To be fair he has a hard time commentating and playing a game that requires focus a lot of attention. I feel like it shouldn't be that bad unless it really bugs me (so far not a single mistake he's made in previous videos that I know of had me super annoyed.)
I have three ideas for buffing Mafia a little bit (how unbalanced it would be, I'm not sure but could be worth a try): Framer, can choose to reverse-frame themselves on any night by selecting themselves (would show up as ns to sheriff or as something else to invest). Disguiser, can become revivable by ret so that it's a true disguise. Blackmailer, when blackmailing someone, also stops their voting power which could lead to an interesting late-game play (almost like an anti-mayor for town). That would also make you want to hide even more early game from the spy.
Building upon the Framer idea: Framer is largely considered the worst Mafia role, so why not give them total immunity to Sheriff? They still get the ability to change for Invest, but Sheriffs can't find them sus ever. It would make Framer substantially more powerful. The only TI that would be able to catch a Framer in action is Spy, unless reverse-framing shows up to Spy as "Mafia Visited". *That* would be overpowered.
I think people forget that mafia have the ability to cooperate at night. If mafia plays right they can actually make some good plays. Mafia is often let down by one or two bad individuals who dont know what they're doing or dont cooperate with other mafia.
Personally, I think evils would have a more reliable way of winning if they had more static roles that are guaranteed to show up. For one, I really dislike that Witch is in the same role category as Jester and Executioner which are both evil roles that can consciously side with town for a free lynch. Witch can be a powerful ally to NK and Mafia but the odds of having one are so overshadowed by trolling Jester and Executioner. The other problem is how poorly distributed evils tend to be. A game with 2 Consiglieres is pretty fucked for Mafia while a game with Janitor and Consort can prevent a lot of night active roles from butchering Mafias such as Vigilante, Jailor, Retri, etc. I wish there was a way to guarantee Consort in every game. It's such a basic role that every Mafia team should have. I think it's okay to have 2 killing roles at all times so Escorts can lay off with "I ROLEBLOCKED X LAST NIGHT AND NO MAFIA KILLS!". It's a really cheap and unfair way for an evil to die instantly, so having Mafioso and GF in the same game guaranteed is helpful to avoid situations like that. Also it would be nice if blackmailed people also lost their right to vote so they can't do the BM vote/cancel vote strat. Spies should counter Blackmailers by revealing to town who was visited by Mafia so that when someone is very quiet they can be confirmed blackmailed by Spy without cheesing the blackmail with vote/cancel vote.
I think an easy way to limit the "BM vote cancel" strat is to either rate limit vote/cancel actions, or put a hard limit on how many you can take per day. Two votes, one cancel, maybe? It'd still be possible to signal that you're BM'd but Town would actually have to pay attention.
I dont know if its just me, but I swear I get mafia over 60% of the time or more. Also if i could buff maf I would make it so bmer stops mayor revealing (might be too op, but makes bmer more fun when you do find a mayor)
Honestly i say remove NK and change it to any that way it throws out the find the 3 random towns people meta and make it so certain mafia roles dont get picked together like forger and framer
I mean if it were that, it would mean you stop all day abilities so you could stop Jailor from Jailing. That would be a really cool mechanic. HOWEVER he already has two abilities and one is stupid overpowered and prevents people from whispering. You can't give blackmailer so much power.
1:15 I'd look into removing the ability to whisper and wills (change them to personal notes that you can quote but don't get revealed on death), they allow town way too much ability to coordinate at no risk. Force town to say things publicly if they have information to share so the mafia knows what the town knows. Either high priority roles are forced to reveal themselves and give the mafia a shot at killing them or information is lost if the mafia randomly kills someone who didn't reveal what they knew.
Something I would change to nerf the ret, is to allow them to revive the disguiser. It's a small change, but could really mess with a game. The mafia needs a role that gives them a bit more killing power sometimes. Look what the Coven can accomplish in a single night. Think Medusa, Necro, Potion Master.
The problem with playing evils is there is no puzzle to solve. towns goal is to find the lies in amongst the truths. find conflicts in logic and use their information to discover the evils. Its puzzle solving which is always enjoyable. as Evil you are the ones setting up the puzzle to solve which isn't anywhere nearly as fun. especially when you don't have enough information most of the time to make convincing lies. You would not believe the number of mafia and NK games I have won by barely saying anything, never claiming and just hoping town is dumb and slow at voting. If I were to fix the game I would do one of two things. 1. Give mafia more information each night. its a real problem that mafia are forced into claiming spy, consorts into escorts, consigs into invests, etc etc. because otherwise its super easy to call their bluff. I would probably do this by reworking either the GF or the mafioso (mafioso is literally the most boring role in the game, you have no agency and have no good claims other than vigi or spy which are so dull) so that they as an action can find out some general information (Think the way Psychic works but it would say "Person A, Person B or Person C is the " or something similar. maybe they find out everything about players that visit a mafia member for example). The point is to give mafia more tools to use to craft their fake wills and therefore more freedom to claim interesting roles. or 2. Give mafia a target maybe there is a certain member (or a couple of town members) that if they can find out who they are and kill them they automatically win. For example what if the mayor was reworked so that if they are killed, mafia win. So mafia have a puzzle they are trying to solve and town have to work together to not reveal who the mayor is. all town would know who the Mayor is (this could cause issues with throwing and double accounts but I think it would be an improvement, perhaps you could have it where only a few town roles know mayor, like maybe jailer and sheriff or something) This would also add an interesting dynamic to town play which would be interesting. and one final idea that would probably help but not fix it completely is to make mafia-mafia whispers not public so they can talk during the day to react more quickly to plays and claims etc. Would love to know what people think about these ideas.
A Problem with mafia-mafia whispers not being public could be that mafia could be easily called out by telling two of them to whisper each other and seeing if a message shows up. could be fixed by adding another button next to the whisper one for private whispering but I am not sure if that would be balanced or not.
@@arctic887 ^^ it IS the vip gamemode. I think it could be reworked though, i think it should have the same concept but give mafia more information that town doesn't have which would benefit mafia in a way that they can plan out who they attack ahead of time. Plus another mafia role that could conceal a mafia member's role. For example, Pretend its d3, Your fellow mafioso is pushed up to the stand and is defending, You ask for a invest to investigate what role he is, The following night, You (the new mafia role) can select which role he could be for example you could set your mafioso to look like a invest, or a bad jester which would lead to a insane amount of outplays and mind games as you could change your own mafia roles even confirming them without town realising until the new role is killed.The only problem is that its basically like a framer with more power since it has the ability to counter invests and allows mafia to get room for cc's which could lead to more potential mislynching on towns which gives mafia mroe time to win.
Honestly, it seems like the worst part about being evil is the leavers. I've been rewatching a lot of your old vids and almost every town win you post has a Mafia that just leaves the game D1. Sure, evils haven't been in a good place for ages, but I think it feels a lot worse than it actually is because Mafia leaves all the time. I think a good way to improve the default ToS experience is to give Mafia stronger, more capable-of-killing roles like Coven has. Give them more Ambusher-esque kill roles to the RM list that have the potential to kill if you play right. Edit: Boy this town sucked.
@@FaithOriginalisme I feel like forger is just too limited in usefulness. You either need to weave a whole, perfect will from cloth without knowing if someone else has copies of their will, or just have enough to be able to erase a day or two, and it's hard to coordinate all of that in the night you have to do it.
Hello leavers are currently punished for leaving but only after multiple concurrent offenses (there was recently an implementation of this) so I know its being heavily discouraged to an extreme but I guess that the dev team needs to do more on their part to actually make it hard to leave. Leaving any team game is an issue but esp so in such a crucial position.
Random mafia should have the ability to vote to attack imo like when gf and Mafioso both aren't attacking you can attack and also don't you think it would be cool if the Gf could actually control the rms himself? But also allow the rms to control themselves
I think there could be a mafia role similar to blackmailer OR a buffed blackmailer. Basically, if a blackmailer blackmails you, you can’t vote/talk/whisper/do any day abilities. Maybe take out do any day abilities because they could keep doing it to jailor, but I think it would be cool.
