Doctor Who Series 12 Is A Disjointed Mess
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- Опубліковано 30 чер 2024
- The dust is still settling on Doctor Who Series 12, the second least-watched NuWho series. Was it good? Or did it suck? Here's a bit of a kneejerk review of the whole mess.
Chapters:
Introduction: (00:00)
Advertising and Expectation: (01:10)
The Companion Conundrum: (04:51)
The Episodes: (08:57)
Final Thoughts and the Future of Who: (26:40)
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#DoctorWho #Series12 #TimelessChild - Фільми й анімація
Hello there! This is a long one so I've got some timecodes for you in case you need to watch bit by bit :)
Timecodes:
Part I: Advertising and Expectations (01:10)
Part II: The Companion Conundrum (04:51)
Part III: The Episodes
- Can You Hear Me? (08:57)
- Nikola Tesla's Night of Terror (11:41)
- Spyfall (12:51)
- Fugitive of the Judoon (15:02)
- Praxeus (16:49)
- Orphan 55 (18:08)
- The Haunting of Villa Diodati (19:19)
- Ascension of the Cybermen (21:41)
- The Timeless Children (24:03)
Part IV: Final Thoughts and the Future of Who (26:40)
I agree I wish they didn't jump so much and drop so much exposition personally I think master shouldn't have been in the finale the lone cyberman was cool and the cyber war should have actually been shown
I think the finale would've been better with JUST the Master, as the Cybermen served almost no purpose. And I'm lowkey glad the Cyber War wasn't shown because if it's the same Cyber War as the one in Nightmare in Silver it'd block plans I have if I ever got to write for Doctor Who 😂
@@HarboWholmes ooooh yeah ugh the cybermen have just been Ruined by moffats nightmare in silver if they brought back classic cybermen like the mondasians then it could be better as they feel more human I just hope they don't try making the timeless child impact more as it was dumb how the time lords don't feel magestic or powerful anymore they just feel like fancy scientists I think chibnill needs to stick to broad church
Nah, I love Nightmare in Silver, if only for all the worldbuilding it has, there's so much potential in that. World Enough and Time/Doctor Falls did a great job restoring the body horror, human aspect of the Cybermen, it's just a shame that Chibnall has undone that
@@HarboWholmes the story and episode was good but the cybermen were too powerful like the speed running and head removal but it wasn't a bad episode
Most of this falls on Chibnall. He forgets his characters. The Doctor loses her companions and doesn't notice. Graham and Ryan make A HUGE deal about being family then when they get separated in Ascension of the Cybermen Graham has no anxiety about losing his grandson and is flirting with some rando.
Yeah, there's no consistency in their writing, meaning it creates a huge disconnect because we don't feel attached to any of them at all
Not just Chibnall, Whittaker is his little pet. She only has the role as he demanded it as a clause in his contract for Show Runner. She had seen all of two Tennant episodes before learning of the fact she was cast and when she was cast, she only watched another couple of episodes before deciding she hated it and wasn't going to be the Doctor.
I'm not positive, but I am pretty certain the extra episodes she watched weren't even classic... they were from NuWho.
Both her and Chibnall were boasting back in 2018, when Capaldi was still the Doctor, that they were going to destroy the shows canon so they didn't have to be tied to the old stuff and they could do what they wanted, because if they didn't they simply weren't capable of doing the show.
ALL of this falls on Chibnall, Whittaker and the writing crew. Along with every person who defended this lot and who shouted fans protesting them down as every kind of bigot under the sun, instead of listening to the actual critiques being put forward and why these things were issues.
It fails directly on the shoulders of moderators and admins on Facebook groups who agreed with all the protests and complaints, but in the interests of 'keeping the peace' and trying to not come across as elitists who dictate who is and is not a fan, censored and muted the people pointing out many of the varied points.
As much as he is the ring leader... it's not just him to blame.
@@makrostheblack4791 no, she only watched a few episodes altogether!!! she said so herself
@Adam Campbell : 2 + another couple, out of 851 (or 294 if you count each x-parter as one) = a few altogether.
@@PikaCinema : In Ascension, Graham wanted to go back for their friends, when the Doctor wasn't even around. That's not one of the instances Makros was refering to.
The "Fam" keeps splitting up, the Doctor goes on her own thing and hardly even worries.
The point about Fugitive being, the Doctor going on a run with Ruth and while there's a whole platoon of Judoon chasing them around (her as well as her fam), for a rather long time she doesn't even try to check in with them, they all each get taken by Jack and she's none the wiser - despite them all having these fun neck-comms. She even goes as far as blaming Ryan for having "lost" Graham (and then does as much as not following up on that).
Not a companion, but in Praxeus Aramu straight out died and nobody ever mentioned him again.
So, would you mind pointing out again where Makros or the OP lied or didn't pay attention?
@@HarboWholmes Jazz is just a name in a script who does nothing.
Now, correct me if I’m wrong, but the timeless children shouldn’t even exist. We have seen, several times, that the doctor was a child, and had a home on gallifrey. In Listen, we see Clara grab the Doctor’s ankle in the middle of the night, causing the whole episode to begin with. In Hell Bent, the Doctor escapes the confessional and awakens on gallifrey, next to the same home. The Doctor is not a being from another dimension, no. The Doctor was born on Gallifrey, like the rest of the time lords, and left out of boredom. The Doctor did not “escape” being tortured, as the Doctor remembers Gallifrey quite fondly. The Doctor remembers being a child. The Doctor went to school. Chibnall’s excuse for a finale should not be considered canon. It should not even exist. We know how Gallifrey ended, with the Last Great Time War. It was not “burned down” by the master, creating nonexistent conflict. Gallifrey is within the 3D painting, sealed away. This is why, to my knowledge, that the Timeless Children is a bunch of malarkey, and shouldn’t even exist to begin with.
Yeah, that whole thing with "Listen" was the immovable object with the story. You really can't place the idea of the Doctor being an immortal being when we saw their childhood.
Well... not that i'm excusing this or trying to defend it but, what I **think** they're going to try to do is say that the Doctor has had their memory erased. You see this with the Ruth Doctor somehow being part of the past but the Doctor not remembering her and then there were those strange asides to the small Irish(?) town where there was a man who had strange regenerative abilities (like the Doctor has now been revealed to have, more than normal) then at the end of his life, they do --something-- to him and thank him for his service and wasn't there something with a timepiece? There was also a scene with like a secret Time Lord secret agency or something. I don't remember clearly, it all sucks and is dumb. Anyway, to bring this all back together, there is a Time Lord Agency which the Doctor was recruited into to do various deeds which are probably very bad and wrong and after leaving said agency for whatever reason, their memory was wiped and that's why we don't know about the Ruth Doctor and also why there are now 15 Doctors and counting because we all needed to have that explained to us. So, after that, the Doctor had their memory wiped and was forcefully regenerated? into a child? and just tossed into some neighborhood to live as normal? I don't know. I sort of like the idea that it's just a lie told by the Master and they can just trash it because it's really dumb. Chibnall is like a really bad Hollywood producer who just sees something he thinks is cool and wants to jam it into their own thing. Like, "having the secret War Doctor was such a cool idea, remember when that happened? wasn't that so cool? Yeah, let's do it again! Secret Doctor!"
@Kaagh178 like I said, I wasn't defending it. And, what is the shadow proclamation? Is that like, a real thing with backstory or something they threw in and kept referencing? At least they could have used that somehow maybe but it seems like Chibnall has no sense of the history of the show. Disappointing is really the best description of it.
+1
Just retcon the whole Timeless Child nonsense. It's really terrible.
End of series 11 character development:
Yaz: policewoman. Just cause
Ryan: has dyspraxia
Graham: lost his wife
End of series 12 character development:
Yaz: a policewoman because she was inspired by another policewoman
Ryan: has dyspraxia and a friend who has problems
Graham: lost his wife and is scared of cancer
K then
😂 that is so on point
Alm Tre i don’t even remember their names
James Poole their names are in his comment so how can’t you remember them?
ApexArmy youre just going around and nitpicking comments because you actually liked this series, aren’t you bud? i am legitimately curious as to why you liked it.
I wouldn’t call it nitpicking to point out that someone’s comment was complete bullshit
I just hope they don't give up on a female Doctor now and blame the failure on sexism. I'd love a female Doctor with great character development, with an actress who's a fan of the show and cares about the character and a director who knows what the show is about. I could just not watch, but I've come to care so much about the show and about the character that it hurts to see it become this shadow of what it used to be. I want to look forward to episodes again, to feel exited when watching them.
I always loved how easy to compare the Sci-Fi-Worlds in Science Fiction are.
The Cyber-Collectives are a great example/measurement-tool for that!
Stargate has one, Star Trek has one, Doctor Who has one.
You can easily see how inferior Doctor Who to Star Trek and Star Trek to Stargate is. Alone from the Effiency of those beings that basically are
walking Effiency - or at least they should be.
Cyberman and Dalek are actually on UA-cam on Lists like "Top 10 Alien Races that are too Dumb to Exist!"
And yeah, that summs it up very well.
Stargates Cosmos is just more realistic and the most realistic. Star Trek is second-place.
And Doctor Who? It's just so filled with Plot Holes and Dumb Alienc Races and Nonsense that it could never ever exist.
Makes it all the more laughable in what state those 3 Franchises are. Stargate is just sleeping while the other 2 (3 if you count Star Wars)
Self-Destruct in an amazing FIREWORK!
Blamed the failure on sexism.... ur a fucking idiot
@@slevinchannel7589 Sir I don't think you understand why people watch Doctor Who. It may be filled with plot holes and stupidity but it's fun. Why do you think it lasted so long if it was so bad?
@@user-jn1wm3tb8v I understood that exactly, buddy. Plot Holes but still fun. The problem is, the fans are widely wrong here.
Just like people enjoey Moffats other show, Sherlock, which was objectively trash.
I dont say that goes for all of Doctor Who, i get it, it's not to think too much about but to have fun - that's more or less fine. But in the bigger picture, it's actually not fine.
@@slevinchannel7589 I still think Amanda Tapping would make a great Doctor.
What I find utterly incredible and obhorrent, is that Chibnall had the cheek to steal most of the Series 12 storylines from previous Doctor Who episodes and then turned the stories into garbage?!
