The Most Important Thing I Learned From Jim Venetos - Golf Test Dummy
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- Опубліковано 8 чер 2021
- The Most Important Thing I Learned From Jim Venetos - Golf Test Dummy
#jimvenetos #golftips #ilovegolfing
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As you rightly say although Jim’s swing looks extreme what it does do is get you on the right path which if your a chopper can only be a good thing. The fact you have made it your own is what we all need to do using this design. Love your channel.
Great video. Part of me wishes you started his system now than when you did.
Jim's older content is so utterly profound and different that it just doesn't sink in the first few times you hear it.
His newer content from the last two years or so is easier to grasp because he's spelled it out more clearly. I think he realized that most of us need that because what he's saying isn't discussed on a weekly basis when we're watching golf on tv and no one else that you know thinks that deeply about golf.
Here are the key takeaways I got from Jim's content:
- Stillness = majority of weight on your foot closest to the target for LW through driver. Putting is opposite.
- Shoulders closed through impact. His Don January fountain of youth video is gold.
- Don't over rotate in the backswing. Less rotation is better because your starting point in his system already has your hips and shoulders rotated away from the target (closed).
- Don't swing so hard. ( I visualize Ernie Els )
- Longer clubs are more challenging because the lever is longer, which demands more of your fitness. It's like lifting weights or doing resistance training. If you don't have the foundational fitness and technique you compensate. That movement that comes from compensation that leads to poor contact and inconsistent trajectories.
- Give yourself some time to adapt because it takes longer than you think.
- Increases in distance do occur. Part of that is because with his system it's so much easier to hit the ball first on the sweet spot on the club, which leads to faster ball speeds. You'll get a higher frequency of flush shots and a lower frequency of off-center hits.
I didn’t want to look weird either. Thanks for explaining Jim’s swing and how not to look super weird using it. It works!
It's true, Chad ... less is more when it comes to the golf swing. I've always liked the simplicity of the Jim Venetos golf system. However, I never felt it necessary to go through all the animation while setting it up ... lol.
Thanks for sharing =)
Thanks George. I can agree with that.
Thank you for your prompt reply! It’s not wholly different from the misnamed stack snd tilt swing vilified from its debut in 2010-but kinda the same big idea. I’m in!
I always enjoy your content because it’s blue collar like me. I’m 72 and just retired from the automotive industry. I’ve been working a lot on my game ( including lessons). I finally managed to get into a professional looking impact position and I struck the ball beautifully. It lasted for about 9 holes. I was 5 over with several 3 putts. The problem is, my 72 year old back could not endure the twisting. It took 2 weeks to get back to normal. Yesterday I went to the range with Jim V’s formula. I was quite pleased with my results and the stillness allowed me to swing without pain. Thank you for your videos. I check out all of these different swing teachings looking for a solution to my problems. Your videos have really helped answer a lot of my questions 😅
So glad to read this, Robert, and a huge congrats on your retirement. I'm always happy to see hard working people get "paroled".
I LOVE your videos! Thank you!
I enjoyed your passion in this video. Ive been in contact with Jim and likely signing up...in part due to your series and experience that you documented. Thank you for your efforts.
I like your right side takeaway. When I add a right wrist bend to start the takeaway and use the Jim Venetos method, I hit the ball much better!
I would like to recommend someone for you to check out. His name is Michael Broderick and he is in Chicago. He is just an average physical specimen and he is 64 years old. He is capable of driving the ball over 300 yards. He is a full time golf instructor. I started implementing his teachings a few weeks ago and it has absolutely changed my golfing life. He has a UA-cam channel and he just uses his name as the name of his channel if you are interested. Pretty incredible stuff and extremely simple to implement. Using his teaching the darn ball just goes straight. Yesterday I was at the driving range and for the first time in my life the area where I was hitting looked like the divots the pros make. You know just perfect rows of divots all the same. Unlike the war zone I use to create. This guy is the real deal.
Great video dude...working from the beginning with jim...and I don't mind weird...but I fully get it...
Cool stuff, Chad. I'm hitting over 1,000 balls a week since they built a Topgolf across the street and I tape my swing. I found the exact same thing you mentioned. I just can't crank the body shut 45 degrees at address but I have found I don't have to.
