Church Archives: Spencer W Kimball Describes the Native Americans as Lamanites
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- Опубліковано 11 вер 2024
- Segment from a 1950 General Conference address demonstrates how the church leaders saw the Native Americans as the descendants of the Lamanites and Nephites.
07:45 - Indian Placement Program
He left out the part about Brigham and the first presidency approval of Special Order no 2. To exterminate the Timpanogos people In Utah.
Didn’t Brigham put ground glass into the bags of flour sold to them?
Scott Johnson Yes they did put glass in the flour.
@@scottjohnson1024 😭 I thought I heard all I could about this horrible man.
I'm half Native. I can't change colors. I'm no Lamanite. I don't carry anyone's curse. And I have no responsibility or accountability for anyone else's actions.
Thank you so much for sharing this.
dam right babe
I’m half Samoan.
@@samoansuave_45sole than you shouldn’t believe our people are descendants of wicked people turned black by god🤦🏽♂️😂 that’s what Joseph smith claims our origins. Like sole let’s go back to Samoa and show them what true worship looks like aaiiinnnggg
Sole uce how are you Uso?
This is what I was taught growing up... And I believed and accepted it... It's what I taught as a missionary in south america...
Me too!!!!
@@MaryH-ol2sd I left the church two years ago this summer... and now I no longer believe any of this.
@@bonegrubber welcome to your new, full life. It will take time to un-brainwash yourself but you can do it.
The church is betting that once the boomer generation passes on then everything will be forgotten and the church will no longer have ties to Mormonism and will then be true!
Joseph Smith always said it was North America. While he was in liberty jail, nauvoo expositor published something about south America which was never verified by JS. AND there was migration and ll kinds of people who came to America (North and South). Just because north American IS book of mormon, doesnt mean the savior didnt also have prophets and appear to those in south america also. He had many that he visited that we will learn of one day soon. Gospel is still true. Book of Mormon is more true today than ever before.
ua-cam.com/video/rHVh3bDYGRE/v-deo.html
Facts trumps Faiths.
There's a Mormon Stories episode that covers Indian Placement Program. Members were sharing stories of how they could see the Indian children's skin getting whiter as they began to live the gospel. Yeah.....
That was actually said by Spencer W. Kimball during another General Conference talk a decade or two after the 1950 talk above.
What in the actual phuck
Is there a video of that somewhere ❓
@@palousetrance2823 Is there a video of that somewhere ❓
@@Preus-by8ru There is. I've seen it. I've lost the link though.
Little did JS know that the forces to prevail against him would be his own! Leadership that is...🤣😂🤣
That's how we know the BOM isn't meant for the millennium. It doesn't hold up to technology or values today.
The 4:45 mark. “Become a white and delightsome people.” I’ve never seen SWK younger like this. I think he believed what he was saying.
Just terrible. In 2012, I was with my daughter in Primary and the teacher pointed out a First Nations boy calling him a Lamanite. Even as a believer I was so uncomfortable with that 🤦♂️
Aww. Poor kid. Same thing happened to me in a high school class.
you can call them cult members like lori vallow fanaticals. Later is true
Soon the narrative will be that the BOM is meant not as a history but as a way to teach people valuable lessons. Meant to be taken spiritually and not literally. And the members will rationalize this change as equating it to how Jesus taught parables that were not meant to be taken as real or actual events, but as teaching guides.
You are on to something. I believe this is happening already. (Some of my husbands family is Mormon)
Gina's right. It's already happening.
Google "Book Of Mormon Geography Essay". The church has had an essay posted on their website for years telling members the BoM is not historical and its geography and historical (in)accuracies are not to be discussed in church settings since it is purely a spiritual and not a historical book.
In anticipation of an apologetic response, the issue here is not merely that earlier church leaders were speaking like this, it's as much, or more so, to do with the fact that this way of speaking and thinking about BoM historicity was the _primal messaging_ to the membership of the church in a time when the church had a _very very tight grip_ on the information about itself as well as a very tight grip on the minds of the members. The leaders of the church throughout the 20 century could direct the beliefs and attitudes of the membership in nearly any way they wanted _without_ having to make official statements on various positions as an organization.
And now that they have lost control of the information and are continuing to lose control of the minds of the membership, they can utilize this lack of explicit, official endorsement to present what appear to be justifiable apologetic arguments and damage control messaging to the membership regarding those words of prophets and apostles and at the same time direct their beliefs and attitudes away from those now debunked teachings.
SO there you have it. Sounds like doctrine to me. So many problems with the Church's treatment of native peoples. Taking children from their families and putting them into LDS families was a horrible idea among many others.
"Taking children from their families and putting them into LDS families"
Ya, I mean I'm all for accountability but let's not spin false narratives.
