An elderly man who used to work in a plastics factory in the U.S. which produced celluloid explained that some companies cut corners to save on the cost of materials. He said that pure distilled water was necessary for producing celluloid. He also said that pure anhydrous alcohol was needed as well. Some companies used tap water and the cheapest denatured alcohol they could find to manufacture celluloid. Celluloid was made up in large blocks approximately 27" by 54" and varying thicknesses. When cured, the block went to a specialty machine which sliced off sheets of varying thicknesses. Because the base material itself is essentially clear, celluloid could be made up in a huge variety of colors and more importantly, patterns. It could imitate elephant ivory, tortoise shell, different pearlescent colors, etc... I have personally handled and worked on thousands of vintage instruments with celluloid parts, such as the binding and purfling, rosettes, pickguards and many other celluloid parts and there is a commonality with some brands. Gretsch had a factory in Brooklyn and they sourced materials as close to their factory as possible. There was a local plastics supplier that they used as a supplier. John D'Angelico used this same supplier and both Gretsch guitars and D'Angelico guitars suffer from binding rot. The factory standard glue/adhesive for celluloid used to be made mainly from clear celluloid dissolved in acetone, ethyl acetate and a few other chemicals to create more open time. This glue actually melted the celluloid and it "melded" the celluloid to the wood. Due to factories needing to keep production flow moving, there was little time for the solvents in the glue to gas off. After nitrocellulose lacquer became the predominant finish for guitars, things changed in that the solvents in the lacquer leached into the celluloid causing it to swell somewhat. Over time, the celluloid would shrink back and all was well. Due to factories using varnish for finishes prior to nitrocellulose lacquer being introduced, there was no real issue with regard to the celluloid being affected. I have seen many instruments over 100 years old with the celluloid parts fully intact. What I used to believe was shrinkage in the celluloid binding of these older instruments may actually be from heavy scraping in the factory when the instruments were made. The celluloid pickguards used to be attached directly to the bare wood of the guitar tops using a solvent that melted the underside of the pickguard. This was very common among factories which would then apply the finish over the top, pickguard and all. With the pickguards that had been finished over with nitrocellulose lacquer, the solvents used to attach the pickguard were still trapped inside the pickguard and with the added solvents from the lacquer, the pickguard swelled a bit. Over the years, the solvents would slowly escape and the pickguard would start to shrink. The Martin guitar company decided around 1966 to stop using celluloid pickguards and they switched to cellulose acetate which was a more stable material than celluloid. Cellulose acetate was used for many purposes but was best known in the eyeglass industry where it was used for frames and, due to the thicker sizes used in making the frames, was stable. What Martin did not know and, surprisingly didn't research, was that in a .020" thickness, cellulose acetate was much less stable than celluloid. They could actually cup the guitar top in the pickguard area and produce cracks in the top. For many years I removed and replaced these cellulose acetate pickguards due to them literally becoming something resembling a black potato chip. Martin had to cover these pickguard replacements and occasional cracks caused by the shrinking guards under warranty. I can't begin to imagine what they had to pay out over the years for this lack of experimentation. I have never seen binding rot on a Martin guitar, but I have seen extreme shrinkage with Martin Boltaron binding.
Thanks for the insightful reply. Trying to put together artificial materials with wood and have them play nice over the years is somewhat of an iffy factor it seems. Looking to buy a new acoustic at the moment but not so confident about buying a new Martin since their modern shrinking bindings problem since 2012 and luthiers refusing loose binding jobs because they are so tired of doing them. Maple bindings make so much more sense in an acoustic guitar (when you don't expect to bump it into stuff).
How would you fix it? I have just been gifted a 1940 Gretsch “Synchromatic” with binding coming off, shrunk in spots. Great shape overall. Sunburst. I can post a picture? I am a violin 🎻 luthier mainly :-)
Hot Tip > Glue Masters Pro CA glue, and Bob Smith Industries Accelerator for the No Fog No White Clear results. I've used this for years its as good as the Satellite City CA glue I used at my guitar shop back in the 90's.
I described it accurately and sold it at a loss. I'm not replacing the binding. If the new guys wants to do that, he can. In the meantime, it's perfectly playable.
if the buyer was willing to wait and pay to have a guitar completely rebound im sure it would've been done.the advice and opinions idiots seem to interject makes it appear like they are somehow affected by this?my suggestion is to watch the videos if you like them and if you dont like them find something else to do that doesn't annoy others like myself and the rest of the people here who do like the videos and watch them purposely
In my flock, I have three Gretschs....I play mine a ton, along with my others, and push them to feedback everytime. These can be absolute beasts. Its a lot of fun to get these totally growling.
I don't know why, but Gretsch used celluloid binding. One of my customers had to have his guitar re-bound after just 7 yrs. Gretsch re-bound it with the same celluloid binding. I replaced the binding for the last time with nylon binding used by the rest of the industry.
LOL...Hey..if y'all motherfuckers had bought a "real" guitar in the first place, like a Rickenbacker or a Gibson or Fender from that era, you would be having problems like that with a Gretsch....LOL
The treble side was borderline. The guitar had already sold though and waiting for new binding to get shipped to me wasn't in the cards. It came out nicely in the end. Well, passable anyway. You'll see in Pt.2.
Is super glue really the right choice for repairing the binding? If, down the road, any new owner would want to replace the binding, that super glue would be extremely hard to remove without causing additional damage to the fingerboard and neck, don't you think?
Yeah I'm with you Guitar Man. I purchased one of these not too long ago thinking that I was going to get a killer deal. It had really bad rotting in The Binding or at least what I thought was really bad binding. The guitar repair man told me that this was the best one he had ever seen. so when everything was said and done it would have been about six to seven hundred dollars to redo the binding. Which really made the guitar almost not doing. So like you I sold her for the same price I paid. I wonder how many times that has happened. Good video probably the best one online in regards to this issue with the grech's.
Nitrocellulose decomposition (normal with age) gives nitric acid fumes. If the guitar stays in a case, the decomposition process is accelerated due to nitric acid attacking the binding in a deadly feedback loop. Keep it outside, and the rot will nearly stop.
The rot will never stop until the binding is completly gone. Most of the time it also burns the finish, the wood, the glue joints of the top and back ot the sides, the metal platings,the pickup windings and the interior of the case. Gluing the rotted binding is not even a bandaid fix. The only permanet fix is complete removal ad replacement of the binding....every trace of it. This was faulty binding to begin with, degrading so slowly as to not be detected by the manufacturer of the guitar or the binding material until years later. Some guitars have binding which comes from several batches...you will see necks and headstocks with good binding and the body on the same guitar has degraded into a toxic peanut brittle, being from a different batch Also, the rotted binding is quite toxic, and you should avoid exposure to it. I have a big pickle jar full of rotted celluloid that i use to relic metal parts with to match replacements to the vintage guitar. My advice is DONT BUY BINDING ROTTED GRETSCHES. Non-rotting guitars are out there, but somewhat rare. If you see ANY ROT, stay away! Even "just a couple spots" means bad binding, and it WILL get much worse.
My friend's step dad used to play with Chet Atkins, he would talk about it all the time, he had an old KUSTOM dual 15" pleated leather bass cabinet and he claimed to own the very first fender P-Bass prototype in existence. He showed me once or twice and told stories of fender going through great lengths to buy it back from him, at one point even offering him $125k for the bass guitar. I don't know how true the story is but I always got a kick out of it. He passed away a few years ago.
