INVESTMENT BANKS DESTROYED in this AWESOME Presentation - Part 4 of 5
Вставка
- Опубліковано 26 сер 2024
- JOIN THE 2024 ITPM END OF YEAR ONLINE CONFERENCE
GET MASSIVE DISCOUNTS ON ITPM ONLINE PROGRAMS CLICK HERE;-
issuu.com/inst...
Institute Education CLICK HERE
www.itpm.com/ed...
Institute of Trading and Portfolio Management - University Tour 2013
Filmed at University College London (UCL) November 2013
University Tour 2013 -- Full Presentation CLICK HERE issuu.com/insti...
'And you can rent them out to all the guys at investment banks' 😂😂😂
LOL this salary discussion thing should be mandatory at every class, imagine the faces on the engineering students when they find out their real prospects
Actually Google or Facebook's software engineer get payment higher than that.
Engineers can make a good salary
I like the fact that he doesnt sugar coat anything. He very realistic, and doesnt spoon feed babies. My hat goes off to anton and l viewed his program and lm very interested in joining.
Although 20% may be possible, he says in other events that 10% is easily achievable because it's a really conservative gain.
Trading for yourself with an annual return of 10% is a better deal versus a salary raise from seniority, promotions and bonuses.
Money is indifferent to you meanwhile bosses expect you to be more productive and have more responsibility on every raise.
Oh boy. Another dream shattered!! LOL
Dream shattered for those who plan to work for Investment Bank.
+Thavy Lor better to know it as soon as possible, right?
@@mpicos100 this is only for trading
Loving this. Knowledge bombs all over the place!
Many people lose thousands of dollars without having heard Anton, if they had the opportunity to listen to Anton before, perhaps now would be millionaires. I am one of them and I'm not ashamed to say it. Even without having made any Anton program, I could understand it to be able to say that he is absolutely right. After losing 100,000 in the market, and become bankrupt, I can now understand each letter of his mouth. Thanks anyway Anton. Continue with your good work.
+Nodens Dagon you can say very loud and clear... how the fuck did you loose 100, 000. But unfortunately , it's true.
You leverage as much you need in order to cover what ever you risk is 2% 3% ect.
Is this a commercial for hedge funds?
I definitely agree with the majority of what Mr. Kreil states, but I also agree with those others on this page who state that there is an overhwelming conflict of interest here.You have to remember that Mr. Kreil is a former Banker who left Goldman and traveled the world for an extended period of time afterwards. Not sure if he's "black-listed," but with the culture of secrecy on the Street, I wouldn't be surprised if some of this stems from bitterness associated with his exit, their unwillingness to take him back, etc; there are obviously multiple factors at work here.
That being said, I will also say that I enjoy his somewhat dry sense of humor, and as a hopeful future professional in the industry, I appreciate the fact that he has no inhibitions regarding what he says.
in life there are always conflicts of interests. the banks them selves are a conflict of interests look at what the caused. it does not detract from the truth he is telling, the truth he has experienced. even if he is bitter as you say the information is accurate. banks and finacial institutions are not houses of truth and sincerity are they now...
Well usually it's this "bitterness" that allows those "exposed" news to surface. The truth usually comes from an insider so this "conflict of interest" doesn't really discredit him per se. The profit for retail would actually be much higher than his example if you went high leverage (which he recommended against but is doable).
The link on the presentation for excel spreadsheet doesn't work...
0:35 does anyone has this Excel Spreadsheet? thanks
Dear IPTM! The link for the presentation has been outdated and therefore we do not have access to that. I would be extremely curious to take a look at this spreadsheet. Any chance you can share that?
Thank you!
This talk was given to a bunch of students - how can any student have £25,000 in their account to start trading?
Part time work, it would take a while tho
what you have said about salaries and benefits should be looked at whatever profession one works in
Why, does your profession require you to live in central London and pay 4k for a rent ? I guess not
20% a year is very high, most average and buy average i mean the median decent trade would be lucky to make 10%.