They need to add stronger abilities for evils, or give them more of an advantage, for example, if someone is bmd then they can’t vote for the day, maybe also depower roles like retributionist, where they (maybe) die when they revive or some other way. Also I would want a more punishable way for mafia leavers to be hit, like not being able to play for half of an hour if you leave, because as an evil it sucks when your whole team leaves, as an upgrade for mafia Godfather would have the ability to kill 2 people in the night, or mafioso can bypass TP just once in the game, maybe as a Farmer they can choose the role that the person shows up as, for being a disguiser, you can talk and be the person (you disguised as) for the day, but you can’t be yourself, as a forger you can change their role to show up as what you would want it too, also maybe give an upgrade for neutrals, like WW can bite only 1 person (who is in the town) to join him as a ww buddy, but only 1 can attack on full moons. As SK, you get the 2 person attack like with GF (don’t know anything else here lol) with arsonist, you can choose to clean someone of dousing (Incase you find witch that you doused) and that you have the ability to have a fire wall up, anyone who visits dies. But their wills are burned down in the fire as well. And also give a boost to exe, and jest. Jester has no night abilities but in the day, he does. What he can do is he can force a vote if he’s on the stand to guilty him, but also if you execute the jester he kills 2 players instead of 1. Executioner will also be able to frame his target so that they will appear evil. I also want to address this even if it doesn’t fit into ranked practice, I think amnes shouldn’t be known to remember if they do, kinda makes it hard for amnes go to evil. Anyway, leave some more suggestions! I want to see what this community comes up with and I hope some changes come to TOS cause we need to see some changes to benefit evils a bit more. Thanks for reading the whole thing and listening to my thoughts!
I think they could replace mafioso with differents mafioso-like roles but with special abilities each. One couldn't be roleblocked for example. Another could ignore bodyguards or crusaders. Forger could be able to kill AND change wills at the same time. We can probably buff/replace multiple evil roles or nerf town. Another option would be to buff WW and SK to destroy will when killing via escort/jailor/staying home. Maybe reducing the amount of exes jailor has would be helpful too. Of course, adding new roles would work well too. These can make evils unique and more fun.
In regards to the BG/Crusader idea, I would think instead of ignoring them, they could have a single-use immunity to them. BG still dies, Crusader still shows an attack, both still block it, but the Mafia member doesn't die. Instead of the BG dying guarding someone, it'd show them as being killed by Mafia, but not show the original target they were guarded.
@@kitsunephantom6155 I always found it pretty ridiculous that the WW could maul people but not destroy the house of their victims in the process ( including the wills). It's a raging werewolf people! Same with Arsonist, let them burn everything down!
To make it a bit more balanced, perhaps make Ret a neutral role. It can then rez town or evil. So effectively a survivor ability to win either way if picked right. Also believe having a gf and a mafioso is sorta pointless. You could have three maf roles that create chaos with framer or consigs etc, but the GF can then decide to kill as an when he needs to, which will send one of the other 3 to do it.
That'd make Ret OP but in a good way to not tip the scales. Perhaps though, there could be a 'Ret' like role that has an opposite alignment. I made an idea for a Vigi that dies from guilt after killing an evil. A Hitman, for either NK or Maf. IF there were more strong opposite but equal to Town Evil roles, I'm sure it'd balance things out more, with more fun roles to get. AND, a comment another person mentioned was a Role lock, so if you get like Mafiso, you can't get it again for 24 hours. Which would allow for some fun because then you KNOW for sure you're not getting the same role over and over.
@@thevoidismyhome7242 agreed. Defo a 24 hour cool down, but how it would work pratically may be the issue (unless you limit it to specific roles). The evil equivalent of Ret is pretty much the Necromancer role... so thinking on that, could Ret be used in a similar fashion i.e. dead BG can be used maybe once to protect a town role, rather than revive. Might take away the power of a vote, but whether it may still be OP if not more... i dunno
@@Name-zz6qv tactically played though, your ability can see you win with town or evils. I.e. 4vs3 and you opt for the town win and rez a drad townie. Or vice versa. Kinda linking the way with jester and exe that if they play it right then they win.
I'd make the game more interesting by making more 'Evils' that are kinda like townie roles, but without like guilt or anything. Like. A vigi that dies when they kill another evil, same 3 shots, and stuff, but a vigi specifically for like Maf. A hitman. And I'd make it so some evils can legitmately team up, so like the SK and Maf could work together, win together. That way the 'odds' against evils isn't: NEvNKvMafVTown You know? It could then be Team Evils V Team Town. Or it could so be the major odds, like, there is more ability.
SK winning with Maf is a cool idea, and SK wouldn't necessarily know who Maf is.. I mean, Maf and SK have to work together most games anyway at the beginning
@@FaithOriginalisme Yeah, it'd even up the odds to have the evils working together and then NOT turn against each other. They could still try for a solo win, but the idea of them working together would lead more NKs to have a chance, and with that kind of killing power, it's possible that Maf would be less likely to leave, knowing there is a chance they could have an SK or Werewolf on their side.
I'd give mafia a type of medium role where they can see dead chat but can't communicate with it then allow them to res a mafia role and give it to another player. Feel like you need to give the "lower" mafia more power along with some of the lower town eg Medium to prevent quitters. or even a Medusa equivalent for the Mafia.
The worst part about being evil is how useless and boring they are. Make the random mafia easier to disguise themselves as town by having similar abilities as town. Also mafioso’s “ability” to become GF isn’t good enough to make him a fun or useful role, 3 RM and GF should be in the game. Town needs one less confirmed town investigative role in the game and maybe move Spy to TS because having your only Ti being Spy probably won’t be good for town and that also makes the OP TS spots have a more balanced alternative. Seen someone say this and I’m stealing it so it can be seen more but making Retri Neutral so he can revive evil or town and be a survivor type role. Neutral Killing needs to be reworked probably. They are extremely hard to win as because they are pretty weak and considering Neutral Evil’s best interest is to work with mafia, NK basically is 1v14 in the game. Coven should be free. You are required to buy premium before you can buy coven on mobile also, which is ridiculous.
The problem I find with the evil roles is that it’s incredibly difficult to keep them alive. In most of the games I have played, the evil roles get busted Night 1 and 2 by the other roles (Jailor jailing SK N1, Escort finding SK/Mafioso). You just can’t defend yourself when there’s no kills because you are blocked (Escort) or they get killed from you attacking them when they jail/block you (SK). At least, I reasonably couldn’t. Then, you have the Mafia players who don’t want to play their roles, leave, and decide to be a-holes and put who the other Mafia are in their wills. Can’t tell you how many times I have had a Forger leave and pull this crap. The same thing happens in Coven games as well, with leavers or getting busted early. Hell, I got Juggernaut for the first time in a game and was busted and hung by a random Investigator D2. Really think something needs to be done to make the game fun again, but I don’t know what could. One thing I would like is if they would put a 24 hour lock on roles so you won’t get the same role multiple times in a row. Can’t tell you how many times I have gotten Mafioso 3-4 times in a row when I played. Other than that, I just don’t want to play the game that isn’t fun and with the way it is, ToS is just not fun.
When you are playing, and someone puts mafia roles in their will or chat, if you aren't already, please report them. Those players will get weeded out through the juror system (as long as the report gets seen)
While there are many great scum readers out there, there are also many dumb ones. I was Ret and on D2, some dude called me scummy before we even spoke or voted. Nearly got hung, and then when that idiot scum reader died, I chose to revive a BG over him (even though he was doc).
The other day I was GF and 2 mafia left n1. Day 2 my other mafia is found. Day 4 WW is found. Somehow I still won though, I claimed Invest so ig they thought that was an unlikely GF claim.
Annabelle Ocampo I remember you! We won the game as a godfather and framer. Framed framed the right person and we got the win as only 2 mafia. I was mayor, The Godfather. The escort was lynched because of our framer framing them. Does that sound familiar?