Hi Brad.Love your videos and though I've never commented I do look forward to them.I'm watching from Scotland.Massive Who/Townshend fan here.This is the model he used(1959)on Who's next,Quadrophenia etc paired with a 1959 Fender Bandmaster!Keep up the good work!
Cool... I just rebound a '65 Duo Jet, body and neck. Actually found it in a pawn shop. Everything else was working. Did a re-fret, new nut, replaced the volume pot, gave the entire thing a thorough scrub down, new strings and set up. Actually think i'm going to keep this one. Got it for an insane steal...!
This is more a case of the pawn shop owner not quite aware of what the guitar actually was. To prove he wasn't out of line on the price tag, given the binding and dirt issues, he showed me an online pic of the latest model electromatic double jet with price. Needless to say, I gave the guy close to asking and bolted before he changed his mind. Truly enjoy the vids, Brad.. Thanks for doing them.
Ignorant pawn shops are always a bonus. I've had my share. Believe me, they'd take advantage of you if they could, so they're fair game as far as I'm concerned.
You know, all 3 of those are good sounding amps. The Crate Club Series are probably the most surprising. I've done recording with the tweed Peavey Classic 50 410. The reverb IC kept blowing on it and I never could figure out why at the time, but other than that, the tone was outstanding. Actually, the music clip at the end of all my videos of late features that amp heavily.
Was the background music yours? I enjoyed the first piece especially. The percussive qualities of the piano and the guitar together added an interesting contrast to the almost plaintive singing.
It's worth restoring the original binding. I have a couple of vintage gretsches, I have done binding work on. The key is leaving them out of their cases once you discover the problem. Sometimes it doesn't matter and the bad patch will flake off anyway, but for the most part the rot doesn't advance because the gas is not confined in the case. You can also use acrylic cement on the bindings. That wide section of binding by the cutaway should be replaced ASAP it's always the first to go.
My 66 Guild has so far not suffered any binding rot. A few spots in the cutaway came loose about 40 years ago but never spread. Shame these beautiful Gretch develop the decay... Good fix up Brad, short of a full overhaul and refinish, you done good👍.
The only Guild I ever saw with binding rot were some of the earliest New York Guilds. None of my Guilds from the sixties suffer from binding rot, just some shrinkage. Binding rot is a Gretsch problem, not a Guild problem.
I re-did a 68 Rally that had this issue. It is worse if they are left in the case. Once that crap kicks off, it will corrode every piece of metal nearby. Getting that fretboard off and rebinding it isn't super easy, but it isn't super hard either. Plus its a good time to re-fret it and recondition the fretboard. The body binding on mine was a real major pain...
I totally agree. You could do it with the fretboard on, but for me it was easier just to get it off and have it all exposed. It wasn't as big of a deal as I expected, but not real easy by any means.
Not to be a weiner, but doesn't it make more sense to do the fix-up on items BEFORE selling them on Reverb to maximize their market value? That's what I do with all of the amps I sell. Makes for better pictures too.
I would just to avoid any "item not as described" issues and pissing people off in general. That way, if you change part of the item or worse, mess up during a repair, they already know what they're getting. You can probably get around some this by wording things correctly in the description, but as mentioned, post-repair photos are usually a good idea.
Yes. This guitar went up on sale before my move when I was trying to downsize some stuff. The binding must have worsened in the interim. I pulled out of the case to inspect before shipping and found the loose binding pieces. The bits of rot were in the description already, but I contacted buyer and told him I'd need a couple days to fix the loose binding before shipping. I was already prepped to take a loss on this one. Not an ideal situation, for sure.
I’m a slide rule collector and that “rot” looks a lot like the old K&E (Keuffel & Esser) slide rule cursor rot called KERCS (K&E Rotting Cursor Syndrome). It occurred on almost all K&E slide rules made for about a decade following WW II. Maybe Gretsch got sucked into buying from K&E vendor’s surplus.
Brad, Isn't the plastic binding originally attached using acetone to "melt" the binding onto the wood? Wouldn't the really thin "Super Glue" be worth running to the local hardware store? I think that it would seep into all of the cracks & reduce the time you had to spend with the gel glue. I _think_ that I saw a video where the Luthier melted some extra binding (the same color as the guitar needing repair) in some acetone to create a paste of the binding material to fill in cracks or chips that wouldn't otherwise "close up." One last idea: An Xacto knife with a #11 blade might help to get the glue down into cracks better than the little screwdriver.
I bet, watched many of his video's he was also cited as an influence by many stars, including Eric Clapton, Brian May, Paul McCartney, George Harrison, John Lennon, Pete Townshend, Keith Richards, Sting, Hank Marvin, Robert Smith, Mike Oldfield, Mark Knopfler and Jimmy Page
Could this binding rot be a reaction to hand oils after many years? It appears to have occurred in specific areas...the binding on the body is on the top where it could be in contact with someones arm or shirtless gut.
Ironically I am rebinding an early70s les paul, the binding is in a similar rotten cracked shrunken state. Not my favourite job, scraping new binding, however , rebinding can be a real seller. I find ,once you start prying and gluing, it never stops. Quicker to strip and rebind.
Brad : Does the rot just happen on the older Gretsch gutairs? I bought a 2015 Gretsch Club jet a couple weeks ago. Wanting to know it has me freaked out.
Enjoyed the video ,I have a newer version of that Model with real F holes,why on earth did they go to painted on f holes ?! Cost cutting ? I really like the "branded " one the most,maybe someday . Thanks Brad ! :-)
Brad you have the patience of a saint!Coodos to you ,I would have sold it as is and let the new owner to redo the binding and a fret job to boot,nice guitar I think that binding is highly flammable as well,that's why theres no such thing as relic binding,Cheers you the Man.
Could this be the same Gretsch Country Gentleman that one of my bandmates owned during our garage band days in Louisville during the 60s? Wow, that would be wild!
It is easier to control, yes. But I needed it to wick in more than it wanted to. You can see me using that tiny screwdriver to push it down in the gaps. Wouldn't be necessary with thinner stuff.
i think using some glue that actually melts the binding and fuses it together is a more permanent fix. I used to use acetone based poly cement glue on jolanas that had the binding from some kind of nitro plastic.
I must say I'm a little surprized that Gretcsh doesn't turn yourr crank. I have a 5236 and I like that it's bright and chimy like my Strat but not thin and shallow. I use my Gretsch interchangeably with a Godin LG PAF. The Godin is a bit darker and fatter but either guitar is great
This is always a tough repair. Here's a tip: cut up an aluminum beer can and use scissors to cut little strips of aluminum 1" long and 1/8" wide. Use these strips as little spatulas to work the glue deep into very narrow cracks. That way there's no need to pry up the binding and risk snapping it or loosening it further. One aluminum can will have you in spatulas for years. The nitric acid vapor from the breakdown of the celluloid plastic also corrodes plating on all the metal parts. Keeping these old guitars in their cases actually speeds up their deterioration because the case contains and concentrates the fumes. And even the hide glue holding the wood together starts letting go after 40+ years. All real Gretsches slowly disassemble themselves. Cheers!