+norm less according to shkreli
This is a number that is archived by Hedgefunds, not a market return
20% a year isn't bad, if they are using 2x leverage then their cash on cash return would easily be 20%
I get over 80%, even going through the recent pullbacks... 20% cannot be high if you're dealing with sub-million funds.
This is the most important part of the presentation
Conservatively, using them figures, start with 10k and making 10% with x5 margin, you're fund will make you a millionaire in 9 years, 15% 7 years, 20% 6 years..
Bank analysts being limited in their own accounts is not as bad as it sounds. They can work out strategies doing paper trading, and in the meantime, invest in long term funds, like an SP500 index fund, Fidelity flagship, or Berkshire Hathway's low priced symbol. Most kids straight out of college could easily burn up 5-6 years preparing a more aggressive strategy. I don't know the exact percentage of college grads who could consistently do 20%/year or better, but I'm sure it's 1/8 or less. 75% of mutual fund managers can't beat the SPY and that's about 12%/yr.
1/8 is a huge overestimate
this index strategy can be gold indeed. You won't hit 20% returns, but then you most likely also don't get wiped out. Just consistent 8-10% is all you'll do, which can still set you up for long-term success with higher degree of certainty.
Nice...!!! I Was Up +35% Last Year... Looks Like I Should Go See Wednesday Night.
Sounds very nice but
1 - Very few (young) people have 25k spare dollars they don't need to start off in trading
2 - 24% of monthly return is very achievable? hmmm
jibeneyto Its 24% of annual return, so its not a financial pyramid type of yield :)
+jibeneyto I see that , but you should know that he can't lie to you saying ( just open an account of 1k or 2k and you will be wealthy ! ) ... and don't forget that you can ( save , learn and practice during that period , invest in other things, and make other projects .. ) I saved some money when I changed a LOT of bad spending habits .. trading should be considered as creating a company and making it grow overtime ...
Correction. Very few young people have 25k.
He said if u go to the hedge fund u will make £5,000,000 over the 10years, but if r getting bonuses of £2,000,000+ surely u will make more?
Frickin Brilliant Anton
The question is how to double the money every year. If we know, we don't need to go to school. Just start trading as soon as you get 25K. No need to attend these presentation, no need to worry about resume, interview. trading is all about redistribution of wealth. S&P earns 15% a year for past 5 years. so you are beating the market by 5% per year. hedge fund actually underperformed the market the past 5 years. If you consistently beat it by 5%, the money redistributed to you. The math just doesn't work if all hedge funds are doing that. Where is the money coming from?? Retail investor? I don't think retail investors have more money than hedge fund. The GDP growth rate is what? 5%? so the whole economy grow at 5% and you get 20%. There must be a lot of inflation some where in the math to make it work.
Also he assumes leveraging 5 times. So if in one year, you lose 20%, you need to start over again. So at the end of say year 3, you lose all your capital. You still have to go back to i-bank!!
What he says makes sense is buying 5 apartments and rent to i-bankers. that is almost risk-free return.
John Wong the money that floods the markets comes from the FED and ECB and BOJ and etc. the GDP didn't grow much but the markets have doubled and trippled since the financial crisis. You don't need to be a genius to understand that we are in a huge bubble yet again. The problem is how to profit from it.
I'm very interested in learning more about this managed account structure 18:01
what a great info man i love this!
Can someone help me here, he talks about half your bonus goes back into the hedge fund and the other half in your bank account how much more money would you have when u add that on as well
can u please make a video detailing the insights of working in m&a
Interesting insight into investment banking. With the banning of prop trading under Volcker rule it would no surprise in seeing more talent moving across to hedge funds and other alternatives. I am looking into the investment management division both in the investment banks and the lesser known firms (in the media that is). Does the opportunities as well as pay differ in the IB investment management division differ from investment banking division?
The excel sheet download doesn't work. Please give us link for it.
