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Use a cheap bench top drill press. Remove the top cover and mount the drill upside down on the column. Add a motor to move the quill up and down. Build a table and housing to package the whole thing up. Maybe add trunnions to allow it to tilt. Possibly get an old table saw and gut it out to use the table and housing. It's going to be my next fabricobble project.
As soon as I saw you starting it on it's side I knew it was going to start smoking soon because the start relay is gravity based. The relay turns on because the the high amperage draw through a coil when it's first switched on. Then as amperage quickly falls when the motor get up to speed gravity takes over and turns off the relay. The start relay powers an extra group of windings inside the motor and if left on while running will overheat very quickly. Most commercial motors use an internal centrifugal clutch that turns it off so it doesn't matter if it's on it's side or not. This relay is mounted right in the middle on the plastic body.
And if it is turned on while on it’s side or upside down they contacts in the relay will likely arc and possibly stick. It can be taken apart to fix. I bought one used and had to polish the contacts with a concave brass rod mounted in a drill. It works great now.
I've used the tilting table to adjust a tapered edge and it worked great. An inflatable rubber spindle sleeve holder would enable you to put air to tighten the hold on the sleeve.
I got a bit worried when you let the smoke out at 5:09 John, cause you know all electrical parts are made from smoke. And ones it gets out....its pretty hard to get back in. Looking forward to your OSS build
I remember reading once that rubber reconstitutes to some extent if you put them inside penetrating oil for 12-24 hrs, useful for restorations of old rubber parts in old machines and furniture
Interesting, I was wondering myself how they work as I've only room for a compact option so watching you work it out is very helpful. Does anyone else find themselves talking along with John?
If you are building a spindle sander then might as well add a longer mandrel to hold two sanding drums so you can sand thicker materials. As for the mandrel itself, look at how bicycle handle bars are held in place - with a wedge that is pulled by a screw. Sure, a spindle based on that will go slightly oval, but i believe that if both wedges (made of PVC pipe perhaps?) are as long as possible and have rubber between them and the sanding drums it would not be _that_ much of an issue. Another potential way to hold the drums is to cut slots length-wise, but not to the very ends, of a plastic pipe, then compress it and let it balloon out, similar to how rubber works. Or perhaps something based on a compression spring? A spring will expand outwards as it's un-twisted slightly, hopefully enough to hold the sanding drum in place. Could even be a quick-switch system: twist the spring to shrink it, then release and let it's own tension hold the drum on, no locking mechanism required.
Hi John, I have a steel version of your sander that uses steel cogs to make the spindle go up and down. My main problem is I will renew the cogs and it will work okay for about a month and then the cogs will wear out again, I now have a spindle sander that goes around but not up and down, as I got fed up with the cost of the cogs. I would be very interested in buying plans from you to make a different sander that did not break down every month after using it about five or six times.
Look up the shopsmith oscillating spindle sander attachment for a wild idea of how to make one work. They’ve also got some pretty neat ideas like a six inch sanding drum where you put 3 different grits on one drum so you can work through them without even having to change the drum.
Seems much more practical just to raise/low it by hand every once in a while to prevent uneven wear, for beginners. I thought of doing that. BTW your community post just showed up for the 1st time for me. I've never gotten any of your old ones, watch every single scrap bin video, and get posts from other *channels I'm not subscribed* to.
John, I’m sure you know and just forgot that the flip down top is what secures the spindles and plates in place?!. Guess I missed the build of the new base for your OSS (oscillating spindle sander). I saw the newer video of you going to make the discs and cabinet already built. BTW, what did you do with the belt sander attachment that came with that OS/Belt sander?
In your Table Saw Series you spoke about how much the plastic for the top was nice to work with. Could you use some of that and turn you some new drums? Assuming you have scrap pieces! Also I have wondered if someone could purchase the Harbor Freight oscalating sander and modify it to have the changeable Sanders like the rigid??