Not sure on this one as I don't fix guitars. But given the age of the Gretsch, would it be better to have the binding redone professionally instead of super glue. I think using super glue it would permanently stuff the guitar.
if the buyer was willing to wait and pay to have a guitar completely rebound im sure it would've been done.the advice and opinions idiots seem to interject makes it appear like they are somehow affected by this?my suggestion is to watch the videos if you like them and if you dont like them find something else to do that doesn't annoy others like myself and the rest of the people here who do like the videos and watch them purposely
I am not a fan of the US made current or older models. Id always picked up Gretsch guitars and within a few minutes put them down. I also am not a fan of the Electromatic models past ones at least. But i tried out one of their cheap Streamliner series guitars and i was blown away. It had a feel like a modern guitar, and id always wanted a modern feel and playing Gretsch. I ended up buying it and it blows my mind. I had also recently gotten a AIO Wolf Rickenbacker copy and the same can be said of that, it imho outplays expensive Ricks because it has a different feel to the neck and just the way it plays in general. If i had not tried this Gretsch out or this AIO W300, i would not own a Rick or Gretsch sounding guitar. Recently ive been recording a lot and these guitars are the bomb. Sometimes the way it was done in the past isnt the best way, thats how i feel with Gretsch and Ricks. Glad i gave these guitars a try because id always wanted that sound and now ive got it.
Wow that low E string !!! lol. You sure thats not an original string from the factory ? ehehe How much would it cost roughly to have the binding redone on this guitar ? Curious.
HAHA! An "In the Blues" ad played before your video and while I was watching it, I thought it was clip you put on the front of your video and you were either spoofing them or some other kind of flame-war scenario... I'm pleasantly surprised it wasn't. I don't want you having any UA-cam enemies unless it's good for business.
I don't think I have any UA-cam enemies...at least not for my part. In the Blues is a good channel. he does a good job, especially for someone in Australia. It would be hard to find good gear down there to talk about, I'd imagine.
We don't need to find it as we build it already it's just you don't know about it We don't live in trees and hunt kangaroos daily and you would be surprised at some of the gear we make and have made in the past
I was told by a old school luthier that the binding rot (Gretsch ittus ) according to collectors is a direct link to the Beatles! After the Sullivan performance , Gretsch was overwhelmed with orders for the " George" guitar. Therefore the suppliers of the binding quicky ran out of material and they scrambled to find enough to meet demand and quality suffered as a result! So it's a badge of honor , a direct result on a guitar manufacturer caused by the Beatles them selves! And collectors love a good story!
Had a1957 Les Paul jr up till 2005 then the tuner buttons finally fell apart not bad for cellulose lasting that long 48yrs ..replacing tuners didnt cut the value. Replace the binding unless your poor. ;)
you watched the video right? were you part of the sales transaction that occurred between the guitologist and the buyer? if you weren't leave your opinions were shit is normally stored
In the cracks, you scrape them out, take an old piece of yellowed binding, sand it down, then mix it with the glue, then put the sanding dust in the crack to hide it. With binding that bad, I would rebind it. You can make it vintage by using yellow food coloring and tea water to stain the new binding. Then clear it with satin clear.
if the buyer was willing to wait and pay to have a guitar completely rebound im sure it would've been done.the advice and opinions idiots seem to interject makes it appear like they are somehow affected by this?my suggestion is to watch the videos if you like them and if you dont like them find something else to do that doesn't annoy others like myself and the rest of the people here who do like the videos and watch them purposely
While I appreciate your admission about your picking style, I'd like to hear some Gibson guitars on your amp demos. While I like the Tele, it has a focused sound. Hearing other guitars on your amp mods would be great. I've followed you for months but I've never heard this guitar on amp demos
Acetone is a CA glue solvent. Very handy for fully cleaning off excess CA. That binding is in very bad shape an ideally should be removed and replaced.
johnnypk1963 And it’s an active solvent for the binding and the lacquer. Melt binding shavings into a paste to fill in voids but yeah, at a certain point just replace it. Always a chess match of decisions with vintage instruments and no matter how careful you try to be it’s possible someone will disagree with the approach. Dig the videos every time.
Good points on both counts. Given enough time and the prospect of maximizing returns above what was already possible I would have ordered new binding strips and replaced. But the way this deal went down, it wasn't really in the cards. I was already taking a loss on the guitar and I didn't discover the loose binding until the guitar had already sold.
if the buyer was willing to wait and pay to have a guitar completely rebound im sure it would've been done.the advice and opinions idiots seem to interject makes it appear like they are somehow affected by this?my suggestion is to watch the videos if you like them and if you dont like them find something else to do that doesn't annoy others like myself and the rest of the people here who do like the videos and watch them purposely
Here's a short dissertation on what you don't know about binding rot, regarding it's cause, what's actually happening within the binding material itself and how to fix it. Oh, and BTW, this condition in Gretsch guitars is predominately seen in their guitars of the mid to end of the '60's. It's rare in the '50's or from '71 onward, when Gretsch, then owned by Baldwin, changed some of the features, and obviously the glue used at the time. I'll just hit the important parts to educate the viewers. Binding rot is NOT caused by the off-gassing of the binding material but by the off-gassing of the adhesive!! Once started, which is at the rear surface of the binding where it contacts the adhesive, it's an unstoppable and irreversible chemical breakdown of the plastic binding and a process of destruction of the binding from the inside out. Being kept in its case for long periods exacerbates the 'rotting' process by speeding it up. The only 'cure' for the poor guitar beset with this fatal condition is complete replacement of the binding with specific attention paid to scraping away ALL traces of the old adhesive prior to applying a modern adhesive and then the new binding. There is no glue or any other coating that can be applied to stop the rot once it's began. By the time you see the dark cracks appearing in the binding, the rot is very much well underway. How fast it will progress cannot be determined as it's on an individual guitar basis. Consider binding rot as a guitar's version of contracting cancer. Extreme versions of binding rot will actually have the binding being very deeply discolored and so brittle it falls off in chunks! At this point and actually prior to getting to that extreme stage, the off-gassing will discolor the finish. Next I'll tell you folks about the vertical splits in the binding on the neck of this era Gretsches.
Strings are I guess a given, yes? Wow never seen one that bad except a 39 Gibson box I have where the tuners are so bad that one completely crumbled while trying to change strings. So I stopped.