This guy has nailed it! don't work for money!! let it work for you! it's not hard to make 7% /mo. in forex. I dont know about stocls etc... since I dont trade anything else. This is what kids need to learn. But I would probably not buy a lot of hard assets I love liquidity
+Mark Vidales Do you still trade FX?
You are someone who thinks they make money :p even if you do now you will likely lose it at some point. You can't trade fx when you don't know how all the markets work. You're not a trader. Your portfolio should be only 20% fx.
***** I'd go with even less than 20%. Maybe 10-20% at most for speculative operations in general.
Hi Anton, I've always been a fan of yours. I remember your term MCM (middle class moron) really stuck with me when you came to speak at The University of Sheffield a few years ago. I love that term. I have one question. In your 'trade by yourself' spreadsheet, how can you be leveraged 5 times in your first year of trading. I can understand 5 times leverage if you have been trading by yourself for a few years and have gained a track record but how can you expect to be leveraged 5 times in your first year of trading. Are you assuming you have traded yourself a few years prior to this spreadsheet starting? Where does the leverage come from at this stage? Does the leverage come from the institute or does it come from outside investors? Cheers boss, James.
Is there another link for the income spread sheet pls? The link is dead.
How does the institute comes in as a prop firm
Anyone know where to download the spreadsheet he shown? Thx
could someone share the spreadsheet which he shared?
He's only talking about if you get the smallest bonus that you are legally allowed to have at the levels when he's on about reinvesting in the fund he hasn't talked about the cash bonuses
Can we get a link for the excel spreadsheet?
Awesome thank you
So when he says you should trade with your own money what software does he suggest to use because I don't imagine he is implying to trade using an app on your smartphone. Does anybody know?
Go to the ITPM website. The information is there.
Wolf of Wall Street plan just went out the window lol we should thank this guy for telling us the truth
Well , 10 leverage is a bit low ... Have in mind that not everyone of us has 25000 $ .... I am trading with 1:50 leverage , with 2500$ acc ... just not opening large volume positions ...
Can somebody explain info. from Anton's table "Trading for yourself?" to me please... How 20% annual return turns 25K margin into 50K margin next year and 50K margin into 100K margin in year 3? Thanks.
4rextrader yes, basically he's saying that at 20% ROI per year would actually yield you 100% because the broker lets you borrow 5 times your money in the form of margin/leverage (1:5). so for every 20% real return you'd actually end up getting 100% so you'd double your money every year basically.
Thanks for explanation Redi, I didn't get that it is margin provided by the broker, not income!
Very well.. you do explain how you can barely live in Central London with 300k (gross)... (you certainly have a point with people "misguided expectations": gross/net, rat race where expenses grow faster than income...)
BUT, you do not explain how you are supposed to live off zero (0), from your margin account until you reach one of the tipping points...
Obviously easier to do if you have managed to save some cash in previous endeavours... (than for a student loaded with debt...)
he says to get another job making a IB associate salary.. but then how can you trade if you are working another job?
@@bullshark3000 …on your “free time” …around 12 hours a week …
Why do you calculate the 20% gain from your exposure? Shouldn't you take 20% of your margin ? BTW i got really excited, i am really interested in becoming a trader when i can raise the capital and the money for education.
Man I'm not even a trader but it's because he used leverage. Remember he said leverage 5 times. 5 times 25,000 = 125,000 x 20% = 25,000. So he made 25,000 in that year. 25,000 + 25,000 = 50,000 by years end!!
Damn I should start trading too aye!!!!
haha in all honesty though I don't really know anything about trading haha, so I'm thinking of doing Anton's course when I have the money and then just start trading. The best way to learn is by physically trading real money I say. It's like playing sport or learning an instrument. You will never master it by just reading about it, you have to actually physically do it to gain the skills. And there will always be some people who end up just having the natural talent for it, but hard work can still take you very far.
yup thats correct but i didn't hear this befor sofar and i know one ore two things about trading. others are calculating the profits from their capital, wich in this case is the 25k.
