Such a shame that Beeching's shortsightedness caused the loss of the nation's great train network. My old neighbour in Keyworth is a huge train buff and told me about how the station was much bigger in Nottingham than it is currently. Thanks for the photos too and that helps visualise where things are on the map. After nearly 20 years away from the town, even some of the photos look new to me!
It wasn't Beeching... It was Marples. Ernest Marples was Minister for Transport at the time Beeching released the first of two now infamous reports, this one being called "The Reshaping of British Railways". Now, Marples was a Transport Minister with a significant conflict of interest: he and his family/friends owned shares in a tarmac company. Railways don't use tarmac. So yet again, an accomplished physicist (which is who Dr. Beeching was. He was no railwayman) took the blame for something that was really the Government's fault... Now where have I heard that before?
@@mastertrams I agree with you. The culprit here was Marples. Beeching was simply his puppet who took the flack, and kept on track to close down as much of the railways as possible to force goods transportation onto the roads against all opposition. Marples and his wife both had strong vested interests in, along with support and promotion of road transport. After making their millions, Marples was had up for tax evasion, and fled to France to avoid imprisonment. I wonder how many Victorian artisans turned over in their graves at the demise of the railways on account of these two. I reckon even Queen Victoria herself.
A train station that should NEVER have been demolished,and that we in Nottingham need more now than ever before.Londoners fought against Beeching, who had planned to demolish St Pancras station, and they won.We tried in Nottingham, and lost.The story of the building of Victoria station is a fascinating one.The amount of Navvies that built it and the demolition of the earlier buildings and streets to build the Victoria station is equally fascinating.We’ve lost a lot of history in Nottingham.Nottingham City council have a lot to answer for😡
@@drt1605 It should have been demolished. It was on a line which was rightly closed due to low traffic, and the land was needed for more important things.
If you look through railway magazines of the steam era, even up to the mid-sixties, you will see that photos of Victoria Station outnumber those of the Midland station by a substantial margin. There was also a much greater variety of traffic at Victoria, most of which quite simply disappeared under the Beeching Report. Until c1959, you could apparently stand on the bridge in Upper Parliament Street to watch trains, although this was later obscured by commercial development. In the late nineteenth century, the city's businessmen were unhappy that Nottingham lacked a central railway station, and encouraged the building of Victoria in 1900, and its opening was seen as a major celebration. The city's then existing stations, Midland and London Road, were well south of the central area. As long as the station was under LNER or Eastern Region control, it would have been safe. Unfortunately, BR, under its "one city, one region" rule, transferred most of the GC Main Line to the London Midland Region early in 1958. From the beginning of 1960, there were just three trains to London, taking three hours, with numerous stops. From 1963, these trains were sometimes formed of non- corridor stock in summer, so that the corridor stock could be used on summer extras. The first time I visited the city, in 1972, not knowing which railway company owned which station, I was expecting to find a station in the heart of the city, with a tunnel at each end. Instead, I saw a huge development called the Victoria Centre. I also noticed, on the fringe of the centre, two viaducts, but no trains. (This was probably Weekday Cross Junction, but I cannot confirm.) After some searching, I found a smaller station, nearly a mile south. When visiting Nottingham two years later, I discovered that there was no early evening train to Sheffield; the only way north was via Derby! The Great Northern also benefited from Victoria Station. Until 1900 GN trains had to leave an east-facing terminus, and use the Nottingham Suburban Railway.
Two years after the Beeching Report, Nottingham Chamber of Commerce publicly announced that there was no need for any railways in the city at all. In 1962, when closure of the GC Main Line was first mooted, the East Midlands TUCC made it clear that Victoria would remain open, even if the GC closed. Then, in 1965, that same TUCC said that closure of Victoria would cause inconvenience, but not hardship.
Nottingham Victoria railway station was a beautiful building. It was loved and cherished by the people of Nottingham. The station was large and spacious, and had six levels. It was a station the city of Nottingham could truly be proud of, a magnificent feat of Victorian engineering, and built to last. But in a time where all the beauty and majesty the Victorians had created and left us as our legacy was seen as nothing more than old and antiquated, vandals, yes vandals can only describe these people, conspired to destroy without question that beauty the Victorians had created, in the so called name of progress. Such was the case with Nottingham Victoria station. It was turned into the plastic and glass gordy monstrosity known as The Victoria Center, against the wishes of the Nottingham people who complained vehemently. This was supposedly some form of progress into the modern age? What complete and totally unadulterated rubbish. The grand and beautiful building was covered over in glass and plastic, and the once proud and majestic railway station reduced to nothing more than an indoor shopping center, with only the clock tower remaining. How stupid are fools that they cannot see, appreciate, and understand what they already had. What the Victorians had left them as their legacy to be cared for and appreciated in awe by all who came in the future generations. But instead they reduced it to less than nothing. Fools, idiotic stupid bloody destructive fools.
Had it still been there it could have been the St Pancras or Bristol Temple Meads of Nottingham and an amazing space. I lived in Nottingham for 10 years a while ago now and oxygen found it very odd hours the station was a very low key out of the way kind of station that was a bit out of place for a city the size and stature of Nottingham. It would have been better to close the other one and keep the Victoria Station, but as usual those with money knew better.