In my opinion, I think that town of Salem should revert to the old ranked and ranked practice role list, where there was an any slot. In my opinion, it made the game more balanced because it allowed there to be more than one NK or NE.
There's a couple of options I've thought up to help give Mafia more of a chance. Option one is just to replace RT and RM slots with Any/"Random Town or Mafia" slots, so there's not a fixed and known number of townies. Even if almost all slots filled with town (presumably protection to prevent just GF/Mafioso vs the world) there's enough uncertainty that Mafia can exploit to deflect suspicion for a few days, maybe even get mislynch. Furhter modifying this would be to take some of the guaranteed RT roles and replace them with "RT/Mafia", so there are even fewer guaranteed townies. Option two is to replace (nearly) all of the roles with Any/"Random Town or Mafia" with some restrictions, like a guaranteed number of Town and a guaranteed number of Mafia. I personally think option one is better, because there's still *some* certainty that Town can fall back on (guaranteed GF/Mafioso, guaranteed Jailor, etc) but if that doesn't help evil winrates enough then this is an option. Really like you (kinda) said Town just has too much info at their disposal, it's far too easy to confirm people. The only way I can think of to fix that is to make it so there aren't as many guaranteed townies, so the Town doesn't know who to trust. "Jack Sparrow claims Invest, there's no CC, but there's no guaranteed TI - do we trust him?" kinda stuff. Obviously with both of these you'd increase the amount of debating time before votes can be cast, so Town has some chance to work through the data and find low-skilled evils. I'd also add in a "vote to skip" button to the talking time, and a dedicated "abstain" button to the voting screen, and increase anti-AFK protection. Not sure how long AFK players are banned for, but if it's not an hour I'd make it an hour, and if it's 1 hour+ I'd increase it buy an hour, because honestly AFK evils not only seem to be more of a problem than a good Town, but it's not fun for Town either.
I think that's a fair report, because you still left your teammates and you could have prevented the leave if you were paying attention to your battery
Christine Cao worst think with playing on phones, is that the game has a horrible tendency to crash, throwing you from the game. I’ve had many games where I was a role I liked, or evil, but the app crashed and I was kicked off of it
I think town needs less occupation of the role list in order to give evils some more presence, personally would change the role list to remove some of the random town spots and/or get rid of the 2nd town investigative slots(though in order for this to be most effective would require the removal of the 4 mafia maximum rule).
What if they had a transcript role for mafia and town or just one. it would work by you pick one target and if they type you get a “log” of they chat of what they said and the other people that talked at marked with a line so you don’t see their name?
I don't play that game a lot but I feel like a lot of town roles is just too powerful. Mafioso can't even choose the target if GF is alive and not jailed. I think that based on how powerful the roles are (maybe by some survey sent to Master rank players) there should be a tier list of roles and, every game there would be, let's say 1 top tier role, 2 medium tier roles and the rest could be whatever. Also Mafioso should be reworked. Maybe he could have hidden pistol with one bullet that he could use on whoever he wants the night he gets sent to kill. This way, Mafioso would get more independence and mafia might be a little more powerful in early game being able to take two targets the same night to cause some chaos. I feel like mafia on the high level can't work fast enough to oppose all the TI's and TS's and unless NK kills some townies, it's hard to overpower a well organised town.
Itd be nice to have a maf role that can multiple kill as well. Like pest, if you go to someones house, you have a chance to infect half the town if they are visiting that player. So maybe a mafia role like... I dunno.. Someone that blows up a whole household and it gets anyone visiting or something.
If we compare this game to Throne of Lies, evils in ToL have: - Conversions and possessions, so no one is ever fully confirmed. - Day abilities that allow them to bleed people, silence them, etc. - A plethora of interesting night abilities. - Kill abilities that go through blocks and protections. - 2-3 Neutrals in every game, with many of them able to make the game pretty chaotic (trollboxes, frames, etc.). Other Neutrals like Alchemist or Sellsword can be really helpful to evils. Evils in ToS, in comparison, have: - No conversions or possessions, so once someone is confirmed, they remain confirmed for the rest of the game. Disguiser used to be able to possess, but that was removed. - No day abilities (for anyone). That makes it much more difficult to derail conversations. - Mafioso, GF and ALL neutral evils have no night ability except for killing, which isn't too interesting. It also makes faking a role much more difficult. - Can't kill through a doctor or bodyguard, so you can't kill dangerous roles early. - Neutrals aren't too useful to evils and mostly do their own thing.
Skimm you got salty for the jailor actually saving your life there... That was a bit tough to watch you get so upset for no real reason... Maybe a LITTLE bit of hubris with that flex on phoenix? Like no need to get so defensive and pissy...
BMG just has a magic system that when you’re maf or neut, you get the worst teammates, a stacked town and your allies leave or die early. When you’re town, you get noobs and complete idiots and trolls. That’s my only explanation
Actually skimm do you know why they like to add two ti in most modes, my theory is two ti working together can confirm most town, here is what I'm saying Spy- can confirm certain mafia roles but can also confirm some town roles. Lookout- if lookout visits someone and the person they visit dies, they can call out said evil role, also effective in finding sk n1, however they cannot confirm arsonist, only the spy can. Sheriff- can find someone who maybe framed as suspicious but downside the nerf only gives them susp or not susp Investigator- Can find out if someone is framed or doused. However each of these ti roles also has disadvantages which is why there is usually two. Investigator- While I said they can find someone who is framed or doused, the invest can't tell the difference between if someone is framed or doused between framer or arsonist so they can easily find the veteran. Also same thing in a transporter game, if someone is transed they get the result of the person that was transed and often has to ask if there is a transporter Sheriff- like investigator, can be fooled in a transporter game, for instance if they investigate someone and the person is transed the sheriff may confuse them as being susp Spy- while it is the most effective ti role in some regards and they can easily confirm most town roles and can also find out about certain mafia roles, having to whisper about mafia visits is also hard they are also ineffective on finding most nk unless mafia attacks them. Lookout- can easily find some town roles which is very helpful, it's also the only role that can find out if certain roles are capable of visiting, for instance: Suppose a lookout visits Mario and we find out Luigi visited him and Mario claims transed we know Luigi is transporter then.
It could also be seen as 'real Spy didn't have fake Spy visited because real Spy was jailed'. As bad as Jailor was, you would of died had he not jailed you.
9:13 Yakos needed to correct his will after seeing that his will didnt match up with the will of the bmer. He should have also been killed for beeing bad
If I Owned ToS To Make The Evil Roles (And The Entire Game In General) More Fun I Would Add More Roles. For Example I Would Add A Mafia Version Of The Transporter (The Transport Message Would Be Different To Not Make It Too OP) This Would Force Jailors To Not Claim Day 1. I Also Feel Like A Mafia Role That Can Disguise Others As Different Roles (Maybe It's A 1 Time Use Where The Role Can Disguise Any Player As A Mafia Role For The Entire Game). I Would Also Add A New NK Called Something Like Ice Wizard That Can Kill By Freezing People Every Other Night (Maybe The Ice Wizard Is Only Available In Coven Mode, Also When Someone Is Frozen You Have To Wait A Day For The Ice To Melt Before Their Role And Will Is Revealed As It'd Be Stuck In The Ice). You May Not Agree But Personally I Think This Would Make The Game More Fun!
What if they added an NC retri-like role (like the escort/consort) that ressed people and changed their win conditions? So you couldn't trust retri's anymore, bc a ressed doc may now win with the mafia, but no one would know.
If that exe was smart he could have made a quick fake spy will, and said that he bugged the "spy" and saw he was blackmailed. Make a fake will and point at Skimm as being the BM'r instead. Now, it might not have worked, but it would have seriously screwed with town and removed a potential "confirmed" live townie.
