Also keep in mind that the DX7 responds to a range of velocity from 0 to only 100. And the SY77 responds to the full standard range of velocity which is 0 to 127. This will greatly affect the sound especially with FM.
But in this case it seems to be a disadvantage of the SY. It mostly sounds dull and thin compared to the TX, which has a kind of natural compression. On the other hand, the SY sounds gorgeous in countless demos. Probably a conversion issue, indeed.
i have an sy77, and if you can get hold of data sheets for the dx7 (like the old ones on magazines and stuff), you can program the same sound into the sy77 just by using a calculator to convert the values, since in some the dx7 has 100 and the sy77 has 64. i figured this out yesterday and have already translated the bass 1 preset and the strings too! sounds exactly like the dx7 with some tweaking, really minor tweaking, and you can set how the sound reacts to velocity to get around the 100 vs 127 velocity issue with conversions :) if anyone wants to know more about how to translate some sounds just comment and ill try to give some tips 🙌😄
I have the sy77/tg77 and I have them for their own sounds and capabilities. I would like the DX7 ll FD but more for nostalgic reasons than superior sound. The SY77/TG77 are 16 voices at 16 midi parts multi timbrel as well as having sampled sounds for layering ala D50. The really nice thing is also you can layer the FM sounds by 4 layers per patch and do cross switching and so on! So much synth power.. I can hardly contain myself lol! Now, I also have the Korg Opsix and Yamaha DX200 and both do sounds I could not duplicate on a classic DX7 but could on FM7/FM8 soft synth. Indeed those 2 units are like hardware versions of FM8 but I know I know.. The Korg IS a software synth in a box.. What.. everrr! LOL! The SY77 on the other hand?? Wowsa!
This is really interesting. I own a TG77 and FS1R, but I don't have a DX7 , so I can't compare myself. I know that a lot of FM synths and FM programs can read DX7 sysex files directly with no conversion, so they might do a better job. For example, it would be interesting to compare a DX7 and Dexed on these same sounds, since no conversion would be needed. A Montage or MODX will also read DX7 sysex.
The converter seems to produce a very good starting point for each patch to tweak by yourself until it sounds as one wants it to sound. The SY77 patches all sound less agressive and mellow. Maybe more feedback / resonance and more agressive envelopes would make them better?
Exactly , sy factory converts the feedback loops wrong I exported plogue ops 7 (which is a near perfect dx7 emulator ) as sysex files , convered them with FM heaven and al feedback loops were wrong
Is there a comprehensive video or community that can help me add patches and stuff to my SY99? I want to add so many sounds to my SY99 but I cant find enough resources to help me understand what Im supposed to do.
Close, I use Dexed and a mk1 DX7 witch are closer. Nothing beats a mk1 for added dirt and grit ( and even warmth?) and i like the key bed better on it versus a DX7 2.
Nearly bought a sy77 for $200 at a yard sale, but i was like 12 at the time and didn't know what it really was so i passed on it. looking back, kinds sucks now.
Tack för din video Martin! Jag har en DX7 II FD och en expanderad SY77:a (kort för att addera egna samplingar och ett special minneskort med 16 banker). Sy77/TG77är en underskattad synth som kan låta riktigt bra. Jag får prova att installera SY factory igen och prova konverteringen. Tyckte dock som du att det bara blev godkänt men inte perfekt. Mvh Skånepåg
Jag har precis skaffat en SY99 istället för SY77:an och som du säger; underskattade synthar! Konverteringen är inte perfekt men klassiska elpiano blir väldigt nära originalet. :)
i made an editor for the sy77 in max and added a feature that could convert dx7 sysex patches. i didn't have a dx7 to check if it was exact, but the results were definitely usable most of the time. i'd post the patch but it's a total mess, plus I sold my sy77 cus i'm an idiot.
I think it’s great to be able to convert DX7 patches but the SY77 itself is a bigger beast and there are great patches out there made especially for it. I think I’ll keep the E.piano for layering and detuning with the TX7.
The differences are minor and just need a little editing to adjust. I have SY Manager for my SY77 and all of the parameters are easy to access and adjust. It's a great editor/librarian.