@@mattpotter8725 It was the trend of the time. Look to Sheffield Victoria. Demolished. Manchester Central, turned into the G Mex Centre. Snow Hill, again demolished and turned into some paltry station halt. Anything Victorian was classed as old and antiquated and not worth saving, but rather something to destroy. Beeching was hand in glove with Marples and the road hauliers. They both wanted freight off the railways and onto the roads. Marples in particular had a vested interest in the roads, and Beeching was his puppet. Marples wife was a consultant civil engineer, and she had her fingers in all the road building projects. Later, having made millions out of that, Marples was had up for tax evasion, and to avoid jail fled to France. But it continued after Beeching and Marples. The S&DJR was closed down by Barbara Castle, then Labour Transport Minister. That whole area that the S&DJR served is now blighted with a huge traffic congestion problem and a public transport nightmare. Just think what Nottingham Victoria could have become. It could have been as big as York Station. Not just a railway station but part of a tramway network too for Nottingham. When Nottingham Victoria closed, and services were cut, there were many living in Worksop that lost their employment in Nottingham. No means of transportation to commute daily. Destroying of Nottingham Victoria Station and the ripping up of the GCR mainline were the biggest acts of modern industrial vandalism ever perpetrated in the UK. But it makes you laugh. The trams were done away with in Nottingham, but now they are back. The GCR mainline would have been the ideal route for high speed channel tunnel services. And the lines Beeching did away with are being in some cases relayed. The Robin Hood line for example. Fools and idiots with no foresight can ever see beyond their balance sheets. The railways needed pruning for sure, but these fools were out for wholesale decimation. You do not prune a bush by cutting it off at its roots. What fools.
@@MrMoggyman You are right, however people then, and still today, in power did (and still do) what benefits themselves and their political backers. There is little to no forethought of what may be good in the future. There probably was a case for the closure of some of the branch lines as they served little purpose and we're no longer profitable, but not on the scale that it happened, because the analysis carried out to judge whether certain lines were profitable was done in such a way to get the outcomes those at the top required. I totally agree having seen many documentaries on the Beeching Cuts that people with vested interests and investments in competing industries were put in positions of power to basically enrich themselves, much like is happening today with multimillion pound contracts just because they are mates of and have direct lines of communication with those in central government. It's corruption, pure and simple and left cities like Nottingham like second class cities, is still in a very odd position on the rail map today I always think. At least Sheffield still has through routes from London to the North (Leeds and maybe even York) whereas as far as I can tell Nottingham is bypassed by the East Coast Mainline when heading further north and is just a final destination in its own right for services from London and you'd have to get a connecting train to go further, maybe I'm wrong. I've lived in both cities and this is the impression I've always had when being a train from each station.
@@MrMoggyman Sheffield Victoria was closed, not demolis- Nevermind, just looked on Google Maps. It was demolished, but the site is still there, and there is still an operational railway running through the site. Even if no trains actually run on it. Oh, and don't make me laugh. GCML even remotely suitable for Eurostar services? The line was speed-limited at 90mph for good reason! It's way too curvy. In fact, the the only straight bit of the line is now being used for HS2. Yes, it would have been nice to keep the line. It would have been useful, beneficial, important. But don't undermine your good arguments with rubbish like that.
Mr Moggyman ~ I fully agree with your remarks. I hated living through the 1960s, and seeing many wonderful railway routes disappearing, and equally terrific stations being smashed up. Most modern stations are boring and even ugly. The Victorians and Edwardians knew how to build things properly.
AMAZING Video!!!!! This was lovely. Nottingham Born and bred, worked Victoria centre flats and even been in the basement where I didn't know trains were once travelling and I still find it amazing that transformation and that we walk around Nottingham with the History of what made it great, right beneath our feet.
No problem. I was exactly two years old when Victoria Train station was being taken down. Chances are, my parents arrived in Nottingham via this station as both of them were from different Cities and Towns. 51 now, I worked for Nottingham City Council for their Housing Department when I was 22 to 32 in differing roles. I was a Mobile caretaker on leave cover when I worked the massive extent of the communal stairs and corridors of what makes up Victoria Centre. A few years later I found myself as a Mobile Caretaker in the basement of those flats again. I've actually mopped the back stairs fro top to bottom. 300 feet worth. I parted company with NCC in 1997
It's a sad fact that the demolition of this station was due to the closure of the entire Great Central Railway eventually. At the formation of British Railways in 1948 they couldn't decide which region to place it in - the one that owned and obviously wanted to support the West Coast Mainline, or the equally self-obsessed region that had the East Coast Mainline. Both starved the GCR of traffic and Beeching just saw it as an isolated mainline that went nowhere that wasn't already served by other mainlines and had little traffic. This completely overlooked the fact that the GCR was built at the end of the 19th century to a much better standard than any other lines in the UK. It was faster and straighter than any of them, and now we're paying a lot of money for a new north-south rail corridor that might not have been necessary had the GCR infrastructure been left in place. As it is, there are chunks missing at Brackley and Rugby and big gaps at Leicester and Nottingham. I don't know much about the route north of Nottingham to Sheffield. At least there will soon be a continuous link from just south of Nottingham to the northern outskirts of Leicester and, like the North Yorkshire Moors Railway, it might be able to provide some public utility in the future, running efficient DMUs for public services between its heritage services. After all, it's a double track mainline, isn't it?
Really helpful visualiser - I wasn't in Nottingham when the Great Central ran, so this really helped me to understand the building and how it fitted into the roads around what is now the Vic Centre - thank you so much !
thats great, very enlightening, it was still extant in my lifetime, and i did work on the railway, twice in fact as a trackman, but as far as l know I never visited the station... much to my regret..
I remember it well, going to town on the trolley bus with my gran seeing steam billowing out of the tunnel mouth then on to Lyons for a drink and cake.
An amazing piece of work. I remember arriving a the station as a child, and being very disappointed to find it had been closed when I visited Nottingham in my late teens. The problem we had was the successive governments since the War used the railways as a cash cow while starving the network of investment, then closed many good lines as well as some that needed closing. The line through Matlock was surveyed on a Bank Holiday Monday when there was no traffic, this being done to support closing the line from Duffield to Buxton. How do I know? A friend of mine worked at the Rowsley sidings as a railway fitter and met the men in bowler hats with their clip boards. Apparently, even they thought it should remain open, but it was not their call. Thanks for the video.
The main line through the Peak District was not even scheduled for closure under Beeching! The only person satisfied by the closure is surely John Ruskin, who thought that Monsal Dale viaduct was a monstrosity.