It seems that for years my shoulders were open ( tour guys open 7 degrees at address on average I read somewhere) so now, when I feel very shut I am NOT very shut but still way shut compared to my old position. I have an maginary line in the ground going back to 4 o'clock and I feel I'm swinging 4 to 10 (GG drill) wothout conscious hand tightening or steering. The ball never goes right - never. I put the club back and inside on that line and stay left with the weight and the contact is great. An excellent point Jimmy V makes is that if you TRY to swing out you recruit the right side and it does not work because of how the shoulders function! To me, this is one of the coolest insights I have ever read in 30 years. I was high 70s and low 80s with the traditional technique but as I got older all that timing and weight shifting became too problematic. People have to know that keeping that weight left is not as easy as they make think. Same with not flinging the shoulders open immediately. This is gonna take some work. My guess is that 99% of weekend hacks come over the top so this is a complete reversal of deeply ingrained habits. I'm gonna subscribe and see what you're up to here!
Stay tuned! Simulator just came in and going to compare some techniques.
It definitely works. The only real issue I've had with the JV swing is a lack of distance. It's repeatable and consistent, but I lost 20 yds per club. Until the other day that is, now it's repeatable and as long as anything else I can do. My issue was my wrists. I know Jim says to disregard the movements of your hands and arms, but when I do that my left wrist wants to cup at the top. I tried s stronger grip and all that, but I was still scooping. Then I went and deliberately made my left wrist bow at the top, and boom there it was. Nice long tight draws, even with the driver. Last Saturday I hit a drive that ended behind the green on a short, 304 yd par 4. Maybe I have to train my wrist to hinge the right way, or maybe I was doing something else wrong. I'm not totally sure, but it's going in the right direction. And now maybe I have found that elusive 'effortless power' I was talking about on your last vid. All my extra exertions, even though I could increase swing speed, also came with too much launch and spin because I would lose most of the shaft lean at impact.
That's awesome to hear! I was playing some really improved golf the last few months, and then in my last 3 rounds, I've had two bad days, so I'm a little disappointed in my latest efforts, but there are always ebbs and flows.
Shawn Clement ran another 1 leg drill video this week. Shares a lot with the concepts in your vid. Simple seems more productive
Can't say enough about simple. It is just the best way to play.
Flamingo drill is awesome. I played a round doing the drill shot a 70
Good one !
Been following Jim's instruction for 3 months, I have added 15-20 yards on my irons and 40 yards to my driver. I used to top 2-3 drives per round, haven't topped a drive once in the past 90 days!
Love this.
I do really well with JV swing except with the driver. Haven’t figured that out yet. There are several styles that talk about minimal body movement after setup and before impact. That really works for me. The arms kind of have to go to the right places then.
Jim always said driver took more discipline.
@@GolfTestDummy I believe it! Thinking about signing up for his lessons and see if he can help.
Signed up. Going through the videos. It will be fun.
Best of luck to you GA!
Your " new " swing (current swing!) looks effortless and smooth. Centred, with little core movement in the fore-aft direction.
I had a similar issue with the JV swing with driver ( I could use it for the shorter fairway woods and my SL Hybrids) in that I tended to push the ball out right a lot. Once I worked out that I needed to rotate my set up left ( open ). i.e. aim left, I could get the JV swing to work with driver. I set up with feet lined up left, shoulder line to target and swing out right (Eureka style) and it worked for me. It could be my somewhat dirt bike induced right shoulder limitations influence my swing too.
The other issue I had with the closing of the club face went away once I used Mike Melaska's hand flapping methods; one for draw and another with fingers of the right hand pointing down toward the ground for fades.
I wish we had some of that heat in Victoria Oz today. It is blowing a gale of Antarctica at present.BTW this is your best video yet!
Haha, thanks Kym. Send that chilly breeze up this way!
RIP Kym, you were gone so suddenly.
Steve is this true??
Garage doors are like wives. They come and go. Golf is FOREVER ! ;)
Thanks Chad
Lol, I've had the opposite experience. My wife is always with me, but my golf game takes multiple vacations yearly.
Funny, Marcus Edblad has a similar take as Jim, but just does it from the back foot!