1. They need to rework broken town support roles. (retri,trans,escort,mayor) they're immediately confirmable and whenever there is more than one in a game town almost can't lose. 2. Take one town investigative and change it to be RT. (more claim space.) Or better yet. Add neutral benign or even an any. 3. Finally give nuetrals there own win conditions that align with mafias interest but dont rely on mafia to win (kill x amount of town) and don't pit them against mafia so that evils can win with maf
To make this game more fair for mafia, I would say they should change the role list so that it’s more unspecific. For example, instead of Jailor, 2 TI, 1 TP, 1 Tk, 1 TS, 3 RT, The 4 mafia, and the two neutrals, I think it should be something like: At least 1tp or 1 Tk, Jailor, At least 1 Ts or Ti, and then 5 RT, the 4 mafia, and two neutrals.
Well, Skimm... when I get annoyed with my games, I step away for awhile and come back. Maybe it's time to take a vacay from ToS? No matter what, your followers will still follow. We love you. :)
Honestly getting rid of ret would help a TON. It confirms at the very minimum 2 roles and swings in towns favor way too heavily. Or steal an idea from ToL and allow mafia to recruit once a game or something
First of all i would rework framer, disguiser and forger into usefull roles. Forger will recieve multiple extra notepads to write fake claims on. Also Forget visits will not be seen by spy or lookout. Framer will recieve only 3 frame charges. But whoever they frame will be seen as a different mafia role. (Framer/Vamp/Jest) (Vig/Vet/Maf) (Bg/Gf/Arso) etc. So you have a doc claim, which is framed, an invest checks it and bam, Lookout Forger Witch. (And framer can choose as which role they frame them. Think of the hypno's list of choices, but for the framer as a role list for frames). Disguiser would also get 3 disguises only. But they will keep the disguise of their last visited target. regardless off how many nights pass.. even if exed in jail, they would still be disguised. And finally, Godfather cannot be randomized by Jester haunt. (They can be specifically selected, because else a jest knows who the GF is and can tell a medium) But when randomizing they can never land on the GF. These changes should give mafia a significant boost. In turn to make NK more viable. For the WW: If you visit a WW rampaging at home, your will will be cleaned. So if a sheriff check WW on WW night the sheriff will die and their will torn to shreds. For the SK: If you get visited by a member of the mafia, you will kill that mafia member AND your selected target, (exceptions being consort which would force you to kill consort only and not also your selected target). For the executioner / jester i would give them a 1 time use disguise lasting one night. So for example an exe claiming LO can disguise for one night as a LO to give themselves more credebility if checked). A jester can disguise themselves as maf or NK or something in order to make them appear even more suspisious for one night. (This should fool Town Invest roles, Coven Leader/Witch/Consiglere should still see the real role (and maybe also the disguised role)). As for the other roles (including coven roles) i wouldnt really change much.
Maybe if maf disconnects/leaves, mafia can recruit a townie for each DC'd maf? Kinda like how vamps can bite a townie and convert. I think most maf plays are ruined when maf just leaves right away, without even trying. I feel especially bad for NKs tho. They almost never win, especially WW and arso.
Skimm: we should have lost this game no one was listening or paying enough attention Jailor who saved his life and letting him ultimatley win the game for town: ima jail skimm tonight instead of the bmer
the Jailor sucks actually. They can jail the real evil but instead jailing skimm. Maybe it's just coincidental for skimm to be attacked so Jailor's mistake kinda saves skimm's life
They should allow Mafia who are not killing roles to visit each other. It would be a harder read to see who is mafia from spy but a risky play for mafia giving up plays against town.
Hella late but I think if a disg disguises a person as like, a townie, and jailor selects the disguised, it should jail the townie. Right now there isn't aot of counter play to being jailed so sometimes you just lose to luck with that.
Didn't hey not notice that Herbert didn't have rbed bug on the Jailor when he first posted his will? He added it after you posted that you rbed the Jailor lol and had to quickly re post since he forgot to recopy it with the update
Also for night 3 yakos had to add Caterpie to his will since he apparently missed it he was a terrible spy never posted a will or claim day 2 just said "okay no will get the spy claim" "he's not bmed" had he posted a will after the guy claimed bmed then he would probably have been lynched or executed as a jest suspect
I support the idea of changing the game so that nobody can visit the same person 2 nights in a row. It would open the game up for evils to be able to counter the jailor claim day 1 tactic. More of a mind game of is someone on this person or not....
Mafia needs some buffs, and maybe make confirming some roles harder or make it harder for town roles to use their abilities correctly (like killer roles that give false results or something )
![Infinity Nikki: Quest Exclusive Seeds of the Past Have Sprouted & Quest more dialogue [PS5Pro]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Aw-u3IpGhhM/mqdefault.jpg)
Maybe jailor has 9 million IQ and jailed you cuz he knew mafia would attack u?
No need to have 9 million IQ to use jailor as Bg.
1 maf is with 2 Town members
I rmb accidentally jailing three confirmed townies and they all got attacked in jail... i still got called an idiot tho :/
NachoToast That’s like jailer jailing revealed mayor for saftey
Jailor probably didn't know who to jail so decided to jail you to save you, and you were attacked in jail so it worked
When skimm was jailed n3 he said I am confirmed not escort (he ment to say consort)
lol Skimm says the wrong roles a lot. I notice he often confuses the town role with the evil counterpart, especially under pressure.
I've done the same thing WAY too many times lol
I've never done that before, but i can see myself doing that
To be fair he has a hard time commentating and playing a game that requires focus a lot of attention. I feel like it shouldn't be that bad unless it really bugs me (so far not a single mistake he's made in previous videos that I know of had me super annoyed.)
Not to mention he was the exe target
Ive never seen a read on a blackmailer as impressive as this
Same! I was confused as to how skimm caught the bmer
Got it instantly lol, It's all about experience. I shouted it out at home excactly when skimm did.
That’s why you shut up as BM and stay silent
Caitlyn Garcia it’s not hard. Spy is a BM claim. Usually when a Spy say they’re BMed they’re the BMer. That’s how it usually goes.
I have three ideas for buffing Mafia a little bit (how unbalanced it would be, I'm not sure but could be worth a try):
Framer, can choose to reverse-frame themselves on any night by selecting themselves (would show up as ns to sheriff or as something else to invest).
Disguiser, can become revivable by ret so that it's a true disguise.
Blackmailer, when blackmailing someone, also stops their voting power which could lead to an interesting late-game play (almost like an anti-mayor for town). That would also make you want to hide even more early game from the spy.
Building upon the Framer idea: Framer is largely considered the worst Mafia role, so why not give them total immunity to Sheriff? They still get the ability to change for Invest, but Sheriffs can't find them sus ever. It would make Framer substantially more powerful.
The only TI that would be able to catch a Framer in action is Spy, unless reverse-framing shows up to Spy as "Mafia Visited". *That* would be overpowered.
Just remove retri
I think people forget that mafia have the ability to cooperate at night. If mafia plays right they can actually make some good plays. Mafia is often let down by one or two bad individuals who dont know what they're doing or dont cooperate with other mafia.
Personally, I think evils would have a more reliable way of winning if they had more static roles that are guaranteed to show up.
For one, I really dislike that Witch is in the same role category as Jester and Executioner which are both evil roles that can consciously side with town for a free lynch. Witch can be a powerful ally to NK and Mafia but the odds of having one are so overshadowed by trolling Jester and Executioner.
The other problem is how poorly distributed evils tend to be. A game with 2 Consiglieres is pretty fucked for Mafia while a game with Janitor and Consort can prevent a lot of night active roles from butchering Mafias such as Vigilante, Jailor, Retri, etc.
I wish there was a way to guarantee Consort in every game. It's such a basic role that every Mafia team should have.
I think it's okay to have 2 killing roles at all times so Escorts can lay off with "I ROLEBLOCKED X LAST NIGHT AND NO MAFIA KILLS!". It's a really cheap and unfair way for an evil to die instantly, so having Mafioso and GF in the same game guaranteed is helpful to avoid situations like that.
Also it would be nice if blackmailed people also lost their right to vote so they can't do the BM vote/cancel vote strat. Spies should counter Blackmailers by revealing to town who was visited by Mafia so that when someone is very quiet they can be confirmed blackmailed by Spy without cheesing the blackmail with vote/cancel vote.