Great piece of work here to recreate this long lost important railway station (bar the clock tower) and extremely useful line (the Great Central "London Extension"). Such narrow-minded and shortsighted decisions made in the 1960s', this could easily have provided the HS2 route of today that instead is going to cost billions of pounds and is unlikely to provide the benefits to this area of the country. Why at least some of the buildings could not be retained and incorporated (plus possibly even a piece of trackbed to possibly allow reopening) is beyond me, but again, it's always easier to destroy something rather than create it. A serious architectural loss that today would probably not happen. For some reason, the authorities in both Nottingham and Leicester have just gone out of their way to allow the eradication of the Great Central - the only UK railway built to an acceptable "continental" loading gauge.
If you park your car in the red car park in Vicky Centre you can still see the tunnel walls and small tunnel entrance going out under Parliament Street. The smell of the smoke in the bricks is still there.
if you go to the top of The Victoria Centre car park outside and look over the top you can still see the remains of the platforms at the the Mansfield road tunnel end of the old Station, well you could the last time I went up there
Not sure about the Mansfield road end, but if you go into the car park at the Parliament street end there are distinct signs of platforms down the sides of the small 'ante car park' beyond the main area (or were, not been in that part since the refurb began)
its fantastic to see, I fount this really interesting as knew nothing about the station , previous to watching this Video. Great efforts and well made !!
A brilliant representation. However, from my memories, the first section of the main footbridge sloped downwards from the booking hall to the first stairs to platforms 1 to 6.
Thanks Andrew. I wish I had memories of the station to go on, but sadly had to base this on the surviving plans which tend to omit important details like that. Great info, though, I love learning more about the site and chuffed you enjoyed the video :)
This was a superb station - exquisite architecture, superb layout of platforms and trackwork, and the best central city location possible. As for the services provided, the Great Central line (Marylebone- Nottingham- Sheffield, and then on to Manchester London Road (Piccadilly), was the most efficiently-run on British Railways. In addition, the Rugby Central - Banbury link meant that a lot of cross-country trains could serve Nottingham Victoria, eg, Swindon - York. The fact that it closed, along with a giant proportion of Britain’s railways in the 1960s, relates to Dr Richard Beeching being British Railways Board chairman even though he was anti- railway! The station’s gone, rightly mourned.
I don't think he was anti-railway. He was simply doing what he was told to do by Ernest Marples, the tarmac company-owning Minister for Transport at the time. Dr Richard Beeching was a physicist, and if Wikipedia is to be believed, quite an accomplished one. But he took the flack for something that was really the Government's fault.
@@mastertrams Richard Beeching was nothing but anti-railway. He worked hand-in-hand with Ernest Marples, the worst Minister of Transport imaginable. What do you think that the +200,000 railwaymen who lost their careers thought of him, and what so many people in the West of England, East Anglia, the North-East and Scotland’s Southern Uplands thought of his achievements? Don’t forget that in 1965, “Beeching 2” was published, with just a few trunk lines like London to Brighton and London to Manchester to be retained, with some suburban survivors in the London area. The Government finally found some common sense, and rejected it. But the damage was done, leaving us with a truncated, skeletal system much too London-centric. Beeching was responsible (or rather, irresponsible!) for what happened during his chairmanship of the British Railways Board (1961-65); he boasted afterwards, that he would do it all again given the chance. Fortunately, he was not.
@@mastertrams Beeching was nowt but anti-railway, and the men of the industry knew it. When he returned to ICI in June 1965 (the chemical industry - which he did know about), he claimed that his work was done, while government ministers stated that he had been fired. He was an arrogant, greedy person who fitted in well with the 1960s leaders who regarded railways as old-fashioned and unimportant. What madness to have as chairman of an industry someone who wants to demolish much of it! If you think that Beeching wasn’t anti-railway, take note that people in many parts of the country still mourn the loss of branch lines and even trunk routes, and that where some lines have been reinstated (like Nottingham Midland- Mansfield and Worksop) they have been a great success. Railway engineers are today, at snail’s pace, rebuilding the Oxford-Cambridge route, and they know that that, like so many other routes, should never have been abandoned by the “axe-man “ Beeching.
@@robertweissman4850 Oh, I've never doubted that they were wrong to close those branch lines and trunk routes. No-one has. And yes, maybe Beeching was anti-railway. But to lay ALL the blame at his feet is wrong, where Ernest Marples had just as much impact on those closures as Beeching did.
Thank you so much for visualisation. This wonderful station and the Great Central seems to cast a spell over so many people. Even those that never saw it working! The GC is tragic loss in so many ways. Pertinent at this time in 2024 as it it could have been a ready made "HS2". I was only 14 when Victoria closed, so only saw the twilight, but cannot forget for the first time seeing how magnificent it was. A true cathedral to the steam age. I'm also angry how crooked politicians like Earnest Marples and the BR board destroyed so much of our wonderful public infrastructure for a handful of silver.
I walked all the tunnels as a kid it was my backyard- such a shortsighted waste of graft I’m now in Canada and planning to start modelling the entire GCR for myself - this never should have closed they made the same cost closures in Ontario now they’re bringing it back as most of the railbeds are intact.
What a bloody disgrace to have destroyed this fine building. Imagine if the fine building in Dunedin in new Zealand were to suffer the same fate the shit would hit the fan., Here in Christchurch,our station was demolished after suffering major damage in the 2011 earth quake. But the station wasn't being used for it's main purpose. The building was being used as multiplex cinema and a hands on science place " science alive". The new station is now situated on the site of the Addington workshops.still a shame none the less to have lost this magnificent building. I'm sure the citizens of Nottingham would have felt the same about Nottingham Victoria.
And I can assure you, the shit did hit the fan! The people of Nottingham vehemently protested against the closure of Nottingham Victoria Station. But nobody was listening to them. All the powers were concerned with was the money that was going to be generated by the so called 're-development'. The clock tower remains. The rest turning into an indoor shopping center covered in plastic and glass. Shocking despicable industrial vandalism of the worst kind.
Credit where it's due to Midland Station, it does have that quaint historic feel. Much better than Euston or Manchester Piccadilly. Even if Victoria is long gone, Nottingham still has a slice of history in town.
