair for last night I bought your mom"
Madonna being old actually would help her remember the lyrics better because of how abnormally rehearsed the information is. It’s crystallize memory at that point. Age usually effects acquisition of new memory.
Nevermind as well music is stored differently in the brain and is being used to help people with Alzheimer's to remember stuff.
Like FF 7 taught me, your memories can be tricky (kinda joking).
She probably just doesn't want to come out and say "I don't want to sing the old stuff; I want to sing my new songs that reflect who I am now". And I can't really blame her for that; artists always want to evolve - but the fans want what they want, and it's on her to deliver that.
I hope Marvel Rivals delivers in its launch version.
I hope so. All that stolen money must have been taken away from some part of the production.
If they LEARN and buy too many servers. Instead of having "enough" and they're basically catching fire during launch day.
@@ExeErdna hopefully it works as smooth as the beta did
All I learned from this is just don’t play team shooters
Honestly not that hard I look at them the same way I look at League and DOTA
What about Tag Team fighters?
What I learned from this is just play TF2 instead
@@posteriorpepperoni tf2? The game that got us into this mess?
@@thecaptain6520 You're out of line but goddammit you're right.
This is like MCR doing the "Black Parade Is Dead" tour and now coming back to do the "Long Live The Black Parade" tour
Psylocke looks so great makes me wanna boot it up
way better compared to her Deadpool movie look
@greatskullz6166 shes not in dead pool
@@Mr.Faust3 She is, very briefly (She was the one who pulled X23 with a pink whip) as part of Nova goons.
The Linkin Park joke, reminds me of an anecdote from a way old podcast in which they described going to a wrestling show, and one of them was able to bring in a sign that said "Bring back Benoit!".
I did not get the Linkin Park joke.
@@Dracobyte It was dark humor, as the original lead singer died several years ago. Implying to bring him back on stage and do the old material.
@@Dragonsmana thanks for explaining it.
I feel that Emily Armstrong has don a great job with the band's vocals.
I mean with Vince's reputation currently being what it is, at this point I don't think bringing back Benoit could hurt it more.
@@Dracobyte she's doing nothing good in terms of the bands reputation though. Imagine hiring a scientologist to replace a singer who struggled with mental health like Chester did
I haven't played OW since 2016, so it's exactly how I remembered it 😅
3:43 I think it's unfair for Pat to say Madonna's lying here. I've seen artists like Tyler the Creator forget lyrics to their songs and ad lib on stage, and the time differential with Like a Virgin is WAY larger.
Laundered a whole concord damn bruh
I want Marvel Rivals to succeed, not just because it looks great and genuinely fun, but because it will make Blizzard very uncomfortable and mad.
3:38 Smash Mouth was this way about All Star, at least circa 2013. They played an event wt my college and were generally pretty pissy at request for it from the crowd. When they eventually did play it, people started leaving so I'm guessing they kinda knew that'd be the result
Woolie channeling his inner Dante AND Vergil with this lighting
¡¡Ultraviolet!!
"You think you do but you don't" wasn't just WoW Classic, it was the whole damn game for like 4 years.
for context:
The game was, and still is, directed by a fella named "Ion Hazzikostas". He got hired on a boss designer first around 2007~2008, and then made director in 2016. He was the director of the game during the expansions of Legion, Battle for Azeroth, Shadowlands, Dragonflight, and now The War Within.
"Battle for Azeroth" and "Shadowlands" are far and away the worst the game's ever been, because of a mountain of feature that made the game's progression awkward, keeping up to date a massive chore, and at times random how strong your character could be. All of the "new" features conceived under his direction (with a single exception) were widely hated, and he walked back TONS of them during their expansions, and basically all of them once Dragonflight launched.
The important thing to know is that he was a prominent math doer before he was a fight designer, he got noticed in the first place for proving a boss was mathematically impossible.
So basically all his direction for the game is grounded in his ideal way to play the game.