Brake fluid will make rubber expand.IDK if it will contract once again but I know it makes it expand,it also restores the rubberiness if it has hardened. I also don't know what it'd do to the sanding cylinders but it sure isn't good for your vehicles paint...lol
I picked up one of these last year, it was heavily reduced at Home Depot and a bit of an impulse buy. I quite like the idea of a custom made cabinet for it, maybe something with the same sort of footprint as your router table?
Haha, yeah. It took me years to get a couple of stinking countersinks incorporated into my workshop. Prior to then, I knew I had them. I just couldn't produce one when I needed it. Also, I never had my bandsaw running quite right, ever, until I took all the tools required to tune it and put them all with the saw, buying extras where needed.
All you need to do to fix the shrunken drums is wrap them with mailing labels. I had a spindle sander before where the mechanism was something like it had two wavy surfaced discs that mated with each other and they both had gears on the outside but a slightly different tooth count. That created a differential between them without having to gear it down.
I know the mechanism you are talking about, but that's even less DIY friendly. Although I suppose the same thing could be done with V belts and pulleys... wheels are turning... (pun intended). Thanks for pointing that out.
@@IBuildItScrapBin Well the simplest way is to just make it not oscillate. It's so easy even I can do it! Oscillating doesn't improve the sanding quality at all, it just spreads the wear out. Making the table height adjustable or move the spindle up and down and the table stays in one place is actually better at that. I tend to think they just make it oscillate because it's cheaper to do that than make the spindle fully height adjustable. Now that I think about it, I really should make my shaper into a spindle sander for the 99.9% of the time I'm not using it to cut box joints.
Got to disagree with you on that one, it's much easier to burn the stock without the oscillation. Too much heat build up in one area, so the up down spreads that out too.
FYI it says right on the side of the unit why you shouldn't turn it on upside down / sideways. I recall seeing a label on mine anyway, not in front of it at the moment to check.
Ryan Dury it’s because of the start up solenoid on the bottom front. It’s gravity activated when off. If it’s upside down or on its side it is in the wrong position and the solenoid sends power in the wrong path for continuous running. It will but up the motor. I’ve had to dis-assemble my solenoid and polish the contacts to get it to work. I bought it used and the contacts were arc compromised and the motor would not turn properly.
If you're building one... put the motor to the side with a small pulley on the motor, large pulley on the mechanism so you're reduced the speed before getting to your mechanism. Then if you build gears/ramps/etc. out of wood they would be running at low speed and could last longer. Your belt drive could run 2 different pullies- one to spin the spindle and one to operate the oscillating mechanism. Easier though to just take the Ridgid drive mechanism out and put into your own table.
I have the first generation of those. I am currently looking for bushings for the spindle but looks like the parts have been discontinued. I feel the pain on the when blowing it off and the parts flying all over.
Hey John nice job! Question I have the same oscillating sander, one day it stopped oscillating but the motor still ran. I took it apart like you did put it back together without changing anything. To my amazement it oscillated until a few weeks later when it stopped again. Any thoughts, Ridgid has no solutions. Thanks
I'd like to see your take on a home made one . I'm looking to make one myself have a nice motor to use and a 12v windshield wiper motor 2 steel rods some brass bushings and 2 pieces of flat steel to create a pivot arm for the up and down motion however speed control of the main motor is my main concern .
I would love to see a video on making replacement spindles for this machine.. I have the exact same one and I've lost the smallest one 😭 Also I thought those were supposed to shrink so the sand paper slides over the spindle and you just tighten the nut on top to compress the rubber to make it expand and hold the sand paper.. thats what I do and its always worked for me
Petroleum jelly will make them swell up. I think they will not shrink down again. I know from applying the jelly to rubber seals that I could not fit back again on a chemical toilet, I thought I was going crazy at the time.
John, you're a good guy, should consider going on the road visiting other carpenter's shops like the Nomad Barber does for barbering. We'd all learn a lot and you could share your common sense like a Johnny Appleseed up and down the frontier.