I've only known about the former existence of this station for around a mere 6 months, having learnt about it through the Bachmann Times model railway magazine. It amazed me as to the size of it, so far from a major city. I was sickened to see how British Rail destroyed it, and can't help but wonder if, aside from the Great Central Railway being a closure recommendation from Beeching, if someone from the old LMS/Midland Railway may have had a long running "dislike (for some silly reason) of the GCR, and so went with Beeching's recommendation. Either way, you have produced a very interesting video. :-)
I'm delighted you enjoyed the video but I agree, it's incredibly sad scenario overall. There are still clues around Victoria Centre to the site's past that are worth investigating.
A really good piece of work but again one of Victoria's unique features not included- beneath the platforms was a network of tunnels and lifts linking the platforms- they were used to allow staff to deliver parcels and mail to the relevant train. When I was a student I spent one summer doing this
seem to think it was the Summer of 1962 the one thing that I remember was that we got £15 a week -the year before worked loading Lorries at John Players for Five pounds a week!
@@TheMikeweb05 Hi Mike, do you remember much about the sub-system of the station? We'd love to get in touch and ask you some questions if you'd be interested! Thanks.
If the tunnels are still there, it would make a fantastic stop for a new tram line towards Sherwood under Vic Centre.. almost a Nottingham Underground!? Can't imagine anyone going for the loss of all those parking spaces though :-/
True, but one's in use; the southbound tunnel now carries heating pipes from the London Rd incinerator to Viccy Centre and St Anns as part of the distric heating scheme. The northbound one -- as far as I know -- is still there, but heavily sealed.
An interesting video. However, I have a couple of criticisms to make. One, The blue lines are RAILWAY LINES and not TRAIN TRACKS. Two, it is a SIGNAL BOX not a SIGNAL FITTERS HUT. It’s a shame that the magnificent train shed roofs were not represented. I have vague childhood memories of Victoria Station. A bit gloomy in places but a huge space. As already mentioned, the first section of footbridge from the booking hall definitely did slope down.
@@nottinghasm The image shown, looks just like a signal box, and is an appropriate size and location for one. However we can only speculate unless someone has photos or definite memories.
Loved it. A shame passenger numbers meant it had to close down. No-one would dream of building an umpteen storey blocks of flats these days. If anything Victoria Station would have had a revival, with the emphasis today on public transport. Ah well. I've had plenty of good shopping experiences at the Victoria Centre. I suppose it had to go.
It wasn’t passenger numbers but deliberately mismanaged pulling trains to other routes away from Victoria itself and not issuing diesel locomotives mostly labour governments and unions that caused the Beeching closures
chrisg1947 sorry, but Nottingham Midland has better approach routes compared to Nottingham Victoria. The double track tunnel to the southern end would limit the number of trains that could use Victoria.
Wonderful video. Music, graphics but above all the pace of it ...brilliant work. Be lovely if other disapeared stations - Liverpool Central, Glasgow St Enoch or LeicesterCentral say - got similar videos made?
Thank you, Jim, really appreciate the feedback. I agree about the other stations, but for me personally Nottingham and its history are my motivation. I wouldn't be able to give anywhere else the TLC it would deserve I'm afraid!
I was 4 years old when they started demolishing Nottingham Victoria… My Parents and large parts of my extended family regularly catches trains from there and even though I was only 4, my Dad would look in on the destruction of this iconic building by taking us there, my brother and I, and I do remember the wrecking balls knocking it down. What came after was an horrible eyesore. The people who earmarked this beautiful building for demolition and those incredible canopies at the front. Should be tried, found guilty and jailed for destroying our precious heritage. Nottingham, the city of my birth, is far poorer for it!
What a terrible station and duplicate line with tiny passenger numbers. Not needed at all. Beeching was correct to recommend this should be demolished.
@@blooga3941 They did downsize it. They retained the south section which was useful and had good passenger numbers. Other sections were also retained for freight and industry.
@@PreservationEnthusiast exactly it had good passenger numbers if they were short on money all they needed to do was demolished the freight side of the station but only keep the platforms rather than demolish an architectural masterpiece 😧
@@robtyman4281 What I say is correct. It wasnt needed. The area is now a shopping centre which was needed. The definition of trolling is not "anything which you dont happen to agree with". I made a perfectly valid and erudite comment.
Such a shame that Beeching's shortsightedness caused the loss of the nation's great train network. My old neighbour in Keyworth is a huge train buff and told me about how the station was much bigger in Nottingham than it is currently. Thanks for the photos too and that helps visualise where things are on the map. After nearly 20 years away from the town, even some of the photos look new to me!
It wasn't Beeching... It was Marples. Ernest Marples was Minister for Transport at the time Beeching released the first of two now infamous reports, this one being called "The Reshaping of British Railways". Now, Marples was a Transport Minister with a significant conflict of interest: he and his family/friends owned shares in a tarmac company. Railways don't use tarmac. So yet again, an accomplished physicist (which is who Dr. Beeching was. He was no railwayman) took the blame for something that was really the Government's fault...
Now where have I heard that before?
@@mastertrams Thanks for the correction.
@@mastertrams I agree with you. The culprit here was Marples. Beeching was simply his puppet who took the flack, and kept on track to close down as much of the railways as possible to force goods transportation onto the roads against all opposition. Marples and his wife both had strong vested interests in, along with support and promotion of road transport. After making their millions, Marples was had up for tax evasion, and fled to France to avoid imprisonment. I wonder how many Victorian artisans turned over in their graves at the demise of the railways on account of these two. I reckon even Queen Victoria herself.
A train station that should NEVER have been demolished,and that we in Nottingham need more now than ever before.Londoners fought against Beeching, who had planned to demolish St Pancras station, and they won.We tried in Nottingham, and lost.The story of the building of Victoria station is a fascinating one.The amount of Navvies that built it and the demolition of the earlier buildings and streets to build the Victoria station is equally fascinating.We’ve lost a lot of history in Nottingham.Nottingham City council have a lot to answer for😡
Absolutely agree, great points. Thank you for commenting on the video, too, it means a lot.