@@notimelikethepresent4739 Are you denying that program ever happened? Because I was alive when it was implemented.
@@DMichaelAtLarge
What did I quote?
They weren't "taken", they were quite literally enrolled into the program by their families. The Church even made efforts to make it increasingly difficult for people to get their children into the program despite its overwhelming popularity.
It's a false narrative to describe it as this person did.
@@notimelikethepresent4739 As I said, I lived through it, and I personally met Native Americans who were outraged by the program.
@@DMichaelAtLarge
And as I said, I was responding to the claim that they were "taken", when they weren't. Whether some Natives didn't like the program is immaterial to the point I was making.
Native Americans have historically ALWAYS been described as "Lamanites" by the "leaders" of the Church. They also described all the Polynesians, etc., as "Lamanites," implying that they too somehow are descendants of Book of Mormon characters who landed in the Americas from Israel. No need to start talking about actual realistic possibilities and logic as long as you subscribe to the current theology and philosophy of "the Brethren," even if those ideas are ever-changing . . . right?
This man does such great, unbelievable work on his videos! Such good Clarity, amazing information, actual factual information/data .. and backs it ALL up too!
Great video! I had no idea that past leadership featured Nephite and Lamanite so prominently in their talks.
I emphasize strongly with the guy on the right. Why am I sitting here?
I think that guy on the right may be Bruce R. McKonkie. He wrote a book "Mormon Doctirine" which has since been dismissed by the church and taken out of circulation.
Kent Judkins Ive wondered why modern leaders disavow this history of their church, this was only 1950-70s??! Has anyone ever called out the pompous GAs out in public? I wish the BYU students would since they are usually the ones with face to face Q&A firesides!
Nice thumbnail. Spencer looking a bit like Al Capone.
Spencer does a really good job channeling the bigotry predominant when the BoM was published.
This doctrine made me ashamed of the color of my skin and my Native ancestry. I literally hid myself from the sun in hopes of losing the cursed shade of brown and becoming white and delightsome. I was so foolish.
They were black people
The trusty old Mormon flip flop..
Retracting what Mormon prophets of old have said. The good old : "That was then and this is now, and he was speaking as a man".
Remember Adam/God?
Since they're constantly updating and changing what a prophet of yesteryear has said into what the new prophet now says, it must needs be that they must also get a brand new Christ each time also, for Him to be in step with contemporary doctrine and policy.
#FACTS
I think that Spencer really believed what he was talking about. If not he’s or was a d... good actor. The emotion and Fiber he was delivering it, just marvelous. I never accepted this as a fact. 😱
I grew up in the LDS Church of the 1970s, I remember being taught that the Book of Mormon was an actual history of the native peoples of north, central, South America and the pacific. Most LDS were pretty optimistic that in time science would confirm the truthfulness of the Book of Mormon. There was nothing abstract, most teaching of the church were very literal. We very much believed that if the Lamenites were converted and baptized in the church that their scene would turn white.
True. What was once considered doctrine is now not doctrine. "Mormonism" of the past will soon become a hiss word to the rising generation just as polygamy is today. The church gets away with just about anything by using the continuing revelation card.
ua-cam.com/video/rHVh3bDYGRE/v-deo.html
ya they had a whole traveling musical play called the Laminate Generation my dad still,has the tapes
You might have believed that. I grew up in the 1960s never dreamed that their skin would change color. I thought of white and delightsome as relating to an inner beauty that radiated out…….like Sister Lee, my primary teacher.
no lol lds and books fiction fiundbonly fiction section. Look this fanatical old man with big ears talking weird
I have changed so much that now it sounds like he is bragging and aggrandizing Mormonism to the point of nausea, excluding the disgusting racism.
Obviously they are lamanites, ive heard alot of mormons saying they have heard indians talking about
Their book of mormon history.
Ive known quite a few and had some good laughs, seriously though i find their oral stories interesring
it's pretty undeniable with video evidence that they viewed native americans and apparently just anyone brown under the sun as canonically Lamanite or Nephite. that shit was 100% real to this man.
I was raised a Mormon for 18 years.And I can testify that the church keeps changing what they believe with politics.Which is why I quit among many other reasons.
think rather have dr phil do dental work stay in tbat bull shit
It s interesting to hear what his voice was like before
Disgusting. Great find. Thanks for sharing.
I don't believe he is right, but I am wondering why you find it disgusting?
I’m gonna start my own religion. 🙃
Hey, if Joe Smith could do it, well why not?
church of Mopar?