Hey Synth Fellow. Please help. You think it makes sense to change SY 77 to 99? I use 77 for AFM sounds. Now I have the opportunity to buy 99 in nice price 🙂
The patches won't sound the same, because the chipset is different in each one. The FM and FM2 engines are different. So, sorry to say, your comparison was not well founded.
You´re absolutely right. I was just trying to demo the possibilities of converting the og DX7 patches into SY77 format wich is an often asked question wether it's possible or not. And as you say, the result is ... naahh... :)
Also keep in mind that the DX7 responds to a range of velocity from 0 to only 100. And the SY77 responds to the full standard range of velocity which is 0 to 127. This will greatly affect the sound especially with FM.
Great input! Thank You!
But in this case it seems to be a disadvantage of the SY. It mostly sounds dull and thin compared to the TX, which has a kind of natural compression. On the other hand, the SY sounds gorgeous in countless demos. Probably a conversion issue, indeed.
@@RayyMusik the SY’s are GREAT machines and should really be played as they are intended and let the OG dx7 do its own work ;)
Opcode Galaxy for the Mac had a wonderful and very accurate conversion of DX7 to SY77 patches. This was many years ago and it worked great.
i have an sy77, and if you can get hold of data sheets for the dx7 (like the old ones on magazines and stuff), you can program the same sound into the sy77 just by using a calculator to convert the values, since in some the dx7 has 100 and the sy77 has 64. i figured this out yesterday and have already translated the bass 1 preset and the strings too! sounds exactly like the dx7 with some tweaking, really minor tweaking, and you can set how the sound reacts to velocity to get around the 100 vs 127 velocity issue with conversions :) if anyone wants to know more about how to translate some sounds just comment and ill try to give some tips 🙌😄
Thank you! Now my SY77 is sold and i bought an SY99 instead but they have the same fm-engine so it would be nice to try tweaking some DX7 sounds. :)
Please do a video tutorial
Ooh, I'd love to have the Trumpets patch from the TX-802. I miss that patch so much from selling that unit for a TG-77 that i may never sell!
that's interesting. there was some conversion software in the past but that's long gone i believe
THe reason why it's off is becasue the SY factory does a wrong conversion with the feedback loops
The sy77 can sound almost sound identical to the dx7
I have the sy77/tg77 and I have them for their own sounds and capabilities. I would like the DX7 ll FD but more for nostalgic reasons than superior sound. The SY77/TG77 are 16 voices at 16 midi parts multi timbrel as well as having sampled sounds for layering ala D50. The really nice thing is also you can layer the FM sounds by 4 layers per patch and do cross switching and so on! So much synth power.. I can hardly contain myself lol! Now, I also have the Korg Opsix and Yamaha DX200 and both do sounds I could not duplicate on a classic DX7 but could on FM7/FM8 soft synth. Indeed those 2 units are like hardware versions of FM8 but I know I know.. The Korg IS a software synth in a box.. What.. everrr! LOL! The SY77 on the other hand?? Wowsa!
I believe the SY 77/99 is underrated as synths. Look away from the AWM side of them and they’re FM monsters.
This is really interesting. I own a TG77 and FS1R, but I don't have a DX7 , so I can't compare myself. I know that a lot of FM synths and FM programs can read DX7 sysex files directly with no conversion, so they might do a better job. For example, it would be interesting to compare a DX7 and Dexed on these same sounds, since no conversion would be needed. A Montage or MODX will also read DX7 sysex.
The DX7 and Dexed are pretty close. Closer than SY77 and DX7. IMHO.
i own a SY77 and its definitely the better one.
I agree to a point. It depends on what want out of a keyboard/synth ;)
I own a DX7 and feel it’s the better one
@@ytpremium7649 nope
The converter seems to produce a very good starting point for each patch to tweak by yourself until it sounds as one wants it to sound.
The SY77 patches all sound less agressive and mellow. Maybe more feedback / resonance and more agressive envelopes would make them better?
I agree .. a great start to tweak the sounds.
You should do more videos; seem great at them...
Thank you and yes, there are more videos planned :) .. I quote Behringer "We're just warming up"
thes are two very different shoes. DX/TX 7 pure original great powerful FM!! But: SY-Series has so many many more sound options...
Of course. The SY77 is a FM beast but I think it was fun to do a test. I love them both and will keep them both.
A near perfect conversion is possible. If it is not sounding the same, then it is a matter of the software not converting everything correctly.
