So, I watched the whole video, and I really appreciate this conversation. It feels like my whole life has been a mission in sovereignty and decolonization, and I don't know why it surprises me how many similarities there are between how various colonized cultures are approached and discussed, especially in "academic" and new age/neopagan communities. My beloved Appalachia is full of so many traditions that have continued and evolved from various diasporas, and the roots of why and where these values, stories, and practices came from is often hidden under centuries of colonialism. I rarely get to sit in on such beautifully complex contextualizing stories, and that is the sort of thing that nourishes the core of my being. Here in the U.S. South, that complexity is often shunned, feared, or seen as a threat, in favor of simplistic categories and explanations that further remove us from being capable of righting the relationships around us. "Conflict isn't abuse." -- Thank you for that Angela! I've been running up against that idea a lot lately. It honestly shocks me how often people view basic community accountability, healthy boundaries, expressions of sovereignty, or just a differing perspective based on a differing experience as inherently abusive. Again, thank y'all so much for all your emotional and educational labor. I hope y'all are aware of just how valued and illuminating it is to some of us.
Thoughts while watching this as an American with Irish heritage. My grandmother spent time in and out of Catholic orphanages during her childhood and she hated nuns. I can only imagine the trauma caused by mother and baby farms, *cough, I mean "homes".
From the Southern U.S., thank you a thousand times for all your efforts to educate. Insight, from all you, is so very appreciated and I'm so grateful to have discovered this guidance, which can be difficult to come by the further one is geographically from the source. I hope one of the biggest lessons people learn is to check their sources' sources :)
Thank you all for your time, for explaining the impact on multiple levels in the present and future contexts. I'm from Australia and very recently was referred to Lora's work and have certainly had a few buttons pushed around cultural appropriation, colonisation and even self responsibility for my deeper learning and in understanding my eclectic spirituality in relation to others and culture with respect. For every uncomfy feeling, THANK YOU! I need to grow in this space and I want to do better. I appreciate it.
This... This is so important. I just want to say thank you for putting into clear words why the misinformation is so harmful. If you're going to place yourself as a teacher or an expert you are putting out there your energy and your words and people will listen. You want to have people listen to the correct information that is informed by the culture and the lore. I really appreciate you all four of you and I really appreciate the Irish Pagan School. Thank you thank you thank you ❤️❤️❤️
thank-you all for taking the time to share such heartful messages and voicing your stories... sitting with this and learning. unlearning. and learning some more. so so grateful. every day. GRMA.
Fantastic panel and absolutely necessary. In the spirit of decolonizing our language, please be aware that the phrase 'calling a spade a spade a spade' is racist one in the U.S.
Thanks for highlighting that. It's a common phrase in Ireland that means a literal shovel, as that is an American racist term we don't really see here. But good to note for the international audience.
Excellent panel and discussion. My life's work has been pushing back against this abuse of our traditions, discussions like this prove there is an appetite for authenticity and it's not a hopeless cause :)
This is so necessary and so very much apprecaited. The honesty and points made by all four of you are extremely important. I, and all of us who are students of the IPS are so very fortunate to have found this space.
Thank you so much for this. It's so important in so many cultures fighting for survival right now across the globe. I very much appreciate the work and emotional labor you've all done to put this together.
As someone from the slurry of ethnicities that make up Southern White Trash, I have to say that I was Horrified by the thought of putting out hair and piss. That's such bad information my initial thought is that it's like it was from someone in cahoots with with the Fair Folk, if I may. My mother was relentless about not letting any little bits get out if she could manage it. I mean, it's good housekeeping, but also so you don't give an opening to anything too. Other comment! Thank you for posting all that you have to everyone part of the IPS. I've been searching for a long time for things that ring true, any when your videos started coming across my feed I felt like I was finding what I needed. That doors were finally opening in ways I couldn't get them to do before.