The big on being that this is the third time that the Master has used the Cybermen in a finale to his own devices and the second time they've raised the dead with them.
I always think of Can you hear me? being the same as the Nightmare Man but without much of a personal stake.
Xenon don't forget the shiity racnos rip off
I agree, to me season 12 felt like a rip off of series 3!
@@Jackgames-vg7cw Played by Rani.
They paid lip-service to mental health whilst simultaneously gaslighting highly depressed and anxious fans as well as mocking Graham’s cancer. I’m sorry, but this was handled appallingly.
@Problembeing
Since you said it was "handled appallingly," I'm guessing the problem was execution not the fact that the Doctor reacted the way she did.
The way I've heard that scene described by Bolwstrek, and I think Nerdrotic it seems like the Doctor was more apathetic to Graham's anxiety, rather than wanting to help but didn't know what to say that moment to comfort him. Another problem is this was later in the series where the Doctor should've been established as her age sagely wisdom surfaces every now and then, and this would've been a good moment to showcase that, but they opted not to.
DemonicRemption it was handled appallingly at every level. First, the actor should know the character, she had plenty of opportunity to study The Doctor, she opted not to. The fact no one told her that given that this is the number one job on TV and the fans are sticklers for detail, they let her get away with ‘blank slating’ The Doctor, which leads me to Chibnall, the one who first told her to just ‘read the script’. He has allowed this actor to play this role for 2 seasons with seemingly nothing in the way of notes to make her tone things down and has written her as fairly two-dimensional, either flapping her mouth off in exposition at rapid speed, or in lecture mode of a scornful primary schoolteacher. There’s no depth and apparently only two settings. Chibnall has failed to bring out what every other show runner and their new Doctor has managed to do within their first one or two episodes.
Apart from those two things, of course the director must have played their part in allowing this Sven to be played out with the cold stage direction, but as the star of the show, why didn’t Whittaker protest? Tom Baker certainly would have! because she’s there to read the script, she hasn’t studied the character. The writers played this scene for a giggle, and it was played that way. No two ways about it. The fact this was allowed to happen after all the lip-service to mental health, mot one person from actor, producer to director to editor said ‘this is a bad idea?’ - and, finally, for the BBC to absolutely double-down on this with their usual dismissive and patronising response to the criticism was nothing but sheer hubris and gaslighting.
I suffer from depression and anxiety and found that episode to be ignorant and insulting. "Vincent and the Doctor" addressed depression in the right way while Chibnall made it sound like depression is nothing more than a temporary case of the blues. It's not. And as someone who tends to be socially awkward, I can tell you that if a friend of mine came to me and said they were concerned about their cancer (or anything, for that matter), I would show a lot more compassion that the fake Doctor did. I really think this episode did more harm than good. And if was boring.
John D I sympathise with you completely. I suffer the black dog too, and have seen two friends die from cancer, and for that line to be delivered for laughs was a tasteless error of judgment that should have seen the lot of them sacked the very next day alone. Not satisfied with doing that, they doubled-down; tripled-down; quadrupled-down and went on to obliterate canon for nothing more than more lip-service and racialist tokenism. They should be ashamed! They have caused no end of damage to this show, fragmented the fandom, and to top it off made people who rely on this show to see them through the dark days feel utterly shattered and broken. It’s unforgivable!
@@Problembeing They've trivialized depression and anxiety, shown a cold disregard for people with cancer and destroyed a show I've been a fan of for over 40 years...a show that I have relied on as an escape when things got really dark for me. And yes, they've totally divided the fanbase of a show that people have loved for decades just so Chibnall and Whittaker can promote their own views. Rather than totally destroy canon, why can't Chibnall move the show forward? I mean, I know he has no original ideas and clearly doesn't understand the show, but to undo everything we've known about the show just because he wanted to double-down on diversity is maddening. Rather than change Doctor Who, just create your own show with it's own canon.
Imo,we should have had another season with Bill.Even though her character arc was wrapped up perfectly,i think that Bill and 13th would have had better chemistry together
Personally I didn't really care much for Bill, but I definitely prefer her to the current companions. It would definitely be interesting to see how the chemistry between her and The Doctor would have changed with the regeneration
Bill was the worst companion, except for maybe Clara, but even Clara had some good bits before being the impossible girl.
Capaldi Clara was definately better than smith Clara, though I still think Moffat missed an opportunity with Victorian Clara being the Clara we got, that would have been much cooler
@@tomgamble3875 Nope
I wasn't a big fan of Bill at the time but going back and watching series 10 now, I think she's great. She showed great emotional range and had great chemistry with Capaldi. I think that her storyline wrapped up perfectly and imo I don't know if the dynamic would work between 13 and Bill. I think it would've been great to see them together and see how Bill reacts to regeneration, but I think that the doctor would have tried to distance themself from Bill after regeneration. Idk though. I just think that there is such a stark contrast between 12 and 13 that I'm honestly not sure how Bill and 13's dynamic would be like. I'd also be a little odd about how Chibnall would write Bill. Still think it would be interesting to see though x
Would be easier to ask ‘what went right?’ That would be less time consuming.
Problembeing nothing.
True lol
@@charlesman8722 Spyfall was great, but I failed to appreciate the rest (still ok) . Also the timeless children is the worst thing that happened to doctor who ever.
I've given it 3 months, haven't come up with anything yet.
Good question.
The Doctor didn’t hang off a cliff with an umbrella for no reason , the Moon wasn’t declared an egg, the Mary Shelley episode was watchable, and not all of the episodes were set on Earth.
Otherwise...
I don’t understand the love for Spyfall.
I feel like he just doesn't get doctor who. This is the first review i've seen actually making good points. I think someone can write a good story but if the characters suck and you don't actually care about them you won't care about the plot either and it just doens't work
Yeah most of the criticisms are “hurr durr I don’t like Woman”
@@saintsea-hat7891 That sounds like projection to me. People criticise the show for lots of reasons, nobody's upset just because she's a girl.
@@peacemaster8117 Pretty sure some people are upset because she's a girl. A lot of the criticisms are some variant of "Thirteen hasn't had any Doctor moments" (ie. powerful dramatic speeches). Which pretty much boil down to "The Doctor isn't as masculine as she used to be". Few people would overtly say they have a problem with the Doctor being a woman (though a few have). Quite a few people seem to object to the Doctor being less forceful and brash (ie. more feminine) than she used to be.
@@irrevenant3 You're just taking valid criticisms and then projecting sexism onto them. That's about you, not the critics.
@@peacemaster8117 How are the criticisms that I cited valid? Why does the Doctor have to be forceful and confronting rather than emotionally sensitive and collaborative in order to feel like a legitimate Doctor? How is her performance not appropriate for the first female incarnation of a character who goes through regular massive personality changes?
If the criticisms are valid then sure, maybe I'm just projecting. *Are* they? Why?
Season 11 was chibnall doing his own version of doctor who and it failed, so for season 12 he basically just filled the series with stuff we've seen before, a secret doctor, a master reveal, Cybermen, destroyed galifrey, a secret to be revealed etc, and it still didn't work in my opinion. Chibnall didn't impress me with his stories before he became show runner and he's proven not to be impressive now
Yeah, I've never really liked Chibnall's contributions to Doctor Who even before he became showrunner, so I was dreading his era from the start. If Series 11 wasn't so bad, maybe Series 12 would have been better, but Chibnall is definitely the wrong choice to be showrunner
@@HarboWholmes agreed, Jaime mathison who wrote mummy on the Orient express and flatine should have been the next show runner those two episodes alone are better than all of chibbnals stories put together
Jamie Mathieson's episodes were great, but I'm not sure about showrunner, I don't really know enough about his other writing credits to know if he has experience in a showrunning role. I'd definitely love him to write more episodes, though. I think one of the biggest issues with the Chibnall era is that apart from Chibbers himself, we haven't had any previous writers return
@@HarboWholmes very true, I think big finish should be given the chance to do their own live series of doctor who, they've certainty proven themselves to have amazing writers and original ideas the current product desperately needs
Four words. Paul McGann mini-series. That's all
Another reason why the companions in series 12 feel underdeveloped is because the Doctor keeps getting separated from them, and there are too many characters of the day.
Yeah, I kept wanting to talk about that more but I thought the video would be too long for me to have ready for this week aha. In almost every episode there are AT LEAST two side characters that get a lot of screentime and basically become companions for the week, despite there already being three. Just look at Tesla's Night of Terror, Can You Hear Me? and Praxeus. There are just too many people all at once
@@HarboWholmes Don't forget the historical women in Spyfall.
@@HarboWholmes Like, earlier seasons of New Who usually only focused on the Doctor, the companion(s), and the villain(s). "Partners in Crime" had three main players: the Doctor, Donna, and Mrs. Foster. "The Shakespeare Code" had the Doctor, Martha, Shakespeare, and the carrionites. "Boom Town" had the Doctor, Rose, Mickey, Jack, and Blon. Imagine how terrible series 4 would be if every episode was like "Midnight".
Yeah. Boom Town is a great three-companion episodes because there are only two other characters that have a lot of screen time (Doctor and Margaret.) The more characters you add, the less time each gets to do anything, and that's why these companions in the Chibnall era have nothing to do. I mean, Praxeus literally has The Doctor, three companions, three not-companions, a villain and a side character on top of that! That's far too many. The only time Doctor Who has worked as an ensemble with a big cast is Stolen Earth/Journey's End, because those were all returning characters from the Doctor Who universe we had had hours to get to know
@@HarboWholmes I think "Can You Here Me?" was the worst offender. The Syrian woman is in about three scenes, and they don't use her background to the story's advantage, because she has the same experience with nightmares as the companions' friends.
If I was gonna do a female Doctor, I would’ve gone with someone like Helena Bomham Carter, Michelle Gomez, or the woman that played Idris. They remind me of like Troughton, or McCoy, or even Matt Smith, acting silly, but then they become scary when provoked.
tgiacin435 other woman who would also be good is Ruth Wilson , Eve Myles and Nicola (last tango) and your right Helen binam crater and idris (Surrane Jones btw) would also be good female Doctor , Jodie comes around like a dumb blonde stereotype
i feel like jodie flips brilliantly between acting silly and serious. she also feels like a more chaotic emily blent lmao
I was hoping it would be Suranne Jones, she would have made an incredible Doctor and had the presence to be overwhelming to her enemies. I loved her in the Matt Smith episode, The Doctors Wife.