if the buyer was willing to wait and pay to have a guitar completely rebound im sure it would've been done.the advice and opinions idiots seem to interject makes it appear like they are somehow affected by this?my suggestion is to watch the videos if you like them and if you dont like them find something else to do that doesn't annoy others like myself and the rest of the people here who do like the videos and watch them purposely
Gretsch used the wrong fret installation process from some period in the late '50's or early '60's into the '70's till the company folded. I know as I have guitars from that era and have had the issue repaired properly. The binding should be installed as the first step, NOT the second. First step is to have the fret's tang cut off at the very ends so that when tapped into the slot in the fretboard, the top part of the fret extends past the edge of the wooden fingerboard and none of the remaining in the wood part of the tang extends into the space where the binding will occupy This allows the bindings top surface to become part of the fingerboard, which allows the string slots in the nut to be cut further apart for the convenience of many of us fingerstyle players who enjoy wider neck/string spaced guitars and also to more easily 'grab' the low E string with their thumb. What Gretsch did was to NOT cut the tang at all and installed the frets, tang intact, protruding slightly past the edge of the wooden fingerboard into the area to be occupied by the binding. They chamfered the ends of the frets at a shallow angle, forcing the stings' slots to be cut closer together so you wouldn't push the two E strings off the fingerboard when playing. Along with the adhesive, they hammered the binding into place impaling it forcefully onto the sharp end of the tang and fret top. This was easily done at the time because the plastic binding was very pliable and could absorb the punishment of this process, however as it aged and lost its pliability and began to shrink, those cuts created on the backside of the binding by the knife-like end of the tang, worked their way to the surface until they split completely. On my '72 Super Chet this split was evident on the binding at all frets! This splitting also creates a small bump you can feel when playing and moving your hand along the neck. My luthier - did Randy Bachman's work for him! - replaced all the frets properly and then gently tapped the binding at all the fret ends. While the splits are still there, they are now closed up as they took up the space previously occupied by the tang and fret ends. Not perfect but barely noticeable now, save for a few spots where the shrinkage over time can't be restored. This is how you fix neck splits if it isn't broken free yet. If you've done the re-fret as I described and there's some areas of the binding that are loose, then by all means remove those pieces and glue them back in place, however IMO, it's an utter waste of time if the binding rot is remotely visible. My SC had no rot, so the operation was a total success. If you viewers would like any and all information on Gretsch guitars, from identification to evaluation go to the Gretsch Discussion Pages. Free to view and no cost to join which is required to be able to post. Among our active members is Ed Ball (with two books) the world's foremost authority on vintage Gretsch guitars and a well renowned luthier with vast experience with Gretsch guitars. Drop by the website for informed advice! :-)
For those of you who might be wondering what all the fuss about these vintage Gretsches is about, this might give you a bit of inkling. Different model, but the action and sound are the same. The thinner the top, the better it will sound. ua-cam.com/video/ds0gmPcUIF8/v-deo.html
I dunno Brad...I think I would of stripped and replaced the neck binding. I mean if the buyer was cool with that, some folks would rather have it original I guess.
if the buyer was willing to wait and pay to have a guitar completely rebound im sure it would've been done.the advice and opinions idiots seem to interject makes it appear like they are somehow affected by this?my suggestion is to watch the videos if you like them and if you dont like them find something else to do that doesn't annoy others like myself and the rest of the people here who do like the videos and watch them purposely
And this is why I build my own guitars folks: way better quality, way lower costs. Only thing that's missing is the brand name, but the question is: why would you want a brand name on your guitar if they put out trash like this?
It is your call as you are the repair man on the spot. I believe the decay continues but may be slowed. If it has a slight vinegar smell generally speaking it is a continuous process which will get worse. Maybe super glue is a quick fix that will hopefully extend binding life. I once had a 1940s Epiphone guitar that the pick guard had melted and ruined the guitar finish underneath. So it's not limited to binding. Enjoy videos . Keep it up
Come on Brad. There are many CA products out there that would be far better than that crap. You should try a thin CA glue so it wicks into the areas between to surfaces. These other products also come on bottles that have the ability to install a very fine applicator so you dont get glue all over the neck like the shit you are using.
if the buyer was willing to wait and pay to have a guitar completely rebound im sure it would've been done.the advice and opinions idiots seem to interject makes it appear like they are somehow affected by this?my suggestion is to watch the videos if you like them and if you dont like them find something else to do that doesn't annoy others like myself and the rest of the people here who do like the videos and watch them purposely
Man, don't do this on a tablet. 3 tries just to put the cursor in the box. WTF? Its not your fault that Gretsch binding sucks. I just hope you mentioned that in your Reverb ad. If you did? The the repairs were on the buyer. Not you. Its cool to want to make stuff right, but you didn't have to. By the way, I LOVE me some Gretsch. Nobody else cops that tone.
if the buyer was willing to wait and pay to have a guitar completely rebound im sure it would've been done.the advice and opinions idiots seem to interject makes it appear like they are somehow affected by this?my suggestion is to watch the videos if you like them and if you dont like them find something else to do that doesn't annoy others like myself and the rest of the people here who do like the videos and watch them purposely
LOL...Hey..if y'all motherfuckers had bought a "real" guitar in the first place, like a Rickenbacker or a Gibson or Fender from that era, you would be having problems like that with a Gretsch....LOL
PART 2 on CHANNEL 2: ua-cam.com/video/U0HjIkGsHEA/v-deo.html
An elderly man who used to work in a plastics factory in the U.S. which produced celluloid explained that some companies cut corners to save on the cost of materials. He said that pure distilled water was necessary for producing celluloid. He also said that pure anhydrous alcohol was needed as well. Some companies used tap water and the cheapest denatured alcohol they could find to manufacture celluloid. Celluloid was made up in large blocks approximately 27" by 54" and varying thicknesses. When cured, the block went to a specialty machine which sliced off sheets of varying thicknesses. Because the base material itself is essentially clear, celluloid could be made up in a huge variety of colors and more importantly, patterns. It could imitate elephant ivory, tortoise shell, different pearlescent colors, etc... I have personally handled and worked on thousands of vintage instruments with celluloid parts, such as the binding and purfling, rosettes, pickguards and many other celluloid parts and there is a commonality with some brands. Gretsch had a factory in Brooklyn and they sourced materials as close to their factory as possible. There was a local plastics supplier that they used as a supplier. John D'Angelico used this same supplier and both Gretsch guitars and D'Angelico guitars suffer from binding rot. The factory standard glue/adhesive for celluloid used to be made mainly from clear celluloid dissolved in acetone, ethyl acetate and a few other chemicals to create more open time. This glue actually melted the celluloid and it "melded" the celluloid to the wood. Due to factories needing to keep production flow moving, there was little time for the solvents in the glue to gas off. After nitrocellulose lacquer became the predominant finish for guitars, things changed in that the solvents in the lacquer leached into the celluloid causing it to swell somewhat. Over time, the celluloid would shrink back and all was well. Due to factories using varnish for finishes prior to nitrocellulose lacquer being introduced, there was no real issue with regard to the celluloid being affected. I have seen many instruments over 100 years old with the celluloid parts fully intact. What I used to believe was shrinkage in the celluloid binding of these older instruments may actually be from heavy scraping in the factory when the instruments were made. The celluloid pickguards used to be attached directly to the bare wood of the guitar tops using a solvent that melted the underside of the pickguard. This was very common among factories which would then apply the finish over the top, pickguard and all. With the pickguards that had been finished over with nitrocellulose lacquer, the solvents used to attach the pickguard were still trapped inside the pickguard and with the added solvents from the lacquer, the pickguard swelled a bit. Over the years, the solvents would slowly escape and the pickguard would start to shrink. The Martin guitar company decided around 1966 to stop using celluloid pickguards and they switched to cellulose acetate which was a more stable material than celluloid. Cellulose acetate was used for many purposes but was best known in the eyeglass industry where it was used for frames and, due to the thicker sizes used in making the frames, was stable. What Martin did not know and, surprisingly didn't research, was that in a .020" thickness, cellulose acetate was much less stable than celluloid. They could actually cup the guitar top in the pickguard area and produce cracks in the top. For many years I removed and replaced these cellulose acetate pickguards due to them literally becoming something resembling a black potato chip. Martin had to cover these pickguard replacements and occasional cracks caused by the shrinking guards under warranty. I can't begin to imagine what they had to pay out over the years for this lack of experimentation. I have never seen binding rot on a Martin guitar, but I have seen extreme shrinkage with Martin Boltaron binding.
Thanks for the insightful reply. Trying to put together artificial materials with wood and have them play nice over the years is somewhat of an iffy factor it seems. Looking to buy a new acoustic at the moment but not so confident about buying a new Martin since their modern shrinking bindings problem since 2012 and luthiers refusing loose binding jobs because they are so tired of doing them. Maple bindings make so much more sense in an acoustic guitar (when you don't expect to bump it into stuff).