Unfortunately, Just so turns out that his ideal for what the game should be has almost no common ground with what the average player wants.
Specifically he LOVED build crafting, and all of his systems were designed to force players to build craft. Turns out most players just wanna download the best build from the website *he used to write for* and slap dragons with their friends. The systems all forced you into some subset of the total options available to your character, some by tedious grinds (eventually made free), some by irreversible choices (eventually walked back), and some by vicious RNG (eventually made selectable). All they did was encourage the low end players to curse the misfortune of their birth, and at the extreme high end encourage players to delete and remake their characters until they got the random subset that was the best for high end content.
@@Tyberes "he got noticed in the first place for proving a boss was mathematically impossible."
It probably was beatable, vanilla players were notoriously bad at the game in terms of knowing what's ACTUALLY optimal and any hardcore Classic guild probably could've cleared it.
It should be noted that when "You think you do, but you don't" was said, it was during the era of Warlords of Draenor, which had up to that point been considered the worst content Blizz had put out and was responsible for such massive sub loss that Blizz permenantly stopped publicly telling us the sub numbers. So they clearly took it very personally when we basically said to them "hey your shit sucks right now, can we go back to when WoW was actually good?"
@@Tyberes tbf pinning the blame for bfa and shadowlands on ion ignores the fact that the he wasn't the guy who wrote those expacs. Afrasiabi was the mastermind on those three and by the time he was off the WoW team BfA would have been at least half done and SL would have been in early production.
I'd recommend reading or listening to some of Jason Schreier's work on what was going on at Blizzard. After the cancelation of Project Titan, Bobby Kotick and Activision tightened their grip on Blizzard and forced them to hire a CFO. The corporate neck breathing kept ramping up and led to a marked shift in their design philosophy, with more monetization and engagement mechanics that made the game feel more like a chore. After the Microsoft merger began and Kotick was expelled, the WoW team was given a huge infusion of funding and had the freedom to move away from those gameplay elements. Dragonflight and TWW have been largely regarded as a return to form for the game.
Everyone knows that the reason why Blizzard took away Overwatch is because they knew no one would actually move to Overwatch 2 if they had the choice of either.
Worse, it's because they made a promise that you'd never had to pay for more with OW1 after buying the game. So they made OW2 where that's not the case and forced everyone to move over to that as a loophole.
I mean the real reason is that Overwatch 2 is not a different game and it was just a patch with a logo change.
Overwatch 2 was actually Jeff Kaplan's pet project. He never wanted to make the original Overwatch into a Game As Service, he wanted it to be a box product with some short term post-launch support that would eventually transition into more robust Overwatch 2 with a PvE campaign and then eventually set the stage for an MMO. Competing interests from the Activision side, the heavy investment in the game's PvP scene, and difficulty in getting the PvE campaign up and off the ground eventually caused them to completely change what OW2 was going to be and Jeff walked.
Wow and I thought destiny 2 being free to play after paying full price was disrespectful. overwatch is now much much worse.
TF2 fans: "First time?"
@@thecaptain6520tf2 wasn't 60 bucks
@@pileofsmiles still paid for it
You mean the Orange Box? @@thecaptain6520
Destiny 2 is still worse IMO
They actively took away content on top of going free. My 60 dollars meant nothing at the end
There's a lot of stuff in the Jason Schrier book, but one of the craziest is that internally the entire overwatch team was like "it's good that overwatch succeeded, but obviously it's just a starting point to build the mmo we always wanted it to be."
Now I’m not gonna say “you think you do” was justified or aged well, but I do think the sentiment behind that phrasing is true. Most people don’t want OW1 the game, they want to experience OW1 as a sensation again, which you can’t replicate. People are already turning on it and going “yeah no this sucks” which like, yeah it’s not the zeitgeist anymore. You keep chasing that high and you’ll have realized you’d dug yourself 40 ft deep way too late.