@@drt1605 It should have been demolished. It was on a line which was rightly closed due to low traffic, and the land was needed for more important things.
If you look through railway magazines of the steam era, even up to the mid-sixties, you will see that photos of Victoria Station outnumber those of the Midland station by a substantial margin. There was also a much greater variety of traffic at Victoria, most of which quite simply disappeared under the Beeching Report. Until c1959, you could apparently stand on the bridge in Upper Parliament Street to watch trains, although this was later obscured by commercial development. In the late nineteenth century, the city's businessmen were unhappy that Nottingham lacked a central railway station, and encouraged the building of Victoria in 1900, and its opening was seen as a major celebration. The city's then existing stations, Midland and London Road, were well south of the central area. As long as the station was under LNER or Eastern Region control, it would have been safe. Unfortunately, BR, under its "one city, one region" rule, transferred most of the GC Main Line to the London Midland Region early in 1958. From the beginning of 1960, there were just three trains to London, taking three hours, with numerous stops. From 1963, these trains were sometimes formed of non- corridor stock in summer, so that the corridor stock could be used on summer extras. The first time I visited the city, in 1972, not knowing which railway company owned which station, I was expecting to find a station in the heart of the city, with a tunnel at each end. Instead, I saw a huge development called the Victoria Centre. I also noticed, on the fringe of the centre, two viaducts, but no trains. (This was probably Weekday Cross Junction, but I cannot confirm.) After some searching, I found a smaller station, nearly a mile south. When visiting Nottingham two years later, I discovered that there was no early evening train to Sheffield; the only way north was via Derby!
The Great Northern also benefited from Victoria Station. Until 1900 GN trains had to leave an east-facing terminus, and use the Nottingham Suburban Railway.
Two years after the Beeching Report, Nottingham Chamber of Commerce publicly announced that there was no need for any railways in the city at all. In 1962, when closure of the GC Main Line was first mooted, the East Midlands TUCC made it clear that Victoria would remain open, even if the GC closed. Then, in 1965, that same TUCC said that closure of Victoria would cause inconvenience, but not hardship.
I love this video, photo's and the incredible music, by one of England's greatest musicians, born and bred in Nottingham, Rosie Abbott!
Nottingham Victoria railway station was a beautiful building. It was loved and cherished by the people of Nottingham. The station was large and spacious, and had six levels. It was a station the city of Nottingham could truly be proud of, a magnificent feat of Victorian engineering, and built to last. But in a time where all the beauty and majesty the Victorians had created and left us as our legacy was seen as nothing more than old and antiquated, vandals, yes vandals can only describe these people, conspired to destroy without question that beauty the Victorians had created, in the so called name of progress. Such was the case with Nottingham Victoria station. It was turned into the plastic and glass gordy monstrosity known as The Victoria Center, against the wishes of the Nottingham people who complained vehemently. This was supposedly some form of progress into the modern age? What complete and totally unadulterated rubbish. The grand and beautiful building was covered over in glass and plastic, and the once proud and majestic railway station reduced to nothing more than an indoor shopping center, with only the clock tower remaining. How stupid are fools that they cannot see, appreciate, and understand what they already had. What the Victorians had left them as their legacy to be cared for and appreciated in awe by all who came in the future generations. But instead they reduced it to less than nothing. Fools, idiotic stupid bloody destructive fools.
Had it still been there it could have been the St Pancras or Bristol Temple Meads of Nottingham and an amazing space. I lived in Nottingham for 10 years a while ago now and oxygen found it very odd hours the station was a very low key out of the way kind of station that was a bit out of place for a city the size and stature of Nottingham. It would have been better to close the other one and keep the Victoria Station, but as usual those with money knew better.
@@mattpotter8725 It was the trend of the time. Look to Sheffield Victoria. Demolished. Manchester Central, turned into the G Mex Centre. Snow Hill, again demolished and turned into some paltry station halt. Anything Victorian was classed as old and antiquated and not worth saving, but rather something to destroy. Beeching was hand in glove with Marples and the road hauliers. They both wanted freight off the railways and onto the roads. Marples in particular had a vested interest in the roads, and Beeching was his puppet. Marples wife was a consultant civil engineer, and she had her fingers in all the road building projects. Later, having made millions out of that, Marples was had up for tax evasion, and to avoid jail fled to France. But it continued after Beeching and Marples. The S&DJR was closed down by Barbara Castle, then Labour Transport Minister. That whole area that the S&DJR served is now blighted with a huge traffic congestion problem and a public transport nightmare. Just think what Nottingham Victoria could have become. It could have been as big as York Station. Not just a railway station but part of a tramway network too for Nottingham. When Nottingham Victoria closed, and services were cut, there were many living in Worksop that lost their employment in Nottingham. No means of transportation to commute daily. Destroying of Nottingham Victoria Station and the ripping up of the GCR mainline were the biggest acts of modern industrial vandalism ever perpetrated in the UK. But it makes you laugh. The trams were done away with in Nottingham, but now they are back. The GCR mainline would have been the ideal route for high speed channel tunnel services. And the lines Beeching did away with are being in some cases relayed. The Robin Hood line for example. Fools and idiots with no foresight can ever see beyond their balance sheets. The railways needed pruning for sure, but these fools were out for wholesale decimation. You do not prune a bush by cutting it off at its roots. What fools.
@@MrMoggyman You are right, however people then, and still today, in power did (and still do) what benefits themselves and their political backers. There is little to no forethought of what may be good in the future. There probably was a case for the closure of some of the branch lines as they served little purpose and we're no longer profitable, but not on the scale that it happened, because the analysis carried out to judge whether certain lines were profitable was done in such a way to get the outcomes those at the top required. I totally agree having seen many documentaries on the Beeching Cuts that people with vested interests and investments in competing industries were put in positions of power to basically enrich themselves, much like is happening today with multimillion pound contracts just because they are mates of and have direct lines of communication with those in central government. It's corruption, pure and simple and left cities like Nottingham like second class cities, is still in a very odd position on the rail map today I always think. At least Sheffield still has through routes from London to the North (Leeds and maybe even York) whereas as far as I can tell Nottingham is bypassed by the East Coast Mainline when heading further north and is just a final destination in its own right for services from London and you'd have to get a connecting train to go further, maybe I'm wrong. I've lived in both cities and this is the impression I've always had when being a train from each station.
