Kierkegaard is actually what kept me in the Christian faith. I read Fear and Trembling in college (actually in a class with Suan Sonna, whom I am sure you know). I was really struggling with my Calvinist/Southern Baptist faith at the time and his "leap of faith" really kept me from falling into complete shambles. A couple years later, after a long journey much like your own, I took a new (and more sturdy) "leap" and joined the Catholic Church and haven't looked back! My Faith has increased by x100 in ways I could never have imagined. I am so thankful!
Kierkegaard is hilarious, he would have been a comedian in the modern times. Our last great philosopher truth tellers, the comedian laughs at all,his dispair.
you might enjoy Cornelio Fabro's work on Kierkegaard. He was a Thomist Italian priest of the last century who loved Kierkegaard and thought many people got him wrong.
Austin, I'm in this position you're talking about...between cities , no gas...cant go back to protestantism because well, once that bell's been rung it cant be un-rung.....just you wait until that first baby of yours is born ..... the angst and frustration exponentially increases. To be responsible for your own soul is one thing, but to decide if and when and by whom your child is baptized, chrismated and communed.... having my first child is what initiated me going down the " who has authority" rabbit hole.... God have mercy . I love your content, thank you!
Man, remember the good ol’ days when we had ecclesial certainty? Childhood was amazing in more ways than one. Sometimes, I wonder if I would be better off if I just shut down my brain.
As a theologian with conviction about the "Truly, I say to you, unless you turn and become like children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven" verse... I often agree with that thought. Theology is important for the minds of humanity. Yet, it has generated justifications for profound divisions in the body of Christ.
Thank you for your candidness, Austin. It's clear your quest for ecclesial certainty hasn't been easy, but I pray you reach your destination. God bless you, brother!
I got lost in the first half but the second half felt more clear. I like the question of if the church is an object of our faith. I'll need to chew on that for a while. I grew up Protestant but started getting interested in Catholicism and orthodoxy. Now found myself in a split between nonresistant "nondenominational" (despite that option not truly existing) and orthodoxy.
This feels like a warm embrace from a mentor saying, “I understand your confusions and doubts, and I want you to lean into that doubt and ask Jesus once again to show himself.” Thank you!
Man, you just nearly perfectly described the place I'm in right now. You were able to articulate my own thoughts and feelings better than I could myself. Sincerely, thank you
Something that has helped me was to humble myself and understand that these decisions are as much if not more spiritual than they are intellectual. Going to God with authentic humility asking him to direct my steps alongside spiritual decernment has been instrumental in my journey. To sum it up, trust the Lord, test run the faith of the church your investigating in its most normal form, pray, and see if it yields a Godly fruit. Praying for you.
I seriously can’t tell you how timely and relevant this video was for me. I feel the same way-Christ is my Rock, and the Church… well… ask me in 5 to 10 years (just kidding… I hope). As a kid, I always thought the world was black and white, but only by God’s grace does He reveal which shades of gray are truly white or black. As I search and learn all that I can, seeking the true (or at least, the most genuine) ancient roots to graft my family into, it’s a relief to know I’m not the only one who feels that, on certain topics, an ecclesial 'leap of faith' seems necessary. Thank you for making this video.
Beautiful honesty all around. Just like a pointillist painting, sometimes what seem like shades of gray are actually just very specific instances of black and white, seen from a distance. If faith in the Church is similar in anyway to faith in Christ, flowing forth from Faith in Him as it were, then we should expect reasonability, but not full certainty, otherwise it would no longer require faith. Therefore, place your uncertainties regarding the Church on Christ. If in seeking the truth with honesty, we should be thwarted in our intellects, our trust in Christ will supply for our deficiencies.
It's nice to see that me and my Fiancé are not the only ones in the world going through this. You get caught in this theological no man's land that leaves you feeling disoriented and disconnected from those around you. We have enough convictions in our reformed baptist church where all of our relationships now feel like people are only trying to "save" us and disappointed in our search. Meanwhile, people also seeming concerned for our wedding in January and even alluding to it not being good to do. We feel like we are alone in this entirely. What we thought was a pursuit for truth and Jesus has resulted in broken relationships and misplaced judgment. Our middle ground as of late is attending Catholic Mass on Wednesday and our home church on Sundays. I remind myself that before they hated me, they hated Him.
I just discovered your channel and I really appreciate everything you said. I’ve been on a similar journey recently and have found Christian Existentialism to be very comforting. I’ve started getting into Kierkegaard and now wanna look into Camus. Btw keep doing what you’re doing. I see a few different comments trying to convince you that the Orthodox Church will solve all your problems. It might, and if it does that would seriously be great, but in the meantime, thank you for shining a light on this issue that some of us really resonate with.
The Orthodox Church has a lot to offer a seeker who is willing to rest. To trust the Church and engage in the practice of the faith. But for those who are determined to keep looking and grasping for certainty and will never be settled until they find it, they’re not going to find it here either.
This issue has caused suicidal ideation out fear of getting it all wrong. Currently reading Kierkegaard and I find him compelling. So ready to let it all go but I love Christ too much. Honestly think I need to stop listening to anybody on UA-cam. Sharing this only because I feel very alone. Anyway, good video thank you
1 Corinthians 14:33 - “For God is not the author of confusion but of peace”. I highly doubt God will send a genuine believer in His Son to Hell because they didn’t comb through enough historical texts or UA-cam debates to find all the correct answers. It doesn’t seem like you’ve found peace, but anxiety. Find rest in Jesus Christ, and go from there. I’m sorry you’ve been going through a tough time. I’m praying for you.
Hey you're not alone my friend. I have struggled with a similar thing with suicidal thoughts because of the uncertainty of life and faith. It gets better. If you have the ability to seek counseling I would highly recommend doing so. #1 thing to remember is that God loves you and you can trust him no matter what anyone says. Praying for you and may God bring you peace.
I relate a lot to this video. It is so counter-intuitive for many of us to think this way because the outcomes feel very black or white (heaven or hell), and so we feel our decision should also be a black-or-white rigid calculation. But working through OCD has taught me that what God expects us to trust in is Himself, not our own logic, yet at the same time we are still expected to use logic and reason in some way. More than anything I want an easy answer, no anxiety, and no struggle. I want to follow God, and I want certainty on how to do that. Instead what God offers me is a promise, "Seek and you will find," and an instruction, "Trust in the LORD with all your heart." One other thing I'll add. It feels very odd that most people who make a leap of faith in this area are pretty evenly split between roman catholicism and eastern orthodoxy, churches that consider each other anathema (generally speaking). That concerns me and I can't really describe why. BTW, I love philosophy.