Exactly , sy factory converts the feedback loops wrong
I exported plogue ops 7 (which is a near perfect dx7 emulator ) as sysex files , convered them with FM heaven and al feedback loops were wrong
Is there a comprehensive video or community that can help me add patches and stuff to my SY99? I want to add so many sounds to my SY99 but I cant find enough resources to help me understand what Im supposed to do.
If you got all the patches as sysex you need a usb to midi cable and a program like MIDIOX to send them to the SY99.
Close, I use Dexed and a mk1 DX7 witch are closer. Nothing beats a mk1 for added dirt and grit ( and even warmth?) and i like the key bed better on it versus a DX7 2.
Dexed is a SUPER nice software version of the DX7. :)
I love it! Especially when layering two or three pianos with a slight detune
To me the SY sounds way too bright. The TX has a moody lofi character that makes it way more present and vibrant. Thanks for the comparison :)
Thank you for input. :)
The same holds true for dx7 vs later versions. The dx7 was noisier and had more aliasing artifacts which made it sound less clean.
I prefer the mk1 before the DX7s/d/fd
I've read that DXconvert/TXconvert will convert between all these synths. It's freeware, it runs in Python, donations are welcome.
Sounds great! 😀
Nearly bought a sy77 for $200 at a yard sale, but i was like 12 at the time and didn't know what it really was so i passed on it. looking back, kinds sucks now.
It’s so easy to be wise afterwards :)
Tack för din video Martin! Jag har en DX7 II FD och en expanderad SY77:a (kort för att addera egna samplingar och ett special minneskort med 16 banker). Sy77/TG77är en underskattad synth som kan låta riktigt bra. Jag får prova att installera SY factory igen och prova konverteringen. Tyckte dock som du att det bara blev godkänt men inte perfekt. Mvh Skånepåg
Jag har precis skaffat en SY99 istället för SY77:an och som du säger; underskattade synthar! Konverteringen är inte perfekt men klassiska elpiano blir väldigt nära originalet. :)
i made an editor for the sy77 in max and added a feature that could convert dx7 sysex patches. i didn't have a dx7 to check if it was exact, but the results were definitely usable most of the time. i'd post the patch but it's a total mess, plus I sold my sy77 cus i'm an idiot.
I sold mine too in favour of a SY99
do you have any plans to release the sy77 editor? :O
it would be really convenient to have something like that in live!
Yep The SY77 is More Fatter Sounding !!!
I agree ... I've sold the SY77 and got a SY99 instead ;)
i wish you had showed us how you used the program
I suppose I should have but that wasn’t the focus of the video. Hmm perhaps I should do a follow up on that?
@@synthfellow would love that!
pretty poor conversion by that software. But even done by hand I still don't think the SY77 sounds like the DX7
I think it’s great to be able to convert DX7 patches but the SY77 itself is a bigger beast and there are great patches out there made especially for it. I think I’ll keep the E.piano for layering and detuning with the TX7.
DX7 MK-I sounds best.
I agree! If you want DX7 MK1 sounds ;) .... But the SY77 is a bigger FM-beast. I use my TX7 mostly as bass synth...
well... the best sounding FM synh is really the DX5/1, but the DX7-I is the closest you can get to it
The differences are minor and just need a little editing to adjust. I have SY Manager for my SY77 and all of the parameters are easy to access and adjust. It's a great editor/librarian.
Where can I find the SY Manager program?
Hey Synth Fellow. Please help. You think it makes sense to change SY 77 to 99? I use 77 for AFM sounds. Now I have the opportunity to buy 99 in nice price 🙂
Sorry for the late answer but my answer is buy it! I've got my hands on a SY99 and it's WONDERFUL. :)
Be careful, the app no longer runs under OSX Monterey. The developer does not respond to this issue ...
I didn’t know that. I run all my stuff on Windows.
Soundiver converts
They should have called the sy77 the dx77 ....it would have sold waaaay better
The patches won't sound the same, because the chipset is different in each one. The FM and FM2 engines are different. So, sorry to say, your comparison was not well founded.
You´re absolutely right. I was just trying to demo the possibilities of converting the og DX7 patches into SY77 format wich is an often asked question wether it's possible or not. And as you say, the result is ... naahh... :)