@@MrMoggyman Sheffield Victoria was closed, not demolis- Nevermind, just looked on Google Maps. It was demolished, but the site is still there, and there is still an operational railway running through the site. Even if no trains actually run on it.
Oh, and don't make me laugh. GCML even remotely suitable for Eurostar services? The line was speed-limited at 90mph for good reason! It's way too curvy. In fact, the the only straight bit of the line is now being used for HS2.
Yes, it would have been nice to keep the line. It would have been useful, beneficial, important. But don't undermine your good arguments with rubbish like that.
Mr Moggyman ~ I fully agree with your remarks. I hated living through the 1960s, and seeing many wonderful railway routes disappearing, and equally terrific stations being smashed up. Most modern stations are boring and even ugly. The Victorians and Edwardians knew how to build things properly.
AMAZING Video!!!!! This was lovely. Nottingham Born and bred, worked Victoria centre flats and even been in the basement where I didn't know trains were once travelling and I still find it amazing that transformation and that we walk around Nottingham with the History of what made it great, right beneath our feet.
Thank you! I'd be keen to ask you more about your time in Victoria Centre flats.
No problem. I was exactly two years old when Victoria Train station was being taken down. Chances are, my parents arrived in Nottingham via this station as both of them were from different Cities and Towns. 51 now, I worked for Nottingham City Council for their Housing Department when I was 22 to 32 in differing roles. I was a Mobile caretaker on leave cover when I worked the massive extent of the communal stairs and corridors of what makes up Victoria Centre. A few years later I found myself as a Mobile Caretaker in the basement of those flats again. I've actually mopped the back stairs fro top to bottom. 300 feet worth. I parted company with NCC in 1997
Awesome info. If you have 5 mins pop me an email please (even just a blank one) so we can chat more - nottinghasm [at] live [dot] co [dot] uk
It's a sad fact that the demolition of this station was due to the closure of the entire Great Central Railway eventually. At the formation of British Railways in 1948 they couldn't decide which region to place it in - the one that owned and obviously wanted to support the West Coast Mainline, or the equally self-obsessed region that had the East Coast Mainline. Both starved the GCR of traffic and Beeching just saw it as an isolated mainline that went nowhere that wasn't already served by other mainlines and had little traffic. This completely overlooked the fact that the GCR was built at the end of the 19th century to a much better standard than any other lines in the UK. It was faster and straighter than any of them, and now we're paying a lot of money for a new north-south rail corridor that might not have been necessary had the GCR infrastructure been left in place. As it is, there are chunks missing at Brackley and Rugby and big gaps at Leicester and Nottingham. I don't know much about the route north of Nottingham to Sheffield. At least there will soon be a continuous link from just south of Nottingham to the northern outskirts of Leicester and, like the North Yorkshire Moors Railway, it might be able to provide some public utility in the future, running efficient DMUs for public services between its heritage services. After all, it's a double track mainline, isn't it?
Really helpful visualiser - I wasn't in Nottingham when the Great Central ran, so this really helped me to understand the building and how it fitted into the roads around what is now the Vic Centre - thank you so much !
That covered so many of my questions about the station - Thank you to those involved
Really interesting video to see how things used to be, really good models to show how things where, great video.
Thanks so much :)
Interesting presentation.
thats great, very enlightening, it was still extant in my lifetime, and i did work on the railway, twice in fact as a trackman, but as far as l know I never visited the station... much to my regret..
Superb work, such a shame it was replaced with, what can as best be described as the dump that is Victoria Centre.
I remember it well, going to town on the trolley bus with my gran seeing steam billowing out of the tunnel mouth then on to Lyons for a drink and cake.
An amazing piece of work. I remember arriving a the station as a child, and being very disappointed to find it had been closed when I visited Nottingham in my late teens. The problem we had was the successive governments since the War used the railways as a cash cow while starving the network of investment, then closed many good lines as well as some that needed closing. The line through Matlock was surveyed on a Bank Holiday Monday when there was no traffic, this being done to support closing the line from Duffield to Buxton. How do I know? A friend of mine worked at the Rowsley sidings as a railway fitter and met the men in bowler hats with their clip boards. Apparently, even they thought it should remain open, but it was not their call.
Thanks for the video.
The main line through the Peak District was not even scheduled for closure under Beeching! The only person satisfied by the closure is surely John Ruskin, who thought that Monsal Dale viaduct was a monstrosity.
Great piece of work here to recreate this long lost important railway station (bar the clock tower) and extremely useful line (the Great Central "London Extension"). Such narrow-minded and shortsighted decisions made in the 1960s', this could easily have provided the HS2 route of today that instead is going to cost billions of pounds and is unlikely to provide the benefits to this area of the country. Why at least some of the buildings could not be retained and incorporated (plus possibly even a piece of trackbed to possibly allow reopening) is beyond me, but again, it's always easier to destroy something rather than create it. A serious architectural loss that today would probably not happen. For some reason, the authorities in both Nottingham and Leicester have just gone out of their way to allow the eradication of the Great Central - the only UK railway built to an acceptable "continental" loading gauge.
If you park your car in the red car park in Vicky Centre you can still see the tunnel walls and small tunnel entrance going out under Parliament Street. The smell of the smoke in the bricks is still there.
if you go to the top of The Victoria Centre car park outside and look over the top you can still see the remains of the platforms
at the the Mansfield road tunnel end of the old Station, well you could the last time I went up there
The platforms are no longer visible as far as I know, just the archway :(
Not sure about the Mansfield road end, but if you go into the car park at the Parliament street end there are distinct signs of platforms down the sides of the small 'ante car park' beyond the main area (or were, not been in that part since the refurb began)
its fantastic to see, I fount this really interesting as knew nothing about the station , previous to watching this Video. Great efforts and well made !!
