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- Опубліковано 26 сер 2024
- What's inside a dial-in pacemaker monitor system?
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the coil inductor turns the pacemaker on to put it in data transmit mode and the flat copper piece on top of the inductor coil is the antenna that picks up the data from the pacemaker i know as a fact because i have one of these in my chest!!
You can tell us how the brain really works because you have it in your head, I suppose.
Your antenna opinion is most likely wrong simply because it's connected by the shielding, not by one of the internal wires. Dave could further confirm that by checking that it's just connected directly to the negative.
listen i was just at the dr 2 weeks ago and grilled the st jude rep on how it worked thats what he told me these pacemakers do not have rechargeable batteries they have a 10= year life span the coil inductor activates the pacemaker's data logging the pacemaker spits out data over radio thats what that flat piece is on top is the rf antenna
Joe Schmoe Ah, thanks for that.
It would have been nice to see that medical grade wall wart torn down!
Yeah, I was waiting for that too!
Brant Martin /Me as well....
Alyx McCown Ok, will do another video on that!
Thanks a ton!
I remember Conexant chips were quite common on dial up modem PCI cards back in the early 2000's.
They sure were, I still have several set aside. But I don't miss that particular era, it was one hell of a slow internet. For outrageous prices too, the phone companies sure know how to skin us alive!
I have a Medtronic pacemaker and was given a similar remote monitoring device - some people require check-ins more often, but I only get checked out twice a year - one office visit, and one telephone. The Medtronic runs on 4 AA batteries and does not have the wrist straps. The inductor is basically a RFID type reader that will trigger the pacemaker to transmit data, the monitoring device then sends the data to a central Medtronic database that the doctors can access. The whole process of reading from the pacemaker and dialing into the Medtronic computer and transmitting the data takes about 5 minutes.
I once came across something slightly more exciting to tear down - a Physio-Control Lifepak 5 EKG/defibrillator in working condition with the defib paddles! It had been discarded in a dumpster, was full of water from recent rain, and had not been calibrated/certified in a LONG time according to the sticker on it - but the internal circuit boards were well sealed and it was not damaged. I have not obtained the correct EKG leads for the machine, but using the defib paddles confirmed that it does indeed pick up a heartbeat just fine. Truly some impressive construction inside that thing.
Dave,
I work with these, this is a telephonic reader of the pacemaker's memory and settings/speakerphone for the patient to communicate with the pacemaker clinic during the session. There is a simple ECG telemetry receiver also to send a live tracing during the session. Good one Dave.
It must be a joy to teardown medical equipment, so professional.
The inductor is used to charge the pacemaker. the other part is a antenna that reads the data the pacemaker has to offer.
brian hilligoss I thought inductive charging pacemakers went the way of the Dodo many decades ago?
EEVblog still used as far as im aware, but i thought they were more of a chest strap you wear over a period of time
And i dont think that the antenna would be connected to the shield of the cable, you would pick up all sorts of crap, my guess would be thats acting as a ground layer between the coil and your heart
My only experience with pacemakers were with my grandpals. His charged by a inductor just like in this video. And the pacemaker had a very low power radio that transmitted diagnostics and history info while hooked to the box. This was just a few years ago. It's what the VA used and could of been outdated.
grrrrr i have a pacemaker and this machine the inductor coil is NOT used to charge the device all it does is turn on the device then it transmits data back to the doctor its not rocket science
Stick the scope on the output of the wrist band amps if they are powered or if you can get them powered, you'll have your own heart monitor and measure your internal oscillator
I've just started my first electronics class! Thanks to your videos Dave for making EE so interesting!
This is a bit of a serious device if you think about it. It's designed to connect the heart of a patient who has heart defects to both AC mains and the telecom system.
Not the kind of thing you'd want to buy from China with a "CE mark" PSU ;-)
You mean those China Export stickers ? :D
Very nice. I've got a Medtronics version for my pacemaker. Saves a trip to the doctor every 3 months.
My grandpa uses one of these, but it actually just looks like a regular phone. You can talk with the hand piece like normal, and then you also hold the hand piece up to your chest. I assume the induction coil is just in the hand piece.