Cool, you're showing a zillion players how to get super glue all over the place. I can always use the work. Thank you.
How would you fix it? I have just been gifted a 1940 Gretsch “Synchromatic” with binding coming off, shrunk in spots. Great shape overall. Sunburst. I can post a picture? I am a violin 🎻 luthier mainly :-)
Hot Tip > Glue Masters Pro CA glue, and Bob Smith Industries Accelerator for the No Fog No White Clear results. I've used this for years its as good as the Satellite City CA glue I used at my guitar shop back in the 90's.
Yeah I need to order some good stuff for sure. The cheap stuff is ok for some applications, but it's a pain in others.
Thanks for this tip.. its time for me to buy fresh CA glue and accelerator.
Brad, at 6:00 min wouldn't you replace the binding? I can't imagine buying a guitar that has that kind of 'hack-job' done to it.
I described it accurately and sold it at a loss. I'm not replacing the binding. If the new guys wants to do that, he can. In the meantime, it's perfectly playable.
Really!:-)
if the buyer was willing to wait and pay to have a guitar completely rebound im sure it would've been done.the advice and opinions idiots seem to interject makes it appear like they are somehow affected by this?my suggestion is to watch the videos if you like them and if you dont like them find something else to do that doesn't annoy others like myself and the rest of the people here who do like the videos and watch them purposely
In my flock, I have three Gretschs....I play mine a ton, along with my others, and push them to feedback everytime. These can be absolute beasts. Its a lot of fun to get these totally growling.
So how would you prevent it? Is binding rot likely to occur with modern Gretsch guitars from the 90's - Present?
Keep it out of its case as much as possible and keep away from any rubber or other chemicals. They will ALL eventually crack.
I don't know why, but Gretsch used celluloid binding. One of my customers had to have his guitar re-bound after just 7 yrs. Gretsch re-bound it with the same celluloid binding. I replaced the binding for the last time with nylon binding used by the rest of the industry.
fuck yea!
authentic celluloid is a “temporary material”.. not stable. Poor choice.
LOL...Hey..if y'all motherfuckers had bought a "real" guitar in the first place, like a Rickenbacker or a Gibson or Fender from that era, you would be having problems like that with a Gretsch....LOL
Can an Acetone do that instead of Super Glue?
Is it possible to just replace the binding along the neck completely ? Sorry I am not a guitarist.......
I'd replace it. Once it turns into chalk there's no use in tacking it back on.
The treble side was borderline. The guitar had already sold though and waiting for new binding to get shipped to me wasn't in the cards. It came out nicely in the end. Well, passable anyway. You'll see in Pt.2.
Aurthor Thing's next project we eagerly await with anticipation
Aurthor Thing MEOWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW
It was cringe worthy watching that shit binding being glued back on. I don't understand how anyone would want that guitar.
Nic Thomas my next project is changing out wheelchair batteries and installing a ramp in a van.
I don't have time to make movies.
Is super glue really the right choice for repairing the binding? If, down the road, any new owner would want to replace the binding, that super glue would be extremely hard to remove without causing additional damage to the fingerboard and neck, don't you think?
I rebound one of these about a year ago. Did the whole fretboard with nibs. It was a job but turned out nice.
Yeah I'm with you Guitar Man. I purchased one of these not too long ago thinking that I was going to get a killer deal. It had really bad rotting in The Binding or at least what I thought was really bad binding. The guitar repair man told me that this was the best one he had ever seen. so when everything was said and done it would have been about six to seven hundred dollars to redo the binding. Which really made the guitar almost not doing. So like you I sold her for the same price I paid. I wonder how many times that has happened. Good video probably the best one online in regards to this issue with the grech's.
Where did Gretsch source its binding? I rarely see this on Gibsons.
My bowels are currently suffering from binding problems. They are from the 60's too..
That makes two of us, and I'm only a late 70s model.
Could the nut repair trick of baking soda and super glue be use to spread over the outside of the binding, to hide the majority of those cracks?
Nitrocellulose decomposition (normal with age) gives nitric acid fumes. If the guitar stays in a case, the decomposition process is accelerated due to nitric acid attacking the binding in a deadly feedback loop. Keep it outside, and the rot will nearly stop.
The rot will never stop until the binding is completly gone. Most of the time it also burns the finish, the wood, the glue joints of the top and back ot the sides, the metal platings,the pickup windings and the interior of the case. Gluing the rotted binding is not even a bandaid fix. The only permanet fix is complete removal ad replacement of the binding....every trace of it. This was faulty binding to begin with, degrading so slowly as to not be detected by the manufacturer of the guitar or the binding material until years later.
Some guitars have binding which comes from several batches...you will see necks and headstocks with good binding and the body on the same guitar has degraded into a toxic peanut brittle, being from a different batch
Also, the rotted binding is quite toxic, and you should avoid exposure to it. I have a big pickle jar full of rotted celluloid that i use to relic metal parts with to match replacements to the vintage guitar.
My advice is DONT BUY BINDING ROTTED GRETSCHES. Non-rotting guitars are out there, but somewhat rare.
If you see ANY ROT, stay away! Even "just a couple spots" means bad binding, and it WILL get much worse.
Is it bad for your health to let it fume in your room?
My friend's step dad used to play with Chet Atkins, he would talk about it all the time, he had an old KUSTOM dual 15" pleated leather bass cabinet and he claimed to own the very first fender P-Bass prototype in existence. He showed me once or twice and told stories of fender going through great lengths to buy it back from him, at one point even offering him $125k for the bass guitar. I don't know how true the story is but I always got a kick out of it. He passed away a few years ago.
What became of the bass?
I love the color & patina on that guitar.. the way the orange has mellowed looks awesome to my eye
Hi Brad.Love your videos and though I've never commented I do look forward to them.I'm watching from Scotland.Massive Who/Townshend fan here.This is the model he used(1959)on Who's next,Quadrophenia etc paired with a 1959 Fender Bandmaster!Keep up the good work!
Cool...
I just rebound a '65 Duo Jet, body and neck. Actually found it in a pawn shop. Everything else was working. Did a re-fret, new nut, replaced the volume pot, gave the entire thing a thorough scrub down, new strings and set up. Actually think i'm going to keep this one.
Got it for an insane steal...!
Binding rot can create some deals for people willing to do the work.
This is more a case of the pawn shop owner not quite aware of what the guitar actually was. To prove he wasn't out of line on the price tag, given the binding and dirt issues, he showed me an online pic of the latest model electromatic double jet with price. Needless to say, I gave the guy close to asking and bolted before he changed his mind.
Truly enjoy the vids, Brad.. Thanks for doing them.
Ignorant pawn shops are always a bonus. I've had my share. Believe me, they'd take advantage of you if they could, so they're fair game as far as I'm concerned.
20ish watt tube amp.
Which one do you prefer?
Crate club? Peavey classic? Or blues junior? Thanks and keep videos coming. .
You know, all 3 of those are good sounding amps. The Crate Club Series are probably the most surprising. I've done recording with the tweed Peavey Classic 50 410. The reverb IC kept blowing on it and I never could figure out why at the time, but other than that, the tone was outstanding. Actually, the music clip at the end of all my videos of late features that amp heavily.
The Guitologist Thank you.