Theresa Swan Idris right?
Theresa Swan yeah, she reminds me so much of Helena Carter, definitely the type that can play the Doctor, and treat the sex change as another part of the regeneration he/she will just have to deal with, but also have fun with it. Hell I’d love to see the interaction between her River and/or the Master
Just want to point out that the “best” episode, “Nikola Tesla’s Night of Terror” the best part of it was Tesla, not the doctor or her companions, but Tesla
Yes, Tesla was brilliant. I can't remember the plot at all but the actor did an amazing job and really outshone the main cast.
And Edison. The two played off each other so well, with so many depths there, it should have just been them.
I know this is late but it really annoyed me that the Eddison actor was too old. He was just 9 years older than Tesla in real life and it didn't look like that at all on screen
It's a BIG red flag when The Doctor and companions are continually outshone by background characters.
@@michelleschaefer683 Basically all the Positive Stuff said by Harbo can be
Debunked or Dismissed.
Basically all the good stuff to be said is not really good for Real.
What a sad thing in itself, isnt it?
"I felt nothing for any of them." 17:19
So relatable throughout the whole Chibs era 🤣
I agree with this all so much. The only thing I will say counter to this is that I would like to see Jodi in a a season without Chibnall. There are time that I see a Doctor in her. So the potential is there. That said, I've hated most of the Doctors when they are new because I loved the previous one so much and was sad to see them go, however, by they time they, themselves are leaving I love them and hate their replacement. But with Jodi, I do not hate her, but I wouldn't morn her like I did Tennent, Smith, or Capaldi. Same with the companions. If any of the companions died I would be a bit sad. But would I cry over them like Clara, or Rose? Would I feel the sorrow I felt for Donna or Bill? No, I wouldn't. I like them all, but two episodes after their death I wouldn't think of them again. I have loved Doctor Who because it's a show that can make you laugh, feel absolute terror, and make you tear up all in the span of an hour. But other than the occasional chuckle I feel none of the same emotions this show has brought for numerous series. So with all that in mind I think that Chibnall and "His" Doctor Who are the problem. Maybe the cast is absolutely amazing and it could have been so much worse. Give them all a Chibnall free series to see what they can do. They at least deserve the shot to make me love them.
Yeah, I agree that there is potential with Jodie, even though I only see The Doctor in her very rarely. I think Chibnall would struggle with any Doctor of his own creation. Tennant and Smith were already established as The Doctor and also incredible actors in the role, so they were able to carry Chibnall stories, but now that Chibnall has complete control, the cast suffers. I really do want a chance to care about Jodie and her companions, but I think it's too late, given the news that Ryan and Graham are leaving in the special.
I can understand that for sure. I loved several of the Chibnall written episodes prior to him being the show runner. I do agree that possible that Smith and Tennant just carried an average story to great lengths. I was very saddened to hear about Graham and ryan’s departure from the show after the special. Yaz is easily the least developed and my least favorite of the current companions.
I think 42 and Power of Three were the only good Chibnall episodes before he took over, but 42 suffers from being too visually similar to Impossible Planet/Satan Pit and Power of Three has that trademark Chibnall rushed ending.
I'm also sad Graham and Ryan are leaving, but mainly because of Graham, he's easily the best of the three companions and I'd rather have him stay on and the other two leave, since he has interesting chemistry with The Doctor that could be explored further. Like I say in the video, having staggered introductions to the companions would have solved a lot of the problems and given us more time to form relationships with each. It's a shame they rushed into such a crowded cast. Hopefully Yaz can benefit from being the sole companion but I can't imagine she'd be the only one, I can see them having another companion as well
@@HarboWholmes Honestly I think Chibnall needs to spend some time sitting down and seriously asking himself two questions:
1. What exactly is this new Doctor like as a person?
2. How do I convey that on screen (preferably without overreliance on exposition)?
Season 12 improved a little in this regard. It's now clearer that Thirteen is a DIY Doctor more inclined to *build* solutions and who geeks out over people like Tesla. But we need more. We had a better feel for who Nine is as a character by the end of his far-too-short run than we do for Thirteen after two seasons. :(
I only just learned upon reading this comment thatGraham and Ryan are leaving. Someone already said it but Graham was just the best companion for the doctor. I think if he had been the only companion then it would have been pretty great. The doctor arrives in the world after regenerating, meets Graham and his wife, then they get involved in trying to save a man’s life resulting in Grace(?)’s death. With no more attachments, Graham asks to go with the doctor to see the universe in an effort to avoid the loss of his wife. Thereby have the end of the series involve him having to deal with that loss rather than the one episode that has him in the fantasy world with her. This could have been a great character moving point but it was squandered by spending time on a “diverse” cast. Rather than making it an interesting cast.
I honestly had to keep reminding myself that I'm watching Doctor Who...
I had to keep reminding myself to watch Doctor Who.
I went from getting so excited and watching Peter's episodes the second they came out to just... not really caring about these ones. Watching them a few days later or something. Watching it just because "it's my favourite show?"
Basically all the Positive Stuff said by Harbo can be
Debunked or Dismissed.
Basically all the good stuff to be said is not really good for Real.
What a sad thing in itself, isnt it?
Whats the point in having a time machine if they are just going to travel to a time where people explain events that happen in the past
Or spend most of the time in present day.
@@xenon8117 Season 12 didn't, though. Of the 10 episodes in Season 12, only three of them were set primarily in present day ('Spyfall Part 1', 'Fugitive of the Judoon', and 'Praxeus'). Two ('Spyfall Part 2' and 'Can you hear me?') spent around half the episode in present day but also spent a fair amount of time bouncing around through time and/or visiting alien worlds/dimensions. Five of them ('Orphan 55', 'Nikola Tesla's Night of Terror', 'The Haunting of Villa Diodati', 'Ascension of the Cybermen' and 'The Timeless Children') spent the entire episode in other time periods.
That would be a legitimate complaint about seasons 9 or 10, but 11 and 12 have been a lot more varied.
I see too much Broadchurch influence in the Chibnall era so far with it's dark, brooding drama and slow burn mysteries. Doctor Who needs to be fun with interesting stories and adventures which is completely missing because I feel like it's being directed as more of a drama than anything else hence the drawn out character development or lack there of for mysterious reasons. Besides Broadchurch I am also feeling LOST vibes where the mystery is great but the answers are bad, bad, bad.
This video is the best one I have seen for criticism of Season 12. I can tell you are a fan who is disappointed like me and not jumping to hatred or despise. I also completely agree with you about the true message of Doctor Who and how The Timeless Children dropped the ball on that. Here is to Doctor Who recovering in the near future.... I hope. Thanks for the video.
Thank you, I'm glad you enjoyed the video. Yeah, I found myself each week WANTING to enjoy each episode, but almost all of the time I found myself bored and/or disappointed, it just made me quite sad that I couldn't enjoy Doctor Who. I think I'm pretty much done with the Chibnall era but I know Doctor Who can get better and I'll definitely give the next showrunner a chance! And I agree about the drama thing. The show never seems to portray travelling with the Thirteenth Doctor as fun, if anything, it makes it look awful. Before, travelling with The Doctor seemed dangerous, but FUN. It was an exciting adventure, but now...why would you want to go with her? If that was the point, some intentional choice for narrative purposes, it would be a good direction, but it's clearly not.
I think it says a lot about Chibnall that Broadchurch was about a guy who fantasized about bumming boys and then murdering him. The BBC is satanic.
Chibnall seems to be a one trick pony. Broadchurch was okay, but it was just filler TV really. You watch it and its okay, but then you never really think about it or want to watch it again. Doctor Who requires much more talent.
@Kaulinis That's the truth. The only way this gets fixed is to get rid of Chibnall and bring in someone with real talent and skill for writing and running a sci-fi series. Then some of Chibnall's antics will need to be retconned, and the longer he sticks around the more will need to get reconned. If he sticks around much longer it may prove incredibly difficult if not impossible. Chibnall is so much of a self-righteous, pompass ass that I could see him writing stores in the next series to dig in and entrench the ridiculous Timeless Children narrative. Depending on how much damage he does he may just permanently kill Doctor Who as a franchise. Which I really hope does not happen.
Harbo Wholmes do you plan to keep watching the show? I’ve stopped since the end of Season 11. It’s really sad as I’ve been a fan since Pertwee’s debut and only stopped once before (After McCoy’s first season). This feels like the same slow demise that came about at that time. Now with the Covid shutdown there’ll be an even longer wait for Chibnall to produce more steaming mediocrity. What a sad state for a once great show to end up in.
Something that bugs me with people who tried to defend 11, and still bring it up with 12, is the First episode's numbers.
The viewing numbers of the first episode of a season has Very little to do with the quality of the show itself. It says "Advertising was good." It says "The prior seasons were good."
It's like saying fish love dying on a boat because so many bite the hook.
Yup. I'm fairly confident the viewer ratings for Season 12 mostly reflect how they feel about Season 11. Noone is ever going to convince me that 'Arachnids in the UK' deserves twice the ratings of 'Fugitive of the Judoon' or 'The Haunting of Villa Diodati'...
Damn that’s a good analogy
I loved that you talked about the delivery of the political messages. They were really hamfisted.
yeah, they feel hamfisted even if you agree with them.
You can’t just make a whole episode about some disability and then give the episode a weak story, the story needs to be impactful and doesn’t need to shove the message right into your face
The thing is though, *most* of the execution is hamfisted, not just the political messaging ("Oh by the way Yaz, you're the greatest person ever. Just thought I'd mention that, k thx bai").
The more I think about it, the more I think Chibnall's tendency to tell rather than show is *the* major problem. He got a little bit better about it this season and if he can get *much* better at it next season I think that'll resolve about 80% of the show's issues.
I always loved how easy to compare the Sci-Fi-Worlds in Science Fiction are.
The Cyber-Collectives are a great example/measurement-tool for that!