I had a constant urge to clear my throat from the 4 minute mark on...
State of the art electronic, but we want to see this medical power supply teardown. Please do a short second part :-)
Domenico Crupi Ok, will do!
EEVblog I wonder how that "medical-rated" power adapter is going to differ from the typical reasonably-engineered power adapter. I am not expecting much of a difference aside from extra isolation from mains and maybe a shunt regulator as a backup in case the PWM regulator overshoots or rings.
Nice work dave always enjoy the teardowns
my father oin low uses the newer versions those comunicate wireless over 433 mhz and back to the hospital over the phone line
but no leeds are needed anymore all the data is send over 433mhz
Suspect the electrode input amplifier section would be some sort of active band pass filter. I recall when I was making my EMG amplifier the frequency range of interest was 50Hz to 200Hz, anything outside this you would want attenuated
ten episodes from now, do a teardown of some vintage tech that was/is absolutely hell to use.
vintage medical equipment
Thank you for posting such great content. I can't wait to see what you're going to tear apart next week.
Those wrist bands look like they came from the Timex Classic Digital watch model number T785879J
Nice job, have been waiting for this teardown, interesting stuff!
excellent tear down
Open the pacemakers! Mike did on his channel and got a nice surprise when he cut one of the welds :)
Pretty cool. Thanks Dave.
Mikeselectric stuff did a teardown of a Medtronic pacemaker a while back. Quite interesting! Implantable defibrillator teardown
Maybe you can salvage the coil and use it for NFC experiments.
I have a little bit of background on this type of electronics having been a contractor for a device maker. The coil reads, and on Guidant devices, could write pacing information to the implanted device. All implanted devices "spoke" their own protocol and none are interchangeable between different manufactures; even some lines were incompatible (latitude and prizm for example). When a device is interrogated and data on implanted device health and, in later models, pacing information and cardiac anomalies are read out. A cardiologist could read the ekg and modify parameters of the device and those would be written back. Devices typically fall in to two categories a pacing device and a defibrillator device. In rare instance you will see both.. One will put out a stream of pulses to keep the heart at a given rate and the other delivers a shock to the heart like you see on TV. As far as I am aware no charging of devices ever took place with a coil/wand. These "wands" were leapfrogged by the Guidant Advanced Patient Management devices which interrogated devices using RF circa 2004.
Hey Dave. You didn't throw a magnet on that little reed bulb in the back. Maybe that's the reason for no action? I would think that the shield of the cable is attached to that finger array to be compliant to grounding regulations. They sure went through a lot of protection with the line isolation. Behind those 2 watt 330k resistors are also some SOT-23 diodes, back to back too. (time 7:30). Probably more so to protect the circuit from spikes. Crack the wall-wart open when you get a chance, it would be interesting to see the build...... Being medical grade and all.(very quick tear down.) Looks like Panasonic FC caps in the base unit? Possibly the same in the wall-wart?
Always enjoy the tear downs! You must have been on a video holiday, seems like a long time since the last.
Mr Carlson's Lab No, the magnet switches the device off when the lid closes.
aptsys So the green wire attached to the shield of the cable isn't providing a form of grounding? I didn't say to the AC outlet! Keeping the oscillating signal in a shielded wire, both for radiation reasons and protection. We can see clearly the plug at the back of the unit at 19:25 and 20:09 going to the power adaptor is only 2 wire. If you think different, what's your take on the finger array in the head, and why is it attached to the shield?
aptsys So I guess in your world, all grounds attach to one place? There are no DC grounds? There are no RF grounds? What is that shield attached to? "A negative plane" Give it up!
aptsys Just can't let it go huh! There are RF radiation guidelines that have to be adhered too. (we all know this, right?) The grounding.... Yes DC grounding of the shield, and RF grounding, (green wire) protects the patient from the two driven wires inside, and so on. ( I'm not wasting my time to look up an ISO # for something so obvious ) But feel free to carry this on :^)
aptsys That was me that gave you the thumbs up, cause your great! also 2 up :^) So anyways, the GREEN wire, the one attached to the shield, what's it's purpose? What is the GREEN wire and shield attached too in the base unit? Ya know, the center pin :^o
Looks like they pulled those wrist straps right out of a standard antistatic wrist band reseller!
