Note: This video was recorded before the new Initiative Training rule was revealed by Warlord. However, the load outs of the squad are still very much my recommend way of running your infantry
Historically, the Germans found the second MG42 in a section was a failure. The extra MG meant an initial greater weight of firepower, but the additional weight of the machine gun meant less ammo carried overall by the section (10 rounds weighs around one pound in weight). Less ammo for two weapons, is worse than more for one.
@nickthenoodle9206 True, but to my understanding the only units who consistently carried two mgs per squad were formations like panzergrenadiers, jaegers and gebirgsjaegers where the weight of fire was generally considered more valuable than its sustainability (then again the gebirgs also seem to have generally favoured the mg34 as far as I can tell)
@@rokivulovicstanaccountit was built to a higher quality standard and used more forged and milled components vs stamped sheet metal. MG-42s had more reliability problems and were more prone to parts breakage. The MG-42 also had problems with out of battery detonations (the gun going off without being fully locked and in battery) due to “bolt bounce” caused by its extremely high rate of fire. Forgotten Weapons has good videos on both the MG-42 and MG-34. Check them out if you want to learn more about them. Hope that answers your question! Cheers!
@jonathanbirkeland1085 Thanks for the well thought out answer. I think in part the reliability issue was probably across the board as QA slipped during the war (the STG is a big example of this but late war karabiners can be pretty shoddy too for instance), but as far as how quickly it wore out parts and the issue with bolt-bounce, fair enough, you got me there.
Great advice here - thanks Mordian! And I think you're right about the STGs: that extra 6" doesn't seem like much on a large table, but it is surprising how often it makes a difference. Plus it means that if a rifle section fires at the unit and is in range, you can move and return fire against them and not worry about range, which is nice
4:00 I think this is bending the rules a bit. The book says that the if the NCO dies, another man will take the NCO's place and pick up his weapon. IMO the loader STOPS being a loader and becomes the NCO. So one LMG will fire without a loader.
In this game each model has exactly on role, be it loader, leader, machine gunner, rifleman. Giving a model two functions like loader and leader is therefore highly questionable.
Thanks for this, helpful for a new recruit here. I wouldn’t hate a detailed post like this on how to build off the Battle of Bulge set for both US and Germany. It would be helpful to get some ideas on how to build them out in comparison to the suggestions in booklet and where to go based on that. I know you have a starter box suggestion video but more thinking “next 500-700pts”
personally I wouldn't; since you want your back units doing what you want them to do, if you take them as Shirkers, 1) they always need to take an order test whenever you tell them to shoot, which could be bad, and 2) they count pins as double, so even if they only get shot at once or twice they're unlikely to pass an order test. So I'd probably pass on it; it saves some points, but may not be worth missing a critical activation when you need it.
Just a heads up, I am a subscriber and watch almost every video you put out and this video was never suggested to me, I only found it by looking for a different video on your channel. I don't know if that information is helpful to you, but just in case I thought I would pass it along.
no infantry unit in boltaction is as durable as a 15 man Japanese rifle squad, free fanatics rule, even when taken as inexperienced militia units, with cover saves they are very hard to get rid of.
A version for every army would be good, they've all changed so much (currently having to rebuild my Airborne since they've lost half their weapon choices).
I've just started putting my German Grenadier starter box together, this vid has been really helpful. One question though, I was planning to have atleast one or 2 men with a panzerfaust (depending on squad size). Is this a good idea or not worth the points? I appreciate that for a long range lmg team it probably wouldn't make sense, but what about for assault squads? Thanks!
@@AnthonyPaoliMasakiSays thanks. I was planning to use only what comes in the starter army box until I got to grips with the game and then go from there. So I've got the Heavy anti-tank gun, and also the puma with an anti-tank gun. But I went with the Stuh -42 instead of the Stug build option. So just the two dedicated AT units.
@@Easy-there The barrels on the stug/stuh 42 is interchangable if you don't glue them. Fit is snug without any glue so they won't fall off by themselves when playing. Basically allows you to change between stug/stuh42 between games by simply switching out the barrels.
Glue a piece of cotton to a 'faust as a sling (I bought some metal ones, not sure if there are loose ones on the new sprues). If you want to add a 'faust to a squad, drape it over the shoulder of one of the figures. When fired you can remove it. This saves you wasting figures from the sprue to model a man firing a 'faust - not as pretty but far more practical.
Cool video dude- but just wanted to nip something in the bud which RAW doesn't work- The German trick with making the loader the NCO. I think you're taking the first sentence, which is basically flavour text, as how the rule works- without taking into account the second half of the paragraph, which covers the rules implementation: 'To represent this, leave the NCO in place and remove any other model instead (it is assumed the new 'squad leader' swaps his weapons with the ones carried by the NCO, if different).' Again, the bit in brackets is flavour text to explain the logic behind how the rule works. On the table- if you pass that 2+ roll when a sniper 'kills' your NCO, the NCO model stays in place and another man is removed instead. The flavour text explains that the model removed assumes the role & equipment of the NCO- but the reality is that the model removed is the casualty. Cross-reference this with the rules for Squad-based Team Weapons on p.104, and it explains that the 'loader' is a designated model, not a transferable piece of equipment, so when that exact model leaves the table, the gunner is at -1 to hit.