Jim V mixed with stack and tilt gets you square to square😉. They have all worked for me for two or three rounds. The hardest thing in golf is finding consistency. The search goes on.
For the majority of us all.
I've hit in the 70's with S and T, JV swing and T. Graves. But very quickly my brain decides the new swing can't work, and I'm back in the high 80's!
@@Rich-ey7jv I know. I’ll be striking the ball beautifully and if I think this is incorrect . I’ll change what’s working back to my old self😢
Good video
Your new swing reminds me a lot of the swing taught by Ross Duplessis. His motto is "Move less, get good."
I'll have to check that out. Thanks so much for the heads up!
You gotta chuckle, like and subscribe for "I don't want to look wierd ". You have a really sound looking swing & sound as well. Look forward to checking out your channel
Merry Christmas Mark!
So it looks like you've come up with a hybrid swing, viz. a combo of Jim Venetos & Tom Saguto. In fact your swing in this video looks more like a Saguto swing,, viz weight forward without the pivot.
Hey Chad I’ve been following you for about a year now. Love your channel… I’ve been having a hard time hitting the ball first and then the ground until recently. Now I focus on the front of the bar and it seems to be working sometimes… what is your trick or technique to hit the ball first and then the ground…?
Man great question. In my experience, a perfect intention means absolutely nothing unless I'm in a position to manifest the intent. So, if I want to touch the ground in front of the ball consistently, I have to be able to deliver it to a spot consistently first. That's in the setup. No matter style of swing you use, at impact, the center of that swing has to be pretty well lined up directly above that spot at impact. Try setting your sternum over the spot you wanna bottom out in the setup. Then make a centered swing without moving off the ball. Try it slow at first and get the contact solid time after time, before you add any speed.
Dude. I have recently EVOLVED back to JVGS after about two years working on my swing. ITS SO TRUE....form follows function. Why complicate it?
Because we're all moron psychopaths, lol. Machines with broken computers for brains.
Hey man can you do a video on Jim’s system using a driver? Sorry I’m late to the party just saw you on UA-cam.
I used trackman and the trackman integrated video after working on Venetos swing for 6 months. All swings with every club looked identical. Accuracy was better with all clubs, distance was maybe 5% shorter 6i to PW (no big deal). I've always had a draw so this was not new to me. 5i to Driver was at least 20% shorter, carry was 25 yds shorter with driver. You could not tell the difference with the swings. If anyone is getting close to the same distance with their driver please let me know how you are accomplishing this with the Venetos swing.
This is valuable! I didn't have the benefit of Trackman, but just speaking observationally, I experienced much the same results, and have heard from many who say the same. I don't think it's a negative necessarily, but as with anything in life, there is a trade off. Give a little distance for a more accuracy, or gain distance, for a more erratic pattern.
The key is in the 'stillness' if the shoulder or fulcrum is not still than you will lose power since you are taking momentum away from the arm/club. People bend the knee or raise the shoulder height which will bleed power. In addition, your left arm should be as straight as possible and extended as far as possible to generate widest swing arc. You are breaking down somewhere in your execution of the swing and therefore bleeding power. That bleed is significant 20yds.
I like some of his method-mostly just the stillness part. I think for most of us busy, every day folks stillness is key for solid and consistent striking. I know I tend to jump around too much trying to exert force. I can hit it great as an 80s shooter doing that but it’s inconsistent because I don’t have the time to play and practice like I used to have. But stillness does make me hit it shorter because I don’t have the same dynamic force and ground forces. My driver ball speed drops from the mid 150s to 140s ball speed. That’s a lot but I think I’m more consistent this way. And also, I’m hitting it similar to a good lpga player in terms of speed. They do well with that. They play on 6,500 yard courses and shoot under par. I think I can give up that speed and enjoy the consistency. Your thoughts?
Not a fan of the closed stance though because, for me, that’s just hooks and pushes.
I can agree with that. As a whole, most people I talk to lose a bit of distance to gain some consistency.
Your JV swing version looks awesome…I’m very tempted to do the JVA stuff but if I’m honest I’m a bit hesitant because it’s so different 🤷♂️
You're not alone, and if you have any qualms about looking different or strange, and having people give you all sorts of criticisms, it can tough.