Brilliant stuff - thanks for this. Will show my dad who remembers the old station
R. I. P Nottingham Victoria station
A brilliant representation. However, from my memories, the first section of the main footbridge sloped downwards from the booking hall to the first stairs to platforms 1 to 6.
Thanks Andrew. I wish I had memories of the station to go on, but sadly had to base this on the surviving plans which tend to omit important details like that. Great info, though, I love learning more about the site and chuffed you enjoyed the video :)
This was a superb station - exquisite architecture, superb layout of platforms and trackwork, and the best central city location possible. As for the services provided, the Great Central line (Marylebone- Nottingham- Sheffield, and then on to Manchester London Road (Piccadilly), was the most efficiently-run on British Railways. In addition, the Rugby Central - Banbury link meant that a lot of cross-country trains could serve Nottingham Victoria, eg, Swindon - York. The fact that it closed, along with a giant proportion of Britain’s railways in the 1960s, relates to Dr Richard Beeching being British Railways Board chairman even though he was anti- railway! The station’s gone, rightly mourned.
I don't think he was anti-railway. He was simply doing what he was told to do by Ernest Marples, the tarmac company-owning Minister for Transport at the time. Dr Richard Beeching was a physicist, and if Wikipedia is to be believed, quite an accomplished one. But he took the flack for something that was really the Government's fault.
@@mastertrams Richard Beeching was nothing but anti-railway. He worked hand-in-hand with Ernest Marples, the worst Minister of Transport imaginable. What do you think that the +200,000 railwaymen who lost their careers thought of him, and what so many people in the West of England, East Anglia, the North-East and Scotland’s Southern Uplands thought of his achievements? Don’t forget that in 1965, “Beeching 2” was published, with just a few trunk lines like London to Brighton and London to Manchester to be retained, with some suburban survivors in the London area. The Government finally found some common sense, and rejected it. But the damage was done, leaving us with a truncated, skeletal system much too London-centric. Beeching was responsible (or rather, irresponsible!) for what happened during his chairmanship of the British Railways Board (1961-65); he boasted afterwards, that he would do it all again given the chance. Fortunately, he was not.
@@robertweissman4850 Oh, I get he was a bad chairman. But I think it is wrong to pile all the blame on him as so many people do.
@@mastertrams Beeching was nowt but anti-railway, and the men of the industry knew it. When he returned to ICI in June 1965 (the chemical industry - which he did know about), he claimed that his work was done, while government ministers stated that he had been fired. He was an arrogant, greedy person who fitted in well with the 1960s leaders who regarded railways as old-fashioned and unimportant. What madness to have as chairman of an industry someone who wants to demolish much of it! If you think that Beeching wasn’t anti-railway, take note that people in many parts of the country still mourn the loss of branch lines and even trunk routes, and that where some lines have been reinstated (like Nottingham Midland- Mansfield and Worksop) they have been a great success. Railway engineers are today, at snail’s pace, rebuilding the Oxford-Cambridge route, and they know that that, like so many other routes, should never have been abandoned by the “axe-man “ Beeching.
@@robertweissman4850 Oh, I've never doubted that they were wrong to close those branch lines and trunk routes. No-one has. And yes, maybe Beeching was anti-railway. But to lay ALL the blame at his feet is wrong, where Ernest Marples had just as much impact on those closures as Beeching did.
Thank you so much for visualisation. This wonderful station and the Great Central seems to cast a spell over so many people. Even those that never saw it working!
The GC is tragic loss in so many ways. Pertinent at this time in 2024 as it it could have been a ready made "HS2".
I was only 14 when Victoria closed, so only saw the twilight, but cannot forget for the first time seeing how magnificent it was. A true cathedral to the steam age.
I'm also angry how crooked politicians like Earnest Marples and the BR board destroyed so much of our wonderful public infrastructure for a handful of silver.
I walked all the tunnels as a kid it was my backyard- such a shortsighted waste of graft
I’m now in Canada and planning to start modelling the entire GCR for myself - this never should have closed
they made the same cost closures in Ontario now they’re bringing it back as most of the railbeds are intact.
Keep me posted on the modelling please! Thank you for commenting, too :)
What a bloody disgrace to have destroyed this fine building. Imagine if the fine building in Dunedin in new Zealand were to suffer the same fate the shit would hit the fan., Here in Christchurch,our station was demolished after suffering major damage in the 2011 earth quake. But the station wasn't being used for it's main purpose. The building was being used as multiplex cinema and a hands on science place " science alive". The new station is now situated on the site of the Addington workshops.still a shame none the less to have lost this magnificent building. I'm sure the citizens of Nottingham would have felt the same about Nottingham Victoria.
And I can assure you, the shit did hit the fan! The people of Nottingham vehemently protested against the closure of Nottingham Victoria Station. But nobody was listening to them. All the powers were concerned with was the money that was going to be generated by the so called 're-development'. The clock tower remains. The rest turning into an indoor shopping center covered in plastic and glass. Shocking despicable industrial vandalism of the worst kind.
Lovely video. Helped me see where every thing was.
Louise Walford I'm chuffed! I could never picture the layout myself and this was half the reason for making the video :-)
Credit where it's due to Midland Station, it does have that quaint historic feel. Much better than Euston or Manchester Piccadilly.
Even if Victoria is long gone, Nottingham still has a slice of history in town.
Awesome video, excellent work mate!
I've only known about the former existence of this station for around a mere 6 months, having learnt about it through the Bachmann Times model railway magazine. It amazed me as to the size of it, so far from a major city. I was sickened to see how British Rail destroyed it, and can't help but wonder if, aside from the Great Central Railway being a closure recommendation from Beeching, if someone from the old LMS/Midland Railway may have had a long running "dislike (for some silly reason) of the GCR, and so went with Beeching's recommendation. Either way, you have produced a very interesting video. :-)
I'm delighted you enjoyed the video but I agree, it's incredibly sad scenario overall. There are still clues around Victoria Centre to the site's past that are worth investigating.