Great video. I’m 63 and for many many decades I’ve been someone who happily stepped away from the edge, lol. I’m a Christian church member, practicing, but I consider myself a “Christian Pantheist”. I’m very much at peace following Christ but also allowing and incorporating other faiths/ideas/spiritualities into my practice. I don’t have a need (as I once did in my young adulthood) for religion to all make sense and somehow become a unified, logical “whole”.
Thank you! A relevant concept I explore is that, because Jesus is LITERALLY The Truth, the truth cannot be possessed by us. The Truth is the totality of everything, so cannot be extracted into a separate part. So there can't possibly be a single institution "has" the Truth.@@dinkledork4421
Through God's providence and infinite wisdom he has put me in a reformed evangelical church in the heart of the most atheistic city in the country. I may have moments where I consider going high church but I believe God put me in this very devout and theologically robust church for a reason, and hope I can serve it as best I can. (also please do more philosophy you're pretty great at it)
Thank you. This view helps me if only in that it reminds me I'm not alone in feeling this way. Also the reminder I don't need absolute certainty is much needed 😅
Strange thing... Existentialism helped me to redevelop a stronger sense of faith.. Existentialism, Kabbalah, The Talmud The Philokalia ( A Greek Orthodox book of wisdom from the Saints) 1 thing that help to inform and change me was a book called The Orthodox Way by Kalistos Ware I read this book and it helped to deal with some of these questions... Things like who God is...who you are A Lot of wisdom in this book. The Way Of A Pilgrim...another Orthodox classic.
Tough. I drifted to agnosticism. But I am beginning to think it’s not forever. I can never go back to Protestantism…I feel like the fruit of individualism that it has born bears witness to a fundamental flaw, so I could never sincerely embrace it without a nagging feeling (to put it lightly) that I have done so out of convenience. Not to mention knowing that I would feel like I was living a budget Christianity. On the other hand I struggle with some of the demands of the old denominations, especially Catholicism, to which I converted when I was 18, and the loneliness that I felt there towards the end. Not that agnosticism fixed that. IDK.
I liked to joke we were Protestant Protestants. The kind searching for the “Acts 2 church.” My mother was raised Lutheran, my father Baptist. From there to a “Bible Church,” and, by the time I remembered anything, home churches, some brushes with messianic Judaism (I still make latkes for Christmas) then non-denominational “community” churches, and spending half of my teenage years with Protestants of all stripes. I then spent around 4 collective years during my Catholicism debating with Protestants.
nothing is confusing if you are not forcing yourself to believe in what you're not justified to believe. you can just simply say: "I am not convinced. I don't have sufficient evidence to believe. I don't know"
You are right that you can spend your entire life chasing definitive answers without ever finding that ONE perfect answer to satisfy your judgement. That’s the point though. People get hooked on the process of finding answers and discussing the next new thing or the ancient thinkers with no intention of finding a final conclusion. There’s also fear of making the decision and being wrong, like not getting married because 50% end in divorce. It does come down to FAITH. This is two way Faith. God is Faithful. He is not out to trick us.
I don’t know if you’re a fan of the Indiana Jones movies, but you remind me of Indy in The Last Crusade, confronted with a seemingly insurmountable gap he must cross if he is to save his father’s life, only to find the path was there all along. His perspective just didn’t allow him to see it. Your spiritual journey is your own, Austin. It will be as long or short as you need it to be. Fortunately for us all, God is patient and forgiving.
I thought of going from Protestantism to Orthodoxy as getting the 'big picture' at last and in that sense my decision to convert was simple. Granted, before this I engaged in much puzzling, too.
So many of your videos feel like your speaking to my angst. I appreciate all you do for making us feel better that we don’t know the answers. Have you ever considered having Dr. Staples? I recently bought his book, but it would be great to obtain his perspective on the “true church”from a scholar with his knowledge. Keep it up, Austin.
Austin, I’m sure I’m not breaking any new ground here but maybe at this point it’s best just to simplify. On an intellectual level, you know all there is to know about the various Christian branches. Maybe just pray daily to the Holy Spirit to give you guidance and to point you in the direction you should go and just sit back then and wait for the guidance to come.
One thing I’ve learnt is that intellectual pursuits can only take you so far in this. Call up your local Orthodox Priest and beg him to arrange a 4 night stay for you at Mt Athos. You can content your journey there.
Austin, I have two comments. First, as someone who has actually read a little bit of Camus and Kierkegaard, I understand the absurdity of trying to find the one true Church. Kierkegaard's image of a Knight of faith is someone who transcends the absurd by faith in fear and trembling, which applies to this in that nobody can ever know all of the answers. Submitting yourself to an ecclesiastical authority requires faith of some sort no matter how much research you've done. For instance, you could be extremely learned on justification and have thoroughly read Augustine, the Reformers, Aquinas, Newman's lectures, Trent, etc., and have a certain clarity that avoids this dizzying feeling of having your feet stuck in the ground but leaning off the edge of a cliff. But even with all this research, you may not have the same breadth and depth on an issue like the papacy and all those historical debates, and you will still feel uncertain. However many issues you study, there will always be more issues, more nuances, that you feel like you cannot possibly learn. Entering into the true Church requires faith and there are many people who convert in a much more simple way than others, and that's okay. Second, I was wondering if you have had any discussions with Christian B. Wagner (Militant Thomist). He has some very high quality content on justification, Sola Scriptura, the Magisterium, etc. that has really helped me in my journey into the Catholic Church. He's kind of been meming around in his content more recently, but make no mistake he still gets down to business. He is very read in the Protestant and Catholic scholastics. Might be a great person to talk to regarding Catholic claims. Anyways, thanks for the video and God bless your journey home!
Great video. In my journey I experienced a similar struggle and came to a similar conclusion. I had completely deconstructed and reconstructed. At some point I had to realize that not all the edges were going to be perfect and certain. But i took a leap of faith. The leap I chose was toward the Eucharist and worship. I've never looked back, and never regretted it. The Orthodox Church has all the pieces.
Let me know if I'm getting this wrong, but the most glaring flaw I see in Orthodox theology is the condemnation of the Filioque as a heresy when this was the belief of many Western saints and Fathers, most notably Augustine. It's one thing to say the view is incorrect, another to call it a full blown heresy. How can you reconcile this? To me, it looks like a gaping hole.
@@wynlararinue6866 Aside from the fact the filioque is a very technical debate, the reality is every single ecclesiological position will have difficult dogmas that are either contradictory with later/earlier doctrine, or simply nonsensical. EO might have issues, but there is no position that doesn't.
@@heremtica I don't think there's anything contradictory or nonsensical in Catholicism (though of course I say that as Catholic lol). Yes, there are things in Catholicism that might look like historical contradictions (e.g. apparent reversal on death penalty teaching and salvation outside the Church) but sufficient investigation reveals the contradictions to be only apparent. Call me biased, but I think Catholicism offers an entirely consistent and reasonable worldview.