Was the background music yours? I enjoyed the first piece especially. The percussive qualities of the piano and the guitar together added an interesting contrast to the almost plaintive singing.
Yes, both songs were originals. The first one was Electric Tooth Syndrome "Nervous Breakdown". It's available for free download on Reverbnation.
Thank you.
Gotta love the iron maiden in the backround nice repair brad and thanks for sharing your knowledge.
i did not know that was iron maiden whats the name of it , thought it sounded famiure
It's worth restoring the original binding. I have a couple of vintage gretsches, I have done binding work on. The key is leaving them out of their cases once you discover the problem. Sometimes it doesn't matter and the bad patch will flake off anyway, but for the most part the rot doesn't advance because the gas is not confined in the case. You can also use acrylic cement on the bindings. That wide section of binding by the cutaway should be replaced ASAP it's always the first to go.
My 66 Guild has so far not suffered any binding rot. A few spots in the cutaway came loose about 40 years ago but never spread. Shame these beautiful Gretch develop the decay... Good fix up Brad, short of a full overhaul and refinish, you done good👍.
Glad yours has escaped so far. Keep out of the case.
The only Guild I ever saw with binding rot were some of the earliest New York Guilds. None of my Guilds from the sixties suffer from binding rot, just some shrinkage. Binding rot is a Gretsch problem, not a Guild problem.
I re-did a 68 Rally that had this issue. It is worse if they are left in the case. Once that crap kicks off, it will corrode every piece of metal nearby. Getting that fretboard off and rebinding it isn't super easy, but it isn't super hard either. Plus its a good time to re-fret it and recondition the fretboard. The body binding on mine was a real major pain...
I had a Rally too at one time. You shouldn't need to remove the whole fretboard to replace binding.
I totally agree. You could do it with the fretboard on, but for me it was easier just to get it off and have it all exposed. It wasn't as big of a deal as I expected, but not real easy by any means.
Not to be a weiner, but doesn't it make more sense to do the fix-up on items BEFORE selling them on Reverb to maximize their market value? That's what I do with all of the amps I sell. Makes for better pictures too.
Your a hotdog!!!
I would just to avoid any "item not as described" issues and pissing people off in general. That way, if you change part of the item or worse, mess up during a repair, they already know what they're getting. You can probably get around some this by wording things correctly in the description, but as mentioned, post-repair photos are usually a good idea.
It is a nightmare selling - period, descriptions, engineered photographs and I've lost count of expensive items that were poorly packaged
Nic Thomas MEOW!!!....
Yes. This guitar went up on sale before my move when I was trying to downsize some stuff. The binding must have worsened in the interim. I pulled out of the case to inspect before shipping and found the loose binding pieces. The bits of rot were in the description already, but I contacted buyer and told him I'd need a couple days to fix the loose binding before shipping. I was already prepped to take a loss on this one. Not an ideal situation, for sure.
I hope we get to see it after it's all cleaned up and has new strings on it!
I’m a slide rule collector and that “rot” looks a lot like the old K&E (Keuffel & Esser) slide rule cursor rot called
KERCS (K&E Rotting Cursor Syndrome). It occurred on almost all K&E slide rules made for about a decade following WW II.
Maybe Gretsch got sucked into buying from K&E vendor’s surplus.
Brad, Isn't the plastic binding originally attached using acetone to "melt" the binding onto the wood? Wouldn't the really thin "Super Glue" be worth running to the local hardware store? I think that it would seep into all of the cracks & reduce the time you had to spend with the gel glue. I _think_ that I saw a video where the Luthier melted some extra binding (the same color as the guitar needing repair) in some acetone to create a paste of the binding material to fill in cracks or chips that wouldn't otherwise "close up." One last idea: An Xacto knife with a #11 blade might help to get the glue down into cracks better than the little screwdriver.
They sound OK ? Ever listen to Chet Atkins !
Or The Beatles. I know, I know. Just never jibed with them.
Never played with Bert Weedon but he taught me how play guitar - go figure ;-)
Nic Thomas Bert was a great guitar player, Hey could've made this old Gretsch Rock'
I bet, watched many of his video's he was also cited as an influence by many stars, including Eric Clapton, Brian May, Paul McCartney, George Harrison, John Lennon, Pete Townshend, Keith Richards, Sting, Hank Marvin, Robert Smith, Mike Oldfield, Mark Knopfler and Jimmy Page
Brian Setzer Wales the 59 Gretch’s
!!’
I'm amazed from the fret job, they're all insde beyond the binding, also the binding seems to match the frets.(?)
Yes. They have the nubs like Gibsons.
Love the music Brad. Was the first song an original?
Thanks. Both were.
It's amazing what the chemical change did to the E string. Never saw anything like that.
Gluing the binding - to the neck - with super glue? Yikes.
really loving the close camera work
Thanks. Experimenting with what's possible.
I can't imagine what that would cost for new binding. You would need it color matched and ground to hide the fret end.
Could this binding rot be a reaction to hand oils after many years? It appears to have occurred in specific areas...the binding on the body is on the top where it could be in contact with someones arm or shirtless gut.
...spoke to soon, just re-watched the video and you said this.
no
Ironically I am rebinding an early70s les paul, the binding is in a similar rotten cracked shrunken state. Not my favourite job, scraping new binding, however , rebinding can be a real seller.
I find ,once you start prying and gluing, it never stops. Quicker to strip and rebind.
Brad : Does the rot just happen on the older Gretsch gutairs? I bought a 2015 Gretsch Club jet a couple weeks ago. Wanting to know it has me freaked out.
thats what he said "google gretch modern binding material"
Enjoyed the video ,I have a newer version of that Model with real F holes,why on earth did they go to painted on f holes ?! Cost cutting ? I really like the "branded " one the most,maybe someday . Thanks Brad ! :-)
It's a hollowbody but Atkins wanted no F-holes on his signature model to cut down on feedback. The painted on F-holes are just aesthetic.
I knew it was a hollowbody I've just never heard or read about him not wanting them.
Hey Brad could you post a link to your reverb store, cheers.
There's nothing much in it right now. But it's under "The Guitologist".
Brad you have the patience of a saint!Coodos to you ,I would have sold it as is and let the new owner to redo the binding and a fret job to boot,nice guitar I think that binding is highly flammable as well,that's why theres no such thing as relic binding,Cheers you the Man.
Could this be the same Gretsch Country Gentleman that one of my bandmates owned during our garage band days in Louisville during the 60s? Wow, that would be wild!
I think that medium cyno glue is better than the runny type. at least you can control it.
It is easier to control, yes. But I needed it to wick in more than it wanted to. You can see me using that tiny screwdriver to push it down in the gaps. Wouldn't be necessary with thinner stuff.
i think using some glue that actually melts the binding and fuses it together is a more permanent fix. I used to use acetone based poly cement glue on jolanas that had the binding from some kind of nitro plastic.
I must say I'm a little surprized that Gretcsh doesn't turn yourr crank. I have a 5236 and I like that it's bright and chimy like my Strat but not thin and shallow. I use my Gretsch interchangeably with a Godin LG PAF. The Godin is a bit darker and fatter but either guitar is great
This is always a tough repair. Here's a tip: cut up an aluminum beer can and use scissors to cut little strips of aluminum 1" long and 1/8" wide. Use these strips as little spatulas to work the glue deep into very narrow cracks. That way there's no need to pry up the binding and risk snapping it or loosening it further. One aluminum can will have you in spatulas for years. The nitric acid vapor from the breakdown of the celluloid plastic also corrodes plating on all the metal parts. Keeping these old guitars in their cases actually speeds up their deterioration because the case contains and concentrates the fumes. And even the hide glue holding the wood together starts letting go after 40+ years. All real Gretsches slowly disassemble themselves. Cheers!