Ha, ha... John does AVE style Videos. Taking tools apart just for curiosity. :D I was working in a vulcanizing company for some years... As far as i can tell, the rubber of your sanding sleefs is loosing some sulfer into the surrounding air. That ends up in a decrease of overall mass...and , of course in shrinkage. An other question... What speaks against the use of a windshield wiper motor for the oscilation function? They are cheap and all over the planet available. And the different makes and models are somehow all comparable. (mounting points, speed, output power, size.....) PWM controllers cost about 5 bucks on e bay...
I have holes just below my ears, that I describe as a colander. The sanders have there uses but I don't find then efficient. The drums might by 100mm but even with turning upside down you still only use approx 35mm which means the middle of the drum never gets any use. Yes definitely needs a drawer to keep the drums in and clean/ free of dust... What did you say your name was??? 🤣
Doesn't really show the mechanism of how these units work. Would like to see one actually fully disassembled, not just a long shot of a black housing. Did learn that it rides on the spiral ramps on the housing, however, so have a little better idea how it works ! Mine is making a burning smell, so I make take mine completely apart. Will try to share if I can !
The bottom has ramps as it turns there is a concentric ring that advance the mechanism a little at a time till it tops out, then it drops and starts over. The oscillation had nothing to do with the smoke, that’s the solenoid in the middle lower front. The contacts are arc burned now.
The smoke was from the motor. So if that's a cutout for the start winding, the start winding was on too long and got hot enough to smoke. Thanks for pointing that out.
I Build It Scrap Bin exactly. It’s easy to polish the contacts in the start solenoid. It’s two tiny flat screws to take it apart. I took a photo before to make sure I put the wires back correctly. Take a part then build a polisher from a #10 brass bolt. Chuck it up in a drill cut off the head then find something to make slight concave indention in the end of the brass bolt. I used a round head screw in a vise for this. Once it’s concave, you push it against each of the contacts while it’s spinning in the drill. The contacts look like silver, it’s takes awhile but they shine right up. You want the contacts to be curved, the reason for the concave polisher.
That is a bloody gynormous enclosure for that thing, just stick the works in a box that suits you, most of the ones I have seen are comparatively small, and expensive !
I Build It Scrap Bin speaking of confused, I think I’m the one who sent you the link to the vix-punch. I ordered two when I got it. I’d send you the second but I haven’t seen it since the day it arrived. Maybe that’s why I identify with this channel.
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You could make the footprint smaller too. That box is mostly empty.
I find that getting out of the cold weather helps alleviate shrinkage.
George Constanza. Seinfeld.
Love it. I do stuff like this at my business. Nice to see a craftsman being a craftsman. Thanks.
Use a cheap bench top drill press. Remove the top cover and mount the drill upside down on the column. Add a motor to move the quill up and down. Build a table and housing to package the whole thing up. Maybe add trunnions to allow it to tilt. Possibly get an old table saw and gut it out to use the table and housing. It's going to be my next fabricobble project.
As soon as I saw you starting it on it's side I knew it was going to start smoking soon because the start relay is gravity based. The relay turns on because the the high amperage draw through a coil when it's first switched on. Then as amperage quickly falls when the motor get up to speed gravity takes over and turns off the relay. The start relay powers an extra group of windings inside the motor and if left on while running will overheat very quickly. Most commercial motors use an internal centrifugal clutch that turns it off so it doesn't matter if it's on it's side or not. This relay is mounted right in the middle on the plastic body.
And if it is turned on while on it’s side or upside down they contacts in the relay will likely arc and possibly stick. It can be taken apart to fix. I bought one used and had to polish the contacts with a concave brass rod mounted in a drill. It works great now.
John going full AvE on us... That'd be a hell of a collab
I've used the tilting table to adjust a tapered edge and it worked great. An inflatable rubber spindle sleeve holder would enable you to put air to tighten the hold on the sleeve.
John, I have to say you're the best!
I got a bit worried when you let the smoke out at 5:09 John, cause you know all electrical parts are made from smoke. And ones it gets out....its pretty hard to get back in. Looking forward to your OSS build
Merci beaucoup pour la vidéo
I remember reading once that rubber reconstitutes to some extent if you put them inside penetrating oil for 12-24 hrs, useful for restorations of old rubber parts in old machines and furniture
Interesting, I was wondering myself how they work as I've only room for a compact option so watching you work it out is very helpful. Does anyone else find themselves talking along with John?