Nimrod Vizi yeah i don't see why he replaces buying power with capital in his example to calculate annual returns. Surely if you have 25,000 capital and its leveraged to 125,000, you can't actually lose 125,000. You can only lose up to 25k, but you can earn high £/tick as if you're trading 125k unleveraged.
If you think like the example you'll be risking 2% of 125k on each trade (2,500) and your account will be wiped out in 10 consecutive losing trades.
...Unless he trades by risking his entire account on one trade and holding that trade for a year....But he'll still be wiped out after a certain number of ticks against him.
Also, its certainly not realistic to expect 20% return per month trading. Elite traders only achieve 2-5% a month during the months they're not losing. Anton is a great trader but I think he's trying to sell his course on this one.
Shady Attia I don't really understand how you say it's 20% per month? I thought he is calculating 20% per year on the leveraged amount, so due to the leverage being times by 5 it equates to 100% profit per year over the original capital figure of 25k (100% per year is 8.33% per month, not 20% per month). So that's 8.33% per month on the capital (but it can be even lower per month if it's "compounding" returns so to speak, like if he buys and sells multiple times throughout the year and continually reinvests all profits on each trade), which equates to 1.67% per month on the exposure (20% per year). I'm not familiar with the usual ways of doing these type of calculations though so I don't know how people usually do these % calculations and if it's on the capital or exposure figures, and 8.33% per month on the capital still seems like a very high figure to me, but 1.67% per month on the exposure seems realistic. I'm very much unfamiliar with it all though but this is how I interpret what he is saying at least. What am I potentially missing here?
Leverage only changes one thing, your buying power ie. how much you earn per movement in price. Making 20% a month won't be 100% a month just because leverage is at 1:5. Through my 6 years of trading i have never experienced anyone calculate their returns based on their buying power. The 125k is not yours and the lender certainly won't let you risk his money. It is kept as collateral so that the max you can lose is 25k (all your money).
Anton is clearly trying to exaggerate the pay of traders to a group of novice traders, to convince them to join his several thousand pound a year trading course.
bit too dramatic for my taste
But it doesn’t make it less truthful
just long bitcoin for the next years and enjoy
I am just sitting here thinking that you would be a lot better of if you have some balls and start your own business after year 6!
+A VB hedge fund
anton can you show me how can you double 25k to 50k with 20% return
if you get 20% return on 25k it will be 30k at the end of the year
rawand takna
I believe its 20% of the exposure and not your margin investment.
…I think it has to do with leverage. They use 5 to 1 leverage so, multiply 20% times 5.
and i am just sitting here, studying electrical engineering and information technology...
seems like you followed the herd
Chuck Norris actually i switched to computer science and it security. much happier.
im in computer science and IT and switching to economics and finance haha
Chuck Norris i would not do that. Its all maths after all. Im still doing my double degree in mathematics, thats actually my basis, computer science is just my way off applying it. I dont want to make a lot of money, i know i will make enough to life comfortably.
Arjan Kasapi so why did you quit?
Basically Anton is saying don't work for a bank. Don't live in Central London. Think for yourselves and do your own thing or you will drown.
uk gov inflation target is 2%
+Shweep keep believing
think 7-8%
I find this presentation very true. However, one must note that the financial markets today is dominated by professional money. To consistently generate handsome returns year after year means taking money from those professionals who also want to do the same. I hope students do not go open a trading account and start trading after watching this presentation. The odds are stacked against the retail.
Paul Lee
well commercial banking is only option looks like.....
Retail is still profitable you just gotta learn the other side of the trade and figure out how to fit in. It's harder than before, but you can still do it. Major key: don't use stop loss orders (brokers/tutes will run em before lift off every single time -- smaller moves they'll let you have)
@@ximmychan But is that advisable on a leveraged account as that can lead to a margin call?