@@wynlararinue6866 I think Orthodoxy is perfectly consistent. The point of the video is that there are so many things like the filioque that a person can go round and round in circles. Finding new data and never coming to an end. At some point you just got to leap. I'm not going to have a discussion about the filioque in a UA-cam thread.
With all due respect, but in my humble opinion this whole quest for "the One True Church" seems rather misguided to me, because I don't believe there is such a thing at all. Jesus stated plainly in Luke 17:20-21 that the Kingdom of God is not something that you can claim is either here or there... Rather, the kingdom of God is within his people, because it is a spiritual Kingdom, not a physical one. "My Kingdom is not of this world", he also said in John 18. Thus, it follows, wherever true, genuine followers of Jesus are, his Kingdom is also. To claim that any particular institution within this world is the "true" representative of the Kingdom of God would be to go against the very things Jesus thought. The true Church is wherever true followers of Jesus are found. Even if such an institution were to exist, its mere existence wouldn't guarantee that it is the inheritor of God's kingdom... Look at the Old Testament, where the Temple and its priesthood are disowned and destroyed, because of the people's unfaithfulness, despite being instituted by God himself. In the New Covenant, God no longer dwells in any Temple, but rather now, the believers are themselves the Temple of the Holy Spirit, and there is are no more priesthoods, because all believers are meant to be priests in their own right. Far more important than having "true churches" is in my opinion, to have true believers that can commune and have fellowship together. Wherever you have that, you have a true Church.
Arians were sincere followers of Christ, it’s just that their understanding of Scripture is that Jesus is a created being. History and even the present time shows us that truth is a certain direction and we need a guide from God. If historical evidence is not decisive for you on either Catholicism or Orthodox, that’s when you take your leap of Faith. If it was the wrong direction, trust that the Lord will continue to guide you.
@@dreistheman7797 The Arians were wrong because their belief contradicted scripture. Athanasius had to fight for orthodoxy because his view was indeed the Bibical one, despite all the opposition he faced. As long as we have the Scriptures freely available in our hands and we follow them faithfully, we can't go wrong. Small disagreements over sotoriology or church practice are irelevant, how we live our lives by faith is the most important. Even if all churches in the world were to go apostate tomorrow, the faithful believers would still have the Scriptures which they would still be able to follow.
@@legodavid9260 How do you know at that point which side contradicts scripture when both sides have their sound arguments from scripture? Because the college of bishops in communion with the bishop of Rome and guided by the Holy Spirit have ruled it so. Even now Biblical Unitarian Protestants argue for it, and their arguments are logical, from Scripture, though logical does not equal to truth.
The landmark for evaluating and determining the ideal Church is by comparing it to the Church of Acts, which was fully developed and functional as Christ’s Body. We should observe documents such as the Didache, research the writings of Church Fathers, and study the proceedings of ecumenical councils to measure the closeness of modern Churches to the ancient Church. Orthodoxy certainly lands the closest to the bullseye, which unfortunately bares its history of schisms from within. But even so, I personally love the emphasis of Oriental Churches which more satisfactorily embrace ecclesial mysteries, rather than forcibly defining every detail of our infinite and unfathomable God.
I appreciate your authenticity in these videos Austin. My question is, if our relationship with Christ is a matter of faith, wouldn’t the Church which is His body also be of a similar nature?
8:45 I think it’s entirely fitting that we’d have to make a leap of faith to trust the church in the same way we trust Jesus! Why? Because the Church is Christ’s body! We are IN Christ! That is the metaphysical mystery!
I am on a similar journey. My biggest hangup is definitely the Eucharist so obviously I would need to convert because only EO and Catholics have valid Eucharist. I also believe the Keys actually carry valid authority so I am only left with Catholicism. There are things I don't understand and things that I don't believe, but I know those areas are my leap of faith. I will submit to the valid authority of the church that Jesus established.
This is very wise. Everyone who spends a lot of time TRULY seeking which "one true church" is the one true church ends up becoming an existentialist - and therefore Protestant!
The argument against the one true Church is literally the same as Richard Dawkins one less God. You can't believe in a religion because all the other religions also claim to be real. Just because two churches claim to be the One True Church, doesn't mean the One True Church doesn't exist.
Why was it so easy for Ignatius and Co.? He knew exactly what the "true Church" was. And his understanding is still held by Orthodox, Catholic, Oriental, and even some Anglicans. That's like 1.5+ Billion people right?
Interesting video. I found myself in a similar position but one thing I didn’t see you mention was the promise of the Holy Spirit to guide the church in all truth. This guidance is active and for all time not just a point in time. For me, I had to believe there was truth somewhere that can be found or else the promise given by Christ regarding the Holy Spirit was false. That truth also had to be consistent over time and traceable throughout the ages. There’s a good St Vincent of Lerens quote that you’ve probably seen that discusses some of these topics you’re mentioning.
Eastern philosophies like Vedanta seem to have a much better strategy. Western minds focus so much on the world and take the self for granted. But by analyzing the self we can sharpen the lense of perception rather than claiming the distortions we see are in the world when instead they are on the lens. Such as the parable of the spec and log
Austin claims that whether we think the Church is an object of faith similar to Christ is key to whether we take a leap of faith and embrace the teachings of some church, usually RC or EO, as opposed to remaining Protestant or denominationally homeless. I think framing the question in this way unfairly favors Protestantism (not that that was necessarily Austin's intention). Of course we should not have faith in the Church in the same way as we have faith in Christ, God Incarnate and our Savior. However, we can't separate our faith in Christ from our faith in the means by which He reveals Himself to us. If our faith was simply in the Person of Christ, yet we retained a skeptical attitude regarding all sources of knowledge regarding Christ, such as Scripture and Church tradition, our faith would have no content beyond a hyothetical willingness to submit to whatever Christ taught, although we would remain skeptical regarding the actual contents of His teachings. So here's a better way to frame the question: should I only have faith in Scripture as an infallible means of communicating the true teachings of Christ (i.e. Sola Scriptura), or should I also have faith that Christ's teachings are infallibly transmitted by the tradition of some Church (usually RC or EO)? The Protestant option may seem more modest on the surface, but several well known problems quickly emerge. I'll mention two big ones. 1) Scripture is often not as clear as the proponent of Sola Scriptura needs it to be in order to unambiguously define the fundamental doctrines of Christianity; as Austin himself has noted, Arianism, while I would certainly consider it a worse interpretation of Scripture than Trinitarianism, is not an utterly implausible interpretation of Scripture, especially if one thinks Trinitarianism is philosophically untenable. 2) Sola Scriptura also has the problem that Scriptura itself provides good evidence that Christ and His Apostles established an institutionally unified Church with teaching authority. Protestants will argue that this Church fell into error at some point, although they disagree regarding when, and this error justifies their schism. However, the arguments Protestants make against RC and EO teachings are highly debatable, so unless you are deeply convinced that both RC and EO have fallen into serious errors, you should probably submit your own fallible judgments to Church authority and join one of these traditions (I'd argue RC, but that's a different subject).