I really like your blocked from voting idea, but that would be broken as all hell late game
@@FaithOriginalisme yeah if they BM Mayor...that's a useless Mayor.
I liked your idea with bmer. It should be added into the game..also revealed mayor should be immune to being bmed.
I think an easy way to limit the "BM vote cancel" strat is to either rate limit vote/cancel actions, or put a hard limit on how many you can take per day. Two votes, one cancel, maybe? It'd still be possible to signal that you're BM'd but Town would actually have to pay attention.
I think they should remove mafioso. It sucks to play a role that has no real ability and only does what the gf says.
I dont know if its just me, but I swear I get mafia over 60% of the time or more.
Also if i could buff maf I would make it so bmer stops mayor revealing (might be too op, but makes bmer more fun when you do find a mayor)
Honestly i say remove NK and change it to any that way it throws out the find the 3 random towns people meta and make it so certain mafia roles dont get picked together like forger and framer
And disguiser could use a buff. Like make them revivable by ret and keep the same town role for multiple days.
@@--Ghost-- That would be a bit weird since the new version shows the revived role next to their name.
I mean if it were that, it would mean you stop all day abilities so you could stop Jailor from Jailing. That would be a really cool mechanic. HOWEVER he already has two abilities and one is stupid overpowered and prevents people from whispering. You can't give blackmailer so much power.
Arctic and it would say the role they disguised as when they died.
skimm, you should collab with irepptar, he always wins as evil
True story
you got your wish
1:15 I'd look into removing the ability to whisper and wills (change them to personal notes that you can quote but don't get revealed on death), they allow town way too much ability to coordinate at no risk. Force town to say things publicly if they have information to share so the mafia knows what the town knows. Either high priority roles are forced to reveal themselves and give the mafia a shot at killing them or information is lost if the mafia randomly kills someone who didn't reveal what they knew.
When you accidentally say "was" in a vampire game instead of "is" or "am"
Something I would change to nerf the ret, is to allow them to revive the disguiser. It's a small change, but could really mess with a game. The mafia needs a role that gives them a bit more killing power sometimes. Look what the Coven can accomplish in a single night. Think Medusa, Necro, Potion Master.
The problem with playing evils is there is no puzzle to solve.
towns goal is to find the lies in amongst the truths. find conflicts in logic and use their information to discover the evils. Its puzzle solving which is always enjoyable.
as Evil you are the ones setting up the puzzle to solve which isn't anywhere nearly as fun. especially when you don't have enough information most of the time to make convincing lies. You would not believe the number of mafia and NK games I have won by barely saying anything, never claiming and just hoping town is dumb and slow at voting.
If I were to fix the game I would do one of two things.
1. Give mafia more information each night.
its a real problem that mafia are forced into claiming spy, consorts into escorts, consigs into invests, etc etc. because otherwise its super easy to call their bluff. I would probably do this by reworking either the GF or the mafioso (mafioso is literally the most boring role in the game, you have no agency and have no good claims other than vigi or spy which are so dull) so that they as an action can find out some general information (Think the way Psychic works but it would say "Person A, Person B or Person C is the " or something similar. maybe they find out everything about players that visit a mafia member for example). The point is to give mafia more tools to use to craft their fake wills and therefore more freedom to claim interesting roles.
or
2. Give mafia a target
maybe there is a certain member (or a couple of town members) that if they can find out who they are and kill them they automatically win. For example what if the mayor was reworked so that if they are killed, mafia win. So mafia have a puzzle they are trying to solve and town have to work together to not reveal who the mayor is. all town would know who the Mayor is (this could cause issues with throwing and double accounts but I think it would be an improvement, perhaps you could have it where only a few town roles know mayor, like maybe jailer and sheriff or something) This would also add an interesting dynamic to town play which would be interesting.
and one final idea that would probably help but not fix it completely is to make mafia-mafia whispers not public so they can talk during the day to react more quickly to plays and claims etc.
Would love to know what people think about these ideas.
A Problem with mafia-mafia whispers not being public could be that mafia could be easily called out by telling two of them to whisper each other and seeing if a message shows up. could be fixed by adding another button next to the whisper one for private whispering but I am not sure if that would be balanced or not.
For the second one, that would basically be VIP mode.
@@arctic887 ^^ it IS the vip gamemode. I think it could be reworked though, i think it should have the same concept but give mafia more information that town doesn't have which would benefit mafia in a way that they can plan out who they attack ahead of time. Plus another mafia role that could conceal a mafia member's role. For example, Pretend its d3, Your fellow mafioso is pushed up to the stand and is defending, You ask for a invest to investigate what role he is, The following night, You (the new mafia role) can select which role he could be for example you could set your mafioso to look like a invest, or a bad jester which would lead to a insane amount of outplays and mind games as you could change your own mafia roles even confirming them without town realising until the new role is killed.The only problem is that its basically like a framer with more power since it has the ability to counter invests and allows mafia to get room for cc's which could lead to more potential mislynching on towns which gives mafia mroe time to win.
Honestly, it seems like the worst part about being evil is the leavers. I've been rewatching a lot of your old vids and almost every town win you post has a Mafia that just leaves the game D1. Sure, evils haven't been in a good place for ages, but I think it feels a lot worse than it actually is because Mafia leaves all the time.
I think a good way to improve the default ToS experience is to give Mafia stronger, more capable-of-killing roles like Coven has. Give them more Ambusher-esque kill roles to the RM list that have the potential to kill if you play right.
Edit: Boy this town sucked.
tbf, not only mafia but even NKs do that (leaving early)
Forger and Jani could be squished into one maybe, and bring over one of the coven mafia roles?
@@FaithOriginalisme I feel like forger is just too limited in usefulness. You either need to weave a whole, perfect will from cloth without knowing if someone else has copies of their will, or just have enough to be able to erase a day or two, and it's hard to coordinate all of that in the night you have to do it.
Hello leavers are currently punished for leaving but only after multiple concurrent offenses (there was recently an implementation of this) so I know its being heavily discouraged to an extreme but I guess that the dev team needs to do more on their part to actually make it hard to leave. Leaving any team game is an issue but esp so in such a crucial position.
Random mafia should have the ability to vote to attack imo like when gf and Mafioso both aren't attacking you can attack and also don't you think it would be cool if the Gf could actually control the rms himself? But also allow the rms to control themselves
Man this game gives me memory’s I watched my friend play it like five years ago and haven’t since
I think there could be a mafia role similar to blackmailer OR a buffed blackmailer. Basically, if a blackmailer blackmails you, you can’t vote/talk/whisper/do any day abilities. Maybe take out do any day abilities because they could keep doing it to jailor, but I think it would be cool.
They need to add stronger abilities for evils, or give them more of an advantage, for example, if someone is bmd then they can’t vote for the day, maybe also depower roles like retributionist, where they (maybe) die when they revive or some other way. Also I would want a more punishable way for mafia leavers to be hit, like not being able to play for half of an hour if you leave, because as an evil it sucks when your whole team leaves, as an upgrade for mafia Godfather would have the ability to kill 2 people in the night, or mafioso can bypass TP just once in the game, maybe as a Farmer they can choose the role that the person shows up as, for being a disguiser, you can talk and be the person (you disguised as) for the day, but you can’t be yourself, as a forger you can change their role to show up as what you would want it too, also maybe give an upgrade for neutrals, like WW can bite only 1 person (who is in the town) to join him as a ww buddy, but only 1 can attack on full moons. As SK, you get the 2 person attack like with GF (don’t know anything else here lol) with arsonist, you can choose to clean someone of dousing (Incase you find witch that you doused) and that you have the ability to have a fire wall up, anyone who visits dies. But their wills are burned down in the fire as well. And also give a boost to exe, and jest. Jester has no night abilities but in the day, he does. What he can do is he can force a vote if he’s on the stand to guilty him, but also if you execute the jester he kills 2 players instead of 1. Executioner will also be able to frame his target so that they will appear evil. I also want to address this even if it doesn’t fit into ranked practice, I think amnes shouldn’t be known to remember if they do, kinda makes it hard for amnes go to evil. Anyway, leave some more suggestions! I want to see what this community comes up with and I hope some changes come to TOS cause we need to see some changes to benefit evils a bit more. Thanks for reading the whole thing and listening to my thoughts!