@@GolfTestDummy Yeah it’s really about making the commitment to a very different change as well. Is the JVA really legit? It just makes perfect sense…I liked the Gary Edwin but had a hard time driving through the right side…JVA left side just seems more logical
We all have a natural swing....you cant tell me shawn clement has a swing that is a thing of beauty...he crosses the line at the top...doesnt look like a conventional swing....but the result is spot on...and the thoughts behind the swing are easy to understand....
Thank god golf teaching is changing and more and more tour players are playing with different swings...the time of the golf robot is over
Couldn't agree more. Love this comment. Great insight and great way of describing it.
@@GolfTestDummy Don’t You think , there were an Lot of Professional’ s and Amatures were Ruined by Teachers trying to change theyre (Natural) Swings Like Michelle Wie and Charles Howell and Numerous Others!
Check out Saguto Golf! Same thing Your saying to stay centered.
@@darylhoskins5696 he's stack n tilt ....another great method...certainly not a natural action ...but a very centred swing.....and another methid that proves there is no right and wrong......i shoukd have listened to myself 20 years ago before i messed up my own swing looking for something that looks right....
Mike Malaska is a great coach ansmd talks about the same thing...he played great on tour..then listened to people that said his grip was too strong and he didnt move right...taken him 20 years
to get back to where he was when he started....a real eye opener
Trying to force them into their little mold. Yeah, I imagine there are probably a lot of stories like that. I had a friend in high school that went to a AA baseball team and they changed his pitching style. A couple years and a few surgeries later, and he was done.
Hi Chad i went down the rabbit hole watching and listening to each and every You Tube instructor over the past several years. Just recently I simplify my personal functioning of my golf swing that I believe is logical and like none other
Please give me a moment to explain.
It is my opinion that the axis of our golf swing in not our spine or sternal notch as been repeatedly said over the years by everyone. Although I believe JV in his set up is using his lead shoulder blade as the axis to his swing.
In truth the axis of our swing are shared by the two stabilized scapula bones ( our body’s axils) that must move opposite of the other as we are swinging our club back and forth. When our trail scapula retract towards the spine then our lead scapula protracts away from our spine and then the reverse is true
To explain a little further the humerus bones of our upper arms are the only levers that moves our stabilized scapulas the opposite direction of each other. Our shoulders sockets or scapulas should never be allowed to move independently of our swinging and they can’t as long as we are alternating with upper arms. If we focus on our downswing with our right arm our shoulder might cause us to unknowingly do the dreaded swing over the top
Believe it or not! Golf is truly 1percent action on our part and 99 percent reaction on our body’s part.
To execute a perfect golf swing as i am setting up to my neutral square golf posture and as I am bending from my hips and then my knees I actually can sense both my scapulas equally protracting away from my spine. So all I need to do now is alternate their direction related to my bent spine with the swinging motion of my UPPER ARMS.
To be precise on my backswing I simply swing with my ´trail upper arm’ to the top of my swing and let my entire body including all the hinges and appendages of our body to react naturally; and then on the downswing I simply swing with my lead ‘ upper arm’ all the way to the finish of my classic swing. My ball simply gets in the way.
At age 73 I discovered the easiest perfect swing for myself ever and I invite anyone anyone to discover it for themselves. You might think I am crazy telling you this; but anyone would be crazy not to at least try it once without a golf club then with a golf club and see for themselves the magic of this new swing happening for themselves. Cheersj
The scapula idea is definitely interesting, and I can't say I'm well versed enough to fully comprehend all of the anatomical stuff. But, I have often made the statement that there no such thing as a true action. Only reaction. Something causes everything. Someone might say, "Well, my action is I take the club away." Not really. You took the club away as a reaction to your brain having the intent to move the club. It did that in reaction to you wanting the ball to be struck. You did that because you want to hit a target. You want to hit a target because..... and on. And on. And on. And on.
@@GolfTestDummy so don’t you just want to swing your golf club through the ball.
Forget about the anatomy and such just see how it feels to swing with your trail upper arm for your backswing and then swing with your lead upper arm crossing your chest for your downswing to the finish of your swing. Allow your body to move as it will.