If you are building a spindle sander then might as well add a longer mandrel to hold two sanding drums so you can sand thicker materials. As for the mandrel itself, look at how bicycle handle bars are held in place - with a wedge that is pulled by a screw. Sure, a spindle based on that will go slightly oval, but i believe that if both wedges (made of PVC pipe perhaps?) are as long as possible and have rubber between them and the sanding drums it would not be _that_ much of an issue. Another potential way to hold the drums is to cut slots length-wise, but not to the very ends, of a plastic pipe, then compress it and let it balloon out, similar to how rubber works.
Or perhaps something based on a compression spring? A spring will expand outwards as it's un-twisted slightly, hopefully enough to hold the sanding drum in place. Could even be a quick-switch system: twist the spring to shrink it, then release and let it's own tension hold the drum on, no locking mechanism required.
Hi John, I have a steel version of your sander that uses steel cogs to make the spindle go up and down. My main problem is I will renew the cogs and it will work okay for about a month and then the cogs will wear out again, I now have a spindle sander that goes around but not up and down, as I got fed up with the cost of the cogs. I would be very interested in buying plans from you to make a different sander that did not break down every month after using it about five or six times.
I got a free craftsman spindle sander, doing the same to mine, fun project.
Look up the shopsmith oscillating spindle sander attachment for a wild idea of how to make one work. They’ve also got some pretty neat ideas like a six inch sanding drum where you put 3 different grits on one drum so you can work through them without even having to change the drum.
Seems much more practical just to raise/low it by hand every once in a while to prevent uneven wear, for beginners. I thought of doing that.
BTW your community post just showed up for the 1st time for me. I've never gotten any of your old ones, watch every single scrap bin video, and get posts from other *channels I'm not subscribed* to.
(1) More like a router table.
Good to see you John!
John, I’m sure you know and just forgot that the flip down top is what secures the spindles and plates in place?!.
Guess I missed the build of the new base for your OSS (oscillating spindle sander). I saw the newer video of you going to make the discs and cabinet already built.
BTW, what did you do with the belt sander attachment that came with that OS/Belt sander?
In your Table Saw Series you spoke about how much the plastic for the top was nice to work with. Could you use some of that and turn you some new drums? Assuming you have scrap pieces!
Also I have wondered if someone could purchase the Harbor Freight oscalating sander and modify it to have the changeable Sanders like the rigid??
Brake fluid will make rubber expand.IDK if it will contract once again but I know it makes it expand,it also restores the rubberiness if it has hardened.
I also don't know what it'd do to the sanding cylinders but it sure isn't good for your vehicles paint...lol
I picked up one of these last year, it was heavily reduced at Home Depot and a bit of an impulse buy. I quite like the idea of a custom made cabinet for it, maybe something with the same sort of footprint as your router table?
Well, it's on - the motor is sitting on my workbench right now. It would probably around the same size as the router table.
Haha, yeah. It took me years to get a couple of stinking countersinks incorporated into my workshop. Prior to then, I knew I had them. I just couldn't produce one when I needed it. Also, I never had my bandsaw running quite right, ever, until I took all the tools required to tune it and put them all with the saw, buying extras where needed.
When building the new casing you may consider incorporating an adjustable top to get more “milage” out of the sanding spindles.
Instead, I think I'll make the drums longer - maybe 6" and then I can just move the sleeve up or down (or flip it over) to make better use of it.
All you need to do to fix the shrunken drums is wrap them with mailing labels. I had a spindle sander before where the mechanism was something like it had two wavy surfaced discs that mated with each other and they both had gears on the outside but a slightly different tooth count. That created a differential between them without having to gear it down.
I know the mechanism you are talking about, but that's even less DIY friendly. Although I suppose the same thing could be done with V belts and pulleys... wheels are turning... (pun intended).
Thanks for pointing that out.