Tl;Dr: DOOM 2016 was absolutely snubbed at the game awards and OW winning was a fucking embarrassment seconded to PUBG being nominated.
I played OW for a solid 2-3 years and it getting worse over time isn't untrue in some regards, but I really don't think that's the case. There were, in fact, so many patches that people almost universally celebrated. Like nerfing Diva for example, after Dive really popped off. Also as far as new characters, everyone always loved Ana, the very first one, she pretty much feels like a core character.
I've found that a lot of people who clamor for "the old thing" are really desperate for it to make them feel like the old thing did when it was new. And it can't, because we're not the same as we were back then.
13:05 "E-sports-sports-sports-sports"
Shoutouts to Arturo Sanchez
ain’t no shoutouts to be had that guy’s a prehistoric asshole, going down the same pits as gootecks
Well, at least StarCraft remastered turned out to be pretty great.
Too bad that several of the devs of its studio / department where not given enough time or money for Warcraft 3: Reforged.
Woolies lighting makes him look like Vivec
I'm praying that Marvel Rivals delivers. I want that same feelings as when Overwatch first came out.
Me too!
I want to go back.
But back to before they cut HotS' life support to plug in Overwatch's.
The music artist(s) that come to mind is the Glitch Mob. Their best album is still Drink the Sea, from 2010 (and the following EP from 2011), and nothing they've done since comes close IMO. Which frustrates me to no end.
Still happily married to TF2.
Final chapter any day now.
They won't kill rivals. It's Marvel, baby
OW classic baffles me because there were so many design choices people DETESTED at launch. blizzard just found different holes to dig after that. like, people were tilted in the open beta. maybe if Classic magically transported you into a universe where blizzard put meaningful effort into playtesting, it would be worthwhile
The WoW Classic "you think you want this but you don't" shit is never not funny to me, WoW Classic private servers existed from the moment TBC came out and nowadays there's private servers for not only every expansion but individual patches too. I like to think given that quote was happening during Warlords of Draenor and they were struggling hard basically from them all the way through to Dragonflight (depending on who you ask even from Cata to DF) even without FF14s meteoric rise that they knew releasing WoW Classic would have destroyed the Retail population.
I mean it applies here. Everyone that tried out OW classic pretty much agrees that its dogshit. And everyone who never played overwatch 1 tried it for the first time and also agrees that its ass. Like...they are not wrong.
I think the funny thing about Overwatch classic is it's a monkey's paw scenario. For the longest time people just wanted 6v6 and then they announce this. Every interaction I've had with people who've played the Overwatch classic have said "Yeah this is shit, we wanted to go back but not this far back."
and they're not doing that, there's a 6v6 playtest with modern balancing being held right after the ow classic event is done. like, this is literally just for nostalgia, it's not the actual 6v6 test. im kinda baffled so many people are this misinformed about it.
in retrospect 2016 overwatch was balanced like shit but god fucking damn is it the most fun with the game I've had since it's been renamed to overwatch 2
The crazy part is that they are making it a temporary change. Just reset the game back to Overwatch 1 already, and I can't believe I am saying this but also bring back the loot boxes cuz they are better than the season pass...
the move to an itemshop/battlepasses fucking ruined that game so bad. by no means was it good before that but actually being able to earn and unlock cosmetics by leveling up a few times without paying 100 dollars for 4 skins is sorely missed.
It's almost like modern Blizzard doesn't know how to do anything other than desperately copy the company's past devs or fuck shit up. Sometimes both. *coughs in Warcraft 3*
Man people really like to lump team 4 and the rest of blizzard together to shit on them for actions that they barely had control over
Tbf WoW is in the best place it's been in years and it's full of new features and looking to add more.
@@Vaishino I've heard War Within is pretty good, I won't take that from them, even as someone who fell off in Shadowlands.