Stargate has one, Star Trek has one, Doctor Who has one.
You can easily see how inferior Doctor Who to Star Trek and Star Trek to Stargate is. Alone from the Effiency of those beings that basically are
walking Effiency - or at least they should be.
Cyberman and Dalek are actually on UA-cam on Lists like "Top 10 Alien Races that are too Dumb to Exist!"
And yeah, that summs it up very well.
Stargates Cosmos is just more realistic and the most realistic. Star Trek is second-place.
And Doctor Who? It's just so filled with Plot Holes and Dumb Alienc Races and Nonsense that it could never ever exist.
Makes it all the more laughable in what state those 3 Franchises are. Stargate is just sleeping while the other 2 (3 if you count Star Wars)
Self-Destruct in an amazing FIREWORK!
@@slevinchannel7589 "Inferior" depends what you're looking for. Stargate SG-1 was arguably more realistic (although the Goa'uld suffer from most of the same "too stupid to live" complaints that can be made about the Cybermen and the Tau'ri repeatedly punch at ludicrously levels above their weight).
That said, youvre making a lot of assumptions about how a cyber-collective should work. Any network is going to be constrained by its core functions. The replicators were created to replicate and seem to have complete neural freedom to explore and innovate beyond that core function. Cybermen are fundamentally human beings with their emotions removed and humans are not fundamentally designed to function as a hive race. In many ways cyber-conversion is a downgrade since emotions are at the root of a lot of human motivation and ingenuity. They were originally created as a desperation move to let people survive the collapse of their world. They were never made to be a super-effective networked race and they aren't. That doesn't mean SG-1 is better - it just means its cyber-creatures were made under different circumstances with different goals.
Personally I like all three series in different ways.
Doctor Who can indeed be very camp and imaginative and silly in its SF. Sometimes it owes more to Hitch-hiker's Guide to the Galaxy than serious SF. If you don't enjoy that aspect of the show, that's fine. That's not a matter of "better", it's a matter of different tastes.
The timeless child should have been the master or a character we font know much about like the other. If it was the master, it would explain a lot of stuff.
Yeah, if it had to be someone we knew, I'd prefer it to be The Master over The Doctor. It would make more sense
@@HarboWholmes Why? They did the same with the sound in his head.
Should have been The Rani
Susan his "Granddaughter".
@@countofdownable ?
Chibnall: ‘I don’t want the Doctor to be a super important god-like hero like they have been’
Also Chibnall: So the Doctor is basically the entire reason the Time Lords can regenerate now
This could have been a great story arc for the introduction of the next doctor for example. Reveal that the timeless child under pressure from torture and experimentation snapped and lost control of her power( do not make her the doctor) creating the time vortex and giving the time lords the power of regeneration. Hint at the doctor having some understanding of where the power of regeneration actually comes from as one of the underlying reasons why the Doctor ran away you could even hint at the doctor unknowingly being responsible for the atrocities against the timeless child if you want. Put a heavy emphasis on the big reveal that the power comes from grave atrocities and every regeneration is done via power stolen from an innocent being this could be used to set up a conflict later on where Jodi is dying but now that she is fully aware of where her power comes from she's resisting the urge to regenerate but the timeless child although angry at the time lords for what they've done to her and extremely conflicted sees all the good the Doctor has done and struggles internally but for the greater good goes to make peace with the doctor giving both the chance to vent their emotions and allowing Jodi to realize that regardless of how she got the power of regeneration the fact that she has constantly tried help others in need and the timeless child seeing the good in a dark situation gives both characters closure so Jodi can regenerate
Wasn't it established that Gallifreyans were incompatible to be "assimilated" by the Cybermen?
ondsinet _ it’s been brought up at least two times in previous seasons, most recently the season 6 episode “Closing Time”.
@@alexshar64 he was making a joke that the writers only read wikipedia
They can ever since Nightmare in Silver... 11 got partially cyber converted. Well, mentally.
@@epsilomtrent932 there are like a million different versions of the Cybermen in various different time periods tho
The Cybemen *were* incapable of assimilating Time Lords. That was before the Master fixed that little problem for them.
@@journey8533 There are a lot of legitimate complaints that can be made about Chibnell. That he doesn't know his canon isn't one of them. He's a fanboy from waaaaaay back, and in this season alone he's referenced everything from the Eternals to the Master's old Tissue Compression Eliminator to the Brain of Morbius.
Thankful you brought up the music, haven't seen anyone else bring this up yet and it's a really important part of the show and to me, not that that would matter. But since Gold left, the music has been lacking in emotion, adrenaline and interest, the music hasn't got the substance that it used to, which is a shame, i have trouble remembering almost any of the episodes not just because the stories were... eh.... but the music makes such a difference, it's made to make you feel and think and engage with things, but in the last 2 series', it just hasn't been there, and that's a real shame.
Ædam no. Up the shard and the long song were my favourites
@@jcfawerd
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You're right about screen presence. Jo Martin as the Doctor was immediately more convincing, even though I didn't agree with her character's part in the plot.
The biggest problem I have with the new doctor and the little I saw was that it didn't feel like dr who. Dr who is essentially the fantastical adventure of a very old and very wise melancholic time traveller who's a tad mad and ruthless at times due to his years of experience and what he's done. This makes the series very political at times, very melancholic at others, and quite hilarious even. It was a rather enjoyable experience because the show covered so much shit at once, and most of it was a good view.
Now here comes the new female doctor, I for one was actually interested in seeing how a female doctor would react to being a woman, and how it would affect his/her behaviour. What I did not expect was the story taking a complete backseat to politics, it completely forgetting how to balance humor, melancholy and seriousness. It completely revamped the doctor's personality. The new doctor has nothing in common with any previous doctors in recent history... It just feels like a different production crew who came in and went "yea, fuck reading up on the lore, fuck hiring writers - just put some snappy jokes in there and riddle it with current politics - it'll be greaaaat!".
The biggest problem with Jodie's "Fam" is their reason for being there. They were teleported away by accident and then just stay, and I get he feeling that Jodie's doctor doesn't care one way or another if they stay or not.
Wow! This is the most neutral review of the show.
I liked the season, well, most of it, but the lore just got destroyed. When I tell my friends that I watch DW I want them to see the magnificence of the show that has been carefully handcrafted by the producers. I don't want them to look at it and be like, "What bullshit is this?"
Neutral? I don't think this can be described as neutral.
The lore hasn't been destroyed, it's been extended.
irrevenant3 - No...it’s been destroyed, from the top down.
Basically all the Positive Stuff said by Harbo can be
Debunked or Dismissed.
Basically all the good stuff to be said is not really good for Real.
What a sad thing in itself, isnt it?
They dumped on William Hartnell. I find that unforgivable.
The scary thing is I can’t see who will replace Chibnall when he wants to move on. I feel like they just want to run Doctor Who into the ground and watch it die
Craig Matthews the sad thing is he is (or at least was) a Doctor Who fan. I genuinely think he believes he’s doing a good job but his run is diabolically bad. His line of work relies on good critical reception and good ratings so what is there to gain in destroying the Doctor Who series. The only thing to do as fans is stop watching a d let the BBC know you’re not watching because of what he’s doing to the show not that you’re tired if watching it. Keeping watching just keeps the ratings up so why would they change anything, they think the fans are happy.
The weird thing is that Season 12 is a significantly stronger season than Season 11. Stories like 'Spyfall', 'Fugitive of the Judoon', 'The Haunting of Villa Diodati' and 'Can you hear me?' were genuinely entertaining, twisty Who stories - and yet the BBC did almost zero promotion for them.
Chibnall has some serious flaws as a writer, but he seems to have taken on board a lot of the criticisms of Season 11. He brought back classic villains, he got rid of that stupid 'no two-parters' rule ('It takes you away' would've been amazing as a two-parter), the stories are more tightly-plotted, etc. He still has a massive problem with telling rather than showing. If he can work on that next season it would fix around 80% of the outstanding issues IMO.
irrevenant3 the series may have been stronger but the ratings were down. I stopped watching in series 11 (having watched the show consistently since Pertwee’s debut) . 2 of my workmates families dropped it after seeing Spyfall part 1. The (alleged) improvements aren’t working. The same criticisms of season 11 are being made for series 12.
And this man is no newcomer to writing TV series, he’s hardly refining his style, this is as good as he gets.
@@CraigTulloch I strongly suspect the ratings are so far down because so many people were burned by series 11 and haven't come back. (Also, I understand the BBC didn't do much to promote the show this time around?). Based on the ratings, twice as many people liked 'Arachnids in the UK' as liked 'Fugitive of the Judoon' or 'The Haunting of Villa Diodati'. I find that very hard to believe
Prior to Season 12 I would have agreed with you about Chibnall - the mistakes he was making seemed to be the same ones as marred his older stuff like 'The Power of Three' and I had little hope of him suddenly getting better. But then he did! I don't know what happened to turn him around but the Season 12 episodes were much more polished and more tightly written than Season 11. And the season felt better overall. Even the worst episode of the season, 'Orphan 55' was better written than 2 or 3 episodes from Season 11, including the season finale.
irrevenant3 You’ve inadvertently answered your own question. Many people were burned by season 11 so much so that there is no reason for them to return when the show still has the same problems ie Chibnall as showrunner and writer, a charisma free performance from Whittaker in the titular role and 3 poorly written companions. Season 11 was so poor I actually started to hate the show. I won’t watch it until Chibnall and Whitaker are gone. I haven’t seen series 12 but Ive seen several reviews (I’m still a fan after all) and they’ve all said something similar that it improved slightly but kept making the same mistakes as in season 11. I’m amazed people are still watching the show. To me Chibnall has destroyed the show.
I think the timeless child would have worked if it just wasn’t the doctor
I think it would be better if it was the master.
I strongly suspect that the Timeless Child reveal was in order to set up stories for Season 13 and beyond. I'm guessing that Season 13 will feature the Doctor searching for her true origins and dealing with the fallout from her time with The Division. I don't think either of those storylines would work if the Timeless Child was someone else.
Imagine the Doctor finally finds the Timeless Children and discovers they're a menace to be feared - and now the Doctor has drawn their attentions to our universe. Is that a more interesting story if the Doctor is a Timeless Child who fled the evil empire to escape and now has to face up to them to defend all she cares about? Or if the Doctor is a Gallifreyan and the Timeless Child is someone else?