No no no no. And I'm going to get hated for posting this but I've got to say this. Bolt Action is supposed to be a HISTORICAL game, otherwise you're just playing 40k under another name. Standard German Squad organisation for most of the war was 10 men, divided into 1rifle section, led by 1 NCO with an smg and 1 mg section led by the squad second in command NCO with an smg. Thats 10 men. 2smg, 1lmg (2 men), 6 rifles. The only people with 2 lmg were in Panzer and Panzer Grenadier divisions, with 2 les rifles and 1 extra lmg. STGG? Used as substitutes for smg, except for Sturm Platoons in VolksGrenadier divisions, which had 2 squads armed entirely with Stgg44 and 1squad armed normally, and their quality was terrible. Of course, you can loose a rifleman here and there as squads were often under strength, but come on, play WW2, not the rules.
One of the things I don't like about Bolt Action is the unhistorical BS like squads with 2 LMGs. Panzergrenadiers typically had 2 LMGs per squad but they also had a vehicle to carry the troops and the ammo. If you play Battlegroup you get far more historical army lists. Mind you, the new Bolt Action Romanian pdf is even worse than the old army book, and that was terrible itself.
You did the Huns before the glorious Empire of the Sun?!?! The Emperor is not amused, no sake for you.........
Note: This video was recorded before the new Initiative Training rule was revealed by Warlord. However, the load outs of the squad are still very much my recommend way of running your infantry
The Huns got a better BANZAI rule than the IJA/IJN did.....
Assault rifles are only valid for late 1944-45 forces.
I am doing historical Sturmzug loadouts. Battle Order and DigitalBattlefieldTours did great videos on platoon formations.
Historically, the Germans found the second MG42 in a section was a failure. The extra MG meant an initial greater weight of firepower, but the additional weight of the machine gun meant less ammo carried overall by the section (10 rounds weighs around one pound in weight). Less ammo for two weapons, is worse than more for one.
@nickthenoodle9206 True, but to my understanding the only units who consistently carried two mgs per squad were formations like panzergrenadiers, jaegers and gebirgsjaegers where the weight of fire was generally considered more valuable than its sustainability (then again the gebirgs also seem to have generally favoured the mg34 as far as I can tell)
The MG-34 was a superior weapon compared to the MG-42. The 42 was just cheaper to make.
@jonathanbirkeland1085 Superior how? As much as I like the MG34, the MG42 had plenty of virtues over the 34 as far as German doctrine was concerned
@@rokivulovicstanaccountit was built to a higher quality standard and used more forged and milled components vs stamped sheet metal. MG-42s had more reliability problems and were more prone to parts breakage. The MG-42 also had problems with out of battery detonations (the gun going off without being fully locked and in battery) due to “bolt bounce” caused by its extremely high rate of fire. Forgotten Weapons has good videos on both the MG-42 and MG-34. Check them out if you want to learn more about them. Hope that answers your question! Cheers!
@jonathanbirkeland1085 Thanks for the well thought out answer. I think in part the reliability issue was probably across the board as QA slipped during the war (the STG is a big example of this but late war karabiners can be pretty shoddy too for instance), but as far as how quickly it wore out parts and the issue with bolt-bounce, fair enough, you got me there.
Great advice here - thanks Mordian! And I think you're right about the STGs: that extra 6" doesn't seem like much on a large table, but it is surprising how often it makes a difference. Plus it means that if a rifle section fires at the unit and is in range, you can move and return fire against them and not worry about range, which is nice
4:00 I think this is bending the rules a bit.
The book says that the if the NCO dies, another man will take the NCO's place and pick up his weapon.
IMO the loader STOPS being a loader and becomes the NCO.
So one LMG will fire without a loader.
Today they released spoilers for the new book and that rule has been completely changed.
@moesfran so how does it work in the new release ?
@@MrNikolajN They simply ignore the -1. Search "Warlord Community", they posted them.
@@MrNikolajN The squad suffers no penalty for losing their NCO. You lose the NCO's equipment though.
In this game each model has exactly on role, be it loader, leader, machine gunner, rifleman. Giving a model two functions like loader and leader is therefore highly questionable.
Incoming, very helpful video. Keep em coming.
This was excellent! I'd love to see this done for the US forces as well!
Only thing is the wording of the new rule, they automatically ignore the -1 for losing leader according to the forthcoming Armies of.
Thanks for this, helpful for a new recruit here. I wouldn’t hate a detailed post like this on how to build off the Battle of Bulge set for both US and Germany.
It would be helpful to get some ideas on how to build them out in comparison to the suggestions in booklet and where to go based on that.
I know you have a starter box suggestion video but more thinking “next 500-700pts”
I pretty much agree with the load outs. I prefer larger squads (8-10) for a little more durability.
I wouldn't mind seeing a similar video for the Soviets.