Excellent video guys
Thank you.
A really good piece of work but again one of Victoria's unique features not included- beneath the platforms was a network of tunnels and lifts linking the platforms- they were used to allow staff to deliver parcels and mail to the relevant train. When I was a student I spent one summer doing this
Good point. I couldn't find a plan of the underground delivery tunnels and lifts. What year was it that you did that job?
seem to think it was the Summer of 1962 the one thing that I remember was that we got £15 a week -the year before worked loading Lorries at John Players for Five pounds a week!
@@TheMikeweb05 Hi Mike, do you remember much about the sub-system of the station? We'd love to get in touch and ask you some questions if you'd be interested!
Thanks.
@@TheMikeweb05
£15 a week was very good pay for unskilled labour in 1962.
Did it include overtime as well as Sunday premium?
Great video. ....👍
Amazing video so much had changed
Hello from Kansas🇺🇸
If the tunnels are still there, it would make a fantastic stop for a new tram line towards Sherwood under Vic Centre.. almost a Nottingham Underground!? Can't imagine anyone going for the loss of all those parking spaces though :-/
True, but one's in use; the southbound tunnel now carries heating pipes from the London Rd incinerator to Viccy Centre and St Anns as part of the distric heating scheme. The northbound one -- as far as I know -- is still there, but heavily sealed.
That would of made a good underground metro station.
Good point Adam. We have trams in Nottingham now and the infrastructure that was removed could've served the trams very well. Short sighted.
An interesting video. However, I have a couple of criticisms to make. One, The blue lines are RAILWAY LINES and not TRAIN TRACKS. Two, it is a SIGNAL BOX not a SIGNAL FITTERS HUT. It’s a shame that the magnificent train shed roofs were not represented. I have vague childhood memories of Victoria Station. A bit gloomy in places but a huge space. As already mentioned, the first section of footbridge from the booking hall definitely did slope down.
Thank you for watching! 👍🏻 'Signal fitters hut' is how it was labelled on the original plan for the station.
@@nottinghasm
The image shown, looks just like a signal box, and is an appropriate size and location for one.
However we can only speculate unless someone has photos or definite memories.
Loved it. A shame passenger numbers meant it had to close down. No-one would dream of building an umpteen storey blocks of flats these days. If anything Victoria Station would have had a revival, with the emphasis today on public transport. Ah well. I've had plenty of good shopping experiences at the Victoria Centre. I suppose it had to go.
Sad indeed. Thanks so much for your comments.
It wasn’t passenger numbers but deliberately mismanaged pulling trains to other routes away from Victoria itself and not issuing diesel locomotives mostly labour governments and unions that caused the Beeching closures
Cool vid mate!
should never have closed Victoria if anything should have closed Midland instead
chrisg1947 sorry, but Nottingham Midland has better approach routes compared to Nottingham Victoria. The double track tunnel to the southern end would limit the number of trains that could use Victoria.
Victoria was a shite station limited by tunnels and space. It was correct to smash it down with a wrecking ball and build a shopping centre.
The Victoria’s were less productive than midlands
Better still,keep them both open
If they kept it then we wouldve had to deal with shitty Broadmarsh shopping centre, had no Vic centre and we probably wouldnt have the trams
What a waste of a wonderful station.
Remember it well- a terrible loss.
Wonderful video. Music, graphics but above all the pace of it ...brilliant work.
Be lovely if other disapeared stations - Liverpool Central, Glasgow St Enoch or LeicesterCentral say - got similar videos made?
Thank you, Jim, really appreciate the feedback. I agree about the other stations, but for me personally Nottingham and its history are my motivation. I wouldn't be able to give anywhere else the TLC it would deserve I'm afraid!
NG Nottinghasm
I hope you saw the two summer 2017 issues of railway magazine. Two-part feature on Nottingham Victoria - some great pictures
No I didn't, but going to track 'em down now! :D
...what about the original Birmingham Snow Hill? ....would like to see this done for that.
I was 4 years old when they started demolishing Nottingham Victoria… My Parents and large parts of my extended family regularly catches trains from there and even though I was only 4, my Dad would look in on the destruction of this iconic building by taking us there, my brother and I, and I do remember the wrecking balls knocking it down. What came after was an horrible eyesore. The people who earmarked this beautiful building for demolition and those incredible canopies at the front. Should be tried, found guilty and jailed for destroying our precious heritage. Nottingham, the city of my birth, is far poorer for it!
Criminal. Could have been the St Pancras of Nottingham..
Agreed.
Definitely
fantastic well done did have to mute the piano @ 1:15 so annoying
Can u please give me the sketchup file? I will help you render in vray.. it will be good for presentation
My email is bharatsays200041@gmail.com
the old atchitects seemed to have much more imagination then they do dtoday, so bland, functional ,and prosaic nowadays
Terminology. Not a signal fitters hut! A Signal Box for signal men, please.
Peter Heath I used the term from the original station plan 😊
O.K., a bit bizarre though!
Put it back 😢
What a terrible station and duplicate line with tiny passenger numbers. Not needed at all. Beeching was correct to recommend this should be demolished.
It was build when it was needed, instead of getting rid of it though they should have downsized it.
@@blooga3941 They did downsize it. They retained the south section which was useful and had good passenger numbers. Other sections were also retained for freight and industry.
@@PreservationEnthusiast exactly it had good passenger numbers if they were short on money all they needed to do was demolished the freight side of the station but only keep the platforms rather than demolish an architectural masterpiece 😧
P.E - What a complete troll you are. Horrible individual.
@@robtyman4281 What I say is correct. It wasnt needed. The area is now a shopping centre which was needed. The definition of trolling is not "anything which you dont happen to agree with". I made a perfectly valid and erudite comment.