The leap of faith is not something we make. It's something God makes. God has leaped into humanity in Jesus Christ and brings the faith of Christ for us through the Spirit. All the naval gazing existentialism and philosophical speculation and probabilistic reasoning in the world will never bring certainty. Jesus brings certainty to us and for us so we can see and know the Father and the Church (which is Christ's body) through the eyes of his faith. A faith that never fails. Our faith in our faith is not a place to start. Not even our faith in God. Jesus Christ's own faith is what we must have (and so we do as a gift) to see and know the Father and Christ's Church. ❤
@@Thatoneguy-pu8ty that actually makes zero sense. That’s just larping lol. The Catholic Church reigned for a 1500 years before the confession was even written. The core of what makes something catholic is it being . Universal (Lutherans make up 8 percent of Christianity) holy ( liberalism reigns supreme and has ruined a once great denomination) and apostolic ( Lutherans lost apostolic succession by cutting themselves off from the church, they claim they still have it but since all the churches with actual apostolic connections reject them, they do not) put all that together, and Lutherans are nothing more then wanna be Catholics that are dying to self imposed liberalism
Unpopular option: Protestants create another denomination that looks like a traditional Catholic or Orthodox church in practice and liturgy but without veneration of Mary or icons
I know the Church helps in our spiritual growth but Central to our lives is knowing Christ. Christ says where two or three are gathered, I am in their midst, so the Lord will be present based on our relationship with Him. Some Churches have great liturgies that enhance once worship but I believe even in the apparently dry times our relationship with the Lord is growing. Personally, I have little respect for any Church that emphasizes itself or anything else other than Christ. For this reason I have fellowshipped in many Churches except were the teaching is blatantly otherwise!
@@dreistheman7797 Great and very important question, but subject for another day! Suffice to say that the gospel of Christ our saviour was meant to be known via preaching about Him and is not some guarded mystery only privy to some group of people.
Do u want us to keep on protesting against the catholic church the whole life?? Once mother Teresa of Calcutta have said "if u judge people uve no time to love them", so when protestants dhould start loving its own fellow bretheren??????
Protestants believe that grace comes from faith Orthodox believe that faith comes from grace.( From God) Protestants believe that grace is created. Orthodox believe that grace is uncreated, as God Is uncreated Protestants accept the Filioque Orthodox do not Protestants believe Salvation is being saved Orthodox believe Salvation is Theosis, Union With God ( through participation in His grace) Orthodox And Protestants have different teachings on Salvation and what it means
I don't know why you feel ecclesial angst. You seem to make a lot of these thumbnail titles, of ecclesial anxiety. Why? It's faith. What do you believe? You can make good arguments for every side. It's faith at the end of the day. We'll only find out on judgment day with assurance what was the right and best church to be in.
Just to maybe explain a little bit, I think the reason most people experience this anxiety is that if you got it wrong on judgment day you could go to hell according to some churches. I find that terrifying
@@kylie5741 Yes, but they all make acceptions, don't they? EO say the salvation of the heterodox is still possible. Catholics, since V2, don't believe you even have to be a Christian to be saved. Christ is "the privileged route to heaven." Protestants don't affirm you must explicitly word out "faith alone" for salvation. That you can be saved by faith alone, without knowing it. SO why the anxiety?
I do not think it is relevant to study so much christian denominations. Because everything goes then around the sacraments, the tradition, the scripture, etc. But it is a waste of time in the long run as it does not talk about the Spirit of God. We need to understand the Spirit of Christianity first of all because the letter kills but the spirit quickens. And the Spirit of Christianity is to die to yourself with Chirst so that you may now serve God your Father. It is the sacrifice into God is interested, not the rituals, nor the masses. Read psalm 40 and 50, or Jeremiah 7 and you will see. The sacrifice God wants is your own life offered to Him. Jesus said the one who will keep his commandments is the one he will love and live in him with his Father. So you cannot be a stranger to the Truth if you are obedient to the Gospel as you have died to yourself in baptism, and partakes now to the flesh and blood of the Son of God by surrendering your life to the Father and by so, suffering with Christ.
I agree that what is most pleasing to God is a heart that worships him in spirit and truth, but that in itself does not negate the value of sacraments and rituals. In fact, I would argue that, if you insist upon an anti-ritualistic, anti-sacramental version of Christianity, you distort the actual message of the Gospel. A heart that truly loves God expresses its love by gratefully receiving the sacraments and performing the rituals He's instituted.
Kierkegaard is actually what kept me in the Christian faith. I read Fear and Trembling in college (actually in a class with Suan Sonna, whom I am sure you know). I was really struggling with my Calvinist/Southern Baptist faith at the time and his "leap of faith" really kept me from falling into complete shambles. A couple years later, after a long journey much like your own, I took a new (and more sturdy) "leap" and joined the Catholic Church and haven't looked back! My Faith has increased by x100 in ways I could never have imagined. I am so thankful!
Kierkegaard is hilarious, he would have been a comedian in the modern times. Our last great philosopher truth tellers, the comedian laughs at all,his dispair.
you might enjoy Cornelio Fabro's work on Kierkegaard. He was a Thomist Italian priest of the last century who loved Kierkegaard and thought many people got him wrong.
Austin, I'm in this position you're talking about...between cities , no gas...cant go back to protestantism because well, once that bell's been rung it cant be un-rung.....just you wait until that first baby of yours is born ..... the angst and frustration exponentially increases. To be responsible for your own soul is one thing, but to decide if and when and by whom your child is baptized, chrismated and communed.... having my first child is what initiated me going down the " who has authority" rabbit hole.... God have mercy . I love your content, thank you!
Trust Jesus in His One True Church that is the pillar & foundation of Truth, nothing else compares
Which church is that?@@geoffjs
@@HopeUnknownisn’t it obvious? Lol
Man, remember the good ol’ days when we had ecclesial certainty? Childhood was amazing in more ways than one.
Sometimes, I wonder if I would be better off if I just shut down my brain.
As a theologian with conviction about the "Truly, I say to you, unless you turn and become like children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven" verse... I often agree with that thought. Theology is important for the minds of humanity. Yet, it has generated justifications for profound divisions in the body of Christ.
Thank you for your candidness, Austin. It's clear your quest for ecclesial certainty hasn't been easy, but I pray you reach your destination. God bless you, brother!