EEVblog What's interesting is that in spite of all the "Certified for medical use" wank, these pacemakers can be read and updated without any authentication whatsoever. Extract sensitive medical information, make it give shocks or put it in test mode making the battery run out and fail when the patient needs it. I encourage you to look up Karen Sandler and hear her experiences getting one implanted and trying to figure out what it really does.
I would love to see you talk about a modern motherboard :)
3:06 the pacemaker itself sits near your shoulder, the leads go inside your arteries into your heart.
I have a retired EOTD (End Of Train Device). It was involved in an accident and was recently retired. It has the battery removed for obvious reasons but it does power up and transmits data bursts on 451.5375 MHz. I would send it to you in Australia but the shipping cost may be too high as this thing has some weight to it.
Hey Dave,
You missed some I think interesting: between the wires of the hand-straps on the PCB is ''ECG''. So there schould be some interesting if You try to read out the ADC to get Your own heartbeat.
Beneath that: Thumbs Up! ;-)
WuWo No need to deal with the ADC, just probe the input.
EEVblog
Probe your own heart? would make an interesting story if an agiliant scope found a problem.
Max Bainrot
Yeah, and if so - Dave could make some Dimes selling the rights to advertise with that story ;-).
Max Bainrot
most likely probe the input to the ADC, after all the sensor electronics
It would be interesting to see how the compliance varies with regard to quality of components and design in that power pack / PSU. Compared especially to say, some $4 ebay creation. However I realise you probably have over 9000 items to choose from for teardowns, many other things are probably are more interesting. Keep up the great vids.
Thanx for this one, Dave:)
Those aren't pacemakers Dave! They are spinal cord simulators to help pain I think.
***** Oh ok, haven't looked into it, was going by the mailbag letter.
Thats right but the form factor of the medtronic Itrel3 looks exatly the same as a medtronic adapta pacemaker.
Good video. You need to use a Dremel with a cutoff wheel to open up those pacemakers like a clam shell. There should be a lithium Iodine battery inside. That is another video. :-)
Using the probemaster probes i see dave! Man they're beautiful...
those medtronic pacemakers are made in my hometown in maastricht in the netherlands
IMHO, the finger on the back of the wire loop is some kind of shielding, they're not using a solid copper plane or a copper mesh because they don't want to make a shorted copper loop right under an antenna, that will ruin your antenna.
I believe the strange pattern on the coil cover is a faraday shield.
mikeselectricstuff did a pretty good teardown of a pacemaker.
That speaker driver chip is an LM4860 1 watt power amp. Could you maybe tap it and make it play music? That's what I'd do with this thing.
Awesome video - as always :)
Just to second what Brian Hilligoss said, the coil only reads the pacemaker and i don't think it actually transmits.
Skip Tabor Possibly. But why would you design the pacemaker to continually transmit? Power consumption is key in pacemakers. So I assumed it would be something like an NFC tag type system.
EEVblog I suspect it may be set to transmit info only when the pacemaker is being charged by the inductive coil.
Winston Smith
Well, the pacemakers Mike tore down used a lithium primary cell. More likely, the coil just sends out a signal to tell the pacemaker to transmit. Or maybe that funky copper pattern has something to do with it?
Brant Martin I'm going by the response from Brian Hilligoss posted below who states: "My only experience with pacemakers were with my grandpals. His charged by a inductor just like in this video. And the pacemaker had a very low power radio that transmitted diagnostics and history info while hooked to the box."
EEVblog My pappy's pacemaker was actually powered by Plutonium 238. I'd imagine that would have a constant power output.
*Granted, they were used for a short amount of time (3-4 years IIRC), with only a handful still in use today.
Aren't the "Voodoo" fingers on the white plate the reflector, since it's connected to the shield of the coax. A directional antenna with the coil side held to the patient/pacemaker?
Sound is not up to your regular standards.
FilmFactry Yep, aware of that. Used the new Canon HF G30 camera. Seems it's internal mic is different and has more echo than the HF G10.
Re Yeah. I don't think I had a setting wrong.