If you seal it with something clear will it still continue to rot?
Not sure on this one as I don't fix guitars. But given the age of the Gretsch, would it be better to have the binding redone professionally instead of super glue. I think using super glue it would permanently stuff the guitar.
if the buyer was willing to wait and pay to have a guitar completely rebound im sure it would've been done.the advice and opinions idiots seem to interject makes it appear like they are somehow affected by this?my suggestion is to watch the videos if you like them and if you dont like them find something else to do that doesn't annoy others like myself and the rest of the people here who do like the videos and watch them purposely
Holy cow those strings look like rusty rebar lol
Lol. My sentiments exactly!
I am not a fan of the US made current or older models. Id always picked up Gretsch guitars and within a few minutes put them down. I also am not a fan of the Electromatic models past ones at least. But i tried out one of their cheap Streamliner series guitars and i was blown away. It had a feel like a modern guitar, and id always wanted a modern feel and playing Gretsch. I ended up buying it and it blows my mind. I had also recently gotten a AIO Wolf Rickenbacker copy and the same can be said of that, it imho outplays expensive Ricks because it has a different feel to the neck and just the way it plays in general. If i had not tried this Gretsch out or this AIO W300, i would not own a Rick or Gretsch sounding guitar. Recently ive been recording a lot and these guitars are the bomb. Sometimes the way it was done in the past isnt the best way, thats how i feel with Gretsch and Ricks. Glad i gave these guitars a try because id always wanted that sound and now ive got it.
Wow that low E string !!! lol. You sure thats not an original string from the factory ? ehehe
How much would it cost roughly to have the binding redone on this guitar ? Curious.
Nice one, thanks for sharing brother!
Get the Stewmac super glue tips that make it into a syringe needle like applicator.
I divorced my first wife because of Binding Rot
There's just no satisfying ~ divorce can be equally messy with folks fretting, did you try Gel and the proper tools?
Lol!
HAHA! An "In the Blues" ad played before your video and while I was watching it, I thought it was clip you put on the front of your video and you were either spoofing them or some other kind of flame-war scenario... I'm pleasantly surprised it wasn't. I don't want you having any UA-cam enemies unless it's good for business.
I don't think I have any UA-cam enemies...at least not for my part. In the Blues is a good channel. he does a good job, especially for someone in Australia. It would be hard to find good gear down there to talk about, I'd imagine.
We don't need to find it as we build it already it's just you don't know about it We don't live in trees and hunt kangaroos daily and you would be surprised at some of the gear we make and have made in the past
watch the videos ,fuck the drama
Epoxy?
I was told by a old school luthier that the binding rot (Gretsch ittus ) according to collectors is a direct link to the Beatles! After the Sullivan performance , Gretsch was overwhelmed with orders for the
" George" guitar. Therefore the suppliers of the binding quicky ran out of material and they scrambled to find enough to meet demand and quality suffered as a result! So it's a badge of honor , a direct result on a guitar manufacturer caused by the Beatles them selves! And collectors love a good story!
Had a1957 Les Paul jr up till 2005 then the tuner buttons finally fell apart not bad for cellulose lasting that long 48yrs ..replacing tuners didnt cut the value. Replace the binding unless your poor. ;)
you watched the video right? were you part of the sales transaction that occurred between the guitologist and the buyer? if you weren't leave your opinions were shit is normally stored
In the cracks, you scrape them out, take an old piece of yellowed binding, sand it down, then mix it with the glue, then put the sanding dust in the crack to hide it. With binding that bad, I would rebind it. You can make it vintage by using yellow food coloring and tea water to stain the new binding. Then clear it with satin clear.
if the buyer was willing to wait and pay to have a guitar completely rebound im sure it would've been done.the advice and opinions idiots seem to interject makes it appear like they are somehow affected by this?my suggestion is to watch the videos if you like them and if you dont like them find something else to do that doesn't annoy others like myself and the rest of the people here who do like the videos and watch them purposely
While I appreciate your admission about your picking style, I'd like to hear some Gibson guitars on your amp demos. While I like the Tele, it has a focused sound. Hearing other guitars on your amp mods would be great. I've followed you for months but I've never heard this guitar on amp demos
You go back, Jack, glue it again... ;-)
Acetone is a CA glue solvent. Very handy for fully cleaning off excess CA. That binding is in very bad shape an ideally should be removed and replaced.
johnnypk1963 And it’s an active solvent for the binding and the lacquer. Melt binding shavings into a paste to fill in voids but yeah, at a certain point just replace it. Always a chess match of decisions with vintage instruments and no matter how careful you try to be it’s possible someone will disagree with the approach. Dig the videos every time.
Good points on both counts. Given enough time and the prospect of maximizing returns above what was already possible I would have ordered new binding strips and replaced. But the way this deal went down, it wasn't really in the cards. I was already taking a loss on the guitar and I didn't discover the loose binding until the guitar had already sold.
if the buyer was willing to wait and pay to have a guitar completely rebound im sure it would've been done.the advice and opinions idiots seem to interject makes it appear like they are somehow affected by this?my suggestion is to watch the videos if you like them and if you dont like them find something else to do that doesn't annoy others like myself and the rest of the people here who do like the videos and watch them purposely
Here's a short dissertation on what you don't know about binding rot, regarding it's cause, what's actually happening within the binding material itself and how to fix it. Oh, and BTW, this condition in Gretsch guitars is predominately seen in their guitars of the mid to end of the '60's. It's rare in the '50's or from '71 onward, when Gretsch, then owned by Baldwin, changed some of the features, and obviously the glue used at the time. I'll just hit the important parts to educate the viewers. Binding rot is NOT caused by the off-gassing of the binding material but by the off-gassing of the adhesive!! Once started, which is at the rear surface of the binding where it contacts the adhesive, it's an unstoppable and irreversible chemical breakdown of the plastic binding and a process of destruction of the binding from the inside out. Being kept in its case for long periods exacerbates the 'rotting' process by speeding it up. The only 'cure' for the poor guitar beset with this fatal condition is complete replacement of the binding with specific attention paid to scraping away ALL traces of the old adhesive prior to applying a modern adhesive and then the new binding. There is no glue or any other coating that can be applied to stop the rot once it's began. By the time you see the dark cracks appearing in the binding, the rot is very much well underway. How fast it will progress cannot be determined as it's on an individual guitar basis. Consider binding rot as a guitar's version of contracting cancer. Extreme versions of binding rot will actually have the binding being very deeply discolored and so brittle it falls off in chunks! At this point and actually prior to getting to that extreme stage, the off-gassing will discolor the finish. Next I'll tell you folks about the vertical splits in the binding on the neck of this era Gretsches.
The Guitologist+ Don't forget the baking soda and crazy glue mix, that will fill in the spaced out binding.
Oh damn, that is one gorgeous guitar!
Hey, Brad! It seems like since the "Pussy Melter" I don't see the Native sons strap promo in the beggining. What gives?
That was just a coincidence. Happened to be the end of their ad run. Native Sons and I are still on great terms. Best woven straps on planet earth!
Looking forwars for a reupload thanks💜💜
Liked this video bro
thank you for such great advice, I'll never buy an old Gretsch now lol...