I must apologize to you Lora for the comment I made on you recent rant. Being an American with Irish ancestry is not easy. I would like to learn the truth. After this video I understand why you were so blunt. I did rescribe to you. I have such a strong pull to Ireland. I will work out my own spiritual path…I’m willing to do the work and appreciate any resources you are willing to share. Best wishes
I really want to let you know how much this authentic information from IPS and all the teachers is greatfully appreciated. As an American of Irish ancestry from the south side of Chicago, I would like to share with you that many of us were spoon fed so much BS of supposed Irish lore as we were growing up (No excuses). I'm personally glad to have the opportunity to unlearn and relearn correctly, and I realize that it's my responsibility to find good and correct sources of information and make sure I'm not spreading hurtful misinformation.
I hope we don't banish the word "tramp." More than just a pejorative, it describes a person whose life is made up of a heavy-footed walking, a homeless itinerant. American poet Robert Frost has a provocative work titled "Two Tramps in Mud Time" which presents a modern social dilemma that still demands consideration. We need these words. They build images that our polite and pasteurized terms of today just cannot handle.
When you brought up The Way of The Seabhean, I thought you said The Way of the Shaman (by Michael Harner), which is another really awful book, originally published in 1980 I think.
What should be the response to TV shows like "Derry Girls" on Prime Video. There are also other shows by the "Irish Film Board." Can these types of shows be trusted? As an Irish American with almost no physical connection with anyone Irish its lonely. It's easy to get connected to shows and books that misrepresent Irish culture because of the spiritual isolation.
Ok ok ok. UA-cam comment for YT yes, but I just realized that John and Lora are in the same room and you can see Lora at the edge of John's screen. This is only important because when it was noted that three of them were in Waterford, I said to myself, "Heh, they're all in the same house just different rooms." And then I look at John's screen! Note: As an American I default to being less formal. As an American from the US South, I want to default to slightly a medium formality and I never know which to use at what time. I'm sorry if the colloquial informality of my statement was offense.
@@Ogham Sorry if what I said implied that. It just tickled me on how I processed everything. Bit neurospicy myself and I guess that's a thing that doesn't translate well ^_^ Thanks for all the work you've done!
I think that it is percieved. With an irish tag on it. That any thing goes ...and boundries of culture are important ..if people slip up ..I think that if they are corrected .they might do better next time ..fingers crossed ...I think your work is meaningful....and important...
I notice that Microsoft word now highlights the word god as an error if you type it in. It converts it to God. I feel really annoyed about this as it's a nod, a subtle one, to modern monotheism. What are your thoughts on this type of correction Lora?
seen there are 4 cycles to irish paganism. where do i start and what books do i read in these cycles? i assume i start with the mythology cycle. any links to books?
I think it's very worrying....but that history of the country. Was under a curse...... Awful control freaks ...very ..improper...just to be aware of what you are saying. Is very true .good explanation....from john..
The Catholic church did the same thing to Native American children. Native American children were killed and buried by the church as well. Humans are capable of such evil. To become aware means we must speak out against it.
these abuses were visited upon native peoples by more than just the catholics, in the united states and canada, as well as in south america and africa. and they are STILL at it.
Thanks so much for this! Are you familiar with Peter O'Conner's book Beyond the Mist? Any opinion on that? I am thinking of reading it and just wondering where it falls in regard to this discussion: ua-cam.com/video/MFJdB3wfZJU/v-deo.html
To the best of my knowledge I have no Irish blood in this life. Though I do feel a deep connection to the island, and doing my best to do the work here in the states. I cringe every St. Patrick's Day at the way most celebrate here and do the best I can to do away with the stereo-types that accompany that day. The push back I often get is "You aren't even Irish" ... and I think perhaps not by blood, but by heart. Still, I speak when I can and hope that some will listen.
![[Irish Reaction] Celtic Shamanism, Irish Mysticism & The Faerie Faith | Jonny Enoch | Lora O'Brien](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/GQC5OCJxuNY/mqdefault.jpg)
So, I watched the whole video, and I really appreciate this conversation.
It feels like my whole life has been a mission in sovereignty and decolonization, and I don't know why it surprises me how many similarities there are between how various colonized cultures are approached and discussed, especially in "academic" and new age/neopagan communities.
My beloved Appalachia is full of so many traditions that have continued and evolved from various diasporas, and the roots of why and where these values, stories, and practices came from is often hidden under centuries of colonialism.