Actually Moe Norman often said he swung with his arms and now I know he meant his upper arms Alternating back and forth. His corresponding forearm; wrist and hand simply followed as did his lower body
Ask you wife to do it. I would be interested what she says. Cheers
I can relate to that idea. I've definitely had the right arm do the equivalent of a bicep curl on the way back. And, Monte Scheinblum actually has some videos in the past where he talks about getting your left arm off your chest to swing through that I've also tried.
@@GolfTestDummy perfect! On the downswing rib cage will rotate as you swing with your lead upper arm. And yes the upper lead arm leave the chest.
At 73 I don’t have the range of motion to do a bicep curl on the backswing like a waiter holding a tray; but it should just happen without you thinking about it.
I admit it is a new personal discovery of mine. I am playing today and will let you know how it goes.
I want to just swing the club with alternating upper arms and let the club do most of the work for me. That way I can concentrate on winning.
Did you try it in your garage?
@@GolfTestDummy it works! Best day of my life for swinging accuracy. Although my putting needs to become better. Hope you try it yourself. Phenomenal chipping as well. Cheers
Would like to see a video of you applying the protocols of the Channel Lock Swing. After watching all your videos on the Jim Venetos swing I am sure the Channel Lock swing would suit you as you do not need to stay still. The only main difference between Channel Lock and your normal swing is playing the ball off your back foot for all clubs .The closed shoulders remain the same. This could be the perfect swing for YOU. Best Wishes and Stay Safe. Bob.
Maybe someday Bob. I like a lot of the Channel Lock ideas and I already know JH and Bayou Steve would help.
Venetos swing is different and produces solid shots. Solid shots always look cool.
Solid shots never go out of style.
Unforrtunately you turn your shoulders 45 degrees which is something Jim does NOT do. His shoulders remain at the same position at the start and through the whole back swing.
Maybe go back in the woods and find the path less traveled isn’t the best golf tip? Lol .... just kiddin around ... this was a great video !!
Yeah, getting lost in certain woods might not be the best plan, lol.
Hey, man - I'm back with this. You should discuss this in a video. Recently (today), I tried the feet together drill and the flamingo drill with all my irons. Remember, I'm 68. At the driving range I hit a bunch of balls and measure my drives with my scope and the flag sticks out in the field. And, guess what? The swing is simple. The only thoughts I had were: 1. Keep left arm straight, and 2. Swing along the arc in to out. Guess what else? Didn't lose any yardage and just about all the balls went straight. On the flamingo drill I played the ball off my left foot. On the feet together drill I played the ball off my right foot (because the swing produces a nice draw). Give it shot. I think you'll see the same thing. I'm using these drills on the course and loving it. I've always said, the golf swing does not have to be as difficult as the instructors make it (ask Jim V. He'll tell you the same thing). If the instructors taught these two drills, they'd be out of work. Over and out.
I've tried feet together and flamingo, but never on course...... hmmm. I may need to do just that. You're the second person in the comments to say that.
Love your passion for the game.
For me it works BEST with my driver.
Chad great vid.....and channel.... 'swinging harder is not the answer'....from your experience what is the answer ???? THANKS, Ron
Honestly, the further down the rabbit hole I go, and the better I get, the more is realize that Cody Lundin was right. The more you know; The less you need. The simplest is almost always the best. Replace flexion, ulnar deviation, axial hip rotation, inversion tabulation, spinal abduction, and alllllll the other crazy stuff..... with up and down. Or back and through.
@@GolfTestDummy THANKS I UNDERSTAND......BUT YOUR EFFORT LEVEL ON YOUR SWING ???? THANKS AGAIN
Ah, I see. I assume you're asking what is my effort level and how do I govern it, right? I suppose it's different for everybody, but for me, it's trial and error with my intentions being to hit one more club, so that I can guarantee I'm shooting for an 80 percent effort. Of course I'm human, so I have to stay diligent, but that's what I try for.
@@GolfTestDummy THANKS SO MUCH
Get your butt inside the house and pop a cold one! Great video once again!!!
Thanks Bill! I'm out in the heat all day walking jobs, so I can't escape the misery of Summer.
Do you know if JV still runs his school? I've emailed him a few times but he has never replied? Appreciate and advice and thanks for your great videos. Thanks Brendon
As far as I know, yes. Maybe your email found the spam folder?