@@VaishinoI want to say I saw someone make the exact opposite claim about 1 minute prior to seeing this
@@UCannotDefeatMyShmeat was it someone who hasn't played the game since shadowlands or longer like pat, or one of the "I don't like new things so the player housing announcement has me angry" people?
oh wow, we have classic crazy talk in this episode, i havent seen him in a while!
The only good game i noticed on my radar are Warhammer and Metaphor. Metaphor thanks to this channel
What are your favorite genres? So I can recommend you some gems.
@Dracobyte Oldie fan from Two Best Friends era so i usually watch when they show niche niiiiche games. i.e Dragons Crown, Darkest Dungeon, Gungeon, 13 Sentinels, Disco to Elysium... Personally i like Fighting Games, rpgs, story driven games, and recently roguelikes.
@Dracobyte I love how the first three games you list are all dungeon related.
@willadkins1354 Soz hahahaahahahahah was trying to think fast lmfao. There was This War of Mine, Persona 4 Arena, uhhh uhhhhhhhh.... omg tht randomly good Transformers Game by Platinum?
Been playing OW Classic and man I really don't get why Pat is doubling down on "every patch made the game worse", every match I've played against is just 6 widows or hanzos and you can't do anything to counter them except be a better sniper somehow.
They do need to bring back 6v6 proper though.
@@Ryaomon it's true to his experience with the game, which ended in 2017 I'm guessing
Its because pat doesnt play OW and has no idea what he is talking about. Everyone agrees that this version is funny for like 5 matches and then you realize how ass it is compared to overwatch 2.
I have no reason to defend Overwatch or Blizzard, but most people saying early Overwatch was the best are just saying it because they didn't play enough to understand how unfun some of its quirks were.
Completely agree. I am bias in that I didn't like the game at launch but many people are able to be critical now without the fresh OW1 hype.
Balance is awful but to me it's clear the devs had no clue how the game was going to be played. And the players didn't either, many of them thought widow was bad. Ow2 has issues but it's much better than OW1 launch that people get nostalgic over
Picking Mei should be considered a bannable offense.
The modern era of video games is weird. If someone told me in the ‘90s that in the future video games with get updated versions that made them increasingly worse and less fun to play, I wouldn’t believe it.
The journey Blizzard has went on with Overwatch has to be one of the most bizarre in all of video games.
But I've played every version of Street Fighter 2
Woolie you missed a perfect opportunity to say Eminem on people who say fuck it fine here's the old thing considering Houdini was LITERALLY him saying fuck it fine here's slim shady
It being limited makes me not feel like even bothering with it, I really enjoyed 1.0 overwatch but this is stupid.
3:24 Reminder that Radiohead will just NOT play Creep live.
More recent reminder that Thom Yorke independently made a newer 13 minute version of Creep that sounds like ass, just so he could play that version if people requested it. Literally the same tactics as Blizzard lol, you like this dumb song so much huh?? What if I ruin it for you?
I personally long for the days of toxic gaming, I miss the era of "Are you guys going Trick Or Treating" in Counterstrike
That was an era?
@@UCannotDefeatMyShmeat Era as in "that point in multiplayer gaming where moments like that were special, but not necessarily rare"
Its been awhile since I seen pat. But his beard looks like he drank some milk and didn't clean it off, and I can't unsee it now.
4:26 [heavy is the crown]
If you had to choose between becoming the human equivalent of Overwatch 2 or the human equivalent of Concord, which would you pick?
Ocerwatch 2, but solely because of character designs, some of the Voice Actors and the setting.
Overwatch 2, because if I was Concord, I'd be a corpse.
Why is this bad and desperate? This seems like a natural thing to do since WoW classic. Also pretty sure most OW players don't seriously want classic. Most want OW1 right before it died with current reworks or just OW2
And people were saying I was cynical for calling the OW Classic event nostalgia bait 😂
The insidious thing about this Overwatch Classic is they didn't do anything to the rewards you get. You still get the tiniest of pennies and are FORCECD to drop full-priced game money on a couple of skins. There are still no lootboxes or any real way to earn rewards. You get the basic match gameplay but none of the reason people stuck around to constantly earn free MEANINGFUL rewards every couple of matches.