Very dubious about what he says here. Very few traders ever make 20% return consistently year on year and that isn't even on a leveraged account! To make 20% of leveraged capital is even harder due to interest payments and also how swings in the market can whipsaw you more when leveraged up.
It is seriously extremely easy to make 20% a year. In my environment you'd be laughed at and then fired for getting such a ridiculous return. Don't accept what is and if someone else can do it, you sure as hell can too.
20% on margined money?? Mmm, highly doubtful over the long term, especially with an announcement like last June when the FED mentioned reducing QE and stocks fell 15% in a few days. On a margined account of 4:1 that would correlate with a fall in account of 60% and possible margin calls never mind the potential psychological impacts which may cause you to sell int he trough!
My strategy is not compatible with margined money so I couldn't tell you that for a fact. But I'm sure that would be possible with a few tweaks.
"stocks fell 15%". This is an astonishingly stupid thing to say.
You make it sound like all stocks fell, which is certainly not the cause. And I'm sure that if I looked, I could find some stocks that dropped 15% today as well. Further more; almost everything was at the upside of the trend at that time, including indices. The drop was predictable the fed only mad it that much more profitable. You obviously don't have a clue about trading and probably don't trade at all.
And to counter your "60% loss". A good trader knows that it's all about risk return ratio's. If you get those right, you can make money whilest having a 50% hitratio(Yes this is bad.). So no one in their right mind, would risk everything they have in one position.
And btw. Stocks have a very negative risk-return ratio. If you have below 250k you should be a 100% focused on trading derivatives. People just trade stocks because at a certain amount of cash, there is not enough liquidity in derivatives at a certain point. Oh and people also trade stocks because they're stupid.
Yes, it ispossible to make more than 20% on NON-MARGINED money but next to impossible on margin which is what Anton is talking about.
What if you had a 10 year career as a nurse/teacher?
Dillon Fisher then you’ll be picketing by year 5.
What if you don't have £25,000 to start trading?
Will the hedge funds see you in the same way if you doubled or tripled your £600 account over one year? (with small risk trades, low Max Return Drawdown)
If you can't make money outside the financial markets, what makes yo think you can walk into the financial makrets and all of a sudden become successful? if you doubled £600 you would have to take massive leverage or choose trades that make say 100% return. This is why amateurs fail. They think doubling £600 is the same as doubling £25,000 or doubling £1,000,000 to £2,000,000. They are very clearly not the same. If you made £1,000,000 would you give it to someone to trade on your behalf who doubled £600? No! They would be out of their depth and wouldnt have a clue how to trade the £1,000,000. They would more than likely spunk it up the wall and lose the lot.
InstituteofTrading Yes i totally agree. This is why i choose to risk small and aim for 2-5% a month. I was up 7% last month, but this month i lost about 4%.
Anyway the problem is that i dont think people who play with little money have much chance getting investors money, even with low risk and consistent winning... this is why so many desperate poor people choose to risk much and lose in the end.
Do you think investors would give money to someone who can make consistently 20-50% a year with £600?
NO!
InstituteofTrading lol ok. I had an offer as a junior fx trade, but turned it down because Uni. Now i got a trainee fx trader offer, which guarantees no job at the end, probably similar to your course.
Its with Emman Charts, do you think trainee positions like these are worth going? Or am i going to have to teach the teachers?
You will definitely be teaching the teachers if you take our course LOL !!! :-)
Successful traders make 20% easily. That's the truth. Another truth is that only 5-10% of all traders at a retail level become successful. Learn to fucking trade. Stop eating up all this bullshit on signal services, get rich quick, and colors and lines all over your fucking charts and hit the books.
Our message exactly!
This guy gets it!
This is a little hopeful that you can make money trading even if trained properly. You have to lose hundreds of thousands of your own money before you can learn to make money consistently and develop the mental tenacity of a trader. Think of that as your other tuition.
Matt Correia not necessarily. I'm now profitable and have only been dabbling with this for less than 5 years. Sure I've lost money but NOT hundreds of thousands. Try a demo account first