There's a leaver buster in the works for all players who leave, not just mafia. AFAIK, it was put on hold to get Unity out
I enjoy being evil in all any. Less pressure
Wauw skimm seemed really angry all through the video
I think they could replace mafioso with differents mafioso-like roles but with special abilities each. One couldn't be roleblocked for example. Another could ignore bodyguards or crusaders. Forger could be able to kill AND change wills at the same time. We can probably buff/replace multiple evil roles or nerf town. Another option would be to buff WW and SK to destroy will when killing via escort/jailor/staying home. Maybe reducing the amount of exes jailor has would be helpful too. Of course, adding new roles would work well too. These can make evils unique and more fun.
In regards to the BG/Crusader idea, I would think instead of ignoring them, they could have a single-use immunity to them. BG still dies, Crusader still shows an attack, both still block it, but the Mafia member doesn't die. Instead of the BG dying guarding someone, it'd show them as being killed by Mafia, but not show the original target they were guarded.
WW and SK destroying wills is /essential/ because of escort. BUFF THE MURDER BOYS
@@kitsunephantom6155 I always found it pretty ridiculous that the WW could maul people but not destroy the house of their victims in the process ( including the wills). It's a raging werewolf people! Same with Arsonist, let them burn everything down!
To make it a bit more balanced, perhaps make Ret a neutral role. It can then rez town or evil. So effectively a survivor ability to win either way if picked right.
Also believe having a gf and a mafioso is sorta pointless. You could have three maf roles that create chaos with framer or consigs etc, but the GF can then decide to kill as an when he needs to, which will send one of the other 3 to do it.
That'd make Ret OP but in a good way to not tip the scales.
Perhaps though, there could be a 'Ret' like role that has an opposite alignment. I made an idea for a Vigi that dies from guilt after killing an evil. A Hitman, for either NK or Maf.
IF there were more strong opposite but equal to Town Evil roles, I'm sure it'd balance things out more, with more fun roles to get.
AND, a comment another person mentioned was a Role lock, so if you get like Mafiso, you can't get it again for 24 hours. Which would allow for some fun because then you KNOW for sure you're not getting the same role over and over.
SparkAnark problem is they would immediately get hanged
@@thevoidismyhome7242 agreed. Defo a 24 hour cool down, but how it would work pratically may be the issue (unless you limit it to specific roles).
The evil equivalent of Ret is pretty much the Necromancer role... so thinking on that, could Ret be used in a similar fashion i.e. dead BG can be used maybe once to protect a town role, rather than revive. Might take away the power of a vote, but whether it may still be OP if not more... i dunno
@@Name-zz6qv tactically played though, your ability can see you win with town or evils. I.e. 4vs3 and you opt for the town win and rez a drad townie. Or vice versa. Kinda linking the way with jester and exe that if they play it right then they win.
If ret could rez mafia then the mafia would be instantly confirmed as evil and killed
I'd make the game more interesting by making more 'Evils' that are kinda like townie roles, but without like guilt or anything. Like. A vigi that dies when they kill another evil, same 3 shots, and stuff, but a vigi specifically for like Maf. A hitman.
And I'd make it so some evils can legitmately team up, so like the SK and Maf could work together, win together. That way the 'odds' against evils isn't:
NEvNKvMafVTown
You know?
It could then be
Team Evils V Team Town.
Or it could so be the major odds, like, there is more ability.
SK winning with Maf is a cool idea, and SK wouldn't necessarily know who Maf is.. I mean, Maf and SK have to work together most games anyway at the beginning
@@FaithOriginalisme Yeah, it'd even up the odds to have the evils working together and then NOT turn against each other.
They could still try for a solo win, but the idea of them working together would lead more NKs to have a chance, and with that kind of killing power, it's possible that Maf would be less likely to leave, knowing there is a chance they could have an SK or Werewolf on their side.
I'd give mafia a type of medium role where they can see dead chat but can't communicate with it then allow them to res a mafia role and give it to another player. Feel like you need to give the "lower" mafia more power along with some of the lower town eg Medium to prevent quitters. or even a Medusa equivalent for the Mafia.
The worst part about being evil is how useless and boring they are. Make the random mafia easier to disguise themselves as town by having similar abilities as town. Also mafioso’s “ability” to become GF isn’t good enough to make him a fun or useful role, 3 RM and GF should be in the game.
Town needs one less confirmed town investigative role in the game and maybe move Spy to TS because having your only Ti being Spy probably won’t be good for town and that also makes the OP TS spots have a more balanced alternative. Seen someone say this and I’m stealing it so it can be seen more but making Retri Neutral so he can revive evil or town and be a survivor type role.
Neutral Killing needs to be reworked probably. They are extremely hard to win as because they are pretty weak and considering Neutral Evil’s best interest is to work with mafia, NK basically is 1v14 in the game.
Coven should be free. You are required to buy premium before you can buy coven on mobile also, which is ridiculous.
The problem I find with the evil roles is that it’s incredibly difficult to keep them alive. In most of the games I have played, the evil roles get busted Night 1 and 2 by the other roles (Jailor jailing SK N1, Escort finding SK/Mafioso). You just can’t defend yourself when there’s no kills because you are blocked (Escort) or they get killed from you attacking them when they jail/block you (SK). At least, I reasonably couldn’t.
Then, you have the Mafia players who don’t want to play their roles, leave, and decide to be a-holes and put who the other Mafia are in their wills. Can’t tell you how many times I have had a Forger leave and pull this crap.
The same thing happens in Coven games as well, with leavers or getting busted early. Hell, I got Juggernaut for the first time in a game and was busted and hung by a random Investigator D2.
Really think something needs to be done to make the game fun again, but I don’t know what could.
One thing I would like is if they would put a 24 hour lock on roles so you won’t get the same role multiple times in a row. Can’t tell you how many times I have gotten Mafioso 3-4 times in a row when I played.
Other than that, I just don’t want to play the game that isn’t fun and with the way it is, ToS is just not fun.
When you are playing, and someone puts mafia roles in their will or chat, if you aren't already, please report them. Those players will get weeded out through the juror system (as long as the report gets seen)
I always did when I was playing and I hoped that the other players did the same.
@@DarkAngel40 best bet is to call for everyone in chat to do it since 2 reports are needed for it to process.. but good on you
While there are many great scum readers out there, there are also many dumb ones. I was Ret and on D2, some dude called me scummy before we even spoke or voted. Nearly got hung, and then when that idiot scum reader died, I chose to revive a BG over him (even though he was doc).
I always hate people who say "I said it in chat so I am physically unable to speak to you", it is such a dumb idea
The other day I was GF and 2 mafia left n1. Day 2 my other mafia is found. Day 4 WW is found. Somehow I still won though, I claimed Invest so ig they thought that was an unlikely GF claim.
Wait, were you playing with someone named Fluffy?
@@annabelleocampo4216 nope sorry... guess solo gf win isnt as hard as i thought but ion know
Lmao no it’s pretty hard I just had a game couple days ago and I was townie. Felt pretty stupid XD
rapmon's jams it is hard but it makes you feel good when you pull it off.
Annabelle Ocampo I remember you! We won the game as a godfather and framer. Framed framed the right person and we got the win as only 2 mafia. I was mayor, The Godfather. The escort was lynched because of our framer framing them. Does that sound familiar?
Always fun to watch a Skimm ToS game! Scum reading is something I still need to work on as a player to be honest. Great read
In my opinion, I think that town of Salem should revert to the old ranked and ranked practice role list, where there was an any slot. In my opinion, it made the game more balanced because it allowed there to be more than one NK or NE.