@@IBuildItScrapBin Well the simplest way is to just make it not oscillate. It's so easy even I can do it! Oscillating doesn't improve the sanding quality at all, it just spreads the wear out. Making the table height adjustable or move the spindle up and down and the table stays in one place is actually better at that. I tend to think they just make it oscillate because it's cheaper to do that than make the spindle fully height adjustable. Now that I think about it, I really should make my shaper into a spindle sander for the 99.9% of the time I'm not using it to cut box joints.
Got to disagree with you on that one, it's much easier to burn the stock without the oscillation. Too much heat build up in one area, so the up down spreads that out too.
Like AvE you let the smoke out!! Like me, you have plenty of tools....if you can find them. I loved the look you had when you saw all the grease!
"It shrinks?"
"Like a frightened turtle!"
Imagine that, a rigid tool having trouble with shrinkage.
FYI it says right on the side of the unit why you shouldn't turn it on upside down / sideways. I recall seeing a label on mine anyway, not in front of it at the moment to check.
Ryan Dury it’s because of the start up solenoid on the bottom front. It’s gravity activated when off. If it’s upside down or on its side it is in the wrong position and the solenoid sends power in the wrong path for continuous running. It will but up the motor. I’ve had to dis-assemble my solenoid and polish the contacts to get it to work. I bought it used and the contacts were arc compromised and the motor would not turn properly.
@@akbychoice Hey, I appreciate the explanation! Thanks!
is the whole motor assembly available as a spare part? Maybe it would be cool to buy just that, and build the machine around myself....
To deal with the shrinking you could try belt grip form a auto shop it softens and rejuvenates old rubber
I would really like to know what you had for breakfast John, you were really happy. I want some too!
Hello. Do you know what is the outside diameter of the smallest spindle sand paper ? I can’t find if it’s 1/2 or 3/4. Thanks
If you're building one... put the motor to the side with a small pulley on the motor, large pulley on the mechanism so you're reduced the speed before getting to your mechanism. Then if you build gears/ramps/etc. out of wood they would be running at low speed and could last longer. Your belt drive could run 2 different pullies- one to spin the spindle and one to operate the oscillating mechanism. Easier though to just take the Ridgid drive mechanism out and put into your own table.
3:15 How to fix the shrinkage? That's the million dollar question.
Still sold for $248 at home depot I think my olllllld Delta BOSS goes up to 3" spindles, but yeah the sleeves can slip a bit.
I wonder if they've improved the drums. They must have had plenty of complaints about it over the years.
sooo funny if you have a special tool your COMPELLED to find it !!!!!! LOL fricken died laughing , soooo true. might takes days at my shop !
Yesterday i was Just Wondering how the Up n down Motion Works on the Spindler Sander !
I have the first generation of those. I am currently looking for bushings for the spindle but looks like the parts have been discontinued. I feel the pain on the when blowing it off and the parts flying all over.
Hey John nice job! Question I have the same oscillating sander, one day it stopped oscillating but the motor still ran. I took it apart like you did put it back together without changing anything. To my amazement it oscillated until a few weeks later when it stopped again. Any thoughts, Ridgid has no solutions. Thanks
Sounds like the slip ring that rides up the ramps in the bottom end may have broken.
I'd like to see your take on a home made one . I'm looking to make one myself have a nice motor to use and a 12v windshield wiper motor 2 steel rods some brass bushings and 2 pieces of flat steel to create a pivot arm for the up and down motion however speed control of the main motor is my main concern .
So what was the smoke from? Just fine dust?
I would love to see a video on making replacement spindles for this machine.. I have the exact same one and I've lost the smallest one 😭 Also I thought those were supposed to shrink so the sand paper slides over the spindle and you just tighten the nut on top to compress the rubber to make it expand and hold the sand paper.. thats what I do and its always worked for me
Petroleum jelly will make them swell up. I think they will not shrink down again. I know from applying the jelly to rubber seals that I could not fit back again on a chemical toilet, I thought I was going crazy at the time.
instead of trying to swell those spindles, maybe paint them with something like plasti dip or sleeve them with something bicycle inner-tube?
It may be possible to see the way the bottom cap was orientated, from the video footage.