I got lost in the first half but the second half felt more clear. I like the question of if the church is an object of our faith. I'll need to chew on that for a while. I grew up Protestant but started getting interested in Catholicism and orthodoxy. Now found myself in a split between nonresistant "nondenominational" (despite that option not truly existing) and orthodoxy.
This feels like a warm embrace from a mentor saying, “I understand your confusions and doubts, and I want you to lean into that doubt and ask Jesus once again to show himself.” Thank you!
Man, you just nearly perfectly described the place I'm in right now. You were able to articulate my own thoughts and feelings better than I could myself. Sincerely, thank you
Something that has helped me was to humble myself and understand that these decisions are as much if not more spiritual than they are intellectual. Going to God with authentic humility asking him to direct my steps alongside spiritual decernment has been instrumental in my journey. To sum it up, trust the Lord, test run the faith of the church your investigating in its most normal form, pray, and see if it yields a Godly fruit. Praying for you.
I seriously can’t tell you how timely and relevant this video was for me.
I feel the same way-Christ is my Rock, and the Church… well… ask me in 5 to 10 years (just kidding… I hope). As a kid, I always thought the world was black and white, but only by God’s grace does He reveal which shades of gray are truly white or black.
As I search and learn all that I can, seeking the true (or at least, the most genuine) ancient roots to graft my family into, it’s a relief to know I’m not the only one who feels that, on certain topics, an ecclesial 'leap of faith' seems necessary.
Thank you for making this video.
Beautiful honesty all around. Just like a pointillist painting, sometimes what seem like shades of gray are actually just very specific instances of black and white, seen from a distance. If faith in the Church is similar in anyway to faith in Christ, flowing forth from Faith in Him as it were, then we should expect reasonability, but not full certainty, otherwise it would no longer require faith. Therefore, place your uncertainties regarding the Church on Christ. If in seeking the truth with honesty, we should be thwarted in our intellects, our trust in Christ will supply for our deficiencies.
Extremely important topic that doesn't get enough serious talk or consideration.
Take the leap. The Truth is found in the Catholic Church and through the most awesome and life creating Mysteries of Christ.
Uncanny timing, Austin. This describes my situation to a T, and I think I know what I need to do. Thank you
It's nice to see that me and my Fiancé are not the only ones in the world going through this. You get caught in this theological no man's land that leaves you feeling disoriented and disconnected from those around you. We have enough convictions in our reformed baptist church where all of our relationships now feel like people are only trying to "save" us and disappointed in our search. Meanwhile, people also seeming concerned for our wedding in January and even alluding to it not being good to do. We feel like we are alone in this entirely. What we thought was a pursuit for truth and Jesus has resulted in broken relationships and misplaced judgment. Our middle ground as of late is attending Catholic Mass on Wednesday and our home church on Sundays. I remind myself that before they hated me, they hated Him.
I just discovered your channel and I really appreciate everything you said. I’ve been on a similar journey recently and have found Christian Existentialism to be very comforting. I’ve started getting into Kierkegaard and now wanna look into Camus.
Btw keep doing what you’re doing. I see a few different comments trying to convince you that the Orthodox Church will solve all your problems. It might, and if it does that would seriously be great, but in the meantime, thank you for shining a light on this issue that some of us really resonate with.
The Orthodox Church has a lot to offer a seeker who is willing to rest. To trust the Church and engage in the practice of the faith. But for those who are determined to keep looking and grasping for certainty and will never be settled until they find it, they’re not going to find it here either.
This issue has caused suicidal ideation out fear of getting it all wrong. Currently reading Kierkegaard and I find him compelling. So ready to let it all go but I love Christ too much. Honestly think I need to stop listening to anybody on UA-cam. Sharing this only because I feel very alone. Anyway, good video thank you
1 Corinthians 14:33 - “For God is not the author of confusion but of peace”. I highly doubt God will send a genuine believer in His Son to Hell because they didn’t comb through enough historical texts or UA-cam debates to find all the correct answers. It doesn’t seem like you’ve found peace, but anxiety. Find rest in Jesus Christ, and go from there. I’m sorry you’ve been going through a tough time. I’m praying for you.
Praying you find peace, and feel free to PM (I’m an intern crisis supporter). 🙏
Hey you're not alone my friend. I have struggled with a similar thing with suicidal thoughts because of the uncertainty of life and faith. It gets better. If you have the ability to seek counseling I would highly recommend doing so. #1 thing to remember is that God loves you and you can trust him no matter what anyone says. Praying for you and may God bring you peace.
I relate a lot to this video. It is so counter-intuitive for many of us to think this way because the outcomes feel very black or white (heaven or hell), and so we feel our decision should also be a black-or-white rigid calculation. But working through OCD has taught me that what God expects us to trust in is Himself, not our own logic, yet at the same time we are still expected to use logic and reason in some way. More than anything I want an easy answer, no anxiety, and no struggle. I want to follow God, and I want certainty on how to do that. Instead what God offers me is a promise, "Seek and you will find," and an instruction, "Trust in the LORD with all your heart."
One other thing I'll add. It feels very odd that most people who make a leap of faith in this area are pretty evenly split between roman catholicism and eastern orthodoxy, churches that consider each other anathema (generally speaking). That concerns me and I can't really describe why.
BTW, I love philosophy.
Great video. I’m 63 and for many many decades I’ve been someone who happily stepped away from the edge, lol. I’m a Christian church member, practicing, but I consider myself a “Christian Pantheist”. I’m very much at peace following Christ but also allowing and incorporating other faiths/ideas/spiritualities into my practice. I don’t have a need (as I once did in my young adulthood) for religion to all make sense and somehow become a unified, logical “whole”.
So good man, you're really helping me think through this too!
I'm writing a book right now to try and address this. Pray for me please 🙏
Would love to read it.
Thank you! A relevant concept I explore is that, because Jesus is LITERALLY The Truth, the truth cannot be possessed by us. The Truth is the totality of everything, so cannot be extracted into a separate part. So there can't possibly be a single institution "has" the Truth.@@dinkledork4421
I feel the same way. Please keep us updated when it’s finished 🙏
Thankyou Austin, wonderful content, much appreciated.
Through God's providence and infinite wisdom he has put me in a reformed evangelical church in the heart of the most atheistic city in the country. I may have moments where I consider going high church but I believe God put me in this very devout and theologically robust church for a reason, and hope I can serve it as best I can. (also please do more philosophy you're pretty great at it)
Thank you. This view helps me if only in that it reminds me I'm not alone in feeling this way. Also the reminder I don't need absolute certainty is much needed 😅
I’m so grateful for the confessional lutheran church I’ve been going to these last months. Glory to our triune God
I've also been going to a confessional lutheran church recently.
@ lets go!!
This is much needed, thank you for it!
Strange thing...
Existentialism helped me to redevelop a stronger sense of faith..