Petition to rename it to a Skimm Read
jailer was most likely protecting you, witch he did, so don't be salty TwoPercentScimm
There's a couple of options I've thought up to help give Mafia more of a chance.
Option one is just to replace RT and RM slots with Any/"Random Town or Mafia" slots, so there's not a fixed and known number of townies. Even if almost all slots filled with town (presumably protection to prevent just GF/Mafioso vs the world) there's enough uncertainty that Mafia can exploit to deflect suspicion for a few days, maybe even get mislynch. Furhter modifying this would be to take some of the guaranteed RT roles and replace them with "RT/Mafia", so there are even fewer guaranteed townies.
Option two is to replace (nearly) all of the roles with Any/"Random Town or Mafia" with some restrictions, like a guaranteed number of Town and a guaranteed number of Mafia. I personally think option one is better, because there's still *some* certainty that Town can fall back on (guaranteed GF/Mafioso, guaranteed Jailor, etc) but if that doesn't help evil winrates enough then this is an option.
Really like you (kinda) said Town just has too much info at their disposal, it's far too easy to confirm people. The only way I can think of to fix that is to make it so there aren't as many guaranteed townies, so the Town doesn't know who to trust. "Jack Sparrow claims Invest, there's no CC, but there's no guaranteed TI - do we trust him?" kinda stuff.
Obviously with both of these you'd increase the amount of debating time before votes can be cast, so Town has some chance to work through the data and find low-skilled evils. I'd also add in a "vote to skip" button to the talking time, and a dedicated "abstain" button to the voting screen, and increase anti-AFK protection. Not sure how long AFK players are banned for, but if it's not an hour I'd make it an hour, and if it's 1 hour+ I'd increase it buy an hour, because honestly AFK evils not only seem to be more of a problem than a good Town, but it's not fun for Town either.
I’ve played with Skimm once but I was playing on my phone and it died lol 😞
You probably got reported for "leaving" that happened to me once but I was in my laptop
I think that's a fair report, because you still left your teammates and you could have prevented the leave if you were paying attention to your battery
KII-OOO Jotobbb I was a exe lol
Christine Cao worst think with playing on phones, is that the game has a horrible tendency to crash, throwing you from the game. I’ve had many games where I was a role I liked, or evil, but the app crashed and I was kicked off of it
EdgeofABlade yeah I was playing with my cousins and I was Jester and it just suddenly crashed lol
Holy crap dude this was epic
haven't watched a skimm ToS game for ages, damn the games changed, and skimms also gotten so much more jaded and fed up. lot has changed
I think town needs less occupation of the role list in order to give evils some more presence, personally would change the role list to remove some of the random town spots and/or get rid of the 2nd town investigative slots(though in order for this to be most effective would require the removal of the 4 mafia maximum rule).
What if they had a transcript role for mafia and town or just one. it would work by you pick one target and if they type you get a “log” of they chat of what they said and the other people that talked at marked with a line so you don’t see their name?
I don't play that game a lot but I feel like a lot of town roles is just too powerful. Mafioso can't even choose the target if GF is alive and not jailed. I think that based on how powerful the roles are (maybe by some survey sent to Master rank players) there should be a tier list of roles and, every game there would be, let's say 1 top tier role, 2 medium tier roles and the rest could be whatever. Also Mafioso should be reworked. Maybe he could have hidden pistol with one bullet that he could use on whoever he wants the night he gets sent to kill. This way, Mafioso would get more independence and mafia might be a little more powerful in early game being able to take two targets the same night to cause some chaos. I feel like mafia on the high level can't work fast enough to oppose all the TI's and TS's and unless NK kills some townies, it's hard to overpower a well organised town.
Itd be nice to have a maf role that can multiple kill as well. Like pest, if you go to someones house, you have a chance to infect half the town if they are visiting that player.
So maybe a mafia role like... I dunno.. Someone that blows up a whole household and it gets anyone visiting or something.
17:26 That could possibly be helpful for mediums to put info in will quickly
"I'm confirmed NOT Escort" C'mon Skimm
If we compare this game to Throne of Lies, evils in ToL have:
- Conversions and possessions, so no one is ever fully confirmed.
- Day abilities that allow them to bleed people, silence them, etc.
- A plethora of interesting night abilities.
- Kill abilities that go through blocks and protections.
- 2-3 Neutrals in every game, with many of them able to make the game pretty chaotic (trollboxes, frames, etc.). Other Neutrals like Alchemist or Sellsword can be really helpful to evils.
Evils in ToS, in comparison, have:
- No conversions or possessions, so once someone is confirmed, they remain confirmed for the rest of the game. Disguiser used to be able to possess, but that was removed.
- No day abilities (for anyone). That makes it much more difficult to derail conversations.
- Mafioso, GF and ALL neutral evils have no night ability except for killing, which isn't too interesting. It also makes faking a role much more difficult.
- Can't kill through a doctor or bodyguard, so you can't kill dangerous roles early.
- Neutrals aren't too useful to evils and mostly do their own thing.
how does he get the different looking wills and things
Love Ur Videos Man!
an easy way to make evil better is stopping d1 chat, u cant confirm all the town with just going on jailer
Skimm you got salty for the jailor actually saving your life there... That was a bit tough to watch you get so upset for no real reason... Maybe a LITTLE bit of hubris with that flex on phoenix? Like no need to get so defensive and pissy...
"It's a bold claim Cotton lets see how it plays out?" Funny movie quote mixed with this game.
Whats your favorite role in tos mine is invest i always carry or i die n2 bc of jailer bc i called out maf d2
I feel we should bring back the old role list with neutral benign and any, gotta love that chaos especially when sometimes vampires showed up as any.
BMG just has a magic system that when you’re maf or neut, you get the worst teammates, a stacked town and your allies leave or die early. When you’re town, you get noobs and complete idiots and trolls. That’s my only explanation
I understand your frustrations
Actually skimm do you know why they like to add two ti in most modes, my theory is two ti working together can confirm most town, here is what I'm saying
Spy- can confirm certain mafia roles but can also confirm some town roles.
Lookout- if lookout visits someone and the person they visit dies, they can call out said evil role, also effective in finding sk n1, however they cannot confirm arsonist, only the spy can.
Sheriff- can find someone who maybe framed as suspicious but downside the nerf only gives them susp or not susp
Investigator- Can find out if someone is framed or doused.
However each of these ti roles also has disadvantages which is why there is usually two.
Investigator- While I said they can find someone who is framed or doused, the invest can't tell the difference between if someone is framed or doused between framer or arsonist so they can easily find the veteran. Also same thing in a transporter game, if someone is transed they get the result of the person that was transed and often has to ask if there is a transporter
Sheriff- like investigator, can be fooled in a transporter game, for instance if they investigate someone and the person is transed the sheriff may confuse them as being susp
Spy- while it is the most effective ti role in some regards and they can easily confirm most town roles and can also find out about certain mafia roles, having to whisper about mafia visits is also hard they are also ineffective on finding most nk unless mafia attacks them.
Lookout- can easily find some town roles which is very helpful, it's also the only role that can find out if certain roles are capable of visiting, for instance: Suppose a lookout visits Mario and we find out Luigi visited him and Mario claims transed we know Luigi is transporter then.
ooooh the zoom in on the chat. Looks nice to me :)
It triggers me that he keeps the names open so we can’t see the names
Yay town of Salem again!!!
Omg i was in your game and i didnt even notice omg i luv you 😂😂 i was James Bayley btw
They should take some notes from the coven role list and revamp mafia.
that was a pretty cool scum read
It could also be seen as 'real Spy didn't have fake Spy visited because real Spy was jailed'. As bad as Jailor was, you would of died had he not jailed you.
OK so pretty sure that the bmed defense message is “I am blackmailed.” With a period, you should be able to instantly tell Parrot is lying.