Overall I don't think we can really say if it would work better for the Timeless Child to be someone other than the Doctor until we see what they're actually planning to do with that idea.
@@ionia2376 me too
Unfortunately, I have to agree with you on most of your points. The main things I disagree with are the episode "Can You Hear Me" (I very much appreciated the effort, as I too struggle with mental health, but I didn't think the episode was very well executed) and your statement that Jodie still doesn't feel like the Doctor. (I actually see her in the role now, but I don't connect with her and also think she was probably miscast.) I wish I could say I won't be back for series 13 but I can't really resist Doctor Who.
That's fair enough! I can see where you're coming from. The mental health message was kind of just tacked on and didn't really fit the rest of the episode. I agree about Series 13. Right now I really don't want to come back for it, but I'll probably end up watching it anyway. Although that being said, I stopped watching Series 11 after Rosa and didn't get tempted back (although I did watch Kerblam! and Battle of Root Canal)
@@HarboWholmes The sad thing is, you didn't miss ANYTHING. Series 11 wasn't good or important in any way.
Yeah, it's why I said that literally any episode could have come after Ghost Monument. I know a lot of people liked that the stories were completely standalone, but the problem is that the stories weren't even all that good anyway
@@HarboWholmes How do you figure the mental health message was tacked on to 'Can You Hear Me?'? The villain was an eternal enemy who turns your own thoughts into monsters to use against you, who can never be fully defeated, only temporarily locked away by facing and owning your monsters. It's a blatant metaphor for depression. Tahira and Tibo went through the same basic journey over the course of the episode in different ways, Tahira's monsters were just more physical than Tibo's.
Series 12 is the worst series of the modern show. Even as someone who genuinely enjoyed series 11 this killed my investment in the show. The biggest moments feel they don't have the weight they should or just forced and are often retreads of stuff done before. Gallifrey's gone again, the Master is just John Simm light except on crack(and they forgot Missy's development), Jack back cause RTD stans are the vocal minority, the Turned Jodie into 10lite with incredibly forced sounding dark moments. Jodie definitely has the range to do it but it just feels unearned.
Eh, I found it more enjoyable than Series 11, but I do agree that there is no weight to any of the big moments and a lot of it is recycled from RTD and Moffat. I did enjoy The Master in this and I'm holding out hope that it's pre-Missy to explain why they binned off her development. In terms of Jodie I've always thought her take on The Doctor is just a bad Tennant impression mixed with a CBBC presenter
Eh I liked season 12 far more than season 11... Thou tbh they are still both in my lower half in the ranking of new who. As for the master, I think Sasha's take was far better then Simms with him just seeming more meaning and physical.
5:28 this is why I loved the Netflix show Dirk Gently’s holistic detective agency so much, because it was mainly Dirk himself who cracked silly jokes every now and again, but I wouldn’t have been as hooked if everyone was doing the same every 2 minutes. Shows need comic relief when it comes to a show like Doctor who, but when every character is just a comic relief machine then it makes everything less serious and enjoyable.
Dirk Gently's Hollistic Detective Agency is actually a BBC show, but I completely agree with you. Comic relief is important, but must be dine with consideration to the tone, plot and characters. Also, nice to hear people talking about that show.
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The BBC rejected careful thought out pitches from life long fan and multi award winning writer, Joe hill, in favor of Chibnel drivel.
Nothing is less Empowering than all
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what the hell
Damn, I was just working on a video called The Companion Conundrum! I feel exactly the same about Chibnall's era, it's made it difficult for me to enjoy.
Haha! Great minds think alike
Not who I was expecting to find here, a surprise to be sure but a pleasant one
I am very much looking forward to your Companion Conundrum! The neglect of the companions' characterisations has much hampered my enjoyment of the show.
The entirety of the Chibnall era has been dreadful. I have stopped watching, as have many long time fans. It no longer feels like Doctor Who. Even at its worst, the Capaldi era still felt like (poor) Doctor Who. This just feels like something completely different and the heart has been ripped out.
I was confused about how the Dr and the Master could suddenly both get to and from Galifrey with no trouble... I thought Galifrey was lost ?
Did you not watch hell bent?
I think it's worth mentioning that so many episodes had Chibnall write or co-write, including Praxeus. Not saying for certain, but I think Chibs' contribution may have been what made the episode so lacklustre. Why can't he just let them write anyway
I definitely don't like how involved Chibnall has been with the stories. Obviously, showrunners are involved with every script, but usually, it's minimal enough to not need a co-writing credit. Chibnall has a writing credit for 14/21 of the stories in his era. He just infects them with Chibnall-ness
The part about the political messages on DW could be resumed like this :
No companion ever ( at least I think so) has seen a dalek and went " oh looks, they look like nazis", but now the messages are just like oh look he's gay, oh look racism is bad
The 12th doctor is going to wake up soon and say to Bill and Nardol, "I just had the worst dream ever, you got turned into a cyberman and I turned into a woman!".
Then Future Master will try to destroy the 12th doctor and Missy will come out regenerate into Jody Witter and it will be reveled to be Romana.
Ah! The Patrick Duffy twist! For those too young to remember, being validated in entire season of Dallas, we're Patrick Duffy's character Bobby was killed. They ended seasoned with him in the shower. I think Capaldi has just enough Moxie to pull that off
Nardol says
I will get us some tea and biscuits.
Oh How I Wished That was So True!😟
@@danielross5292
Nardol is making tea.
I honestly haven’t watched series 12 I stopped watching halfway through series 11.
I've been watching Dr who since 1975 - as soon as they gave the Doctor a sex change I stopped watching. If they wanted a female role model .. why didn't they just bring back Romana III?
I have also avoided series 12, but I have been reading reviews and such. Clearly I made the correct choice.
@
Nautilus1972 There is no problem, at all, with The Doctor regenerating into a woman. Its been known for a long time that Time Lords can change gender when regenerating. Missy was awesome, that worked out very well. Chibnall & Whittaker just failed at it.
Its allot better than series 11. But it's still upsettingly shite
same lol
There's a couple that are worth seeing.
No, literally just two. Making EIGHT in the series not being worth the bother.
To write the now chosen one Doctor Who you need a chosen one writer: Neil Gaiman, who knows very well this franchise, has a lot of experience in sci-fi and fantasy, and likes a lot to write female characters.
Unfortunately, I think Gaiman has been burned by his experience with Nightmare in Silver. I also think I saw something where he said he doesn't want to be a showrunner for any show
@@HarboWholmes : I knew but at least I tried to have the rest of the year living a happy lie...
@@HarboWholmes ok, someone needs to resurrect Terry Pratchett then.
Romel Muñoz Nial Gamein could not write his way out of a paper bag in terms of TV , he should stick to books , his mind is too vast for silly Sci fi that he can’t write BUT as a show runner and an ideas man he may have been good
I feel that Gaiman wrote himself into a corner with the Cybermen. How can a monster be overcome when it's constantly upgrading ?
The thing is, the Mythbusters actually proved you CAN polish a turd. It’s disgusting, look it up.
I...don't think I will 😂 But man I miss Mythbusters
I still feel the Timeless Children was one of the Masters lies to have one more attempt at breaking the doctor, and not exactly truth
Beant maybe in 5 years we all survive the Coronavirus , chibnal will be booted and they reboot the whole thing or at least retconn it all
FINALLY SOMEBODY MENTIONS THE SCORE! THE MUSIC IS SO DULL!!!
“...they’re still just blank slates; devoid of character...”
In the case of two of them, I’d agree. But, Graham did see quite a lot of character development in season 11 and that’s been carried forward into season 12. As painful as it was to watch season 11, because of his bereavement, Walsh’s character did have more depth and I could identify with him more; of course, being bereaved 8 months prior (my wife) had something to do with it, as I saw a lot of what I was going through in Graham’s actions.
Retconning the lore of a series that has been around for over 50 years is a cardinal sin in my book.
Especially when you’re retconning it with absolute shit...
no words to express how much I relate to this comment lol
The issue with most of season 12 is that it breaks literally all the previous lore. For example, in the first series, the doctor shows rose how Humans spread out into space and expand from Earth. But the new series states that Earth dies from global warming. I get the meaning, but it fails. And don't get me started with the Doctor being the original time lord.
I feel like they took like 5 people from the street and were like "your the docyor, you three are companions and you are the master :)"
Ah I feel that's harsh to Sasha. He portrayed the master really well imo
SOOO happy that someone else recognized that Praxeus was essentially Doctor Who's Birdemic!!
As soon as I saw the trashed river and the swarming birds I thought, "Did they rip off Birdemic?"
The praise of Fugitive of the Judoon is absolutely insane completely wasted Captain Jack and ruined Doctor Who until the finale killed it completely
I just get so bored watching this I can’t watch any of it. It’s just so boring and predictable. It is like a 8 year old wrote this and they got the actors from the street. If she doesn’t regenerate soon then the show will be so plain and boring
Are you telling me that you predicted what would happen in Fugitive of the Judoon? Or even the twist in Orphan 55?
irrevenant3 Obviously I don’t mean EVERY single moment, but a lot of the time you could predict what would happen.
@@James_Ravenscroft Everyone sees things differently but that wasn't my experience. The ending of Spyfall Part 1 surprised me. I didn't see the main twist in Orphan 55 coming, nor the one with Bella. I didn't know what the purpose of the sphere in the Tesla episode was or what the aliens were after at first. Fugitive of the Judoon surprised me about three different times. I *was* suspicious of the well-equipped shack in the middle of nowhere in Praxeus, but I didn't anticipate the nature of the threat (which was a clever concept, IMO) and I didn't guess what the aliens' goal was. I didn't anticipate the twist with the captured young woman in "Can you hear me?". I didn't anticipate the nature of the haunting in "The Haunting of Villa Diodati". I didn't anticipate the ending of "Ascension of the Cybermen".
In short, almost every episode had at least one thing that came as a surprise, sometimes more. If you picked most of those then you're probably just better at anticipating twists than me. Personally I didn't find the stories this season predictable.
Irrevenant Fair enough, but for me I could nearly predict most of them.