EEVblog
it sounds like your mics just to close, we have breathing and clipping, see if you can turn down mic sensitivity
Also, wet throat. The gargling sound while Dave spoke was exceedingly noticeable and tbh made my stomach turn. *vom*
Very cool!
When i seen Conexant chip i knew it's a modem, because i got same chip (but diffrent model) in my old Zoltrix 56k modem ;3 I didn't know about voice codec chip, i looked at it and it has it too.
Dave ..you missed power supply. I would like to see it is as well :)
I'd be careful with newer pacemakers as, IIRC, many are powered by nuclear batteries. I had a few old ones I picked out of a bucket in an abandoned hospital. Yes, a bucket full of pacemakers.
Hey Dave, there's a unpopulated DB-9 socket on the PCB. I think it could be some kind of serial interface. Could you please do some measurement on TX/RX line to see if there's any data flowing? If yes you may connect it to PC.
Would be nice to see what passes the Optocoupler with you connected. ;-)
My mom has a pacemaker and uses a new version of this
Is that a polarizer (at 19:49 ) to shield some EM waves ? I am pretty sure its gonna limit the amount of energy it transmits
Nice, Very interesting video, I am going to send you an email about the wrist straps and cables.
11:01 U1 :ATMEL EEPROM
I think the cardiac symbol means it's defibrillation proof
Medical devices are expensive because they spend so much on design and making a device that is made extremely well both for reliability and continuously performing precisely, and they have to be designed on that high level too to really be considered well made and worth the cost. Attention to all these details I think are completely expected, at least in my eyes it is. I'd guess based on the video that you'd tend to agree too.
Put in the shelf for now. It might come in handy for the last of us after the zombie apocalypse.
ahhh, i was waiting to see power supply teardown....... #disappointed
Ground plane?
What do you do with all this stuff you tore down or was send to you?
Would the isolation be sufficient for a lightening strike to the phone line?
The isolation is mainly supposed to protect from the voltage difference between the arms which is the dangerous bit. Without a class 1 product having a proper Earth outlet wire, it is impossible to prevent the lightning voltage from going through to the patient's body. It is, however, doable to prevent a left/right gradient from being made.
We call it a pacemaker interrogation
do the power supply please
Hi Dave. I hope this is not your new camera you have used. The mircophone is terrible and the image quality has a lot of noise
BMW 3 Series Yes, it is my new HF G30, something seems wrong...
indeed - when it was at 1080p i just lowered the quality since it didn't look much better then 480p.
i thought this aswell, the audio is so sharp, dunno whether hes clipping or what but ive had to set a different eq when i watch his vids at work lately :/
please, teardown more medical devices
Well, send him some medical devices in the mailbag! ;)
dave with your's oscilloscope's u can mace cardiogram ... )
Yeah! Germany! :D
Would have been awesome if you called in... Sir, you are dead! Nooo, I'm alive... Noooo, you're dead!
found : xmodem.org/chipsets/conexant/conexant_smartscm.html
Donate to St, Judes, it is the best Hospital in the world, No child turned away, No charge to any child or child's parents.
Cancer Hospital created by Marlo Thomas father to cure children with cancer.
Looks a lot like Great Ormond Street, only without the support from being part of a government mandated universal healthcare system (GOSH is part of the English NHS) or the royalties from a popular children's book franchise (GOSH were donated the copyright to Peter Pan by the author, a special act of parliament had to be passed so that GOSH's copyrights on Peter Pan would never expire and it wouldn't be the first time that Americans looking to adapt Peter Pan have looked to get out paying royalties)
I put the sensors on my wrists and lets see if it will , oh it's tingling, oh no ahhhh ahhhh i'm getting shocked, ahhhhh shit its defective, I think my heart is gonna explode, ahhhhhhh call ahhh for ahhhhh help ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!
Pacemaker Teardown
Pacemaker Teardown by Eric Wasatonic
Dave, not sure how big St. Jude is? en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St._Jude_Medical
A medical device manufacturer? And here's me thin king they'd be a hospital or some sort of healthcare trust.
GeoNeilUK I used to work for their competitors... these are HUGE companies specializing in invasive treatment for heart arrhythmia patients