Oh, and the stuff you do earn from the event? One spray. One profile card. One emblem. One other bullshit menu thing. That's all you earn. No skins, you gotta pay for those.
overwatch "classic" holy shit fucking LMAOOOOOOOO
this is slurm classic like what the fuck
this is one of the most hilarious humbling backdowns I've ever seen. but I still fucking hate it because it shows that they'll crawl back rather than just at least go bloody bankrupt.
Is it true that some Marvel Rivals devs were charged with money laundering?
It was management and execs iirc not the devs themselves
Not Rivals devs specifically, but execs at NetEase
@@notsoywow that is crazy!
Game devs don't have enough money to commit those kinds of crimes
@@notsoy I see, thanks for the clarification.
Kids, what does rizz mean?
It is a slang word derived from "Charisma".
Why does woolie look like vivic from morrowwind in this one
He knows what he did.
* Vivec.
It's not even the old maps either, they're the current versions of the original maps.
Man people really have nostalgia goggles for 1.0 overwatch. 1.0 is traaaaaash compared to current ow
It's really funny. Overwatch 2 truly has no reason to exist. They canceled every possible idea for why they made the shift.
It will be awesome when we will have overwatch classic, wow classic and hearthstone classic.
Imma be real, after playing overwatch classic for a few hours, the current form of overwatch 2 is better
So what crime against humanity has act/bliz committed before making this anouncement?
I mean I'm sitting here wanting to play Marvel Rivals constantly and I've had zero interest to even download overwatch again so yeah Rivals already won in my mind.
Overwatch "classic" died when they introduced Moira and Brigette, two healers than function without looking at allies and out DPS'd the DPS characters. Segway that into nerfing fun characters over and over in service of inserting more poorly considered characters so they can keep selling lootboxes. When those lootbox sales dried up, selling over half a billion dollars worth of copies by the end of 2016.
I've been through enough game cycles now to recognize what choices were made in overwatch post-release were centralized around refocusing players onto new characters and selling them the kind of skins you wish the characters would always have had AFTER they nerf that character to the point of it not being fun to main. Seems like there's a high focus on withholding the things that would give you dopamine and nostalgia vibes ONLY WHEN BLIZZARD HAS DONE BAD.
I’ll only play OW classic if they bring back Jeff Kaplin for three weeks
Honestly as someone who's played every version of OW and OW2 classic OW is ass. Roadhog hooks are ignorant and hero stacking while fun gets old fast. Mid OW was peak tho. OW2 on launch was great and 5v5 isn't awful just 6v6 needs to be balanced better cause double barrier tanks was a slogfest.
Also idc for marvel so sadly OW still better to me.
Fwiw i dont think the whole money thing is connected directly to Marvel Rivals
Let's not go calling Marvel Rivals babe until we see their *true* monetization scheme. It will be bad, I promise you.
Reverse? Good.
Limited time? Piss off.
And then there’s Valorant, the other overwatch
Valorant is just Fortnite CS:GO
@@izikmiddleton9996 as opposed to Apex Legends which is Fortnite Overwatch
Straftat clears i'm afraid.
Just bring back 6v6.
Overwatch Classic kinda served as a reminder of how good we have it now. It’s fun as a nostalgia trip, but I definitely prefer most of the changes we have now.
Pat saying “The game got worse with every patch” makes me remember that he hasn’t played the game in seven years and I don’t particularly care about his opinions on it
@@kot4311it's just like when he talks about WoW, a game he hasn't played since wrath of the lich king.
Not sure what you're talking about.
1.0 Overwatch was *the* casual experience. People played because it was fun, the progression felt well and each character felt distinct. Now, every single healer follows a nearly similar formula, every tank is given too much responsibility and every DPS must either one shot the target or not bother.