9:13 Yakos needed to correct his will after seeing that his will didnt match up with the will of the bmer. He should have also been killed for beeing bad
If I Owned ToS To Make The Evil Roles (And The Entire Game In General) More Fun I Would Add More Roles. For Example I Would Add A Mafia Version Of The Transporter (The Transport Message Would Be Different To Not Make It Too OP) This Would Force Jailors To Not Claim Day 1. I Also Feel Like A Mafia Role That Can Disguise Others As Different Roles (Maybe It's A 1 Time Use Where The Role Can Disguise Any Player As A Mafia Role For The Entire Game). I Would Also Add A New NK Called Something Like Ice Wizard That Can Kill By Freezing People Every Other Night (Maybe The Ice Wizard Is Only Available In Coven Mode, Also When Someone Is Frozen You Have To Wait A Day For The Ice To Melt Before Their Role And Will Is Revealed As It'd Be Stuck In The Ice).
You May Not Agree But Personally I Think This Would Make The Game More Fun!
Can You Please Stop Writing Like This?
ImOneOfThem Nope, Im Not Gonna Change The Way I Type Just To Suit Your Views!
Also There's A Ton Of People Who Type Like This
ImOneOfThem This Is A Totally Perfect Way To Write, And Is Grammatically Correct. It Definitely Doesn’t Look Weird At All.
How is the interface different for you? Mine is still the old one
Kevin Mossa it’s a beta I’m pretty sure
Oh ok! How do you join the beta version haha.. it’s probably a stupid question
@@woofkidd its on the steam or mobile version.
What a game skimm ggwp ur the best scum readers xD
I once had a game in all any that literally was 1 maf and 14 town and the town sucked so badly the maf made it to final 3
Invest is my favourite role cuz I played this one game and scum read the entire mafia that town thought I was consigliere
Bmer also changed n1 bug results on stand how did no one catch that
I was just watching and got a notification
Making retri neutral chaos that can res any role.
What if they added an NC retri-like role (like the escort/consort) that ressed people and changed their win conditions? So you couldn't trust retri's anymore, bc a ressed doc may now win with the mafia, but no one would know.
Bree Duncan but everyone will know the role and if town has majority then the person rezzed will just be hanged.
@@geo-em That's the kind if creativity BMG needs
Noone said anything about the interface change?
wtf when did the new layout get released?
When did they change the design?
If that exe was smart he could have made a quick fake spy will, and said that he bugged the "spy" and saw he was blackmailed. Make a fake will and point at Skimm as being the BM'r instead. Now, it might not have worked, but it would have seriously screwed with town and removed a potential "confirmed" live townie.
1. They need to rework broken town support roles. (retri,trans,escort,mayor) they're immediately confirmable and whenever there is more than one in a game town almost can't lose.
2. Take one town investigative and change it to be RT. (more claim space.) Or better yet. Add neutral benign or even an any.
3. Finally give nuetrals there own win conditions that align with mafias interest but dont rely on mafia to win (kill x amount of town) and don't pit them against mafia so that evils can win with maf
To make this game more fair for mafia, I would say they should change the role list so that it’s more unspecific. For example, instead of Jailor, 2 TI, 1 TP, 1 Tk, 1 TS, 3 RT, The 4 mafia, and the two neutrals, I think it should be something like: At least 1tp or 1 Tk, Jailor, At least 1 Ts or Ti, and then 5 RT, the 4 mafia, and two neutrals.
Well, Skimm... when I get annoyed with my games, I step away for awhile and come back. Maybe it's time to take a vacay from ToS? No matter what, your followers will still follow. We love you. :)
Honestly getting rid of ret would help a TON. It confirms at the very minimum 2 roles and swings in towns favor way too heavily.
Or steal an idea from ToL and allow mafia to recruit once a game or something
First of all i would rework framer, disguiser and forger into usefull roles.
Forger will recieve multiple extra notepads to write fake claims on. Also Forget visits will not be seen by spy or lookout.
Framer will recieve only 3 frame charges. But whoever they frame will be seen as a different mafia role. (Framer/Vamp/Jest) (Vig/Vet/Maf) (Bg/Gf/Arso) etc.
So you have a doc claim, which is framed, an invest checks it and bam, Lookout Forger Witch. (And framer can choose as which role they frame them. Think of the hypno's list of choices, but for the framer as a role list for frames).
Disguiser would also get 3 disguises only. But they will keep the disguise of their last visited target. regardless off how many nights pass.. even if exed in jail, they would still be disguised.
And finally, Godfather cannot be randomized by Jester haunt. (They can be specifically selected, because else a jest knows who the GF is and can tell a medium) But when randomizing they can never land on the GF.
These changes should give mafia a significant boost.
In turn to make NK more viable.
For the WW: If you visit a WW rampaging at home, your will will be cleaned. So if a sheriff check WW on WW night the sheriff will die and their will torn to shreds.
For the SK: If you get visited by a member of the mafia, you will kill that mafia member AND your selected target, (exceptions being consort which would force you to kill consort only and not also your selected target).
For the executioner / jester i would give them a 1 time use disguise lasting one night. So for example an exe claiming LO can disguise for one night as a LO to give themselves more credebility if checked). A jester can disguise themselves as maf or NK or something in order to make them appear even more suspisious for one night. (This should fool Town Invest roles, Coven Leader/Witch/Consiglere should still see the real role (and maybe also the disguised role)).
As for the other roles (including coven roles) i wouldnt really change much.
I swear the whole town had a negative iq score
New evil roles and new/better abilities for the evils.
Maybe if maf disconnects/leaves, mafia can recruit a townie for each DC'd maf? Kinda like how vamps can bite a townie and convert. I think most maf plays are ruined when maf just leaves right away, without even trying. I feel especially bad for NKs tho. They almost never win, especially WW and arso.
I'm confirmed not escort. nice quote
Skimm: we should have lost this game no one was listening or paying enough attention
Jailor who saved his life and letting him ultimatley win the game for town: ima jail skimm tonight instead of the bmer
the Jailor sucks actually. They can jail the real evil but instead jailing skimm. Maybe it's just coincidental for skimm to be attacked so Jailor's mistake kinda saves skimm's life
@@AgateChew ik the towns stupidity lead to skimms carry lol
@@aaronphillips6698 yeah.
@@aaronphillips6698 He called out one evil and ignored chat for most of the game. How is that a carry?
was there a new revamp to the game?
Jailor saved you, it was a good play.
They should allow Mafia who are not killing roles to visit each other. It would be a harder read to see who is mafia from spy but a risky play for mafia giving up plays against town.
Early squad!!! Hoping i can play with you one day, Skimm!! :)
Hella late but I think if a disg disguises a person as like, a townie, and jailor selects the disguised, it should jail the townie. Right now there isn't aot of counter play to being jailed so sometimes you just lose to luck with that.
how do you get town of salem mobile on pc?
you scrolled right past phoenix’s vet claim lmao
Didn't hey not notice that Herbert didn't have rbed bug on the Jailor when he first posted his will? He added it after you posted that you rbed the Jailor lol and had to quickly re post since he forgot to recopy it with the update
Also for night 3 yakos had to add Caterpie to his will since he apparently missed it he was a terrible spy never posted a will or claim day 2 just said "okay no will get the spy claim" "he's not bmed" had he posted a will after the guy claimed bmed then he would probably have been lynched or executed as a jest suspect
will you by any chance try out werewolf online?
i was retri once and decided to revive bg on n2 cause i thought i'd die. n2, i got RB'ED BY THE BLOODY ESCORT AND DIED BY MAFIA WHAT KIND OF LUCK
Hey, I'm not sure if you get this question a lot but how is Medi? Do you keep up with her?
Nah man that jailor on you was 5 billion IQ
When he was in jail he said he was confirmed NOT escort lol
what is the version of the game skimm is playing?? why does it look completely different??
How do you feel about the update to the ui?
Eh
I support the idea of changing the game so that nobody can visit the same person 2 nights in a row. It would open the game up for evils to be able to counter the jailor claim day 1 tactic. More of a mind game of is someone on this person or not....
Mafia needs some buffs, and maybe make confirming some roles harder or make it harder for town roles to use their abilities correctly (like killer roles that give false results or something )
Why does the games graphics look super different