You should build a small cabinet labelled "Hard to find tools" and store them there.
Windshield wipers motor might do the trick.
It's icky! How old are you John?
Release the schmoo!
John, you're a good guy, should consider going on the road visiting other carpenter's shops like the Nomad Barber does for barbering. We'd all learn a lot and you could share your common sense like a Johnny Appleseed up and down the frontier.
Why make it oscillate? What's the function off that?
i have that same sander i have the same problems damn shrinkage
Use a wind shield wiper motor from a car to the up and down movement..
Haha he sounds like me when i'm drunk, maybe confinement induced drinking haha
Mind like a steel trap! You know, the steel you trap your cooked spaghetti in...
Ha, ha... John does AVE style Videos. Taking tools apart just for curiosity. :D I was working in a vulcanizing company for some years... As far as i can tell, the rubber of your sanding sleefs is loosing some sulfer into the surrounding air. That ends up in a decrease of overall mass...and , of course in shrinkage. An other question... What speaks against the use of a windshield wiper motor for the oscilation function? They are cheap and all over the planet available. And the different makes and models are somehow all comparable. (mounting points, speed, output power, size.....) PWM controllers cost about 5 bucks on e bay...
I have holes just below my ears, that I describe as a colander. The sanders have there uses but I don't find then efficient. The drums might by 100mm but even with turning upside down you still only use approx 35mm which means the middle of the drum never gets any use. Yes definitely needs a drawer to keep the drums in and clean/ free of dust... What did you say your name was??? 🤣
Doesn't really show the mechanism of how these units work. Would like to see one actually fully disassembled, not just a long shot of a black housing. Did learn that it rides on the spiral ramps on the housing, however, so have a little better idea how it works !
Mine is making a burning smell, so I make take mine completely apart. Will try to share if I can !
Lol, almost thought I was watching one of my videos. Surprised to see you less focused.
@4:07 - have you been told that before lol
that's what she said... not!
:)
@4:03 how many time have ya said that
The bottom has ramps as it turns there is a concentric ring that advance the mechanism a little at a time till it tops out, then it drops and starts over. The oscillation had nothing to do with the smoke, that’s the solenoid in the middle lower front. The contacts are arc burned now.
The smoke was from the motor.
So if that's a cutout for the start winding, the start winding was on too long and got hot enough to smoke. Thanks for pointing that out.
I Build It Scrap Bin exactly. It’s easy to polish the contacts in the start solenoid. It’s two tiny flat screws to take it apart. I took a photo before to make sure I put the wires back correctly. Take a part then build a polisher from a #10 brass bolt. Chuck it up in a drill cut off the head then find something to make slight concave indention in the end of the brass bolt. I used a round head screw in a vise for this. Once it’s concave, you push it against each of the contacts while it’s spinning in the drill. The contacts look like silver, it’s takes awhile but they shine right up. You want the contacts to be curved, the reason for the concave polisher.
I think izzy swan made a drill powered spindle sander at one point in time
That is a bloody gynormous enclosure for that thing, just stick the works in a box that suits you, most of the ones I have seen are comparatively small, and expensive !
Now your stepping into mathias’s world ! Lol
Like everyone has that spindle sander.
5:30 How do we know you really came right back? I guess we'll have to trust you.
You were having a rough day during this video.
This is your brain on "edits" - friends don't let friends edit alone...
Perhaps you could partner up with AvE in B.C and make it "chooch" more better.
Have you tried dissolving some Viagra in water and soaking them in that?
58th.
John, I think you’re losing it. Memory lapse, clumsiness, and a video on Thursday!?!?
This isn't Sunday???
I Build It Scrap Bin I’m kind of confused myself.
I Build It Scrap Bin speaking of confused, I think I’m the one who sent you the link to the vix-punch. I ordered two when I got it. I’d send you the second but I haven’t seen it since the day it arrived. Maybe that’s why I identify with this channel.
@@IBuildItScrapBin just wait, it will be....
I guess it is the same as Viagra!
Not AvE... funny.
OK, now you’re really getting bored!