@@James_Ravenscroft Fair enough. So yeah, just genuinely a case of us experiencing it differently...
-"easier for a newer audience to hop on"-
ads towards older fans.....
a paradox indeed
'How do I explain something to a bunch of doctor who nerds in a way they'll find relatable? I know, football management metaphors!'
I agree with pretty much all of this, especially what you had to say at the end about not wanting the show to get cancelled. A lot of former fans are hoping for the show to get cancelled, but I hate that sentiment. I don't want the show to get cancelled; I want it to get better.
Personally, I really disagree with a lot of what you said about "Can You Hear Me?". I absolutely hated this episode by the end of it; in fact, it's the episode that made me give up on the show until we hopefully get a new showrunner/Doctor. First off, that scene at the end with the Doctor and Graham. You say you like it because the Doctor not knowing what to say is relatable to you. Fair enough. I think it's awful because of the way it characterizes the Doctor, or maybe fails to characterize her. My problem isn't so much that she didn't know what to say but that she showed absolutely no compassion for Graham in a very vulnerable moment for him. I feel any other "socially awkward" incarnation of the Doctor would have found something to say in that moment because, in my view, that's the kind of person the Doctor is. For example, I think of the girl dying at the end of "A Good Man Goes to War." The Doctor has no idea who she is, but even so, he finds the words to comfort her in her final moments. That's the Doctor, not whatever the hell 13 did in that scene.
Secondly, the writing in that episode was piss-poor. It started out alright, but it ended up being yet another case of Chibnall having no clue how to wrap up an episode. The conflict was solved in a few minutes with little to no effort on the Doctor's part. I mean, for god's sake, the way they built up how dangerous and powerful those two Eternals were, you'd think the Doctor would have to try a bit harder to defeat them, but no, the episode's almost over and we still have to shoehorn in 5-10 minutes on the companions' mental health! Just an absolute mess.
Finally, I want to talk about the timeless child. Like I said, I didn't finish the series, but I've seen plenty of coverage of it at this point to have a pretty good understanding of how the timeless child arc went down. I want to say that I actually love certain aspects of this idea. The Timelords kidnapping a child and torturing it for ages to steal the power of regeneration is such an interesting idea. What ruins it is that they made the Doctor the timeless child. Imagine if it wasn't the Doctor; it was just some kid. The Doctor learning the origins of the power of regeneration would create a huge moral dilemma for her. When it comes time for her to regenerate, she has to come to terms with whether or not it's okay for her to do. On the one hand, she feels guilty about using the stolen power after learning its dark origins, but on the other, she's used it for good all these years and could continue to do good for many more if she were to keep using it. That's the dilemma she faces, and it would provide such a desperately needed character arc for this incarnation of the Doctor. As a side note, if they wanted to make the timeless child a familiar character, why not make it the Master? Then it becomes even more personal for the Doctor, but there's still that important separation. It would also make the Master destroying Gallifrey make a lot more sense and could be used to explain the several times we thought the Master was dead for good only to return later.
Whatever. That's it. I know it's a lot. None of my friends watch the show, so I guess I needed to finally vent somewhere.
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I like the Doctor not being a Timelord because Timelords have been shown to pretty much exclusively be terrible people so to me it makes more sense that way
The interesting thing isn't just that it rewrites the Doctor's history; that means Rassilon lied to everyone about everything for practically an eternity; an entire civilization was built on lies and stolen power while the source of that power was ostracized and eventually sentenced to death for refusing to go along with their evil.
It's a good narrative, and even touches on one of the older quasi-canon origins for the Doctor as a progenitor that threw themselves into the Loom and were reincarnated as the Doctor.
To me what makes it more interesting than the original backstory is that it really unseats the Doctor from the regular flow of time and mortality; the Doctor has done so many things in New Who (rebooted the universe???) that if all Timelords were actually capable of such feats, if they were truly that powerful and smart, how did the Daleks ever become a real threat?
No, their power has always been an illusion, their feats lies and deception meant to hide the truth; their power and dominance came from something they stole from an orphaned child.
This was a masterfully well done video essay.
Thank you! :)
The one moment in the finale that sums it up to me, the one moment that show's Chibnall's complete misunderstanding of the Doctor is when Ko offers to sacrifice himself instead of the Doctor, and she barely bats an eyelid and runs away. When has the Doctor EVER so willingly let someone else sacrifice themselves in his/her place? Because now, since she is so special, the most divine being in the universe, she just has to let someone else die in her place.
What went wrong?
In short: Chibnall happened.
It took me years to realise: All the Episodes i skip in a D.W. rewatch are ALL Chibnall Episodes.
He's by no means a bad writer. The man practically saved Torchwood and made it into something worth watching. He also wrote the short story with Rory's dad. Which was amazing. The dude just can't handle full Doctor Who episodes for whatever reason.
So I just watched The Timeless Children a second time and I think The Master is lying by having hacked The Matrix and is giving The Doctor a false existential crisis because The Master never wins and is running out of ideas. I also believe The Master is such a narcissist that if the information he is projecting into The Doctor's mind is absolutely true he couldn't and wouldn't give this information to The Doctor because The Master will never accept that The Doctor is better than he is. The Master suffers from cognitive dissonance and is completely delusional because no matter what he tries whether cheating or in this case lying he never will win and that he is the epitome of persevering insanity. Thoughts?
Hacking the matrix is the easy out for this whole mess, but it is a bit of a copout (still, I'd rather take an eye-rolling copout than what we currently have to deal with!) Your idea makes sense because this is something The Master would do as a last-ditch effort. Rather than trying to kill The Doctor directly he wants to break her and make her snap and seek vengeance, thus bringing her down to his level. You're absolutely right that The Master wouldn't want to tell The Doctor that she's more important than him.
Personally, I like to think that if we do need one of the two to be the Timeless Child, it fits The Master better, especially because he's been manipulated and used by the Time Lords his whole life. It also makes more sense as to why he would be angry enough to destroy Gallifrey itself upon finding it out.
@@HarboWholmes Yes! If it's revealed that The Master is the timeless child than it would definitely make more sense and would be the reason he even has that specific name. I also agree that it would be a cop out to an extent but this explanation would bother me the least amount. I also forgot to mention all of the redacted info that he somehow couldn't read/hack or wouldn't show if he already knows that info. The episode did linger on that for a while.
@Scooby McDooby I also have a theory that Ruth might be The Master which is why neither her or The Doctor remember each other and why she appeared in the Matrix but who knows? I won't say it will never happen because we don't know what's going to happen next. I see that you would bet on it not happening but I think a retcon wouldn't happen because of egos and lying in the bed that's made, moreso than a black child.
The problem with Orphan 55 wasn't the twist that its Earth, it was everything else.
I’m fed up with Chibnall’s constant use of threads that go nowhere and redundant characters. After you’ve seen it so many times you have little investment in the series because you can recognise the route the story is taking and the elements that are worth ignoring. In its current incarnation, the only sense of ‘wonder’ I get from Doctor Who is “I wonder why I bothered watching”.
Do you have some examples of 'threads that go nowhere'?
It would've been so much better if the Master was the Timeless Child - it might explain why he escapes all of the time when in impossible scenarios plus it gives a reason for his insanity
Nothing is less Empowering than all
of this Modern Wokeness.
My problem is that I couldn't give a shit about the companions even if I tried. I remember when companions used to be the most interesting characters of their seasons. Yaz, Ryan and Graham are just plain. There's too many of them to focus on. The Doctor Who dynamic should only ever work with two main characters (maybe three if the chemistry is right), but four? That's too many characters to have in such little time, especially if you have other side characters that the episode is based around.
Jodie Whitaker could've been an amazing Doctor, unfortunately she was paired with Chibnall's writing. Had Jodie been paired with Moffat or even Davies, she would've excelled in this role.
I feel like we need a do-over, either with a new showrunner, new companions, a new Doctor or even all of the above.
Well said.
This Doctor doesn't seem to GENUINELY CARE ABOUT any of her companions.......
Quick question, at that one point of Skyfall Part Two, why did the Doctor lock the Master put if the elevator? First, it goes against her character, as the Doctor always wanted to redeem the Master. Second, the Master is a murderous SOCIOPATH. He will murder all of the people sent to arrest him, but it seems that the Doctor forgot she wants to save people's lives. It also seems like the writers forgot the Master enjoys killing and hurting people, too.
This is really bothering me, so if anyone has an explanation, please tell me.
Nothing is less Empowering than all
of this Modern Wokeness.
My peev with 13 is that when someone dies, she's just:
"oh rip :(" *aight, back to normal haha*
The other Doctors usually cared about that stuff, even if it was something completely out of his control, you'd see some regret or anger, sadness maybe? But nothing sticks with 13 and she just carries right on 95% of the time.
That would be ok if the other characters actually acknowledged it and had some feelings towards the Doctor's lack of. It could lead to some conflict and more depth in their dynamic, depth on the new doctor, but no we can't have that.
"Ehoop Tim Shaw owzat!"
Any of the others would've been righly miffed.
Only reason Tennet's Doc outs Harriet is he had a big DaddyStreak.
Great video, this season really sucked. Really bad acting, really bad stories, really bad dialogue...it was just........really bad.
Add to this the pointless retcon and the toxic fans.....so I’m out. I’ve been a fan since I first saw remembrance of the daleks in 1988. But thanks to chibnall and whittaker I’m done with this show.
Just out of curiosity, what's your opinion on the Cartmel Masterplan?
'Can You Hear Me?' has some good themes and good character development. The animation sequence is an interesting way to deliver Chibnall's exposition. It still has the same issues as most of Chibnall's era. The Syria plot point could have been removed to delve deeper into our companions. The female eternal could have been fleshed out better. The resolution was poorly handled and the villains were defeated by the sonic.
Spyfall borrows a lot of elements from Army of Ghosts, The Sound of Drums and The Bells of Saint John and those episodes do it a lot better. Fugitive of the Judoon borrows elements from Smith and Jones, Utopia and Name of the Doctor. Orphan 55 borrows elements from The Mysterious Planet.