Existentialism, Kabbalah, The Talmud
The Philokalia ( A Greek Orthodox book of wisdom from the Saints)
1 thing that help to inform and change me was a book called The Orthodox Way by Kalistos Ware
I read this book and it helped to deal with some of these questions...
Things like who God is...who you are
A Lot of wisdom in this book.
The Way Of A Pilgrim...another Orthodox classic.
Have you seen the new documentary on Icons? It’s called “The Hidden History of early Christian art”. It’s on the Harmony UA-cam channel.
Tough. I drifted to agnosticism. But I am beginning to think it’s not forever. I can never go back to Protestantism…I feel like the fruit of individualism that it has born bears witness to a fundamental flaw, so I could never sincerely embrace it without a nagging feeling (to put it lightly) that I have done so out of convenience. Not to mention knowing that I would feel like I was living a budget Christianity. On the other hand I struggle with some of the demands of the old denominations, especially Catholicism, to which I converted when I was 18, and the loneliness that I felt there towards the end. Not that agnosticism fixed that.
IDK.
Very honest...I admire that
What type of Protestant were you?
I liked to joke we were Protestant Protestants. The kind searching for the “Acts 2 church.” My mother was raised Lutheran, my father Baptist. From there to a “Bible Church,” and, by the time I remembered anything, home churches, some brushes with messianic Judaism (I still make latkes for Christmas) then non-denominational “community” churches, and spending half of my teenage years with Protestants of all stripes.
I then spent around 4 collective years during my Catholicism debating with Protestants.
nothing is confusing if you are not forcing yourself to believe in what you're not justified to believe. you can just simply say: "I am not convinced. I don't have sufficient evidence to believe. I don't know"
You are right that you can spend your entire life chasing definitive answers without ever finding that ONE perfect answer to satisfy your judgement.
That’s the point though.
People get hooked on the process of finding answers and discussing the next new thing or the ancient thinkers with no intention of finding a final conclusion.
There’s also fear of making the decision and being wrong, like not getting married because 50% end in divorce.
It does come down to FAITH. This is two way Faith. God is Faithful. He is not out to trick us.
I don’t know if you’re a fan of the Indiana Jones movies, but you remind me of Indy in The Last Crusade, confronted with a seemingly insurmountable gap he must cross if he is to save his father’s life, only to find the path was there all along. His perspective just didn’t allow him to see it.
Your spiritual journey is your own, Austin. It will be as long or short as you need it to be. Fortunately for us all, God is patient and forgiving.
Either it is about existence of God, true religion, True Church or about ...the shape of the Earth, it always boils down to the authority question.
I understand you. Follow peace.
I thought of going from Protestantism to Orthodoxy as getting the 'big picture' at last and in that sense my decision to convert was simple. Granted, before this I engaged in much puzzling, too.
Perhaps Gospel Simplicity is at the point of being confused as to why he is still confused.
So many of your videos feel like your speaking to my angst. I appreciate all you do for making us feel better that we don’t know the answers. Have you ever considered having Dr. Staples? I recently bought his book, but it would be great to obtain his perspective on the “true church”from a scholar with his knowledge. Keep it up, Austin.
Austin, I’m sure I’m not breaking any new ground here but maybe at this point it’s best just to simplify. On an intellectual level, you know all there is to know about the various Christian branches. Maybe just pray daily to the Holy Spirit to give you guidance and to point you in the direction you should go and just sit back then and wait for the guidance to come.
Wonderfully insightful discussion. Did you see the documentary by Harmony on Hidden History of Early Christian Art yet?
Great stuff brother
In searching for Theological certainty, I found the application of Mystery in much of Orthodox Theology to be exactly what I was looking for.
This is what draws me there too.
One thing I’ve learnt is that intellectual pursuits can only take you so far in this. Call up your local Orthodox Priest and beg him to arrange a 4 night stay for you at Mt Athos. You can content your journey there.
Austin, I have two comments.
First, as someone who has actually read a little bit of Camus and Kierkegaard, I understand the absurdity of trying to find the one true Church. Kierkegaard's image of a Knight of faith is someone who transcends the absurd by faith in fear and trembling, which applies to this in that nobody can ever know all of the answers. Submitting yourself to an ecclesiastical authority requires faith of some sort no matter how much research you've done. For instance, you could be extremely learned on justification and have thoroughly read Augustine, the Reformers, Aquinas, Newman's lectures, Trent, etc., and have a certain clarity that avoids this dizzying feeling of having your feet stuck in the ground but leaning off the edge of a cliff. But even with all this research, you may not have the same breadth and depth on an issue like the papacy and all those historical debates, and you will still feel uncertain. However many issues you study, there will always be more issues, more nuances, that you feel like you cannot possibly learn. Entering into the true Church requires faith and there are many people who convert in a much more simple way than others, and that's okay.
Second, I was wondering if you have had any discussions with Christian B. Wagner (Militant Thomist). He has some very high quality content on justification, Sola Scriptura, the Magisterium, etc. that has really helped me in my journey into the Catholic Church. He's kind of been meming around in his content more recently, but make no mistake he still gets down to business. He is very read in the Protestant and Catholic scholastics. Might be a great person to talk to regarding Catholic claims.
Anyways, thanks for the video and God bless your journey home!
Austin is home.
Great video. In my journey I experienced a similar struggle and came to a similar conclusion. I had completely deconstructed and reconstructed. At some point I had to realize that not all the edges were going to be perfect and certain. But i took a leap of faith. The leap I chose was toward the Eucharist and worship. I've never looked back, and never regretted it. The Orthodox Church has all the pieces.
Let me know if I'm getting this wrong, but the most glaring flaw I see in Orthodox theology is the condemnation of the Filioque as a heresy when this was the belief of many Western saints and Fathers, most notably Augustine. It's one thing to say the view is incorrect, another to call it a full blown heresy. How can you reconcile this? To me, it looks like a gaping hole.
@wynlararinue6866 that doesn't seem to fit with the discussion of the video
@@wynlararinue6866 Aside from the fact the filioque is a very technical debate, the reality is every single ecclesiological position will have difficult dogmas that are either contradictory with later/earlier doctrine, or simply nonsensical. EO might have issues, but there is no position that doesn't.
@@heremtica I don't think there's anything contradictory or nonsensical in Catholicism (though of course I say that as Catholic lol). Yes, there are things in Catholicism that might look like historical contradictions (e.g. apparent reversal on death penalty teaching and salvation outside the Church) but sufficient investigation reveals the contradictions to be only apparent. Call me biased, but I think Catholicism offers an entirely consistent and reasonable worldview.
@@wynlararinue6866 I think Orthodoxy is perfectly consistent. The point of the video is that there are so many things like the filioque that a person can go round and round in circles. Finding new data and never coming to an end. At some point you just got to leap. I'm not going to have a discussion about the filioque in a UA-cam thread.