@@GolfTestDummy cheers bud I got an email from him and signing up this weekend. He seems a great guy and love his method. Thanks for your great videos by the way. Regards
Brendon
The need for power is what mess up the JV swing. Let the club do the hitting, and you be the catapult.
That's true. That instinct to swing hard messes with every swing.
Does your lack of pivot and closing the shoulders produce a straighter ball flight ?
I've always hit either a baby draw or a pretty straight shot. Even when I first started golf, I was never a slicer. I'm not 100 percent sure exactly why that holds true no matter what swing I try.
Only one thing in your method that will not work consistently......the suction cup thing to fix the garage dent !!!!
Haha! There might be a few dents, which I will neither confirm or deny....
Just curious Chad, are you moving away from Shawn Clement? Or, like me, are you just trying to find some kind of consistency no matter what it takes. I just can’t stay consistent. I have shot 72-85 in my last 20 rounds. I’ll focus on the target and hit it good a few rounds. Then lose it. Then I’ll keep my weight on the left stacked a few rounds and hit it decent. The I lose it. I will watch video of good golfers and their impact position. Mine has never looked like that. Such a frustrating game.
It's hard to say, but I do know that I'm a product of all I've come across in one way or another. It's impossible not to be I think. Even if I'm not actively trying to employ something, I've been exposed to it and it has an influence in some way. At this point, no matter what I do, it's sure to be a hybrid on some level.
Oh and one more thing about Mr. Broderick. He went from a 15 handicap to slightly below scratch in 2 1/2 years when he was studying and putting together what he teaches now.
I think I'm missing part of your comment, or missing another comment altogether. Did you delete the first one?
@@GolfTestDummy No. I didn't delete anything, My two comments are here together, at least on my computer.
Ok. On my end, I just see the notification for this comment and the original isn't tied to it. No biggie. I've watched a lot of MB's stuff and the things he does with students in that indoor driving range are awesome.
@@GolfTestDummy Well you are pretty talented. I think you could make any swing method work.
Why are the shoulders closed-for this to work?
To ensure an inside out path with a shallow angle of attack, according to Jim.
Chad
JV’s swing system and JH’s Channel Lock swing system are a lot alike and if more beginner golfers would play with them they wouldn’t quit the game chasing the cure for the slice
Some teachers don’t even teach the inside out move in conventional golf...it’s a down the line swing...no place for inside out
Your so right GTD...golfers want to look like the there TV heros and none of them play with JV or JH swing so they don’t even want to try because it’s not on TV
Channel Lock has kept me in the game and JV has kept others playing as well
They both produce a lovely draw and no slices
Can’t get any easier then that
I've said it before. The guys and girls on TV are playing a similar game to the one we play, but it just ain't the same.
@@GolfTestDummy Could it be that there is money to be made by the industry in selling the fantasy that we can play golf just like champion golfer X, without spending hours on our swing, working out daily and being young and flexible?
Haha, the magic 8 ball would say "It seems certain".
Except for closed shoulders, they bear no resemblance to one another. Just study JH’s takeaway dogma.
@@cameronlawoffices898
I think you should look again
Besides the shoulders and ball position and weight on the legs they both teach a inside out swing and that my friend is the main point for both swing system
A draw swing 👍
Window aircon.
Haha, that might an idea. Or a PTAC.
Dude open the garage door!
Haha, you can't. If I open it, it will be over my head, and the club will hit it. Plus, the road noise would be brutal.
Didn't you gave up in jim swing a year ago?
I still keep all of the teachings I've encountered in mind, along with the big takeaways that I reference from time to time.
Have been here for awhile. You’ve lost about half a person. Calendar shoot next?
I'm not sure I understand this comment.... Did I miss the joke?
You look skinny.
Hey I'll take that! Lol. In the last few weeks, I'm actually about 3 or 4 pounds higher than average.
You might get heat stroke out there man. Started the video out looking fresh, ended it looking like you took a shower in your clothes
Haha, I noticed the huge change to my shirt as time went on.
You didn't learn anything from jim because you don't set your weight forward. You don't close your shoulders and hips. You know how to explain the technics, but at the start when you were hitting balls you didn't do any of it.