I rarely get to sit in on such beautifully complex contextualizing stories, and that is the sort of thing that nourishes the core of my being.
Here in the U.S. South, that complexity is often shunned, feared, or seen as a threat, in favor of simplistic categories and explanations that further remove us from being capable of righting the relationships around us.
"Conflict isn't abuse." -- Thank you for that Angela! I've been running up against that idea a lot lately. It honestly shocks me how often people view basic community accountability, healthy boundaries, expressions of sovereignty, or just a differing perspective based on a differing experience as inherently abusive.
Again, thank y'all so much for all your emotional and educational labor. I hope y'all are aware of just how valued and illuminating it is to some of us.
Thoughts while watching this as an American with Irish heritage. My grandmother spent time in and out of Catholic orphanages during her childhood and she hated nuns. I can only imagine the trauma caused by mother and baby farms, *cough, I mean "homes".
From the Southern U.S., thank you a thousand times for all your efforts to educate. Insight, from all you, is so very appreciated and I'm so grateful to have discovered this guidance, which can be difficult to come by the further one is geographically from the source. I hope one of the biggest lessons people learn is to check their sources' sources :)
You are very welcome
Thank you all for your time, for explaining the impact on multiple levels in the present and future contexts. I'm from Australia and very recently was referred to Lora's work and have certainly had a few buttons pushed around cultural appropriation, colonisation and even self responsibility for my deeper learning and in understanding my eclectic spirituality in relation to others and culture with respect. For every uncomfy feeling, THANK YOU! I need to grow in this space and I want to do better. I appreciate it.
thank you for this. Very important subject.
The comments here are giving me LIFE. Thanks for your thoughtful and caring responses 🙂
This... This is so important. I just want to say thank you for putting into clear words why the misinformation is so harmful. If you're going to place yourself as a teacher or an expert you are putting out there your energy and your words and people will listen. You want to have people listen to the correct information that is informed by the culture and the lore. I really appreciate you all four of you and I really appreciate the Irish Pagan School. Thank you thank you thank you ❤️❤️❤️
thank-you all for taking the time to share such heartful messages and voicing your stories... sitting with this and learning. unlearning. and learning some more. so so grateful. every day. GRMA.
Our pleasure!
Fantastic panel and absolutely necessary. In the spirit of decolonizing our language, please be aware that the phrase 'calling a spade a spade a spade' is racist one in the U.S.
Thanks for highlighting that. It's a common phrase in Ireland that means a literal shovel, as that is an American racist term we don't really see here. But good to note for the international audience.
Thank you for pointing that out Kaoime, I wasn't aware of that but will be mindful of it going forward
I'm in the US and this phrase is in reference to a shovel. I have never heard it in reference to race.
This!!!!!
The heart of the message fits on other topics.
Thank you for bringing this to the light.
Excellent panel and discussion. My life's work has been pushing back against this abuse of our traditions, discussions like this prove there is an appetite for authenticity and it's not a hopeless cause :)
Thank you. Great information. I love the multiple views on this.
Glad you enjoyed it!
This is so necessary and so very much apprecaited. The honesty and points made by all four of you are extremely important. I, and all of us who are students of the IPS are so very fortunate to have found this space.
Excellent. This is such important work. Thank you!!!
Thank you so much for this. It's so important in so many cultures fighting for survival right now across the globe. I very much appreciate the work and emotional labor you've all done to put this together.
As someone from the slurry of ethnicities that make up Southern White Trash, I have to say that I was Horrified by the thought of putting out hair and piss. That's such bad information my initial thought is that it's like it was from someone in cahoots with with the Fair Folk, if I may. My mother was relentless about not letting any little bits get out if she could manage it. I mean, it's good housekeeping, but also so you don't give an opening to anything too.
Other comment!
Thank you for posting all that you have to everyone part of the IPS. I've been searching for a long time for things that ring true, any when your videos started coming across my feed I felt like I was finding what I needed. That doors were finally opening in ways I couldn't get them to do before.