You got it spot on for the Haunting of Villa Diodati. The Lone Cyberman appears halfway through the episode and I'm underwhelmed by it. The doctor decides that it's the lone cyberman 2 seconds after finding out. Jodie's performance at the end is a highlight for her character. It's a bit messy especially after mr lonelyman appears. The finale is poor even if you forget about the reveal.
Jodie doesn't have any gravitas which is why she doesn't feel like the doctor. Even the Ruth Doctor has more screen presence.
I been waiting all season for your overall opinion 👍🤪
Well, you need not wait any longer!
Harbo Wholmes I agree with absolutely everything only except for when graham went to the doctor to explain about his fear of cancer, this is the 13th doctors quote when people come to for help I never refuse...welllll that quote is kinda bullshit since her friend her companion of well over a year comes to her for reassurance of fear of cancer, and the doctor just says I’m socially awkward...I’m about as socially awkward as the next person it’s something I struggle with but if my friend came to me scared of getting cancer again I’d do everything to eliminate that fear and that’s just what I would do...I can only imagine what 10th 11th or 12th would have said or done surely something so much more reassuring and less cold than sorry I’m socially awkward, ugh in my opinion such a down grade in terms of the doctor being someone who apparently never refuses help whatever way that may be !!
Btw I would love to see a video of the top scariest dr who episodes like god complex midnight or even the parting of ways that episode was terrifying all those people just waiting for the daleks to kill them cos they didn’t listen to cap jack ugh scary etc and which one is the absolute scariest!!!! Old who new who which ever!!👍☺️
Yeah, I definitely see the other side of the argument when it comes to that scene, I think a lot of it comes from how people read into it. I do disagree with the people who say she should take him to get permanently cured because that would give The Doctor far too much power. The Thirteenth Doctor has no clear character or morals either, which doesn't help that scene. As you said, the previous three Doctors all have clear personalities that would lead to different responses in that scenario, but the Thirteenth Doctor has been so inconsistent with her morals that it's difficult to understand why she reacts in that way. If she had been shown to be far more socially awkward before (such as the Twelfth Doctor with his cue cards) I don't think there'd have been as much backlash
Throwing shade at Legends? Not cool dude
I'd sum up the Whitaker era as 'preachy.'
Yeah, Legends is satire so it can get away with doing stupid shit. Chibnall who on the other hand
Being someone who lives in the US I didn't know I had even started until the doctor who youtube channel started posting clips from episodes.
The best parts for me for the David Tennant Doctor Who was just him and His companion enjoying where they were, the action and adventure was fun, but just seeing two people enjoying time travel is really great
It's just occurred to me, or do a lot of Chibnall's finale type episodes seem to have the same battlefield setting? Ascension of the Cybermen basically seems the same as The Battle of Ranskoor Av Kolos (not that I remember what that was about anyway) and Resolution a bit and that has made me zone out. This engine is becoming increasingly more difficult to restart after so many stalls.
Well over half the Doctor Who finale episodes have a battlefield setting. That's not particularly a Chibnall thing. Though personally it bugged me that, despite the name, 'The Battle of Ranskoor Av Kolos' *had no battle in it!*
@@irrevenant3 I guess so. Chibnall just seems to have a thing for long, complicated titles even if they have no relevance to the plot.
@@DoctorVision Yup. xD Although to be fair, I think that's the only one that's actually inaccurate.
I think Jodie herself isn’t focussed on enough as a damaging factor to the show.
Constantly people say “it’s the writing, not her”, but aside from maybe 3 seconds in Spyfall Part 2, she’s shown no nuance in her performance and not a single one of her “funny moments” land.
I think Jodie is a very talented actor, but she is a huge miscast for the show. It’s like Chibnall squandered his one chance to shock the world with a female doctor- this opportunity will never happen again and he clearly didn’t choose the right woman for the job.
I use to love the adverts after usually a Christmas special which would show sneak peak clips for the new series it got me so excited as a child.
The reveal of the doctor being the Timeless Child or whatever felt like me watching Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker. The took Rey, and the doctor, who were both nobodies making a name for themselves, then turned them into beings of superiority due to their birth. Like, it undermines their whole character in a hilarious way. Like you said, why does someone have to be born special? Why can't we see a character we know and love make a name for theirself and show others who they are. With the reveal of the doctor being as special as they are, it just takes away the character growth we've seen in a way that can't be fixed easily.
20:46 I hated that moment because it was so undeserved in that situation, it felt like it came out of nowhere, and her companions did nothing about being treated this way. If she'd actually lost someone to the cybermen it would have made sense. If Yaz or Ryan had called her out on how they're supposed to be a team, a "fam", it would have felt dynamic. But instead it feels like timelord vaingorious but if 10 wasn't about to die, wasn't fighting an impossible battle, and if Brooke had just been like "okay" and let him do it.
Well, she has a history of losing companions to Cybermen. Adric, Rose (it was a Cyberman story) and Bill, so given how her PREVIOUS companion got horrifically converted into a Cyberman, I don't think it came out of nowhere, although I do agree that she is wrong for chastising Ryan so much. He's not wrong for suggesting that they let Shelley die. It's the train car problem, but she acts like he's a monster for suggesting it, when she then goes and allows the future of humanity to suffer in the CyberWar. Rather than treating it like a proper moral dilemma and exploring the weight of that choice, we're just told that Ryan is wrong and The Doctor is right
Spot on, for much of this! The Doctor sounded like she was brushing off Graham, I think that was a problem. She didn't give trite, surface reassurances, but she also acted like she couldn't give a toss.The only reason is that she still seems like she's still in shock after losing Bill & Clara. Jodie has moments as the Doctor, & other moments as the actor simply following her cues & making her marks to play the Doctor.
I think it comes down to Jodi as an actress. She is a good actress, but I don't believe has the true range to make the Doctor work in all situations. I could easily imagine Capaldi making that scene work, and in their own unique way, Eccleston, Tennant and Smith. I hate to even think this, but is it our reaction to the Doctor being female and how that reads in certain scenes? Is the character of the Doctor so fundamentally male in the public consciousness that the gender swap doesn't work on a basic level? I don't know, but I've not enjoyed any of S11 or 12
The only reason I knew that Doctor Who S12 existed was because I had it on record since season 10, so it automatically recorded season 12.
PUTTING MARKETING BUDGET TO A GOOD USE THERE, BBC!
I honestly don't know how the BBC went from the full hog on advertising to nothing at all. I would see it every time I went to the cinema 3 months before the series was even aired. I had to hunt down series 12 advertising. Really dropped the ball there.
Also it's really funny how annoyed what your saying is compared to your unemotional tone
Yeah, they seemed to turn the advertising up for the last episode, but it was too little, too late. And I was livid after the finale 😂I just don't really have an expressive voice ahah
@@HarboWholmes you really should just let it rip for one video, just for fun. As for this Series, I don't know; It's leagues better than 11, actually having really good ideas with some terrible parts (well most of it TBH) that could easily be reworked with only some small changes/reworked scenes whereas series 11 required to be built up from the ground all over again (My entire rewrite of it was 19 pages long, this would be about half it). Jodie was better in this series but still lacks authority, in like Ruth who would have made a much better first female doctor. The companions were likeable too but still bland for a heavy majority of it, particularly Ryan. I really love Sacha as the Master and he is easily the best part of this series regularly outshining the doctor. I think Orphan 55 should have been better and can you hear me should be a two parter, removing peraxus. I beg to differ on the Cyberlords though. As for the timeless child, I'm okay with the lore thing, except it being a bit disrespectful to Hartnell. The fact is that it makes the Doctor the centre of the universe which I HATE as well as meaning nothing for the character as A)She just shrugged it off and B) It's just forgotten anyway. Would of made more sense to be the master giving him motivation to destroy Galifrey and make the Cyberlords as though forming him own Galifreyans
If my mic was better maybe, but my mic clips so easily if I show expression, so it doesn't help me break the monotone! 😂 I definitely agree that Series 12 is a lot better than Series 11, but it's still one of the worst NuWho series imo. I actually agree with most of your points, and I'd have touched on them more but the video was getting too long. I really warmed to Sacha as the Master and I thought he was great, although he overshadowed The Doctor, and I also agree that the Jo Martin Doctor was way better than Jodie. I can't agree with the Cyberlords, though, they were just so stupid and made no sense. And when it comes to the Timeless Child stuff, I have an entire video about that mess written already!
I really think you should branch out to the community more as your massively underated. Consider a discord server or maybe a colab. On a more positive note for the show itself, I think it's only a matter of time until it gets good again and that's why the BBC won't cancel it like they did in the 80s as it was just regaining it's audience. All if really takes is a show runner with a good vision and good marketing. It's not a matter of 'if' it gets better but 'when'
I have no idea how to network, I barely even know about other Doctor Who channels 😂 I'd love to start a Discord if enough people want one, but I've never really used it myself.
And yeah, Doctor Who definitely goes through peaks and valleys. Hell, it almost got cancelled during the Troughton era until the UNIT and exile storylines of the Pertwee era brought people back. Hopefully, the BBC are patient enough and the next showrunner can turn the ship back around. Unfortunately, there's a persisting rumour that there's going to be a hard reboot co-production with a new First Doctor and remakes of stories like Genesis of the Daleks. Basically what they initially wanted to do with the American series in 1996 but this time it might actually happen. I really hope it doesn't, though
What went wrong? Everything.
This is what happens when you try to introduce/develop 4 characters at once.
I agree completely with what you said about Jodie Whittaker and being the authority figure. In fact, Jo Martin had that authority immediately as the Doctor, when Jodie hasn't in two series.
It took me a few days, but I eventually figured out on my own that Jack's appearance was a big distraction to the audience to hide the flaws. One of my biggest issues of the season was that, as said, the companions are continuously sidelined when it comes to the series arc. Jack's appearance thrilled audiences, but it also was hiding the fact that once again the companions were just pushed aside so the Doctor can do walk through the arc; as well as using Jack as a channel for heavy exposition.
The lone cyberman had the possible to be one of the best Villains. If he was Brendan, it would have worked out much better and it would have linked toward the final episode much better.
10:39 I heard this line spoken by so many people to excuse poor story telling so many times. I know that's not what your saying but I sick on tired of hearing that be said over and over again.
A poorly written story is a poorly written story and their No amount of pretty visuals that can make up for it.