With all due respect, but in my humble opinion this whole quest for "the One True Church" seems rather misguided to me, because I don't believe there is such a thing at all. Jesus stated plainly in Luke 17:20-21 that the Kingdom of God is not something that you can claim is either here or there... Rather, the kingdom of God is within his people, because it is a spiritual Kingdom, not a physical one. "My Kingdom is not of this world", he also said in John 18. Thus, it follows, wherever true, genuine followers of Jesus are, his Kingdom is also. To claim that any particular institution within this world is the "true" representative of the Kingdom of God would be to go against the very things Jesus thought. The true Church is wherever true followers of Jesus are found. Even if such an institution were to exist, its mere existence wouldn't guarantee that it is the inheritor of God's kingdom... Look at the Old Testament, where the Temple and its priesthood are disowned and destroyed, because of the people's unfaithfulness, despite being instituted by God himself. In the New Covenant, God no longer dwells in any Temple, but rather now, the believers are themselves the Temple of the Holy Spirit, and there is are no more priesthoods, because all believers are meant to be priests in their own right.
Far more important than having "true churches" is in my opinion, to have true believers that can commune and have fellowship together. Wherever you have that, you have a true Church.
Arians were sincere followers of Christ, it’s just that their understanding of Scripture is that Jesus is a created being. History and even the present time shows us that truth is a certain direction and we need a guide from God. If historical evidence is not decisive for you on either Catholicism or Orthodox, that’s when you take your leap of Faith. If it was the wrong direction, trust that the Lord will continue to guide you.
@@dreistheman7797 The Arians were wrong because their belief contradicted scripture. Athanasius had to fight for orthodoxy because his view was indeed the Bibical one, despite all the opposition he faced. As long as we have the Scriptures freely available in our hands and we follow them faithfully, we can't go wrong. Small disagreements over sotoriology or church practice are irelevant, how we live our lives by faith is the most important. Even if all churches in the world were to go apostate tomorrow, the faithful believers would still have the Scriptures which they would still be able to follow.
@@legodavid9260 How do you know at that point which side contradicts scripture when both sides have their sound arguments from scripture? Because the college of bishops in communion with the bishop of Rome and guided by the Holy Spirit have ruled it so. Even now Biblical Unitarian Protestants argue for it, and their arguments are logical, from Scripture, though logical does not equal to truth.
But I appreciate the post on faith and ultimately taking the "leap" in other areas of your Christian faith.
The landmark for evaluating and determining the ideal Church is by comparing it to the Church of Acts, which was fully developed and functional as Christ’s Body. We should observe documents such as the Didache, research the writings of Church Fathers, and study the proceedings of ecumenical councils to measure the closeness of modern Churches to the ancient Church. Orthodoxy certainly lands the closest to the bullseye, which unfortunately bares its history of schisms from within. But even so, I personally love the emphasis of Oriental Churches which more satisfactorily embrace ecclesial mysteries, rather than forcibly defining every detail of our infinite and unfathomable God.
I appreciate your authenticity in these videos Austin. My question is, if our relationship with Christ is a matter of faith, wouldn’t the Church which is His body also be of a similar nature?
8:45 I think it’s entirely fitting that we’d have to make a leap of faith to trust the church in the same way we trust Jesus! Why?
Because the Church is Christ’s body! We are IN Christ! That is the metaphysical mystery!
I am on a similar journey. My biggest hangup is definitely the Eucharist so obviously I would need to convert because only EO and Catholics have valid Eucharist. I also believe the Keys actually carry valid authority so I am only left with Catholicism.
There are things I don't understand and things that I don't believe, but I know those areas are my leap of faith. I will submit to the valid authority of the church that Jesus established.
This is very wise. Everyone who spends a lot of time TRULY seeking which "one true church" is the one true church ends up becoming an existentialist - and therefore Protestant!
The argument against the one true Church is literally the same as Richard Dawkins one less God. You can't believe in a religion because all the other religions also claim to be real.
Just because two churches claim to be the One True Church, doesn't mean the One True Church doesn't exist.
I'm 75% sure you're trolling.
Why was it so easy for Ignatius and Co.? He knew exactly what the "true Church" was. And his understanding is still held by Orthodox, Catholic, Oriental, and even some Anglicans. That's like 1.5+ Billion people right?
lol Protestantism and existentialism have one thing in common: Cope
Interesting video. I found myself in a similar position but one thing I didn’t see you mention was the promise of the Holy Spirit to guide the church in all truth. This guidance is active and for all time not just a point in time. For me, I had to believe there was truth somewhere that can be found or else the promise given by Christ regarding the Holy Spirit was false. That truth also had to be consistent over time and traceable throughout the ages. There’s a good St Vincent of Lerens quote that you’ve probably seen that discusses some of these topics you’re mentioning.
Which books/chapters does Kierkegaard discuss this?
Personally I'm not looking for a one true church. I just want to find believers in my area I can fellowship with. Good job w/ your hair btw
I found certainty in Agnosticism. It's easy to be certain that you don't know, all it takes is swallowing pride.
One issue is that we in general do not allow ourselves to consider other kinds of evidence. And UA-cam influencers don't give a crap.
Eastern philosophies like Vedanta seem to have a much better strategy. Western minds focus so much on the world and take the self for granted. But by analyzing the self we can sharpen the lense of perception rather than claiming the distortions we see are in the world when instead they are on the lens. Such as the parable of the spec and log
Please start at band called “Ecclesial Angst”
Austin claims that whether we think the Church is an object of faith similar to Christ is key to whether we take a leap of faith and embrace the teachings of some church, usually RC or EO, as opposed to remaining Protestant or denominationally homeless.
I think framing the question in this way unfairly favors Protestantism (not that that was necessarily Austin's intention). Of course we should not have faith in the Church in the same way as we have faith in Christ, God Incarnate and our Savior. However, we can't separate our faith in Christ from our faith in the means by which He reveals Himself to us. If our faith was simply in the Person of Christ, yet we retained a skeptical attitude regarding all sources of knowledge regarding Christ, such as Scripture and Church tradition, our faith would have no content beyond a hyothetical willingness to submit to whatever Christ taught, although we would remain skeptical regarding the actual contents of His teachings.
So here's a better way to frame the question: should I only have faith in Scripture as an infallible means of communicating the true teachings of Christ (i.e. Sola Scriptura), or should I also have faith that Christ's teachings are infallibly transmitted by the tradition of some Church (usually RC or EO)?
The Protestant option may seem more modest on the surface, but several well known problems quickly emerge. I'll mention two big ones.
1) Scripture is often not as clear as the proponent of Sola Scriptura needs it to be in order to unambiguously define the fundamental doctrines of Christianity; as Austin himself has noted, Arianism, while I would certainly consider it a worse interpretation of Scripture than Trinitarianism, is not an utterly implausible interpretation of Scripture, especially if one thinks Trinitarianism is philosophically untenable.