@@xaverrogers4910 Merica
A later talk by Kimball with similar sentiments. speeches.byu.edu/talks/spencer-w-kimball/lamanite-burden-burden/
Hey miss you are you okay?!? Where are your new videos!? I watch you everyday. Even your old ones. I'm not a stalker. Lol It's just That you tell it like it is! You got me to think about things differently, unfortunately I grew up in what I don't want to meanly call a cult... but let's just call it what it is, and you helped me see things so much more clearly I can't thank you enough for everything! This guy's the best! Unbelievable, the info, the clarity, the patience, and you seem like a really good dad also! Please make more videos :-) this one was great by the way I watched it last month though! LOL I know I pretty much just said that. But thank you Jon! You're the best I hope everything's okay! I hope you didn't move the channel, and I wasn't aware LOL, have faith anyway oh, I know like church told us to, LOL but hey let's just hold on to that truth, have faith, don't ever live in fear of that organization! Don't let them ever bully you! They did that enough to us! By lying to us, and try to almost Hold Us hostage, in this unbelievable masked and camouflage incredibly harmful religion! I say that with passion as I tell the truth, thank you for all you've done!! I believe we are all children of a higher you know being, but never of an organization again! I didn't realize that's what was going on while I was in the church! Thank you for all you do! Please make more videos, hoping you're okay! Is everything okay? With love, probably your number one fan.. Mary.
The Anglo Saxons and celts which were living on which is now known as Britain at the time that the Romans arrived, were far more savage and uncivilised then the native Americans ever were! And when they arrived in America they were still not fully civilised they went around killing anything that moved killed all the buffalo almost wiped out the natives of the land and created mayhem everywhere they went the Native American people are owed an apology!
Oh no but that wasn’t doctrine .
Only division has sprung up from Mormon doctrine. Jesus is not pleased with division. Creating a class system on earth and in heaven is not pleasing with The Lord.
laminates are another name of savages
Gross. It was the “olden days”, but gross!
All descendants from Adam may share some similarities.
So?
wow that dirty old man said what? Embarasing
...are the principal ancestors of the american indians ... thats what was in the book of mormon .... is it still in there?
the mormon church is racist - D&C tells that the mark of cain was black skin ... while it does not say anything like that in the bible (ohh bible must not have been translated correctly then.. )
and hahha no they are not the ancestors of the american indians ... DNA killed that
but it just amazes me that they can immediately pivot and say past church leaders were wrong... well what if current church leaders are wrong...? I thought they talk to god? obviously that is bs
oh and bringing the gospel to the lamanites ... and in the same instance removing them from their culture
All falsehoods based on a false prophet, Joesph Smith - I'm Indigenous and remain that way as I was created
Hahaha. He Is wrong.
It beggars belief that any one believes such rubbish.
lds con man
How sad to see so many railing against a prophet. For those of you who are atheists, why do you care what anyone believes? We will all be dust soon, right? And for those of you who are Christians, are you really trying to use science to disprove a religion? Doesn't science disprove Christianity? As for me, I know President Kimball is a prophet of God and look forward to seeing him again soon. The Book of Mormon is true, and science will discover that in due time.
How about you address the vulgarity of this talk rather than whine about everyone else? Do you believe in what this "prophet" has said? That Native American skin would turn white if they embraced Mormonism?
@@kalyanman thanks for your reply. However, I don't argue with internet people I don't know. I do however invite you to read the Book of Mormon to find out for yourself it's truthfulness. One day we will all stand before the bar of God and know that Spencer W. Kimball was a prophet. Have a nice day.
@@wyattholtsclaw1175 Yep, as expected. Deflecting when you actually don't have an answer, the oldest trick in the book. I'm a member FYI. Spare me your persecution complex. I have a conscience and I will hold people accountable when they twist the word of God. No one wants you to argue, answering a question doesn't constitute an argument. If you don't want to respond to "internet strangers", then stop commenting like an idiot. Put up or shut up. And then have a nice day.
@@kalyanman I should have known you were a member from your strong testimony of the calling of prophets and Christlike attributes. My bad.
@@wyattholtsclaw1175 Yep, white supremacy vibes from a "prophet" are definitely signs of Christlike attributes. Pull your head out of the sand, you spineless bird.
DNA cannot be used to prove or disprove the BOM, just ask a population geneticist.
We did ask, you numbskull, and they say the Native Americans have NO NO NO NO NO genetic markers consistent with Middle Easterners. EXCEPT a few have a little bit of Hebrew DNA they acquired over 12,000 years ago (way way way way way before BoM timeframes). There are NO NO NO NO NO Hebrew DNA markers among Native Americans from 500-3,000 years ago, for sure. Don't LIE LIE LIE about what scientists have clearly concluded: DNA disproves the BoM, period!
dna proves lds full shit eastasia mongolia