@@ZhukovsBoots same for the British Paras :p
I needed this video 3days ago!!! LOL
The replacement NCO for Germans no longer rolls it happens automatically in V3.
Technically, it doesn't happen at all. The NCO isn't replaced, they just fight on without one at no penalty.
KSTN 131 v is how I roll. 1 fire support squad and 2 assault squads. Let history be your guide
Thanks for the video, helped put things in perspective with hiw things work as a new player.
Where did you pick up the German models?
Your English is really good!
Great video thank you
Great video. Can you do the Americans next ?
@Mordian what is your opinion on making the backline LMG squads Shirkers?
personally I wouldn't; since you want your back units doing what you want them to do, if you take them as Shirkers, 1) they always need to take an order test whenever you tell them to shoot, which could be bad, and 2) they count pins as double, so even if they only get shot at once or twice they're unlikely to pass an order test. So I'd probably pass on it; it saves some points, but may not be worth missing a critical activation when you need it.
Good vid MG ! could you do more of this content please👌
Just a heads up, I am a subscriber and watch almost every video you put out and this video was never suggested to me, I only found it by looking for a different video on your channel. I don't know if that information is helpful to you, but just in case I thought I would pass it along.
no infantry unit in boltaction is as durable as a 15 man Japanese rifle squad, free fanatics rule, even when taken as inexperienced militia units, with cover saves they are very hard to get rid of.
A Japanese version of this video would be useful since they play so differently from the western powers
A version for every army would be good, they've all changed so much (currently having to rebuild my Airborne since they've lost half their weapon choices).
7 men with one light mortar to infinity.
Cant seem to find the Wargames Atlantic Link?
I've just started putting my German Grenadier starter box together, this vid has been really helpful. One question though, I was planning to have atleast one or 2 men with a panzerfaust (depending on squad size). Is this a good idea or not worth the points? I appreciate that for a long range lmg team it probably wouldn't make sense, but what about for assault squads? Thanks!
I think it really comes down to what else you're bringing. Are there other AT weapons in your list?
@@AnthonyPaoliMasakiSays thanks. I was planning to use only what comes in the starter army box until I got to grips with the game and then go from there. So I've got the Heavy anti-tank gun, and also the puma with an anti-tank gun. But I went with the Stuh -42 instead of the Stug build option. So just the two dedicated AT units.
@@Easy-there The barrels on the stug/stuh 42 is interchangable if you don't glue them. Fit is snug without any glue so they won't fall off by themselves when playing. Basically allows you to change between stug/stuh42 between games by simply switching out the barrels.
@@okisdr Great tip, thanks!
Glue a piece of cotton to a 'faust as a sling (I bought some metal ones, not sure if there are loose ones on the new sprues). If you want to add a 'faust to a squad, drape it over the shoulder of one of the figures. When fired you can remove it. This saves you wasting figures from the sprue to model a man firing a 'faust - not as pretty but far more practical.
Cool video dude- but just wanted to nip something in the bud which RAW doesn't work- The German trick with making the loader the NCO.
I think you're taking the first sentence, which is basically flavour text, as how the rule works- without taking into account the second half of the paragraph, which covers the rules implementation:
'To represent this, leave the NCO in place and remove any other model instead (it is assumed the new 'squad leader' swaps his weapons with the ones carried by the NCO, if different).'
Again, the bit in brackets is flavour text to explain the logic behind how the rule works.
On the table- if you pass that 2+ roll when a sniper 'kills' your NCO, the NCO model stays in place and another man is removed instead. The flavour text explains that the model removed assumes the role & equipment of the NCO- but the reality is that the model removed is the casualty.
Cross-reference this with the rules for Squad-based Team Weapons on p.104, and it explains that the 'loader' is a designated model, not a transferable piece of equipment, so when that exact model leaves the table, the gunner is at -1 to hit.
No no no no. And I'm going to get hated for posting this but I've got to say this. Bolt Action is supposed to be a HISTORICAL game, otherwise you're just playing 40k under another name. Standard German Squad organisation for most of the war was 10 men, divided into 1rifle section, led by 1 NCO with an smg and 1 mg section led by the squad second in command NCO with an smg.
Thats 10 men. 2smg, 1lmg (2 men), 6 rifles.
The only people with 2 lmg were in Panzer and Panzer Grenadier divisions, with 2 les rifles and 1 extra lmg.
STGG? Used as substitutes for smg, except for Sturm Platoons in VolksGrenadier divisions, which had 2 squads armed entirely with Stgg44 and 1squad armed normally, and their quality was terrible.
Of course, you can loose a rifleman here and there as squads were often under strength, but come on, play WW2, not the rules.
One of the things I don't like about Bolt Action is the unhistorical BS like squads with 2 LMGs. Panzergrenadiers typically had 2 LMGs per squad but they also had a vehicle to carry the troops and the ammo. If you play Battlegroup you get far more historical army lists. Mind you, the new Bolt Action Romanian pdf is even worse than the old army book, and that was terrible itself.
First!!!