2) Sola Scriptura also has the problem that Scriptura itself provides good evidence that Christ and His Apostles established an institutionally unified Church with teaching authority. Protestants will argue that this Church fell into error at some point, although they disagree regarding when, and this error justifies their schism. However, the arguments Protestants make against RC and EO teachings are highly debatable, so unless you are deeply convinced that both RC and EO have fallen into serious errors, you should probably submit your own fallible judgments to Church authority and join one of these traditions (I'd argue RC, but that's a different subject).
I said a "hail Mary" for ya
You just need a second channel: Church Complexity… and THERE you discuss philosophy and more complicated church theology xD
Austin.... which Orthodox claims are hurdles for you?
Think less about it and pray more about it. In your prayer, talk less and listen more. God will tell you.
The leap of faith is not something we make. It's something God makes. God has leaped into humanity in Jesus Christ and brings the faith of Christ for us through the Spirit.
All the naval gazing existentialism and philosophical speculation and probabilistic reasoning in the world will never bring certainty.
Jesus brings certainty to us and for us so we can see and know the Father and the Church (which is Christ's body) through the eyes of his faith. A faith that never fails.
Our faith in our faith is not a place to start. Not even our faith in God. Jesus Christ's own faith is what we must have (and so we do as a gift) to see and know the Father and Christ's Church. ❤
This recent video from Fr. Josiah Trenham feels relevant to this conversation.
ua-cam.com/video/tHW0IAqqpKQ/v-deo.htmlsi=iaf_ty822bfrBvxK
I have a suspicion that you are becoming EO Austin…
Lutheranism is best it gets imo
Catholicism is just better Lutheranism😉😉
@ Nah. Lutheranism is the Catholic Church. The Augsburg Confession is the confession of the entire church.
@ Lutheranism IS Catholicism.
The faith of Augsburg is the faith of the Catholic Church.
@@Thatoneguy-pu8ty that actually makes zero sense. That’s just larping lol. The Catholic Church reigned for a 1500 years before the confession was even written. The core of what makes something catholic is it being . Universal (Lutherans make up 8 percent of Christianity) holy ( liberalism reigns supreme and has ruined a once great denomination) and apostolic ( Lutherans lost apostolic succession by cutting themselves off from the church, they claim they still have it but since all the churches with actual apostolic connections reject them, they do not) put all that together, and Lutherans are nothing more then wanna be Catholics that are dying to self imposed liberalism
@@Thatoneguy-pu8ty did my response go through?
Just pray about it bro. Sometimes Jesus doesn’t speak to your brain, he speaks to your heart.
pray, read the scriptures, pray some more
Unpopular option: Protestants create another denomination that looks like a traditional Catholic or Orthodox church in practice and liturgy but without veneration of Mary or icons
That already exists in the Church of England
And the Lutheran church gets pretty close
Lutheranism. The way Protestantism was always meant to be.
That can't work. No Apostolic Succession. I have pondered that as well.
@@jessebartunek3195 Nordic and Baltic Lutheranism…. And apostolic doctrine
I know the Church helps in our spiritual growth but Central to our lives is knowing Christ. Christ says where two or three are gathered, I am in their midst, so the Lord will be present based on our relationship with Him.
Some Churches have great liturgies that enhance once worship but I believe even in the apparently dry times our relationship with the Lord is growing.
Personally, I have little respect for any Church that emphasizes itself or anything else other than Christ. For this reason I have fellowshipped in many Churches except were the teaching is blatantly otherwise!
“except where the teaching is blatantly otherwise”. How did you know which were blatantly false?
Interesting perspective, thank you for sharing
@@dreistheman7797 Great and very important question, but subject for another day! Suffice to say that the gospel of Christ our saviour was meant to be known via preaching about Him and is not some guarded mystery only privy to some group of people.
Do u want us to keep on protesting against the catholic church the whole life??
Once mother Teresa of Calcutta have said "if u judge people uve no time to love them", so when protestants dhould start loving its own fellow bretheren??????
Protestants believe that grace comes from faith
Orthodox believe that faith comes from grace.( From God)
Protestants believe that grace is created.
Orthodox believe that grace is uncreated, as God Is uncreated
Protestants accept the Filioque
Orthodox do not
Protestants believe Salvation is being saved
Orthodox believe Salvation is Theosis, Union With God ( through participation in His grace)
Orthodox And Protestants have different teachings on Salvation and what it means
Most protestants believe faith is a gift that comes from God's grace
I don't know why you feel ecclesial angst. You seem to make a lot of these thumbnail titles, of ecclesial anxiety. Why? It's faith. What do you believe? You can make good arguments for every side. It's faith at the end of the day. We'll only find out on judgment day with assurance what was the right and best church to be in.
Just to maybe explain a little bit, I think the reason most people experience this anxiety is that if you got it wrong on judgment day you could go to hell according to some churches. I find that terrifying
@@kylie5741 Yes, but they all make acceptions, don't they? EO say the salvation of the heterodox is still possible. Catholics, since V2, don't believe you even have to be a Christian to be saved. Christ is "the privileged route to heaven." Protestants don't affirm you must explicitly word out "faith alone" for salvation. That you can be saved by faith alone, without knowing it.
SO why the anxiety?
@@giovannivarlí Because "possible" isn't really good enough when dealing with heaven/hell
@@kylie5741 Then you must not believe their claims enough to convert😉 Question answered. Their claims are untenable and should be reformed out of.
I do not think it is relevant to study so much christian denominations. Because everything goes then around the sacraments, the tradition, the scripture, etc. But it is a waste of time in the long run as it does not talk about the Spirit of God. We need to understand the Spirit of Christianity first of all because the letter kills but the spirit quickens. And the Spirit of Christianity is to die to yourself with Chirst so that you may now serve God your Father. It is the sacrifice into God is interested, not the rituals, nor the masses. Read psalm 40 and 50, or Jeremiah 7 and you will see. The sacrifice God wants is your own life offered to Him. Jesus said the one who will keep his commandments is the one he will love and live in him with his Father. So you cannot be a stranger to the Truth if you are obedient to the Gospel as you have died to yourself in baptism, and partakes now to the flesh and blood of the Son of God by surrendering your life to the Father and by so, suffering with Christ.
I agree that what is most pleasing to God is a heart that worships him in spirit and truth, but that in itself does not negate the value of sacraments and rituals. In fact, I would argue that, if you insist upon an anti-ritualistic, anti-sacramental version of Christianity, you distort the actual message of the Gospel. A heart that truly loves God expresses its love by gratefully receiving the sacraments and performing the rituals He's instituted.
First