Strings are I guess a given, yes? Wow never seen one that bad except a 39 Gibson box I have where the tuners are so bad that one completely crumbled while trying to change strings. So I stopped.
I am never without tin set super glue. Me I would have replaced the biding and fixed the bad spot on the nut where its chipped.
if the buyer was willing to wait and pay to have a guitar completely rebound im sure it would've been done.the advice and opinions idiots seem to interject makes it appear like they are somehow affected by this?my suggestion is to watch the videos if you like them and if you dont like them find something else to do that doesn't annoy others like myself and the rest of the people here who do like the videos and watch them purposely
Gretsch used the wrong fret installation process from some period in the late '50's or early '60's into the '70's till the company folded. I know as I have guitars from that era and have had the issue repaired properly. The binding should be installed as the first step, NOT the second. First step is to have the fret's tang cut off at the very ends so that when tapped into the slot in the fretboard, the top part of the fret extends past the edge of the wooden fingerboard and none of the remaining in the wood part of the tang extends into the space where the binding will occupy This allows the bindings top surface to become part of the fingerboard, which allows the string slots in the nut to be cut further apart for the convenience of many of us fingerstyle players who enjoy wider neck/string spaced guitars and also to more easily 'grab' the low E string with their thumb. What Gretsch did was to NOT cut the tang at all and installed the frets, tang intact, protruding slightly past the edge of the wooden fingerboard into the area to be occupied by the binding. They chamfered the ends of the frets at a shallow angle, forcing the stings' slots to be cut closer together so you wouldn't push the two E strings off the fingerboard when playing. Along with the adhesive, they hammered the binding into place impaling it forcefully onto the sharp end of the tang and fret top. This was easily done at the time because the plastic binding was very pliable and could absorb the punishment of this process, however as it aged and lost its pliability and began to shrink, those cuts created on the backside of the binding by the knife-like end of the tang, worked their way to the surface until they split completely. On my '72 Super Chet this split was evident on the binding at all frets! This splitting also creates a small bump you can feel when playing and moving your hand along the neck. My luthier - did Randy Bachman's work for him! - replaced all the frets properly and then gently tapped the binding at all the fret ends. While the splits are still there, they are now closed up as they took up the space previously occupied by the tang and fret ends. Not perfect but barely noticeable now, save for a few spots where the shrinkage over time can't be restored. This is how you fix neck splits if it isn't broken free yet. If you've done the re-fret as I described and there's some areas of the binding that are loose, then by all means remove those pieces and glue them back in place, however IMO, it's an utter waste of time if the binding rot is remotely visible. My SC had no rot, so the operation was a total success. If you viewers would like any and all information on Gretsch guitars, from identification to evaluation go to the Gretsch Discussion Pages. Free to view and no cost to join which is required to be able to post. Among our active members is Ed Ball (with two books) the world's foremost authority on vintage Gretsch guitars and a well renowned luthier with vast experience with Gretsch guitars. Drop by the website for informed advice! :-)
For those of you who might be wondering what all the fuss about these vintage Gretsches is about, this might give you a bit of inkling. Different model, but the action and sound are the same. The thinner the top, the better it will sound. ua-cam.com/video/ds0gmPcUIF8/v-deo.html
I read somewhere that it was a bad batch of plastic from Germany . . . which is not surprising to anyone who has ever owned a German car. =)
I dunno Brad...I think I would of stripped and replaced the neck binding. I mean if the buyer was cool with that, some folks would rather have it original I guess.
if the buyer was willing to wait and pay to have a guitar completely rebound im sure it would've been done.the advice and opinions idiots seem to interject makes it appear like they are somehow affected by this?my suggestion is to watch the videos if you like them and if you dont like them find something else to do that doesn't annoy others like myself and the rest of the people here who do like the videos and watch them purposely
Also, unlike wood glue adding more of this stuff does not make it stronger.
The funk growing on that low E string could probably cure herpes.
Or genital worts, at least.
To be sure , there is ' binding rot ' ?
One of those jobs that is soul destroying, easy for those who have never attempted this before to say replace
I think its simpler than that ~ whatever Brad does, there will be someone who knows better afterall it was his decision so I respect this
I hate binding ..it will always go bad. I avoid it like the plague.
When I saw 'binding rot' I thought it was going to be about politics...LOL!
binding a guitar with tofu was never a good idea - even if it had been fried in soy sauce
Roman numerals on the side😂
WE ALL KNOW MODDING A GUITAR WILL DIMINISH IT'S PRICE. BUT WILL A BINDING REPLACEMENT ,
JUST ON THE NECK, DO THE SAME ????
And this is why I build my own guitars folks: way better quality, way lower costs. Only thing that's missing is the brand name, but the question is: why would you want a brand name on your guitar if they put out trash like this?
the guitar is 50-60 years old you fucking moron
Seems like it might be a job for super glue and baking soda. Some cool tunes in this.
John Strange * super glue and baking soda did not work for me. Had it worked for you ?
looks like off gassing from the binding
finger picking and Gretsch's....what?
My thinking is replacement not repair. vapors from decay are corrosive to metal and will become only worse with time.
They are corrosive if left in the case, mainly. Would you replace the body binding?
It is your call as you are the repair man on the spot. I believe the decay continues but may be slowed. If it has a slight vinegar smell generally speaking it is a continuous process which will get worse. Maybe super glue is a quick fix that will hopefully extend binding life. I once had a 1940s Epiphone guitar that the pick guard had melted and ruined the guitar finish underneath. So it's not limited to binding. Enjoy videos . Keep it up
Play that funky music white boy!
Not interested in this one The Beatles used Gretsch guitars in the Abbey Road Studios
Come on Brad. There are many CA products out there that would be far better than that crap. You should try a thin CA glue so it wicks into the areas between to surfaces. These other products also come on bottles that have the ability to install a very fine applicator so you dont get glue all over the neck like the shit you are using.
Yep my binding is rotting my wife wont take it off. ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,I am not even married.
Come on, thats pathetic. You must hold the piece in place until the glue sets. The damned binding is poping right back off the neck.
This type of super glue has a longer cure time,hence the reason for the tape so he don't need to hold it in place for an hour before it fully cures.
If you're such an expert,,make some content and put it up on you're channel.
if the buyer was willing to wait and pay to have a guitar completely rebound im sure it would've been done.the advice and opinions idiots seem to interject makes it appear like they are somehow affected by this?my suggestion is to watch the videos if you like them and if you dont like them find something else to do that doesn't annoy others like myself and the rest of the people here who do like the videos and watch them purposely
Man, don't do this on a tablet. 3 tries just to put the cursor in the box. WTF?
Its not your fault that Gretsch binding sucks. I just hope you mentioned that in your Reverb ad.
If you did? The the repairs were on the buyer. Not you.
Its cool to want to make stuff right, but you didn't have to.
By the way, I LOVE me some Gretsch.
Nobody else cops that tone.
if the buyer was willing to wait and pay to have a guitar completely rebound im sure it would've been done.the advice and opinions idiots seem to interject makes it appear like they are somehow affected by this?my suggestion is to watch the videos if you like them and if you dont like them find something else to do that doesn't annoy others like myself and the rest of the people here who do like the videos and watch them purposely
LOL...Hey..if y'all motherfuckers had bought a "real" guitar in the first place, like a Rickenbacker or a Gibson or Fender from that era, you would be having problems like that with a Gretsch....LOL