I mean, they can, that's why people don't read as many books.
The Zygon Inversion speech also works because you know its coming from a soldier who, for a long time, was certain he performed genocide and that it was just the final crime in a series of crimes.(By his own compass) It was a speech from experience, not superiority. He wasn't preaching down, he was pleading people not to make the same mistakes he had. And he never really denies all the motives for war, just stresses the cost should demand its avoidance. Nor are his points about talking perfect but it all works because you know where the pain comes from and that, for the circumstances of the speech, that he's right this time. From what I hear Jody's Doctor never gets a chance to earn that much gravitas or circumstance for a lot of her speeches, they're just given.
I must be lost as heck, 'cuz I thought this season only had the alien bounty-hunter guy who nearly kills Ryan's dad in the first episode and then comes back at the end in a twist.
I miss the low production value episodes. It felt like classic British programming like Rumpole of the Bailey or Fawlty Towers.
You know you have a problem when the actor playing the Master would make a better Doctor than the current Doctor.
You know you have a problem when in introduce a new doctor for 1 episode and they put the main doctor to shame
@@Mafu._ FACT! If only Ruth was a future Doctor. I loved her Doctor but I can’t get behind it after the whole timeless child crap.
@@The_D0C70R i feal the exact same, i hope it turns out she is the 14th doctor, because if she is pre hartnell then there lots of reasons why it wouldnt make sence
Don’t forget that in Praxeus they use that lab on the beach even though the tardis can create anything you want. There is no need to use human tech.
Over 2 seasons Mickey, a somewhat insignificant side character who only appeared in a few episodes had: a developed personality, emotional development and a character arc from coward to choosing to live in an alternate dimension as a badass resistance fighter. Over series 11 and 12 Yaz, Ryan and Graham have become WORSE characters and they're the main companions that are in every. Single. Episode.
There wasn't a panel because nobody would go to it.
Here’s my thoughts on each episode:
Spyfall Part 1 - while I didn’t mind this episode when it first aired, I’d agree with you that on rewatches it would get very boring very quickly. Essentially, the master reveal at the end does not reconcile for the first 50 mins of the episode (5/10)
Spyfall Part 2 - there wasn’t really much I liked in the second part and found the conclusion to the story rather weak. While I was sceptical at the time of bringing back the master so soon after missy’s ‘death’ in series 10, Dhawan was giving a phenomenal performance from the get go. Though I did find the historical bits unnecessary (3/10)
Orphan 55 - I will continue to defend this episode despite its demise in the last 10 mins. Much like kerblam, this felt the most like Doctor Who which is why I resonated with it so strongly. I wouldn’t even mind the global warming message at the end if a different doctor was making it but the fact that Whittaker was virtually staring into the camera put the ‘speech’ in very bad taste. Plus, I don’t think it’s bold to say that most whovians are left wing, so who exactly is this message directed to? (7/10)
Nikola Tesla’s Night of Terror - I found this quite boring and would have no desire to rewatch it. I suppose it doesn’t help that I’m not a huge fan of historicals but once again exposition felt like a problem during this episode. That said, the actor portraying Tesla was very good in the role (4/10)
Fugitive of the Judoon - there is lots to like in this episode and overall did enjoy it. While the shock factor of Ruth being the Doctor was cool at the time, with what we know now the reveal is not as impactful (7/10)
Praxeus - I find myself agreeing with a lot of what you said in the video, given that McTighe wrote my favourite episode last series too, unfortunately I think I set my standards too high and found myself severely disappointed. While the environmental message was handled better than orphan 55, I just find this episode so boring and dull (4/10)
Can You Hear Me? - all the ingredients were here to make this episode an all time classic but the payoff was very poor. The first half of the episode was very promising though the downfall of it comes with the resolution of the story. Yaz’s 50p scene was pointless given that I have no investment in the character and the scenes between the ‘doctor’ and graham at the end were so distasteful. How can this character give such beautiful speeches in Vincent and the Doctor, The Doctor Falls, etc just to stand there and says she’s socially awkward? This made for very uncomfortable viewing and dragged the episode down immensely (3/10)
The Haunting of Villa Diodati - I have mixed thoughts on this episode. On the one hand the lone cybermen design is awesome and liked the doctor’s words on the team structure and the tension it brought that series 11 lacked. Though I’m still not sure how well a haunted house episode and cybermen mix. For one of my least anticipated episodes of the series, I came out with a lot of positive things to say (8/10)
Ascension of the Cybermen - overall I’d say this is quite a strong episode that leads into the finale. While this was nowhere near the levels of Dark Water or World Enough and Time, it does its job quite well in establishing the cybermen as a threat. Despite this, I found the episode dipped somewhat during the middle and the cliffhanger at the end felt redundant as that is what we were all expecting (6/10)
The Timeless Children - oh Chibnall, why must you do this? Everything with the timeless child I absolutely loathed. It represents an unnecessary rewriting of Doctor Who cannon just for short term audience shock factor. While Dhawan was absolutely incredible here and the master cybermen were kinda cool, it is nowhere near enough to save this dumpster fire. This episode has further split the fandom once again and what I believe to be last straw for many viewers (2/10)
A few more things...
1) I still can’t comprehend why the doctor is so visibly upset in spyfall part 2 upon seeing the ruins of Gallifrey. Why is she so emotional when she couldn’t even be bothered to show up to save her home planet in Day of the Doctor? This further represents the flaws in her character that make it harder for me to connect with her as the doctor.
2) As you mentioned in you video, I despise how the timeless child essentially makes the doctor the most important person in the universe. I think it is put best by 12 in Death in Heaven, that the Doctor is ‘an idiot with a box and a screwdriver; passing thorough; helping out; learning’
3) At 5:02 I believe that clip is from Dark Water (better days) 😉
If that's the case, the right-wing of the DW fandom like to think it's mostly right-wing people that watch the show but it's actually the other way round. Hey, I can make sweeping political generalisations too!
I agree with most of this. I'd just add:
- Spyfall Part 1 - I'd give it more credit than that. The Kasavin are a suitably interesting and creepy Doctor Who monster and the idea of interdimensional spies focusing on espionage targets was a neat one. The Master reveal is kind of disconnected, but really it's lead-in to the next episode more than part of this one.
- Orphan 55 - My major complaint about Orphan 55 other than the lecture is the creature aesthetics. The first half of the episode they seemed to realise that the costume only looked good in closeups and dim lighting - then they promptly forgot that for the second half. >_< One thing I really like about this episode is how well Ryan's character comes across in his interactions with Bella.
- re: 'Who exactly is this message directed to?'. Done well I don't see the point as delivering a message, but rather taking contemporary issues and exploring them through an SF lens. Ideally the story isn't in service to a message, the theme is something that underlies the story and grounds it in something real.
- "Can you hear me?" - The point of the Yaz scenes were to *create* investment in her character and for me that mostly worked. She's still underdeveloped as a character but I had a better feel for her after this episode than I did going in.
- This character *didn't* make beautiful speeches in Vincent and the Doctor or The Doctor Falls. That was Eleven and Twelve respectively. Each incarnation of the Doctor has their own personality and quirks. And note that Twelve wasn't particularly great at forming intimate connections with people either. He was great at the speechifying but he could be very cold and unsympathetic. (Remember the "I'm very sorry for your loss. I'll do all I can to solve the death of your friend slash family member slash pet." cue cards?) The interesting thing to me about Thirteen is the she seems to be someone who needs close human connections (witness her immediately glomming onto a group of strangers as her 'fam') while simultaneously being poor at actually *forming* close human connections.
- "Why didn't you turn up to save Gallifrey?" is going to be a question for all future incarnations of the Doctor. The real reason is 'because we hadn't cast the character yet'. Really Moffat should've had 24 Doctors to turn up, but he didn't and we're stuck with that decision. (Of course, if they did that, the Doctor's 25th regeneration would eventually have to field this question...).
- The Timeless Child really *doesn't* make the Doctor the most important character in the universe. Personally I think Chibnall handled that aspect of the character better than Moffatt. Moffatt turned the Doctor into a character who traded on their reputation, whose very name could cause the end of the universe, who is President of Earth, who personally rebooted the universe twice, etc. etc. (To his credit the "idiot with a box" line was Moffatt trying to wind back the character a bit and turn him into less of a demigod).
The Timeless Child reveal does basically two things: (1) It gives the Doctor extra history for writers to play with, and (2) it makes the Doctor's origin mysterious again. In terms of character, the Doctor is the same character as always - just with more history. Rather than being a Time Lord who left his people behind to explore the universe and who ended up making a difference, she's a Timeless Child without her people who wanted to explore the universe and who ended up making a difference. In terms of abilities, the Time Lords copied everything the Timeless Child can do so she has no advantages over them. She did have unlimited regenerations, but apparently so can they if they wanted to. And based on 'The Time of the Doctor' it seems likely that the Doctor had his regenerations capped at 12 anyway when he was reset to infancy by the Division.
Ultimately the Timeless Child was an alien with useful biology who the Gallifreyans used as a lab rat and then a pawn. And who, despite all that, cast off those origins and became a hero. As far as I can see, Chibnall has a really good idea who the Doctor is. This reveal gives the Doctor more mystery and more history while carefully sidestepping the trap of making them a chosen one because of one key distinction: It's not *what* the Doctor is that made them a hero - it's *who* they are. Someone who chose to go out into the universe and help. Regardless of what the path laid out before them, they step off it and go roaming. That's who the Doctor was as a Time Lord who grew up on Gallifrey and that's who the Doctor was as the Timeless Child.
Jodie reminds of that primary school teacher who would always tell me off for no reason at all.
when you said the doctor being awkward around Graham when he talked about cancer, I never thought of it like that. of course some people would be unsure of how to act. however, I do think it could have been better executed. it came off as rude, like "I'm too quirky and awkward to talk to you."
To make the scene work, I would have made her straight up tell Graham that she doesn't know what to say, after trying to find the words, and maybe even an awkward hug. I'd make her mention she may be able to find or make something to help Graham, but she still acts awkward.
I wish someone would redo series 11 and on using the same cast, just better everything.
I wish someone would kill the entire cast and retcon everything since Tennant left