I played with plenty of people recently, ones that didn't witness release OW. You know what their most common line was? "X is broken/overpowered!" Yes. It is. But just like everything being OP in COD MW2 cancelled itself out and made it silly but fun, so it does here. Everything is busted. Therefore, nothing is
But devs listened to the 0.5% of the playerbase - the competitive sweatlords that wanted to not have a casual game. And we ended up in a trash pile we are now. Where balancing and nerfing was more important than having fun
@@jpjfrey5673Not to be rude, but a lot of this is just wrong. The devs have actively worked to remove all one-shots except Widow. Hanzo only recently got some one shot potential back and the devs made it clear that was temporary until they have something else for him. Plenty of non- oneshot DPS are viable. Hell tracer has been meta for a lot of OW2
It's very clear that the devs, like most devs, try to balance for everyone. Not saying they always succeeded but it's clear that was their intent. Otherwise characters like Sojurn and Kirko would have been dumpstered immediately with how much they dominated high rank. Instead they tried to raise lower the skill floor and keep the skill ceiling worth it by making body shots more rewarding and headshots slightly less.
No problem having a different opinion on OW1 though. I will say that with OW classic, it's clear that a big part of the fun was people not knowing how to play the game
I would legit go back if they brought back old Sombra (before recent rework) she was the last bit of fun I found in even OW2 and they ruined her because bronze players got pissy.
Hopefully Marvel Rivals destroys OW completely.
Y'know it's just how it is but ever since I recently actually started playing OW2, hearing them talk about it is kinda painful. Like people complaining about a pothole that was fixed years ago.
yeah it's a little painful hearing them talk out of their ass lol.
especially when the actual proper 6v6 tests are coming out right after the classic event is done. like blizz went out and wrote in big letters that classic is like a nostalgia event and not the actual playtest. sometimes i wish they'd do some like even surface level research before talking about it. it's still like a cynical move putting release overwatch back for a few weeks, but not for the reason they're saying lmao.
I am sorry but this is really a redditor approach when everytime blizzard does basically anything you shit on it because upvotes to the right. Thats what pat is doing here. He doesnt play the game, he doesnt know what the community thinks. This is nothing but a neat little option to play the really old version of the game that will never come back and that millions have never had the chance to play. Its fun for a handful of matches and then it does indeed fall apart when compared to current overwatch 2. So yall are just really really laser-focused on trying to shit on something thats basically just entirely positive for the community that actually plays the game.
This isnt even the actual 6v6 test yet, that comes later this year. So all you did here was hear the name blizzard and overwatch and figured youll just talk some shit for the updoots. Yall can defo do better than that.
I find this funny cause I’ve heard nothing of this laundering news though I’ve been in the petty parts of the overwatch community and still budding rivals community so I guess it doesn’t mean much rn lol.
These guys proving they still don't know what they're talking about saying that a full team revive is a good thing
It is. When everyone gets their alt back so quick it really doesn't matter that a whole team can be revived.
@@idontknowanymore4739 forcing team comp to include one specific character because they are game breaking is not good game design
>Releases great game
>Slowly ruin the game over time
>Release the original game
They literally have done that to all of their ips
1:30
Like.
I wouldn't say EVERY patch made overwatch worse, unless we're talking post 2017, THEN every patch made the game worse
I'm retroactively justified in thinking Marvel Rivals looked like a fake-ass cash grab game!
It's almost like the signs were there yet people continue to mindlessly consume their products. Doesn't make it right but I don't get the outrage.
17:00 You guys are so close to understanding that personal income taxes are about control, yet still so far because of how Canadian you both are.
LMAO, I ain't touchIng either. Fucking f2p hero shooters bore the shit outta me, even the one that stars characters I like.
Every time I hear about Madonna for the past 25 years, I think of Kenny from South Park ranting about her on his deathbed after the Make-a-Wish Foundation stupidly suggested meeting her as his last wish