I must apologize to you Lora for the comment I made on you recent rant. Being an American with Irish ancestry is not easy. I would like to learn the truth. After this video I understand why you were so blunt. I did rescribe to you. I have such a strong pull to Ireland. I will work out my own spiritual path…I’m willing to do the work and appreciate any resources you are willing to share. Best wishes
I really want to let you know how much this authentic information from IPS and all the teachers is greatfully appreciated. As an American of Irish ancestry from the south side of Chicago, I would like to share with you that many of us were spoon fed so much BS of supposed Irish lore as we were growing up (No excuses). I'm personally glad to have the opportunity to unlearn and relearn correctly, and I realize that it's my responsibility to find good and correct sources of information and make sure I'm not spreading hurtful misinformation.
Hi Everyone! I needed to hear that, thank you.
Any time!
Really enjoyed this talk...sorry I missed the the live stream..
I hope we don't banish the word "tramp." More than just a pejorative, it describes a person whose life is made up of a heavy-footed walking, a homeless itinerant. American poet Robert Frost has a provocative work titled "Two Tramps in Mud Time" which presents a modern social dilemma that still demands consideration. We need these words. They build images that our polite and pasteurized terms of today just cannot handle.
The damage to the psyche..of thease people .
Is not to be left un told.
When you brought up The Way of The Seabhean, I thought you said The Way of the Shaman (by Michael Harner), which is another really awful book, originally published in 1980 I think.
I'm a Canadian Pegan thank you for this info video.
What should be the response to TV shows like "Derry Girls" on Prime Video. There are also other shows by the "Irish Film Board." Can these types of shows be trusted? As an Irish American with almost no physical connection with anyone Irish its lonely. It's easy to get connected to shows and books that misrepresent Irish culture because of the spiritual isolation.
Well thought out lora.... x
Ok ok ok. UA-cam comment for YT yes, but I just realized that John and Lora are in the same room and you can see Lora at the edge of John's screen.
This is only important because when it was noted that three of them were in Waterford, I said to myself, "Heh, they're all in the same house just different rooms." And then I look at John's screen!
Note: As an American I default to being less formal. As an American from the US South, I want to default to slightly a medium formality and I never know which to use at what time. I'm sorry if the colloquial informality of my statement was offense.
Jon and I share an office, but Amy doesn't live with us. She has her own house in Waterford.
@@Ogham Sorry if what I said implied that. It just tickled me on how I processed everything. Bit neurospicy myself and I guess that's a thing that doesn't translate well ^_^ Thanks for all the work you've done!
I think that it is percieved. With an irish tag on it.
That any thing goes ...and boundries of culture are important ..if people slip up ..I think that if they are corrected .they might do better next time ..fingers crossed ...I think your work is meaningful....and important...
I notice that Microsoft word now highlights the word god as an error if you type it in. It converts it to God. I feel really annoyed about this as it's a nod, a subtle one, to modern monotheism. What are your thoughts on this type of correction Lora?
seen there are 4 cycles to irish paganism. where do i start and what books do i read in these cycles? i assume i start with the mythology cycle. any links to books?
We literally have a free resources guide linked right under every video, my guy.
I think it's very worrying....but that history of the country. Was under a curse......
Awful control freaks ...very ..improper...just to be aware of what you are saying. Is very true .good explanation....from john..
The Catholic church did the same thing to Native American children. Native American children were killed and buried by the church as well. Humans are capable of such evil. To become aware means we must speak out against it.
these abuses were visited upon native peoples by more than just the catholics, in the united states and canada, as well as in south america and africa. and they are STILL at it.
Thanks so much for this! Are you familiar with Peter O'Conner's book Beyond the Mist? Any opinion on that? I am thinking of reading it and just wondering where it falls in regard to this discussion: ua-cam.com/video/MFJdB3wfZJU/v-deo.html
Not familiar, but this video may help ua-cam.com/video/wJkYi0KyUOA/v-deo.html
The source for that video, the brehon law academy, is utter shite too
To the best of my knowledge I have no Irish blood in this life. Though I do feel a deep connection to the island, and doing my best to do the work here in the states. I cringe every St. Patrick's Day at the way most celebrate here and do the best I can to do away with the stereo-types that accompany that day. The push back I often get is "You aren't even Irish" ... and I think perhaps not by blood, but by heart. Still, I speak when I can and hope that some will listen.